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The Bell of Lost Souls, probably the best blog out there (I want his pre-Heresy Death Guard army!), has posted loads more datasheets. Everything from Tau vehicles, Eldar Titans, Tyranid Bio-Constructs, right through to the mighty Warlord Titan!!

http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/

BYE

Is Apocalypse the coolest GW release ever???

I think it will be. I am already drooling about the possibilities for super heavy T.W.A.R. additions I can build

Well, considering I take the 'cool' aspect as a given, I'm now mostly concerned about the actual rules. In my opinion most of the Tyranid stuff is completely imbalanced (read: broken) especially when compared to other races' stuff. Tyranids get what, deep striking Carnifexes with free cover saves, Raveners that assault the same turn they deep strike, Hierodules that shoots 12 times S10 and the Hierophant that shoots 16 times S10. What's worse, Tyranid synapse creatures are apparently immune to instant death from strength D weapons. When a Revenant Titan can't kill a 113pt Dakkafex in one volley (but can kill a couple squads of Space Marines, or a Baneblade) and in turn gets annihilated in one volley from a Barbed Hierodule, something is wrong.


Well you certainly couldn't have picked a cheesier rules set for your gundams.

Posted By Therion on 09/11/2007 2:42 AM

Well you certainly couldn't have picked a cheesier rules set for your gundams.

That's right Migs, you cheesy git 

Though I'm with Therion on Nids getting more broken crap.  Friend of mine has a trygon, and we've played it a few times so far.  Assault after strike is nasty and unless you really really prepare for it, pretty much ends the game.  Doesn't help that he sends 30 hormagaunts through the tunnel after it ... (FW rules clearly)

And if synapse keeps TMC from dying to D, then what the hell's the point of "D as in Destroyer (of Everything. Ever)" weapons?  You can obliterate Abaddon in one hit, trash any vehicle smaller than a mountain and frag terminators like there's no tomorrow, but you can only tap 1 wound from a fex inside synapse?

:|

All the same, I like what I see in the APOC sheets for the most part.  Points seem low for the titans and things, but clearly 2500 for the warlord's 9 structures X void shields and pyschotic guns has been exhaustively playtested and balanced

- Salvage

That warlord titan is just insane. I mean, look at the size comparison. How can you play a game with something that big? I guess you can play on the floor like some folks do but that ain't for me. I'd step on half my army.

I like the Tyrgon datafax.. if there was one FW big bug I would ever get it would be that one just for looks. And his head would also be the easiest to Alienify

What is T.W.A.R.?

The Dropping Carnifex data sheet would have been mean even without the 5+ Cover save after dropping.

But I think we cannot judge Apocalypse in the ordinary "quasi-competitive" or "competitive" way. Apocalypse is for fun.
Everything else is just stupid, because balancing things like the Force Org Chart are dismissed. Games like:" HAHA, I brought 15 Falcons and you don't!" or "HAHA I have 20 TMCs and you don't!" won't be much fun for anyone, i guess.

Therefore I have some problems seeing Apocalypse as the great breakthrough ruleset, I mean you could have take a Tank company before if you agreed with you opponent. Same with Vehicle design rules. I'm irritated that many people think Apocalypse will be balanced and "finally" makes big monsters/tanks or wacky squadrons available for the game. You just had to agree before...

Greets
Schepp himself

does anyone know if NECRONS get ANYTHING new? I mean every other race is getting tons of insane stuff, but nothing in the Necron list can fight those super titans. Do they really have nothing coming out than can fight back?

PYLON, Monolith Phalanx ... Probably something else?

But the pylon will be their big gun. Deep strikes, probably 10" template S D would be appropriate I'd think. I forget what the actual FW rules are for it.

- Salvage

EDIT - Found the FW rules, and they're kinda neat.  To keep it vague, basically an immobile monolith with 2 structure points, no teleporter but with flux arc and massive whip.  12-120" range, anti-aircraft, titan killer.  I'd think the blast goes to 10" and the strength / AP goes up from S9 / AP3 in the FW rules.

It's basically like old 40k and WM/Hordes. Balance through imbalance. IF there are so many powerful things available,few units will overpower.

And it is aimed more at people that will bring and plan these things out. You might tell your friends you are brining the Abbadon cloe army, and they will come up with things to counter it,.. it's more for the fun and challenge of the play. To set up scenarios and go at it. Balance is created by those who play it, not necessarily by the rules.

That sounds pretty sweet. What does the model look like, the pylons in DoW?

Do Sisters get anything fun, or are they left to pick the scraps of the IG's feast?

Am I reading the terror right under the Hive Mind Brood. I'm all for big crazy nastiness, but a 72" area of effect pin check just seems a few steps over the top (hugely over the top when combined with choir). I guess it's on par with the 10 raveners and trygon assaulting on the turn they deepstrike in, same page!

If anyone out there has seen the Apocalypse book (Reecius?), is there anything in there regarding immobile units and VPs?

Because with the supplement including points-heavy immobile units like the Necron Pylon I would figure they'd have to do something about immobile units automatically giving up 1/2 of their points. . .perhaps written into the unit datasheets themselves?

Any information?

More pics here.  85 GBP of love.

- Salvage

I like what I see so far, but like Scheep himself said, you cannot look at Apocalypse through competitive eyes. Form what I have been gathering, it's all about the crazy wacky games that are just for fun, not competition. If the idea behind no force organization is true, I was thinking about taking 10 Chaos Lords in terminator armor. The 10 Lords of Chaos stride through the deserted ruble strewn streets...sort of thing, some thing absolutely crazy!

I like the Tyranid drop datasheet, and it's not because I am a zilla player (which is the only army I have just about fully completed) it just makes sense! I like it when game systems match their fluff, which I feel PP does so well with WM/Hordes. It makes sense to me that for the round they enter play they have a chance for some cover saves, because you know that they are gonna be shot to crap the turn they enter play, especially if someone is fielding tanks and planes.

Anyway, I am excited for October! I cannot wait for this expansion to hit store shelves and yes I am totally tempted to buy 3 baneblades and get the armored company box for a 3000+ point game!

Thanks,
Chappy P!

In Apocalypse there are no Victory Points. You win by claiming objectives so I doubt they'll address the issue Yak. Hopefully they'll address it before I start a DKoK army.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

nice stuff.....however we need ork pics!

How can you people read these? What are you all eagles or something? Do you eyes have glare filters?


Can i get a plain text translation of the warlord titan ?

Posted By ShumaGorath on 09/11/2007 8:13 PM
How can you people read these? What are you all eagles or something? Do you eyes have glare filters?


Can i get a plain text translation of the warlord titan ?

I just eat my carrots every day.

As for the issues of balance, the ultimate balance is still in the game.  You choose who you're going to play with.  Apocalypse isn't intended for random pickup games with strangers, it's intended for games with your friends.  Play with people who play the way you like to play, and don't play with people who play the way you don't like to play.  Some groups are going to play with uber cheese armies, some are going to play with underpowered but extremely characterful armies.  This is not a tournament ruleset so there's no excuse not to enjoy playing this game. 

Strength D v. ID - causes d3 Wounds.

Terror - looks to me like 12", plus 12" if the Tyrant is still alive. 72" would be silly, even for Apocalypse.

Necrons v. Titans - forget the Gauss rule? Your basic Necron Warrior unit is one of the best things in the game for taking down Titans, if they get close enough.

Posted By IJW on 09/12/2007 10:43 AM

Necrons v. Titans - forget the Gauss rule? Your basic Necron Warrior unit is one of the best things in the game for taking down Titans, if they get close enough.

Also note that most titans can't shoot within 12" of themselves, so port on over and rapid fire ftw.  Or get stepped on next turn (something like automatic 1 hit per model, S6 no saves)

- Salvage

So things immune to instant death, D weapons cause d3 wounds on? Can you take inv saves? How do D weapons work vs vehicles?

The Warlord can't shoot it's carapace weapons within 24"!

D weapons auto-penetrate anything with an AV, and I think they may take off additional Structure Points on top of that. No wound rolls, no cover saves (on the grounds that the cover isn't there anymore), no armour saves, but I believe that you do get invulnerable saves.

Yeah I know the gauss rule is really good, but having a giant titan or Carnifex horde or baneblade seems a bit cooler than glancing on a 6.

not that i remember but Ozy said it, you dont use VP's so it is a moot point.

and i heard some more stuff yesterday while playing at the store, and this is with a pinch of salt because i didnt see the book, this was just told to me,

but apprently you can put MC's in super heavy transports. I personally find this hard to believe, but i was told they take up 10 spaces in a transport. In the example i was given, you could put a bunch of carnies in a Gorgon or an Ork baneblade.

Again, i dont know if that is true, and i part of me hopes it isnt, but hey, its a rumor.

also, my friend said he saw some more Ork models and he said "they were so awesome i almost pee'd my pants."

he said the Trukks are huge, which is cool for modeling but sucks for game play. and he said the other models look awesome and also, that Ghazkull's Prophet of the WAGGHHH ability works on all units within 6" and that he can do it EVERY turn! So that means you can get a unit of mega armored nobs moving at a decent clip if they are with Ghaz.

Yeah I know the gauss rule is really good, but having a giant titan or Carnifex horde or baneblade seems a bit cooler than glancing on a 6.

'Cool' is a totally different thing than 'but nothing in the Necron list can fight those super titans'.
Anyway, haven't you seen the Monolith Phalanx? Improved WBB, reduced Strength enemy shooting and a Psyker no-go zone sounds pretty vicious/cool to me...

Posted By Reecius on 09/12/2007 4:47 PM

but apprently you can put MC's in super heavy transports. I personally find this hard to believe, but i was told they take up 10 spaces in a transport. In the example i was given, you could put a bunch of carnies in a Gorgon or an Ork baneblade.

I hope that's true if only so that I can put a bunch of orks on a big squiggoth, which as a MC can be put transported in a looted Gorgon.  It's the  turducken of the 40K universe.

a Squigoth is a gargantuan creature, not an MC, so that rule would not apply i would think, but i dont know.

Posted By Reecius on 09/13/2007 9:31 AM
a Squigoth is a gargantuan creature, not an MC, so that rule would not apply i would think, but i dont know.

I haven't seen the squiggoth rules in Apocalypse but the Forgeworld rules I have, which might have been updated, have the "big" squiggoth as a MC with space to transport 10, and the "gargantuan" squiggoth as a gargantuan creature.  Not that it really matters.  I was just being facecious as I don't own any squiggoths or super heavies.  Just an interesting loophole, again if the rumor is true.

Posted By Jay of Moore on 09/12/2007 6:31 PM
 It's the  turducken of the 40K universe.

That's one reference I never thought I would see on Dakka.