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Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 06:52:24


Post by: silent25


Edited by Manchu
 Manchu wrote:
I wrote an overview of the Beta rule set for anyone wondering about the mechanics:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/664369.page
The full contents of the starter set are:

20 Plastic Concord Strike Troopers
4 Plastic Concord Support Drones
3 Plastic Ghar Battle Squad Walkers
3 Plastic Ghar Assault Squad Walkers
Launch edition metal character model
Full Hard Back Rulebook
Plastic templates and shot tokens
Scenario booklet
Plastic Pin markers
Order Dice & Polyhedral dice
Launch Edition of the box game contains the hardback rulebook and launch edition miniature, available for a limited time
 judgedoug wrote:
It looks like the Retailer edition of Gates of Antares will have a limited edition Ghar miniature (whereas the Warlord direct has the limited edition Concord miniature)

Also a FLGS with a Warlord retail account that orders the Gates of Antares store bundle also receives a giant poster of the cover art signed by Rick Priestley to display.


New Ghar faction:











Ghar Power Armour Sprue:
Spoiler:


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 07:10:20


Post by: Bulldogging


Nice, looking forward to see what else is coming.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 07:36:18


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


Wow. It's amazing how much these models look just like I hoped they wouldn't. Are they pricey, too?


Is Hansi...Hansa...Hans Landa...not-Nappa available for purchase yet?

Any word on plastics?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 07:40:34


Post by: Joyboozer


Why would anyone fire a weapon with part of it resting in their groin? Do they not have a tender groin area or are the weapons recoil less?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 07:55:18


Post by: BrookM


From the Warlord site:

Rick Priestley succumbs to Boromite infestation – news of Warlord’s forthcoming science-fiction project.

2013 was a busy year for the Warlord team. What with the astonishing success of our WWII-based Bolt Action game on top of our growing Black Powder and Hail Caesar ranges, we’ve had to run around like billy-ho just to keep up with all the mould making, casting, packing and despatching. So much so, in fact, that there are now considerably more of us than this time last year, and we’ve also had to invest in more premises, more equipment, and more stock just to satisfy the demand. That is – of course – all thanks to you our customers, and I for one would like to say thank you very much for supporting our efforts throughout the year. Thank you!

Now, you might think with all that running round, casting, packing and what-not we’d have enough to do, but – needless to say – we’ve also been doggedly pursuing a number of very exciting new projects behind the scenes. Foremost amongst these is the development of my new Science-Fiction wargame, called Beyond the Gates of Antares.

From now on, I’ll be including regular updates about the Antares game as part of the Warlord Newsletter. Over the next month or so we’ll be taking a look at the model ranges, both what we have completed and work in progress, and we’ll start to explore the game and the ideas behind it. But to kick off with, we present a sneak-peak selection of our new Boromite models – a panhuman race designed by our ace and entirely human designer Wojtek Flis. Bear in mind these new models aren’t quite ready for sale just yet (remember all that mould making, casting and so on?) but they will be amongst the first Antarean releases.



Boromite Overseer team, consisting of Boromite Overseer with plasma carbine, tractor maul and reflex armour plus two Gangers with plasma carbines and reflex armour.



BOROMITE LABOUR GUILDS

In the distant past, the ancestors of the Boromites were bio-engineered for hard and dangerous work in extreme environments. As a result they are able to endure extremes of pressure and temperature that would soon kill any other human. Boromites are amongst the most visibly different of all panhuman mutants, with their broad, robust bodies and thick, gnarly hides studded with horny nodules. Their name derives from the mining colonies of Borom, a system that consists of a densely packed asteroid annulus but no planets. Today the Boromites have spread throughout Antarean space and can be found upon worlds within the Panhuman Concord, the Isorian Shard, and beyond. They have no worlds of their own. Instead, they form an itinerant work force with its own distinctive cultural identity and secretive customs. They easily avoid becoming absorbed into the societies they live amongst because their primitive minds do not interact freely with the Intergrated Machine Intelligences of more sophisticated cultures. As a consequence they remain almost entirely hidden, even amongst highly regulated autocratic societies, a reclusive and insular sub-culture with its own values and social mores.

Although they are spread throughout Antarean space, Boromites maintain strong contacts with each other via the trading networks of the Freeborn. Boromite labour gangs are but one of the services regularly traded by the Vardos of the Freeborn. Individual work gangs are small social units – clans that comprise a number of closely related families – multiple gangs are formed into competing Guilds. These Guilds and labour gangs also form the basis for military action. All Boromite workers are also warriors, and their labour organisations also provide the basis of their military organisation. Although competing Guilds are rivals – sometimes bitterly so – different Guilds will often band together to fight a common enemy. Several Guilds have to work in concert to undertake a major operation, such as to secure a mineral rich planet or asteroid. Because they are spread throughout space, Boromite gangs can also be found in the fighting forces of other societies, where their hardiness and determination make them highly valued fighters. Boromite gangers carry the common weapons of Antarean space, but in addition they uniquely make use of weapons developed from mining tools, including mass compactors, tractor mauls and frag borers. Reflex shielding is also common – the metallic nodes that support the enclosing armour field are often fixed directly into the wearer’s thick hide.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 08:20:10


Post by: Shandara


I'd almost forgotten about the GoA...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 08:33:29


Post by: Pacific


Think they look cool! Always thought GoA had so much potential, will be interesting to see where it goes from here.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 08:37:48


Post by: BrookM


Hopefully less of a mess and honestly with less player input at the early stages, as those who shrieked the loudest..


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 08:50:10


Post by: -DE-


I like these!

GoA kickstarter was an ill-conceived mess, but if they manage to release it without crowdfunding, it might be something to keep an eye on.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 08:50:55


Post by: BrookM


They can, they just need to set a lower bar and involve the crowd less at the earlier stages.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 10:32:57


Post by: Agamemnon2


I think those are very nice miniatures. The visual design of the Boromites is pretty solid, and the studio paintjobs excellent. We're still a long way away from a sellable product, it seems, so let's see what comes on that front.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 11:47:33


Post by: AlexHolker


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Any word on plastics?

They did have a guy sculpting a robot intended to be a plastic squad, but that was before the Kickstarter was cancelled.

I'm not expecting anything worthwhile to come of this. Everything they did, they bungled. That robot, for example, was being hand sculpted, despite the need for multiple, symmetrical copies of the same rigid components in different configurations. If anything should be sculpted digitally, it's that. Or their planned releases that would make themed armies impossible without buying five or six copies of the same five or six single piece sculpts, where Necromunda would give you twenty or more before you needed to double up.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 11:50:10


Post by: scarletsquig


If it's a small range of boutique, expensive metals for a sci-fi skirmish game... well, I'd go for Infinity first.

Hard plastic sprue of anything sci-fi at Warlord prices = colour me interested. Other than dreamforge, there is pretty much jack all in the way of good sci-fi sprues out there.

I don't know why they can't just relaunch the KS with less buggering about and "we need the funds to properly cover all the costs of a new company" and instead just get some minis out there, get some free rules out there for beta test and get things rolling.

There's a bit of a sense of half-heartedness about the whole thing so far that is a little off-putting, as if the people involved are taking a "either it makes a fortune immediately or it's not worth us bothering".

Other new sci-fi skirmish projects like Total Extinction have just got on with it, having low KS goals and a razor focus on funding production costs.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 11:57:02


Post by: Pacific


I think that was one of the main aims of the Kickstarter, there was a lot of talk of plastic sprue releases with different weapon options and whatnot. I've heard Bolt Action is going very well sales-wise, so it might be that Warlord are in more of a position to make something of GoA now.

Might be able to bring myself to look at the official website/forum at some point, although last time I checked it had been completely abandoned, refuge only to fiends, mutants and other creatures from the underworld


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 12:17:44


Post by: BrookM


I just hope that the other ranges of Warlord do not suffer from this as Bolt Action is doing really well right now with great new plastic kits every few months, I hate for something good and successful to suffer because someone felt that we needed another sci-fi setting out there. While I'm all for more diversity, I'd rather not see it at the cost of good things.

But we'll see, so long as they keep the community out of the design process until they've got a beta or late alpha at the very least, it could do a whole lot better this time round.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 13:19:53


Post by: AlexHolker


 BrookM wrote:
I just hope that the other ranges of Warlord do not suffer from this as Bolt Action is doing really well right now with great new plastic kits every few months, I hate for something good and successful to suffer because someone felt that we needed another sci-fi setting out there. While I'm all for more diversity, I'd rather not see it at the cost of good things.

I think we need another sci-fi setting. We don't need this one. It is a fundamentally stupid premise - a setting where worlds are saturated with AI controlled deconstructor nanites is not a setting where you need a rifle to kill someone.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 14:14:57


Post by: CURNOW


I've got the hansa model in resin its very good . Hopefully any new releases can match up to it. These don't look like they can.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 14:43:05


Post by: lord_blackfang


 AlexHolker wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Any word on plastics?

They did have a guy sculpting a robot intended to be a plastic squad, but that was before the Kickstarter was cancelled.

I'm not expecting anything worthwhile to come of this. Everything they did, they bungled. That robot, for example, was being hand sculpted, despite the need for multiple, symmetrical copies of the same rigid components in different configurations. If anything should be sculpted digitally, it's that. Or their planned releases that would make themed armies impossible without buying five or six copies of the same five or six single piece sculpts, where Necromunda would give you twenty or more before you needed to double up.


That's what happens when you have a design team of people who stopped being innovative in the mid 90s and whose mentality never really moved past the "garage company" stage in any way (quality, production, nor business sense). Funnily this handicap seems to be entirely a UK-based thing.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 15:14:24


Post by: warboss


 BrookM wrote:
Hopefully less of a mess and honestly with less player input at the early stages, as those who shrieked the loudest..


Well.. I guess in a way coming out with half rock guys is about as far away from a furry as you can get in terms of softness...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 15:19:14


Post by: Kilkrazy


To me, the most interesting thing about the original GoA bunch of ideas was the formation of a continuous worldwide campaign that used a smartphone app to let players put all their game results into an evolving timeline.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 15:26:50


Post by: BrookM


And they lost me, while I'm all for an ever evolving timeline and setting, doing it through apps is kak.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:25:27


Post by: Kilkrazy


Why?

If you want players to send in battle results it's going to have to be done electronically. An app is a great way to do it and doesn't stop you from having a web page too.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:35:03


Post by: Pacific


 Kilkrazy wrote:
To me, the most interesting thing about the original GoA bunch of ideas was the formation of a continuous worldwide campaign that used a smartphone app to let players put all their game results into an evolving timeline.


Definitely.. that was one of the things that really caught my attention. There were so many good ideas, especially on that side of things - getting download 'missions' on a particular week, according to your factions progress, with results that would then shape the creation of the game universe.

Would have been a massive project (and I think one of the problems was that they didn't realise the scale of work it would involve), but I think it could potentially have been game changing. With the biggest players in the industry seemingly willing to travel in small circles, doing things the way they have always be done, I think the industry needs a kick up the bum every now and again - GoA definitely had potential to do that, I think.

Anyway, a slow and small blip has taken the place of the flat-line, let's see where we go from here


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:47:40


Post by: Grot 6


Setting is interesting, even if the "Project" was a hot pile of mess.

Though I'm not too impressed by these fugly figures, I am excited that they are getting it off the ground.

I wish them success.

I'm with killkrazy on this one. Using a app to evolve the game sounds like a pretty cool idea. Gets me thinking EVE on tabletop.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:48:38


Post by: BrookM


 Kilkrazy wrote:
Why?

If you want players to send in battle results it's going to have to be done electronically. An app is a great way to do it and doesn't stop you from having a web page too.
What of the people who have phones or phone services that do not support that type of thing? Why not a website instead?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:54:48


Post by: Alpharius


These figures are an odd choice to restart the line with.

I can't see them drumming up much excitement or enthusiasm.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 16:55:51


Post by: BrookM


Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 17:12:31


Post by: judgedoug


I'm incredibly happy that they've spent most of the last year playtesting in a closed group. There's really no good well-distributed sci fi skirmish wargame on the market. I'll be especially happy if GoA has a points creation system.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 17:12:34


Post by: Da Boss


Seems to compete with what Mantic are putting out to an extent- an appeal to old fashioned cheesy sci fi.

Not blown away by the posing or the over all look of those models to be honest.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 17:16:12


Post by: Kanluwen


 Kilkrazy wrote:
To me, the most interesting thing about the original GoA bunch of ideas was the formation of a continuous worldwide campaign that used a smartphone app to let players put all their game results into an evolving timeline.

It sounds more like they heard about what Bungie is doing with "Destiny" and tying in players' timelines with a smartphone app.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 17:31:50


Post by: NTRabbit


 Kanluwen wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
To me, the most interesting thing about the original GoA bunch of ideas was the formation of a continuous worldwide campaign that used a smartphone app to let players put all their game results into an evolving timeline.

It sounds more like they heard about what Bungie is doing with "Destiny" and tying in players' timelines with a smartphone app.


The Kickstarter project where all this was mentioned was launched and cancelled before the smartphone/social stuff with Destiny became public knowledge. It was more taking the 13th Black Crusade campaign to the next logical step with newly available technology.

I was enthusiastic about the project at the time, but that enthusiasm has waned some.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 19:53:17


Post by: Alpharius


 BrookM wrote:
Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.


Because that's what I was after?

WTF?!?

My biggest problem with these odd looking miniatures is that they just don't look good overall, period.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 19:59:49


Post by: Compel


So, it's been about a year now since GoA's kickstarter was attempted and the progress was 3 models on top of the 1 they made during the kickstarter?

I was really into the kickstarter but when it was cancelled, I ended up putting the funds I had aside for it into Deadzone instead.

It just seemes too little too late now.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:07:09


Post by: Kilkrazy


 BrookM wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
Why?

If you want players to send in battle results it's going to have to be done electronically. An app is a great way to do it and doesn't stop you from having a web page too.
What of the people who have phones or phone services that do not support that type of thing? Why not a website instead?


Why not an app and a website? The campaign system would be a database and it could be accessed through several different front ends without difficulty.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:08:55


Post by: plastictrees


 Compel wrote:
So, it's been about a year now since GoA's kickstarter was attempted and the progress was 3 models on top of the 1 they made during the kickstarter?

I was really into the kickstarter but when it was cancelled, I ended up putting the funds I had aside for it into Deadzone instead.

It just seemes too little too late now.


The guy on the right was pretty much entirely sculpted during the course of the KS...so, 2 models.

They aren't especially inspiring. Especially given what other companies are producing without half a million dollars of up front investment.

Still interested in seeing where this goes, but I'm pretty much covered as far as grim/pulpy sci-fi (40k) and near future SCI-fi (Infinity), and there are other companies with very robust initial mini offerings that are more likely to fill any holes in my interest.
As has been stated, multi-part plastic kits will be a big move if they can justify it financially.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:10:36


Post by: edlowe


I was massively disappointed with the Goa kickstarter and following abandonment of the forum. I did however pick up a resin Hansa which is a really nice figure. I'll probably pick up the releases as they come out but my attentions been grabbed now by other systems such as deadzone and the forthcoming Afterlife from Anvil.

I must admit I do like the retro look of the figures, the painter's done a nice job especially on the skin tones.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:15:25


Post by: Kilkrazy


TBH I don't think it matters if the figures are good, except of course that if they want to make the money from the figures rather than the rest of it.

I have so many SF figures I really don't need any more and I don't care if they match some official universe.

What I want is good rules and a campaign.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:16:45


Post by: BrookM


 Alpharius wrote:
 BrookM wrote:
Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.


Because that's what I was after?

WTF?!?

My biggest problem with these odd looking miniatures is that they just don't look good overall, period.
Come to think, not sure what you like.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:17:28


Post by: Grimtuff


 BrookM wrote:
Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.


Instead we get General Traag and Ben Grimm.

I personally like them. Curious to see where this goes this time.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:22:26


Post by: edlowe


Im sure the the background they released the Boromites were two sub races with the larger overseers and smaller workers. It will be interesting to see if they stick to this plan.

Also I believe their changing the rules to match Bolt action. I've got not experience with that games system. Is it any good?

Also not sure why I noticed it but the model on the left seems to have a very rocky groin area?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:27:44


Post by: AlexHolker


 BrookM wrote:
Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.

Something different, not something odd. Start with something where people can see the utility and think "why didn't anyone else make these?" and not something where people know why nobody made these (because they look like refugees from bad 60s sci fi).

The drones would be far more interesting to me if they were a tracked chassis instead of legged. They could have made one plastic kit that could be used to build a semi-humanoid robot like Johnny-5, a combat drone like a TALON or SHIV, or just a utility robot like a MALP.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:39:27


Post by: BrookM


As neat as that sounds, I'd rather not see Warlord waste precious resources on plastics for a concept that has failed the first time round.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 20:45:11


Post by: edlowe


Surprised to find a new Goa forum on Warlords site.

Found this little bit of info from Rick P

 
it's going to be next year before we can start in a serious way - although I've done a lot of work on the game, we do need to wait until we can catch up with the model making - always the most difficult bit in many respects. Copies of the revised rules have gone out to several play test groups - folks who have helped me in the past with different projects (including Bolt Action). Wojtek has been making Boromites, and we have some test sculpts of the Isorians ready too, and I have been working on a range of buildings to go with the game - so expect to see some sneak peeks of work in progress from January. We've played a good few games - I've lost almost every one - so that's a promising start

The background story was one of the things that I enjoyed most about the Kickstarter - in so far as it really gelled very quickly and was very exiting to work on, although filling out the detail takes the time of course! The Boromites have evolved into something quite characterful and interesting, thanks to Wojtek's sticking with it... and working out the odd surprise. Well it surprised me anyway And I've managed to hammer the background out into a more cohesive overview - it's the difference between the initial phase, where you bang down all the ideas regardless of where they fit or how important they are, and the refined vision, where there's a more coherent hierarchy in terms of the concept and details. So, I reckon we're where we need to be right now - and next year should start to see some of that work come to fruition. 

GoA has been a very interesting project for me - and it reminds me of nothing else than the initial run up to the original Rogue Trooper WH 40,000 game! Perhaps that is just me We've been playing very character led, almost role-playing skirmish wargames, and having great fun. We've played some more run of the mill 'line 'em up games' too - Bolt Action style confrontations between two sides - and plainly the game has to work on that level too. I just enjoy the umpire/Gm driven games where three sides are trying to achieve their objectives and don't quite know what the other guys' objectives are - sit back and watch the anarchy erupt - style of play!


so some more new figs on the way plus plastic buildings? Sounds like they could be investing quite a bit into this.





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:06:59


Post by: Alpharius


Needs moar generic white males in pseudo power-armor.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:17:50


Post by: BrookM


Well, if they're using the Bolt Action system with order dice, not bad! It's a system I can get wholly behind.

Also, yes, we need more generic white guys. (And gals!)





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:18:29


Post by: -DE-


 Alpharius wrote:
Needs moar generic white males in pseudo power-armor.


In different colors, some with viking horns.

That these models look so gleefully old-school is why I like them so much and they're growing on me more each time I look at them. They look like straight out of a '50s sci-fi movie, and that's fine! Even if the game doesn't pan out, these models I'll happily add to my collection.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:18:55


Post by: AlexHolker


 BrookM wrote:
As neat as that sounds, I'd rather not see Warlord waste precious resources on plastics for a concept that has failed the first time round.

Are you talking about the game as a whole, or my tracked robot idea?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:22:00


Post by: BrookM


 -DE- wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
Needs moar generic white males in pseudo power-armor.

They look like straight out of a '50s sci-fi movie, and that's fine! Even if the game doesn't pan out, these models I'll happily add to my collection.
That I could get behind, I'd love me some more wacky 50's styled raygun gothic minis!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 AlexHolker wrote:
 BrookM wrote:
As neat as that sounds, I'd rather not see Warlord waste precious resources on plastics for a concept that has failed the first time round.

Are you talking about the game as a whole, or my tracked robot idea?
Either, both. While I like the idea of a modular robot kit, Warlord isn't a GW or Privateer Press, so it can't really pony up dosh for small projects like that.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 21:35:01


Post by: warboss


 Alpharius wrote:
Needs moar generic white males in pseudo power-armor.


You can't handle that much 70's porn star butt-plate magnitude.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/19 22:42:29


Post by: Azazelx


 lord_blackfang wrote:
 AlexHolker wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Any word on plastics?

They did have a guy sculpting a robot intended to be a plastic squad, but that was before the Kickstarter was cancelled.

I'm not expecting anything worthwhile to come of this. Everything they did, they bungled. That robot, for example, was being hand sculpted, despite the need for multiple, symmetrical copies of the same rigid components in different configurations. If anything should be sculpted digitally, it's that. Or their planned releases that would make themed armies impossible without buying five or six copies of the same five or six single piece sculpts, where Necromunda would give you twenty or more before you needed to double up.


That's what happens when you have a design team of people who stopped being innovative in the mid 90s and whose mentality never really moved past the "garage company" stage in any way (quality, production, nor business sense). Funnily this handicap seems to be entirely a UK-based thing.


I dunno. Warlord Games seems to be doing quite well. And, well, that's where most companies in our niche hobby seem to be, excepting for a very few of them like the ones that Hasbro ate, and FFG. PP? Wasn't McVey involved in that?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 00:13:30


Post by: Gallahad


I agree with others that these look like bad retro sci-fi designs complete with a "battle drill" because Miners!

Sci fi injection molded plastic would be a welcome addition, but I think that is unlikely based off their previous funding model of "pay us money so you can design a sci-fi game we aren't willing to take any risks on!"


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 00:22:05


Post by: TechMarine1


I'm interested in seeing where they go with this, but those first minis aren't that impressive IMHO.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 00:25:30


Post by: primalexile


I like the idea of the models but the execution seems poor in comparison to new age sculpts. I would like to see a relaunch of the Kickstarter to just find the rule on faster. I was excited to see Rick bring a great set of Sci-Fi rules.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 04:15:23


Post by: Azazelx


I'm not sold on the background or the models, unfortunately. It'd take a lot for something to beat 40k for me, sadly.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 04:54:28


Post by: Piston Honda


Reminds me of the mutants from the Hills have Eyes


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 05:32:46


Post by: Buzzsaw


 Alpharius wrote:
 BrookM wrote:
Sometimes it might be better to start off with something odd instead of generic white males in pseudo powered armour.


Because that's what I was after?

WTF?!?

My biggest problem with these odd looking miniatures is that they just don't look good overall, period.


I have to agree with this: I just don't find those models to be all that interesting from a design or execution standpoint. Granted the high-end paint job helps, but... they just don't seem all that good to me.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 09:40:24


Post by: monders


Eurgh, they're dreadful.

They remind me of Rock Lords from He-Man.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 10:13:45


Post by: Osbad


If they're going to be metal, and I expect them to be, as Warlord don't seem to muck about with resin, then that for a start is a mark in their favour for me.

Right now I am in the market for interesting races of futuristic aliens in metal at 28mm-ish scale. Plastic is OK for cheap rank-fillers if absolutely necessary (or of course vehicles), but that's all, and resin, or more often these new-fangled "sprueless plastic" materials = yuck. For me that was the one downside of Deadzone - "restic" is one of the poorest materials I have come across that has been seriously used for modelling (although it has to be said, I understand the benefits in price to the end consumer that it has, I also like low prices!). If someone produces some nice models that I can proxy in for rebs, its gold.

The rules for GoA, I couldn't care less about at this stage. There are plenty of decent sci-fi rules out there already (and Deadzone is one of the better ones), so either GoA brings something new and interesting to the table (did you see what I did there?) in which case great, or it doesn't, in which case I stick with what I've got. Where there's a shortage is decent, metal, sci-fi aliens in numbers and variety to make squads.

So far these models are "OK" but nothing exciting. I'm hoping for something more unusual and less anthropomorphic in the future.





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 10:35:37


Post by: BrookM


Single minis are always metal with Warlord, they reserve resin for vehicle kits and in some cases, large shaped things, like the Roman Testudo set.

I don't see them changing any time soon, as why change something that works so well?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 14:12:28


Post by: judgedoug


 Azazelx wrote:
I'm not sold on the background or the models, unfortunately. It'd take a lot for something to beat 40k for me, sadly.


Come now, I know you don't play games because of background or models. You and I are Warhammer background and model fans... that play Kings of War.

I'm very excited about the possibility of a GOOD sci fi ruleset that I can use 40k models and background with.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 14:23:13


Post by: kronk


These minis seem a poor way to launch a new enterprise.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 14:45:29


Post by: BrookM


Maybe they are lowering the expectations now and blowing us away with the next batch?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/20 15:07:43


Post by: warboss


 BrookM wrote:
Maybe they are lowering the expectations now and blowing us away with the next batch?


That strategy didn't work with the kickstarter and its updates.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/21 14:30:58


Post by: mitch_rifle


Their not too bad i like them interesting to see what happens especially if they follow the bolt action style rules


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/21 18:17:35


Post by: Theophony


Glad they stepped back to see what was wrong from the get-go and decided that it was just their timing . Betting the next models will be the space furries . The thing hat bothers me about the boromites is one has huge eyes, and another has 1980s style slim glasses that h eyes couldn't fit behind . Lets get some consistency


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/21 18:34:10


Post by: Kilkrazy


GW cracked the technique of selling a set of rules associated with a background and selling the "official" models for the same game.

Flames of War attempted to do the same thing for WW2, and did pretty well by choosing 15mm rather than the existing, popular 20mm scale (1/72) but in the end they were unable to corner the market in WW2 rules, fluff and models.

Other companies, like Corvus Belli, are doing the same for SF or Fantasy.

I believe the next big thing might be not a set of rules with official fluff and models, but "games as a service". What I mean is a set of rules and fluff, supported by a subscription campaign that players can join and use any models they like to play out their battles. The concept combines multi-player online games like Eve Online with tabletop gaming.

That is what I think Gates of Antares could be.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/22 13:25:12


Post by: BrookM


Another update from the Warlord site: http://www.warlordgames.com/42292/beyond-the-gates-of-antares-rules-system/

Rick Priestley tells us more about Warlord’s forthcoming science-fiction project Beyond the Gates of Antares:

For this update on the Beyond the Gates of Antares game I’m going to talk a little bit about the game system. Don’t worry though, we do have plenty more models on their way – and we’ll be showing you some of those in next weeks newsletter. This time round I thought I’d just outline what I’ve been up to with the game system itself. It’s still a work-in-progress, especially in terms of detail, but by-and-large we’ve hammered out the core rules. Our aim is to publish a playable version online in a few months time, when everyone will get to have a go and volunteer their input via our forums.



Some of Rick’s Boromites take up position ready to react to any enemy advance.

The game is essentially a Sci-Fi development of Warlord’s existing Bolt Action game system, which means that players familiar with Bolt Action will have a good idea of the basic mechanics of play. We use the same Order dice – although there is wild talk of using a slightly modified version – but the Bolt Action dice does the job. The Order system is also broadly the same as for Bolt Action: each unit has a dice in the dice bag and the players pull one dice at a time to determine which side gets to take an action. The chief difference between Antares and Bolt Action is that the new game uses D10s for most resolution purposes rather than D6s or 2D6. This allows for a greater band of stats and modifiers, which is necessary to accommodate the different capabilities, size, robustness, and strength of the combatants. So, with the Order dice, the system is basically the same as Bolt Action, except that instead of rolling 2D6 against the unit’s modified morale value to act, you roll a single D10 against the unit’s Command stat. The new Command stat is used for giving orders. The orders themselves follow the same format as in Bold Action, except for ‘Ambush’ which works somewhat differently as we shall see.

REACTIONS
The reason why the Ambush order is different to Bolt Action is that it works with the new Reaction system. In Bolt Action units can sometimes react to enemy actions, for example a unit that has been charged by an enemy can shoot as it approaches, and units that are shot at can react by going Down. However, in Bolt Action all these reactions are somewhat ad hoc parts of the games system, utilising different mechanics and functioning in different ways. In Antares all of these reactions are subsumed within the same new mechanic. This allows for different types of reaction, and it makes room for us to add more should we wish. It also permits us to incorporate specific reactions into scenarios if that should prove useful (it does – more of that sort of thing in the future!). So, overall Reactions are a very flexible and useful feature of the game. To make a reaction a unit must take and pass a Reaction test. This test is taken against a new stat Initiative. So, where in Bolt Action we have a single morale stat, in Antares we have two different stats: Command for taking orders, and Initiative for making reactions. The Initiative test is otherwise taken in the same way as an Order test, in this case using a D10 against the unit’s modified Initiative stat. Pins on a unit work in the same way as in Bolt Action, and affect both Command and Initiative. The chief difference is that if a unit fails a Command roll it automatically goes Down (as a unit does in Bolt Action when failing an Order) however, if a unit fails a Reaction roll it instead gains +1 Pin marker.

SO WHEN CAN YOU USE A REACTION?
Well, units can only attempt a Reaction if they either have no Order dice (i.e. if they have yet to receive an Order that turn) or if they have an Ambush order dice. The Ambush order acts as a kind of marker that the unit is alert and ready to react. Units that make successful reactions are allocated an Order dice corresponding to whatever they do (usually Fire or Run). Units can attempt reactions in the following circumstance.

Stand and Shoot. A unit that has been successfully assaulted by an enemy can react by shooting as the enemy approach. If successful, this gives the unit a Fire order and enables it to try and shoot down the approaching enemy before they can bring their known weapons to bear. This Stand and Shoot reaction replaces the equivalent reaction in Bolt Action – see what I mean about integrating the reactions in Bolt Action into the new system.

Firefight. A unit that is shot at by an enemy unit with a Fire order at ranges up to 20″ can react by shooting back. If successful the unit gets a Fire order and both units exchange fire. This shooting takes place simultaneously, so both units shoot at full effect before both remove casualties.

Run to Cover. A unit that has been shot at by an enemy unit with a Fire order at ranges greater than 20″ can react by running to cover, either to place itself out of the line of sight of the shooters, behind cover, or at longer range. The unit gets a Run order and moves before the enemy can shoot.

Escape! A unit that has been assaulted by an enemy can react by making an immediate run move to try and place itself out of reach of the assault. The unit gets a Run order and makes its move before the enemy unit can make its assault.

Go Down! A unit that is targeted by enemy shooting can react by going down. This is the only reaction that doesn’t need a Reaction test – a unit that Goes Down does so automatically and a Down order is placed next to the unit. However, there is an important difference between down units in Bolt Action and Antares. In Antares units with a Down order can’t automatically place the dice back in the dice bag at the end of the turn. Instead, they have to pass an Initiative test to do so. This makes it risky to Go Down as there’s a good chance you’ll stay down! On the plus side though, down units are much harder to hit in Antares than in Bolt Action – so it’s a trade off between mobility and safety.

Ambush. The Ambush reaction is also a little different to the general run of Reactions because only a unit that already has an Ambush order can make an Ambush. A unit can make an ambush if an enemy unit moves within its field of fire using either a run or advance order, presenting a clear shot as it does so. A Reaction test is needed as usual, and if successful the unit can fire with a Fire order and then revert to an Ambush order immediately afterwards if the player wishes. If the test is failed the unit can still make its Ambush by firing at the enemy, but retains the Fire order afterwards. This mean a successful Ambusher can make a further Ambush or other reaction subsequently in the turn, but a failed dice roll means you just get the one Ambush and that’s your lot. This is rather different than the way the Ambush works in Bolt Action, although in both games units that are give an Ambush order can make an Ambush – only in Antares the unit can potentially keep its Ambush order and continue to react throughout the turn.

One interesting feature of these reactions is that some troops, and some kinds of Panhuman mutants, have better or poorer Initiative compared to their Command values. So, some forces are good at getting orders off but worse at reacting, whilst others may be less adept when it comes to orders but very good at reacting. Because the different tests use different stats there is also room for character-based modifiers with professional leaders boosting Command and inspiring, heroic individuals boosting Initiative. It certainly makes for an interesting dynamic and means that Antares plays and feels very differently to Bolt Action in many ways, whilst retaining the core Order dice mechanic that makes Bolt Action such a fast-paced and exciting game.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/22 14:42:13


Post by: lord_blackfang


Oh, good, yet another sci-fi system that is just WW2 with lasers tacked on. Just like anything ever made by historical companies trying to get into the sci-fi market.

Enjoying the promo pic of the Boromite boy band touring the middle east, though.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/22 16:43:48


Post by: Gallahad


Hmm. I like the Boromites a bit more in that photo. I am also pleased that the system uses D10. I think the Boromite design also makes a bit more sense as Panhumans. Still a bit boring and campy, but not as bad as I originally thought.

I do agree about the "WWII with lasers" thing about the rules, but that is pretty standard fare. 40K certainly comes to mind.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/22 17:49:00


Post by: lord_blackfang


Nah, 40k is medieval with lasers


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 04:23:53


Post by: Barzam


I'm surprised at the amount of hate for the Boromites. I know a lot of you guys were upset with the way the KS was handled and the "community involvement," but those figures don't look bad. I mean, yeah, they look like they should be chasing the Doctor through a rock quarry, but they're well sculpted and each figure has a nice bit of personality to them. I'm all for Warlord bringing in some new sci-fi figures. It gives me more variety to choose from.

I couldn't give a crap about the setting or gameplay though since they'd just wind up getting shoehorned into some other game.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 17:11:17


Post by: JohnnyHell


Ugly miniatures... still staying well clear of GoA.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 17:25:34


Post by: AlexHolker


 Barzam wrote:
I'm surprised at the amount of hate for the Boromites. I know a lot of you guys were upset with the way the KS was handled and the "community involvement," but those figures don't look bad. I mean, yeah, they look like they should be chasing the Doctor through a rock quarry, but they're well sculpted and each figure has a nice bit of personality to them.

The Boromites are a "Rembrandt comic book" - or if you prefer, a polished turd. It doesn't matter if the execution is good if the concept is bad, and for a lot of us, the concept is ugly and goofy.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 18:41:08


Post by: Guildsman


 AlexHolker wrote:
 Barzam wrote:
I'm surprised at the amount of hate for the Boromites. I know a lot of you guys were upset with the way the KS was handled and the "community involvement," but those figures don't look bad. I mean, yeah, they look like they should be chasing the Doctor through a rock quarry, but they're well sculpted and each figure has a nice bit of personality to them.

The Boromites are a "Rembrandt comic book" - or if you prefer, a polished turd. It doesn't matter if the execution is good if the concept is bad, and for a lot of us, the concept is ugly and goofy.

Exactly. Yes, the Boromites are well-sculpted technically, but that doesn't stop them from being ridiculous. They look like purple Thing knockoffs with goofy old-school rayguns and a drill because they're miners, get it?! Also, the bit from the background fluff about "minds too primitive for advanced technology" is problematic at best.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 18:58:13


Post by: Yodhrin


Hmm, not too sure about those rules, they have the stench of the old "Overwatch problem" about them; if you can run away when assaulted, take cover when shot at, and units can perform multiple ambushes, the only time you really risk your men dying is if you try and attack the opponent. Unless there's some other mechanics in the rules to limit Reactions in some way, they look to heavily favour the defender in any scenario missions, and in straight-up combat missions may well end up promoting really dull games where players are reluctant to take even mild risks.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 19:26:57


Post by: BrookM


If it's like Bolt Action, making a unit react means they're giving up their own action for that turn.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 19:44:22


Post by: Kilkrazy


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Oh, good, yet another sci-fi system that is just WW2 with lasers tacked on. Just like anything ever made by historical companies trying to get into the sci-fi market.

Enjoying the promo pic of the Boromite boy band touring the middle east, though.


To be fair, 40K is just Mediaeval warfare with magic and lasers tacked on.

The basic WH/40K rule concept has been used for Warhammer Ancient Battles, Napoleonic Naval Combat, Great War, and English Civil War.

This is a good thing or a bad thing depending.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 19:44:48


Post by: frozenwastes


I'm sure the game will actually be good. Not too daring with a lot of ideas that are common in Rick's designs from the last few decades. Bolt Action pretty much is a cleaned up WW2 version of 40k with a lowered model count and more turn interactivity with the activation and reaction system.

Given, however, that everyone knows Space Marines are GW's best selling products, I don't get why other companies who want to move into the market for 40k-like game start with things like rock people.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 19:52:51


Post by: edlowe


Well Rick did mention there are two test sculpts for these guys done. Hopefully people might prefer them to the boromites

[Thumb - goa-isorian.png]


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 19:54:44


Post by: lord_blackfang


 Kilkrazy wrote:

To be fair, 40K is just Mediaeval warfare with magic and lasers tacked on.


Which is what I said a few posts after the one you qouted


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 22:56:23


Post by: frozenwastes


 edlowe wrote:
Well Rick did mention there are two test sculpts for these guys done. Hopefully people might prefer them to the boromites


I definitely like those guys better.

I like Warlord's stuff. I like Bolt Action and Warmaster and all the historical post-Warmaster extensions like Hail Caesar, Black Powder and Pike & Shotte.

I'm expecting good stuff here in terms of both miniatures and rules, even if the boromites currently get a "...whyyy...?" reaction from me.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/23 23:14:39


Post by: AlexHolker


 edlowe wrote:
Well Rick did mention there are two test sculpts for these guys done. Hopefully people might prefer them to the boromites

I know I do. I like the Yuuzhan Vong/Necromonger bioengineered armour look. While it's not something I want to own (but with the possible exception of robots, I'm not expecting there to be any), it's something I'd be happy to see across the table.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 00:13:50


Post by: Zond


Not a fan of Bolt Action or the background presented thus far. I would like the Boromites to have some kind of industrial bodysuit at the least. Right now we have The Thing in banana hammocks, or rocky Donald Duck. :-P


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 14:20:29


Post by: TechMarine1


 edlowe wrote:
Well Rick did mention there are two test sculpts for these guys done. Hopefully people might prefer them to the boromites


Much better (at least on the concept). Hope they actually end up looking like that.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 14:25:05


Post by: Kilkrazy


If you don't like the rules, the fluff and the models, it's best to try a different game.

OTOH if you think the rules are OK but the fluff and models are pants, you can play the rules with different models and read an SF book.

Most of us probably have enough 40K and/or other SF figures to easily play any skirmish scale game in 28mm.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 14:36:31


Post by: judgedoug


I'm expecting a refined Bolt Action rules set (a good thing) and at least one, if not several, plastic kits. Ever since Warlord dropped Renedra and bought/invested in their new plastics company, their plastics output has been really high- one kit every two months or so, right?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 14:42:37


Post by: Some_Call_Me_Tim?


 edlowe wrote:
Well Rick did mention there are two test sculpts for these guys done. Hopefully people might prefer them to the boromites


Dang! If the minis look anything like this drawing, I think I'll be wanting some. Really liking the Prometheus Engineer vibe.

~Tim?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 15:49:10


Post by: Red Viper


 Theophony wrote:
Glad they stepped back to see what was wrong from the get-go and decided that it was just their timing . Betting the next models will be the space furries


Have they mentioned a furry race/faction? I will proudly play furries if I have the chance.

Hopefully they can get 4+ factions. I'm interested in this.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 16:39:50


Post by: Guildsman


 Red Viper wrote:
 Theophony wrote:
Glad they stepped back to see what was wrong from the get-go and decided that it was just their timing . Betting the next models will be the space furries


Have they mentioned a furry race/faction? I will proudly play furries if I have the chance.

Hopefully they can get 4+ factions. I'm interested in this.


Back when they were taking suggestions on their forum (which is now all but defunct), some form of humans with engineered animalistic traits was something that a segment of the audience was pushing for. Of course, flame wars cropped up between pro- and anti-furry posters. For that reason alone, I doubt that it will happen.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 17:22:49


Post by: AlexHolker


 Guildsman wrote:
 Red Viper wrote:
Have they mentioned a furry race/faction? I will proudly play furries if I have the chance.

Back when they were taking suggestions on their forum (which is now all but defunct), some form of humans with engineered animalistic traits was something that a segment of the audience was pushing for. Of course, flame wars cropped up between pro- and anti-furry posters. For that reason alone, I doubt that it will happen.

The reason that is a crap idea is that they are not simply a race that appeals to furries, they are furries. First generation Panhumans are literally humans who are such donkey-caves that they deliberately doom their children to look like freaks.

If they weren't going out of their way to look like animals, it wouldn't be stupid. This sort of body modification makes more sense if it's limited to things that are either genuinely useful (like catlike eyes to grant night vision) or cosmetic changes meant to make you look more than human, rather than less. An angel's wings are far more palatable than a dog's snout, for example.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 17:39:31


Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured


I don't know if a dogs muzzle came with a dogs sense of smell it might be something to consider in the right circumstances


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 17:56:42


Post by: Kilkrazy


Also having an Os Penis. Look it up.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 18:12:08


Post by: BrookM


 judgedoug wrote:
I'm expecting a refined Bolt Action rules set (a good thing) and at least one, if not several, plastic kits. Ever since Warlord dropped Renedra and bought/invested in their new plastics company, their plastics output has been really high- one kit every two months or so, right?
Doesn't mean that producing their own plastics is cheap all of the sudden. As I've mentioned before, I'd rather not see them waste their own resources on this until it's certain that it will sell.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 19:09:03


Post by: AlexHolker


 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
I don't know if a dogs muzzle came with a dogs sense of smell it might be something to consider in the right circumstances

A dog's sense of smell, taken in isolation? Sure, I can see how that might seem like a good idea at the time. But I don't think you'd want to disfigure your face - and your children's faces - to do it.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 19:12:10


Post by: judgedoug


 BrookM wrote:
 judgedoug wrote:
I'm expecting a refined Bolt Action rules set (a good thing) and at least one, if not several, plastic kits. Ever since Warlord dropped Renedra and bought/invested in their new plastics company, their plastics output has been really high- one kit every two months or so, right?
Doesn't mean that producing their own plastics is cheap all of the sudden. As I've mentioned before, I'd rather not see them waste their own resources on this until it's certain that it will sell.


A good generic sci fi plastic kit should sell well. With Warlord's prices I'd buy several, personally.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 20:18:31


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


I would love it if they bought some designs from Thon or Total Extinction and made those into plastic.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 20:39:00


Post by: Guildsman


 AlexHolker wrote:
The reason that is a crap idea is that they are not simply a race that appeals to furries, they are furries. First generation Panhumans are literally humans who are such donkey-caves that they deliberately doom their children to look like freaks.

If they weren't going out of their way to look like animals, it wouldn't be stupid. This sort of body modification makes more sense if it's limited to things that are either genuinely useful (like catlike eyes to grant night vision) or cosmetic changes meant to make you look more than human, rather than less. An angel's wings are far more palatable than a dog's snout, for example.

This is a problem with the entirety of the background, and it'll be really interesting to see if/how it's ever addressed. Even the figures we've seen so far beg the question: who in the hell thought it would be good to curse their descendents to look like palette-swapped versions of the Thing for all time? "Hey guys, let's turn ourselves and all of our offspring forever into rock monsters!"

Now, exploring this idea of the cultural issues resultant from your ancestors fiddling with your genetics could be brilliant if executed correctly. Maybe the Boromites have no desire for tradition or history because they hate what their ancestors did to them. Maybe another race feels themselves to be superior to all others, because they feel that they were altered "correctly." You could get light years of story mileage out of it, while exploring real-world issues.

Not that any of this is likely to happen, but still, it's nice to dream.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 20:59:18


Post by: AlexHolker


 judgedoug wrote:
A good generic sci fi plastic kit should sell well. With Warlord's prices I'd buy several, personally.

I don't think generic sci-fi even exists - you're always going to be working with some subset of sci-fi or another. Depending on the feel of the setting and the faction, a hover tank could be anything from Hammer's Slammers' air cushion tanks to Dreamzone's hover-MBT to Games Workshop's Falcon to Supreme Commander's Blaze.

For me, there are four broad categories of things they could make:

Things I want, and would buy for their own sake. Examples: women in armoured bodygloves ala Mass Effect.
Things I want, to supplement things from the first category. Examples: vehicles, drones.
Things I don't want, but would be happy to see across the table. Examples: that guy in the bioengineered armour.
Things I think suck. Examples: space-faring gorillas.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 21:25:55


Post by: edlowe


As far as I can gather Rick is still hoping to forge ahead with the plastic robot drones that make up the majority of the pan human forces. I'll ask on their forum and see what answer I get. I know the work was started on them during the ks but was put on hold due to its failure.

edit, looks like someone beat me to it, a semi offical reply?
by Paul @ Warlord Games » Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:02 pm

Key didn't really get that far with his Wardrone so there's not really anything to show off or make available



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/24 23:34:37


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


Maybe they should make an egg-shaped mecha hardsuit. Seems there's a market for it...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/25 22:30:54


Post by: edlowe


Some more bits of info from the GoA forum from Rick.
Yes - as Paul says we didn't get very far with our initial design and we'll have to start again on that one. Beyond the Gates of Antares (which I always refer to as Antares but I notice it gets calls Gates, GoA and all sorts) is being developed at a good pace consistent with getting the models and game play right - there are lots of things we wanted to do originally which are just going to have to wait until the game is established. The WarDrones are one of those things - our first priority to to get playable forces out for the Boromites and Algoryn we've already started to show you - and then the Isorians and Concord. It's not exactly a slow burn - 'cos there is load of stuff in preparation! - but the concept is so big there is no limit to what we could do. So - there is no 'everything' to get done -if you see what I mean - we could go on forever

One of the things I've had to give up on for now are all the ideas for an on-line real-time participation - because that would require an IT team that we simply can't afford. So, my ambitions for the game are a little more conventional that when we started out, but quite honestly that's not a bad thing in many ways - our team has some experience in that field! The WarDrones are on the list - just not right at the top! 




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/25 22:51:18


Post by: AlexHolker


...our first priority to to get playable forces out for the Boromites and Algoryn we've already started to show you...

For reference, the guy in the bioengineered armour isn't an Algoryn.

So in other words, their first two races are ugly men with a skin condition, and short, ugly men with a skin condition. Was anyone asking for either of those?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/25 22:54:30


Post by: Cruentus


So... They still have very little if any models done or near done, they've dropped the community input due to cost, and the 'didn't get far with the initial design'. Wow. I'm surprised they even tried to kickstarter this. Or maybe I'm not.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 01:00:35


Post by: Compel


What amazes me, is not that they tried to kickstart it. But it's they tried to kickstart it a year ago.

If they were that interested in relaunching this, I can't help but thing they would have got a whole lot more done.

Have the wardrones changed concept? From my understanding they were the main unit for almost all the factions. - It'd be the equivalent of GW doing a Horus Heresy game without working on a space marine with a bolter.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 01:45:31


Post by: Azazelx


 judgedoug wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:
I'm not sold on the background or the models, unfortunately. It'd take a lot for something to beat 40k for me, sadly.


Come now, I know you don't play games because of background or models. You and I are Warhammer background and model fans... that play Kings of War.

I'm very excited about the possibility of a GOOD sci fi ruleset that I can use 40k models and background with.


Well, I'm clearly talking about the background and models there, rather than specific rulesets.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 01:54:48


Post by: privateer4hire


I really wish that Warlord and Mantic would team up here. Priestly and Cavatore already have been working on similar core rules for the past several years.

It would take very little IMHO for them to make a common rulebook for sci-f that allowed a merged universe. Make up some dimensional access mumbo jumbo to allow cross-over btw model lines IF the players wanted it.

That lets one rulebook (and most of the rules these gents make is both awesome AND stylistically consistent) do double duty. It unites players and expands both companies potential purchases by a common player base --- that was likely going to be split on this any way.

Just a thought.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 01:56:01


Post by: Azazelx


 AlexHolker wrote:
...our first priority to to get playable forces out for the Boromites and Algoryn we've already started to show you...

For reference, the guy in the bioengineered armour isn't an Algoryn.

So in other words, their first two races are ugly men with a skin condition, and short, ugly men with a skin condition. Was anyone asking for either of those?


If they want to sell models, they need humans in both light and heavy space armour as one of their opening factions. This doesn't just mean not-Space Marines and not-Colonial Marines- it means something that fits the sci-fi tropes that have been in existence for decades. If the models look good, they'll also be bought by the bucketful with an IG Codex right around the corner...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 02:46:22


Post by: Yodhrin


 BrookM wrote:
If it's like Bolt Action, making a unit react means they're giving up their own action for that turn.


It was specifically noted that units can do multiple ambushes in a turn. Combine that with the fact any unit you shoot can immediately shoot back(and resolves simultaneously) and any unit you assault can just run away when you try to engage them, and you have a system in which moving around and attacking the enemy are actively discouraged.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 02:56:15


Post by: AlexHolker


 Azazelx wrote:
If they want to sell models, they need humans in both light and heavy space armour as one of their opening factions. This doesn't just mean not-Space Marines and not-Colonial Marines- it means something that fits the sci-fi tropes that have been in existence for decades. If the models look good, they'll also be bought by the bucketful with an IG Codex right around the corner...

If it was me, this is what I'd do to start things off:

- Come up with a single stylish form of "rubber forehead alien" (i.e. something not human that can wear human armour, like Asari do in Mass Effect).
- Come up with a single stylish form of human body armour.
- Make a multipart plastic kit with heads for both humans and the other race.

You'd still get your not-Imperial Guard in a material appropriate for massed infantry, but would also already have an OPFOR race even before you make a second kit.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 03:35:07


Post by: Rolt


@Alex

That's actually a pretty good idea (I think I'll "borrow" it (), considering that most basic troops in just about any sci-fi game boil down to avenge sized humanoid solider in armor with a gun/combat weapon (regardless if human or alien)
its not hard to believe a degree of standardization in their design couldn't work. You could even take it one step further and create add-on armor parts/baggage similar to both what DFG and KD are doing with their plastics.
Combine this with a versatile plastic drone kit and you could have the "core" options for 3 or 4 armies with the barest amount of kits.

Ya'know I really don't want to sound like a GoA hater, but its really hard to believe they still have so little to show after a years of work, I thought this was meant to be their "dream project" they've been planning for years, I really
hope we see something amazing soon, the boramites are OK, I just don't see myself ever rushing to buy them. I'd love to believe their just holding back the big ground-breaking surprise for last.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 04:07:57


Post by: Kilkrazy


They haven't started a new Kickstarter yet. Perhaps they are saving their new stuff to put on that.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 05:59:56


Post by: Barzam


I think they could do "furry" type characters without having to make them actual furries. Just make them like the Beastmen from Phantasy Star Online or the Wulvers from Infinity.

Come to think of it, just make a Phantasy Star Online miniature game. That'd be much cooler.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 06:29:13


Post by: skrulnik


 Rolt wrote:
@Alex

That's actually a pretty good idea (I think I'll "borrow" it (), considering that most basic troops in just about any sci-fi game boil down to avenge sized humanoid solider in armor with a gun/combat weapon (regardless if human or alien)
its not hard to believe a degree of standardization in their design couldn't work. You could even take it one step further and create add-on armor parts/baggage similar to both what DFG and KD are doing with their plastics.
Combine this with a versatile plastic drone kit and you could have the "core" options for 3 or 4 armies with the barest amount of kits.

Ya'know I really don't want to sound like a GoA hater, but its really hard to believe they still have so little to show after a years of work, I thought this was meant to be their "dream project" they've been planning for years, I really
hope we see something amazing soon, the boramites are OK, I just don't see myself ever rushing to buy them. I'd love to believe their just holding back the big ground-breaking surprise for last.



Why should they have anything more to show?
If they are doing work on it on the side, minis would be the last thing to work on.

From the GoA KS page
Dark Space Corp is a new company, founded by ex- Games Workshop stalwarts Rick Priestley & John Stallard, and a video games guy called Rik Alexander.

We've formed a partnership with the brilliant Warlord Games who will handle all the production and operational side so that DSC can focus on the game development, miniature design and community.


They still need to do their day jobs to cover all the things like rules development and paying sculptors.
That was the point of the KS. So they could afford to focus on making just this game.
You can plan the gak out of anything, but if you don't have the time to implement it, it doesn't move on its own.
That's what we are seeing here more than anything, imo.
They've been concentrating on the rules part.
These sculpts are probably all they've been able to afford on their own.

Also, they are not part of Warlord Games.
Dark Space Corp, who are creating GoA, are affiliated with Warlord in the respect that once they have a product ready, Warlord will help them sell it. Maybe they have agreements in place to help them produce it as well, but who knows?
Similar to Mantic and Allessio Cavatore's various games.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 06:33:30


Post by: Gallahad


 AlexHolker wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:
If they want to sell models, they need humans in both light and heavy space armour as one of their opening factions. This doesn't just mean not-Space Marines and not-Colonial Marines- it means something that fits the sci-fi tropes that have been in existence for decades. If the models look good, they'll also be bought by the bucketful with an IG Codex right around the corner...

If it was me, this is what I'd do to start things off:

- Come up with a single stylish form of "rubber forehead alien" (i.e. something not human that can wear human armour, like Asari do in Mass Effect).
- Come up with a single stylish form of human body armour.
- Make a multipart plastic kit with heads for both humans and the other race.

You'd still get your not-Imperial Guard in a material appropriate for massed infantry, but would also already have an OPFOR race even before you make a second kit.


Good idea! Unfortunately, I fear we will only be getting the mutant rejects from 80's sci-fi in metal.

I mean, somebody has to be looking at what Mark has done with the Dreamforge Games Eisenkern, and saying "Hey! There is a market for alternative sci-fi miniatures in injection plastic!" It has always puzzled me that the historical market is packet with true plastic kits from a variety of manufacturers (Fireforge, Perry, Conquest, Gripping Beast, Victrix, etc.) but sci-fi has largely been neglected. The sci-fi market for miniatures gaming has to be 10X the size of the market for historicals.

As others have said, the current showing for Gates of Antares is pretty poor.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 08:10:56


Post by: frozenwastes


 AlexHolker wrote:
...our first priority to to get playable forces out for the Boromites and Algoryn we've already started to show you...

For reference, the guy in the bioengineered armour isn't an Algoryn.

So in other words, their first two races are ugly men with a skin condition, and short, ugly men with a skin condition. Was anyone asking for either of those?


Why is it that when ex-GW people decide to get into making their own sci-fi game, they seem to always think Space Dwarves are a good idea for their initial ranges? First Mantic with their Forge Fathers and now this. Short guys that tunnel underground but with ray guns.

Ugh.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 08:57:40


Post by: Agamemnon2


Because they've all been left shellshocked by the fate of the Squats?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 08:57:57


Post by: ChaoticMind


 frozenwastes wrote:
 AlexHolker wrote:
...our first priority to to get playable forces out for the Boromites and Algoryn we've already started to show you...

For reference, the guy in the bioengineered armour isn't an Algoryn.

So in other words, their first two races are ugly men with a skin condition, and short, ugly men with a skin condition. Was anyone asking for either of those?


Why is it that when ex-GW people decide to get into making their own sci-fi game, they seem to always think Space Dwarves are a good idea for their initial ranges? First Mantic with their Forge Fathers and now this. Short guys that tunnel underground but with ray guns.

Ugh.


They want to de-retcon the squats. Problem is you need a slightly silly game to do that and GoA, Warpath, and Deadzone are serious settings. They work in Dreadball because it is fantasy football where every team has a shtick.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 09:19:30


Post by: AlexHolker


 frozenwastes wrote:
Why is it that when ex-GW people decide to get into making their own sci-fi game, they seem to always think Space Dwarves are a good idea for their initial ranges? First Mantic with their Forge Fathers and now this. Short guys that tunnel underground but with ray guns.

Ugh.

You remember how every Games Day we'd get a bunch of berks asking when the Squats would be coming back?

I blame those guys.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 09:52:46


Post by: Palindrome


 frozenwastes wrote:
they seem to always think Space Dwarves are a good idea for their initial ranges?


At least its not space elves.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 12:16:38


Post by: legoburner


How close is Rick to retirement? I remember the GoA outline stating that he wanted something that would fund him through retirement but if retirement is close and it has been a year already, is there a chance this could end up as a bit of a pump and dump from a rules and background perspective?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 12:23:03


Post by: Azazelx


 ChaoticMind wrote:

They want to de-retcon the squats. Problem is you need a slightly silly game to do that and GoA, Warpath, and Deadzone are serious settings. They work in Dreadball because it is fantasy football where every team has a shtick.


I don't see squats as needing a silly game. In any case, Warpath/Deadzone already has space orcs and dancing space goblins.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 12:29:34


Post by: Compel


I know it's incredibly irrational, especially since I went into the mantic kickstarters and would still go into their kickstarters, despite them being arguably less in need of the money than Dark Space Corp are.

However, it really did raise my hackles that a couple of months after GoA was cancelled, I seem to remember reading an article that talked about how Rick Priestley had been spending the same amount of money he was asking for in the kickstarter to turn his barn into a heated gaming room.

It just makes me feel as if I've been tricked.

As I said, incredibly irrational.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 12:33:33


Post by: Azazelx


I dunno. Given the job of "wargames rules designer" it seems like he could be in semi-retirement while working from home on his own schedule more or less with something like GoA (or even a limited amount of work-for-hire rules writing).


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Compel wrote:
I know it's incredibly irrational, especially since I went into the mantic kickstarters and would still go into their kickstarters, despite them being arguably less in need of the money than Dark Space Corp are.

However, it really did raise my hackles that a couple of months after GoA was cancelled, I seem to remember reading an article that talked about how Rick Priestley had been spending the same amount of money he was asking for in the kickstarter to turn his barn into a heated gaming room.

It just makes me feel as if I've been tricked.

As I said, incredibly irrational.


Well, there's a difference between kickstarting the setting up a new company and using your savings after a lifetime of work to do some renovations. I'm sure Ronnie has quite a nice games room, and Mantic keep Kickstarting things.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 14:05:58


Post by: TechMarine1


 Palindrome wrote:
 frozenwastes wrote:
they seem to always think Space Dwarves are a good idea for their initial ranges?


At least its not space elves.


Or space rats...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 14:20:46


Post by: lord_blackfang


 Azazelx wrote:

Well, there's a difference between kickstarting the setting up a new company and using your savings after a lifetime of work to do some renovations. I'm sure Ronnie has quite a nice games room, and Mantic keep Kickstarting things.


I think it speaks volumes when someone is afraid of investing his own capital into his own project. Knowing that Ricky actually had the required money on hand makes it even more obvious GoA wasn't the dream project it was touted as but just a "give me money cause I'm famous!" cash grab.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 14:25:10


Post by: Zweischneid


 lord_blackfang wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:

Well, there's a difference between kickstarting the setting up a new company and using your savings after a lifetime of work to do some renovations. I'm sure Ronnie has quite a nice games room, and Mantic keep Kickstarting things.


I think it speaks volumes when someone is afraid of investing his own capital into his own project. Knowing that Ricky actually had the required money on hand makes it even more obvious GoA wasn't the dream project it was touted as but just a "give me money cause I'm famous!" cash grab.


Maybe not. There was far too much high-flying rhetoric surrounding the GoA Kickstarter.

That said, it is (I think) legitimate to use Kickstarter to "test" the demand for a game, rather than sinking your own life savings into a dud. Just need to avoid all that "Kickstarter-like-it-was-truly-meant-to-be-BS", which made them (Rick?) look bitter not only towards GW, but also bitter towards people having success on Kickstarter.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 15:07:21


Post by: ChaoticMind


 Azazelx wrote:
 ChaoticMind wrote:

They want to de-retcon the squats. Problem is you need a slightly silly game to do that and GoA, Warpath, and Deadzone are serious settings. They work in Dreadball because it is fantasy football where every team has a shtick.


I don't see squats as needing a silly game. In any case, Warpath/Deadzone already has space orcs and dancing space goblins.


I meant the old squats style that wouldn't bat an eye at ork rock-stars as a unit. The bikes, dwarfs, burrowing tanks Etc. can stay but to fit they need to drop the over the top style GW had at the time and instead be a "new" concept from the ground up, not just Squats / Dwarfs in Spaaaace.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 15:51:52


Post by: Rolt


I think at the end of the day wherever or not the Algoyal/space-dwarfs work will depend completely on the overall visual style they take with them, even Mass Effect had a short dwarf-like race and they fitted in fine because they matched
the overall branching style of the game. GoA on the other hand we still don't know what this game is even meant to look like visually, there just isn't enough for us to digest yet. Although one key issue I see popping up with this game is due
to the simple fact that most of these races are meant to be altered humans (panhumans), if they were simply aliens I wouldn't be surprised if they were accepted more naturally, or at the very least less of a knee-jerk reaction to the concept.

So on a different note are they going to do a second KS for this game? I still like those CoCom troopers, kinda surprised they didn't open up the new project with them.




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 17:37:10


Post by: Gallahad


The Algoyal are space dwarves? This fascination with space dwarves baffles me. My interest in anything to do with Gates of Antares is sinking fast.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:26:33


Post by: edlowe


Heres the fluff for the Algoryn Prosperate.


The Algoryn Prosperate is a powerful group of worlds within the Determinate and one of the chief enemies of the Gwar. The Algoryn are adapted to high levels of radiation and very hot temperatures, with thick, gnarly skins, dense musculature and bony outgrowths over their eyes that shield them from the radioactive glare of the Algoryn suns. They have a relatively high civilisation level and trade Concord technology through Freebooter traders.


And regarding aliens, heres the first planned 'Alien' species, not panhuman

Aside from these panhuman dominated regions of Antarean Space there are many alien species, of which the most dangerous from the point of view of humans is undoubtedly the Vorl Orde. These savage creatures care little for the lives of humans or any living things for that matter. They are plunderers and raiders whose only aim appears to be to subject and enslave other species. Fortunately, they are fractious creatures, so rarely do they act in concert or maintain their efforts for long.





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:32:57


Post by: Compel


Hopefully the Vorl Orde won't be slightly larger than a man, with extremely large muscles, a tusked jaw and green skin...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:37:00


Post by: Rolt


Any idea who the Gwar are or what they look like?



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:41:14


Post by: BrookM


Nothing good can come from a faction name like that.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:41:59


Post by: edlowe


As far as i recall the Gwar are heavily modified humans bred for war, they are massily into their own superiority over any other panhumans or aliens and are in a state of war at all times. Not very nice people to have as your neighbours. I seem to remember their belief in their own superiority had become a kind of religious fever leading to them being highly expansive, though still not a big player in the GoA universe.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:43:44


Post by: Taarnak


This is The GWAR:
Spoiler:


Everyone else are pretenders to the throne...

Took me a minute to find a safe-ish picture. Lol.

~Eric


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 18:55:00


Post by: Rolt


@Edlowe
Thanks Eldowe, sounds cool enough, a race of super soldiers, not really my sort of thing I normally prefer stuff like Eldar, Aleph, Astrain, more techy factions, I'm sure the game will have one at some point. I look forward to the KS, one thing I still love about the idea of this universe is the gates themselves open the possibility for a limitless variety of races, alien or otherwise, this game has a ton of potential for conversions and custom content.

@Taarnak
They're too beautiful for words.....





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 19:49:59


Post by: Alpharius


The Gwar?

Seriously?



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:00:48


Post by: Rolt



"The Gwar does the warring
Keeps the enemies ah gnawing
Makes the babes ah fawning"

Gwar battle chant, true story.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:06:30


Post by: warboss


 Alpharius wrote:
The Gwar?

Seriously?



And the furries are left to pout yet again... Still, I agree with the sentiment. Basing your faction name on a band whose shock rock members are probably in AARP by now? I'm continually disappointed even further with every announcement for this. *fingers crossed for thon as the potential shining light for previously failed/cancelled kickstarters*


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:21:42


Post by: Kilkrazy


If the furry fans want a furry SF faction they should make a Kickstarter to build one. Frankly I am tempted to do it myself because it could make some decent money and it would be brilliant to annoy all the anal anti-furry players in GW-land and so on.

I don't know what the fuss is about, really. In the good old days we used to play Traveller with the Vargr and Aslan without batting an eye at "furryism".


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:22:06


Post by: Compel


Oh, I thought everyone was facepalming for another reason, not related to some shock rock thing...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:26:16


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


 Azazelx wrote:

Well, there's a difference between kickstarting the setting up a new company and using your savings after a lifetime of work to do some renovations. I'm sure Ronnie has quite a nice games room, and Mantic keep Kickstarting things.



I'd love to see Ronnie's game room. I bet it's full of warped Ikea furniture and bookcases missing shelves, lined with Liefeld paintings covered in creases and twisty-tear marks. But it was 20% cheaper than a nice gaming room!


Back on topic, it feels to me like Dark Space Corp didn't really keep any of the market info they gleaned from the kickstarter, and just want to keep on doing whatever they'd planned to do since before the KS. Only slower.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 20:38:15


Post by: edlowe


Bit more of info on the size of games.

All the games I've played so far have been in the region of about 30-40 models a side - the BA type of sequencing does support games of any size - but very large games of BA can get a bit slow. I think there are ways round that involving multiple unit moving based on the Order dice (almost a cross between Bolt Action and Black Powder where a 'command' is a group of units) but that's not a priority at the moment. 

I have set the infantry units up as 5-10 and command units as 1-5 - with the support units as one weapon and crew of 2 or 3 depending on size - a support weapon can also be a single model drone - that is my initial working basis. I have set all the sample forces at units of 5. Smaller units work better in Antares than in BA because you can't draw LOS through other models in Antares so the units have to spread more. I'm also sensitive to the cost of a unit - and if you can play a satisfactory game with say 20-30 models that strikes me as a good thing.


I saw Gwar two years ago (the band) definitely Nsfw.

This wednesdays newsletter will also have some more info and models.




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 21:15:26


Post by: Rolt


Also in relation to edlowes post:

" Will there be flyers in Antares or some kind of air support?"

In good time yes! We are going to start with a selection of infantry and support weapons - we'll work up to vehicles after that - the scope of the game is enormous
(I hesitate to say infinite!) and we can't do it all at once as much as I might wish we could

So if I'm reading this right the games gonna start as an medium sized MSU infantry based game with surpport weapons (heavy weapon teams and such) and will more up to mass combat, vehicles and all as it grows.




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 21:18:38


Post by: BrookM


Sounds like how some other game started out a lot of us play from time to time.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 21:18:49


Post by: Rolt


 Kilkrazy wrote:
If the furry fans want a furry SF faction they should make a Kickstarter to build one. Frankly I am tempted to do it myself because it could make some decent money and it would be brilliant to annoy all the anal anti-furry players in GW-land and so on.

I don't know what the fuss is about, really. In the good old days we used to play Traveller with the Vargr and Aslan without batting an eye at "furryism".


At this rate I'm inclined to agree, there's a clear untapped market we need to exploit.... *cough* I mean appeal to, if you ever need a sculptor for a project like that, hook me up, could be fun.




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 21:27:18


Post by: Red Viper


If I had any skills, it's totally what I'd do.

Make a Cat people (coolest furry) army that can proxy as DE/HE, Beastmen or Lizardmen.

I'd buy the whole army if it was cats. I don't care if people "steal" this idea... just someone do it!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/26 21:53:16


Post by: AlexHolker


 Rolt wrote:
Although one key issue I see popping up with this game is due to the simple fact that most of these races are meant to be altered humans (panhumans), if they were simply aliens I wouldn't be surprised if they were accepted more naturally, or at the very least less of a knee-jerk reaction to the concept.

Well, yes. Because that would be less stupid. PanHumans, if they exist, should be equal to or better than Revers (homo sapiens sapiens). If something is "pretty" - like wings for maneuvering in zero-gee environments - people may choose to receive such body modifications. If something is not "pretty" - like a heavy, neanderthalish brow to block the sun - people will instead choose to wear a hat.

 Alpharius wrote:
The Gwar?

Seriously?


Is it any worse than the Al Gore-ians?

 Kilkrazy wrote:
If the furry fans want a furry SF faction they should make a Kickstarter to build one. Frankly I am tempted to do it myself because it could make some decent money and it would be brilliant to annoy all the anal anti-furry players in GW-land and so on.

I don't know what the fuss is about, really. In the good old days we used to play Traveller with the Vargr and Aslan without batting an eye at "furryism".

Even in fantasy, furries are generally the polar opposite of the things I like. I like cervitaurs and mermaids and angels and sphinxes because their "humanity" is emphasised in their designs, and because they are drawn from higher inspiration than some beast walking on two legs. For anything more drastic than catgirls, the first thing to go is the face, and I don't like that.

Even the ones I like, such as this art from Magic: the Gathering, I'd still rather have a human Amazon with the same feel. Or a dragon - intelligent, strong and with a will like iron, without any need to force it into a humanoid shape.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/27 00:55:34


Post by: Azazelx


 lord_blackfang wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:

Well, there's a difference between kickstarting the setting up a new company and using your savings after a lifetime of work to do some renovations. I'm sure Ronnie has quite a nice games room, and Mantic keep Kickstarting things.


I think it speaks volumes when someone is afraid of investing his own capital into his own project. Knowing that Ricky actually had the required money on hand makes it even more obvious GoA wasn't the dream project it was touted as but just a "give me money cause I'm famous!" cash grab.


My point is that we don't know how much of his own money he was putting in anyway. I find it unlikely that he wasn't putting anything in. And frankly, it's a bit silly to suggest that he should have put in his life's savings instead of KSing it. I should also point out that I did not back GoA, and thought they were asking for way too much for way too little done. I don't mind helping others to "make it happen" with production money, but with KS I'm also not particularly interested in paying developers a year's wage for them to make it.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/27 01:03:41


Post by: edlowe


I did back GoA as my first delve into kickstarter and must say I was massively disappointed by how it progressed. One question I asked myself today was if they relaunched now with more to show including sculpts and rules would I now back again? Probably is the answer, I still think it has a lot of potential as a setting but it came across very amateurish considering the names involved.

I personally tho dont seeing them going down this route, I think we'll instead see limited monthly releases in the more traditional way of selling. Im looking forward to seeing how they price and promote the system and how much of the inital big idea has survived the reality of completion.

I do think it needs some strict universe developement to focus the creative side. Less furrys and more hard science future.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/27 01:07:50


Post by: Azazelx


 ChaoticMind wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:
 ChaoticMind wrote:

They want to de-retcon the squats. Problem is you need a slightly silly game to do that and GoA, Warpath, and Deadzone are serious settings. They work in Dreadball because it is fantasy football where every team has a shtick.


I don't see squats as needing a silly game. In any case, Warpath/Deadzone already has space orcs and dancing space goblins.


I meant the old squats style that wouldn't bat an eye at ork rock-stars as a unit. The bikes, dwarfs, burrowing tanks Etc. can stay but to fit they need to drop the over the top style GW had at the time and instead be a "new" concept from the ground up, not just Squats / Dwarfs in Spaaaace.


Original RT-era Squats were actually pretty well not over the top. Even the later-RT things on the outlier like Living Ancestors and Hearthguard in egg-armour weren't too bad. I'd suggest the most over-the-top aspect of the old Squats was the egg-armour. The rest of them were pretty grounded, and not overly-"dwarfs in spaaaace" anyway - it looked like that's where they were going to take them in 2nd Ed before they got canned, but the RT-stuff was pretty sober and grounded. Much less cartoony than the Orks turned in 2nd ed onwards. Check out the Red Book (Warhammer 40k Compendium 1989). Clannish Miners and Biker-engineer-grease monkeys isn't exactly on a par with Goff Rokkerz and <fill in the blank> Squigs.

I never played EPIC, but their vision of Squats didn't seem ridiculous, either.

And as TechMarine1 mentioned (but I forgot) - Veer'Myn/Skaven in SPAAAAACE don't really make the Warpath Universe more serious. Considering their 40k analogues seem to be Genestealers, they seem even less so...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zweischneid wrote:
[
There was far too much high-flying rhetoric surrounding the GoA Kickstarter.

That said, it is (I think) legitimate to use Kickstarter to "test" the demand for a game, rather than sinking your own life savings into a dud. Just need to avoid all that "Kickstarter-like-it-was-truly-meant-to-be-BS", which made them (Rick?) look bitter not only towards GW, but also bitter towards people having success on Kickstarter.


I'll agree with you on this. KS is what it is. High horses have really no point. I'd much rather pay to help fund the production on a project that the creators have done as much as they can to turn into a reality by themselves - like Dreamforge, DeadZone, Zombicide, Red Box's latest, Secret Weapon Tables, etc than pay a year or more's wages for someone to develop a ruleset/background/etc - and I don't find the latter any more noble than the former.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
If the furry fans want a furry SF faction they should make a Kickstarter to build one. Frankly I am tempted to do it myself because it could make some decent money and it would be brilliant to annoy all the anal anti-furry players in GW-land and so on.

I don't know what the fuss is about, really. In the good old days we used to play Traveller with the Vargr and Aslan without batting an eye at "furryism".


The internet happened, and anthromorphic animals of all kinds outside of Disney/WB cartoons and their ilk became inextricably linked with actual furries. And yiffing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gallahad wrote:


I mean, somebody has to be looking at what Mark has done with the Dreamforge Games Eisenkern, and saying "Hey! There is a market for alternative sci-fi miniatures in injection plastic!" It has always puzzled me that the historical market is packet with true plastic kits from a variety of manufacturers (Fireforge, Perry, Conquest, Gripping Beast, Victrix, etc.) but sci-fi has largely been neglected. The sci-fi market for miniatures gaming has to be 10X the size of the market for historicals.

As others have said, the current showing for Gates of Antares is pretty poor.


I wonder why Sci-Fi is always taken to be so proprietary, especially compared to historicals. I mean, I know that you can't say claim the ECW or WWII as "your IP" (even though Battlefront Tried!), but outside of Battlefront's attempts, a 15mm PzIV is a 15mm PzIV and plays in whatever game you're playing. Same with a Renaissance Pikeman or a Spartan Phalanx. Yet all the rules developers and miniature designers seem content and accepting that people will use whichever figures with whichever ruleset they like. Fantasy is somewhat in the same vein, with WFB obviously being the big dog and highly invested in their own models, but Mantic and the other smaller fantasy rulesets mostly seem to understand that we'l play with the figures we like. But then we get into sci-fi, where.. I dunno. But the companies all seem to want to have their own universes that don't really fit others' figures in as much. Mantic again have allowed for people's existing Imperial Guard and Ork armies, but that feels more like wanting to sell their figures for use as 40k-proxies - which is the big "except-for" in the room on this topic.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that GoA and others want to sell rules in order to sell their specific models - even when their own models are years away. Eisenkern and even Mantic's Corporation come to mind as "sci-fi humans" that would fit into the Warpath or GoA universe reasonably easily, so why not make them "official proxies" for an undeveloped faction. LIkewise with Eisenkern for Warpath/DeadZone.

I dunno if my message is clear - it feels a little muddled, but it's hot and I'm tired. I guess I'm just thinking out loud about how nice it would be to see producers of non-historicals, and sci-fi in particular working together a little more rather then trying to put up fences around their IP like GW do (except that almost all of them seem to be happy to make not-40k models..)


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/27 14:59:29


Post by: judgedoug


Speaking of GWAR and space rats...

The members of GWAR used to play 40k at one of my FLGS. One of the members had a space Skaven force he converted to be riding skateboards.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/28 00:44:29


Post by: AlexHolker


 Azazelx wrote:
I wonder why Sci-Fi is always taken to be so proprietary, especially compared to historicals. I mean, I know that you can't say claim the ECW or WWII as "your IP" (even though Battlefront Tried!), but outside of Battlefront's attempts, a 15mm PzIV is a 15mm PzIV and plays in whatever game you're playing. Same with a Renaissance Pikeman or a Spartan Phalanx. Yet all the rules developers and miniature designers seem content and accepting that people will use whichever figures with whichever ruleset they like. Fantasy is somewhat in the same vein, with WFB obviously being the big dog and highly invested in their own models, but Mantic and the other smaller fantasy rulesets mostly seem to understand that we'l play with the figures we like. But then we get into sci-fi, where.. I dunno. But the companies all seem to want to have their own universes that don't really fit others' figures in as much. Mantic again have allowed for people's existing Imperial Guard and Ork armies, but that feels more like wanting to sell their figures for use as 40k-proxies - which is the big "except-for" in the room on this topic.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that GoA and others want to sell rules in order to sell their specific models - even when their own models are years away. Eisenkern and even Mantic's Corporation come to mind as "sci-fi humans" that would fit into the Warpath or GoA universe reasonably easily, so why not make them "official proxies" for an undeveloped faction. LIkewise with Eisenkern for Warpath/DeadZone.

I dunno if my message is clear - it feels a little muddled, but it's hot and I'm tired. I guess I'm just thinking out loud about how nice it would be to see producers of non-historicals, and sci-fi in particular working together a little more rather then trying to put up fences around their IP like GW do (except that almost all of them seem to be happy to make not-40k models..)

I think part of it is that each manufacturer wants the best seat in the house: Earth. If you're making a World War II game there's some balance between "America, feth yeah!" and the German's aesthetics, and Fantasy could have balance between the Empire and Bretonnia, but generally sci-fi has the Terran government, and those other guys.

The other is that Sci-fi diverges more. Historicals are a straitjacket, and anything outside the norm might as well not exist. Fantasy is more free and you do sometimes see something interesting (like Eberron's dinosaur-riding halflings), but apart from the elves it still tends to hit the same notes. But Sci-Fi... you can get anything from Starship Troopers' Mobile Infantry to Star Trek's redshirts to Stargate's modern Special Forces. Put a redshirt in his longjohns with an unergonomic pistol next to the rocket-jumping, nuke-throwing tank that is a Mobile Infantryman and things start to look silly.

A single, unified ruleset would be a good thing if done right, and you could always throw in some handwaving nonsense about multiverses and wormholes, but that will always be a fragile thing - it's only a matter of time before some dumbass fanboy tries to write a codex presenting the redshirts as being so much better than the longjohn-wearing, pistol-wielding mooks they are.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/28 16:50:53


Post by: Grot 6


 judgedoug wrote:
Speaking of GWAR and space rats...

The members of GWAR used to play 40k at one of my FLGS. One of the members had a space Skaven force he converted to be riding skateboards.


They sold the GWAR game there, as well.


Miss that game.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 14:37:02


Post by: judgedoug


The new preview of the Algoryn look great and are exactly what I want for a generic sci fi alien bipedal race - good Star Trek DS9 style alien makeup with cool armor and guns.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 14:48:58


Post by: AlexHolker


The Algoryn look much, much better than the Boromites. But then, that's not saying much.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:16:21


Post by: Buzzsaw


The Algoryn look... pretty good, actually.



More at link. One thing that... well, concerns is probably the wrong word, something that stood out to me is that the Boromites have a very last century, hand-sculpted feel to them, while the Algoryn have the clean, sharp lines of digital design. Of course, we'll have to wait to see what the actual models look like before we know how that actually presents on the tabletop.

Heh, it's funny you mention DS9 Doug, because to me they seem more the inheritors of the Babylon 5 aesthetic of the Narn (perhaps with a bit of Minbari thrown in), not that that's a bad thing!

Spoiler:







Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:22:00


Post by: Alpharius


I'm glad at least one model in that group has an X-sling.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:25:57


Post by: Tibbsy


Now those I like; especially the helmets. I wasn't sold on the Boromites but these are a big improvement.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:27:13


Post by: richred_uk


 Alpharius wrote:
I'm glad at least one model in that group has an X-sling.


And a rock. There's just not enough miniatures with their feet resting on rocks.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:31:24


Post by: Rolt


Just saw these on the warlord forum, really impressed, could easily imagine picking a few of these up, unlike the boromites.

Going by the other images on the warlord forum these look like they could be mutli-part head, arms and torso-legs similar to some of mantics stuff.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:31:54


Post by: warboss


Agreed... these are a big improvement.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:44:23


Post by: Gallahad


richred_uk wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
I'm glad at least one model in that group has an X-sling.


And a rock. There's just not enough miniatures with their feet resting on rocks.


Lol, both comments made me chuckle.

I don't like the helmets, but everything else looks pretty good. It does look like some of the arms are of variable length so hopefully it is just the angle of the render shots.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 15:49:21


Post by: BrookM


They remind me of the Turians from Mass Effect.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 17:20:37


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Boromites were bad and still look bad, the concept and execution is way outdated, the Algoryn are a more realistic approach to what a modern consumer would demand.

Overall GOA has several issues, in all levels, deciding what it wants to be would be the biggest, but trying to be a new 40k should be the last thing it wants.

I feel some factions like the post apocalypse looking humans should be spirited away and center more on an organic modern sci fi look.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 18:11:37


Post by: edlowe


I stuck a thread up on the GoA forum regarding miniature materials and got a reply from Rick.

This is still a bit up in the air - if folks want resin models then that is something we can do - although the cost is considerably more than for metal, as you know. The Boromites have been mastered into our regular moulds for spin casting in metal, and we are making production moulds for spin casting sample sets. Unless there is something we can't make in metal, I'm sure we will make everything in metal and might make some models available in resin as well - as we did with Hansa. If the demand is there we will do it

I'd love to do plastics when we are ready for a full release - but this game is going to grow organically - bit at a time - so we're not going to worry about plastics right away. Making the models in metal allows us to try different things, tweak, and basically - if we see something we like or which is really popular more easily explore that by making more metal models relatively quickly. Plastics takes forever to do - and once it's done it's done - and you're stuck with it! 

There may be some things we simply cannot do in metal because they are too big or a shape that doesn't suit metal casting. I am guessing; most vehicles, larger weapons, buildings and terrain.

rick priestley 285 Sun Apr 20, 2008 8:04 am


and somemore info from the newsletter regarding the Algoryns
ALGORYN SPOTTED IN THE NANOSPHERE!

This week I’m very pleased to be able to reveal something of our work-in-progress on our next force for Beyond the Gates of Antares: the Algoryn. At Warlord HQ (otherwise known as the bicycle sheds behind the gas works) we’re all very excited about these, because these are the very first models that have been digitally sculpted for us, rather than produced in the time-honoured method by means of hand, spit and eye (other bodily parts may be involved… also fluids). Hence what we have to show you are 3D computer renders rather than the usual ‘greens’ with which you may be familiar. In other respects, what we have is entirely representative of the final pieces, which will be produced in metal just like our Boromites and other Antarean models.

The Algoryn Prosperate is a league of independent worlds that includes Algoryn colonies as well as affiliated worlds peopled by other pan-human types. The Algoryn are descended from root human types over many generations. They lack hair upon their heads, which are instead covered with crest-like keratinous growths. Similar nodules of keratin form a thick scaly layer upon their exposed flesh. This dense protective layer shields the Algoryn against the harsh rays of the twin suns of Algorya, which periodically bathe the planet in dangerous levels of heat and radiation. With that basic idea in mind we’ve worked to create a distinctive look that combines regular human anatomy with a unique twist, as you can see from these early concept renders.





[Thumb - Algoryn-Preview-8.jpeg]
[Thumb - Algoryn-Preview-7.jpeg]
[Thumb - Algoryn-Preview-5.jpeg]
[Thumb - Algoryn-Preview-6.jpeg]
[Thumb - Algoryn-Preview-1.jpeg]


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 18:20:48


Post by: Compel


Yeah, they look like Turians, but with less of a bird focus and more of a reptile one.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 18:38:34


Post by: Pacific


Think those latest renders are the most promising thing miniature-wise to come out of this yet!

 legoburner wrote:
How close is Rick to retirement? I remember the GoA outline stating that he wanted something that would fund him through retirement but if retirement is close and it has been a year already, is there a chance this could end up as a bit of a pump and dump from a rules and background perspective?


I suppose it depends if that old 'payment per Space Marine' legend was true.. although if it were, I guess they wouldn't have ever needed a Kickstarter, and we would already be playing with a fully-fleshed out games system


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 18:41:48


Post by: hubcap


I think affiliating with Warlord Games is probably the best outcome for Gates of Antares.

I mean, it's more of labor of love thing for Rick Priestley, isn't it? He is trying to recapture the spirit of Rogue Trader in a hard SF setting - what 40k was rather than what it has become. Skirmish game, small stakes, a little rough around the edges, lots of room for individualization and improvisation.

I think the Kickstarter proved that he still has neat ideas, but lacks the focus and organization to connect all the dots and get a full game system up and running. So hand all the gruntwork of actually producing, distributing and supporting a game to his friends at Warlord. And honestly, I think adapting the Bolt Action rules is also a good thing. They are a fine, solid set of rules. I don't think the wargaming world is crying out for yet another way to stage 10-on-10 skirmishes. Pick an existing one to work with and move on to the weird stuff.

So let Priestley focus on the background and some fun tweaks and leave the other stuff to people who have done it before. Seems like a good result to me.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 19:19:49


Post by: frozenwastes


This is so much better than the space dwarves I was expecting. Like so much so.

warlord's metal prices are super reasonable, so it'll be interesting how these shake out.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 19:24:41


Post by: edlowe


 hubcap wrote:
I think affiliating with Warlord Games is probably the best outcome for Gates of Antares.

I mean, it's more of labor of love thing for Rick Priestley, isn't it? He is trying to recapture the spirit of Rogue Trader in a hard SF setting - what 40k was rather than what it has become. Skirmish game, small stakes, a little rough around the edges, lots of room for individualization and improvisation.

I think the Kickstarter proved that he still has neat ideas, but lacks the focus and organization to connect all the dots and get a full game system up and running. So hand all the gruntwork of actually producing, distributing and supporting a game to his friends at Warlord. And honestly, I think adapting the Bolt Action rules is also a good thing. They are a fine, solid set of rules. I don't think the wargaming world is crying out for yet another way to stage 10-on-10 skirmishes. Pick an existing one to work with and move on to the weird stuff.

So let Priestley focus on the background and some fun tweaks and leave the other stuff to people who have done it before. Seems like a good result to me.


I think you've hit the nail on the head there hubcap regarding how GoA should progress.

A nice slow monthly release of figures based of what customers are asking for along with a solid set of rules will help GoA grow organically into a cool system. I think I prefer this route to the bit hitters releasing a whole army in one go. Kind of like the old gw way of doing things. Plus it sound like there will be plenty of gamer feedback involved in the games developement.

I look forward to picking up something cool each month and growing a collection rather than the ks figure bombs I've recently being going for.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/29 23:38:25


Post by: mitch_rifle


Much interested in this, the new renders look nice, and a whole army of metal guys would be awesome, considering that warlord do reasonable prices on their metals, aka roughly 50-60 aus for 20 odd figures in their metal BA range


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 01:09:31


Post by: Guildsman


That's more like it! Those I might be interested in buying. Just to clarify, are these renders final or WIP? The preview isn't exactly clear.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 02:51:28


Post by: Azazelx


These look much better, and so does the idea of using a modified Bolt Action ruleset - I've written a few times about not wanting to see the wheel of basic rules reinvented over and over and over. My only concern with those models is they look very much to be multi-part models. While I don't mind separate-head-metals, and I'm completely fine with one-piece metal models, multipart metals are - and have always been - horrible to deal with. And even moreso for troops...

Still, they've at least gotten me interested again.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 03:02:18


Post by: paulson games


Pure speculation here, but somebody just sold over a million shares of GW stock. Maybe a former GW cornerstone employee dumped his stock in the company to fund GOA?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 04:56:44


Post by: Barzam


I still have yet to see something I don't like. Granted, I'm not keen on everything being metal, but beyond that, I like it all. Maybe I'll even buy a few at some point.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 05:30:35


Post by: MrMoustaffa


Things are looking up a bit. Those miniatures show there might be some life in the GoA model line yet (and honestly even if they were all crap it's not like there aren't other kickass miniatures out there cough *Dreamforge* cough. Only thing I don't like about these new models is the helmets, but that's easy to remedy.

I also like the sound of the supposed changes to the Bolt Action system. That ruleset has a lot of promise and if they expand on it in the right ways it will be a ton of fun.

The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.

Also, will there be a "regular" human faction? Aka one that isn't genemodded into some sort of hideous abomination? I would like to see some sort of "traditional" society that has either shunned genemods or at least kept them to subtle changes. Not that I hate the idea of genemods in and of themselves. I just hate the idea of the only "human" factions being gorilla people, cat people, purple Thing/Hulk hybrids, etc. with no norm to show how different they've become.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 05:50:03


Post by: Motograter


The renders look the spitting image of some of the dream forge games stuff. Its a shame they will be in metal as a plastic release for the last lot would be rather cool


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 05:50:24


Post by: AlexHolker


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.

Right, which is what I was saying about "pretty" gene mods. Or you might have a group like the One World Church from Cable and Deadpool who used body mods as a political gesture, rejecting racial discrimination by turning themselves blue.

Also, will there be a "regular" human faction? Aka one that isn't genemodded into some sort of hideous abomination? I would like to see some sort of "traditional" society that has either shunned genemods or at least kept them to subtle changes. Not that I hate the idea of genemods in and of themselves. I just hate the idea of the only "human" factions being gorilla people, cat people, purple Thing/Hulk hybrids, etc. with no norm to show how different they've become.

Yes. There are races with low key body mods, and also the Revers who have no body mods at all.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 05:59:54


Post by: Agamemnon2


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.


It makes slightly better sense from a dystopian point of view. If you turn all the working classes into purpose-engineered abominations, you make social mobility impossible and help secure society against any kind of change. You'd always be able to tell who the "inferiors" were. Being a Boromite would be a yellow armband you could never take off.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 06:13:53


Post by: NoseGoblin


 Azazelx wrote:
I wonder why Sci-Fi is always taken to be so proprietary, especially compared to historicals. I mean, I know that you can't say claim the ECW or WWII as "your IP" (even though Battlefront Tried!), but outside of Battlefront's attempts, a 15mm PzIV is a 15mm PzIV and plays in whatever game you're playing. Same with a Renaissance Pikeman or a Spartan Phalanx. Yet all the rules developers and miniature designers seem content and accepting that people will use whichever figures with whichever ruleset they like. Fantasy is somewhat in the same vein, with WFB obviously being the big dog and highly invested in their own models, but Mantic and the other smaller fantasy rulesets mostly seem to understand that we'l play with the figures we like. But then we get into sci-fi, where.. I dunno. But the companies all seem to want to have their own universes that don't really fit others' figures in as much. Mantic again have allowed for people's existing Imperial Guard and Ork armies, but that feels more like wanting to sell their figures for use as 40k-proxies - which is the big "except-for" in the room on this topic.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that GoA and others want to sell rules in order to sell their specific models - even when their own models are years away. Eisenkern and even Mantic's Corporation come to mind as "sci-fi humans" that would fit into the Warpath or GoA universe reasonably easily, so why not make them "official proxies" for an undeveloped faction. LIkewise with Eisenkern for Warpath/DeadZone.

I dunno if my message is clear - it feels a little muddled, but it's hot and I'm tired. I guess I'm just thinking out loud about how nice it would be to see producers of non-historicals, and sci-fi in particular working together a little more rather then trying to put up fences around their IP like GW do (except that almost all of them seem to be happy to make not-40k models..)


Actually I did reach out to them early in the Kickstarter for just such a proposal. They seemed mildly interested but not overly so and it just never went anywhere. I would love to work with them for a cross promotion but now that they are with Warlord, that ship has likely sailed as Warlard makes its $$ from their mini sales.... Who knows, perhaps some day?

I am still open to the idea.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 06:15:59


Post by: silent25


 paulson games wrote:
Pure speculation here, but somebody just sold over a million shares of GW stock. Maybe a former GW cornerstone employee dumped his stock in the company to fund GOA?


Think more a former GW cornerstone employee dumping his stock because he realizes it might become worthless soon

Having more faith in GoA with these figs. The initial figs had a 80's vibe in a bad way. The line feels like an old rock act trying to make it back onto stage with new stuff trying to stay relevant. Some stuff seems dated, but still able to do some wow.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 06:32:15


Post by: frozenwastes


The boromites are growing on me, but I think I'd paint them up more nasty looking. Not quite a full nurgled out disease thing, but something a bit more unsavory.

Anyone here part of the Warlord Games forum? If so, could you PM an admin and tell them to actually activate memberships instead of leaving them in limbo? I've sent emails but I have gotten no response whatsoever.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 08:02:15


Post by: MrMoustaffa


 AlexHolker wrote:
 MrMoustaffa wrote:
The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.

Right, which is what I was saying about "pretty" gene mods. Or you might have a group like the One World Church from Cable and Deadpool who used body mods as a political gesture, rejecting racial discrimination by turning themselves blue.

Yeah see I kind of like that possible avenue of story telling. Some sort of "cult" or outcast group. In that case, go nuts. They're people who went nuts with genemods, make them as "furry" as you want.

As long as they're not doing stuff like "We put a dog snout and a tail on it because that's totally a huge bonus for a certain career path", I'm cool with it and it's believable. I can see somebody saying "screw it, I want to be different, turn me into a half cat person,". I have a lot harder time believing "I turned myself into a half cat person so I can be a far better accountant."

Also, will there be a "regular" human faction? Aka one that isn't genemodded into some sort of hideous abomination? I would like to see some sort of "traditional" society that has either shunned genemods or at least kept them to subtle changes. Not that I hate the idea of genemods in and of themselves. I just hate the idea of the only "human" factions being gorilla people, cat people, purple Thing/Hulk hybrids, etc. with no norm to show how different they've become.

Yes. There are races with low key body mods, and also the Revers who have no body mods at all.

Sweet.

I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this then. At the very least I'll just use some of my starship trooper and dreamforge models and give the rules a spin.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 08:17:46


Post by: Pacific


 MrMoustaffa wrote:

The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.


Spoken like a true 21st-century earthling!

Imagine that there were generations of these people living in utterly inhospitable environments. Despite vigorous safety procedures and equipment checking death by 'spacing' is a common occurence, and that almost 50% of the people you know would die (in a pretty horrific manner) during the course of their short lives. If the doctors said, "we can give your child a 10% improvement in surviving in vacuum and extreme cold for a few minutes, enough for a colleague to rescue them" would you take it? It wouldn't be a change from human -> the Thing in one generation, but a gradual process of the human genome being altered to fit its environment. Our concepts of what it means to be 'human' would alter radically when considered next to the most fundamental desire; that of safety.

So you're right, I don't think this would be appropriate for workers shuttled from earth to work hollowing out a rock for 6 months to be like this. But, if it became an environment that humans had to live, work and die across generations in, then you can certainly imagine it. There would be a massive leap in perspective about such things.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 08:22:48


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


Hope they genemod the part of their brains responsible for erections, then.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 09:22:13


Post by: AlexHolker


 Pacific wrote:
Imagine that there were generations of these people living in utterly inhospitable environments. Despite vigorous safety procedures and equipment checking death by 'spacing' is a common occurence, and that almost 50% of the people you know would die (in a pretty horrific manner) during the course of their short lives. If the doctors said, "we can give your child a 10% improvement in surviving in vacuum and extreme cold for a few minutes, enough for a colleague to rescue them" would you take it? It wouldn't be a change from human -> the Thing in one generation, but a gradual process of the human genome being altered to fit its environment. Our concepts of what it means to be 'human' would alter radically when considered next to the most fundamental desire; that of safety.

So you're right, I don't think this would be appropriate for workers shuttled from earth to work hollowing out a rock for 6 months to be like this. But, if it became an environment that humans had to live, work and die across generations in, then you can certainly imagine it. There would be a massive leap in perspective about such things.

Humans can already survive in a vacuum for short periods, and improving your chances of survival would not require drastic changes to your appearance. At most, I'd expect it to involve a small valve implanted at the base of the throat to stop you building up a dangerous overpressure by trying to hold your breath. Of course, the smarter way would be to design and build environments so that they don't depressurise regularly and waste all your oxygen. If you can't do that you'd still be stuck on Earth, or blasted to pieces when your fuel tanks depressurised.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 09:33:40


Post by: Joyboozer


Duh, obviously living conditions in that area lead to the build up of silica in the internal organs so their bodies were modified to filter it into less harmful dermal storage.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 10:37:44


Post by: Yodhrin


I think some people seriously underestimate just how many others are out there that don't share their particular views of behavioural and body norms(furries? scarification? Klingon weddings?). I also think some people don't fully grasp just how motivating true desperation can be to a human.

Imagine an overcrowded, dystopian future-earth. Unemployment and violence are rife, the authorities are corrupt and uncaring, and you have been born into a social strata with essentially zero prospects of improvement or hope of a better life. There's no state education system, no institutional medical care available. Your choices are as follows;

A. Commit suicide.
B. Join a violent criminal gang and likely end up dead within a couple of years.
C. Become a prostitute.
D. Scrape together any dregs of work and cash you can and spend the rest of your life hungry, tired, and frequently sick.
E. Answer the corporate adds plastered across every screen and billboard in your country that offer you a life-long honest job with decent living conditions, free medical care, solid pay, and the chance to escape the squalid slum you grew up in, and all you have to do is accept a wee injection.

Which would you choose? I know people who're desperate enough to take the last option today, nevermind a hypothetical dystopian sci-fi future society.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 10:56:45


Post by: Azazelx


 MrMoustaffa wrote:

The only thing that really bugs me so far is the background, namely genemodding things that you would normally just wear a suit (or a hat) to achieve. I don't care how good a mining job paid, I'm not turning myself into the thing just so I can walk around with no suit on. I'll take the environment suit thank you.


I'll agree with you on that (and cat people, dog noses, etc). It's actually a situation where the stale old trope works much better - "Generations ago, scienticians working fot the ebil corporation(s) (illegally) changed the prisoners/slaves ancestors via DNA/gene-splicing and these are there descendents."


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 10:57:12


Post by: Kilkrazy


 Azazelx wrote:

...
...

I wonder why Sci-Fi is always taken to be so proprietary, especially compared to historicals. I mean, I know that you can't say claim the ECW or WWII as "your IP" (even though Battlefront Tried!), but outside of Battlefront's attempts, a 15mm PzIV is a 15mm PzIV and plays in whatever game you're playing. Same with a Renaissance Pikeman or a Spartan Phalanx. Yet all the rules developers and miniature designers seem content and accepting that people will use whichever figures with whichever ruleset they like. Fantasy is somewhat in the same vein, with WFB obviously being the big dog and highly invested in their own models, but Mantic and the other smaller fantasy rulesets mostly seem to understand that we'l play with the figures we like. But then we get into sci-fi, where.. I dunno. But the companies all seem to want to have their own universes that don't really fit others' figures in as much. Mantic again have allowed for people's existing Imperial Guard and Ork armies, but that feels more like wanting to sell their figures for use as 40k-proxies - which is the big "except-for" in the room on this topic.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that GoA and others want to sell rules in order to sell their specific models - even when their own models are years away. Eisenkern and even Mantic's Corporation come to mind as "sci-fi humans" that would fit into the Warpath or GoA universe reasonably easily, so why not make them "official proxies" for an undeveloped faction. LIkewise with Eisenkern for Warpath/DeadZone.

I dunno if my message is clear - it feels a little muddled, but it's hot and I'm tired. I guess I'm just thinking out loud about how nice it would be to see producers of non-historicals, and sci-fi in particular working together a little more rather then trying to put up fences around their IP like GW do (except that almost all of them seem to be happy to make not-40k models..)


I understand your point exactly. I have often thought about it and the reason, IMO, is basically that everyone saw GW build a £100 M business off Space Mariens (Hurr!) and Grimdarkness™, and they thought they would like a slice of that pie. You create a background, and a set of rules, and army figures, and sell the whole package. Much more remunerative than just selling rules.

Flames of War attempted fairly successfully to do it in Historicals by changing the scale to 15mm -- WW2 players traditionally used 1/72 or 20mm, which actually are pretty interchangeable -- and convincing players that, having bought the rules from Battlefront, they needed to buy the models too.

It did pretty well for a while but once the game got popular, lots of other companies started to make 15mm scale stuff, and Battlefront could not prevent them because there is no IP in WW2. Their attempt to ban non-BF models from tournaments failed due to a huge player backlash.

There it is. If you want to build a whole package to sell, it has to be Fantasy or SF. For some reason, Fantasy is less popular, perhaps because it’s too similar to Historicals and there are heaps of generic Fantasy figures already on the market.

That said, I’ve never really understood why so many people are keen to play 40K with GW official models all the time.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 11:00:48


Post by: Azazelx


 NoseGoblin wrote:

Actually I did reach out to them early in the Kickstarter for just such a proposal. They seemed mildly interested but not overly so and it just never went anywhere. I would love to work with them for a cross promotion but now that they are with Warlord, that ship has likely sailed ans Warlard makes its $$ from their mini sales.... Who knows, perhaps some day?

I am still open to the idea.


That would be awesome, because as you probably know by now, and without blowing smoke up your arse, you have some of the very best sci-fi humans out there. I know Warlord are in the business of selling models, but I can't for the life of me see why GoA couldn't have, you know, more than one kind of Earth-humans faction involved. Still, you saying this publicly is pretty cool, and with GoA still embryonic, maybe it can help something to happen...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kilkrazy wrote:

There it is. If you want to build a whole package to sell, it has to be Fantasy or SF. For some reason, Fantasy is less popular, perhaps because it’s too similar to Historicals and there are heaps of generic Fantasy figures already on the market.
That said, I’ve never really understood why so many people are keen to play 40K with GW official models all the time.


Yeah, I get all of that. I guess the thing is that 40k grew up in a different time and place, and clearly filled a vacuum that was in the market. These guys need to realise that there won't likely ever be another 40k. GW may be sold off, but Hobbyco or WotC or whoever will keep the 40k train running one way or another. Yet they almost all still want to be the big dogs with their own closed rule systems and own special snowflake miniatures (half of which can conveniently work as Imperial Guard/Marines/etc). I suggested something about a unified Sci-fi ruleset awhile back in the Misc minis forum, but it quickly got overwhelmed by a combination of people thinking it would involve power-creep codices between companies, some random guy saying that his homebrew ruleset should "be it" and a couple of people just being dickheads for the sake of "getting back" at me, so I stopped reading the thread pretty quickly.

Still, when I open the Mantic KoW rulebook and see Fireforge knights in it, or look through, say, an Army Painter painting guide and see all manner of not-GW models sharing the space, I do wonder why there aren't some more slightly more miniatures-agnostic rulesets out there. The way I see it, GoA and all the rest of them are going to struggle, and most will likely die off in an incredibly fething crowded market like the corpses of 3 editions of WarZone, Vor, Trinity Battlegrounds, Sedition Wars, and so on and on. PP is the outlier, and a lucky one at that who managed to get off and keep going.

I dunno, Mark from Dreamforge seems to be willing to talk with others. I know Vic from Victoria Miniatures was also willing to get onboard with a ruleset from her comments in my thread on the topic. I know it'd make my fething year to see a few of the companies I like working together in the way I described. We're somewhat off-topic now, but Mark - you're putting together a game. Please contact Vic and get her on board. Her figures, like yours are amazing, and like yourself, she's always very nice and respectful. I'd love to see a couple of you guys make one another stronger by working on things that the others won't/can't all cover at once, rather than trying to launch a new game with 6 factions.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 11:59:01


Post by: mitch_rifle


that would be great, a universal rule set which each company can collaborate and make miniatures and factions under one rule set

we have to be honest no other companies are probably ever going to match the scale of GW, but a collaboration bringing many together could work


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 12:57:23


Post by: judgedoug


 mitch_rifle wrote:
that would be great, a universal rule set which each company can collaborate and make miniatures and factions under one rule set

we have to be honest no other companies are probably ever going to match the scale of GW, but a collaboration bringing many together could work


That's been my idea for a decade or so now, whenever I win the $200 million dollar lottery. Create a universal ruleset and then obtain different licenses to produce 28mm armies for it. Terminator Skynet and Resistance, Aliens Xenos and Colonial Marines, Starship Troopers book, movie bugs, movie infantry and show infantry, Dune houses and sardaukar, Predators, Doom monsters, hell maybe even Halo or Gears of War, maybe even try to license Star Trek and Star Wars!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 15:25:55


Post by: Albino Squirrel


Keep in mind that Gates of Antares takes place maybe hundreds of thousands, or even millions, of years in the future. I think most of the different PanHumans have just evolved along different paths. It does say the Boromites were bio-engineered, but the original changes may have been much more subtle, and have been accentuated slowly by evolution over a vast amount of time.

http://www.darkspacecorp.com/the-universe-2/


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 15:32:31


Post by: warboss


 paulson games wrote:
Pure speculation here, but somebody just sold over a million shares of GW stock. Maybe a former GW cornerstone employee dumped his stock in the company to fund GOA?


Is there another site to check that? The official LSE one only lets you see the past day's worth of trades. Is that where you saw the info?

http://www.lse.co.uk/ShareTrades.asp?shareprice=GAW&share=games_workshop


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 15:36:31


Post by: Necros


Dunno how I missed this, must not have been paying attention.. but it's nice to see that even though the KS didn't work they're still moving along and making some nice looking minis


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 15:40:11


Post by: warboss


You didn't miss much. A large part of the reason the KS failed is the only thing they initially had to show was the game's logo and a WIP green of a scifi 70's porn star. They were basically trying to bank on nostalgia and the star power of a single big name (in the minis genre at least).


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 15:56:21


Post by: Alpharius


Albino Squirrel wrote:
Keep in mind that Gates of Antares takes place maybe hundreds of thousands, or even millions, of years in the future.


I don't think it does as that would just be too silly... wouldn't it?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 16:07:20


Post by: Eggs


On the 70's porn star, I went to buy him today, from warlord. £5 for the model, £4 for postage. They can stick that up their isorian shard.

Anyone know anywhere with more reasonable postage?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 20:13:24


Post by: judgedoug


 Alpharius wrote:
Albino Squirrel wrote:
Keep in mind that Gates of Antares takes place maybe hundreds of thousands, or even millions, of years in the future.


I don't think it does as that would just be too silly... wouldn't it?


as silly as "a long time ago in a galaxy far far away"

also AT-43 took place millions of years in the future and that has a far more believable background than pretty much every other sci fi game i've seen.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:10:34


Post by: Alpharius


I guess my point was that 'millions of years in the future' will probably mean NOTHING will look remotely like it does now, if in fact humanity is still around!

A prefer a more plausible 200 to 1000 years forward!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:26:32


Post by: edlowe


I believe GoA is set an unknown time in the future, where human expansion and divergence have occurred leading to many rises and falls of mankind so much so that past history is mostly forgotten or hearsay. I guess many of the panhumans could believe themselves to be the original humans and the others gross mutations. Who knows what a boromite may find beautiful?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:33:21


Post by: BrookM


"In 20XX rock men wore bad speedos.."


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:36:40


Post by: frozenwastes


What we find attractive in a mate is often linked with viability of offspring or connected with a variety of neurological factors. If you can modify genetics enough to change appearances, you can modify what people find attractive by genetically changing the brain.

it's also possible that the first generation of a given changed group didn't have a choice and then after the change, they'd think back on how they were as ugly or lesser as their brain was changed as part of the process.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:51:45


Post by: Compel


Hmm, maybe it's set, oh, I dunno, about 38000-39000 years in the future?

That sounds like a good compromise?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:52:25


Post by: judgedoug


 Alpharius wrote:
I guess my point was that 'millions of years in the future' will probably mean NOTHING will look remotely like it does now, if in fact humanity is still around!

A prefer a more plausible 200 to 1000 years forward!


That's why the AT-43 background is so phenomenal


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 21:57:09


Post by: Alpharius


 Compel wrote:
Hmm, maybe it's set, oh, I dunno, about 38000-39000 years in the future?

That sounds like a good compromise?


Nope.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/30 22:07:01


Post by: PsychoticStorm


 Azazelx wrote:

Spoiler:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kilkrazy wrote:

There it is. If you want to build a whole package to sell, it has to be Fantasy or SF. For some reason, Fantasy is less popular, perhaps because it’s too similar to Historicals and there are heaps of generic Fantasy figures already on the market.
That said, I’ve never really understood why so many people are keen to play 40K with GW official models all the time.


Yeah, I get all of that. I guess the thing is that 40k grew up in a different time and place, and clearly filled a vacuum that was in the market. These guys need to realise that there won't likely ever be another 40k. GW may be sold off, but Hobbyco or WotC or whoever will keep the 40k train running one way or another. Yet they almost all still want to be the big dogs with their own closed rule systems and own special snowflake miniatures (half of which can conveniently work as Imperial Guard/Marines/etc). I suggested something about a unified Sci-fi ruleset awhile back in the Misc minis forum, but it quickly got overwhelmed by a combination of people thinking it would involve power-creep codices between companies, some random guy saying that his homebrew ruleset should "be it" and a couple of people just being dickheads for the sake of "getting back" at me, so I stopped reading the thread pretty quickly.

Still, when I open the Mantic KoW rulebook and see Fireforge knights in it, or look through, say, an Army Painter painting guide and see all manner of not-GW models sharing the space, I do wonder why there aren't some more slightly more miniatures-agnostic rulesets out there. The way I see it, GoA and all the rest of them are going to struggle, and most will likely die off in an incredibly fething crowded market like the corpses of 3 editions of WarZone, Vor, Trinity Battlegrounds, Sedition Wars, and so on and on. PP is the outlier, and a lucky one at that who managed to get off and keep going.

I dunno, Mark from Dreamforge seems to be willing to talk with others. I know Vic from Victoria Miniatures was also willing to get onboard with a ruleset from her comments in my thread on the topic. I know it'd make my fething year to see a few of the companies I like working together in the way I described. We're somewhat off-topic now, but Mark - you're putting together a game. Please contact Vic and get her on board. Her figures, like yours are amazing, and like yourself, she's always very nice and respectful. I'd love to see a couple of you guys make one another stronger by working on things that the others won't/can't all cover at once, rather than trying to launch a new game with 6 factions.


I disagree with this idea, generic rulesets are just that, generic, deprived from flavor and direction, or on the other side of the coin arcane monstrosities of rules to cover all the possibilities, likewise, miniature lines without a background in mind are plain, maybe good, but its obvious they are generic.

A complete ecosystem benefits both the rules and the miniatures line and both are shaped by the background.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 00:52:46


Post by: AlexHolker


 frozenwastes wrote:
What we find attractive in a mate is often linked with viability of offspring or connected with a variety of neurological factors. If you can modify genetics enough to change appearances, you can modify what people find attractive by genetically changing the brain.

it's also possible that the first generation of a given changed group didn't have a choice and then after the change, they'd think back on how they were as ugly or lesser as their brain was changed as part of the process.

This is a repulsive idea that exists only to justify making ugly models. What's wrong with a game that does justice to transhumanism, instead of turning it into institutionalised date rape?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 07:14:40


Post by: frozenwastes


 AlexHolker wrote:
 frozenwastes wrote:
What we find attractive in a mate is often linked with viability of offspring or connected with a variety of neurological factors. If you can modify genetics enough to change appearances, you can modify what people find attractive by genetically changing the brain.

it's also possible that the first generation of a given changed group didn't have a choice and then after the change, they'd think back on how they were as ugly or lesser as their brain was changed as part of the process.

This is a repulsive idea that exists only to justify making ugly models. What's wrong with a game that does justice to transhumanism, instead of turning it into institutionalised date rape?


Alex, I think it might be time to accept that this particular fictional universe isn't going to turn out how you would like it to. Where you see background that doesn't make sense, other people have no problem with it. I hope it takes the dark route like the explanation I suggested, even if you happen to find it repulsive.

I like dark sci-fi far, far more than happy shiney optimistic transhumanism. This game is going to be set in a universe with conflict, not one where everyone's problems get solved with technology.

The boromites are definitely growing on me the more I see them. They're unusual, but I no longer consider them ugly. And the Algoryn renders look excellent. No ugly to justify there at all.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 07:37:04


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


After neoBSG and Stargate Universe, I have to say that dark sci fi is overrated. Also, every bit as corny and cheesy as the light stuff, but with a higher chance of making you feel depressed.

What we really need is New Wave French sci fi. How about a setting with no plot, characters who may or may not be figments of their own imaginations, and belligerent orifices who expound for whole chapters on the pointless minutia of punctuation to apathetic, be-mammaried space crustaceans?


EDIT: Wait, damn. I think we're back to furries again? But post-irony furries with no humor about their crotchless condition.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 07:43:42


Post by: frozenwastes


Oh, I don't think I'm going to get my dark sci-fi fix from this game universe. I just don't think it's going to be what Alex is looking for either. It's probably going to have a bit of a kitchen sink approach with a lot of different elements.

I happen to really liked SG:U and the remake of BSG. Different people have different tastes, but I don't think we're going to see GoA satisfy Alex's critiques.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 09:24:19


Post by: Yodhrin


 frozenwastes wrote:
Oh, I don't think I'm going to get my dark sci-fi fix from this game universe. I just don't think it's going to be what Alex is looking for either. It's probably going to have a bit of a kitchen sink approach with a lot of different elements.

I happen to really liked SG:U and the remake of BSG. Different people have different tastes, but I don't think we're going to see GoA satisfy Alex's critiques.


There were two problems with SG:U - the first was that they cancelled SG:A to make it, then essentially remade the same show but all emo'd up, which was a kick in the teeth to fans of SG:A; the second was that it was a demonstrably bad show for most of the first season(most of the acting swung wildly between wooden and overwrought, the pacing was awful, a lot of the stories were petty soap-opera fodder), and by the time it picked up and started to get interesting they'd already shed too many viewers. BSG went the opposite way, it was fantastic at first, then dove headfirst into the spiritualist mumbo-jumbo and disappeared up its own backside.

Regardless, neither of them were really "dark" sci-fi; there's a difference between "dark" and "angsty". I hope we see some of the former and much, much less of the latter in GoA. If you want really dark sci-fi, read the Revelation Space series.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 15:51:14


Post by: Albino Squirrel


Let's please not get into discussions about what "dark sci-fi" or "hard sci-fi" mean, or whether or not the Gates of Antares universe fits either of those terms. Let's just accept that those terms mean different things to different people, and move on.

Also, it's fine for you to like or not like whatever you want, but please don't try to justify your like or dislike of a thing by saying it's because the thing is/isn't "hard sci-fi", or is/isn't "realistic". And certainly don't try to act like something is objectively good or bad because you think it is or isn't "realistic". Debating what is realistic in this completely fictional universe is pretty pointless. If you don't like it, that's fine. But that's not because it isn't realistic, it just isn't your thing. Just say that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As an example, the notion of a computer program as we understand it becoming self-aware is completely absurd in reality. I can still watch and enjoy The Terminator, I just accept that in that world it is a possibility and I'm fine with it. If I didn't like the concept of a movie about self-aware artificial intelligence, I wouldn't like The Terminator. But I wouldn't go on and on about how the movie is silly because the premise is unrealistic. It's a movie.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 16:27:35


Post by: Yodhrin


Albino Squirrel wrote:
Let's please not get into discussions about what "dark sci-fi" or "hard sci-fi" mean, or whether or not the Gates of Antares universe fits either of those terms. Let's just accept that those terms mean different things to different people, and move on.

Also, it's fine for you to like or not like whatever you want, but please don't try to justify your like or dislike of a thing by saying it's because the thing is/isn't "hard sci-fi", or is/isn't "realistic". And certainly don't try to act like something is objectively good or bad because you think it is or isn't "realistic". Debating what is realistic in this completely fictional universe is pretty pointless. If you don't like it, that's fine. But that's not because it isn't realistic, it just isn't your thing. Just say that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As an example, the notion of a computer program as we understand it becoming self-aware is completely absurd in reality. I can still watch and enjoy The Terminator, I just accept that in that world it is a possibility and I'm fine with it. If I didn't like the concept of a movie about self-aware artificial intelligence, I wouldn't like The Terminator. But I wouldn't go on and on about how the movie is silly because the premise is unrealistic. It's a movie.


Whether or not people are capable of enjoying a thing in spite of its flaws does not make the objective presence of those flaws any less so. I love Stargate SG:1 and Atlantis to bits, that doesn't change the fact they're cheesy, deus-ex-machina-crammed popcorn stories.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/01/31 22:51:46


Post by: PsychoticStorm


I thought the definition of hard sci fi was always, the less science magic we need for things to happen by our today's assumptions of all science fields the harder it is.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 01:47:05


Post by: Azazelx


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
[
I disagree with this idea, generic rulesets are just that, generic, deprived from flavor and direction, or on the other side of the coin arcane monstrosities of rules to cover all the possibilities, likewise, miniature lines without a background in mind are plain, maybe good, but its obvious they are generic.

A complete ecosystem benefits both the rules and the miniatures line and both are shaped by the background.


Yeah, you've missed my point entirely. So simply put: What you wrote is irrelevant. Sorry.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 02:02:04


Post by: AlexHolker


 Azazelx wrote:
 PsychoticStorm wrote:
[
I disagree with this idea, generic rulesets are just that, generic, deprived from flavor and direction, or on the other side of the coin arcane monstrosities of rules to cover all the possibilities, likewise, miniature lines without a background in mind are plain, maybe good, but its obvious they are generic.

A complete ecosystem benefits both the rules and the miniatures line and both are shaped by the background.

Yeah, you've missed my point entirely. So simply put: What you wrote is irrelevant. Sorry.

To elaborate: the Codex/bestiary should be different for each game, but the actual core rules should be the same. You don't need twenty different ways to depict someone firing a rifle.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 02:15:48


Post by: frozenwastes


I'll agree not to dive any further into the dark sci-fi topic any further except to say that if GoA ends up being a kitchen sink setting, there will be room for it and the opinions presented of the early episodes of SG:U and later episodes of BSG are pretty much what I think as well.

I finally got around to truly reading the rules related blog post and I like what I'm hearing. I've already played sci-fi using Bolt Action + home made army lists with a handful of house rules and GoA sounds like it'll be even better. Things like the firefight reaction sound great to me. A good way to have guys exchanging fire without going quite as far as Tommorow's War did.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 04:06:47


Post by: Gallahad


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
After neoBSG and Stargate Universe, I have to say that dark sci fi is overrated. Also, every bit as corny and cheesy as the light stuff, but with a higher chance of making you feel depressed.

What we really need is New Wave French sci fi. How about a setting with no plot, characters who may or may not be figments of their own imaginations, and belligerent orifices who expound for whole chapters on the pointless minutia of punctuation to apathetic, be-mammaried space crustaceans?


EDIT: Wait, damn. I think we're back to furries again? But post-irony furries with no humor about their crotchless condition.


Bob...you are hilarious. Reading little gems like these from you makes Dakka a better place. If I could be bothered to figure out how to put a quote in my sig, I would sig this.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 08:09:53


Post by: PsychoticStorm


 AlexHolker wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:
 PsychoticStorm wrote:
[
I disagree with this idea, generic rulesets are just that, generic, deprived from flavor and direction, or on the other side of the coin arcane monstrosities of rules to cover all the possibilities, likewise, miniature lines without a background in mind are plain, maybe good, but its obvious they are generic.

A complete ecosystem benefits both the rules and the miniatures line and both are shaped by the background.

Yeah, you've missed my point entirely. So simply put: What you wrote is irrelevant. Sorry.

To elaborate: the Codex/bestiary should be different for each game, but the actual core rules should be the same. You don't need twenty different ways to depict someone firing a rifle.


Yes, didn't miss the point at all.

I have behind me a few of those systems, collecting wargame rules is a hobby for me and all are as I describe them and all have the same issues I described.

You cannot make core rules that will fit everything and everybody will use them, because each play experience is tailor made and each manufacturer wants to give something else, all the attempts for such a system will produce a system that will be plain and bloated to broaden the possibilities of its use.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 08:17:41


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


 Gallahad wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
After neoBSG and Stargate Universe, I have to say that dark sci fi is overrated. Also, every bit as corny and cheesy as the light stuff, but with a higher chance of making you feel depressed.

What we really need is New Wave French sci fi. How about a setting with no plot, characters who may or may not be figments of their own imaginations, and belligerent orifices who expound for whole chapters on the pointless minutia of punctuation to apathetic, be-mammaried space crustaceans?


EDIT: Wait, damn. I think we're back to furries again? But post-irony furries with no humor about their crotchless condition.


Bob...you are hilarious. Reading little gems like these from you makes Dakka a better place. If I could be bothered to figure out how to put a quote in my sig, I would sig this.



Thank you. I really appreciate your kind words. For me, Dakka is such a wonderful place because it lets all aspects of our love (hate?) for the hobby flourish. Maybe that's why I spend more time on here than I do painting...


Antares is exciting now because it has so many ideas, like a new hire who hasn't run head-first into reality yet. I'm pretty excited to find out where they will eventually plant their post-optimism rut.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 08:31:39


Post by: Azazelx


 AlexHolker wrote:
 Azazelx wrote:
 PsychoticStorm wrote:
[
I disagree with this idea, generic rulesets are just that, generic, deprived from flavor and direction, or on the other side of the coin arcane monstrosities of rules to cover all the possibilities, likewise, miniature lines without a background in mind are plain, maybe good, but its obvious they are generic.

A complete ecosystem benefits both the rules and the miniatures line and both are shaped by the background.

Yeah, you've missed my point entirely. So simply put: What you wrote is irrelevant. Sorry.

To elaborate: the Codex/bestiary should be different for each game, but the actual core rules should be the same. You don't need twenty different ways to depict someone firing a rifle.


That, to an extent. Just sharing a core ruleset and then each game can have their own special rules, points system, whatever. But as you said, no need for 20 ways to resolve basic shooting.
More specifically what I was talking about here is that both Mark and Vic have shown interest in collaboration with others, so there's potential space for both manufacturer's kits and fluff to be part of the same universe and game - directly.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 09:10:33


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Marc has already his fluff and it is more logical than GOA at least so far, I cannot see how it can fit in GOA.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 09:19:12


Post by: BrookM


I also think that both the style of Mark and Vic wouldn't fit in with what's going on here.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 09:58:09


Post by: Azazelx


Ah, well, for the last several posts where I've been getting specific I was thinking more of Vic's stuff joining Mark's stuff in his game - rather than either having anything to do with GoA anymore. I apologise if that was unclear. And yes, I guess rather tangental to the GoA topic, but it was an organic aspect to the conversation.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 10:20:20


Post by: Elemental


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I thought the definition of hard sci fi was always, the less science magic we need for things to happen by our today's assumptions of all science fields the harder it is.


My impression from the internet was "Like soft SF, but everything is justified by nanotech and god-AI's."


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 11:00:40


Post by: Compel


Isn't GURP's relatively popular in the RPG circles?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 11:21:52


Post by: lord_blackfang


 Elemental wrote:
 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I thought the definition of hard sci fi was always, the less science magic we need for things to happen by our today's assumptions of all science fields the harder it is.
My impression from the internet was "Like soft SF, but everything is justified by nanotech and god-AI's."


Soft sci-fi: what humanity can do with crazy made-up tech
Hard sci-fi: what crazy made-up tech does to humanity

In a nutshell.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 14:12:37


Post by: Rick Priestley


 silent25 wrote:
 paulson games wrote:
Pure speculation here, but somebody just sold over a million shares of GW stock. Maybe a former GW cornerstone employee dumped his stock in the company to fund GOA?


Think more a former GW cornerstone employee dumping his stock because he realizes it might become worthless soon

Having more faith in GoA with these figs. The initial figs had a 80's vibe in a bad way. The line feels like an old rock act trying to make it back onto stage with new stuff trying to stay relevant. Some stuff seems dated, but still able to do some wow.


Wish I had a million GW shares to dump! I'm not complaining - I was paid well by GW - but not that well I'm sorry to say!

With the GoA models we started work on four of the races/factions at the same time - but in some cases the sculptors weren't up to it, and in others we were never happy with the concepts, in the meantime we employed a new sculptor who is bringing his expertise to bear. It just happened the Boromites got done first. It's not a cunning plan or anything. It's just how it panned out.





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 14:16:13


Post by: Eggs


Any idea when we'll start seeing some models becoming available to buy?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 16:15:04


Post by: Theophony


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
 Gallahad wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
After neoBSG and Stargate Universe, I have to say that dark sci fi is overrated. Also, every bit as corny and cheesy as the light stuff, but with a higher chance of making you feel depressed.

What we really need is New Wave French sci fi. How about a setting with no plot, characters who may or may not be figments of their own imaginations, and belligerent orifices who expound for whole chapters on the pointless minutia of punctuation to apathetic, be-mammaried space crustaceans?


EDIT: Wait, damn. I think we're back to furries again? But post-irony furries with no humor about their crotchless condition.


Bob...you are hilarious. Reading little gems like these from you makes Dakka a better place. If I could be bothered to figure out how to put a quote in my sig, I would sig this.



Thank you. I really appreciate your kind words. For me, Dakka is such a wonderful place because it lets all aspects of our love (hate?) for the hobby flourish. Maybe that's why I spend more time on here than I do painting...


Antares is exciting now because it has so many ideas, like a new hire who hasn't run head-first into reality yet. I'm pretty excited to find out where they will eventually plant their post-optimism rut.


You weren't watching Red Dwarf recently were you?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 16:39:53


Post by: Grot 6


When I see this stuff, I am reminded of Firefly/ Space:1999 types of shows. Sort of like a darker edged Star Trek. Not "we come in peace, set phasers to kill", but more " Hey, we need to survive, and make some scratch to keep this heap running, so we're going to keep exploring and taking these jobs till we can hit the big time. because if we just sit around here, we're going to be snatched up as next weeks leftovers..."


The figures are ok. Not show stoppers, but they really are not that bad. I'm really reminded of the old school game from Heritage miniatures, Galacta. In that game you could scratch together a few figures, and fight it out, expanding the crew into other avenues, such as RPG's, or even adding other figures to the line. It was sort of like Star Wars around the same time as star wars got out to the public, but before it became as big as it did.

Here's a better discussion of that one, but the similarities are there, and a hell of alot better fleshed out.

http://www.goingfaster.com/heritage.html

No, Gates isn't pretty so far, but damn does it have some fresh leeway to play a scifi game with. And the amount that you can do for yourself without some clownass telling you you have to do this or that is really refreshing.

Bit of a mix of the old and new, with room to expand as you'd see fit. A true sandbox game at its core.

Myself? I can throw in a few different scifi figures from other ranges, and come up with a few cool things to throw around.

A ship crew, where you can take them to different places, and adventure on tabletop with material from other games thrown in. New races, that you can make for your self, ( Vor tried it, but died on the vine.)

Come up with the ship/ ships. As you progress, you keep one ship going, add in a couple more with a few extra crews and expand the exploration game to include new planets, systems.

Any word on a space ship/ exploration system?

Any word on developing your own new weapons/ technology?

Any word on the "Make your own race" that was alluded to during the KS project?


Eve on the tabletop is a good description of what I'm seeing here. Tell the truth, Stargate was a little too liberal left wing gak to me. ( Army/ military= bad, Free spirited, weak defeatest thinking hippy liberal civilian who cares more about him/ herself then his/ her mates= good.) that show universe was good to go at first, but evolved into dragging udder crap from behind the cow...


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/01 21:49:07


Post by: PsychoticStorm


 Rick Priestley wrote:

Wish I had a million GW shares to dump! I'm not complaining - I was paid well by GW - but not that well I'm sorry to say!

With the GoA models we started work on four of the races/factions at the same time - but in some cases the sculptors weren't up to it, and in others we were never happy with the concepts, in the meantime we employed a new sculptor who is bringing his expertise to bear. It just happened the Boromites got done first. It's not a cunning plan or anything. It's just how it panned out.



I kinda wish you had too, those would be money well earned and well spend.

You will probably hear some harsh criticism from me from time to time, I really love what you try to achieve from GOA, Rogue trader was the thing that initiated me into wargaming at 10, I would really love to see the concept of that universe come back to life and not the mutated husk that 40k has become, but I would really love to see it evolved, it has been more than two decades and some ideas need some readjustment to fit a more modern pallet, I respectfully want to see such an old storyteller, whose base story has captured my imagination in the past and upon whose foundations an empire has been build to evolve in a modern storyteller.

I love the concept of GOA saga, I quite like the overall ideas, the details sometimes though leave me desiring for something more, modern.

The recent dichotomy is a nice example, gene modding good concept, millennia? em not so good timescale something vastly shorter would not be bad, Boromites, like they came from the 80's, Algoryn look far far better and in line with modern expectations.

In any case keep up the good work sir.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 00:13:48


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


Why is the timeline having some space in it such a problem? Millions of years of background gives the universe space for torch ships, trans-humans, post-humans, degenerate humans, uplifted species, servitor races, rebellions, true enlightenment into energy squids, and time for the energy squids to restock the galaxy with Humans Classic for the retro charm. Boromites make more sense if you have millions of years of sociological forces diverging on millions of worlds than if you only have a few centuries and a sensibly smaller human space to work with.


@Theophany, I haven't seen Red Dwarf in a decade, ever since I loaned my DVDs to a friend.

And did someone just call Stargate, a.k.a. The USAF Blows Up UnChristian God-Aliens, a liberal left-wing gak-show?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 01:00:44


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Because a million years is an unimaginably long time, millions is way too much.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 01:15:53


Post by: Compel


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

And did someone just call Stargate, a.k.a. The USAF Blows Up UnChristian God-Aliens, a liberal left-wing gak-show?


I think he was referring to the film.

But yeah, Stargate SG-1 was probably one of the most heavily supported action tv shows from the US military. You quite often had assorted US Generals appearing on the show, including their Chief of Staff, General John P Jumper. Don S Davis, who played General Hammond in the show, was an army Captain in Vietnam.

One of my favourite stories was Richard Dean Anderson asking one of the Generals who came onto the show. "Do you ever have real colonels who act the way I do." The reply? "Yes. And worse."


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 03:01:56


Post by: mitch_rifle


Looking forward to getting those boromites, and please rick don't make this game too serious, leave some room for fun and invention, the reason ive lost some love for warhammer is it is becoming far too serious


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 07:39:16


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
Because a million years is an unimaginably long time, millions is way too much.


I don't see how the second part follows from the first. Yes, it is an unimaginably long time. Which is good for a setting that involves godlike transcendant AI, nanotech, transhumans, posthumans, etc., etc.. A few hundreds of years is just not enough time for mankind to colonize very many planets, give each of them a "thing" for their background, create multiple subspecies with enough "oomph" to be playable races, and enough tech to make a dent in any kind of FTL Grand Central Station's worth of worlds. If there is a series of Fargates to every place worth visiting, why would there be battles for resources in just a few hundred years? Or even a few thousand?


In what way does having a vast period to fill with background qualify as "too much"?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 08:42:25


Post by: Vain


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
In what way does having a vast period to fill with background qualify as "too much"?


I gotta say I am in the 'million years is too long' camp myself.

What a human is and what it looks like would change a lot thanks to all the Natural (and Unnatural) elements of the environment. Anywhere between 5-50 thousand years would be enough to provide space to do all the funky stuff with the Pan-Human and unexpected genetic expressions for the tampering.
At a million years I would expect humans to not look like what I think of as humans, with all the beneficial naturally selected traits rising to the surface meaning we have a lot less in common that I see Hansa having with your regular humie.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 10:23:17


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Indeed that is the answer, a few thousand of years are more than enough for most things a million years is a vastly huge period for things to happen.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 13:47:44


Post by: Alpharius


Agreed - it is an unnecessarily long and, quite frankly, silly and distracting amount of background time to suggest!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 15:39:17


Post by: judgedoug


and this is why the 'design by committee' approach of the original KS failed


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 16:20:24


Post by: Sidstyler


In A.D. 2,100,001. War Was Beginning.

Anyway, I'm glad to see this project wasn't completely abandoned or forgotten about at least.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 16:26:10


Post by: warboss


 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
 PsychoticStorm wrote:
Because a million years is an unimaginably long time, millions is way too much.


I don't see how the second part follows from the first. Yes, it is an unimaginably long time. Which is good for a setting that involves godlike transcendant AI, nanotech, transhumans, posthumans, etc., etc.. A few hundreds of years is just not enough time for mankind to colonize very many planets, give each of them a "thing" for their background, create multiple subspecies with enough "oomph" to be playable races, and enough tech to make a dent in any kind of FTL Grand Central Station's worth of worlds. If there is a series of Fargates to every place worth visiting, why would there be battles for resources in just a few hundred years? Or even a few thousand?


In what way does having a vast period to fill with background qualify as "too much"?


Consider what has happened over the past million years both biologically and technologically speaking. It's too long of a time. Transhumans could easily naturally occur in 200k years (look at human evolution and Neanderthal man which appeared 300k years ago) and much, much quicker with genetic engineering and transcendant goldlike AI with Moore's Law will likely occur in a few hundred years if not sooner. One million years just seems to stretch too much the fiction part of science fiction at the expense of science.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 16:50:07


Post by: judgedoug


one million is an easy number to have multiple clean slates.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 16:53:10


Post by: Albino Squirrel


 judgedoug wrote:
and this is why the 'design by committee' approach of the original KS failed


Pretty much. I'm glad they aren't going that route anymore. The setting (at least what is known so far) is vast and open enough that once the game is out, people can add in their own background without breaking it. But the setting itself needs to come from the creative vision, not be voted on by the internet.

By the way, the specific amount of time in the future was never specified, and it probably won't be. It doesn't matter. It's not supposed to be a prediction of what the future will really be like, which would be absurd and pointless even 100 years in the future. It just needs to be a large enough time in the future for man to have spread out, colonized several galaxies, for human civilization to have collapsed and re-risen seven times, and more importantly for humans to evolve along such different paths to allow an unending variety of PanHumans to populate the game with. If you're more comfortable imagining that to be 40,000 years in the future because that's what you're used to, I guess that's fine. If you think the whole premise is silly, then like someone else said, maybe the game isn't for you.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 16:54:44


Post by: PsychoticStorm


judgedoug wrote:and this is why the 'design by committee' approach of the original KS failed


Generally speaking, indeed that was an issue with its failure on many levels, I appreciate taking feedback and even changing things upon discussion, but allowing design in the hands of many is an invitation to disaster.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 18:17:19


Post by: Rick Priestley


The Kickstarter version is kinda the past as far as I'm concerned - I mean I'd no real idea what a KS was when we started - I just agreed to design a game if we could get sufficient funding - and then found myself pressured into designing a game on the fly. Not really what I expected. Lots of the ideas were already buzzing around in my head - so I had a good overview on the scope of the game, some general design ideas, and so on. The online elements are really just my take on running a wargames campaign in a modern environment - love campaigns - always have Can't afford to pursue that idea for the moment though.

The good thing about the KS is that it forced me to actually put pen to paper and make a start at a project that would probably never gel otherwise. Playing games again, I mean SF inspired games, forces you to face up to the practicalities of design, and you start to get a better idea of what the models are going to be like and so on. I've always felt that the best people to make decisions about the sculpts are the sculptors - and you need to feel your way into that - the game design, model design and background should evolve together - well I always say so anyway!

Anyway - I wouldn't put too much store in anything we did for the KS - I've basically started again. As for when the game is set - well it's the far future - it doesn't matter exactly when and I may not worry too much about fixing that either. When I worked out the 40K background I chose a timescale that was deliberately unimaginable - c10,000 years ago = the last ice age - c5,000 years = the entire scope of human history. I suspect any imagined future will look pretty old-fashioned in a few decades time.





Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 18:39:11


Post by: primalexile


Rick,

Thanks for the explanation. I have a couple of questions if you don't mind answering them.

1). Any chance at a second Kickstarter to help fund the rule book or the online campaign system? I would happily donate for both.

2). Will the difference in sculpt qualities be addressed? The Borormites and the Algoryn both look great but one looks 90's and the other is modern.

3). Will Hansa have rules and be playable when the game launches?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 19:51:54


Post by: PsychoticStorm


I am always glad to read such insightful information from game designers, nice to hear about the kickstarter and how you evolved from it, it seems it served its most important role, kickstart you into action.

I agree on the organic evolution of all three aspects of a wargame in unison, I feel that in games were each part is evolved in isolation the results are painfully obvious, of course each specialist does indeed excel on his field and a sculptor traditional or digital is best suited to know better on how a sculpt must be made, but an overall collaboration between the three different elements is essential.

Personally I find a "somewhere in the future" point reference without a time reference clever and exhilarating, better than an arbitrary X amount of years in the future.

You are of course right that any imagined future now will look old fashioned in the future, but personally when I spoke of Boromites, I meant the look, not the background, I understand the overall background and I feel its good, but some details and the visual feel looks old, not the idea itself.

Overall I will say it again, while I am critical on some aspects of your new creation, I am really eager to see what you will create.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 20:53:08


Post by: warboss


 Rick Priestley wrote:
The Kickstarter version is kinda the past as far as I'm concerned - I mean I'd no real idea what a KS was when we started - I just agreed to design a game if we could get sufficient funding - and then found myself pressured into designing a game on the fly. Not really what I expected. Lots of the ideas were already buzzing around in my head - so I had a good overview on the scope of the game, some general design ideas, and so on. The online elements are really just my take on running a wargames campaign in a modern environment - love campaigns - always have Can't afford to pursue that idea for the moment though.



So... in other words, you were willing to take almost a half million US dollars with only a vague notion about what you were doing and complacently ignorant about the method (crowdfunding) you were using to take it? Ughh... that's disgusting. You're one of the most well known names in the industry and should have known better. I do appreciate the honesty about it and that does at least reflect well on you.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 21:17:35


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Its a bit harsh don't you think, a game designer is not necessary a businessman and can accept to work on something that other manage the business end.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 21:59:48


Post by: Buzzsaw


Spoiler:
 Rick Priestley wrote:
The Kickstarter version is kinda the past as far as I'm concerned - I mean I'd no real idea what a KS was when we started - I just agreed to design a game if we could get sufficient funding - and then found myself pressured into designing a game on the fly. Not really what I expected. Lots of the ideas were already buzzing around in my head - so I had a good overview on the scope of the game, some general design ideas, and so on. The online elements are really just my take on running a wargames campaign in a modern environment - love campaigns - always have Can't afford to pursue that idea for the moment though.

The good thing about the KS is that it forced me to actually put pen to paper and make a start at a project that would probably never gel otherwise. Playing games again, I mean SF inspired games, forces you to face up to the practicalities of design, and you start to get a better idea of what the models are going to be like and so on. I've always felt that the best people to make decisions about the sculpts are the sculptors - and you need to feel your way into that - the game design, model design and background should evolve together - well I always say so anyway!

Anyway - I wouldn't put too much store in anything we did for the KS - I've basically started again. As for when the game is set - well it's the far future - it doesn't matter exactly when and I may not worry too much about fixing that either. When I worked out the 40K background I chose a timescale that was deliberately unimaginable - c10,000 years ago = the last ice age - c5,000 years = the entire scope of human history. I suspect any imagined future will look pretty old-fashioned in a few decades time.



Very interesting commentary that should be taken to heart by anyone that attempts a Kickstarter Campaign!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 22:56:20


Post by: warboss


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
Its a bit harsh don't you think, a game designer is not necessary a businessman and can accept to work on something that other manage the business end.


Absolutely not. Being famous doesn't in my book grant you a rerollable 2++ save versus criticism. He is the cofounder of the company that was running the project and is by definition a businessman. It's bad enough when a company treats a kickstarter as business as usual like a preorder but to suggest that they shouldn't treat it as a business? I definitely disagree with that. If I want complete strangers to assume almost 100% of the financial liability of backing my dreams/ideas, you can bet that I'll talk for an hour or two with a lawyer or consultant familiar with the legalities and responsibilities of crowdfunding to better understand it before I go and ask my fellow Dakkites to give me over $400,000. I will also go to you and other posters with more information and planning than will fit on a sheet of 8.5x11" paper including pictures and a less than half done miniature. That amount of preparation would get you laughed out of making an appointment with a financial institution or private angel investor let alone actually getting them to fund you. Don't get me wrong... I don't think crowdfunding should be treated exactly like traditional funding but I do think that creators owe their investors the respect to at least prepare the initial presentation as if it was. It's bad enough that backers don't have the financial stability and safety net that the traditional routes give lenders but both the projects as well as the backers deserve the initial forethought and preparation the traditional routes get especially when your talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 23:04:08


Post by: PsychoticStorm


You are missing the point, if you are the creative part of a company and the business part come and says bla bla if we get funding you will do X project ok? and you say yes, under the assumption that project will happen after funding happens and suddenly get in the kickstarter madness that everybody expects an almost finished product.

I do not debate if the project was handled badly, I am debating the conditions on which a part of a kickstarter can be involved and on what initial conditions it is lead to believe it needs to be involved.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 23:27:20


Post by: Compel


While I wouldn't be saying, or thinking things as strongly as Warboss there, a lot of what he's saying really does strike a note with me.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/02 23:54:43


Post by: mitch_rifle


Well look at the hundreds of thousands mantic takes and delivers some of the poorest quality product out there


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/03 00:03:46


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
You are missing the point, if you are the creative part of a company and the business part come and says bla bla if we get funding you will do X project ok? and you say yes, under the assumption that project will happen after funding happens and suddenly get in the kickstarter madness that everybody expects an almost finished product.


Since the Kickstarter was cashing in on his name and status, I would expect him to have been a little more cognizant of what a Kickstarter is. It was more than just a celebrity endorsement.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/03 06:25:56


Post by: Kilkrazy


As is obvious that was not the case.

The Kickstarter failed to fund, due mainly to the obvious slackness of the preparatory work, which was widely commented on at the time.

Consequently not a single backer lost even a penny.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/03 07:12:44


Post by: frozenwastes


Rick Priestley wrote:As for when the game is set - well it's the far future - it doesn't matter exactly when and I may not worry too much about fixing that either. When I worked out the 40K background I chose a timescale that was deliberately unimaginable - c10,000 years ago = the last ice age - c5,000 years = the entire scope of human history. I suspect any imagined future will look pretty old-fashioned in a few decades time.


I hope in the end it stays undefined. Or at the very least impossible to connect to our current calender.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/03 10:39:11


Post by: Pacific


 PsychoticStorm wrote:
Its a bit harsh don't you think, a game designer is not necessary a businessman and can accept to work on something that other manage the business end.


Quite. As if Rick would have been the only person involved with bringing the KS out?

It might have been not a very well thought out position but I think saying 'disgusting' is going to go a little too far, but hey you had a great opportunity there Warboss to get your forum e-peen lengthened by a few inches even it means you've probably just stopped one of the founding fathers of modern wargaming from posting on here again..


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/03 10:44:10


Post by: Kilkrazy


I am sure Rick Priestly is a big enough guy not to be put off by a few sledgers.

He is of course entitled to the same protection as any user on the forum, so perhaps we had better get back to the main topic.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 10:47:43


Post by: Rick Priestley


Well - let me see - the reason I was comfortable with raising the money - and potentially a great deal more - is I'm confident with nearly thirty years of experience in design, running a studio, developing GW plastics ranges (responsible for 2 million pound budget per annum on tools alone at one time) I can make sure that the project would work - but only if enough money were raised. When it was obvious we couldn't raise enough to do the job properly I decided the project was untenable - and that it would indeed be unfair to reduce our target and put ourselves in a position where we couldn't deliver.

Enough KS eh!



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 11:18:50


Post by: Kilkrazy


What is the plan now?

The part of the original idea that interested me the most was the idea to do an online campaign to advance the background timeline by players sending in their battle results. Much like the 40K "Eye of Terror" and "Medusa V" campaigns done by GW.

That requires the building of a system to handle player inputs, which is a different thing to designing tabletop rules and models.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 12:56:11


Post by: Apologist


Rick notes 'Can't afford to pursue that idea [online elements] for the moment though'. From the discussion on the Warlord Games forum, I think the plan is currently to release the rules once a small range of Boromites and Algoryn have been built up, possibly with some models for a third faction.

I think the gradual build-up is a sensible way of releasing the game, to be honest. While having an all-singing, all-dancing range of four complete armies released at the same time, this approach allows for tweaking once the game hits the real world before too many people are involved, and minimises the risk of something fundamental being a problem (like AT-43's blast rules).

On the 'hard sci-fi' aspect, and the overall ethos of the production of the game, I've seen similar campaigns that turn out to be 'missing the wood for the trees'. I'm reassured by Rick's notes that 'I've always felt that the best people to make decisions about the sculpts are the sculptors' and 'As for when the game is set - well it's the far future - it doesn't matter exactly when and I may not worry too much about fixing that either' – that attitude shows a proper understanding that an overview is more important than micromanagement, and will hopefully stay in place to ensure that the different contributors all get to flex their skills.

I'm hoping for some cool campaign/progression rules, myself.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 16:55:52


Post by: Albino Squirrel


Very brave of Rick to show up in such a wretched hive of scum and villainy. I suppose he must have developed pretty thick skin over the years, especially when it comes to reading what people post on the internet. I certainly hope he doesn't get too discouraged or influenced by what a few vocal people are posting on a message board. I think a lot of people are really looking forward to what he (and the sculptors, artists, etc) comes up with for Gates of Antares.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 17:28:49


Post by: warboss


 Pacific wrote:
Quite. As if Rick would have been the only person involved with bringing the KS out?

It might have been not a very well thought out position but I think saying 'disgusting' is going to go a little too far, but hey you had a great opportunity there Warboss to get your forum e-peen lengthened by a few inches even it means you've probably just stopped one of the founding fathers of modern wargaming from posting on here again..


Both your characterization and prediction were wrong. Being famous doesn't give you a 2++ rerollable versus criticism and the KS justifiably failed on its merits (or more accurately lack thereof). Why did it need the impetus of failing to take other people's money to give it the critical thought it got during the 6 weeks before cancellation? There is a saying about success being 90% perspiration and 10% inspiration that the campaign ignored. Now I don't expect a KS to have that ratio as the money raised pays for the perspiration (inspiriation is free!) but this one seemed to have the ratios backwards. You'll never convince me that a few broad paragraphs of text, a logo, a single half done miniature, and a famous name are enough to justify asking for $400k+. If they had put forth the 6 weeks worth of effort they created on the fly under pressure during the KS when it was floundering instead prior to it, the result and reception likely would have been different. His 30 years of experience including managing the largest minis game line in the hobby's history should have indicated that more effort on the backend would be a good idea before going public asking for hundreds of thousands of dollars.

In the end, the failure of the KS and changing to a traditional release (maybe with a future KS to expand the core) will probably benefit everyone. He gets to flesh it out and give it the development he feels that it needs without doing so on the fly in full view of the public. That will be better for both the IP, the company, his rep, and the community rather than a hastily put together half thought out KS that would likely go through significant changes after the community pledged based on what was initially written.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 18:12:35


Post by: Grot 6


I wouldn't mind seeing some more of the sculpts.

I'd really be interested in about 10-20 of the rock guys with some different weapons options.

Interested in seeing the game flesh itself out, then maybe take it to the KS with something other then good intentions and a name. End of the day, figures and a good game is what its about.


And for what its worth, Rick is in good company here. We're not busting his balls to be chones about it. The concept, the game, and what was initially put out BEFORE the KS began was a solid core project with room for evolution, interaction with the players, and a well rounded evolution concept of the races that really had/has promise.

I really am interested in the game, but for what its worth, when you go a full on five to six weeks with a generic Norseman in space, it really did not do the project much when there was nothing in there, and people were at that point screaming to high heaven over it to see MORE.

1. Will the evolution of the beings in this universe sustain themselves in concept, and developable character? Can you do more then "Ten sculpts, and move on?"

2. Vehicles? What are we looking at, tanks, APC's, walkers, robots, GIANT robots? flying boxcars? What does the game have for vehicles?

3. Evolution of the warbands/ armies/ squads.... What and where do they go from the base starter of a couple of figures, and some terraign?

4. Planets, battlegrounds, environment rules? Exploration, territory advancement, how and why am I fighting these alien crossbreeds?


Just a couple of questions....


The game really looks interesting from my perspective, and I for one would like around 20 or so of those brick-men for some laughs.

The figures would be absolutly Ace with an added titan from Crocodile.

Bunch of rock people with a rock giant running around. A giant rock people with some mech parts hanging off of him, like a gun or a ROCKet launcher........


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 18:25:03


Post by: Pacific


 Kilkrazy wrote:
What is the plan now?

The part of the original idea that interested me the most was the idea to do an online campaign to advance the background timeline by players sending in their battle results. Much like the 40K "Eye of Terror" and "Medusa V" campaigns done by GW.

That requires the building of a system to handle player inputs, which is a different thing to designing tabletop rules and models.


That was one of my main hopes for it also. I think with modern communications technology there is a massive potential in that kind of interactive environment between developer and player, at a level not seen before. Of course, I would imagine this kind of thing would cost a fair amount of money..

And, what Apologist said!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 19:23:01


Post by: Elemental


 Pacific wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
What is the plan now?

The part of the original idea that interested me the most was the idea to do an online campaign to advance the background timeline by players sending in their battle results. Much like the 40K "Eye of Terror" and "Medusa V" campaigns done by GW.

That requires the building of a system to handle player inputs, which is a different thing to designing tabletop rules and models.


That was one of my main hopes for it also. I think with modern communications technology there is a massive potential in that kind of interactive environment between developer and player, at a level not seen before. Of course, I would imagine this kind of thing would cost a fair amount of money..

And, what Apologist said!


And the problem is, wargames settings have to be relatively static. What if the campaign leads to one side being annihilated, or permanently changed such as to eliminate what players originally liked about them?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 19:26:07


Post by: BrookM


Ah yes, the Eye of Terror campaign results and codex: Cadians Imperial Guard getting its release not long after, awkward!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 19:33:22


Post by: Pacific


 Elemental wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
What is the plan now?

The part of the original idea that interested me the most was the idea to do an online campaign to advance the background timeline by players sending in their battle results. Much like the 40K "Eye of Terror" and "Medusa V" campaigns done by GW.

That requires the building of a system to handle player inputs, which is a different thing to designing tabletop rules and models.


That was one of my main hopes for it also. I think with modern communications technology there is a massive potential in that kind of interactive environment between developer and player, at a level not seen before. Of course, I would imagine this kind of thing would cost a fair amount of money..

And, what Apologist said!


And the problem is, wargames settings have to be relatively static. What if the campaign leads to one side being annihilated, or permanently changed such as to eliminate what players originally liked about them?


Infinity has a progressing storyline, although I agree that you would have to be careful (and certainly not give any false premises, like the Eye of Terror campaign!).
I'm sure with careful writing and good handling it could be achievable.

And thinking back, the Eye of Terror was tremendous fun, and had a great effect of pulling games-players together. I think these days it would be that much easier to pull off just because of the communications technology available, that could have only been dreamt about at that time.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 20:37:19


Post by: Kilkrazy


 Elemental wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
What is the plan now?

The part of the original idea that interested me the most was the idea to do an online campaign to advance the background timeline by players sending in their battle results. Much like the 40K "Eye of Terror" and "Medusa V" campaigns done by GW.

That requires the building of a system to handle player inputs, which is a different thing to designing tabletop rules and models.


That was one of my main hopes for it also. I think with modern communications technology there is a massive potential in that kind of interactive environment between developer and player, at a level not seen before. Of course, I would imagine this kind of thing would cost a fair amount of money..

And, what Apologist said!


And the problem is, wargames settings have to be relatively static. What if the campaign leads to one side being annihilated, or permanently changed such as to eliminate what players originally liked about them?


Start a new campaign on a different planet. The previously defeated side can get their revenge.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 21:01:42


Post by: Compel


I have sometimes pondered things like a living game system. Sure, there's the worries about drastically changing the makeup of the armies, but as long as no models are invalidated, it doesn't seem to be too bad.

To take 40k as an example, you have all the different marine codices, that are, at the core, based on the same range of models (broadly speaking). Imagine if, instead of them being different armies, it was the same army but changed throughout time.

Perhaps, something like, over the course of, say, 10 years, you start off with an 'Army' being a horde-ish force of troops (aka, traditional Black Templars), that lose their numbers, but become more organised after conquering a world (aka traditional Codex Space Marines). However, disaster strikes in the next set of campaigns, resulting in there being a relatively small number but significantly higher elite troop concentrations left (EG, Deathwing Dark Angels). Then, flash forward a few years and you get a force desparate for revenge, having lost their home and are entirely assault based (Blood Angels).

Essentially using the same models, nothing is particularly invalidated but things are kept fresh and you see the army evolves with the campaigns by changing their points costs, force structures.

It seems do-able, if a company was sufficiently motivated.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/04 23:01:10


Post by: MrMoustaffa


I just hope we have access to a "generic" force selector that allows you to create your own armies. For example, I'd love to be able to create a mercenary force or my own planetary militia.

It would need to be heavily playtested to keep from being abused, but it could really help the game have a rich universe and attract players. A basic system could be something like

1.Pick race(s) that your force is made of, from a list of the major races in the setting.

2.Pick tech level you want available, with everything from improvised weapons and reserve tier weapons, to high tech special forces equipment.

3.Tech level dictates the type of troops you can take. For example, reservists wouldn't have access to heaps of high tech weaponry, but special forces might be allowed to take a little from any tech level, simulating them using whatever they can find if they're stuck behind enemy lines.

4.The type of troops you take as a core dictates your force selector. A reservist militia might be allowed to take a ton of regular squads, but be severely limited in access to heavy weapons and vehicles. A veteran infantry company on the other hand may be low on regular squads, but have a high concentration of special and heavy weapons to make up for their low numbers.


Besides the obvious ability to draw in players from other systems by using minis they already own, it gives players the ability to make a force that they truly feel is their own. If enough players band together, they may even be able to create a new faction, which would be awesome to see (and give you a new miniature line to make inspired by the conversions the players came up with)

I doubt it would happen since there's all sorts of potential problems a system like that could run into, but it would really help the universe to come alive. It would also help a global campaign system out if there's a decent chunk of mercenary players, as you could provide incentives for them to side with the losing faction to balance the fight. Just a thought.

Either way I'll be keeping an eye on this. I like the core of the Bolt Action rules, and felt they could be truly great with a bit of expansion and tweaking. Since that seems to be the direction this rules system is going, I think it has a lot of potential. Even if I don't like any of the factions Warlord makes, I'll probably try proxying models from other systems to give the game a try.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/05 00:00:03


Post by: judgedoug


 MrMoustaffa wrote:
I just hope we have access to a "generic" force selector that allows you to create your own armies. For example, I'd love to be able to create a mercenary force or my own planetary militia.


This. this this this. i've spent my miniatures gaming life looking for a good generic sci fi ruleset. SG2 and TW are close but I'd really like something with a points system that would at least get to approximate equality for pick up and play scenarios. I've got several sci fi forces from Urban War Viridians, Pig Iron, Copplestone, EM4, Defiance UAMC, Mantic Corporation, Khurusan Federal, etc, that are itching to be played with on a regular basis and not just "let's give this system a try and see if my group likes it".


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/05 01:09:25


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


 Kilkrazy wrote:


Start a new campaign on a different planet. The previously defeated side can get their revenge.


I don't think that would work. People are not likely to get all fired up for the worldwide campaign, Battle For The Planet Of The Ah Who Cares? It Doesn't Matter Anyway. If the campaigns are so generic that you can just pick a new planet and everything's groovy, then there's no reason for people to get excited. If the campaigns happen on worlds (or Rings or Spheres, etc.) that matter, then people will get upset when something important happens to the background that they don't like.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Compel wrote:
I have sometimes pondered things like a living game system. Sure, there's the worries about drastically changing the makeup of the armies, but as long as no models are invalidated, it doesn't seem to be too bad.

To take 40k as an example, you have all the different marine codices, that are, at the core, based on the same range of models (broadly speaking). Imagine if, instead of them being different armies, it was the same army but changed throughout time.

Perhaps, something like, over the course of, say, 10 years, you start off with an 'Army' being a horde-ish force of troops (aka, traditional Black Templars), that lose their numbers, but become more organised after conquering a world (aka traditional Codex Space Marines). However, disaster strikes in the next set of campaigns, resulting in there being a relatively small number but significantly higher elite troop concentrations left (EG, Deathwing Dark Angels). Then, flash forward a few years and you get a force desparate for revenge, having lost their home and are entirely assault based (Blood Angels).

Essentially using the same models, nothing is particularly invalidated but things are kept fresh and you see the army evolves with the campaigns by changing their points costs, force structures.

It seems do-able, if a company was sufficiently motivated.


See, I started 3 armies based on the Oldcrons' fluff surrounding the War in Heaven and the C'Tan. The Newcron codex killed almost all of my enthusiasm for the projects instantly. The models have not been invalidated or anything, but their flavor has soured for sure. Sometimes the background actually matters.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/05 01:17:41


Post by: plastictrees


If it's managed properly there's no reason that you couldn't have new units that reflect the campaign (Guerilla units as a force loses resources etc.) while still legitimately using existing units.

If it's a galaxy spanning conflict you could easily see a force fighting in it's original manner in one sector, while they've had to adapt tactics/ gear/ hire mercenaries in another sector.

This is sort of what Warmachine does, at least as far as releases go, and I think it's a good model. Obviously it's based on written backstory and not really on player input.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 10:30:34


Post by: Eggs


Well I have to say, my first Gates of Antares purchase is.... Disappointing.

As someone who had pledged a decent amount during the kickstarter, I thought I'd buy the Hansa figure to support the project. I find warlord selling it for £5, which is fair enough, but they charge £4 for postage. Against my better judgement, I ordered it anyway.

The figure arrived today. The sculpt itself is nice. No major mold line issues or anything, but they don't even include a base! Nor does it have a tab for slotting in a base. Just a thin strip of metal between the feet like you used to get on some cheap 80's metal figs. It has issues standing up on this, and will take a lot of work with file and clippers to remove it so I can mount it on a 25mm round (like the promo pics has it...) Not even GW has gotten to the point where they don't include bases with their models. If this is the route the project is going down, I'm afraid I'll be spending my money elsewhere.

Shame, because I really liked the look of this project.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 10:35:13


Post by: Kilkrazy


I know the feeling that the company was too cheap to include such a minor item, but surely a 5p plastic base won't break the deal.

I mean it seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face, if you like the figure.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 10:45:39


Post by: Eggs


If it's so minor, then why not include it! It's not just the base though. It's the time it'll take to prep the feet. Don't mind doing it for a one off, but if the whole army is cast on these daft flat metal tabs, that'll be hours of work I could be doing something more constructive. And after shelling out £9 for the figure, I really don't see why I should have to shell out more just to make the model stand up!


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 12:37:28


Post by: edlowe


I picked up the resin version on release with the same tab. Took a bit of work to remove it and I ended up basing it on a spare 30mm wm base. I must say the cast was really good but I wish they'd reconsider doing this on all the figures as is planned.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 14:58:23


Post by: judgedoug


Very few companies (excluding companies with closed systems) include bases with their figures, especially with Warlord being a historicals company. it's almost pointless as there are so many rulesystems that all use different basing methods.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 15:12:33


Post by: Eggs


But it's for their own rule system. Warlord are only the distributor, and I have to say, I've never bought a mini from any other company that didn't include a base. Privateer press, Corvus belli, games workshop, raging heroes, fantasy flight etc. all these companies are going to be direct competitors for this game, and all include an appropriate base for the relevant rule set. Not including one just seems unnecessarily cheap.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 15:22:27


Post by: pgmason


It's definitely a holdover from historicals - with most historical ranges bases are usually sold separately or improvised, rather than coming with the models. This is because the same figures may be intended for use with an individually round bnased skirmish game, a mass battle game with 4 or 5 models on a single base, or anything in between.

Having said that, it does seem a bit cheap when compared with other sci-fi and fantasy ranges. I tihnk its just a case of Warlord rather feeling their way in a new market.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 17:03:14


Post by: edlowe


Im pretty sure its been said on the forum that the minis will come equipped with a lipped base. Cant link as im on my phone atm. I think it could be due to hansa being initially released before they knew what bases to include for the new rules.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 17:13:28


Post by: CptJake


I know all my Zulu War stuff did not come with bases, but the figures (even the metal ones) had an integral base. I ended up putting all the figures on metal washers.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 17:24:23


Post by: frozenwastes


Email them, it could be that they just forgot to pack it and they'll pop one in an envelope and sent it off to you.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 17:28:00


Post by: Herzlos


 Eggs wrote:
But it's for their own rule system. Warlord are only the distributor, and I have to say, I've never bought a mini from any other company that didn't include a base. Privateer press, Corvus belli, games workshop, raging heroes, fantasy flight etc. all these companies are going to be direct competitors for this game, and all include an appropriate base for the relevant rule set. Not including one just seems unnecessarily cheap.


Only the latest Warlord plastic sets come with bases as part of the sprue, and some bundles come with a set of bases from Renedra, but the majority of the line doesn't come with bases. The same applies to most historical companies from what I can tell.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 17:55:57


Post by: Pacific


Herzlos wrote:
Only the latest Warlord plastic sets come with bases as part of the sprue, and some bundles come with a set of bases from Renedra, but the majority of the line doesn't come with bases. The same applies to most historical companies from what I can tell.


Yes I think it's pretty common with historicals stuff. A lot of it probably comes from a lack of standard convention for basing, with people using multi-mounted models or single bases depending on the rulesets people want to use, a lot of the time it makes sense not to include bases.

As a consequence, I think a lot of collectors have big mixes of bases that have been bought separately, leftovers from other kits, or made (at least, I know I do!)

And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!

Eggs wrote:Well I have to say, my first Gates of Antares purchase is.... Disappointing.

As someone who had pledged a decent amount during the kickstarter, I thought I'd buy the Hansa figure to support the project. I find warlord selling it for £5, which is fair enough, but they charge £4 for postage. Against my better judgement, I ordered it anyway.


Covered the point about the bases above, but really what were you doing ordering some Warlord stuff without availing of some of their terrific Hail Caesar or Bolt Action stuff?




Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 18:17:12


Post by: Eggs


 Pacific wrote:
Herzlos wrote:
Only the latest Warlord plastic sets come with bases as part of the sprue, and some bundles come with a set of bases from Renedra, but the majority of the line doesn't come with bases. The same applies to most historical companies from what I can tell.


Yes I think it's pretty common with historicals stuff. A lot of it probably comes from a lack of standard convention for basing, with people using multi-mounted models or single bases depending on the rulesets people want to use, a lot of the time it makes sense not to include bases.

As a consequence, I think a lot of collectors have big mixes of bases that have been bought separately, leftovers from other kits, or made (at least, I know I do!)

And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!

Eggs wrote:Well I have to say, my first Gates of Antares purchase is.... Disappointing.

As someone who had pledged a decent amount during the kickstarter, I thought I'd buy the Hansa figure to support the project. I find warlord selling it for £5, which is fair enough, but they charge £4 for postage. Against my better judgement, I ordered it anyway.


Covered the point about the bases above, but really what were you doing ordering some Warlord stuff without availing of some of their terrific Hail Caesar or Bolt Action stuff?




To be honest, another system is the last thing I need at the minute. With factions under way for warmachine, 40k, infinity, dust, xwing and whfb, I really just wanted the Hansa figure.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
The reason I liked GoA, is because by the time it's a fully fledged system, I should be just about caught up with my other stuff.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 18:19:57


Post by: lord_blackfang


 Pacific wrote:
And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!


The extra work itself doesn't seem like a big deal to me. But it sends a strong message - this is a half-assed project from a team that's 20 years behind the times. Not that we didn't know it already.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 18:33:07


Post by: Eggs


It's not a big deal. It's just not very well thought out is my point


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It's not a big deal. It's just not very well thought out is my point


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 19:07:11


Post by: judgedoug


 lord_blackfang wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!


The extra work itself doesn't seem like a big deal to me. But it sends a strong message - this is a half-assed project from a team that's 20 years behind the times. Not that we didn't know it already.


I'm confused - are the principle designers of 40k and WHFB also working on this project? Both of those systems need a hard reset, with rules firmly mired in the 90's.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 19:28:00


Post by: Pacific


Eggs, I admire your self restraint in not buying miniatures for yet another game system!

 lord_blackfang wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!


The extra work itself doesn't seem like a big deal to me. But it sends a strong message - this is a half-assed project from a team that's 20 years behind the times. Not that we didn't know it already.


Have you seen some of their later Hail Caesar and Bolt Action stuff? Some of their plastics are fantastic, think the new ranges are probably up there with GW plastics.


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 19:33:06


Post by: Alpharius


 Pacific wrote:
Eggs, I admire your self restraint in not buying miniatures for yet another game system!

 lord_blackfang wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
And .. TBH I'm amazed that anyone would complain about having to cut off a tab to stick it on a base!


The extra work itself doesn't seem like a big deal to me. But it sends a strong message - this is a half-assed project from a team that's 20 years behind the times. Not that we didn't know it already.


Have you seen some of their later Hail Caesar and Bolt Action stuff? Some of their plastics are fantastic, think the new ranges are probably up there with GW plastics.


Really?

Which ones in particular?


Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 21:15:50


Post by: Kilkrazy


 Eggs wrote:
If it's so minor, then why not include it! It's not just the base though. It's the time it'll take to prep the feet. Don't mind doing it for a one off, but if the whole army is cast on these daft flat metal tabs, that'll be hours of work I could be doing something more constructive. And after shelling out £9 for the figure, I really don't see why I should have to shell out more just to make the model stand up!


I don't either, but if the stark choice is between a great figure you really like, for which you have to provide a base, and some other figure that isn't as nice but you get a free base, I know what I would choose.

To be fair, I have zillions of spare bases lying around from whatever sources I don't know, and it really doesn't hurt me if I need to get my own base.



Beyond the Gates of Antares: The Ongoing News & Rumors Thread @ 2014/02/07 21:29:39


Post by: Pacific


Should have clarified that in terms of rank and file/standard units. Not character pieces, some of the new plastic GW ones are excellent.

But for your standard units the Hail Caesar Legionnaires are brilliant, really nicely detailed. Found some pics, this is the kind of standard you can get with a kit that costs about 60p a miniature, the Imperial Roman era and Celt miniatures are great also.
Spoiler:




And the Bolt Action stuff I have seen is really nice as well, the US and Brit plastic sets are much better than the GW Cadians and Catachans I think. Much cheaper as well, and you get a lot more random little bits on the sprues.