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I don't paint my models because I don't enjoy painting. I find it boring, slow, and it hurts my neck and upper back. I even got a bar table and a drafting chair with an adjustable height to try to fix that last part, and it helped a bit with the neck and upper back pain, but not much. I've tried putting on music, and putting on TV shows to listen to, and it helped for a few sessions but eventually that wore off. I've tried painting for 45 minutes a day, but eventually I stopped because I'd rather be doing things other than painting.

I will not even try to use lack of time as an excuse for myself, because I don't work and I don't go to school as a result of a medical disability, which gives me pretty much all day to myself.

As for how I got into a tabletop wargame where the models don't come pre-painted, I had previously been playing MageKnight when I stumbled across one of my friends playing 40k with his friends. It looked like fun, so I bought a box of Dire Avengers a few months later with my saved allowance money. When I got the box home and opened it was when I found out that the models didn't come pre-built or pre-painted. And then for the first couple of years, I actually did enjoy painting the models. But that changed at some point.

 Peregrine wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:
As far as im concerned it is finished

So you paint all of your models then?

Nope. I edited my post please read it again

 CrownAxe wrote:
Because i don't care about pretending that my models are actually have a little tiny battle. when they are unpainted it feels like its my models and that im doing something.

And now I'm completely confused here. Painting your models keeps you from thinking that you're doing something and they're your models?

Also, if you don't want to pretend that your models are having a tiny battle then why put so much work into converting them? I can understand how people who just want to play a game would assemble their game pieces as quickly as possible and never bother to paint them, just like they'd punch the cardboard tokens out of their sheet to play a board game. I can't understand how they could be masochistic enough to pick 40k as their game, but I can understand the lack of interest in treating the models as anything other than really expensive game tokens. But I can't understand at all how someone could care enough about their models to invest time and effort into converting them and treating them like works of art, but not care enough to actually finish their models.

 Pouncey wrote:
I don't paint my models because I don't enjoy painting. I find it boring, slow, and it hurts my neck and upper back. I even got a bar table and a drafting chair with an adjustable height to try to fix that last part, and it helped a bit with the neck and upper back pain, but not much. I've tried putting on music, and putting on TV shows to listen to, and it helped for a few sessions but eventually that wore off. I've tried painting for 45 minutes a day, but eventually I stopped because I'd rather be doing things other than painting.

I will not even try to use lack of time as an excuse for myself, because I don't work and I don't go to school as a result of a medical disability, which gives me pretty much all day to myself.

As for how I got into a tabletop wargame where the models don't come pre-painted, I had previously been playing MageKnight when I stumbled across one of my friends playing 40k with his friends. It looked like fun, so I bought a box of Dire Avengers a few months later with my saved allowance money. When I got the box home and opened it was when I found out that the models didn't come pre-built or pre-painted. And then for the first couple of years, I actually did enjoy painting the models. But that changed at some point.

It sounds like you're leaning forwards to bring your eyes closer to the model. You need to get closer by lowering your chair instead.

Many people sit too high, you have to go quite low even with good eye sight. A draftsmans chair is generally not ideal because they're quite tall.

 Peregrine wrote:

 CrownAxe wrote:
Because i don't care about pretending that my models are actually have a little tiny battle. when they are unpainted it feels like its my models and that im doing something.

And now I'm completely confused here. Painting your models keeps you from thinking that you're doing something and they're your models?

Also, if you don't want to pretend that your models are having a tiny battle then why put so much work into converting them? I can understand how people who just want to play a game would assemble their game pieces as quickly as possible and never bother to paint them, just like they'd punch the cardboard tokens out of their sheet to play a board game. I can't understand how they could be masochistic enough to pick 40k as their game, but I can understand the lack of interest in treating the models as anything other than really expensive game tokens. But I can't understand at all how someone could care enough about their models to invest time and effort into converting them and treating them like works of art, but not care enough to actually finish their models.

Do you paint chess pieces? I like the ascetic that using chess pieces feels like which is an abstract form for which I am playing a game. Painting my models just adds more degrees of separation from that.

Also do you paint LEGOs? I like modelling because its fun to do and play with exactly like LEGOs. I'm just putting cool stuff together I'm not looking at making a grand masterpiece.

 CrownAxe wrote:
Do you paint chess pieces? I like the ascetic that using chess pieces feels like which is an abstract form for which I am playing a game. Painting my models just adds more degrees of separation from that

Of course I don't paint chess pieces, but I also don't convert my own custom chess pieces to match the story I've invented about how awesome they are. Nor do I use chess pieces that are intended to be literal representations of "real" soldiers instead of abstract shapes. If I had a chess set made out of 40k characters I'd paint the pieces (even if it's just in a monochrome black and white like they're meant to be sculptures instead of "real" soldiers) because they're no longer just abstract tokens.

Also do you paint LEGOs? I like modelling because its fun to do and play with exactly like LEGOs. I'm just putting cool stuff together I'm not looking at making a grand masterpiece.

No, because LEGOs are temporary things that will probably be torn apart and turned into something else soon. Painting them and treating them as one-time projects to build defeats the whole purpose of buying LEGOs in the first place. If I want to build something I'll get a model kit and then finish it by painting it.

Lol, so you're telling me dboy that if I was playing with your group *shudders* that even if every week I came in with 5-7 newly painted models, showing progression constantly towards getting an army done, you.. players wouldn't allow me to play? Thank goodness. I'm sure many a 40k players get saved by such a grace.

I personally will only field painted models, but I have a very relaxed attitude towards the game. I am ok with pretty much every proxy there is and will often proxy in my own things as well. Thankfuly my gamer group shares this attitude.

I would never field an army of unpainted guys, but I would happily play someone who didnt paint his at all. I am just happy to play the game with people. Only thing I really care about is the person I am playing with. If you are a nice guy I am perfectly fine with you proxying in your Ork Trukk as a landraider.

Now if you only bring top tier play to win lists then thats another story...

I try to get my stuff painted, but I am glacially slow about it. I would probably never get a game if I had to have everything painted. I just get distracted way too easily by other things. I feel less bad about this condition because at my FLGS most players have some (or all) of their armies unpainted. Usually at tournaments I see about 25% of the armies fully painted, but there's usually one or two that have very few, if any, painted miniatures. I don't think this is a good thing by any stretch of the imagination, but even if my stuff was fully painted I would still play with those guys, as most of them are nice people and fun to play with.

On a side note, I usually like to pick up painting tips from the people with fully painted armies. Any bit helps!

Experiment 626 wrote:
In this case, the standard tactic of 'send more slaves' availed me not.

 eskimo wrote:

Why do players play 40k if they don't like painting?
We all bitch and moan about the lack of balance and terrible rules, so why 40k? There are better games out there, but i thought it was the cool models that drew people in?

Because 40k is the game my friends play, and so far they've been disinclined to try anything else.


Also, just going to throw in my hat as someone else who hates painting but likes converting. Go figure.

It's the moment after building/ converting a model where I go "this looks nice, time ruin my vision for it by applying paint"' where I always end up dissatisfied with the outcome. If I pay to get them painted, I'm dissatisfied I didn't do it. I am become barrel of hipocrasy. Also I don't enjoy painting on the whole.

A guy local to me raised what I consider a very valid point recently.
What about players with disabilities, minor or severe?

If a player buys a £75 starter set, the £60 rules and barely has enough physical coordination to assemble the models, never mind paint them (dysgraphia, physical disabilities, some forms of back and neck injury), what are their options if we would only allow painted figures?

Pay a studio.
Find a friend capable of painting for them.
Be refused games.

It's not an unusual scenario. I have friends who physically cannot paint, and if they did, half of you would be wincing or laughing at their efforts.
But they want to play, and they should not have to justify or pay extra to do so.

 Mozzyfuzzy wrote:
It's the moment after building/ converting a model where I go "this looks nice, time ruin my vision for it by applying paint"' where I always end up dissatisfied with the outcome. If I pay to get them painted, I'm dissatisfied I didn't do it. I am become barrel of hipocrasy. Also I don't enjoy painting on the whole.

I'm similar, but a little different.

I can usually stand painting my converted characters. They're unique, so I always know that I don't have to repeat this (which is always nice), and they're also the models I care most about - so I'm willing to actually spend some time on them. I doubt my painting will win any awards, but I can at least get them to a standard I'm happy with:




However, when it comes to larger conversions or squads, I find that my enthusiasm quickly dies away. Hence my converted grotesques still look like this:



Admittedly, in this case, I have another reason for keeping them dark in that it helps hide my horrible green-stuff molding.

 Buttery Commissar wrote:
A guy local to me raised what I consider a very valid point recently.
What about players with disabilities, minor or severe?

If a player buys a £75 starter set, the £60 rules and barely has enough physical coordination to assemble the models, never mind paint them (dysgraphia, physical disabilities, some forms of back and neck injury), what are their options if we would only allow painted figures?

Pay a studio.
Find a friend capable of painting for them.
Be refused games.

It's not an unusual scenario. I have friends who physically cannot paint, and if they did, half of you would be wincing or laughing at their efforts.
But they want to play, and they should not have to justify or pay extra to do so.

That's a whole other thing.

No way i judge anyone if they are unable to- end of.

I don't enjoy painting much at all. I like basing and modelling sometimes- it's the end result i like.
This is why i'd rather play a bad looking army painted by the player than a good looking army painted by someone else (comissioned job).

I think 40k is 50/50 in terms of hobby/gaming.
Plenty of other games out there that are less painty and better ruled.
But each to their own.
So thanks for those who answered my earlier question.

I think, out of my whole collection, I've painted 10 models. This includes my WMH collection.

I just pay someone to paint everything for me. I'm not a big fan of art projects in general, and don't much care for the modeling side of the army. I like the game for the game. If there was a computer game that was 100% true to the tabletop, I would never pull my models out again.

It would have to allow house rules though, the way GW is going.

Experiment 626 wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Having a cat who's into playing with your models the second you turn your back also makes life entertaining. (my poor, poor Skaven army... )

I don't like to laugh at the misfortune of others, but there's something amusing about a cat playing with your skaven.

In this case, the standard tactic of 'send more slaves' availed me not.

You often have interesting stories. You mentioned one of your cats likes to jump on the side of the door and the other imitates and fails at it. I always imagine that one as barely grabbing the top of the doorway and flying through the air doing flips meowing and then splatting on the wall outside. The idea makes me laugh.

I used to paint but then my painting skill got better and I got a lot more colors. It doesn't help when you have OCD with those sorts of things. Either I suffer through bouts of OCD and perfectionist issues and paint imperial guard, skaven and vampire counts (why do I tend to go for horde armies?) or I just leave most of them unpainted and just paint when I can. Chances are at least 97% of my skaven army are still gray (or metal, resin, etc.) and some aren't even put together anymore. I used to love building models but sometimes the thrill of that is gone esp. since I work at a plastic molding company and trim plastic all day. Not to mention if the models are core units of something nobody tends to get excited about anyway (the million and a half guardsmen or ork boy) it just gets tedious. Doesn't help the cadian aesthetic (or at least their armor) looks like in their fiction the cadians came off an assembly line (not just the plastic dudesmen but in the lore too).

Dman, I thought that for once you had actually started a good thread that was not just another joke troll attempt but you have disappointed me.

All three of my Guard platoons are fully painted with only a couple of exceptions and all bar three sections and 4 CCS models are based.
My Skaven... Well that is another story (I am working through them).
That said I do not expect my opponent to play with everything done to competition standard. Some people do not have the time and others lack the inclination. Should they wish t play with greys I will not have too much of a problem, I do prefer to face painted armies but that does not matter when it comes to the game.

Once more Dmn you are showing this asshat elitist attitude which everyone dislikes.

 Buttery Commissar wrote:
A guy local to me raised what I consider a very valid point recently.
What about players with disabilities, minor or severe?

There's always someone who plays the disability card when painting little plastic men is brought up. If you have a legit disability, then fine. No one's going to make fun of or exclude someone with a disability. But the list of disabilities that allow you to sit and assemble tiny pieces but somehow lack the ability to hold a paintbrush is pretty narrow, yes?

So, let's not bring up the 1% or less of gamers who suffer from such maladies in these discussions. Cripes, I know more personal details about some of you than my own family.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Buttery Commissar wrote:
A guy local to me raised what I consider a very valid point recently.
What about players with disabilities, minor or severe?

There's always someone who plays the disability card when painting little plastic men is brought up. If you have a legit disability, then fine. No one's going to make fun of or exclude someone with a disability. But the list of disabilities that allow you to sit and assemble tiny pieces but somehow lack the ability to hold a paintbrush is pretty narrow, yes?

So, let's not bring up the 1% or less of gamers who suffer from such maladies in these discussions. Cripes, I know more personal details about some of you than my own family.

You do know you can have someone assemble your army for you pretty quickly as it doesn't take that much time to glue the models together, painting on the other hand is a much bigger time sink.

Don't forget, paint and brushes is also expensive, which I know is silly in a game as expensive as 40k, but that basic amount of paint can easily be another box of models or an upgrade from a small box to a big box, which is pretty big when you're starting the game.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Buttery Commissar wrote:
A guy local to me raised what I consider a very valid point recently.
What about players with disabilities, minor or severe?

There's always someone who plays the disability card when painting little plastic men is brought up. If you have a legit disability, then fine. No one's going to make fun of or exclude someone with a disability. But the list of disabilities that allow you to sit and assemble tiny pieces but somehow lack the ability to hold a paintbrush is pretty narrow, yes?

So, let's not bring up the 1% or less of gamers who suffer from such maladies in these discussions. Cripes, I know more personal details about some of you than my own family.

We were not sat picking hypothetical issues out if the air.
This was a common enough issue in our town for it to occur to us as a real circumstance.
I just gave common examples of people with hidden disabilities that would struggle to paint.
Having spent a lot of time socialising, travelling and occasionally freelancing with the wider wargaming scene, that "1%" is total bunkum.

Okay, I'll ask again: what physical or mental limitation allows one to assemble little plastic figures but not hold a paintbrush? For that matter, what financial limitation allows one to purchase wargaming models, but not paint and brushes?

 the_Armyman wrote:
Okay, I'll ask again: what physical or mental limitation allows one to assemble little plastic figures but not hold a paintbrush?

Colour-blindness immediately springs to mind.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Dman, I thought that for once you had actually started a good thread that was not just another joke troll attempt but you have disappointed me.

You did?! He picked probably the most flamebait issue on Dakka, one that consistently brings out the same uncompromising views from the same handful of shouty people, and you thought for a moment that he was being sincere?

 the_Armyman wrote:
Okay, I'll ask again: what physical or mental limitation allows one to assemble little plastic figures but not hold a paintbrush? For that matter, what financial limitation allows one to purchase wargaming models, but not paint and brushes?

And I'll tell you again, a person might not be able to do either, but it's significantly easier to get someone to build some models for you than it is to get someone to paint them. Also, anything that causes shaking hands, since you can manage to slot things together with time, but painting is pretty much impossible, unless you are really into abstract postmodernist art.

What financial limitations? There are a ton. If you're trying to build a list, there's literally no benefit to having painted models if you can't buy the whole list, not everyone buys their army in one large lump, a lot of people buy a little at a time, and when they're doing that, spending 25$+ or more on a can of primer, a single brush, and 3 paints is a big difference. Sure you can get a paint set from GW for like 50$ but that's the difference between having the Commander your list needs or not.

Don't forget, it's also an aspect of time, and if you don't believe you'll have enough time to really paint, that financial investment in paint all of a sudden because that much more undesirable. Oh, and yes, I'm sure you'll say something like "But if you don't have time to paint, you don't have time for 40k" and no, that's not the case, because they could have time for one or the other, but not both, and they probably don't want to sacrifice playing the game for painting.

These are my favorite threads >

Paint your minis, hippie.

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:
I don't paint my models because I don't enjoy painting. I find it boring, slow, and it hurts my neck and upper back. I even got a bar table and a drafting chair with an adjustable height to try to fix that last part, and it helped a bit with the neck and upper back pain, but not much. I've tried putting on music, and putting on TV shows to listen to, and it helped for a few sessions but eventually that wore off. I've tried painting for 45 minutes a day, but eventually I stopped because I'd rather be doing things other than painting.

I will not even try to use lack of time as an excuse for myself, because I don't work and I don't go to school as a result of a medical disability, which gives me pretty much all day to myself.

As for how I got into a tabletop wargame where the models don't come pre-painted, I had previously been playing MageKnight when I stumbled across one of my friends playing 40k with his friends. It looked like fun, so I bought a box of Dire Avengers a few months later with my saved allowance money. When I got the box home and opened it was when I found out that the models didn't come pre-built or pre-painted. And then for the first couple of years, I actually did enjoy painting the models. But that changed at some point.

It sounds like you're leaning forwards to bring your eyes closer to the model. You need to get closer by lowering your chair instead.

Many people sit too high, you have to go quite low even with good eye sight. A draftsmans chair is generally not ideal because they're quite tall.

I got a bar table too, as you might've read. Bar tables are quite tall. And my drafting chair has an adjustable height. Combined, I got them to a balancing point between having my face close to the models, and being able to see the parts and paints on my desk without standing up.

 Las wrote:
These are my favorite threads >

Paint your minis, hippie.

That's it! I'm turning my painting and modeling blog into one where I acquire professionally painted models and re-paint them a grey to specifically look like unpainted models!

 Tinkrr wrote:

 Las wrote:
These are my favorite threads >

Paint your minis, hippie.

That's it! I'm turning my painting and modeling blog into one where I acquire professionally painted models and re-paint them a grey to specifically look like unpainted models!

I recommend using a non-GW semi-gloss grey primer spray. But it's not perfect, you'll want to apply some glossy varnish to small areas near part joins to simulate glue stains.

 Pouncey wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:

 Las wrote:
These are my favorite threads >

Paint your minis, hippie.

That's it! I'm turning my painting and modeling blog into one where I acquire professionally painted models and re-paint them a grey to specifically look like unpainted models!

I recommend using a non-GW semi-gloss grey primer spray. But it's not perfect, you'll want to apply some glossy varnish to small areas near part joins to simulate glue stains.

Don't forget to add to add tiny bits of greenstuff to some parts to simulate realistic mold lines!



I could never bring myself to playing with unpainted miniatures. I don't care if it takes years before I get my army ready for its first game, everything will be painted, always.
I do mind if other people don't paint their miniatures too, but not so much as to refuse to play with them. I'll happily play against your gray plastic legion of doom. I am just of the opinion that if you don't paint, you are better off playing video games. The point of a miniatures game is the miniatures, after all.

Dman137 wrote:

 Matthew wrote:
Some people don't have time, some people just don't want to, and some people feel like they're too bad to paint.

everyone has time to paint, it's called being lazy and not wanting to that's the problem

Um, what?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Captain Joystick wrote:
I live in southern Ontario.

The warmest, balmiest part of Canada.

There are two three-month long windows in which the local weather might be friendly to spray-on primers. Which is further complicated if you don't plan on doing it piecemeal in the late hours after work or on the weekend.

No, I don't fault anyone for missing that window or not wanting to risk trying it during the humid, damp, or frosty months.

go to the garage and prime there

[color=cyan]Not everyone can afford/have access to a well ventilated garage with space./color]

 Iron_Captain wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:

 Las wrote:
These are my favorite threads >

Paint your minis, hippie.

That's it! I'm turning my painting and modeling blog into one where I acquire professionally painted models and re-paint them a grey to specifically look like unpainted models!

I recommend using a non-GW semi-gloss grey primer spray. But it's not perfect, you'll want to apply some glossy varnish to small areas near part joins to simulate glue stains.

Don't forget to add to add tiny bits of greenstuff to some parts to simulate realistic mold lines!



I could never bring myself to playing with unpainted miniatures. I don't care if it takes years before I get my army ready for its first game, everything will be painted, always.
I do mind if other people don't paint their miniatures too, but not so much as to refuse to play with them. I'll happily play against your gray plastic legion of doom. I am just of the opinion that if you don't paint, you are better off playing video games. The point of a miniatures game is the miniatures, after all.

Funnily, that's pretty much exactly what I've been doing. : D

I've put in 2 months of playtime on my main character in World of Warcraft alone since the new expansion came out about 14 months ago. With a total of over a year across all of my characters combined since 2007, not counting the ones that got deleted at various points.

That's in addition to the 2,000+ hours I've spent playing Star Trek Online since 2013, as well as hundreds of hours in Planetside 2 and yet more time in various other video games I've tried.

Along with the countless hours I've spent browsing and posting on various forum sites. Tens of thousands of posts in the past decade across a few different websites.