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A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/18 18:08:24


Post by: BeAfraid


In 1999, I had a marriage come to an end in what could be possibly the worst way that a marriage could end (worse than divorce).

But during the separation, I had an accident that put me in the hospital, and my wife stole everything I owned, which included about 10,000 miniatures, about ¼ of which were Citadel/GW miniatures from 1978 - 1994, with the vast majority of them being 1982 - 84 vintage Citadel (Original Beaky marines, Original Beastmen - then still Runequest Broo, Zoats, LOADS of Slann, The Master Molds for the early-80's Citadel Imperial Dragon, an Army each of their LoTR line from the 80s, I am not even Counting the Adeptus Titanicus and Epic 40K miniatures here, which included one of the very few Metal Original Warlord Titans).

But there were some features that would make the miniatures identifiable.

1) They were VERY well painted.
2) The 40K stuff was based such that the bases were grey and looked like Starship deck plating (these were the sloppiest painted things in the collection, as I stupidly did not mask off the bases to get properly straight lines).
3) the Space Marines were all black, and had a "Man-in-the-Moon" emblem for their chapter insignia.
4) The Fantasy miniatures were mostly based upon round, 1" styrene bases that has been filled with plasticize so that the miniature's base blended into the plastic base, and was then painted a dark brown with a green flocking. For older miniatures, they would be surprisingly regular sized bases (I used a machine punch to create them - a rarety for the 1980s).
5) All of the Epic 40K miniatures were based on the 20mm square bases, and would probably be accompanied by Vehicles from FASA's Renegade Legion game, Centurion. The Infantry would also be based 4 to a stand, and not 5 (except for some of the Space marines, and most of the Space Orks).


There are other identifiers, but they will stand out in any description to be used by me to identify actual leads.

And that is because I will be paying at least a three figure reward for any verifiable leads as to where any one miniature from my collection might be.

The Miniatures were originally stolen in San Francisco, and she sold them as a part of a Storage Unit in May of 1999, while I was in the hospital.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/18 19:51:42


Post by: master of asgard


Honestly, 15 years later you have very very little chance of ever finding them again. Your collection has probably been broken up, sold on ebay, stripped, repainted and resold at least once, probably much more.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it's like when a person goes missing they say that after 24 hours they stop looking for a person and start looking for a body. You're really looking for a needle in a haystack here.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 00:31:37


Post by: gunslingerpro


No harm in trying, but without photos or even a trail, the likelyhood of finding them is nil.

Though best case scenario, I'd say she still may have them in the back of a storage unit or in an attic. I'm constantly surprised how often that happens with stolen/misplaced armies, strictly because people have no idea what they are worth.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 01:17:50


Post by: niv-mizzet


10000?! D:

I have one of the biggest collections out of our group, with about 15,000 points of blood Angels, and that's ONLY like 350 models. And that takes up my armoire, a few carry cases, and a reaver Titan sitting on the "undeployed/reserves" table in my game room.

I can't begin to imagine 10,000 models.

Did you outsource to a Chinese child labor factory to get them painted?

In all seriousness, good luck.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 02:04:21


Post by: Jehan-reznor


If she didn't chuck them in the bin out of spite, then they have surely been sold, piece by piece, there is no way of finding them, any pictures?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 02:57:29


Post by: Sammoth


Really, it's 2015 and you worry about it NOW ? It was 16 years ago. You're a bit past the Statute of Limitations. I would just chalk it up as a loss and move on.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 03:03:38


Post by: mechanicalhorizon


BeAfraid wrote:
The Master Molds for the early-80's Citadel Imperial Dragon MB


Out of curiosity, how did you get your hands on that?

I imagine it involved Tom Cruise crawling through air vents and repelling out of a ceiling vent.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 04:30:56


Post by: angryboy2k


 Sammoth wrote:
Really, it's 2015 and you worry about it NOW ? It was 16 years ago. You're a bit past the Statute of Limitations. I would just chalk it up as a loss and move on.


Good for you.

The OP has decided to throw out a few lines of inquiry to see if he can dredge anything up. It doesn't cost him much to ask, and after all these years he obviously has reached a stage in his life where he thinks back on these things, finds he still wishes he could get them back and is making the attempt. I don't understand why anyone would think this is the place to give him advice in moving on. I'm quite sure that he had enough "moving on" when his marriage collapsed "in the worst possible" way and he's now through with moving on.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 05:11:56


Post by: triplegrim


Such a big collection as that might have been bought as a single auction by an avid collector for instance. Its not beyond hope that he might get a clue here, especially with so many rare pieces in it.

I think asking your ex what she did with it might be the best place to start, you never know when its just been stored in the attic.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 05:32:04


Post by: xraytango


Wow, sorry for your loss.

I'm going to be Johnny Raincloud though and guess that worst case she chucked them, best case she gave them to some kid and they are fighting battles across the galaxy on someones kitchen table. In between those she might have sold them.

Triplegrin does make a good point and if your ex-isn't against talking to you it might be worth asking.



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 06:02:03


Post by: Stormonu


Man, sorry to hear that. But with the amount of reward you are offering have you considered hiring a detective instead?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 06:28:57


Post by: Mastiff


I wish you the best of luck with your quest. Do any pictures exist of any of these minis?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 08:10:45


Post by: Sammoth


angryboy2k wrote:
 Sammoth wrote:
Really, it's 2015 and you worry about it NOW ? It was 16 years ago. You're a bit past the Statute of Limitations. I would just chalk it up as a loss and move on.


Good for you.

The OP has decided to throw out a few lines of inquiry to see if he can dredge anything up. It doesn't cost him much to ask, and after all these years he obviously has reached a stage in his life where he thinks back on these things, finds he still wishes he could get them back and is making the attempt. I don't understand why anyone would think this is the place to give him advice in moving on. I'm quite sure that he had enough "moving on" when his marriage collapsed "in the worst possible" way and he's now through with moving on.
I by no means am talking about his past marriage. . I am talking about the timeframe to throw a question out there like this. I understand he is grasping for some answer. Let be real it's not a few years we are talking about 16 years ago. I just stated the truth like many others here have. Besides you would think the first person to ask would be his ex. Not some random strangers. That would be were I would start.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 08:43:19


Post by: angryboy2k


 Sammoth wrote:
Besides you would think the first person to ask would be his ex. Not some random strangers. That would be were I would start.


Unless she's dead or he can't locate her.

I'm sure the OP isn't a total moron; he's obviously aware that he's only got a very slim chance of anyone here actually being able to help him and if he were able to contact his ex about this he would have done so by now.

There's a lot of pessimism in this thread, and the opinion seems to be generally "Nah man, you should just give up." As I said the OP is aware he's got next to no chance of finding his stuff but it looks to me like he has given up on "giving up" - he's spent 16 years dealing with whatever hell he's gone through and maybe now he's looking around him and he's thinking he's got the time and resources to do a little hunting and offer a reward for info leading to his stuff. Captain Obvious statements like "ask your ex" or "she may have chucked em in the trash" aren't helpful at all.

Good luck to him, I hope he finds something - anything - from his collection.



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 13:01:07


Post by: Sammoth


angryboy2k wrote:
 Sammoth wrote:
Besides you would think the first person to ask would be his ex. Not some random strangers. That would be were I would start.


Unless she's dead or he can't locate her.

I'm sure the OP isn't a total moron; he's obviously aware that he's only got a very slim chance of anyone here actually being able to help him and if he were able to contact his ex about this he would have done so by now.

There's a lot of pessimism in this thread, and the opinion seems to be generally "Nah man, you should just give up." As I said the OP is aware he's got next to no chance of finding his stuff but it looks to me like he has given up on "giving up" - he's spent 16 years dealing with whatever hell he's gone through and maybe now he's looking around him and he's thinking he's got the time and resources to do a little hunting and offer a reward for info leading to his stuff. Captain Obvious statements like "ask your ex" or "she may have chucked em in the trash" aren't helpful at all.

Good luck to him, I hope he finds something - anything - from his collection.



You're making blind assumptions about him without knowing anything. Maybe if he took the time to tell us the whole story we would have a better idea. How do you or I know she is dead or he can't contact his Ex it's not like he stated any of that ? He only claimed a worse than divorce & a separation He also CLAIMED his wife stole everything. (I am not the only one who said to ask his EX). I never said / presumed that he was a moron. You did or at least how you took it. I am not a pessimist I am a realist. Why do you feel the need to pick on me when I am not the only one in the thread that said this ? It's not directed at you why do you care ?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 13:21:01


Post by: Kosake


 triplegrim wrote:
I think asking your ex what she did with it might be the best place to start, you never know when its just been stored in the attic.


Good luck and a hearty dose of sodium pentaholate in this endeavour!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 13:30:56


Post by: Darkjim


Yep good luck to the OP, it is a long shot but they sometimes come off, I hope something turns up.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 13:51:45


Post by: angryboy2k


 Sammoth wrote:

You're making blind assumptions about him without knowing anything. Maybe if he took the time to tell us the whole story we would have a better idea. How do you or I know she is dead or he can't contact his Ex it's not like he stated any of that ? He only claimed a worse than divorce & a separation He also CLAIMED his wife stole everything. (I am not the only one who said to ask his EX). I never said / presumed that he was a moron. You did or at least how you took it. I am not a pessimist I am a realist. Why do you feel the need to pick on me when I am not the only one in the thread that said this ? It's not directed at you why do you care ?


You're right. I'm sorry. I was unnecessarily rude and my tone was uncalled for.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 13:55:27


Post by: thechosen1


OP, why didn't you press charges? If you had acquired all those minis before your marriage, then they are not marital property and thus she had no right to take them.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 15:10:16


Post by: notprop


BeAfraid wrote:
In 1999, I had a marriage come to an end in what could be possibly the worst way that a marriage could end (worse than divorce).........


Sod the toys; they're gone, what the hell does this mean?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 15:35:28


Post by: master of ordinance


Good luck OP, losing that many rare mini's must have been traumatic. The hopes are very slim, but I will keep my eyes open for them.

Also, as thechosen said, why didnt you press charges?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 15:51:06


Post by: Tannhauser42


BeAfraid wrote:

The Miniatures were originally stolen in San Francisco, and she sold them as a part of a Storage Unit in May of 1999, while I was in the hospital.


If there are any posters here from San Francisco, hopefully they can point you towards any well-established clubs and game stores in that area that you can try contacting (also, you may want to try posting on some of the other major forums like BoLS, Warseer, B&C, etc., to spread the net even wider. If it was part of selling off a storage unit, and if they were not the main "selling point" for that sale, then there is every possibility that whoever bought the storage unit may have just chucked them for not knowing what they were (just toys to the uneducated) or given away to the buyer's kids and still treated just like toys. It's equally possible the buyer knew what they were (or knew where to go to find more about them), and, in that case, contacting the gaming "establishment" as mentioned above may help you find details of the sale. I've been in the hobby 20 years, and I know that if someone sold off a massive haul of 10,000 classic minis in my city, word would have spread and it would still be talked about by the veterans even today.

One last possibility: check the newpaper archives for the months following that storage unit sale for auction listings and such. Maybe even visit some of the auction houses that were in business back then and check their archives.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 21:29:52


Post by: oni


If you believe they were sold as part of a storage locker sale - likely an auction. Go to the storage locker facility and see if they have records of sale dating back to that year or if the facility hired an independent agent, try and find out who and seek out a record of sale from them. If records of sale are available, contact the purchaser.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 21:38:18


Post by: Trondheim


Consider them lost to time, and you waited 16 years man ! A bit long to wait for something like this


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/19 21:38:49


Post by: Desubot


 Trondheim wrote:
Grow a pair and consider them lost to time, and you waited 16 years man! A bit long to wait for something like this


Ya know what if he was in a coma for 16 years

 mechanicalhorizon wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
The Master Molds for the early-80's Citadel Imperial Dragon MB


Out of curiosity, how did you get your hands on that?

I imagine it involved Tom Cruise crawling through air vents and repelling out of a ceiling vent.


He seems to have some sort of sculpting connections from his other threads.

perhaps he was in the industry before a terrible greenstuff accident hospitalized him.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 00:09:23


Post by: Medium of Death


Can we assume you murdered your ex-wife and that's why it has taken so long for you to get on the trail?



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 00:25:41


Post by: Hordini


I'm sorry for your loss.

It does seem like a long shot at this point, but I wish you luck in finding them.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 04:23:43


Post by: Robisagg


 Medium of Death wrote:
Can we assume you murdered your ex-wife and that's why it has taken so long for you to get on the trail?



She stole the minis, then he murdered her?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 04:36:51


Post by: PrehistoricUFO


Did you happen to have a collection of vintage Dwarves?

Pre-slottas.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 06:04:32


Post by: triplegrim


The advice about both newspapers auctions and company records of sale sounds pretty smart.

Do you have any pics at all of the models? Would make them much easier to find if they were sold and ended up in the community somehow.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 08:02:31


Post by: BeAfraid


niv-mizzet wrote:
10000?! D:

I have one of the biggest collections out of our group, with about 15,000 points of blood Angels, and that's ONLY like 350 models. And that takes up my armoire, a few carry cases, and a reaver Titan sitting on the "undeployed/reserves" table in my game room.

I can't begin to imagine 10,000 models.

Did you outsource to a Chinese child labor factory to get them painted?

In all seriousness, good luck.


I used to be one of the best miniature painters in the US and England in the late-70's and early-80's.

I painted miniatures for display work for Heritage, Ral Partha, Citadel (where. I had models on display at Dalling Road for over a decade from 1984+: The Thrudd the Barbarian collection, and several Beastmen - although they were still Runequest Broo at that time - and Chaos Warriors), Steve Jackson Games, Martian Metals, and a couple of other manufacturers I cannot recall.

Due to my wife, the only samples of my work that still exist are on the box-art for a few of SJ Games OGRE miniatures (the Fencer - which I painted in about 20 minutes sitting at Steve's booth in 1992 at Origins, the trucks, the Combine GEVs, and either the light tanks or GEVs... Can't recall).

Roughly half of my collection wasn't painted (mostly Essex, Archive, and Dragon's Tooth Miniatures Armies - Those Dragon's Tooth. Lizard men would bring a freaking fortune on eBay).

But I got most of them by being allowed to just take what I wanted from manufacturers. I came home from school in London in 1984 with a little over a ton of lead from Citadel (not as many miniatures as you would think, especially when 10 of them were Imperial Dragons). This was before Airlines bothered with weighing your luggage, and just limited you to "2 Items." I did pay extra for two additional "Items" of luggage. They were steamer trucks filled with miniatures (4 in total).

And, given the level of paint jobs on most of the painted miniatures, I doubt seriously anyone would strip them.

To date... I have located precisely ONE miniature. A Ral Partha Genie. It was on eBay in 2006. It had been re-based, but the paint job was intact, with a few touch-ups to dings and nicks.

I don't have much hope of finding them.

I imagine one day I will be at a convention and will see one, or an army.... But.... Not much hope.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:


I have asked on other miniature forums.

But. I just learned about DakkaDakka a few months ago...

And due to the accident that caused my wife to have the opportunity to steal them (she sold them for drugs), I was busy learning how to walk again for a couple of years after that... Which took up a bit of time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Sammoth wrote:
Really, it's 2015 and you worry about it NOW ? It was 16 years ago. You're a bit past the Statute of Limitations. I would just chalk it up as a loss and move on.


I mentioned in another reply that there were issues, and that this isn't the first time I have inquired about it (in other venues).




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 mechanicalhorizon wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
The Master Molds for the early-80's Citadel Imperial Dragon MB


Out of curiosity, how did you get your hands on that?

I imagine it involved Tom Cruise crawling through air vents and repelling out of a ceiling vent.


I owned the rights to the. Citadel Imperial Dragon.

Bought them (it) from Bryan Ansell in 1984.

It was produced for a while by the company that eventually became Reaper.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 triplegrim wrote:
Such a big collection as that might have been bought as a single auction by an avid collector for instance. Its not beyond hope that he might get a clue here, especially with so many rare pieces in it.

I think asking your ex what she did with it might be the best place to start, you never know when its just been stored in the attic.


And, just to reiterate:

Sold it for $200 worth of Crack (The collection of Miniatures was not all that was included. Also in the collection was a library worth about $150,000. It included one of eight copies of Daniel Webster's 16th or 17th Century Manuscript on Hunting Witches. That hasn't turned up either).

As I said... She stole EVERYTHING (she even stole my underwear and socks that I wasn't wearing, and didn't have in the hospital).

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Sammoth wrote:
angryboy2k wrote:
 Sammoth wrote:
Really, it's 2015 and you worry about it NOW ? It was 16 years ago. You're a bit past the Statute of Limitations. I would just chalk it up as a loss and move on.


Good for you.

The OP has decided to throw out a few lines of inquiry to see if he can dredge anything up. It doesn't cost him much to ask, and after all these years he obviously has reached a stage in his life where he thinks back on these things, finds he still wishes he could get them back and is making the attempt. I don't understand why anyone would think this is the place to give him advice in moving on. I'm quite sure that he had enough "moving on" when his marriage collapsed "in the worst possible" way and he's now through with moving on.
I by no means am talking about his past marriage. . I am talking about the timeframe to throw a question out there like this. I understand he is grasping for some answer. Let be real it's not a few years we are talking about 16 years ago. I just stated the truth like many others here have. Besides you would think the first person to ask would be his ex. Not some random strangers. That would be were I would start.


She was killed shortly after the last time I spoke to her, when I did verify that she sold them to some random person for $200 (so she could buy crack, since dancing around that issue will just waste time.... Which is what caused our separation to begin with. I had seen what cocaine does to people in the 1980's, and I gave her six months to quit, and instead she used that time to try to kill me).

But that information didn't lead very far, and at the time, people didn't know about eBay for selling miniatures like they do now.

And... For many years I was not able to do much at all, let alone walk. I still have wounds that don't heal because of injuries associated with that time.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 master of ordinance wrote:
Good luck OP, losing that many rare mini's must have been traumatic. The hopes are very slim, but I will keep my eyes open for them.

Also, as thechosen said, why didnt you press charges?


Did... Wound up as a suspect in her disappearance (at the time, she was just "missing." It would be almost half a decade before we found out she had been killed).

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 oni wrote:
If you believe they were sold as part of a storage locker sale - likely an auction. Go to the storage locker facility and see if they have records of sale dating back to that year or if the facility hired an independent agent, try and find out who and seek out a record of sale from them. If records of sale are available, contact the purchaser.


I could try this again. The storage facility would not give up the records without a warrant, and due to extenuating circumstances, the police were less than helpful in tracking things down once my wife went missing.


MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Medium of Death wrote:
Can we assume you murdered your ex-wife and that's why it has taken so long for you to get on the trail?



Sigh....

If I knew where her body was, I would go dig it up, raise her from the dead in some unholy rite, and then kill her again.

But she died shortly after stealing everything.

And, read above for what "took me so long."

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Did you happen to have a collection of vintage Dwarves?

Pre-slottas.


Yes... An entire army of them. Both the Norse Dwarves, and the "Regular" dwarves that came out at the same time as the pre-slot a Bob Olley Goblins and Orcs that are also so rare these days (they suffered from lead rot pretty badly, as I remember that a lot of my Bob Olley Orcs had that happen to them, and I thought an extraterrestrial alien fungus had chosen me as a vector to infect the planet and take over the world, and that I was going to start sprouting tentacles at any second like in John Carpenter's The Thing.

Only about three units worth were painted, though (Norse Dwarves, I think). I can' true all how they were based, though, because I remember. I was planning on re-basing all of my armies to DBx standards in the early 1990's, in a revolt against Warhammer.

Those dwarves are perhaps the BEST Dwarves that have ever been done. If Tom Meier would do some dwarves now, they might be better.

But in my opinion, no one else has come close to the Dwarfy-ness of those Dwerrow.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 09:26:22


Post by: Howard A Treesong


It's still a very long shot. But the Citadel Collectors Yahoo group is a good bet, they know a lot about who owns what in the community when it comes to unusual stuff. When it comes to very rare items, the community is fairly small.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 09:34:49


Post by: Reality-Torrent


This thread makes for a interesting read!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 10:40:56


Post by: Skinnereal


I've known addictions in marriage, and it's not pretty. Mine didn't end anywhere nearly as badly as yours, and that's a hell of a time you had.

The only ways I can think of to track down your stuff would be to ask other sculptors (which you have), collectors (see above), and the previous 'owners'.
A detective might be able to wangle something out of the police to get the storage sales info.

Otherwise, I expect it to have been melted down and sold by weight :(
Being able to prove prior ownership might help if you went to a pro. Employment history and the box lids might be enough.
Links to the models in question too, from sites such as http://www.solegends.com/


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 17:18:20


Post by: Da Stormlord


I may have seen them, even though I'm in the UK. By any chance were some of these just primed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spoiler:


Did they look like this model?

Added spoiler tags to large image which was causing the thread to scroll sideways - RiTides



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 20:06:44


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


@Beafraid, thank you for sharing your story, you didn't have to. I really I feel for you.

Have you also asked at the Miniatures Page, Stuff of Legends and the Collecting Citiadel Miniatures wiki?

The forums and or webmasters might be able to keep an eye out.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 22:36:38


Post by: Sammoth


Thank you for sharing your sad story. However, the only advice I could offer is try the Storage Auction records and start from there. However it might be a lost cause without a paper trail.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 22:42:38


Post by: RiTides


BeAfraid wrote:
I used to be one of the best miniature painters in the US and England in the late-70's and early-80's.

Surely you must have pictures in that case (I saw you say that there are almost no samples of your work but... come on, you've got to have a few pictures). You even mentioned seeing an auction in 2006, that must have a picture. Without some sort of pictures your request is going to be basically impossible... and seemingly, finding pictures should be easier than finding the miniatures themselves, at least for starters.



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 23:02:00


Post by: calamarialldayerrday


Hey dude. Best of luck with your endeavour. I don't have anything to add with regard to finding your miniatures. I imagine you've done a lot of investigating already, and if they were sold as a large amount, one would imagine word would get around. I'm really rooting for you.

Have you done any modeling or painting work since? I'd love to see your more current work.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 23:06:33


Post by: BeAfraid


Da Stormlord wrote:
I may have seen them, even though I'm in the UK. By any chance were some of these just primed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spoiler:


Did they look like this model?

Added spoiler tags to large image which was causing the thread to scroll sideways - RiTides



All of the Space Marines were either 1983/84 Metal, or Original Plastics (beaky Marines, I hear they are called).

And all of my Space Marines were painted, with the Man-In-The-Moon chapter insignia (pity things went so sideways, they might have become an official chapter).

I wish that I could remember which armies were completely painted, and which were not. I have tried going through everything step by step, but inevitably I will forget something along the way.

But I do know that my Space Marines were all painted, because I had exactly 280 of the Marines, and then Dreadnaughts for each platoon of 20 Marines (this was before the days of official lists), and a platoon of scouts for each company (these were four jet-bikes, and one speeder per platoon. I think I had it grouped into four companies of three platoons each, plus a command group and a weapons section. Two Dreadnaughts per platoon. They were the original Dreadnaughts.

But given what was in the collection, it could have been spread all over creation.


MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
@Beafraid, thank you for sharing your story, you didn't have to. I really I feel for you.

Have you also asked at the Miniatures Page, Stuff of Legends and the Collecting Citiadel Miniatures wiki?

The forums and or webmasters might be able to keep an eye out.


I first asked on TMP back in 2003, but I no longer get along very well with the owner of TMP over the fact he tends to be rather tyrannical and hypocritical on some issues and his management of the boards.

I did ask The Stuff of Legends owner, but he had not seen anything come up.

And I had not heard of the Collecting Citadel Miniatures Wiki. That might help produce some leads.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 RiTides wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
I used to be one of the best miniature painters in the US and England in the late-70's and early-80's.

Surely you must have pictures in that case (I saw you say that there are almost no samples of your work but... come on, you've got to have a few pictures). You even mentioned seeing an auction in 2006, that must have a picture. Without some sort of pictures your request is going to be basically impossible... and seemingly, finding pictures should be easier than finding the miniatures themselves, at least for starters.



I will see if I can track down the auction image.

The only problem is that the base was altered, and the bases are the most distinctive way to identify them. The style of the paint jobs are pretty distinctive as well, as I was pretty good then.

But The only photos of them that I owned were in the storage unit with the miniatures.

And the Box Art for the OGRE minis aren't good samples for most of the miniatures, considering I did those paint jobs in such a rush (and they are very different from the typical paint jobs I did on vehicles, which doesn't help at all for the armies and character figures).

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/20 23:46:11


Post by: Sinful Hero


@BeAfraid

Do you mind if I ask what you intend to do when you find them? Are you wanting to buy them back, just find out where they went, or something else?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 02:49:01


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


 RiTides wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
I used to be one of the best miniature painters in the US and England in the late-70's and early-80's.

Surely you must have pictures in that case (I saw you say that there are almost no samples of your work but... come on, you've got to have a few pictures). You even mentioned seeing an auction in 2006, that must have a picture. Without some sort of pictures your request is going to be basically impossible... and seemingly, finding pictures should be easier than finding the miniatures themselves, at least for starters.



Don't forget this happened in 1999. Digital photography and 'the cloud' were just taking off, I think I got my first digital camera around 2003. So you'd be talking about physical photos that were probably lost with the rest of the collection.

That being said if there are any old magazines you know your work was in someone here could probably send you pics.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One other thought, your best bet for mobilizing the community might be to get your story into print in a magazine or newspaper as well as online.

Work with a journalist to really tell the story the highs and lows and persuade people to care.

And make sure it's available online for lots of sharing and online plugging.

You also mentioned your library, so this story might be of more general interest than just the small and insular wargaming community.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Da Stormlord wrote:
I may have seen them, even though I'm in the UK. By any chance were some of these just primed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spoiler:


Did they look like this model?

Added spoiler tags to large image which was causing the thread to scroll sideways - RiTides



If this is a joke it's in really bad taste.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 15:54:06


Post by: Da Stormlord


 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
 RiTides wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
I used to be one of the best miniature painters in the US and England in the late-70's and early-80's.

Surely you must have pictures in that case (I saw you say that there are almost no samples of your work but... come on, you've got to have a few pictures). You even mentioned seeing an auction in 2006, that must have a picture. Without some sort of pictures your request is going to be basically impossible... and seemingly, finding pictures should be easier than finding the miniatures themselves, at least for starters.



Don't forget this happened in 1999. Digital photography and 'the cloud' were just taking off, I think I got my first digital camera around 2003. So you'd be talking about physical photos that were probably lost with the rest of the collection.

That being said if there are any old magazines you know your work was in someone here could probably send you pics.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One other thought, your best bet for mobilizing the community might be to get your story into print in a magazine or newspaper as well as online.

Work with a journalist to really tell the story the highs and lows and persuade people to care.

And make sure it's available online for lots of sharing and online plugging.

You also mentioned your library, so this story might be of more general interest than just the small and insular wargaming community.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Da Stormlord wrote:
I may have seen them, even though I'm in the UK. By any chance were some of these just primed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Spoiler:


Did they look like this model?

Added spoiler tags to large image which was causing the thread to scroll sideways - RiTides



If this is a joke it's in really bad taste.


Not a joke, I've just not seen much old 40k stuff. I have a whole collection of old space marines and never used them, planning to list them on ebay.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 16:21:58


Post by: Orlanth


We need to read the thread as what it is.

The OP is looking back at his collection, missing it and posted here in order to make himself feel he is doing something.

In general the mission here is to generate some sympathy, and as most gamers have had something stolen at some time, for me it was my Battletech novels and my dice, plus the occassional missing crap from eBay. We know it can get irritating when we reminisce.

With exception of a few dicks the replies here have shown sympathy, and so do I.

The only actual recourse the OP has is to track the Storage Unit sale to see who bought it. You maybe he could then trace who it was sold to and make enquiries there.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 16:59:50


Post by: Polonius


I'm going to make a wild guess here, but if they were sold as part of a Storage Unit Auction, they probably weren't sold for melt. Unless the guy buying the stuff was a complete amateur, he'd see thousands of carefully painted and packaged figures, and assume it's a collection. 1999 was a while ago, but it was well into the time when people went to estate sales/flea markets/storage auctions looking to cash in on collectibles.

It's not that hard to figure out to ask at the comic/gaming/collectibles shops and finding somebody that would buy them. There were, and still are, guys that just love having piles of lead.

Were I a betting man, I'm guessing this entire collection is sitting in some gamers house. The only real way to back track to it would be to follow in the footsteps of the Auction Buyer in 1999 - find the people that worked/owned those stores, see if anybody remembers a person buying or selling a massive lot of miniatures. Keep in mind, the sale was likely legal, and they won't have to divulge information.

Even worse, even if you find that they're in the hands of a private owner, there's no real way to recover. The length of time since the sale and their nature as marital property would make legal recovery difficult.

Still, I feel very bad for the OP. I didn't lose a collection of nearly the length, nor have a marriage end, but I've lost minis in a break up. I still sometimes wonder where the Juan Diaz daemonettes are....


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 17:10:11


Post by: Ratius


To our fallen miniature brothers


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 17:13:25


Post by: Desubot


 Orlanth wrote:

In general the mission here is to generate some sympathy, and as most gamers have had something stolen at some time, for me it was my Battletech novels and my dice, plus the occassional missing crap from eBay.


My MTG Rare binder (no power 9 but a bunch of expensive ones and duel lands)


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 17:27:22


Post by: Portugal Jones


 Ratius wrote:
To our fallen miniature brothers

Pouring out a 40 of Lantham Medium.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 18:00:03


Post by: Sinful Hero


 Orlanth wrote:

In general the mission here is to generate some sympathy, and as most gamers have had something stolen at some time, for me it was my Battletech novels and my dice, plus the occassional missing crap from eBay.

For BeAfraid's massive collection, my Pokémon binder, and everyone else who's had something stolen...



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 18:18:55


Post by: Da Stormlord


 Sinful Hero wrote:
 Orlanth wrote:

In general the mission here is to generate some sympathy, and as most gamers have had something stolen at some time, for me it was my Battletech novels and my dice, plus the occassional missing crap from eBay.

For BeAfraid's massive collection, my Pokémon binder, and everyone else who's had something stolen...



Lol

I've not actually had anything stolen


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 18:36:47


Post by: KaptinBadrukk


Hey,
I'm sorry you've lost all those minis. Losing 10000 minis is hard to deal with (even though I've never had that happen before).
Your chance of retreiving your minis is near zero, if not at zero. You said your wife sold them to some random guy so she could buy crack. Those minis are long gone. I estimate that the chance of ever retreiving them is 0.00000000000000000000000047%. (yes, that is an uneducated guess).
Perhaps if you had tried to find that guy who your wife sold them to earier-and I mean at least 16 years earlier-like just arfter you lost them-you would hvae had at least a 45% chance of retreiving them (yes, that is also an uneducated guess).
Most likely, you will never get them back. But either way, happy hunting! PM me if neccesarry.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 20:43:27


Post by: oni


I understand what it's like to get nostalgic. I all to often find myself thinking about the MTG cards I owned and wonder where they're at now. I had the power 9, four of every dual land, the list goes on and on... so many cards that now sell for hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars that I had bought in $3.00 booster packs, traded for or purchased for only a few dollars (a fraction of what they sell for now). It's tough thinking about it at times - I too wish I could reclaim things lost. I can sympathize with OP.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/21 20:57:14


Post by: Da Boss


Ah jeez. OP, man, I know I'm clogging up the thread with this, but I hope you get somewhere with this. Massive sympathy for you here.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/22 03:26:16


Post by: BeAfraid


 Orlanth wrote:
We need to read the thread as what it is.

The OP is looking back at his collection, missing it and posted here in order to make himself feel he is doing something.

In general the mission here is to generate some sympathy, and as most gamers have had something stolen at some time, for me it was my Battletech novels and my dice, plus the occassional missing crap from eBay. We know it can get irritating when we reminisce.

With exception of a few dicks the replies here have shown sympathy, and so do I.

The only actual recourse the OP has is to track the Storage Unit sale to see who bought it. You maybe he could then trace who it was sold to and make enquiries there.


I have already tried that, and I need to get a warrant or court order to get them to surrender the information of who usually buys from them (There is a cop in SF, or who was in San Francisco, who I was friends with who told me that the storage company is under investigation for some shady practices, and they are playing really close to the vest).

As for "generating sympathy."

No... Not really... I am hoping to eventually generate some leads which might help track down even ONE miniature.

And the thread has proved useful in providing some ideas for avenues that either did not get fully explore, or which are completely new.

If I eventually discover that my miniatures are in the hands of a gamer who has been taking care of them, or using them to game with, then I will be very happy, even if I never have them returned.

My biggest fear is to discover they have been destroyed, because it would mean the destruction of many one of a kind and/or very rare miniatures.

But I can do without sympathy. I am too old, jaded, and cynical for it at this point.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Sinful Hero wrote:
@BeAfraid

Do you mind if I ask what you intend to do when you find them? Are you wanting to buy them back, just find out where they went, or something else?


Very good question!!!

Pretty much the exact same thing that one might expect with a beloved pet that went missing.

If it was in a good home, with an owner that was loving, and provided a decent life for the pet, then one might well leave things as they are.

The same with my miniatures.

For those that wound up in a decent home, where the owner appreciated and kept care of them (as well as using them), then I would be satisfied with just knowing what became of them.

There are a few pieces and armies which I might seek a way to recover: The Slann, the 1983 Citadel Orcs, Goblins, Dwarves, Giants, and Skeletons. Much of my 6mm Sci-Fi stuff. And the Archive Conversions I created in 1980 that never saw production (Hobgoblin and Goblin conversions to produce figures for an entire army)... And I would seek recovery of the Master Molds for the Citadel Imperial Dragon, and the other molds for lines I own the rights to (although we may have the means to re-create the molds for some of these from existing stock that survived at Reaper from when it used to be Genesis Gaming Products).

But.... Ultimately, I just want to find out that the miniatures were not destroyed, or did not become part of a landfill.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/22 07:06:44


Post by: Schlyne


BeAfraid wrote:
Also in the collection was a library worth about $150,000. It included one of eight copies of Daniel Webster's 16th or 17th Century Manuscript on Hunting Witches. That hasn't turned up either).


OW. If that is what my few minutes of research on google is what I think it is, I hope for your sake that's sitting in somebody's private collection somewhere as well.

I can sympathize to some degree...last summer our idiot upstairs neighbor burned down the entire apartment building...I lost 23 years of books, along with a number of other things, but the books tend to hurt the most, since they had the majority of our biggest irreplaceable items. (Everybody got out okay, everybody's pets go out okay, the building was a total loss).

Other than the Ebay mini you mentioned earlier, have you had any luck recovering anything out of the locker?







A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/23 12:02:32


Post by: zoat


Sorry for your losses! I understand how the minis were not your top priority. More difficult to track the minis now, but if they were sold to someone who actually cares about them it might not matter.

If one was trying to find lost miniatures I guess the first thing to do would be to look for pictures of them. If your reputation was what you claim, maybe you can track down copies of old magazines and such? Maybe ask people you used to work or play with if they have kept magazines or photos? Maybe someone even have minis you painted? Any pictures would be extremely helpful I am sure.

If I was to guess I would say that the minis probably didn't travel too far. Getting your story in a local newspaper might be useful. I'm sure I would remember someone pushing 10k minis even if I wasn't a gamer myself.





A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/24 03:48:21


Post by: BeAfraid


zoat wrote:
Sorry for your losses! I understand how the minis were not your top priority. More difficult to track the minis now, but if they were sold to someone who actually cares about them it might not matter.

If one was trying to find lost miniatures I guess the first thing to do would be to look for pictures of them. If your reputation was what you claim, maybe you can track down copies of old magazines and such? Maybe ask people you used to work or play with if they have kept magazines or photos? Maybe someone even have minis you painted? Any pictures would be extremely helpful I am sure.

If I was to guess I would say that the minis probably didn't travel too far. Getting your story in a local newspaper might be useful. I'm sure I would remember someone pushing 10k minis even if I wasn't a gamer myself.





I didn't even think about trying to go to newspapers.

As for photos.... Very few exist. I know that my Thrudd miniatures that were at the Dalling Road store did show up in a WD around '84/''85.

I might be able to track those down.

But everyone else I painted for had the rather short-sighted habit of only publishing black-and-white catalogs (I am looking at you Ral Partha!), so the work I did was primarily used for convention displays.

As I said previously only the OGRE miniatures photos have survived that I can find.

But the Newspaper idea is a good one.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/24 04:02:19


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


A newspaper might be the logical next choice, especially if you're willing to share your story and talk about the missing rare books as well.

A good reporter mgiht even be able to do some legwork and find leads better than you can.

As for photos if you can remember a rough issue number for the WD someone here might be able to post scans.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/24 04:52:21


Post by: triplegrim


 KaptinBadrukk wrote:
Hey,
Your chance of retreiving your minis is near zero, if not at zero. You said your wife sold them to some random guy so she could buy crack. Those minis are long gone. I estimate that the chance of ever retreiving them is 0.00000000000000000000000047%.


I disagree. If they were not destroyed or thrown away; then they exist in some gamers collection today.

In fact, he says he managed to track down a genie-model from ebay, and that shows that these models were not thrown away, but broken up and is in ownership and not landfills.


As long as it is in the possession of some hobbyist, then it can also be found. Getting pictures from catalogues/magazine and whatever else exists should be the first step to create a "wanted" poster.

16 years is not THAT long in a miniature gamers shelf life. And I mean that.

Make a proper picture based wanted poster and keep posting it once every second month. You might get lucky.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/24 08:13:49


Post by: AnFéasógMór


BeAfraid wrote:
[quote=niv-mizzet 631790 7517196 null. Also in the collection was a library worth about $150,000. It included one of eight copies of Daniel Webster's 16th or 17th Century Manuscript on Hunting Witches. That hasn't turned up either)


I actually feel like this is your best avenue to start searching. I've known many people over the years who dealt in rare books or worked in preservation of rare books. If there's a missing copy of such a rare manuscript floating around, chances are there'd be some interest or rumors buzzing around the rare book market. There are rare book dealers who specialize in tracking down missing books. Finding somebody like that to help track down the book might help you establish the book's trail from your ex-wife to its current owner. From there you could try to branch off the trail to find out when, and how, the models were separated from it.

And yeah, it is a daunting prospect finding them after 16 years, and yeah, it's possible they're gone forever, but the historian in me also has to point out that King Tut's tomb was buried in the sand for over 3000 years before Howard Carter discovered it. After 16 years, there's definitely still some hope.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/24 08:56:45


Post by: BeAfraid


AnFéasógMór wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
[quote=niv-mizzet 631790 7517196 null. Also in the collection was a library worth about $150,000. It included one of eight copies of Daniel Webster's 16th or 17th Century Manuscript on Hunting Witches. That hasn't turned up either)


I actually feel like this is your best avenue to start searching. I've known many people over the years who dealt in rare books or worked in preservation of rare books. If there's a missing copy of such a rare manuscript floating around, chances are there'd be some interest or rumors buzzing around the rare book market. There are rare book dealers who specialize in tracking down missing books. Finding somebody like that to help track down the book might help you establish the book's trail from your ex-wife to its current owner. From there you could try to branch off the trail to find out when, and how, the models were separated from it.

And yeah, it is a daunting prospect finding them after 16 years, and yeah, it's possible they're gone forever, but the historian in me also has to point out that King Tut's tomb was buried in the sand for over 3000 years before Howard Carter discovered it. After 16 years, there's definitely still some hope.


The work turns out to be John Webster.... It had been a while since I looked through my notes about the cataloging of the various items that would stand out.

It was a draft manuscript for On the Displaying of a Witch, but contained copies from the pages of More's and Glanville's Saducismus Triumphantus, and a smattering of the Malleus Mallificarum, and it was dated around 1630 (various portions were dated prior and post that date).

And every auction house in the USA that would accept it has it on file as being a work to look out for.

My losing the book cost me a lot more than just the book. It also cost me the connections I had which allowed me to purchase the book to begin with, as well as dealers refusing to sell other works to me.... Not that I can afford many now, but one refused to sell me a signed copy of a first printing of Edward Gorey's The Vinegar Works (his most famous faux children's books)...

Now.... I have not been able to track down and contact every rare book dealer in the USA, but that might not be such a bad idea, given that Webster's book was not the only thing of significant value to be lost (Signed copies of all of HR Giger's portfolios, and original, one of a kind, artwork of Giger's in one of them - it was just a quick sketch he did for me when I had him sign the books).... So....

Maybe tracking down the rare book dealers in each state might not be such a bad idea, because there are probably no more than a dozen in each state.

And they might be more willing to work with me to contact the source of any of the books than was the storage company in providing any leads (I doubt they would just hand over contact information, but I would bet they would at least contact the source, or seller, and let them know that I was offering a reward for information).

Thanks.... Helpful tips.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/25 12:50:50


Post by: Erzanj


Maybe the Oldhammer community could help? The items you listed are typically the kind of things they're always on the lookout for, and some of them have connections with people who were working in the industry back then.

People like the owners of the "Realms of Chaos 80s" and "Eldritch Epistle" blogs.

Don't know if that helps. In any case, best of luck in your search.



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/26 04:05:11


Post by: BeAfraid


I did not even know that a thing called "Oldhammer" existed.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/27 23:21:43


Post by: david choe


Can you tell us you and your ex age in 1999?

This way, sombody might remember that ....oh a 25 year oldish lady walked into a hobby shop will 10,000 minis for sale cheap back in1999. You would be surprise that a small description can spark a 40 year old man memory.

Her description of 1999 uniqueness might help a lot.

Ignore the negative comment here guy, it cost you 5 mins to type and you have a lottery chance vs. no chance at all.

I hope you get lucky and people in similarly situation have been lucky. Why not you!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/28 10:53:24


Post by: Mymearan


Definitely try the Oldhammer community, they seem like a pretty tight-knit, insular group with the connections and interest to help you. Start with it's "founder" Orlygg of Realms of Chaos 80s. If he writes a blog post about it, it'll get attention in the community.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/29 10:43:02


Post by: BeAfraid


Let's see... I was about 36 in 1999 (but still looked like I was in my 20's), and my wife was in her late 20's.

Something that occurred to me was that I might be able to reproduce the paint jobs on a few of them, either IRL, or using a Photoshop composite, to give people an idea of what to look out for.

Some of the minis I had (the old Ral Partha stuff, particularly) is easy to come by on eBay, or from Ral Partha Europe.

The Citadel stuff, though, would need to be composited from images of the older products. But I do have the software with which to do it.

And, thanks for the tip about the Oldhammer group.

I'll try there.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/29 12:17:04


Post by: Kosake


Good Luck with that, mate. I hope you can rediscover at least some of the loot.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/29 12:27:16


Post by: zedmeister


BeAfraid wrote:
I did not even know that a thing called "Oldhammer" existed.

MB


Here we are bud: http://forum.oldhammer.org.uk/

Chances are that if they have been put up for sale, the lads over here may have come across a piece of two


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/29 18:07:43


Post by: KaptinBadrukk


david choe wrote:
Can you tell us you and your ex age in 1999?

This way, sombody might remember that ....oh a 25 year oldish lady walked into a hobby shop will 10,000 minis for sale cheap back in1999. You would be surprise that a small description can spark a 40 year old man memory.

Her description of 1999 uniqueness might help a lot.

Ignore the negative comment here guy, it cost you 5 mins to type and you have a lottery chance vs. no chance at all.

I hope you get lucky and people in similarly situation have been lucky. Why not you!

hey, that's a great idea. Do it!!!!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 01:11:19


Post by: david choe


Just to add....
When a criminal steel something....the police look for the goods and the criminal. They get both description.

You keep telling us about athe missing items, but not the ex wife. I understand this might be a bad subject to talk about, but If you can give us her name and last name, her description, etc... It would be much eaiser to solve this case.

Tracking your ex is much easier to find than the minis. You find the ex, you get the leads to find the minis.

This is your best path.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 01:31:17


Post by: Swabby


The moral of this story is that even rich people shouldn't get involved with crack whores!

There has got to be more to this story. With the dollar amounts tied to this whole mess we're talking felonies and police involvement.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 04:01:14


Post by: BeAfraid


david choe wrote:
Just to add....
When a criminal steel something....the police look for the goods and the criminal. They get both description.

You keep telling us about athe missing items, but not the ex wife. I understand this might be a bad subject to talk about, but If you can give us her name and last name, her description, etc... It would be much eaiser to solve this case.

Tracking your ex is much easier to find than the minis. You find the ex, you get the leads to find the minis.

This is your best path.


She is dead.

Her name was Candice Carrie (Bailey)

But she was 5'3", and about 110#


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Swabby wrote:
The moral of this story is that even rich people shouldn't get involved with crack whores!

There has got to be more to this story. With the dollar amounts tied to this whole mess we're talking felonies and police involvement.


There was a LOT of police involvement, and they were less than helpful due to my wife disappearing shortly after this happened, when they were more enthusiastic about trying to claim that I killed her (not that the thought didn't cross my mind, but due to the fact I could barely walk, they had a hard time making any sort of case).

It sucks to be in a netherworld where the police don't care.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 07:24:30


Post by: david choe


Ok...
So she stole your stuff.
Then she die soon after your minis went missing.

How long of a time fram from the time she took your minis and her death?

What city she die in?

What city were the minis at before they were stolen?

these are important clues that you need to give us.

Example: July 1999 your minis went missing in Dallas, TX
Your wife die in October 1999 in Houston , Tx.

Chances are your minis were sold around texas area in 1999. Most likely in Dallas or Houston hobby shop might have bought them in 1999

You know what I mean.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 07:39:54


Post by: BeAfraid


david choe wrote:
Ok...
So she stole your stuff.
Then she die soon after your minis went missing.

How long of a time fram from the time she took your minis and her death?

What city she die in?

What city were the minis at before they were stolen?

This are importantly clues that you need to give us.

Example: July 1999 your minis went missing in Dallas, TX
Your wife die in October 1999 in Houston , Tx.

Chances are your minis were sold around texas area in 1999. Most likely in Dallas or Houston hobby shop might have bought them in 1999

You know what I mean.


The original post contains some of that information.

They went missing in May of 1999, when she sold the contents of a storage room that had pretty much the sum total of my existence. This was in San Francisco, as I mentioned in the original post.

She was declared dead in 2005, but had been missing since early/mid-2000 (no body has ever been found, at least not to my knowledge, but I doubt her family would tell me if she was found - alive or dead).

I was in the Hospital for most of that period, so I was not even aware that anything was amiss until around Sept./Oct. or 1999, only a few months before she went missing (which was also the last time. I had contact with her, when her "boyfriend/crack dealer" was arrested, and the police dumped her in the streets). I am simultaneously happy that she suffered and sad that she did, and that she died (but relieved at the same time - she was not a happy person).

I have gotten a few leads that could provide some information (in terms of what to track down, or who to contact).

But so far, only one miniature has turned up.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 07:57:57


Post by: david choe


BeAfraid wrote:
david choe wrote:
Ok...
So she stole your stuff.
Then she die soon after your minis went missing.

How long of a time fram from the time she took your minis and her death?

What city she die in?

What city were the minis at before they were stolen?

This are importantly clues that you need to give us.

Example: July 1999 your minis went missing in Dallas, TX
Your wife die in October 1999 in Houston , Tx.

Chances are your minis were sold around texas area in 1999. Most likely in Dallas or Houston hobby shop might have bought them in 1999

You know what I mean.


The original post contains some of that information.

They went missing in May of 1999, when she sold the contents of a storage room that had pretty much the sum total of my existence. This was in San Francisco, as I mentioned in the original post.

She was declared dead in 2005, but had been missing since early/mid-2000 (no body has ever been found, at least not to my knowledge, but I doubt her family would tell me if she was found - alive or dead).

I was in the Hospital for most of that period, so I was not even aware that anything was amiss until around Sept./Oct. or 1999, only a few months before she went missing (which was also the last time. I had contact with her, when her "boyfriend/crack dealer" was arrested, and the police dumped her in the streets). I am simultaneously happy that she suffered and sad that she did, and that she died (but relieved at the same time - she was not a happy person).

I have gotten a few leads that could provide some information (in terms of what to track down, or who to contact).

But so far, only one miniature has turned up.

MB


Have you contact the storage and the buyer of the auction?
Have you cold call all the hobby shop in SF area and talk about 1999 incident?

Chances were your minis were sold to hobby shop areound 1999 in SF area.

I doubt your ex would sell by eBay because it would take too much effort and time. Same goes for the guy who bought the auctioned storage.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 08:23:55


Post by: Obiken


Sorry about the whole ordeal.

Some ideas for pursuing this with the caveat that I'm from Norway, and my experience with storage lockers are a few episodes of Storage Wars on Discovery Channel...

The storage facility might have records of the buyer if the sale of the locker went through them, or even if she sold it privately.
Police report might contain information about buyer. Have no clue if you in California have any right to see that though.
Buyer is most likely someone who does this as a business, and then resell the various parts of the lot to make a profit. There might be ways to find out who does this. Possibly storage facility might have some list of potential buyers when they are selling out contents of forfeited lockers.
These buyers might take the trouble of sell of miniatures on ebay or such, but a good chance given how niche our hobby is they might have sold it off to someone who knows the market better. This might be game stores and others that sell second hand miniatures.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 13:11:58


Post by: BeAfraid


david choe wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
david choe wrote:
Ok...
So she stole your stuff.
Then she die soon after your minis went missing.

How long of a time fram from the time she took your minis and her death?

What city she die in?

What city were the minis at before they were stolen?

This are importantly clues that you need to give us.

Example: July 1999 your minis went missing in Dallas, TX
Your wife die in October 1999 in Houston , Tx.

Chances are your minis were sold around texas area in 1999. Most likely in Dallas or Houston hobby shop might have bought them in 1999

You know what I mean.


The original post contains some of that information.

They went missing in May of 1999, when she sold the contents of a storage room that had pretty much the sum total of my existence. This was in San Francisco, as I mentioned in the original post.

She was declared dead in 2005, but had been missing since early/mid-2000 (no body has ever been found, at least not to my knowledge, but I doubt her family would tell me if she was found - alive or dead).

I was in the Hospital for most of that period, so I was not even aware that anything was amiss until around Sept./Oct. or 1999, only a few months before she went missing (which was also the last time. I had contact with her, when her "boyfriend/crack dealer" was arrested, and the police dumped her in the streets). I am simultaneously happy that she suffered and sad that she did, and that she died (but relieved at the same time - she was not a happy person).

I have gotten a few leads that could provide some information (in terms of what to track down, or who to contact).

But so far, only one miniature has turned up.

MB


Have you contact the storage and the buyer of the auction?
Have you cold call all the hobby shop in SF area and talk about 1999 incident?

Chances were your minis were sold to hobby shop areound 1999 in SF area.

I doubt your ex would sell by eBay because it would take too much effort and time. Same goes for the guy who bought the auctioned storage.


As was mentioned earlier in the thread, the storage company will not reveal the names of any buyers that work with them without a warrant, and the police were less than helpful with that at the time (they were busy trying to prove that I killed her).

But there is a chance that I might be able to get one at this point, if I can get the SFPD to reopen the case.

And... I am friends with the manager of pretty much the only Hobby Shop in the Bay Area at the time... He said nothing came through them.

There were other items that would be vastly easier to track, which it might stand a better chance of looking for private buyers who could afford such things (I had some 17th century manuscripts from Anglican and Puritan Witch Hunters in the Americas and Britain). The various auction houses that trade in such things would have notified me if one of the items came up for sale.

But someone earlier recommended that I might be able to track down all of the rare book sellers in the Western USA, or many even the entire USA, since there would be at most a few dozen per state who would deal in things like that.

But thanks for the suggestions.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 13:16:42


Post by: Sinful Hero


A lot of these questions being asked could be answered by reading earlier posts. This thread is only 3 pages.
We're people selling a lot of minis on eBay in 1999?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 14:34:43


Post by: Swabby


Ebay was still really young at that point. I doubt ebay was the point of sale.

What else was in the storage shed? What was the most obvious valuable item in it? She sold the whole shed right? Maybe the person who bought it did not even care about the miniatures.

You said it sold for a certain amount, where did that info come from?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 14:41:19


Post by: Hollismason


If you weren't divorced when the Auction sale happened then you've probably got some sort of rights to know the information of it's sale.

You should contact a lawyer they'll explain it better but that whole " You need a warrant to get those records"

That's complete bs.

So yeah, contact a lawyer.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 16:13:53


Post by: Swabby


Who was paying for the storage shed?


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 20:12:11


Post by: mars2024


Sorry about the whole ordeal MB.

One thing that occurred to me and hasn't been mentioned is that if you do create some 2D reproductions in photoshop or IRL, you could try to see what Google Image Search comes up with. I haven't had much luck with that technology, but if someone posted an image on the web and it's a super rare model... anyway, you never know.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/30 21:20:08


Post by: BeAfraid


 Swabby wrote:
Ebay was still really young at that point. I doubt ebay was the point of sale.

What else was in the storage shed? What was the most obvious valuable item in it? She sold the whole shed right? Maybe the person who bought it did not even care about the miniatures.

You said it sold for a certain amount, where did that info come from?


The last time I talked to her, when she confessed to everything, she told me what she got for it.

I do worry that the miniatures were casualties, but at least one turned up on eBay.

But it was one that was among some particularly well-done works that were in a carrying case, and thus would automatically have "seemed" more valuable just because of that.... At least given the perceptions I have seen with people reacting to them.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hollismason wrote:
If you weren't divorced when the Auction sale happened then you've probably got some sort of rights to know the information of it's sale.

You should contact a lawyer they'll explain it better but that whole " You need a warrant to get those records"

That's complete bs.

So yeah, contact a lawyer.


My own suspicion is that their refusal to give out any information unless I obtain a warrant is BS. But without a Lawyer... Or the cops pushing for a warrant, what am I supposed to do.

I tried to get a lawyer in the 01 - 03, but the Statute of Limitations expired on any criminal or civil charges since then.... And I don't exactly have the money to pay a Lawyer who works for fee (as they usually charge about $500 - $2,000 per hour, and want ten hours up front).

This is one of those situations where having money allows a person access to Justice, while those without it are just kind of screwed.

It is so frustrating that sometimes I wake up grinding me teeth with my fists clenched yelling about her, and the stupid morons where the storage unit was who allowed this to occur.

And I feel stupid as hell for not doing more to protect myself the SECOND I discovered she was smoking crack. Having seen what it does to people in the 80's/90's, I was a fool for not just throwing her out into the streets the second I found out... At least in hindsight. When you care about someone, your thinking becomes compromised.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Swabby wrote:
Who was paying for the storage shed?


Technically we both were.

She did have a few things in there as well.

This is a lesson for marrying outside of one's social-economic-status.

The whole relationship was messed-up to begin with, and she was so very obviously a Gold-Digger. Yet I was in a place where I had just had my best friend drop dead in front of me, and a girlfriend commit suicide when I met her.... And she certainly took advantage of my vulnerability...

I still feel like a complete moron for being so taken in.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/31 00:16:40


Post by: Polonius


BeAfraid wrote:


I tried to get a lawyer in the 01 - 03, but the Statute of Limitations expired on any criminal or civil charges since then.... And I don't exactly have the money to pay a Lawyer who works for fee (as they usually charge about $500 - $2,000 per hour, and want ten hours up front).

This is one of those situations where having money allows a person access to Justice, while those without it are just kind of screwed.



No, this isn't one of those situations. You had a really lousy thing happen to you, in one of the worst ways, but how much money you have isn't why you aren't getting "access to justice."

First off, I'm a licensed attorney, but I do not practice law. I am not your lawyer, and nothing here is legal advice, on this, or any other matter. My comments are speculative and meant to apply in general.

Second off: there are several reasons nobody is in any hurry to help you. One is that while in your mind, your property was stolen, the reality is that your wife sold property, at least some of it likely marital property, legally. To even show that theft occurred, you'd have to show that the property in question was yours prior to the marriage, and never intended to become marital property. Two: for such a large and valuable collection, you really seem to have no evidence that you owned it. No pictures, no insurance filings, not even a comprehensive inventory posted online from the time. Three: even if you could show that you owned the property, and that it was not marital property, and that it was in fact stolen... I woudl imaging that the statues of limitations have long since run. What that means is that even if you find out that a hobby store down the block has the entire collection in their basement, and they knew they were buying stolen goods... you can't recover. There is no recourse.

Third: $500-2000 an hour? You can hire a patent attorney for about $250/hr, and general lawyers bill way less than that. I'm guessing you got the crank case pricing, which is where a lawyer knows there isn't a case, but the client wont' really accept that, and so the lawyer tosses out a really high number.



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/31 01:15:13


Post by: Swabby


Beafraid, my own story doesn't even compare, but I had a similar situation, with far less financial involvement, where I lost everything.

I used to be a professional artist myself, working on quite a few commercial products. I was away and my portfolio and about 15 years of work all went up in smoke because my wife at the time decided that she was done with the relationship and wanted out.

That event stunted me so badly that to this day I have not actually drawn a single sketch of anything. The desire just up and died in me.

While the financial value of a loss like yours is staggering, I understand that the emotional destruction caused by an event like this is the real damage. I feel for you dude, probably more than I could possible explain here.

I wish we could make it right man. I'm not sure that we can in the way that you need.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/31 03:35:04


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


Um just a reminder to everyone as we get into true confessions mode do keep in mind this is the internet, and you might want to be a bit more coy about sharing so much personal information.

Cheers.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/31 04:49:52


Post by: BeAfraid


 Polonius wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:


I tried to get a lawyer in the 01 - 03, but the Statute of Limitations expired on any criminal or civil charges since then.... And I don't exactly have the money to pay a Lawyer who works for fee (as they usually charge about $500 - $2,000 per hour, and want ten hours up front).

This is one of those situations where having money allows a person access to Justice, while those without it are just kind of screwed.



No, this isn't one of those situations. You had a really lousy thing happen to you, in one of the worst ways, but how much money you have isn't why you aren't getting "access to justice."

First off, I'm a licensed attorney, but I do not practice law. I am not your lawyer, and nothing here is legal advice, on this, or any other matter. My comments are speculative and meant to apply in general.

Second off: there are several reasons nobody is in any hurry to help you. One is that while in your mind, your property was stolen, the reality is that your wife sold property, at least some of it likely marital property, legally. To even show that theft occurred, you'd have to show that the property in question was yours prior to the marriage, and never intended to become marital property. Two: for such a large and valuable collection, you really seem to have no evidence that you owned it. No pictures, no insurance filings, not even a comprehensive inventory posted online from the time. Three: even if you could show that you owned the property, and that it was not marital property, and that it was in fact stolen... I woudl imaging that the statues of limitations have long since run. What that means is that even if you find out that a hobby store down the block has the entire collection in their basement, and they knew they were buying stolen goods... you can't recover. There is no recourse.

Third: $500-2000 an hour? You can hire a patent attorney for about $250/hr, and general lawyers bill way less than that. I'm guessing you got the crank case pricing, which is where a lawyer knows there isn't a case, but the client wont' really accept that, and so the lawyer tosses out a really high number.



If you read the entire thread (and my last post - re:statues of limitations) you would know that I am no trying to recover the collection, just determine what happened to it, and then MAYBE negotiate for the return (buy back) the few pieces to which I was most attached.

Nearly my entire family are lawyers, so I am very well acquainted with the law surrounding what happened, and how I am pretty screwed by the situation.

But, to even discover what happened to the miniatures requires resources that are beyond me at the moment.

As for pricing, I have had Lawyers on retainer before, and their prices tended to be roughly equivalent to the stated prices.

Plus, searching in California, all of the websites list that price range for pretty much everything, except in cases where they are working on a percentage of a settlement, which this isn't.

I do have some documentation showing ownership of some of the miniatures from the companies from which I purchased the rights.

But that does little good for anything except possibly producing those miniatures again in the future if I could somehow create new molds.

As for their being no photos... Most people don't seem to realize that prior to the advent of the cheap digital camera, people who collected miniatures didn't compulsively take photos of their miniatures.

For one, they were not that valuable until the 00's.

Pretty much everything you have mentioned, I had already mentioned earlier in the thread, so it isn't new information.

As I said.... I am just trying to find out if they wound up in a good home, or if they wound up being destroyed at this point.

MB




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Swabby wrote:
Beafraid, my own story doesn't even compare, but I had a similar situation, with far less financial involvement, where I lost everything.

I used to be a professional artist myself, working on quite a few commercial products. I was away and my portfolio and about 15 years of work all went up in smoke because my wife at the time decided that she was done with the relationship and wanted out.

That event stunted me so badly that to this day I have not actually drawn a single sketch of anything. The desire just up and died in me.

While the financial value of a loss like yours is staggering, I understand that the emotional destruction caused by an event like this is the real damage. I feel for you dude, probably more than I could possible explain here.

I wish we could make it right man. I'm not sure that we can in the way that you need.


I know what you mean.

I will get some photos of the surviving artwork I did in the 1980's/90's that my sister and brother still own.

The head of the design dept. of the school I went to when I was younger compared me to Raphael in my style and ability.

Yet the events with my wife left me devastated, and feeling incomplete (I have been diagnosed with PTSD, partially as a result of that marriage).

The miniatures were just a portion of the portfolio.

In addition to the visual art (miniatures, drawings, paintings, sculpture) was a good deal of audio work from the bands I was in (I was Goth #5 or #6 in Texas in the 1980's, and eventually become the most well known in the state of Texas by 1990, and had a band in London and LA). The production/engineering recordings of the band were in that storage unit, and the rest of the members of the band died of various things between 1990 and 1995 (so I am the only surviving member,and that music is likely forever lost).

But until last year, I had been unable to bring myself to draw or paint anything.

I had painted a few miniatures (some Epic 40K stuff, some generic 6mm Sci-Fi stuff, a 15mm Carthaginian, Roman, and Gallic Army, and some LotR minis) in the period from 2003 to 2006. But it became harder and harder for me to focus, as I kept obsessing over the lost items.

Finally, in the middle of last year, I finally started drawing again when I got the urge to produce some miniatures to complete a line that Tom Meier won't (see the thread "New Goblins (.....)" for some images of the 3D models I have produced, which should be ready to be printed in another few months).

But it takes a monumental effort to even draw a freaking line on a piece of paper.

It feels like the sky is going to fall on me if I draw something.

And as for music.... I no longer have the looks I used to have, which would not fit the style of music I (or "We") played and composed.

She very literally stole my life from me, as everything that proved who I was, and what I had done was in that storage unit.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Um just a reminder to everyone as we get into true confessions mode do keep in mind this is the internet, and you might want to be a bit more coy about sharing so much personal information.

Cheers.


Good point, but so far... Everything that has been written here has been mentioned in much more exhaustive and explicit detail elsewhere.

Plus.... In this case, there is no getting around some of what happened...

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/01/31 15:50:02


Post by: troa


BeAfraid,

Did you try talking to the person who you re-aquired your model from on eBay? That person may have a lead on who they bought, and may be a place to start tracking back depending on how many people remember where they got the model from.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/01 00:53:57


Post by: BeAfraid


 troa wrote:
BeAfraid,

Did you try talking to the person who you re-aquired your model from on eBay? That person may have a lead on who they bought, and may be a place to start tracking back depending on how many people remember where they got the model from.


He got it from a guy at a convention. Have not been able to track backward further than that.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/04 22:58:31


Post by: MagickalMemories


My name is Eric. I go by MagickalMemories pretty much everywhere.
I'm an Admin on Bartertown. You should join there and check our discussion forums. We have a few people who are pretty big into collecting old models (esp. GW.40K). There's a thread there titled "That Mini" (or something). You can ask there. The collectors spend a lot of time in that thread. Someone might be able to offer help or leads.

Eric


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/05 02:24:27


Post by: BeAfraid


 MagickalMemories wrote:
My name is Eric. I go by MagickalMemories pretty much everywhere.
I'm an Admin on Bartertown. You should join there and check our discussion forums. We have a few people who are pretty big into collecting old models (esp. GW.40K). There's a thread there titled "That Mini" (or something). You can ask there. The collectors spend a lot of time in that thread. Someone might be able to offer help or leads.

Eric


Thanks.

This and the Oldhammer forums should help to maybe locate one or two of the most distinctive miniatures ( such as the metal Warlord Titans - the ORIGINAL metal Warlord Titans that were never offered for sale - I had many of them, but only two painted), assuming that the miniatures did not wind up being sold as metal scrap... Which would make me terrifically sad.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/05 02:26:24


Post by: Hückleberry


I hope you find them as well. I hope the person that bought the locker didn't mistake them for a collection of army men or something along those lines and just dispose of them.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/15 06:36:00


Post by: triplegrim


Well, the fact that he backtracked at least one model and found it physically, tells us that they were distributed and broken up as a collection.

Apart from that, maybe hiring a private detective could help? Some of them are not that expencive to hire either.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/15 09:55:36


Post by: frozenwastes


 triplegrim wrote:
Well, the fact that he backtracked at least one model and found it physically, tells us that they were distributed and broken up as a collection.


Exactly. If they were sold for scrap they would have all just been disposed of at once. While it is often a logical error to extrapolate from one instance and make generalizations about it, the existence of one piece of the collection should probably be seen as evidence that at least part of it exists and that it is no longer together. If the search is ever abandoned, I think it would be reasonable to assume that a great many different people are now enjoying the miniatures, perhaps across the country or even the whole world.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/15 20:41:12


Post by: BeAfraid




SECOND MINIATURE JUST RECOVERED



http://www.ebay.com/itm/281578039639?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2650&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Caveats

1) The miniature has been re-based.
2) The miniature has been re-sealed using what looks to be semi-gloss or gloss sealer (I would have NEVER used anything but a matte sealer)
3) The Miniature was among the first I ever painted (in my first couple of dozen, dating to around 1979/80). So the paint job is very sloppy, and not what I would later be capable of, but it does reflect a style that I would carry through to later, better executed examples.

Other Information

1) I will be re-basing him as the original miniatures were based, so that he might serve as an example of what my earlier work looked like
2) There is a SMALL possibility that he came from a small number of miniatures that were left with a friend in a plastic case, but I cannot recall. Wherever he came from, I am pleased to see his return.



MB



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/15 20:57:11


Post by: gunslingerpro


BeAfraid wrote:


SECOND MINIATURE JUST RECOVERED



http://www.ebay.com/itm/281578039639?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2650&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Caveats

1) The miniature has been re-based.
2) The miniature has been re-sealed using what looks to be semi-gloss or gloss sealer (I would have NEVER used anything but a matte sealer)
3) The Miniature was among the first I ever painted (in my first couple of dozen, dating to around 1979/80). So the paint job is very sloppy, and not what I would later be capable of, but it does reflect a style that I would carry through to later, better executed examples.

Other Information

1) I will be re-basing him as the original miniatures were based, so that he might serve as an example of what my earlier work looked like
2) There is a SMALL possibility that he came from a small number of miniatures that were left with a friend in a plastic case, but I cannot recall. Wherever he came from, I am pleased to see his return.



MB



Fantastic news! Hopefully you'll catch a few of yours in one place, but a model at a time ain't bad considering the length of time.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/15 21:40:28


Post by: Tannhauser42


Good news that you found one of them. Looking at the listing, I am amazed you could recognize it as your own paintjob (especially after so many years). I think it is also worth noting that the seller is in California, so it didn't travel very far from home. Maybe the seller can provide you with some more information about where they got it.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 01:38:58


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


Congratulations! I hope the seller can shed some light on where he got it from.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 01:52:22


Post by: frozenwastes


BeAfraid wrote:


SECOND MINIATURE JUST RECOVERED
...
2) There is a SMALL possibility that he came from a small number of miniatures that were left with a friend in a plastic case, but I cannot recall. Wherever he came from, I am pleased to see his return.




Awesome stuff. Hopefully you'll come across another one that you know was in the storage unit so you can at least be sure they weren't melted down and turned into shotgun pellets or something.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 02:05:11


Post by: Raven911


thechosen1 wrote:
OP, why didn't you press charges? If you had acquired all those minis before your marriage, then they are not marital property and thus she had no right to take them.


actually depending on state law, and in most states, it all falls under marital property. He pretty much has zero legal recourse short of the devorce judge telling her to return them. Kind of like you had a house before you got married, then you get divorced and now SHE has the house. It sucks, but that's how it is.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 02:20:22


Post by: jreilly89


OP, I know its not much, but the fact that you have gotten two back is a small glimmer of hope. I am cheering for you, and hope you get back as much as you can!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 03:08:21


Post by: triplegrim


Now it will be interesting to hear what the seller can tell you about where it is from.

My tip would be to not tell him the whole sad story, but just tell him you painted these professionally back then, and would love to track down the entire set.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 03:37:10


Post by: BeAfraid


 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Good news that you found one of them. Looking at the listing, I am amazed you could recognize it as your own paintjob (especially after so many years). I think it is also worth noting that the seller is in California, so it didn't travel very far from home. Maybe the seller can provide you with some more information about where they got it.


We are contacting eBay together.

The seller bought it off eBay about six years ago.

So eBay (Google) will still have the listing on file somewhere.

But from the sounds of things, the previous owner had re-based all of my miniatures on GW plastic bases (which makes me insane, considering how well I had based them).

Of course, since Grendel was one of my earlier miniatures, I may not have completed basing him as I has my later miniatures (those painted after 1985).

As for recognizing it....

The hair and spikes are something that I recall being especially unhappy with, and I kept forever planning to re-paint those parts.

But otherwise.... My painting style is very distinctive, and easily recognized (by me, and a few others who are intimately familiar with it).

If you look at the miniature, you will notice that I do not use a dark primer, and that I do not use hugely contrasting black-lined detail, which is typical of the GW standard painting tutorials.

If I had painted this guy again after 1985, I would have spent more time on a wet-to-dry-brush blending on the flesh, which currently only has a wash and one color drybrush (from when I was young and lazy). It is that single-wash and drybrush that sets off my miniatures, as well as a color pallet that deviates from available paints (I always mixed my own paints at Heritage and Genesis, who were the Industry Standard in paints through the 1980's).

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 triplegrim wrote:
Now it will be interesting to hear what the seller can tell you about where it is from.

My tip would be to not tell him the whole sad story, but just tell him you painted these professionally back then, and would love to track down the entire set.


As I mentioned... I have contacted the seller, and told him most of what happened.

He is willing to help track down the original seller on eBay.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 frozenwastes wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:


SECOND MINIATURE JUST RECOVERED
...
2) There is a SMALL possibility that he came from a small number of miniatures that were left with a friend in a plastic case, but I cannot recall. Wherever he came from, I am pleased to see his return.




Awesome stuff. Hopefully you'll come across another one that you know was in the storage unit so you can at least be sure they weren't melted down and turned into shotgun pellets or something.


There are many that I would instantly know where from the storage (40K miniatures, Epic40K, Historicals, Ral Partha Fantasy Armies, Citadel 1st Edition WHFB Ogres - including THE Ogre, WWII miniatures, as well as the stuff I sculpted myself).

I am hoping that the 2008 reseller will be the person who wound up with the storage unit.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 04:12:36


Post by: frozenwastes


When you talk with them you should never mention the items being stolen or describe their sale as theft. No one who honestly sells things wants to be involved willingly with any talk of stolen goods. If someone approached me about some auction I ran years ago and started talking about stolen goods, I wouldn't reply at all and would forward everything to my lawyer (who would then tell me not to worry because it's been to long and then I'd just not reply at all).


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 04:34:12


Post by: jreilly89


 frozenwastes wrote:
When you talk with them you should never mention the items being stolen or describe their sale as theft. No one who honestly sells things wants to be involved willingly with any talk of stolen goods. If someone approached me about some auction I ran years ago and started talking about stolen goods, I wouldn't reply at all and would forward everything to my lawyer (who would then tell me not to worry because it's been to long and then I'd just not reply at all).


Yep. I would tell them you either sold them or traded them. Telling someone they were stolen usually shuts down people, as they don't want to get involved.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 04:34:41


Post by: Hordini


Glad to hear you found a couple of them. That's pretty amazing, honestly. I wish you luck in finding more!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 12:20:30


Post by: BeAfraid


 frozenwastes wrote:
When you talk with them you should never mention the items being stolen or describe their sale as theft. No one who honestly sells things wants to be involved willingly with any talk of stolen goods. If someone approached me about some auction I ran years ago and started talking about stolen goods, I wouldn't reply at all and would forward everything to my lawyer (who would then tell me not to worry because it's been to long and then I'd just not reply at all).


I know how to go about the discussion.

And eventually, they are going to need to know why this issue is important.

If someone is so paranoid as to think they could be charged for possessing a stolen item, 15 years after it's theft, which has obviously been through at least one other set of hands, then there is nothing that can be done about it.

Not replying (according to eBay's policy on dealing with Stolen Items, regardless of involvement in the theft), though, could result in the shutting down of the eBay account until the person responds to the questions, depending upon the severity of the crime.

MB


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, no one involved with the miniatures past my wife has anything to fear regarding legal prosecution.

I know who stole the miniatures, and she is long dead.

Anyone after the fact would simply be an unwitting participant in the chain of ownership, and technically (unless they were all in one place), I would have to buy back everything that was lost (laws regarding theft in the USA suck if the thief sells your property - you have to buy it back, usually).

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 15:23:45


Post by: Matthew


Wow, that girl was a real Adepta Sororita.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 16:00:28


Post by: frozenwastes


BeAfraid wrote:
Also, no one involved with the miniatures past my wife has anything to fear regarding legal prosecution.


I'm talking entirely pragmatically in terms of what will work for you. And going in with something like "I'm contacting you because I'm trying to recover stolen property" isn't going to work. And marching out any threat of "eBay might shut down your account if you don't cooperate" is also going to be counter productive.

You are looking for people's help. For something that happened a decade an a half ago.

All people are saying is that when you finally do find someone who has some of the miniatures you believe to have once been yours, going in with talk of stolen property might not be the best way to go. And when someone mentions they probably wouldn't reply you trot out the idea of shutting down ebay accounts.

I'm sorry, but don't be adversarial when you're trying to get people's help.

That's all that's being said here.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 16:51:10


Post by: BeAfraid


 frozenwastes wrote:
BeAfraid wrote:
Also, no one involved with the miniatures past my wife has anything to fear regarding legal prosecution.


I'm talking entirely pragmatically in terms of what will work for you. And going in with something like "I'm contacting you because I'm trying to recover stolen property" isn't going to work. And marching out any threat of "eBay might shut down your account if you don't cooperate" is also going to be counter productive.

You are looking for people's help. For something that happened a decade an a half ago.

All people are saying is that when you finally do find someone who has some of the miniatures you believe to have once been yours, going in with talk of stolen property might not be the best way to go. And when someone mentions they probably wouldn't reply you trot out the idea of shutting down ebay accounts.

I'm sorry, but don't be adversarial when you're trying to get people's help.

That's all that's being said here.


I don't do that.

I simply ask them to give me the history of their ownership of the miniature:

• Did you paint that, or did you buy it like that?

• What did it looks like when you bought it?

• Where did you get it? Does the seller have more of them?

Etc....

And, then.... When it comes down to their getting curious, I let them know that depending upon the answer, it could mean an extra $25 - $500, depending upon the outcome.

That usually gets them talking.

And so far, I have not had any problems once they find out what happened.

Most people aren't that paranoid unless they have a guilty conscience of some sort.

MB



A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/16 19:54:16


Post by: triplegrim


It looks rebased to me as well. Is it a coin it stands on? And the white basing doesnt really match the rest of the pain job I'd say.

If it was resealed less profesionally, it could be that it is a collector that ended up with them. Someone who paints, but doesnt do it profesionally, and loves the collecting part of it. I dont think this model travelled through many hands. The 2008 seller could be the original person who ended up the the loot.


Personally I think I would stick with the story that i was the original artist and wanted to track down the rest of them, for a few photos, since the all documentation of your previous work has been lost.
It is all true, as well.

People would perhaps be happy to supply photos of any models they got in the same batch.

Only a little later would I tell that they were part of a large unit that was stolen.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another tip, though it sounds banal, might be to google the names of your rarest models that got lost.

I just googled Grendel Ral Partha, and up popped a picture of the model that you painted in the 20 first pictures on google.

I know my friend managed to find back to a runequest Duck model that he was looking for just by googling an image search.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/17 03:54:14


Post by: BeAfraid


 triplegrim wrote:
It looks rebased to me as well. Is it a coin it stands on? And the white basing doesnt really match the rest of the pain job I'd say.

If it was resealed less profesionally, it could be that it is a collector that ended up with them. Someone who paints, but doesnt do it profesionally, and loves the collecting part of it. I dont think this model travelled through many hands. The 2008 seller could be the original person who ended up the the loot.


Personally I think I would stick with the story that i was the original artist and wanted to track down the rest of them, for a few photos, since the all documentation of your previous work has been lost.
It is all true, as well.

People would perhaps be happy to supply photos of any models they got in the same batch.

Only a little later would I tell that they were part of a large unit that was stolen.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another tip, though it sounds banal, might be to google the names of your rarest models that got lost.

I just googled Grendel Ral Partha, and up popped a picture of the model that you painted in the 20 first pictures on google.

I know my friend managed to find back to a runequest Duck model that he was looking for just by googling an image search.


I regularly try either Googling or searching on eBay for the rarest of the minis.... Little to no luck.

This one turned up simply because I was looking for another troll for my Hithaeglir Goblins, and there it was.

But I typically use the "This is a part of a prior collection I had that was lost in an accident, and I am trying to recover the locations of where they might be for the purposes of recording images" as a precursor to a complete explanation.

So far, though, I have only had 4 total people whom have had any knowledge of the miniatures (or possession of one - and only two of those, this one included).

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/23 20:37:03


Post by: KaptinBadrukk


Congratulations! I've seen you have already recovered 2 minis.
Keep up the work!!!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/23 21:29:03


Post by: Kojiro


Man, as someone who had a whole Ultramarine army and a massive Epic army stolen in 1995, I really hope you get your stuff back. I often wonder what became of my gear, if it's sitting in someone's collection, has been repainted. I'd be stoked to get one or two of them back (hideously painted as they were). Hope you find more.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/24 00:40:47


Post by: BeAfraid


Got my second miniature from my collection in the mail on Saturday.

Having it back is something that is hard to describe,

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/24 00:47:57


Post by: Desubot


Well the bright side of all of this is that now you know it wasn't likely sold off for scrap metal


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/24 01:47:46


Post by: Alpharius


BeAfraid wrote:
Got my second miniature from my collection in the mail on Saturday.

Having it back is something that is hard to describe,

MB


Congratulations!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/24 04:47:04


Post by: Peregrine


 Desubot wrote:
Well the bright side of all of this is that now you know it wasn't likely sold off for scrap metal


At least not immediately. I wouldn't jump to any conclusions here, the original collection was clearly broken up at some point and sold to different people and it's fairly likely that at least some of it ended up thrown in the trash/sold for scrap/etc by someone who didn't know how much the stuff was worth.

BeAfraid wrote:
But from the sounds of things, the previous owner had re-based all of my miniatures on GW plastic bases (which makes me insane, considering how well I had based them).


Just try to keep the right perspective on this: the models are priceless to you, but to someone else they're just models and all of the work you did on them has no value. If I had bought any of them it would have been to paint myself, and I would have thrown them directly into the paint stripper without any thought of how much work the original owner put into them. Same thing with the basing, if the buyer needed them to be on standard GW bases for a GW game or to match the rest of your army then your original basing has to go, no matter how nice it was.


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/24 14:28:57


Post by: BeAfraid


 Desubot wrote:
Well the bright side of all of this is that now you know it wasn't likely sold off for scrap metal


I can't yet rule that out, unfortunately.

I had left two small plastic storage cases of miniatures at a friend's house in 1998.

I don't recall all that was in those cases, but there is a chance this one might have been among them.

So... There is just an increased chance that they did not turn up as scrap.

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/02/25 04:19:15


Post by: Forgemaster Argos


I am very happy that some of your lost items are turning up.

Having had my own life meltdown in 2008 (nothing as severe as your experience but still a huge pain ), I am pulling for the day that you look back and say "Man, I can't believe how far ive come."

On a search note to try and help, have you ever consulted the "Internet Way back Machine " project which I THINK it's affiliated with the Library of Alexandria?

I'm not really sure how well it will work with Ebay, if being a fast moving site with many listings and all, BUT it might be able to help research old classified style ad listings for your lost miniatures in the San Francisco area.

It's been a while since I've used the way back machine, but it might just help with those 2008 listing as well.

Good hunting.

Robb aka Forgemaster Argos


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/03/31 04:14:43


Post by: twinner


any updates? I have been watching this thread. Hopefully you find more!


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/04/10 07:24:18


Post by: BeAfraid


Nothing. Still going through eBay every other day

MB


A Vain hope: In 1999, I had 10,000 miniatures stolen. Looking for any clues as to their whereabouts @ 2015/04/10 22:59:41


Post by: Rippy


BeAfraid wrote:
Nothing. Still going through eBay every other day

MB

Such a shame about all this, at least you have found a couple of them so far!