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Post by: warboss
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rrpgt/robotech-rpg-tacticstm  The initial goal of $70,000 was funded within 3 hours with both early bird specials gone in the first hour. Delivery date is listed as Dec 2013. Pictured below is most popular Battlecry pledge level (the lowest one that gets the "freebie" unlocks) and what it includes.  PAST STRETCH GOALS: 90k: $20 Spartan Pack Add-On ------ DONE 125k: FREE VF-1A/J/S Pack Bonus----- DONE 150k: $20 Gnerl Fighters Add-On ----- DONE 180k: FREE 3x Regult Pods Bonus ----- DONE 220k: 4 Destroids in Destroid Add-On ----- DONE 240k: FREE 12x UEDF Dice Upgrade Bonus ----- DONE 240k: $12 12x UEDF Dice Add-On ----- DONE 260k: FREE Roy Fokker Veritech in 3 Modes Bonus ----- DONE 260k: $15 Roy Fokker Veritech in 3 Modes Add-On ----- DONE 280k: FREE Zentraedi Command Bonus ----- DONE 280k: $20 Zentraedi Command Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 325k: $40 MKII Monster Add-On -----DONE 325k: $150 Daedelus Attack Add-On ----- DONE 345k: FREE 12x Zentraedi Dice Upgrade Bonus ----- DONE 345k: $12 12x Zentraedi Dice Add-On ------ DONE 375k: 3 Gnerls in each Gnerl Add-On ------ DONE 400k: $20 2x Support Pod Add-On ----- DONE 2200: FREE Spartan and Phalanx Destroids ----- DONE 430k: Core Set upgrade to 4 Destroids ----- DONE 450k: $20 3x Male Power Armor Add-On ----- DONE 2400: FREE Plastic Weapon Template Upgrade ----- DONE 475k: 4x Destroids in each Spartan Pack Add-On ----- DONE 500k: FREE Khyron Glaug Bonus ----- DONE 525k: FREE VF-1 A/J/S B Bonus ----- DONE 2600: FREE 2x Support Battle Pods ------ DONE 550k: FREE 3x Regults Bonus ----- DONE 2800: FREE Core Set Laminated Cards Bonus ----- DONE 575k: 4x Support Pods in each Add-On ----- DONE 600k: 2x Super Valkyrie Add-On ----- DONE 3000: FREE 1x Spartan and 1x Phalanx Bonus ----- DONE 625k: FREE 3x Gnerls Bonus ----- DONE 650k: $30 6x Heavy Zentraedi Infantry Add-On ----- DONE 3200: FREE 2x Support Battle Pods Bonus ----- DONE 700k: $30 3x Female Power Armor Add-On ----- DONE 725k: FREE Miriya in Power Armor Bonus ----- DONE 750k: $30 2x VEF-1/VF-1T Add-On ----- DONE 775k: $20 2x Armored Battloids Add-On ----- DONE 800k: FREE 3x Male Power Armor Bonus ----- DONE 3500: FREE Core Set Decals Bonus ----- DONE 825k: 6x Light Infantry Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 850k: $20 2x Lancer II Add-On ----- DONE 875k: 4x Armored Battloid Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 900k: $15 Objective Marker Sets Add-On ----- DONE 925k: $30 1x/$80 3x Glaug-Eldare Add-On ----- DONE 950k: FREE 1x Super Valkyrie Bonus ----- DONE 1 mill: FREE 3x Female Power Armor Bonus ----- DONE 1.025: $20 2x Ghost Fighter Add-On ----- DONE 1.050: 4x Lancer II Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 1.075: FREE Plastic Command Point Token Upgrade ----- DONE 1.075: $10 UEDF or Zentraedi Token Add-On ----- DONE 1.1m: FREE Super Valkyrie Bonus ----- DONE 1.125: 4x Ghost Fighter Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 1.15m $20 Resin SDF deck bases Add-On ----- DONE 1.18m $20 Resin SDF-1 Model Add-On ----- DONE 1.23m Experimental FPA Add-On Only Upgrade ----- DONE 1.25m FREE 2x Lancers Bonus ----- DONE 1.275 FREE Recovery Pod Bonus ----- DONE 1.3m $30 YF-4 Veritech Add-On ----- DONE 1.315 FREE Experimental FPA Battlecry Upgrade ----- DONE 1.340 $20 4x Experimental Battloids Add-On ------ DONE 1.360 Super VEF/1D Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 1.385 FREE 2x Ghost Fighters Bonus ----- DONE 1.405 Artillery Pod Particle Cannon Add-On Upgrade ------ DONE 1.43m Experimental Phalanx Add-On Upgrade ----- DONE 1.455 Artillery Pod Particle Cannon Battlecry Upgrade 1.48m Experimental MPA Add-On Upgrade 1.5m Experimental Phalanx Battlecry Upgrade 1.525 Experimental MPA Battlecry Upgrade 1.6m FREE 2x VF-4 Bonus 
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
Why must companies continue to tease me so with these Kickstarters?
I'm trying very hard to keep myself in check financially.
If they end up dropping Inbit/ Invide stuff, I'm in.
I hope the battroid models end up looking a bit more dynamic. Too static for my taste.
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Post by: Manchu
I'm in at Battle Cry. I'll be interested to see stretch goals.
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Post by: warboss
I got in at the early bird blitzkrieg level but would prefer to have the booby trap if they change the Rick Hunter mini to an add-on instead of a pledge level exclusive.
@alph: I figure I've commented in dozens of these threads so I might as well step up and update one seeing as how this is my first time funding a KS.
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Post by: GamesNGears
The entire G&G crew have pledged. We wish our very best to Ninja division and cannot wait to get Robotech Gaming!!
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
If this does well I wonder if someone could talk Palladium into a Rifts skirmish game.
Say what you will about Palladium and its Great Leader, but they've got some neat stuff up in Rifts design- wise.
I'll even forgive them for giving the Glitter Boys the cannon from the full armor double zeta gundam.
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Post by: warboss
 highlord tamburlaine wrote:If this does well I wonder if someone could talk Palladium into a Rifts skirmish game.
Say what you will about Palladium and its Great Leader, but they've got some neat stuff up in Rifts design- wise.
I'll even forgive them for giving the Glitter Boys the cannon from the full armor double zeta gundam.
http://cravengames.com/interviews/kevin-siembieda-on-robotech-rpg-tactics.html
The owner of Palladium talks about that in the interview linked above. I'd post it in the initial post but I'm trying to keep it relatively clean and to the point.
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Post by: RiTides
I'm sitting this out and waiting for Mecha Front (although maybe you could use models from each for both?).
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Post by: solkan
I scrolled through the entire page, and it didn't say anything important about what people really care about:
Will those be the right scale to play Battletech? 
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Post by: saaywhu
Giggles giggles. Just pledged 260 boxset..=)
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Post by: warboss
Lol, I just noticed that the kickstarter continues Palladium's habit of dropping TMs on everything (they'd copyright the letter P if they thought they could get away with it!) and the TM is even in the title and url of the kickstarter.
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Post by: Manchu
CG: First off, Minmei or Lisa Hayes?
KS: Oh, I’m a Lisa Hayes guy.
LOL he gets points for that in my book! KS: There is no “hopefully” including them. I mean, when we started this project, our goal from the very beginning was to do all eras of Robotech. So that has been our plan from day one and that continues to be our plan. It’s easier to tackle them pretty much in order, starting with Macross, so that’s what we’re doing. We plan on banging out pieces for every era of Robotech.
And more points! But then there's ... I’ve never really been a tactical combat guy or a wargamer, so that has limited appeal, although I think this game for me personally as a roleplayer and a Robotech fan, this game is so fun that a lot of people regardless of what their orientation is for Robotech can pick it up pretty easy and have a lot of fun.
Don't worry, however, because Palladium's role is limited design-wise: And of course, we’ve had input with game design, because while I may not be a wargamer per se, I certainly know Robotech inside and out, know what feel we need for the game. And game design, the fundamentals of game design, apply to most mediums so you want stuff that’s fast-paced and fun, that creates the television experience. It’s all translation.
Automatically Appended Next Post: YES!
They specifically chose 1:285/6mm for this reason.
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Post by: warboss
I'd like to point out that it's also incredibly close to the 1/270 scale of the Xwing minis game for which I'm planning to make conversions of the Robotech models for. I will, after 25 years, finally be able to answer the question of who would win... Rick Hunter in a veritech or Luke Skywalker in an X-wing. That just leaves me with the other equally important age old question of Hulk Hogan versus Lou Ferrigno Incredible Hulk. 
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Post by: Manchu
What X-Wing stats do you have in mind for Rick in his Veritech? And more to the point, why oh why are we not gaming together?!
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Post by: darkeldarcrone
Pledged!
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Post by: warboss
 Manchu wrote:What X-Wing stats do you have in mind for Rick in his Veritech? And more to the point, why oh why are we not gaming together?!
Lol, I don't have my chicken scratch ideas with me currently (they're on suitably 80's method of handwritten notes on paper) but I was going with three separate profiles for each veritech from which you'd choose one each turn when placing your dial. Roughly, the jet mode would be as fast and nimble as an A-wing (complete with boost) with a normal fire arc, the guardian would be around xwing in terms of speed and maneuverability but with a 180 forward fire arc for the gun pod, and the battloid mode would be slow (max 2 movement) but with a 360 turret fire arc for the GU-11 gun fire and movement direction (but normal arc for missiles if taken similar to the falcon) and possibly two actions (like vader).
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Post by: Manchu
Sounds like Luke is fethed!
But your idea of porting Robotech to the X-Wing system has now dramatically increased the value of my KS pledge. I'll be thinking about that hack for a while, I'm sure. So many possibilities ...
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote:Sounds like Luke is fethed! But your idea of porting Robotech to the X-Wing system has now dramatically increased the value of my KS pledge. I'll be thinking about that hack for a while, I'm sure. So many possibilities ...
Indeed, although don't discount the power of the force! (or R2 units, push the limit, and engine modification cards!). Plus Luke would have the advantage of shields (which robotech stuff doesn't have) as well as a 3 primary attack as I'd only give the veritech gun pod a 2 base attack. My dislike of the Palladium rules and fear that some variant of them will be used in this kickstarter game made finding a secondary ruleset for the minis a priority. The announcement of the scale combined with my pleasure at playing a simple ruleset that still has room for deeper tactics (like X-wing) pretty much sealed the decision of what to use them with alternatively.
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Post by: Manchu
It looks like Mr. Siembieda did not write the rules -- that he just asked clarifying questions in the course of playtesting.
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Post by: cincydooley
I think they're demoing this at Adepticon. If so, ill report in tomorrow.
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Post by: Cypher-xv
Guys I've never funded a KS before. I plan on funding at the $140 level. Will I be able to add on unlocked goals?
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
And the first goal has been met.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cypher-xv wrote:Guys I've never funded a KS before. I plan on funding at the $140 level. Will I be able to add on unlocked goals?
Generally, each campaign is ran in a unique manner though, watch the updates and ask questions of the creators. You can adjust you pledge up and down over the course of the campaign to include more options if you like.
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Post by: Manchu
There is no standard way. Generally speaking, unlocked stretch goals add to what you get at certain pledge goals. You can change your pledge amount throughout the pledging period in case you want something that's been added at a higher level (although I don't know that things will be added above Battle Cry). Some KS let you do add-ons. This one, for example, let's you do that from the beginning with every model except Rick Hunter. Whether stretch goals will be add-ons that you can purchase in addition to pledge level or more rewards added to your existing pledge level remains to be seen. Let me know if that answers your question.
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Post by: CaptKaruthors
Awesome! First goal has been met! Looks like the first stretch goal has the Spartan and Gladiator Destroids.
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Post by: Manchu
Nevermind -- question answered: When we reach $90,000 we will unlock a new unit that will be available as an optional Purchase Add-on. What could it be!?
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Post by: Ironwill13791
I am definitely thinking of backing this when I have the extra cash. Looks cool.
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote:Nevermind -- question answered: When we reach $90,000 we will unlock a new unit that will be available as an optional Purchase Add-on. What could it be!?
Yeah, I kind of expected that frankly. To be honest, I was shocked at the number of minis in the starter as Palladium gave out *NOTHING* in their home made crowdfunding as a freebie. I was extremely pleasantly surprised that the set had more than 10 minis at under $100. Either way, we've got weeks and weeks to see what freebies (if any) they give out. I suspect they'll only hand them out at the $130/140 price bracket and up though.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cypher-xv wrote:Guys I've never funded a KS before. I plan on funding at the $140 level. Will I be able to add on unlocked goals?
It says about half way down the page that you just change your funding amount to account for the add ons and they'll send out a form to find out exactly which ones you want. I'm personally waiting till the last few days before changing anything so I only have to do it once.
This kickstarter is hurting my wallet more and more as the minutes go by. Robotech minis + Urban Terrain Tiles (from the ongoing KS) + Cardboard Dropzone Commander Buildings = Defense of Macross City!
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
Palladium actually produces a good value for content if you look at page count versus price. They might still be black and white, but the books are really close to the same price as they were in the 1990s (compare to other books which have easily doubled or more since then).
I think the overall value of this campaign will be surprising to some.
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Post by: Cypher-xv
Does this mean I add extra $ to the $140 to get the other destroid models?
Never mind already found my answer. Does anyone know witch veritech is unlocked at the 125k level?
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Post by: warboss
 Sean_OBrien wrote:Palladium actually produces a good value for content if you look at page count versus price.
The phone book has even better page count versus price value but neither it nor Palladium RPG books succeed at creating a comprehensive or comprehensible ruleset. :(
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cypher-xv wrote:Does this mean I add extra $ to the $140 to get the other destroid models?
Yup. It's a paid add-on only. Although I think we all know what it'll be, I'd wait the hour or two till its officially "unlocked" before changing it personally.
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Post by: judgedoug
Cypher, yup. Say you have a $140 pledge and you want to add on $75 worth of add-ons, you just up your pledge to $215 but keep the $140 pledge level selected.
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Post by: Alpharius
First stretch as a paid add-on?
That's a bold move.
This is going to be a long and potentially expensive campaign...
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
Yes.
If you are in for the $140 pledge...you will select that option, but then add the extra $20 or whatever to you pledge. If a week from now, there are an extra $40 worth of stuff...you then edit your pledge to include the $140 of your pledge level (still just selecting the $140 option) but adding in the additional funds to you pledge amount for a total of $200. Automatically Appended Next Post:  Alpharius wrote:First stretch as a paid add-on?
That's a bold move.
This is going to be a long and potentially expensive campaign...
Considering it is still bankers hours in the US and they are ticking up in pledge amounts fairly steadily...I think it might be a solid record breaker in the end. Expect it to explode in a couple of hours as people get off from work.
More options then you can shake a really big stick at...and lots of sore credit cards.
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Post by: warboss
No real news about the accompanying rules unfortunately. I was hoping for a gameplay video but they may be holding off the real details besides just the flattering platitudes by the creators due to the overwhelmingly negative reaction Palladium's rules generally get if they're compatible with the RPG. A friend zoomed in on the stat cards in the video and it seems that they may be the RPG stats divided by ten.
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Post by: CaptKaruthors
I'm surprised at how quickly the first goal was met. They may make their first stretch goal by the end of the work day. I'm wondering what stretch goal number the M.A.C. II monsters are in. I want a horde of those....
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Post by: Forar
Even if the MAC II's aren't fully to scale (being roughly twice the height and thus several times the size) to the other destroids, those things would likely be utterly massive. Wouldn't be surprised if they were more like a $15 apiece add on, rather than 2 for $20 the others are.
But that's completely pulled from my butt, and I do hope they make it into the campaign.
Given that we're already only 5k away from the first stretch unlocking, I've got a good feeling about our progress.
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Post by: GamesNGears
They will be demoing Robotech tomorrow at Adepticon. So we should here news then about the game play.
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Post by: judgedoug
The Monster is HUGE. I wouldn't not be surprised if it was $30-$40.
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Post by: GamesNGears
We have seen some of the miniatures at GAMMA. They were top notch. We cannot wait to paint them up ourselves and game with them.
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Post by: Manchu
I was thinking MDF from Game Craft. I just received a pile of their 15mm scifi modular range that I plan to break into this weekend. Will post a review as/when. In the meantime, their 6mm range (with some stuff available in acrylic) seems very affordable ... http://store.gcmshop.com/c/34/1285th-scale-6mm Dakka is on it:  cincydooley wrote:I think they're demoing this at Adepticon. If so, ill report in tomorrow.
 judgedoug wrote:The Monster is HUGE. I wouldn't not be surprised if it was $30-$40.
$30 - $40 sounds totally reasonable to me ... I would be pleased if it were that low.
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote:I was thinking MDF from Game Craft. I just received a pile of their 15mm scifi modular range that I plan to break into this weekend. Will post a review as/when. In the meantime, their 6mm range (with some stuff available in acrylic) seems very affordable ...
The 6mm stuff is affordable for what you get but definitely more than the downtown city you get for $35 (albeit cardstock and out of scale).
Is it just me or did the timeline for this project just change? It initially said the stuff would be done around 45 days after the end of the kickstarter but now has a delivery date of December under the pledge levels.
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Post by: judgedoug
Head to manufacturing within 45 days.
The Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Kickstarter helps Palladium to fund the launch of a compelling and expanding game line designed specifically for Robotech® fans and gamers.
Six months of product development has produced nearly two dozen gorgeous sculptures (with more to come), a mountain of artwork, and game rules that have been play-tested by more than 100 Robotech fans and gamers to ensure we make Robotech® RPG Tactics™ everything you could want.
Once the Kickstarter reaches our funding goal, we have a host of fantastic upgrades, additional game pieces and new unit add-ons to unlock! Every Destroid. More Zentraedi mecha. More fun!
And because so much is DONE, this project should go into manufacturing within 45 days after the Kickstarter! That’s fast.
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Post by: Barzam
I'm rather surprised that they're using the original Macross names for some of these units rather than the actual Robotech ones. Since when are the fighters in Robotech no longer Veritechs? That's really odd.
I really don't want to back this KS since A)it's Palladium, B)it's Robotech, thus money going to Harmony Gold and C)they really screwed over Paulson, but it is really hard to resist those Destroids. Spartans and Phalanxes never get the love they deserve. It'd be even harder if they were to throw in some armored Zentradi foot soldiers and Meltrandi powered armor. And If Invid start getting thrown in? And I'm one of those rare, weird people who really likes the Southern Cross designs. I absolutely have to pledge if those get models.
You know what else could get me to back this? If they made some of the really obscure units, like the Lancer II space fighter seen in the first couple of episodes of Macross. Or the Dragon and Karyovin fighters. Or maybe a fleet based game with ARMD carriers and Zentradi battle cruisers.
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Post by: Manchu
 warboss wrote:Is it just me or did the timeline for this project just change? It initially said the stuff would be done around 45 days after the end of the kickstarter but now has a delivery date of December under the pledge levels.
At the time of my pledge (i.e., right before my first post ITT) it said December 2013. Automatically Appended Next Post: First goal met:  Second goal:  Once we reach $125k all pledges of Battle Cry or above will receive the models in the teaser below for free!
Roy?
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Post by: Barzam
only one antennae in that pic, so I'm betting Ben/Max VF-1A
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Post by: judgedoug
 Barzam wrote:I'm rather surprised that they're using the original Macross names for some of these units rather than the actual Robotech ones. Since when are the fighters in Robotech no longer Veritechs? That's really odd.
I really don't want to back this KS since A)it's Palladium, B)it's Robotech, thus money going to Harmony Gold and C)they really screwed over Paulson, but it is really hard to resist those Destroids. Spartans and Phalanxes never get the love they deserve. It'd be even harder if they were to throw in some armored Zentradi foot soldiers and Meltrandi powered armor. And If Invid start getting thrown in? And I'm one of those rare, weird people who really likes the Southern Cross designs. I absolutely have to pledge if those get models.
You know what else could get me to back this? If they made some of the really obscure units, like the Lancer II space fighter seen in the first couple of episodes of Macross. Or the Dragon and Karyovin fighters. Or maybe a fleet based game with ARMD carriers and Zentradi battle cruisers.
The original Macross names ARE the Robotech names. They're called the Macross names in the show. What happened was Matchbox invented names and Palladium used them originally, and has confused everything since then. Your best bet is to forget about the 'Excalibur' and 'Raidar X' and that nonsense.
Valkyries are Veritechs. The VF Valkyrie is the series of Veritech fighters. The Spartas Hovertank is a Veritech as well.
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Post by: warboss
Barzam wrote:I'm rather surprised that they're using the original Macross names for some of these units rather than the actual Robotech ones. Since when are the fighters in Robotech no longer Veritechs? That's really odd.
They've made a concerted effort at harmony gold to return to the original macross names which is why even in the rereleased RPG they changed the name as well. You won't see alot of references to veritechs and RDF or other americanized terms in this likely as well. It is likely though that you'll catch me occasionally using those now disavowed terms though as that is what I grew up knowing them as. @Judge and Manchu: I guess I missed that December date. I must have been so happy about that 45 day note that I just assumed it would be out by GenCon/Late Summer. Automatically Appended Next Post: cincydooley wrote:I think they're demoing this at Adepticon. If so, ill report in tomorrow.
Cool, thanks. Are you familiar with the palladium RPG system to know if it's compatible or related to it? If not, Palladium is a by product of AD&D and uses a mix of d20 style mechanics to attack (roll d20 add/subtract modifiers and the opponent rolls an opposing d20 to dodge/parry) but percentiles for skills (pilot veritech skill is 45% base + 5% per level, roll under on d100 to succeed). It looks like the dice are d6 in the video but with a custom zentraedi face at a minimum.
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Post by: recruittons
Well, Kai Nesbit plugged the campaign on his Hell Dorado campaign's updates and said that Cipher are behind the rules (at least in part), so if you've played Anima Tactics you'll know that they are quite good at game design for fun, fast-paced games. This game is going to be a lot of fun, I bet!
Also, my sister-in-law is a MASSIVE Robotech fan, so I think this is going to be her Christmas present
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Post by: Cypher-xv
When is this game supposed to come out?
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Post by: CaptKaruthors
I'm wondering what stretch level will have Skull 1. Personally, I'd like a Max VF-1J
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Post by: Cypher-xv
Well there past 100k. Here's to reaching 125k before the day is over.
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Post by: Manchu
KS delivery estimated to be December 2013.
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
Barzam wrote:I'm one of those rare, weird people who really likes the Southern Cross designs. I absolutely have to pledge if those get models.
I can verify this to be true. You are one of a very select minority in that regard.
Now the bad guy bio armor things that rode around on the DoDai looking flying discs like a bunch of red Goufs? Those I liked.
I'm in if those dude show up.
Or your Meltrandi.
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Post by: Manchu
Mr. Siembieda said in the interview warboss posted that he wants to do miniatures from all three series.
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Post by: RogueRegault
I'll probably pledge the Battle Cry level and then up the pledge if Queadlunn-Rau, VF-1S Supers, and Monsters get unlocked. Automatically Appended Next Post: Manchu wrote:Mr. Siembieda said in the interview warboss posted that he wants to miniatures from all three series.
They'd have be done in different scales.
Cyclones, Logans, and Alphas would wind up too small for meaningful detail.
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Post by: judgedoug
RogueRegault wrote:I'll probably pledge the Battle Cry level and then up the pledge if Queadlunn-Rau, VF-1S Supers, and Monsters get unlocked.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Manchu wrote:Mr. Siembieda said in the interview warboss posted that he wants to miniatures from all three series.
They'd have be done in different scales.
Cyclones, Logans, and Alphas would wind up too small for meaningful detail.
Disagree. GHQ's 1/285 stuff is amazingly detailed. And they've already stated all will be done to be played against each other.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked stretch goals, right?
BATTLE CRY PLEDGE LEVEL INCLUDES:
Full color, 90+ page, softcover rulebook
24 Battle Dice
40 color game cards (unit cards, etc)
1x Rick Hunter SE Veritech
6x VF-1A Veritech Valkyries (in Fighter, Guardian, and Battloid modes)
1x VF-1J "Officer" in all three modes
2x Destroids (includes parts to make them Tomahawks, Defenders, or one of each)
18x Regult Zentraedi Battlepods
1x Glaug Officer's Battlepod
1/285th scale, high quality, multi-pose plastic game pieces.
All Unlocked Stretch Goals
For those of you looking to maximize your free goodies, Battle Cry is the pledge to have. Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.
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Post by: Necros
I thought this was gonna be the Robotech Battles game a buddy of mine made, but he just said it's not .. he was still part of the development though so that's something.
dilema now is... spend my cash on my secret weapon board, or this one? can't do both :/
Was never a huge Robotech fan but the models look good. Can't they do robots based on more modern planes, instead of Top Gun stuff? Or is it sacrilege to even think it?
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Post by: warboss
vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked FREE stretch goals, right?
Corrected that for you. It does not include the paid add ons which currently make up 1 of the 2 unlocks so far.
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Post by: RogueRegault
vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked stretch goals, right?
There are some unlocks that are free add-ons, and some that just give more options to pledge. Currently, the Spartan is an option, and the extra VF-1 frame at $125 is an add-on.
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Post by: Aeneades
@Vitia_drinker.
The second stretch goal will be included in that pledge level as its marketed as a stretch goal (sel lower right corner of the image), the first stretch goal was marked as an addon instead so I do not believe will be included unless you pay extra. That's how I read it at least.
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
 Necros wrote:I thought this was gonna be the Robotech Battles game a buddy of mine made, but he just said it's not .. he was still part of the development though so that's something.
dilema now is... spend my cash on my secret weapon board, or this one? can't do both :/
Was never a huge Robotech fan but the models look good. Can't they do robots based on more modern planes, instead of Top Gun stuff? Or is it sacrilege to even think it?
Sacrilege...though some of the veritechs had designs that are more modern.
The scale wont be an issue, some of the 6mm figures that are available are surprisingly detailed, so anything from Robotech will not be a problem.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
warboss wrote:vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked FREE stretch goals, right?
Corrected that for you. It does not include the paid add ons which currently make up 1 of the 2 unlocks so far.
Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free.
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Post by: Manchu
Necros wrote:Can't they do robots based on more modern planes, instead of Top Gun stuff? Or is it sacrilege to even think it?
Yes, that is a blasphemous thing to ask. As penance, go watch the Blood Dragon trailer five times.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
warboss wrote:vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked FREE stretch goals, right?
Corrected that for you. It does not include the paid add ons which currently make up 1 of the 2 unlocks so far.
Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free.
The next stretch goal is probably like the Rick Hunter Veritech model, IE: not an add on pack.
The Battlecry level specifically states ALL stretch goals.
A stretch goal is a stretch goal is a stretch goal.
See that little set of words in the lower right...
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Post by: warboss
vitae_drinker wrote: warboss wrote:vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked FREE stretch goals, right?
Corrected that for you. It does not include the paid add ons which currently make up 1 of the 2 unlocks so far.
Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free.
Lol... I'll show you where you quoted it yourself. It's right past the part you made red. All irony aside, no big deal as I've made mistakes myself regarding the details of this kickstarter.
vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked stretch goals, right?
BATTLE CRY PLEDGE LEVEL INCLUDES:
Full color, 90+ page, softcover rulebook
24 Battle Dice
40 color game cards (unit cards, etc)
1x Rick Hunter SE Veritech
6x VF-1A Veritech Valkyries (in Fighter, Guardian, and Battloid modes)
1x VF-1J "Officer" in all three modes
2x Destroids (includes parts to make them Tomahawks, Defenders, or one of each)
18x Regult Zentraedi Battlepods
1x Glaug Officer's Battlepod
1/285th scale, high quality, multi-pose plastic game pieces.
All Unlocked Stretch Goals
For those of you looking to maximize your free goodies, Battle Cry is the pledge to have. Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.
Automatically Appended Next Post: vitae_drinker wrote:
Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free.
The next stretch goal is probably like the Rick Hunter Veritech model, IE: not an add on pack.
The Battlecry level specifically states ALL stretch goals.
A stretch goal is a stretch goal is a stretch goal.
See that little set of words in the lower right...
Come now.. don't get snarky especially if you're completely wrong...
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Post by: recruittons
Yup, it's in the Battlecry Pledge description in the main body of text. It specifically states FREE stretch goals
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here, official word from Palladium on the Spartan
Creator Palladium Books about 2 hours ago
The $90k stretch goal is an add-on. Since it is an entirely new unit the amount raised by the stretch goal only funds its development. So if you want to receive it you will need to increase your pledge amount for it, regardless of which pledge you have made.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
warboss wrote:vitae_drinker wrote: warboss wrote:vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked FREE stretch goals, right?
Corrected that for you. It does not include the paid add ons which currently make up 1 of the 2 unlocks so far.
Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free.
Lol... I'll show you where you quoted it yourself. It's right past the part you made red. All irony aside, no big deal as I've made mistakes myself regarding the details of this kickstarter. vitae_drinker wrote:You guys do realize that the Battle Cry level includes all unlocked stretch goals, right? BATTLE CRY PLEDGE LEVEL INCLUDES:
Full color, 90+ page, softcover rulebook
24 Battle Dice
40 color game cards (unit cards, etc)
1x Rick Hunter SE Veritech
6x VF-1A Veritech Valkyries (in Fighter, Guardian, and Battloid modes)
1x VF-1J "Officer" in all three modes
2x Destroids (includes parts to make them Tomahawks, Defenders, or one of each)
18x Regult Zentraedi Battlepods
1x Glaug Officer's Battlepod
1/285th scale, high quality, multi-pose plastic game pieces.
All Unlocked Stretch Goals
For those of you looking to maximize your free goodies, Battle Cry is the pledge to have. Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.
Automatically Appended Next Post: vitae_drinker wrote: Could you show me where it says that? Nowhere does it state free. The next stretch goal is probably like the Rick Hunter Veritech model, IE: not an add on pack. The Battlecry level specifically states ALL stretch goals. A stretch goal is a stretch goal is a stretch goal. See that little set of words in the lower right...
Come now.. don't get snarky especially if you're completely wrong...
Wow, my bad. They completely changed the picture and just overwrote the old one. I'm looking at it in my email and still shows this:  If so, it seems a little disenginuous to say one thing, and then contradict yourself. But hey, it's Palladium, so there you go. Sure looks like a stretch goal to me!
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Post by: Forar
It's also possible that Paid unlocks might become Free unlocks (in a fashion) at later points in the campaign. Tooling up to make the parts for the next two destroids might be expensive enough that they can't just guarantee adding them to boxes, but perhaps at a later price point they'll include a couple extra.
I've seen other KS's do that, which isn't to say this one definitely will, but it's a possibility. Though I do get that doing so might cannibalize some of their funding (why back for an extra $20 to get 4 destroids if you end up with 4 in the box?) but some of those folks might back for 6 instead, or simply adjust what they want (get another Veritech wing for an extra $5 or whatever instead).
Edit 2: and as noted, the next one is a free add on to the tiers that qualify. Edit 3: that we're only 10k away from.
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Post by: Manchu
Well, it certainly was a stretch goal. But it wasn't a free stretch goal.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
I think they'll actually have a fair number of disgruntled people if they try to stick with their double-speak. Including "All Unlocked Stretch Goals" and then trying to limit that is not exactly going to win you fans, especially when leaving it out of the bullet point only saved you 5 characters of internet type space, which is for all intents and purposes infinite.
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Post by: Manchu
vitae_drinker wrote:I think they'll actually have a fair number of disgruntled people if they try to stick with their double-speak.
Here we go ... The main page under Battle Cry says: For those of you looking to maximize your free goodies, Battle Cry is the pledge to have. Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.
You did not did not read it very carefully when you originally quoted it. It says "free stretch goals." We know about two stretch goals so far. One says it's an add-on. The other explicitly says it comes with Battle Cry. So there's no double speak.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
Manchu wrote:vitae_drinker wrote:I think they'll actually have a fair number of disgruntled people if they try to stick with their double-speak.
Here we go ... The main page has under Battle Cry says: For those of you looking to maximize your free goodies, Battle Cry is the pledge to have. Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.
You did not did not read it very carefully when you originally quoted it. It says "free stretch goals." We know about two stretch goals so far. One says it's an add-on. The other explicitly says it comes with Battle Cry. So there's no double speak.
Well, to say one thing ("All Unlocked Stretch Goals") and then to immediately change it ("Battle Cry pledges will receive all future unlocked free stretch goals.") is rather disingenious. Would you sign a contract that state one thing, but then immediately changed that statement in the next clause? By entering into a Kickstarter pledge, that's essentially what the supporters are doing. Rather shady.
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Post by: Ironwill13791
I have to agree. It doesn't look like there is any double speak to me.
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Post by: warboss
I think we're overlooking the important point that the part that may or may not be contradictory was right after the first statement which, if you grade Palladium on a curve of their own products, deserves an A+. If they had followed their usual editing and writing styles, the clarification would have been buried in the middle of a paragraph about the warehouse in the "About Us" section of the kickstarter. That's progress, people!!
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Post by: vitae_drinker
warboss wrote:I think we're overlooking the important point that the part that may or may not be contradictory was right after the first statement which, if you grade Palladium on a curve of their own products, deserves an A+. If they had followed their usual editing and writing styles, the clarification would have been buried in the middle of a paragraph about the warehouse in the "About Us" section of the kickstarter. That's progress, people!!
If Kevin had admitted there was a problem at all... "Which one is right, Kevin?" "No, no, that's how it is intended to work!" "Wait...what? That's not what I asked..." "Nothing needs to be fixed!" "What are you talking about? And why do you use so many exclamation points?" "That's how it's always worked!" "Wha-....huh?" So, yeah, that is much better than usual.
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Post by: TalonZahn
It just hit 125k.
I don't think they anticipated this cash influx, lol.
I need Stretch goals of Fokker, Max, Ben, Super Valks, MORE! MORE! MORE!
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Post by: Manchu
$125k Stretch Goal reached ...
$150k Stretch Goal posted ...
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Post by: TalonZahn
Looks like a Gnerl fighter!
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Post by: Alpharius
The $20 paid add-ons are coming fast and furious!
I'm not that much of a Robotech fanatic... they are starting to annoy me!
I have no idea what I'd 'need' to have, 'want' to have...ugh!
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Post by: warboss
It's a cool free addition only because it can apparently be made into a VF-1S which I don't think the ones in the starter nor the additional sprue can do. Otherwise it would be a very lackluster addition.
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Post by: Necros
maybe I missed it .. but do the models actually transform? Or are you buying and painting 3 different versions of the same guy?
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
Alpharius wrote:The $20 paid add-ons are coming fast and furious!
I'm not that much of a Robotech fanatic... they are starting to annoy me!
I have no idea what I'd 'need' to have, 'want' to have...ugh!
Whatever looks the coolest.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Necros wrote:maybe I missed it .. but do the models actually transform? Or are you buying and painting 3 different versions of the same guy?
It reads that you get 4 Valks in all 3 modes for a total of 12 minis.
They need to leave the reached goals on the front page too.
It's a cool free addition only because it can apparently be made into a VF-1S which I don't think the ones in the starter nor the additional sprue can do. Otherwise it would be a very lackluster addition.
Can't agree more with this statement. At first it appears to be "meh" but since it has all the options, it's much better.
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
Necros wrote:maybe I missed it .. but do the models actually transform? Or are you buying and painting 3 different versions of the same guy?
Multipose - but I do not believe they are transforming (that is why they have different figures for the Fighter, Guardian, and Battloid modes.
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Post by: vitae_drinker
Necros wrote:maybe I missed it .. but do the models actually transform? Or are you buying and painting 3 different versions of the same guy?
Each Veritech sprue should let you built 1 jet, 1 guardian, and 1 battleoid.
Zentradi Battlepods look like 2 per sprue.
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Post by: Forar
I'd be okay with alternating free and paid add-ons, especially if the latter become the former over time.
Also, someone was lamenting the LE Rick Hunter mini. In the update they clarified that like the other add ons you can buy one (or more) like any other add on, just add the extra $15 (x how many you want) and they'll sort it out at the end.
Not that I want to see a bunch of people down-pledging, but better that people get something they want/are happy with than simply bumping up the total a few bucks but leaving people feeling frustrated that they can't customize to get what they want.
Gotta say, coming off the Malifaux RPG kickstarter (which was all "ADD ONS? HOW DARE YOU! NO WE DO THIS OUR WAY!!"), the tier customization is pretty awesome. Even if it's just par for the course for most others.
To be pedantic, they seem to be 3 per sprue.
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Post by: Necros
So those 3 models are like 3 different characters? I just assumed it was 1 guy that had 3 different modes.
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Post by: Forar
Necros wrote:So those 3 models are like 3 different characters? I just assumed it was 1 guy that had 3 different modes.
Nope, you had it right, 3 models for 1 figure that can transform. I mean, you don't literally shape shift the figure like lego, but yes, you probably replace one figure with another when you change modes.
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Post by: TalonZahn
I believe that it is "1 guy, 3 modes".
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Post by: warboss
TalonZahn wrote:
Can't agree more with this statement. At first it appears to be "meh" but since it has all the options, it's much better.
Depending on how they actually do the kit, it might be incredibly useful. If they have 3 heads for each mode (A, J, S) which I'd expect since they're saying they're going for accuracy then you could make another starter set model an officer version as well.
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Post by: RogueRegault
Necros wrote:I thought this was gonna be the Robotech Battles game a buddy of mine made, but he just said it's not .. he was still part of the development though so that's something.
dilema now is... spend my cash on my secret weapon board, or this one? can't do both :/
Was never a huge Robotech fan but the models look good. Can't they do robots based on more modern planes, instead of Top Gun stuff? Or is it sacrilege to even think it?
There aren't any in the three series that formed Robotech.
In the later Macross series, they stuck to the F-14 look. When asked why none of the new Valkyries looked like F-22s, Shoji Kawamori replied "Because the F-22 is hideously ugly."
I'm guessing Ghosts will be up after the Gnerls. They'll probably want to wait a while before springing the Monster as a stretch goal.
I just hope they do a full line of Zentraedai mechs.
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Post by: warboss
Alpharius wrote:The $20 paid add-ons are coming fast and furious!
I'm not that much of a Robotech fanatic... they are starting to annoy me!
I have no idea what I'd 'need' to have, 'want' to have...ugh!
I guess the answer would depend on your level of nostalgia in the IP. I'd imagine the few Southern Cross superfans who posted would be interested more in the destroids as they're centered more on ground combat (like the veritech hovertanks). For me personally, I'm all about the zentraedi and Valkyries/Veritechs. Unless the rules for them are super duper, you'll likely find my destroids in my swap shop thread around Jan 2014. For me personally, the first paid add on is at best a one time buy just to get a single variant of each destroid assuming I keep any of them (see above). If you want to do space combat versus aliens, stick with the core set so far. I imagine the next free add on (after this upcoming paid fighter that is next at 150k) will either be another glaug officers pod or a power armor.
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Post by: TalonZahn
There were tons of Destroids in the original series. They used to go out on the decks of the carriers and provide fire support from there.
Also, when the SDF-1 performed the Daedalus Maneuver and punched a Zentradi ship, the front of the carrier was loaded with Destroids. The ship would open up inside and the Destroids would open fire before the doors would close and the arm pulled out.
They also provided general security in the city all the time.
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Post by: warboss
Is anyone disputing that?
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Post by: TalonZahn
I was merely commenting on - Southern Cross superfans would be interested more (more than Original Series fans I got as your intent) in the destroids.
So some people might be interested in destroids base solely of the things I mentioned from the Original series. They weren't really a Southern Cross thing.
Either way, I want more destroids that don't come as paid add-ons.
Also, I'll just preemptively let you know that if you are looking to off load yours, keep my info for PM handy. 
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Post by: RogueRegault
Am I the only one hoping for a decal sheet as a stretch goal?
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Post by: Manchu
That's a fantastic idea. If you've already pledged, you really should write that in as a comment on the Updates!
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Post by: warboss
TalonZahn wrote: I was merely commenting on - Southern Cross superfans would be interested more (more than Original Series fans I got as your intent) in the destroids. So some people might be interested in destroids base solely of the things I mentioned from the Original series. They weren't really a Southern Cross thing. Either way, I want more destroids that don't come as paid add-ons. Also, I'll just preemptively let you know that if you are looking to off load yours, keep my info for PM handy.
No, that wasn't my intent. I was merely giving a single example from the thread of someone who *might* be interested in things that don't necessarily interest me and it wasn't meant as an all encompassing statement. No worries though. I don't think they'll have full destroids as free add ons frankly though. With veritechs, they have some relatively inexpensive things they can throw in like armored bits and super veritech booster bits (sorry, using the old robotech terms). There really isn't an equivalent freebie that I know of on the destroid front. Possible Bits: Super Veritech Parts (arm missiles, boosters, leg armor, etc) Armored Veritech Parts (armor and missile bays for every part of a normal Valkyrie kit) Glaug Rocket Booster ELINT Conversion Parts Regult Recon Variant Parts Regult Missle Variant Parts Possible Full Models Yet to be Revealed: Male Power Armor Female Power Armor Rick Hunter's Civilian Plane Ghost Fighter Flying Double Barrelled Laser Cannon thingee with a helicopter blade MAC II Zentraedi Generic Armored Infantry Zentraedi Generic Unarmored Infantry Zentraedi Characters (Both Unarmored and Armored) Then there are the items that are likely too stupid to be made (like floating zentraedi transport platforms) and things likely too large in size for an initial game like the Cyclops Recon craft and AWACs plane. Am I missing anything from the list above? I just don't see much wiggle room for free destroid stuff above except maybe a GU-11 gun pack for Gladiators.
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Post by: TalonZahn
A collection of Bits Frames would be an awesome and easy add on as well.
I'm hoping for character model add-ons too.
[Edit] I also love that it's the same scale as Battletech. Should go well with my way too extensive collection of mechs and my metal "unseen"
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Post by: GamesNGears
decal sheet would be awesome
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
Next goal incoming
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Post by: Ironwill13791
$150,000 reached. Now time to see the next stretch goal.
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Post by: TalonZahn
So the $180k goal looks like 3 more pods in the box.
Still not a fan of these purchase add-ons.
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Post by: warboss
Hopefully they'll be standard starter set add-ons plus a little something extra like the VF-1A outline was (with the parts to make a J or S variant). I'd be ok with 3 more pods if they were light/heavy missile variants. Lets face it.. three more free pods is still three free pods and not something bad. I'd just rather have something maybe less "valuable" but more unique instead like the missile pod kits (with or without the core pods).
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Post by: Barzam
If you mean the VE-1 Elint Seeker, don't bet on it since that's a DYRL design and Harmony Gold never got the rights for it. Now, if it's a VEFR-1, that's totally doable, but those aren't option packs on them. The VEFR-1's radome is a permanent attachment. Supposedly they also lack hands and a head.
warboss wrote:
Flying Double Barrelled Laser Cannon thingee with a helicopter blade
That's the Lancer II that I mentioned.
Yes you are.
-There's the YF-1R or whatever they called it from the PS2 videogame that was based on an animation error from near the end of the show (maroon, 3 head lasers)
-Mig Karyovin- seen in a flashback, I believe, from the Unification Wars
-Dragon II- seen in the same flashback
-the UN's naval choppers from the first episode.
-The Easter Egg VF-1A w/ Orguss armor
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Post by: Dewgan
Woot! Take my money!
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Post by: CIsaac
Nostalgia... or pocket book? Nostalgia.... pocket book?
I DON'T KNOW! OH MY GOD I LOVED ROBOTECH SO MUCH.
$140 seems like not toooooo much for a gak ton of liquid awesome.
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Post by: warboss
TalonZahn wrote:So the $180k goal looks like 3 more pods in the box.
Still not a fan of these purchase add-ons.
Not a fan in terms of not liking the idea of purchase add ons or not liking the actual add ons themselves? I'm a bit surprised with Palladium adding something more tangible than a d6 as a freebie frankly so I'll take what they offer. So far, the free VF-1S add on to the lackluster VF-1A outline was a pleasant surprise.
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Post by: Alpharius
I'm guessing he's not a fan of having to pay $20 to get something from every other stretch goal.
I could be wrong though.
I cannot believe how fast this one is going.
At this rate, this will end up being a very expensive campaign for the completists among us!
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Post by: Cypher-xv
I hope they add the lightning fighter. It's seen towards the end of the series,with Rick playing with a model of one. I wonder if they'll produce figs from the movie Macross II. I remember having some of the RPG books.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Yea, having to purchase add-on is kind of a downer when compared to other Kickstarters where they give away everything but the kitchen sink.
I love what they are offering, and honestly $20 for 2 minis isn't anything out of the ordinary for the market today.
I saved up and am fully prepared to drop $500 on this thing despite the fact I own enough Robotech stuff to make Carl Macek puke.
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Post by: Kalamadea
I'm not a fan of the additional models being paid addons. I don't really want 3 more Veritechs or 3 more battlepods, I'd MUCH rather have 2 Gnerls or a Gladiator&Spartan instead
That said, DAMNIT! Stupid work, not letting me get in on the earlybird floor! Now I have to pay $140 like a chump :( Work is SO lucky it's giving me money to buy this or we'd be having some words, he and I!
Can't WAIT for Zentraedi female power armor and armored infantry! I expect to at least double my pledge at that point.
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Post by: warboss
Yeah, the KS is going fast but frankly no other kickstarter we've had covered on dakka to my knowledge has involved a pop culture phenomenon that happened to occur during the average veteran gamer's childhood. I suppose a power ranger minis game kickstarter with lots of zords and rubbery monsters will be the smash hit of 2023.
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Post by: Alpharius
Ha!
Right now is THE time to Kickstart anything popular in gamer-geek culture from 1980 through to maybe early 1990's.
We've now got disposable income, and apparently we're not afraid to use it.
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Post by: judgedoug
Yeah, I said "feth it" and dropped $500 now because I know I'll be doing it later on anyway.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
LOL, I have a feeling I will go over my set budget as well, especially when the Female Power Armors become available.
This is one of my favorite fight scenes even if not from Robotech, it's expressive what Miriya pulls off.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7TYNPeRWPZc
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Post by: warboss
I forgot about the pulsating brains! I'll definitely go in for a pair of FPAs but I don't think I'll reach some of the wallet busting prices being mentioned in the thread. As much as I like Robotech, I still haven't met anyone locally that shares my interest and I've already got one robot game that I can't find a scene for in my collection. I've had a Robotech ring tone for certain gaming friends and so far only one stranger/acquaintence knew what the heck it was. I'll be OK with 3 squadrons of 2 generic pilots and 1 officer type veritech each... so I only need one officer more to get there with my blitzkrieg pledge. The only other things I'd want are maybe some armor upgrades for the veritechs as well as freebies. As for zentraedi, the fighters are tempting but I'd prefer some missile pods upgrades and maybe another Glaug plus two FPAs as paid add ons. A small amount of armored infantry (3-6) would be nice as a freebie but I'm not sure I'd buy them as a paid add on. I'm very meh on the destroids personally so maybe I can work out a trade deal with them as I only actually want to keep a MAC II. I might be able to squeak in under $200 with the above.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
What's the big game in your area, I know you've mentioned X-wing, what else see a lot of play?
So in the earlier Rick versus Luke Skywalker conversation, what about Miriya versus Luke? Any bets, mine money would be on Miriya.
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Post by: judgedoug
see, I personally have always been a fan of Destroids and ground combat way more than the aerial combat stuff.
I really want Zentraedi Botoru (Male) Powered Armor and Armored Zentraedi Infantry so I can do post-Zentraedi wasteland patrols between Destroids and renegade guerrilla Zentraedi units.
I also really really really want some Bioroids and Invid to fight. I still love the scenes in the Sentinels where the Invid overwhelm the Bioroid defenders... so awesome.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
The Malcontent uprising opens up lots of gaming ideas, I could see how they can also introduce the VHT-1s early since they started to appear during the uprising in use by units such as Jonathan Wolfe's Wolf Pack.
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Post by: warboss
UN Test Pilot wrote:What's the big game in your area, I know you've mentioned X-wing, what else see a lot of play? So in the earlier Rick versus Luke Skywalker conversation, what about Miriya versus Luke? Any bets, mine money would be on Miriya.
I haven't gotten down to full character details so I won't hazard a guess just yet... but I'd say the answer depends on which Luke she's fighting. Farmboy or Jedi Knight makes a difference. 40k is very popular as is Warmachine with WHFB as a distant third. Malifaux seemed to make an initial push but I haven't seen anyone playing that in a while (although I only go to the store around once a month on weekends) and I don't think I've ever seen anyone playing Infinity. Clix stuff is long gone as well. Occasionally, you get a preplanned meeting of people to play something in particular (like a Mongoose Star Trek meet up a few weeks back when I picked up my Tau Codex). Magic and Pathfinder are the popular card and roleplaying games that see regular play. There's a pretty active historical group that plays at the local store and they play everything and anything (switching from LOTR with classic 80's rules to NASCAR diecast car races with 6ft long speedways modelled that they bring in... not kidding!) but I haven't seen them playing anything other than FOW and Bolt Action that was published in the past decade. Automatically Appended Next Post: judgedoug wrote:see, I personally have always been a fan of Destroids and ground combat way more than the aerial combat stuff. I really want Zentraedi Botoru (Male) Powered Armor and Armored Zentraedi Infantry so I can do post-Zentraedi wasteland patrols between Destroids and renegade guerrilla Zentraedi units. I also really really really want some Bioroids and Invid to fight. I still love the scenes in the Sentinels where the Invid overwhelm the Bioroid defenders... so awesome.
For me the most interesting "ground" combat scenes were the ones in defence of macross city (as in my avatar pic) involving veritechs and Miryia's romp through the SDF-1 City before scooting back out. The armored infantry does sound cool as I'd like to throw them into a city scene versus veritechs in a Macross City defence type scenario. What's important is that we can all agree on a few key things... namely that Minmei was annoying and Kyle was a douche!
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Post by: Barzam
But, but but... Kyle's a kung-fu master!
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Post by: Manchu
Anyone else currently getting a KS error message for this project? We apologize, but it looks like something's gone wrong. We've been notified about this issue, and we're currently looking into it.
Thanks for your patience, and sorry for the inconvenience. Please try again later.
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Post by: DaveC
It's happening on all projects - I logged out and logged in again and it sorted it but when I refreshed a little later same message so log out and in again.
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Post by: Manchu
Cleared up now, anyhow.
EDIT: Spoke too soon.
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Post by: Alpharius
Sheesh - that $180K stretch goal will fall any minute now!
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Post by: Manchu
$180k Stretch Goal met:  $220k Stretch Goal teased: Once we reach $220,000 the Destroid Pack will be DOUBLED in size. In addition, every pack will come with enough parts to make all four game pieces any combination of Tomahawks and/or Defenders.
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Post by: CaptKaruthors
Awesome. Stretch goals keep on coming. I want a M.A.C. II!!!
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Post by: Manchu
Personally, I really like the last few stretch goals as they are adding value to the core product. On the other hand, however, I hope whatever comes after $220k is a little more exciting.
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote:Personally, I really like the last few stretch goals as they are adding value to the core product. On the other hand, however, I hope whatever comes after $220k is a little more exciting.
I suspect we'll see a bunch of these (not a complaint but rather an observation) that add value to add ons to encourage people to add to their total pledge amount at no additional tooling cost (like would be the case with making a new model). I was hoping that the regults wouldn't be just standard ones but it looks like they are. Still 3 more pods is still 3 more "free" pods.
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Post by: Alpharius
So the paid add-ons are becoming 'better values' with these stretch goals?
I admit - it isn't clear to me...
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Post by: Lt. Coldfire
Alpharius wrote:So the paid add-ons are becoming 'better values' with these stretch goals?
I admit - it isn't clear to me...
Yeah, at the next stretch goal, the "Destroid Pack" is being doubled in size. It's an add-on for $20, so it'll be made twice as sweet. It is a bit confusing though, but what isn't on KS.
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Post by: Alpharius
Good point - and it makes the add-ons a lot more attractive...
Thanks!
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Post by: Manchu
warboss wrote:I was hoping that the regults wouldn't be just standard ones but it looks like they are.
I'm hoping for Heavy and Light Artillery upgrade kits as later stretch goals.
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Post by: Alpharius
Does the box set come with some sort of playmat?
Are there going to be terrain rules, and appropriately sizes terrain?
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Post by: warboss
Alpharius wrote:Does the box set come with some sort of playmat?
Are there going to be terrain rules, and appropriately sizes terrain?
I suspect that there is no playmat as there would be no reason to not list it in the core set contents. Sounds like a good and cheap idea (even if just made on paper) for a free stretch goal. Hopefully the Dakkites at Adepticon will get a chance to catch up on the thread and ask the questions during their demos. Automatically Appended Next Post: Manchu wrote: warboss wrote:I was hoping that the regults wouldn't be just standard ones but it looks like they are.
I'm hoping for Heavy and Light Artillery upgrade kits as later stretch goals.
Indeed. I've been trying to moderate my comments (no pun intended) with the idea that this is a 30+ day Kickstarter and that not everything I want will pop up on day 1 or 2.
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Post by: Manchu
We know virtually nothing about gameplay as of yet. Mr. Siembieda confirmed it involves squadron-based activation turns, uses inches for movement measurement (not hex/grid), that there will be character-specific rules, that there is a MDC stat, and that one Veritech is worth about three Regults.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
Another bonus of the next goal is that you can choose to make all 4 Destroids Defenders or Tomahawks instead of 2 of each. The Intial add on was just 1 Defender and 1 Tomahawk, not modular like in the base game. So you get 8 upper bodies and 4 legs, not to bad.
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Post by: Alpharius
warboss wrote:
Indeed. I've been trying to moderate my comments (no pun intended) with the idea that this is a 30+ day Kickstarter and that not everything I want will pop up on day 1 or 2.
Maybe yes, maybe no!
At the pace this thing's moving you might get everything on your wish list sooner rather than later!
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Post by: CaptKaruthors
They considered terrain based on the scale. Apparently there is lots of 3rd party terrain that is in the scale of the game. We'll see. I like that it's squad activation instead of IGOUGO.
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
"His name's Kyle! I'm gonna fix him good!"
This scene stands out in my head more than any other scene for some bizarre reason. More so than Max's video game battle, shower scenes, kissing scenes, mecha porn, or Itano circuses. Kyle flying around kung-fuing up the screen is a defining moment in Macross history.
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Post by: Lt. Coldfire
Are there any scale shots of these minis comparing them to other miniature lines?
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
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Post by: Lt. Coldfire
Ah, thank you!
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Post by: warboss
Cool link. I think that's the first peek we get at the veritech datacard.  I a bit concerned about all those close combat options as its not a focus of Robotech in general. One or maybe two max close combat options for a veritech is enough... I don't think it needs 5 whereas the Gu-11 gun pod seemingly gets 1. Judging from the speeds, it looks like the top row is the Battloid followed by Gerwalk and Jet. I'm curious if the GU-11 only being listed under battloid means you can only fire it in that mode. I seem to remember a little scene with rookie civi rick firing the GU-11 at a pod in his inaugural veritech flight.
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Post by: highlord tamburlaine
That card is going to be busy if it's covered with all kinds of markers. Doesn't look very large either, considering it's for the entire squad.
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Post by: Manchu
That is a tiny play space:
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Post by: Cyporiean
Well it is for demoing in a crowded hall.
1
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Post by: warboss
It's enough for quick 4 round/15-20 minute demos. Both Warmachine and Heavy Gear used a similarly sized setup for demos at Gencon when I used to go a few years back.
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Post by: GamesNGears
Looks great. We think that is a 2 by 2 demo table. Which a lot of booths use in conventions. Although we cannot wait to see mass scale armies on a 6 by 4.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
So from looking at the Video yesterday, a Squad of Regaults appears to be 6, and they had 5 Damage boxes each, the Tomahawks were in squads of 2 and had 24 damage boxes, wonder if that 80 on the left side of the VF card is point cost for the squad.
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Post by: Manchu
Gotta say, I do like the look of the terrain there. The shattered building is very cool.
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Post by: TalonZahn
OK, got a couple free minutes at work to check out the updates since I first checked this morning.
The 220k stretch, to me, is another weak stretch goal. It upgrades a purchased add-on? Maybe it should upgrade the contents of the main box. It would even be better to upgrade the other Destroid add-on instead.
I'm really hoping that these weaker stretch goals are because of their anticipation that this KS is going to generate a ton of money and they're saving "the good stuff" for later on.
So far I'm not seeing too much that's begging for more money to be thrown down in good amounts. This just seems to be getting run so different to many, many, other Kickstarter and Indiegogo projects for games. So much opportunity for low cost, high value add-on stuff that's been suggested too. People need to keep it up in the Comments area about, decals, bits frames, bases, and so on.
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Post by: Gitzbitah
I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.
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Post by: Manchu
Can someone give me a quick history between Macross/Robotech and Battletech?
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Post by: TalonZahn
Gitzbitah wrote:I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.
However, as I stated, if they would just up the count on the box by 2, you'd get the same thing and not have to spend another $20 on top of the boxed set.
So this Stretch Goal basically caters to people that are more than likely spending less money, by getting just the add-on boxes, than those getting the boxed set alone or boxed set plus add-ons.
Seems like a backwards way to reward the folks that are more than likely your biggest spenders.
Maybe that's why it doesn't sit right with me.
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Post by: Manchu
Think of it this way: what is the intended MSRP of a squadron (apparently 2 models) of destroids? Is it $10 or $20? When I say, MSRP, I mean how much will it cost in general release? Because it would be kind of lame to spend $20 for 2 models during the kickstarter and only pay $20 for 4 models after. See where I'm going? The stretch goals are probably taking into account that Palladium/Ninja Div were totally confident that they'd be reached.
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Post by: Gitzbitah
TalonZahn wrote:Gitzbitah wrote:I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.
However, as I stated, if they would just up the count on the box by 2, you'd get the same thing and not have to spend another $20 on top of the boxed set.
So this Stretch Goal basically caters to people that are more than likely spending less money, by getting just the add-on boxes, than those getting the boxed set alone or boxed set plus add-ons.
Seems like a backwards way to reward the folks that are more than likely your biggest spenders.
Maybe that's why it doesn't sit right with me.
That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.
Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.
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Post by: Manchu
Gitzbitah wrote:I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.
I don't think anyone can fault you for that! It's an unspoken goal of this KS after all ...
Anyhow, you're not detracting from us folks who want to play Robotech. The more dollars you add, the more stretch goals get unlocked. I look at it this way: if it weren't for the add on options, the project would be less likely to get any of your dollars.
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote:Think of it this way: what is the intended MSRP of a squadron (apparently 2 models) of destroids? Is it $10 or $20? When I say, MSRP, I mean how much will it cost in general release? Because it would be kind of lame to spend $20 for 2 models during the kickstarter and only pay $20 for 4 models after. See where I'm going? The stretch goals are probably taking into account that Palladium/Ninja Div were totally confident that they'd be reached.
They haven't come out with the MSRPs but my assumption (and it's just that) is that the original add on prices will be the MSRPs. It's likely that the stretch goals are already predetermined and are a mix of adding free stuff (whether models or bits for variety) to the core box, free stuff to existing paid add ons, and completely new items. $20 for two large plastic models of terminator size or larger is a fair retail value. Doubling that during the kickstarter for add ons is a fair offer for early adopters as well. As pointed out earlier, doubling the box content destroids (when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out) would likely satisfy the average consumer's demand for those models and not generate as much additional money as increasing the value of the paid add on packs.
@Gitzbitah: There is always trading.... I don't think it'll be too hard to find someone who is willing to trade at a comparable "retail" value (so $5 per destroid with the upcoming stretch goal and $4 per battle pod with the current add on price).
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Post by: TalonZahn
Gitzbitah wrote:That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.
Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.
This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.
People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.
At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.
You need to check yourself before you reply.
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Post by: Manchu
Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.
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Post by: warboss
TalonZahn wrote:Gitzbitah wrote:That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.
Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.
This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.
People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.
At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.
You need to check yourself before you reply.
If he's being disparaging, it's to himself. We've got enough mods posting in the thread so I'll let them do their red text job but I will pipe in with this... I believe you need to add "wreck yourself" for the proper reply.
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Post by: shade1313
TalonZahn wrote:Gitzbitah wrote:That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.
Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.
This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.
People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.
At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.
You need to check yourself before you reply.
I am massively confused about what you found so offensive in his reply. I don't see anything there that needs you calling him names over, and at the moment, your response seems totally unwarranted.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Manchu wrote:Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.
The manner and phrasing of his "self-depricating remarks" came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here.
This: It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company.
Is passive-agressive BS.
So if he spends $20 and get a $20 bonus, great.
I don't think that's the way to go for a Kickstarter, and neither do any of the other companies that have come before.
You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.
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Post by: Manchu
TalonZahn wrote:came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here
Use the report function. Responding like that will get you suspended.TalonZahn wrote:You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.
Thanks to the franchise crossover, this is a special case.
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Post by: shade1313
TalonZahn wrote: Manchu wrote:Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.
The manner and phrasing of his "self-depricating remarks" came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here.
So if he spends $20 and get a $20 bonus, great.
I don't think that's the way to go for a Kickstarter, and neither do any of the other companies that have come before.
You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.
Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.
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Post by: Manchu
warboss wrote:(when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out)
That's true from a Robotech POV but what about Battletech? I know there's a premium for Unseen but having other plastic mecha for BT is pretty huge, too. I know that is one of the things that has kept me from getting into BT.
From WilhelmRochRedDuke on Robotech Battles: Speed (SPD) – movement.
Gunnery (GN) – accuracy.
Defense (DF) – damage resistance.
Piloting (PIL) – performance.
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Post by: judgedoug
Manchu wrote:Can someone give me a quick history between Macross/Robotech and Battletech?
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Macross: tv show in Japan in 1982, 36 episodes
Robotech: Harmony Gold bought license for Macross (and other shows) but US TV required 65 episodes for daily syndication; Carl Macek edited together Macross, Southern Cross, Mospeada to make the 85 episode space opera known as Robotech. it's called Robotech only because at that time REVELL was releasing japanese model kits in the USA under the name Robotech
Battletech: originally Battledroids (C&D by George Lucas made it become Battletech). FASA licensed Macross designs (and other designs from Crusher Joe, Dougram, etc) but not from Harmony Gold, and there was a big ol court case in the 90's, and then FASA/then WIZKIDS/then CATALYST don't use the designs anymore (now called the "unseens") and obviously the old minis of them are way out of print and hard to get
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Post by: TalonZahn
shade1313 wrote:Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.
Do try to keep up.
I already stated my displeasure before he began the passive-agressive garbage.
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Post by: Manchu
Okay, please direct any criticism anyone has about this KS at the KS. Personal attacks are against this site's rules. I'll delete further posts on this outburst as off-topic. Thanks!
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Post by: shade1313
TalonZahn wrote:shade1313 wrote:Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.
Do try to keep up.
I already stated my displeasure before he began the passive-agressive garbage.
<deleted out of courtesy to Manchu. He's right, this is nonsense that is not on topic>
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Post by: Ironwill13791
The figures look awesome all painted and with that great cityscape.
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Post by: Manchu
judgedoug wrote:Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote: warboss wrote:(when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out)
That's true from a Robotech POV but what about Battletech? I know there's a premium for Unseen but having other plastic mecha for BT is pretty huge, too. I know that is one of the things that has kept me from getting into BT.
I can only comment from my perspective as a Robotech fan and Robotech gamer in that I've almost universally noticed in both minis games and RPG sessions over 15 years (both locally and at gencon) that Veritechs were more popular than destroids. My only experience with Unseen in Battletech was buying the plastic starter that had all the plastic unseen around 15 years ago and selling it last year. I'm not sure from a 2025 or whatever year perspective which unseen are considered better for their role/points costs in battletech so I can't comment about the utility of them for that purpose.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
Never mind miss read your earlier post
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Post by: Manchu
So going by Robotech Battles ...
VF-1 Jet Mode
Speed (movement): 12
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 2
VF-1 Guardian Mode
Speed (movement): 10
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 3
Battroid Mode:
Speed (movement): 5
Gunnery (accuracy): 3
Defense (damage resistance): 5
Piloting (performance): 2
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Post by: warboss
Manchu wrote: judgedoug wrote:Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?
Jetfire was also changed from that in both future toys AND in his initial appearance in the cartoon to specifically not look like the original macros looking toy. Apparently there were some lawsuits flinged around regarding who could and couldn't use the design and the fight stretched into the 90's.
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Post by: Manchu
Thanks ... but I have seen RoboTech! (Okay, not in a few years but you know what I mean.) I was asking about the legal history between Harmony Gold and FASA.
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Post by: judgedoug
Manchu wrote: judgedoug wrote:Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?
they got upset about ALL macross designs. that's why there's no more warhammer (tomahawk), rifleman (defender), archer (spartan), longbow (phalanx), wasp/stinger/phoenix hawk/crusader (veritech valkyrie), marauder (glaug) ost-mechs (regult), etc etc.
and Jetfire was a Super VF-1S because they licensed specifically the Takatoku/Bandai toy of the Super VF-1S from Japan.
Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
Yeah misread your post edited my last one after I saw that.
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Post by: Manchu
judgedoug wrote:Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.
That explains why I can only remember owning a diecast Defender ... I think I had Chibi veritechs, though, which could transform into Chibi battroids.
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Post by: Gitzbitah
My apologies!
I was simply being honest about my satisfaction in the stretch goal, and what I intended to use the product for.
I used the Battletech names because that's what they are to me, and I thought it might be helpful to others like me who are seeking Unseen to see those names in a post.
All of my colorful characterizations of my low contributions were intended for nothing more than a laugh, and again to illustrate that I am not their target audience.
I am unreservedly thrilled to see both the quality and quantity of the models displayed, and will restrict myself to discussion of such in the future in this thread.
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Post by: Forar
Manchu wrote: judgedoug wrote:Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?
It's my understanding that HG was pretty peeved about the whole thing. There are a good dozen+ crossovers in one of the first Battletech novels I ever read, with handy images in the back that make it clear exactly what is being referenced. Officers Pod = Marauder, Raider-X/Defender = Rifleman, Battloid = Stinger, Super Battloid (I believe) = Phoenix Hawk. Warhammer, Archer, there's a giant list that sadly covers most of the mechs I loved in both series, so I'm always annoyed when there's a Battletech game and it lacks those favourites (for good reason, of course).
As I recall, the Jetfire toy was literally a modified (in the production process) Veritech Fighter. Changed some of the colours, etc.
I always wanted one of those when I was a kid, and when someone pointed out the crossover years ago it blew my mind. Wish I could find one, but even a reasonable condition one on ebay is usually around "$Texas" by the time the auction ends. Automatically Appended Next Post: Related to the KS campaign, I'll say this much; I'm honestly a little worried that the reports from Adepticon will be that the game is quick, easy to learn, hard to master and fun as all get out.
I'm not sure my wallet or I would survive the encounter if that's the case. I'm trying to avoid buying into extras, especially early (I'm lazy and don't feel like adjusting my pledge up and down every few days as stretch goals are hit), but by the end I know I'll probably be in for at least a 'booster pack' or two. Beef up the Destroid numbers, maybe enhance what the Zentraedi can field a little, keep things interesting without breaking the bank (much more than it already will, yeesh, $160 in, probably end up around 200+? Let's keep this between us, fellas, eh?)
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Post by: shade1313
A couple years ago, I came across a toy that appeared to have been made from the Jetfire molds, in a dark grey color. I have it in a storage bin somewhere in my garage, right now.
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Post by: warboss
Just thinking about it from a robotech perspective... getting two core sets is still a better "value" than getting the $140 early bird set currently if you're building forces (assuming you don't put much value on the art print and single Rick Hunter sculpt). This is of course assuming that their offer of additional core set add ons at $70 still applies (which I can't find at the moment).
Two core sets for $150: 10 full Valkyries including two officers, 4 destroids, 24 battle pods, 2 glaugs (plus two rulebooks and double the dice).
Battlecry Level for $140: 8 full valkyries including two officers, 2 destroids, 21 battle pods, 1 glaug (plus art print, VF-1J Rick Hunter Battloid only, and bits for a VF-1S variant)
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Post by: Forar
You make a good point, Warboss, but I suspect by the end of the campaign the Battlecry will be at least equal after accounting for all the stretch goals/rewards/bonuses/whatevers.
Also also, I think that breaks down the moment you go international (bloody US campaigns, grumble grumble). Battlecry for $170 versus 2 x First Contact for $220. I got in on the Blitzkrieg, so the lucky ones who got there it's actually $160 vs 220.
$50-60 for 12 extra models, and if they keep up the "paid/free/paid/free" pattern, the goal after 220 should be another free boost to the higher tiers. And of those extra models, most of them are more Veritechs and Battlepods, which I'm guessing would mainly be important if you wanted to try to run multiple games off one box (as I might) or have larger scale games. Otherwise, assuming you'd normally use a Battlecry box's worth of battlepods/veritechs at a time, it's really just $50-60 for 2 more destroids and an Officer's Pod, which you can buy for $40 directly and save a little cash if you really want them. Becomes even better at 220k, since you'd get an Officer's Pod and 4 Destroids (2 and 6 total, respectively) for that amount.
Shouldn't take too many of those to eat up the difference, especially if it's something like adding the 2 recently added destroids to those tiers outright, or something along those lines.
Edited out pedantry.
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Post by: Manchu
warboss wrote:This is of course assuming that their offer of additional core set add ons at $70 still applies (which I can't find at the moment).
I can't find this, either.
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Post by: Forar
Oh, I missed that comment regarding cheaper extra boxes, but it strikes me as odd that they'd have a "buy as many as you like for the Early Bird price past the first box" as an option. Maybe hidden in the comments or the comments on one of the updates? I've been staying on top of this one, but I don't recall seeing that along the way.
Any chance you're misconstruing the notes on the two art tiers (that apparently also applies to the Rick LE battloid) where you can just add that much to your game box pledge and get them as well, as though they were add ons? (tiers as add ons.. that one took a bit to wrap my mind around; tierception!)
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Post by: judgedoug
Manchu wrote: judgedoug wrote:Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.
That explains why I can only remember owning a diecast Defender ... I think I had Chibi veritechs, though, which could transform into Chibi battroids.
Yup but they were chibi so didn't really count. They made a non-transforming Veritech that the Rick figure could pilot.
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Post by: warboss
Forar wrote:Oh, I missed that comment regarding cheaper extra boxes, but it strikes me as odd that they'd have a "buy as many as you like for the Early Bird price past the first box" as an option. Maybe hidden in the comments or the comments on one of the updates? I've been staying on top of this one, but I don't recall seeing that along the way. Any chance you're misconstruing the notes on the two art tiers (that apparently also applies to the Rick LE battloid) where you can just add that much to your game box pledge and get them as well, as though they were add ons? (tiers as add ons.. that one took a bit to wrap my mind around; tierception!)
I tried finding it and cant seem to. The only thing I can find is a comment about getting two from a poster. Maybe I confused or imagined it but I could have sworn that it was there as my initial choice on the front page as I was hedging between the two (getting two core versus getting the $130 early bird). Eh, maybe the minmei attack threw me for a loop... I guess I'll redo it from the perspective of someone pledging twice at First Contact Versus Battlecry. Two core sets for $160: 10 full Valkyries including two officers, 4 destroids, 24 battle pods, 2 glaugs (plus two rulebooks and double the dice). Battlecry Level for $140: 8 full valkyries including two officers, 2 destroids, 21 battle pods, 1 glaug (plus art print, VF-1J Rick Hunter Battloid only, and bits for a VF-1S variant). The battlecry level would have to get another 2 valkyrie set ($25), 2 more destroids ($10 assuming the next stretch goal is met), half a battle pod set ($12.50), and a glaug ($20) for a total of $67.50. The two core boxes would have to get a Rick Hunter Battloid for $15. The art print and VF-1S bits (for me at least) roughly equal the value of extra custom dice and a 2nd rulebook to use at the table for a new relative total of Two Core: $175 Battlecry: $207.50 for as close to an apples to apples comparison as possible (although this is admittedly a granny smith to macintosh one since you can't buy half a battlepod add on). I suspect we'll see some parity between the two in around another two free stretch goals. EDIT: As Forar mentions correctly above, the analysis above is only true for US buyers. The comparison flips if you're playing international shipping twice.
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Post by: Ironwill13791
Any idea where I can read any gameplay previews or comments. I kinda wanna know how the game plays before me or my friend might jump in on it.
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Post by: Cyporiean
Squad based, d6 + modifier rolling mechanics. Pretty simple and quick.
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Post by: Manchu
What I've been able to glean so far: Manchu wrote:Mr. Siembieda confirmed it involves squadron-based activation turns, uses inches for movement measurement (not hex/grid), that there will be character-specific rules, that there is a MDC stat, and that one Veritech is worth about three Regults.
Manchu wrote:So going by Robotech Battles ...
VF-1 Jet Mode
Speed (movement): 12
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 2
VF-1 Guardian Mode
Speed (movement): 10
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 3
Battroid Mode:
Speed (movement): 5
Gunnery (accuracy): 3
Defense (damage resistance): 5
Piloting (performance): 2
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Post by: Cyporiean
There was a 'command' stat as well, it worked slightly like focus in war machine in that you dole it out to your units, providing them with a bonus to doing stuff.
Sorry that's kinda rambly, only go a quick walk through this morning.
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Post by: Manchu
Did you find out anything about the transformation mechanic?
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Post by: Cyporiean
Manchu wrote:Did you find out anything about the transformation mechanic?
No, but I'll likely go pester them some more in a bit... Since they are like 5 feet from me.
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Post by: Manchu
You have my thanks for any info you can pass along!
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Post by: RiTides
These sculpts look a bit unimpressive to me... anyone want to try to change my mind on that? They just don't seem very detailed, and are rather static... old school / nostalgia is cool, but only up to a point.
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Post by: Manchu
Well, as to them being static -- I believe they are poseable.
Other than that, I'm not sure how vehicle sculpts can be dynamic. Basing choices maybe?
The detail level seems fine relative to other mecha products:
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Post by: Ironwill13791
The sculpts look pretty good to me.
I like that it sounds quick and easy to learn. It will be easier to convince my friend to get in on this to play. Awaiting any more info that sneaks out of Adepticon, hopefully it is good news.
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Post by: warboss
 RiTides wrote:These sculpts look a bit unimpressive to me... anyone want to try to change my mind on that? They just don't seem very detailed, and are rather static... old school / nostalgia is cool, but only up to a point.
They are indeed VERY static looking but then you get the odd man out that is posed much better despite them being identical sculpts except for heads. I don't know if that's just artistic license on the renders or what but the models shown so far look very static.
Take a look at the 5th battloid veritech who is "flying" with the clear flight stick. He's not the officer as the one next to him with the gun pointed up matches the VF-1J officer picture in the solo art so he's likely a VF-1A... Are they all poseable? Is just one of 4 poseable? One of two poseable since they're sold in groups of two? No idea.
Another good question for Cy to pass on as these appear to be renders photoshopped into a larger picture rather than actual models.
edit: It appears that the VF-1S image is in the "core" set. I don't know if that means that you get his bits there as well or if that's just an artistic short cut.
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Post by: Cyporiean
They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.
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Post by: Manchu
@warboss: Take a look at the VF-1S's left hand, too.  Cyporiean wrote:They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.
Does it look to you like (looking at Roy, for example) there are any decals or is it freehand?
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Post by: giothulu
I've been waiting for this since it was announced. Looking forward to seeing all the stretch goals.
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Post by: Cyporiean
Manchu wrote:@warboss: Take a look at the VF-1S's left hand, too.
Cyporiean wrote:They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.
Does it look to you like (looking at Roy, for example) there are any decals or is it freehand?
I believe it's freehand.
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Post by: Manchu
Confounded! Ah well ... remember to ask for a decal sheet in the update comments, people! And thanks for answering Cyp! Automatically Appended Next Post: Regarding the $180k Stretch Goal: Palladium wrote:This one only upgrades the Destroid Pack. Not the boxed game.
We still have 31 days, so we'll see what the future holds for the others.
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Post by: Forar
I would love a decal sheet.
I am.. not a talented painter. Getting into Malifaux a year ago has made me give it a shot, and while I'm happy with the results, pro level work it isn't, and if I'm going to be painting up literally 50+ figures by the end of this, a few decals to make Skull One look extra spiffy would be appreciated.
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Post by: Manchu
In all honesty, it would not necessarily be hard for me to make one. But that's kind of all the more reason why you'd think the licensee would do so ...
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Post by: Cyporiean
Decal sheet = Confirmed.
Transforming - beginning of your activation you pick a form for that activation. Each form has pros/cons, Gerwalk is better at defense, Battleoid is better at attack.
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Post by: Manchu
As stretch goal? In starter box? For general release? Or just generally, "we'll make one"? Cyporiean wrote:Transforming - beginning of your activation you pick a form for that activation. Each form has pros/cons, Gerwalk is better at defense, Battleoid is better at attack.
I like that, nice and simple.
It's nice having such a reliable Dakkanaut at Adepticon! Thanks again!
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Post by: warboss
Cool. Could you ask them if the GU-11 only being listed under battloid means you can only use it in that mode?
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Post by: Cyporiean
Not sure how its coming, I'm just getting info as I can in our mutal lulls of people.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
judgedoug wrote: Manchu wrote:Can someone give me a quick history between Macross/Robotech and Battletech?
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.
Macross: tv show in Japan in 1982, 36 episodes
Robotech: Harmony Gold bought license for Macross (and other shows) but US TV required 65 episodes for daily syndication; Carl Macek edited together Macross, Southern Cross, Mospeada to make the 85 episode space opera known as Robotech. it's called Robotech only because at that time REVELL was releasing japanese model kits in the USA under the name Robotech
Battletech: originally Battledroids (C&D by George Lucas made it become Battletech). FASA licensed Macross designs (and other designs from Crusher Joe, Dougram, etc) but not from Harmony Gold, and there was a big ol court case in the 90's, and then FASA/then WIZKIDS/then CATALYST don't use the designs anymore (now called the "unseens") and obviously the old minis of them are way out of print and hard to get
Manchu the Macross/Robotech/Battletech/Jetfire issue is a tangled Gordian Knot of rights issues only the brave dare tackle.
Besides what Doug says we've ended up with different chunks of the original being owned by different companies.
So Big West (or their successor) owns Macross and I assume is responsible for the new translations that came out recently under the Macross name. Not sure how they did that, maybe because their versions are subtitles and not dubbed?
But HG owns Robotech and has exclusive rights to some (but not all) merchendise based on Macross.
They gave a licence to Palladium which (they say) gives them exclusive rights to any tabletop games based on Robotech or Macross.
Big West (or whoever) also owns the various sequels and spinoffs so HG and Palladium cannot use them.
Takara who made most of the toys in Japan licensed the Super Veritech to Hasbro to make Jetfire, but not the TV/comic rights necessitating the creation of 'Skyfire' who's nowhere as cool. It also blocked Matchbox from importing/making VT toys in the US necessitating the selling of the chibi VTs. Not sure what this blocked the sale of smaller scale VT toys but there you go.
Somewhere in there FASA got the rights from BW and other Japanese animators to use their mechs but HG and other licensors in the US objected resulting in their images and minis being removed.
And that's what I know...
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Post by: Manchu
Thanks K_K! The VFs I had were even smaller:
http://www.ecrater.com/p/16424447/macross-robotech-vf-1j-veritech?gps=1
I wish I had gotten the one you posted! Looks awesome.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Still not sure I'll get this...
I mean I've not played a mini game in almost 2 years what with being in TT and all... And the piles of unpainted stuff loom ever higher...
But I do love me some Macross and even Robotech.
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Post by: Alpharius
Update!
Size Chart
Update #9 · Apr 19, 2013 · 8 comments
We've had many, many requests for a size chart and we're happy to oblige! All models are on 40mm bases, except for the Glaug Officer's pod which is on a 50mm base.
NEW SCULPTS!
We're also excited to show you the continued development of the Regult Battlepod sculpts. As you can see they have become very dynamic models, suitable for all your cinematic anime destruction!
MULTIPLE PLEDGE LEVELS
We have had several questions asking if you can purchase multiple pledges. The answer is yes! Simply increase the amount of your pledge by the value of any additional pledges you want. At the end of the Kickstarter you can tell us how you would like your funds used.
For Example: If you have already purchased Battle Cry ($140) but would also like to get Homecoming ($25) and A New Dawn ($15), simply increase your pledge to $180 (140+25+15)
.
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Post by: Necros
How come the defender is trying to shoot off his own feets?
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Post by: Salacious Greed
Necros wrote:How come the defender is trying to shoot off his own feets?
Because in space, no one can tell you your guns aren't pointed at the enemy.
Or he's incredibly lazy...
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Necros wrote:How come the defender is trying to shoot off his own feets?
If you overcharge the guns and spin the radar at high speed it can achieve liftoff.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
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Post by: Manchu
Looks like the VF-1:Regult cost ratio is actually 1:2. And a Tomahawk is more expensive than either! Also, I wonder what the "Life Is Cheap" special rule does ... Regult Speed (movement): 7 Gunnery (accuracy): 1 Defense (damage resistance): 6 Piloting (performance): 1 Tomahawk Speed (movement): 5 Gunnery (accuracy): 3 Defense (damage resistance): 5 Piloting (performance): 3
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Post by: Justyn
I scrolled through the entire page, and it didn't say anything important about what people really care about:
Will those be the right scale to play Battletech?
Well, they are really close to the original Ral Partha Battletech sculpts in size.
If the base is 40mm
Then it stands about 45mm tall based on that picture.
The Ral Partha Warhammer is 46mm top of base to top of missile launcher.
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Post by: warboss
I like the more dynamic battle pods. I wonder why making all the robotech sculpts more action oriented wasn't a priority in the first place. Also, I wonder if just the 3 free stretch goal pods using the new sculpts or if all of them will.
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Post by: Ronin_eX
Justyn wrote:I scrolled through the entire page, and it didn't say anything important about what people really care about:
Will those be the right scale to play Battletech?
Well, they are really close to the original Ral Partha Battletech sculpts in size.
If the base is 40mm
Then it stands about 45mm tall based on that picture.
The Ral Partha Warhammer is 46mm top of base to top of missile launcher.
This makes me happy. Probably wont go in on the KS (Warzone largely drained me and I'm holding back a few hundred just in case the next Mantic KS looks too awesome to pass up) but I will almost definitely pick some of these up if they are close to battlemech sized. The only worry I have left is the Glaug being quite a bit larger than the others. But then, my current IWM Marauders also are, so that shouldn't be too bad. I'll be glad to pick up some proper Archers again (largely the only 'mech that I just can't stand the re-seen version of).
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Post by: Justyn
The Glaug is 70mm tall. So way way too big even for a Marauder II. The Valkryies are too large to use for Btech too. Its possible the Armored Valk will be decent sized for a Crusader, but still on the big side.
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Post by: Kalamadea
Well, they're 1/285th, but they're using Macross scales. I imagine the Destroids will match almost perfectly to the unseens and not much else will. But, at $5 for a superbly detailed unseen Warhammer/Spartan/Rifleman/Longbow you can hardly complain. I wonder how well that would make a Marauder match the clickytech figs? Probably a bit small, but I'd bet it's usable.
I also wonder how well some 28mm sci-fi infantry would match for armored Zentraedi infantry? I'm sure they'll have actual models for them by the time the KS is over, but if not maybe some repurposed Sedition Wars/Infinity with drab green armor would be pretty good.
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Post by: warboss
 Kalamadea wrote:Well, they're 1/285th, but they're using Macross scales. I imagine the Destroids will match almost perfectly to the unseens and not much else will. But, at $5 for a superbly detailed unseen Warhammer/Spartan/Rifleman/Longbow you can hardly complain. I wonder how well that would make a Marauder match the clickytech figs? Probably a bit small, but I'd bet it's usable.
Having the exact same scale doesn't mean that the two minis would be the same size. If the Glaug in robotech is 70ft tall but the equivalent mech in battletech is listed as 60ft tall, the models will still be a different size despite using the exact same scale. I don't know if the technical manuals in battletech had actual heights of the mechs listed but it might be a good idea for someone knowledgeable in both to compare the "real" heights and post them.
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Post by: Kalamadea
That's what I'm saying, people are expecting things to match 100% just because they're 1/285 but it just ain't gonna happen. So, to those people, I say be glad you're getting a few plastic unseens that look like they WILL match 100% and a few that will work if you don't mind a bit of off-scale figs and a lot that will be just too far off because they were originally meant to be piloted by 30 foot tall humanoids.
Also, a little bit of napkin math shows that a 30mmish fig should be about perfect for Zentraedi infantry, happy day
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Post by: TalonZahn
OK, I dug out a box of Battletech minis that I knew had some Unseen to measure. It's late and I'm lazy or I would post pics, however:
All measurements are from the base to top of highest bit, with no hexbase underneath:
Marauder - 52mm - This can vary depending on tilt of pod/gun
Archer - 48mm
Rifleman - 43mm
Warhammer - 50mm to top of missile pod - 42/43mm to top of head
Stinger - 40mm
Crusader - 52mm to top of jet pack - 47mm to top of head
Phoenix Hawk - 52mm to top of jet pack - 47mm to top of head
This box didn't have any Longbows or Wasps. They must be packed away somewhere else.
I hope that helps!
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Post by: Ronin_eX
Well the Marau--err-Glaug being 70mm is a bit heart-breaking. But hey, proper Archers again!
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Post by: Justyn
There are no consistent heights for Battletech. They have been listed all over the place. I've seen everything from 12m to 25m tall for the Atlas. Robotech had solid consistent numbers. The Tomahawk is 12.7m tall, which comes out to 44mm in 1/285th. Which means it might be a mm or two off from the Warhammer miniature, but will be close enough to use. The other Destroids should also work just fine, as they are all in Robotech correctly sized vs the Warhammer. The Valks vs the Stinger/Wasps will be quite a bit off. The Super Valk as Phoenix Hawk may be somewhat useable, but will look pretty huge. Armored Valk for Crusader may work but again will look large. The Glaug/Marauder will be the furthest off I am sure. Some folks will use them anyway, but to me they will look too far off.
Also, a little bit of napkin math shows that a 30mmish fig should be about perfect for Zentraedi infantry, happy day
50ft tall aliens should be closer to 54mm figures. Remember that Max in his fighter in Battloid mode was the same height as a standard Zentradi trooper. So 50mm tall give or take a bit. And Breetai was some 70 feet tall as I recall.
Marauder - 52mm - This can vary depending on tilt of pod/gun
Archer - 48mm
Rifleman - 43mm
Warhammer - 50mm to top of missile pod - 42/43mm to top of head
Stinger - 40mm
Crusader - 52mm to top of jet pack - 47mm to top of head
Phoenix Hawk - 52mm to top of jet pack - 47mm to top of head
This box didn't have any Longbows or Wasps. They must be packed away somewhere else.
I hope that helps!
Did you measure from the top of the integral base or bottom? I measured from the top and got 46-47mm for the Warhammer. Just checking if thats why our numbers disagree. It makes the most sense.
Well the Marau--err-Glaug being 70mm is a bit heart-breaking. But hey, proper Archers again!
The more I look at the picture of everything together the more I think you Might be able to use it as a Marauder II (100 ton Marauder).
I'm just trying to figure out where I'm going to get legs and arms for all the Regult Pods so I can begin the OST invasion.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Justyn wrote:Did you measure from the top of the integral base or bottom? I measured from the top and got 46-47mm for the Warhammer. Just checking if thats why our numbers disagree. It makes the most sense.
The bottom. Average integral base would be 3-4mm thick depending on casting, wear, etc....
So basically we have the same height, just different starting point.
Like I said, other thing come into play also, extra bits, tilt of pieces and parts.
I don't have any plastic Battletech minis or I would measure those as well. I bet they would be closer in size to the Robotech stuff.
I'm all metal and all before 3050!
[Edit] I forgot I have some Grey Death Legion in my Gallery here, lol. You can't really tell the size though, nothing in background to compare too. I guess you can see how much bigger the Phoenix Hawk is compared to the Stinger pretty well.
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Post by: Kalamadea
Zentraedi are often described as 50 feet tall (especially in the novels), but they are actually nowhere near it in the anime, more like 25'-35' tall. I did my napkin math off of http://macross2.net/m3/sizecharts/sizechart-1.gif. As for plastics, my Warhammer is 48mm to the top of the missile pod, 41mm to the top of his head not counting the integral base.
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Post by: Justyn
Well 35 feet would be much closer to 28mm miniatures than 54. However that would still be a bit short. I'm thinking they have some actual Zentradi minis ahead.
Somewhere in there FASA got the rights from BW and other Japanese animators to use their mechs but HG and other licensors in the US objected resulting in their images and minis being removed.
FASA won their day in court. They had legal licenses to use what they did. They decided it was too expensive to pay more legal fees and withdrew what are now known as Unseen to Battletech fans so there would never be future issues. Which is why the Unseen list included things that were not involved in the lawsuit. They covered their bases by withdrawing everything that wasn't developed in house. And so the golden age of Battletech died.
Harmony Gold is pretty bad about throwing around Cease and Desists weather they have any legal ground to stand on or not. I hate them for all of the very excellent Macross toys or models I have to order from HLJ or Ebay instead of being able to pick up locally.
As far as the kickstarter goes. I love how Valks are $4 a model and Destroids are $10 a model.
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Post by: Andrew1975
I know I would like to be able to pose them at least a little.
Even the destroids are way to static. Please no minis that are just standing there.
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Post by: Justyn
So you missed the
1/285th scale, high quality, multi-pose plastic game pieces.
that was under every description in the kickstarter. Emphasis mine.
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Post by: Andrew1975
Justyn wrote:So you missed the
1/285th scale, high quality, multi-pose plastic game pieces.
that was under every description in the kickstarter. Emphasis mine.
I didn't really miss it. That doesn't really mean anything.
This is a "high quality" multi pose game piece. Unfortunately every pose is extremely static.
Companies always say everything is High quality. It doesn't mean anything. Hell Finecast was supposed to be the greatest thing since...well ever. We all know how that turned out!
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Post by: Cypher-xv
They have more dynamic battle pods now. Also we just cleared the $220k mark meaning we'll get 4 extra destroids.
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Post by: Justyn
$220,000 STRETCH GOAL
UPGRADE: Once we reach $220,000 the Destroid Pack will be DOUBLED in size. In addition, every pack will come with enough parts to make all four game pieces any combination of Tomahawks and/or Defenders.
This upgrade will be received by any backer who has pledged for the Destroid Pack Add-on.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Cypher-xv wrote:They have more dynamic battle pods now. Also we just cleared the $220k mark meaning we'll get 4 extra destroids.
No, you get 2 Extra Destroids....... if you buy the $20 Add-on pack of the first set of Destroids. I expect another stretch of the same kind for the other Destroid pack later on.
Next Stretch...... Special Dice!
Again, it's an OK upgrade, but nothing too special.
If you read the comments section, others are starting to complain about weak stretch goals and possibly lowering their Pledge.
This could go south real fast if they don't step up their game.
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Post by: Mad4Minis
Hmmm....this does have me tempted.
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Post by: Joyboozer
TalonZahn wrote:Cypher-xv wrote:They have more dynamic battle pods now. Also we just cleared the $220k mark meaning we'll get 4 extra destroids.
No, you get 2 Extra Destroids....... if you buy the $20 Add-on pack of the first set of Destroids. I expect another stretch of the same kind for the other Destroid pack later on.
Next Stretch...... Special Dice!
Again, it's an OK upgrade, but nothing too special.
If you read the comments section, others are starting to complain about weak stretch goals and possibly lowering their Pledge.
This could go south real fast if they don't step up their game.
Ha, yeah, cause there's nothing worse than when the complainers drop out...
It's way too early to be complaining about add ons.
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Post by: Alpharius
No way this one goes south, almost no matter what.
Nostaglia Wave - all consuming!
Plus, OK look miniatures!
Plus - have you seen how much it has already made?
People may back out (myself included!), but this one will go down as one of the most successful mini Kickstarters to date.
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Post by: Ironwill13791
There is still a month left. Plenty of time for new models and for them to add diversity to the game. If you are iffy about it then take a wait and see approach.
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Post by: warboss
I don't think there is much chance of it going south like Thon as people aren't complaining in general about the core set but rather the stretch goals (if they're complaining at all). All of the freebie stretches have added value to the core game so far and they have to keep some of the "good" stuff for the last few days. That means we'll have some mediocre but still valueable goals in between in that somewhat awkward 28 middle days.
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Post by: RiTides
Alpharius wrote:Nostaglia Wave - all consuming!
Plus, OK look miniatures!
Plus - have you seen how much it has already made?
I agree with all 3 of these facts, but this one's progress is still rather shocking to me  . I'm wondering if they'll release some posed renders to show that things can be posed more dynamically (or not). Also, thanks for the thoughts on that for those who responded to my question a few pages ago.
It will be interesting to see if it can sustain it's progress...
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Post by: warboss
Sustain the rise of the first day? Incredibly unlikely. I think we'll just see a relative dribble each day (10k per day instead of the 100+ in the first day) until the last few days. I will say that the initial rate of increase surprised me in its scope as well as its brevity. When I saw the pledges skyrocketing up unexpectedly (I had expected a fast rise but not THAT fast), I did think it would continue for 2-3 days and not necessarily end in roughly 24 hours.
An interesting side note is that the new stretch goal appears to be for EVERY core set ($70+) and not just the previous $130+ level pledge minimum from my reading.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Joyboozer wrote:Ha, yeah, cause there's nothing worse than when the complainers drop out...
It's way too early to be complaining about add ons.
Oh look, it's this type of response again.
Again, for like the 4th time in this thread... all I'm saying is they could be doing something a little better or perhaps something more. Maybe they will down the line, maybe they won't.
The dice aren't bad, it's an OK/nice upgrade, but it's not some earth-shaking Stretch that's going to drive a wave of cash.
By "go south" that's what I meant. If they want to ride the nostalgia wave or the "it's miniatures!" wave, they need to do that by producing those things. Dice aren't nostalgic or miniatures and half the miniature stretch goals are paid add-ons.
If people are asking for a M.A.C. or character minis, they are basically saying "Take all my money, and here's how!"
Then they wouldn't have to settle for a 10k a day dribble.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
I think he means the major complainers on the Kickstarter comments who are threatening to lower their pledges or drop out.
Yeah the dice effect everyone who is getting a starter, usually goals that improve dice/cards and such are of everyone.
I wonder if there will Zentraedii dice to replace the other 12.
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Post by: warboss
I suspect a lot of kickstarters would love to have a 10k a day dribble. I do agree with some of your other points but think they need to space the "good" freebies and add ons out over the 30 days. This campaign feels a bit more purposely thought out and measured in its stretch goals than other earlier ones last year like mantic where people got tons and tons of freebies in a frenzy. Of course, a side effect of trying not to give out too much too quickly may be that pledges don't spend too much too quickly. Automatically Appended Next Post: UN Test Pilot wrote:I think he means the major complainers on the Kickstarter comments who are threatening to lower their pledges or drop out. Yeah the dice effect everyone who is getting a starter, usually goals that improve dice/cards and such are of everyone. I wonder if there will Zentraedii dice to replace the other 12.
I thought the base dice were zentraedi dice but I could be wrong. I zoomed in on the video and they looked to have a zentraedi V symbol as one of the facings.
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Post by: Joyboozer
Maybe they're happy with 10k a day dribble.
The purpose of the kickstarter was to fund the game, which they did on the first day. Why is there an automatic assumption they need to do any more than that?
Also I should clarify, I didn't mean anyone here, it's the kickstarter extremists I was referring to.
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Post by: TalonZahn
warboss wrote:This campaign feels a bit more purposely thought out and measured in its stretch goals than other earlier ones last year like mantic where people got tons and tons of freebies in a frenzy.
I can't agree more.
That's the only thing I can come up with when trying to figure out their pacing and stretches. I may not want to do a dance of joy every time a Stretch is revealed, but at least it look like they have some sort of plan.
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Post by: warboss
An interesting observation in the general comments regarding a post in the update #10 comments. The Rick Hunter Add-On just went from a battloid to all three modes. That adds a lot of perceived value to that particular add on for me.
@Talon: I'm right there with you but I'm in for the length of the campaign. That said, despite my interest, I have no problem dropping down to the $70/80 level + cool add ons (FPA, MACII, Rick Hunter) instead of the $130/140 level if the freebies don't pan out. I just won't make that decision until the last 2 days or so.
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Post by: rigeld2
Joyboozer wrote:Maybe they're happy with 10k a day dribble.
The purpose of the kickstarter was to fund the game, which they did on the first day. Why is there an automatic assumption they need to do any more than that?
Also I should clarify, I didn't mean anyone here, it's the kickstarter extremists I was referring to.
Businesses exist to make money. Better stretch goals mean more money.
With this license its essentially printing money. They could make significantly more by doing more attractive stretches.
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Post by: Joyboozer
Short term yes, but which sells more long term? The core game or a fancy add on?
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Post by: TalonZahn
Joyboozer wrote:Short term yes, but which sells more long term? The core game or a fancy add on?
The fancy add-on.
It turns into the sustaining miniature line AFTER the Kickstarter.
Once people have the Core set, they want more toys to go with it.
You don't keep buying the X-Wing core set. You buy all the hot ships they release afterwards.
[Edit] Also, a lot of the Core sets out there for games are loss leaders. They don't make as much profit on them as they do the individual sculpts. They drag you to the buffet with a great Core set deal, and then take you to the cleaners at the dessert-bar.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
From Palladium, They will be ABS plastic so you can use super glue or plastic glue.
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Post by: Joyboozer
But you already got all your add ons in the kickstarter, there's nothing more to buy.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Joyboozer wrote:But you already got all your add ons in the kickstarter, there's nothing more to buy.
You think this Kickstarter is all you'll ever see of this game or these miniatures?
They are launching a game and miniature line. There will be more stuff once it goes to print, that isn't from, or in, this KS.
This is to fund it. As such, the people funding it should get good deals for front-loading them with funds to get this going. I mean, it's kind of the entire point of KS.
These stretches and add-ons will be in "a store near you" after this is all said and done. Those "fancy add-ons" are what will sustain this game once it goes to the shelf.
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Post by: yeri
sorry if this is off topic, but I've never really heard of Robotech before (it was before my time) and I was wondering if there will be any other factions in this game other than the earth one and the current alien one? I really just want a nice mech game more than I want a Robotech game, but if this is going to be a full on wargame with more than two factions I think I may be in.
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Post by: warboss
 yeri wrote:sorry if this is off topic, but I've never really heard of Robotech before (it was before my time) and I was wondering if there will be any other factions in this game other than the earth one and the current alien one? I really just want a nice mech game more than I want a Robotech game, but if this is going to be a full on wargame with more than two factions I think I may be in.
Since Palladium has said they do eventually want to cover all three eras of the cartoon, there will effectively be 6 factions in all likelihood. The Robotech Cartoon was a Frankenstein's monster conglomeration of 3 different Japanese anime series that were combined into one story arc. "Earth" has three separate and completely different looking (but related) armies to fight the three different alien armies attacking them. There are some minor factions that were introduced in the RPG and novels (like EBSIS... left over eastern European communists) but I doubt they'll make it into the minis game (or even if they exist in the rereleased RPG). If you're simply out for a mech game, I'd wait until you see some gameplay video uploads before deciding if you don't have 80's nostalgia for the IP.
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Post by: Joyboozer
TalonZahn wrote:Joyboozer wrote:But you already got all your add ons in the kickstarter, there's nothing more to buy.
You think this Kickstarter is all you'll ever see of this game or these miniatures?
They are launching a game and miniature line. There will be more stuff once it goes to print, that isn't from, or in, this KS.
This is to fund it. As such, the people funding it should get good deals for front-loading them with funds to get this going. I mean, it's kind of the entire point of KS.
These stretches and add-ons will be in "a store near you" after this is all said and done. Those "fancy add-ons" are what will sustain this game once it goes to the shelf.
So what happens when, because of all the extras they've added, the release schedule gets blown way out and they can't sell the product retail until its all sorted?
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
I got this response on Destroids poses
Creator Palladium Books 1 minute ago
We are still locking down the poses for the Destroids, we are looking to make them dynamic with a solid degree of customization. As soon as we have them locked down we will post pictures, similar to how we updated the Regult Battlepod pics.
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Post by: Alpharius
A bit early to go to the 'special dice' thing, but at least it is out of the way now.
I've got enough dice to last me... forever!
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Post by: Mad4Minis
 Ironwill13791 wrote:There is still a month left. Plenty of time for new models and for them to add diversity to the game. If you are iffy about it then take a wait and see approach.
At this point Im holding out, theres another kickstarter coming soon Im trying to hold funds for...however, if they start adding Invid...Ill probably be in pretty quick.
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Post by: Taarnak
UN Test Pilot wrote:From Palladium, They will be ABS plastic so you can use super glue or plastic glue.
Well, that certainly has an effect on things. Not sure its a positive one. Are we talking full ABS or some sort of resin/ABS hybrid (aka Restic)?
Also, does Polystyrene Cement (aka plastic glue) actually work on ABS? Never tried it.
~Eric
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Post by: CIsaac
So.... I ended up falling asleep rewatching Robotech last night. The nostalgia is really hard not to want to pledged $140 and ride it out. I really love the look of the veritechs.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Joyboozer wrote:So what happens when, because of all the extras they've added, the release schedule gets blown way out and they can't sell the product retail until its all sorted?
Last response to this discussion.
These companies have a plan for the future when they do this. Many (most of them) post timelines of when we can expect to see these things on the shelf, once they have exceeded what they already had made/created/in stock.
I don't worry about release schedule after the KS, just what I get/will get from that KS. Look at the Kensei Indiegogo, some of those items won't be released until 18 months after the campaign. I still haven't received stuff from the first Mantic KS because all they had the time was some sketch art.
Anything in this KS will be on the shelf at some point. Period.
The line sustains the core, not the other way around.
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
 Taarnak wrote:UN Test Pilot wrote:From Palladium, They will be ABS plastic so you can use super glue or plastic glue.
Well, that certainly has an effect on things. Not sure its a positive one. Are we talking full ABS or some sort of resin/ABS hybrid (aka Restic)?
Also, does Polystyrene Cement (aka plastic glue) actually work on ABS? Never tried it.
~Eric
Yes, most plastic glues work fine on ABS. Some of the specific formulations dont work, or rather dont work as well...though that is normally the things like the non-fogging formulas for clear plastic. Most of your regular plastic cements work fine with ABS though.
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Post by: TalonZahn
I like Loctite glues.
They make many types for different uses and are generally less costly than games store glues.
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Post by: Sean_OBrien
BTW...to test your own particular brand of glue, you can give it a try with some Legos.
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Post by: warboss
 Mad4Minis wrote: Ironwill13791 wrote:There is still a month left. Plenty of time for new models and for them to add diversity to the game. If you are iffy about it then take a wait and see approach.
At this point Im holding out, theres another kickstarter coming soon Im trying to hold funds for...however, if they start adding Invid...Ill probably be in pretty quick.
I think they said that the scope of this kickstarter will be macros only but they do eventually plan on doing models for the other two eras including Invid. I'm guessing that the Shadow Chronicles/Sentinels/New Generation era will be next since that's the era that Harmony Gold is supporting but that is a complete guess on my part and obviously doesn't follow the series story chronologically.
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Post by: Taarnak
Sean_OBrien wrote:
Yes, most plastic glues work fine on ABS. Some of the specific formulations dont work, or rather dont work as well...though that is normally the things like the non-fogging formulas for clear plastic. Most of your regular plastic cements work fine with ABS though.
Good to know. I thought it might, since they are both variation of styrene, but I wasn't sure.
Thanks.
~Eric
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Post by: warboss
It appears that the original 24 dice in the core set were *wink* *wink* just regular dice despite the video showing zentraedi custom ones. Currently, the next stretch goal is to turn 12 of the dice into UEDF ones with the other 12 in the core as standard for now (with a likely future zentraedi dice stretch goal).
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Post by: Eilif
Has anyone confirmed the size comparisons to BT mechs.
I realize they have a printed scale of 1/285, but that means just about nothing if the BT and Robotech fluff don't have them standing the same height.
For example, unless I'm mistaken, the Zentraedi pods in 6mm would be much larger than their Ostol and Maurader BT counterparts. And the Valkyries in Robogear look as big as the Destroids, whereas in BT, Wasps and Stingers are smaller than Rifleman and Warhammer mechs.
Anyone know how the sizes of the other BT and Macross designs compare?
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Post by: warboss
There were a few battletech fans a page or two back doing comparisons after measuring their own unseen models and doing some photoshop kung fu on robotech models to gauge their height.
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Post by: Justyn
The short answer was Destroids yes everything else no for Battle tech.
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Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
Taarnak wrote:UN Test Pilot wrote:From Palladium, They will be ABS plastic so you can use super glue or plastic glue.
Well, that certainly has an effect on things. Not sure its a positive one. Are we talking full ABS or some sort of resin/ABS hybrid (aka Restic)?
Also, does Polystyrene Cement (aka plastic glue) actually work on ABS? Never tried it.
~Eric
Something labelled polystyrene cement won't work as the chemicals in it won't melt ABS (or won't melt it well enough)
but there are a bunch of glues that do work on ABS (typically they have high Methy Ethyl Ketone content, and are nice and toxic)
Plasticweld ( http://www.amazon.co.uk/Tasma-Products-Ltd-Plastic-Cement/dp/B0053WXLVU or
Testors http://www.testors.com/product/136635/3502X/_/Liquid_Cement_for_Plastic
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Post by: Eilif
Eric,
As you're in the US, I highly recommend Plastruct Plastic Weld. I assume it's the same as the UK product mentioned above, except that it comes in an orange bottle like this in most USA hobby shops. I use it for all types of plastics and it works great. The brush applicator is really neat also.
Don't get the white labeled bottle as it is a fine product, but doesn't bond as many types of plastic.
Justyn wrote:The short answer was Destroids yes everything else no for Battle tech.
Thanks!
I play Mech attack in 10mm, so it looks like the Valks, and maybe the Zentraedi would scale up well there. I've got zero interest in the Robotech game, so I'll have to give it some thought as to whether/how to get involved in this kickstarter.
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Post by: Mad4Minis
Eilif wrote:
I play Mech attack in 10mm, so it looks like the Valks, and maybe the Zentraedi would scale up well there. I've got zero interest in the Robotech game, so I'll have to give it some thought as to whether/how to get involved in this kickstarter.
I have little/no interest in the base game either, so the scale is a big hold up for me as well. Im getting into 15mm mecha, and I think these are just going to be too small. I have some old Battletech/Robotech 1/200 scale models and they scale up well to my N scale Battletech models, so Im thinking the 1/285 would be too small...double so since I have Battlepods & an officers battlepod already...smaller versions of the same would be weird. Likely my funds will be held for Paulsons Mecha Front in 15mm, which I think will be announced soon.
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Post by: Justyn
The fact that they won't let you pledge for just destroids is also very annoying. I don't want any of the products I would need to pledge for to attach a few boxes of destroids to.
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Post by: TalonZahn
Justyn wrote:The fact that they won't let you pledge for just destroids is also very annoying. I don't want any of the products I would need to pledge for to attach a few boxes of destroids to.
That's not true.
Just pledge your amount and select No Reward.
Then at the end when they send the survey, you just put in the items you want.
Which can be all add-on Destroids if you wish.
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Post by: Manchu
Speak for yourself. I have bought three and may buy a fourth. It's the best way to get the workhorse ships that drive that game. The core box in this game could be the same.
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Post by: warboss
TalonZahn wrote:Justyn wrote:The fact that they won't let you pledge for just destroids is also very annoying. I don't want any of the products I would need to pledge for to attach a few boxes of destroids to.
That's not true.
Just pledge your amount and select No Reward.
Then at the end when they send the survey, you just put in the items you want.
Which can be all add-on Destroids if you wish.
Indeed. Just pledge the princely sum of $1 and then add on all the destroids you want.
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Post by: Manchu
warboss wrote:I'm guessing that the Shadow Chronicles/Sentinels/New Generation era will be next since
Mr. Siembieda confirmed as much in the interview you posted on page 1.
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Post by: Kalamadea
Hrm, when I first saw the dice upgrade I was more than a little underwhelmed. As somebody already said, I'm a gamer, I already have way more dice than I'll ever need. Then I realized, if I had robotech dice, that is ALL I WOULD EVER USE! Bring on the dice!
Also, they have a blurb in that update about the 260K goal being another freebie addon, and the picture is of the skull and crossbones emblem from Roy's Skull Squadrion VF-1S
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Post by: TalonZahn
Manchu wrote:Speak for yourself. I have bought three and may buy a fourth. It's the best way to get the workhorse ships that drive that game. The core box in this game could be the same.
I try to get out and they keep pulling me back in.....
After general release. If you need more Pods or Valks in this game, you would buy the Pods/Valks boxed set not the core set.
You don't buy the 40K boxed starter to get more marines, you buy the Tac Squad box.
Same idea.
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Post by: Kalamadea
Actually, I know a LOT of people that buy 2 or 3 of the 40k box sets. I've seen people buy 2 Warmachine starters, quite often in fact. Generally speaking, the starter sets tend to be the best value and are an easy way to bulk up your armies as long as you're just looking for more basic stuff and aren't picky about having so many duplicates (or are willing to spend some time on conversions)
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Post by: Manchu
I can get the X-Wing core box for $26 -- three ships, templates, dice, cards, counters for $26. Buying everything separately means I'm closer to $35 and then I'm not getting everything from the core box (admittedly, the expansion packs have a few cards the core doesn't, too). For me, the obvious choice for rounding out both of my fleets was therefore the core set. Obviously, I can't make the same pricing assumptions about this product. Just saying -- it is possible that a core set has multiple purchase value. X-Wing is the paradigm case for that and game-wise it's very similar to what we're seeing with Robotech. Automatically Appended Next Post: Kalamadea wrote:Also, they have a blurb in that update about the 260K goal being another freebie addon, and the picture is of the skull and crossbones emblem from Roy's Skull Squadrion VF-1S
 .........$260K BONUS to all Battle Cry, Gloval's Report, and 2x Showdown pledges.
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Post by: TalonZahn
There's just no end to it. I need to stop posting.....
My point is, and was when I was actually trying to discuss this: The Core Set does not sustain the line. It's ALL the other stuff that sustains the line over time.
Of course the Core sets are of more "value" because that's how they get people into the game. By in large, in all systems, people do not buy the Core game over and over to increase their armies of any game/nature/system. Of course there will be outlier customers that want their entire Dark Angel army to be built with nothing but what's in the Starter Box, but they are the fringe. If any of this was untrue, miniature companies wouldn't make anything but the Core Set.
Can we please just go back to discussing how awesome the next Stretch Goal is?
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Post by: Alpharius
TalonZahn wrote:There's just no end to it. I need to stop posting.....
My point is, and was when I was actually trying to discuss this: The Core Set does not sustain the line. It's ALL the other stuff that sustains the line over time.
Of course the Core sets are of more "value" because that's how they get people into the game. By in large, in all systems, people do not buy the Core game over and over to increase their armies of any game/nature/system. Of course there will be outlier customers that want their entire Dark Angel army to be built with nothing but what's in the Starter Box, but they are the fringe. If any of this was untrue, miniature companies wouldn't make anything but the Core Set.
Can we please just go back to discussing how awesome the next Stretch Goal is?
Yes, can we please?
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Post by: warboss
...nevermind due to the pre-crime warning above that came up while I was typing. So.. back to the topic.. I bought cheap on ebay and received one of these blockade runners for my x-wing games (with working lights and sounds... pew pew! swoosh!)...  and now I'm debating getting one of these for Robotech but I'm having a hard time trying to figure out how to make it a dynamic Prometheus play area as opposed to getting the cardboard building and city terrain set (which is the front runner currently).  Automatically Appended Next Post: 12x UEDF/RDF custom dice upgrade unlocked in each core set. After that relatively lackluster stretch goal (and with the Zentraedi dice future stretch goal spoiled by the intro video showing them), the next stretch goal is a lot more exciting. At $260k, each Blitzkrieg and up pledge receives a Roy Fokker veritech in all three modes free as well as available for purchase as a $15 add on (like Rick Hunter).
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Post by: Spartan-Kun
I have every intention of getting the "Showdown" level. at $260 over one hundred models is amazing. I can hardley contain myself. I only hope that after this is done, and they begin to add more from the later Robotech eras that the hovertank gets introduced as well.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
You sir are my hero. I have the same blockade runner on my shelf, such a great looking ship.
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Post by: UN Test Pilot
From Palladium in regard to Ricks and Roy's Veritechs, also was said the Skull1 will have the shill and crossbones etched on.
Rick's Veritech will have a dynamic and unique pose to separate him from other Veritechs. Of course, they both have special rules as well.
Also the game cards are planned to be released with the model, but will also be in the rulebooks, so to get Rick and Roy's cards you need the SE models.
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