Malifaux Through the Breach - Malifaux RPG Kickstarter - Pics of Minis and Shipping boxes (Pg 52)

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**Forar**

**Gymnogyps**

Update for today.

I'm really concerned about Mack losing touch with reality... This is really disturbing.

Is your campaign art?
6 comments
3 likes

Salutations Everyone!

Mack here with a bit of a designer diary on Through the Breach and the upcoming Penny Dreadful. With principal work on the core books done and them going off to the printer, my heavy lifting is complete. It’s a good time during the design process for the designer. The production team is working hard on hitting the Q1 target, but I get to sit back and look to the future. It’s a time where I get to plan future innovations, and contemplate what the very nature of an RPG published adventure can be.

As you are likely all aware, one of my close friends is a gentleman named Ross Watson. He and I have had some lengthy (and enjoyable) conversations about the nature of art, and whether or not a tabletop campaign qualifies. It blends literature, performance art, and drama. Why can’t it be art? To that end, if it is possible for a campaign to be considered a form of art, why can’t it be high art? Well we think it can. We think that it might already be! So that’s where the Penny Dreadful series comes in. What can we provide to the players that allow them to make their own version of classic literature?

Each game is different. If the players can’t change the course of the adventure then it isn’t an RPG, and we might as well try to write “The Great American Novel” in 2nd person perspective. There is a term in video games called “Disassociation of Authorship.” The audience has agency in the game, and it’s the effect in a video game where the player says “Look what I did.” It means that we, as designers and writers, know that the players aren’t going to take ownership of the art, they are going to make things happen. When you think about it, that’s a powerful tool. If we do our jobs correctly, the players will have a piece of art that they truly cherish. It will move them, excite them, and they will yearn to re-experience it.

In Defense of Innocence is our first Penny Dreadful, and Ross has taken a surgeon’s approach to bringing these concepts to the page. The adventure isn’t a narrative, it’s a snapshot. It’s a look at the town of Innocence during a critical time. As the town prepares to hold an election for mayor the Fated player characters must defend the people from an impending Neverborn attack. The players have multiple roads to travel, and there isn’t one set ending. It’s a fully fleshed out town, with dozens of adventure hooks and a nearly infinite range of possibilities for the Fatemaster.

The adventure also includes running themes and metaphor. We can write combat encounters all day, and there is plenty of fighting to be had, but what about something bigger? In a classical piece of literature the reader is walked through an exploration of a theme. In The Hunchback of Notre Dame, for instance, we are asked to ponder the relationship between Man and Monster, and what makes a person one or the other. In a book, that’s something that the author has a lot of control over. However, in an RPG, we have a powerful tool… the player. What new ways can we explore these themes? The players, as they interact with the town and its inhabitants, are going to explore the nature of “innocence” as a concept. What is its relationship to ignorance? Who is innocent? Is it worth protecting?

It’s a high target to aim at, but it’s not impossible to hit. I’m pretty excited to get the first adventure into your hands. I want us to all make some beautiful art.

**Cyporiean**

Gymnogyps wrote:
Update for today.

I'm really concerned about Mack losing touch with reality... This is really disturbing.

I'm glad I'm not the only one scratching there head at this update.

At least its not Katalyka levels of wtf yet.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
This was in the comments:

Creator Wyrd Miniatures 41 minutes ago

Hi Backers - we want to thank you for your support and continued interest in Through the Breach. We're in the manufacturing window right now, which is why we haven't been able to show you much. We'll be launching a comprehensive update tomorrow though, so in the meantime, please make sure your address is up to date and enjoy the Designer Diaries.

**spiralingcadaver**

I like his sentiment (aspirations to something great) and referenced execution (symbolism in a free-form RPG is something I haven't seen done with much success) but disagree with his argument/expectation that participants will intend to make art (and I'm not sure what he means by drama (as separate from literature or performance art).

Most of the time in my experience, the narrative is up to the game writer and GM (if there is one), and the PCs (and to a degree GM) will mostly be there for an adventure and cool stuff, not making an epic tragedy or something.

**Breotan**

Rulebook PDFs are supposed to be out. I'm worked blocked so I can't verify the links but you should be able to get yours anytime.

**Cyporiean**

Breotan wrote:
Rulebook PDFs are supposed to be out. I'm worked blocked so I can't verify the links but you should be able to get yours anytime.

Downloaded them, but haven't had a chance to look at them yet.

**Forar**

I have to admit, I'm surprised they're releasing them this far (at least a month) before we're likely to have the physical copies in hand, unless that month estimate is far off and they've already begun firing packages into the mail (though I assume that'd be update worthy).

I'd figured they'd hold off until roughly that time (if not a bit later) based on piracy concerns alone.

Oh well, have to head over and pick mine up eventually.

**Forar**

Less than 3 weeks left in the month.

It's not looking good for that "late Q1" release target.

**nix2825**

Forar wrote:
Less than 3 weeks left in the month.

It's not looking good for that "late Q1" release target.

Thats not a surprise for anyone though, right? It seems to be the "norm" for Wyrd lately.

**Forar**

Regarding the delivery time frame, from the Wyrd TtB forums:

"NATHAN CAROLAND

When the books come in from print and the miniatures arrive off the boat. On someone else's schedule now."

I asked for clarification on both points (are the books nearly printed, or just starting the run? Is the boat visible from the US shores now, or did it just leave port to begin its trek, etc) a moment ago, but at least that's a start.

**Alfndrate**

Forar wrote:
Regarding the delivery time frame, from the Wyrd TtB forums:

"NATHAN CAROLAND

When the books come in from print and the miniatures arrive off the boat. On someone else's schedule now."

I asked for clarification on both points (are the books nearly printed, or just starting the run? Is the boat visible from the US shores now, or did it just leave port to begin its trek, etc) a moment ago, but at least that's a start.

*sigh* I don't think I like the passing the buck sort of thing... I get that they can't make the boat move through the water faster, or get through customs quicker, but we're still past one year since the end of the KS. The humorous thing is that if they had gotten us the playtest files as soon as the KS ended and the cash was in their account, we'd have had an extra 6 months of playtest time, which may have kept everything on schedule or we might have a 2013Q4 release instead of a 2014Q2 release... W/e I'll get a package on my doorstep sometime before 2015 at this point, and I'll probably just throw it on the shelf and not bother with it now...

**Buzzsaw**

Cyporiean wrote:
Gymnogyps wrote:
Update for today.

I'm really concerned about Mack losing touch with reality... This is really disturbing.

I'm glad I'm not the only one scratching there head at this update.

At least its not Katalyka levels of wtf yet.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
This was in the comments:

Creator Wyrd Miniatures 41 minutes ago

Hi Backers - we want to thank you for your support and continued interest in Through the Breach. We're in the manufacturing window right now, which is why we haven't been able to show you much. We'll be launching a comprehensive update tomorrow though, so in the meantime, please make sure your address is up to date and enjoy the Designer Diaries.

Did that "comprehensive update" ever actually happen? The most recent update is backers only, so I've no idea what it says. Am I out of the loop, or did the multi-pose kits never get shown?

**Forar**

No. The "comprehensive update" hasn't materialized, and the latest update is just to let people know they can go get their .pdf copies off the site.

I snagged mine, but for anything this long I generally prefer to read a physical copy, so I haven't really plowed into it yet.

Despite my local gaming crew falling out over Malifaux (2.0 was highly contentious for some of us), there remains some interest in playing TtB (good thing, given that we have 2 Gaming Room and 1 Dining Room backer between us), so they're growing a bit antsy as the delays keep showing up.

Edit: Plus, y'know, this being the second longest overdue Kickstarter on my profile...

**Buzzsaw**

I just don't.... what the hey? It's not like Mack is doing the 3D rendering, so what could be the hold-up on the multipose?

That product just seems like it could be such a seller in and of itself: things like the chainsaw and gatling gun aside, a truly customizable kit for fantasy/steampunk PCs (in hard plastic!) seems like a license to print money...

**Breotan**

I didn't see it posted here but I assume everyone knew about this?

Project Update #56: Fated and Fatemaster's Almanac Available for Download!

Hi Backers,

The PDF of the Fated and Fatemaster's Almanac are available for download! Thanks for your support and patience, everyone. We've just sent individual messages with instructions to everyone at the Core Set level and above. Let us know if you didn't receive a message from us!

-The Wyrd Team

**Forar**

Whelp, guess Q1 has come and gone.

Not terribly surprised, but a bit disappointed all the same.

**Alfndrate**

Well, with AdeptiCon coming and going, it's been a year since the announcement of M2E and a year and a half since the TtB kickstarter... anyone else feeling like its gonna be GenCon by the time we see this stuff?

**Forar**

That'd be... problematic.

They've claimed the books are at the printers and the figures are on a boat. It's been that way for nearly a month or so. Customs are a bitch and shipping isn't a small thing, but it taking another 4+ months would mean we've been flat out lied to somewhere along the way. I mean, above and beyond all the questionable gak we've seen to date.

**Siygess**

Urgh, suddenly I'm starting to think that my pessimistic prediction of mid-June shipping isn't so far fetched :(

**Forar**

Hell, might've been outright optimistic.

Which is kind of depressing. KS's have delays, no doubt about it, but for a project that was supposed to be essentially 'done' and wrapped up beta testing back in early January, going 3 months without apparently having even an educated guess as to when they might deliver is rather unsettling.

I'm sure they've got faith that they'll have it by August. They probably don't want to say it aloud, but let's be real, this will be one of or even THE big item they unveil for Gencon.

Not that I'm one for conspiracy theories, but some people have pondered what the odds are that they're just going to wait so they don't anticlimactically pre-empt their own big unveiling. On the official forums someone asked me "what reason would they have to wait before sending backers their stuff?"

Well, that'd be one of them. Wanting to wait to send them off just before Gencon so they can still launch to great fanfare, rather than simply having the books available after the backers have already had them for 4 months.

It's not the strongest of theories, but as the weeks go by, it's not exactly losing strength.

**Ashitaka**

In the latest Chronicles they list the RPG books and materials as 'summer' releases.

**Alfndrate**

Ashitaka wrote:
In the latest Chronicles they list the RPG books and materials as 'summer' releases.

Which, like Forar said, would make TtB the big GenCon reveal but unfortunately we as backers have already paid for a product promised for last September.

At this point it's getting a little ridiculous.

**Forar**

Format?

Alf, your autocorrect, it stings me.

But I'm definitely tired of the silence around what is supposed to be the final act of the project. I simply cannot believe that, if they're really at production, that they don't have anything else to say or show off potentially mere weeks off from delivery.

And if we're months off, they really need to say something.

And if they really don't know, I'm calling shenanigans. It's mutually exclusive with what they've told us so far, and for whatever reluctance they have to speak up because apparently some people get fussy, well silence has people commenting about seeking refunds through their CC/bank (which, even this far out, people have managed across some campaigns), so obviously damage is being done.

I don't know about you, but in a 'damned if I do, damned if I don't' situation, I generally err on the less gak'y side of things where possible, and I don't feel they're acting in good faith these days.

As I feel I've said elsewhere, I'm not an unreasonable man. Hell, an update with some shots of decks and test run sprues would be nice. A "look, the boat is in the middle of the ocean, might be another couple of weeks, possibly a month if US customs are jerks" would be nice. "It's not on our schedule" without any further information or context is bullgak.

**Ashitaka**

This whole experience has soured me on Wyrd. (And my group was positive about the switch to M2E.)

In the mean time they put out M2E and they've been pumping out board and card games, the reaction to which seems to be a big 'meh' from what I can gather.

The lack of updates is disturbing.

Forar - is that DS cake in your sig the one I saw at Meeplemart the other day?

**Catyrpelius**

Ashitaka wrote:
This whole experience has soured me on Wyrd. (And my group was positive about the switch to M2E.)

In the mean time they put out M2E and they've been pumping out board and card games, the reaction to which seems to be a big 'meh' from what I can gather.

The lack of updates is disturbing.

Forar - is that DS cake in your sig the one I saw at Meeplemart the other day?

Kings of Artifice and Evil Baby Orphange were actually pretty good, but on the same note Jetpack Unicorn was horrible.

I've backed alot of Kickstarters... Back in the day I paid a ton of attention to delivery dates and updates and all it really did was make me angry. Now I've taken a step back, don't pay as much attention and be plesently suprised when I get a mystery box in the mail. I'm not saying that a company should be able to treat backers however they choose, I just don't worry about it anymore. I take prior prefermance into account when consider backing new projects. Most likely I won't back another Wyrd Kickstarter.

The best advice I can give to people who want to be active in Kickstarter... Only use money you can afford to loose.

**Forar**

Ashitaka wrote:
Forar - is that DS cake in your sig the one I saw at Meeplemart the other day?

Funny thing, yes it is.

And while being laid back about Kickstarters and viewing them as 'only giving money you can afford to lose' isn't a bad way to go about things, it isn't for everyone, and moreso, I think there are some issues in the whole system/community with stances that reduces creator responsibility.

They've barely said or shown anything in any updates going on 15 months, and the best they can come up with on the supposed verge of delivery is "we're on someone else's timeline"? That's bullgak.

Delivering the pdfs was a good start. Don't get me wrong. We have proof the thing exists. But I and many others prefer to read a couple hundred pages as a physical book, and honestly I just want to get the rest of my backer rewards on ebay at this point, so soured am I on the whole campaign and how Wyrd has treated the backers (and me personally). There was a time when I was really looking forward to having a second Miss Terious (another Death Marshall) and the Hanging Tree (more terrain!) and Hannah (rare! Ooooh!) and Santana (also rare! oooooooh!) and my one of a kind doll. Now I just want to give the doll to a friend and get the rest on its way to recouping some of the significant pile of cash I handed them 15'ish months ago.

Feels like they can't even be bothered to pretend to care...

**Fenrir Kitsune**

Forar wrote:

Feels like they can't even be bothered to pretend to care...

They've got the money, they've people on their forums telling them how great they are, I doubt they really give a toss one way or the other at this point.

**Catyrpelius**

Forar wrote:
Ashitaka wrote:
Forar - is that DS cake in your sig the one I saw at Meeplemart the other day?

Funny thing, yes it is.

And while being laid back about Kickstarters and viewing them as 'only giving money you can afford to lose' isn't a bad way to go about things, it isn't for everyone, and moreso, I think there are some issues in the whole system/community with stances that reduces creator responsibility.

They've barely said or shown anything in any updates going on 15 months, and the best they can come up with on the supposed verge of delivery is "we're on someone else's timeline"? That's bullgak.

Delivering the pdfs was a good start. Don't get me wrong. We have proof the thing exists. But I and many others prefer to read a couple hundred pages as a physical book, and honestly I just want to get the rest of my backer rewards on ebay at this point, so soured am I on the whole campaign and how Wyrd has treated the backers (and me personally). There was a time when I was really looking forward to having a second Miss Terious (another Death Marshall) and the Hanging Tree (more terrain!) and Hannah (rare! Ooooh!) and Santana (also rare! oooooooh!) and my one of a kind doll. Now I just want to give the doll to a friend and get the rest on its way to recouping some of the significant pile of cash I handed them 15'ish months ago.

Feels like they can't even be bothered to pretend to care...

I don't disagree that the company should be held responsible, at this point I'll probably never back another Wyrd Kickstarter ever again. They've handeled the two Kickstarters I've backed them with pretty poorly, for the life of me I really can't figure out why no one at Wyrd will take the hour or two too sit down and write a proper update. There isn't a whole lot I can do too change the way their handeling this project right now so I'm simply not going to let it bother me. I will however make my displeasure known in the future by not supporting their projects.

Maybe I'm jaded, I got to play the RPG at Gencon last year with Mack in their Cannon Campaign. So all along I've known that the game actually exsists and that I enjoy it, I actually think they've done quite a number of inovative things with this RPG.

Wyrd isn't going to ruin their reputation by not delivering on their Kickstarter. It might take alot longer then you'd expect or like but they will eventually delivere as promissed.

**Forar**

Oh, I'm sure they'll deliver, but having communications go from "bad" to "terrible" in what should be the final lap is kind of becoming my final straw.

I don't think I even really gave the campaign a second thought until they flew past the September deadline with barely recognition of the matter, beyond starting up the open beta around that time. Even while annoyed, I think I've been pretty laid back about the 6 months they tacked onto the target.

Approaching 7 months late, with no deadline, no communication, and snark when asked for a heads up? Yeah, no. I was pondering snagging the arsenal deck for my faction and maybe even the M2E rule book, just to try things out and see where they settled down after the beta finished, but now? Definitely not.

**Catyrpelius**

Forar wrote:
Oh, I'm sure they'll deliver, but having communications go from "bad" to "terrible" in what should be the final lap is kind of becoming my final straw.

I don't think I even really gave the campaign a second thought until they flew past the September deadline with barely recognition of the matter, beyond starting up the open beta around that time. Even while annoyed, I think I've been pretty laid back about the 6 months they tacked onto the target.

Approaching 7 months late, with no deadline, no communication, and snark when asked for a heads up? Yeah, no. I was pondering snagging the arsenal deck for my faction and maybe even the M2E rule book, just to try things out and see where they settled down after the beta finished, but now? Definitely not.

I think it's all part of them trying to encourage people to go to their forums... But it's having the opposite effect and just pissing people off.