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2008/03/17 01:53:24
Subject: Topic Update
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This is an automated message added by the articles system. A new article titled Hivefleet yakface has been added to the dakka articles system. This message thread is for the discussion of content in the article. Any updates to the article will be automatically added to this thread and (if you are logged in), you can get automatic email updates as and when the article changes by clicking 'Email me when this thread changes' below. If you are the author or have added a lot to the article then it is a good idea to do this to ensure that you maintain control over the content of the article. If you have anything to add to the article, then just jump in and edit it by going to the actual article page and clicking 'edit' (the link can be found just above the article). If there is no edit link then the article is locked for now, so just add your comments or content to this thread and if they are appropriate and the article owner checks this thread, they should get merged in. If there is something in the article that you wish to debate, then this is the place to do it. Just hit the reply button and get chatting. You need to be registered and logged in to post in the forums so if you are an anonymous article editor then now would be a great time to register and join in dakka's great forum discussion!
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2008/08/25 21:03:39
Subject: Re:Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Good work and good luck on getting more done!
Question: have you found with 5th ed cover saves that your stealers do not need carapace, or are they in the open too often or else the save is needed in CC?
Looking at your list, I thought that dropping the carapace and running another small brood of spinegaunts Without Number (to come back and cap objectives) would work fairly well.
Let me know what you think.
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2008/08/25 21:50:40
Subject: Re:Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club
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doak22 wrote:Good work and good luck on getting more done!
Question: have you found with 5th ed cover saves that your stealers do not need carapace, or are they in the open too often or else the save is needed in CC?
Looking at your list, I thought that dropping the carapace and running another small brood of spinegaunts Without Number (to come back and cap objectives) would work fairly well.
Let me know what you think.
In my few v5 games that I've played with Tyranids I've definitely found that Extended Carapace is worthwhile for two big reasons:
1) When you get into combat the enemy piles in to your unit meaning that you invariably end up taking more hits back from the enemy which can then be saved by EC. Also the fact that rending is less effective also means the enemy will tend to get more attacks back at your Stealers in combat.
2) Since you can no longer consolidate into combat, you find that after a successful assault your stealers are left standing out in the open ready to face whole units of bolters ready to gun you down. EC again is worth its weight in gold in allowing your unit to survive such situations.
So while it's true that you don't need EC as much when crossing the table because Gaunts and/or terrain can be used to give you a 4+ save, once you get into combat (and beyond) the EC is still quite useful.
And yes, I need to get another unit of Gaunts painted (among many other things).
Thanks for the comments.
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2008/08/25 22:00:57
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[MOD]
Madrak Ironhide
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Were you the anonymous guy editing your article, yak?
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2008/08/25 22:59:13
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club
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Nope.
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2008/08/26 01:54:00
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Nasty Nob
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Hey Yakface - for 1850 - what is your idea of a competitive Stealer Shock list?
Im new to bugs
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A man's character is his fate.
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2008/08/26 09:35:25
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club
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kaiservonhugal wrote:Hey Yakface - for 1850 - what is your idea of a competitive Stealer Shock list?
Im new to bugs
The 1,850 list I'm building towards looks something like this:
HQ
Hive Tyrant /w 2 x TL Devourers, enhanced senses, implant attack, toxic miasma, toxin sacs, wings, warp field - 214 points
ELITES
Lictor - 80 points
3 x Warriors /w scything talons, rending claws, extended carapace - 81 points
TROOPS
8 x Genestealers /w extended carapace, scuttlers - 184 points
8 x Genestealers /w extended carapace, scuttlers - 184 points
8 x Genestealers /w extended carapace, scuttlers - 184 points
8 x Genestealers /w extended carapace, scuttlers - 184 points
10 x Gaunts /w spinefists, scuttlers & without number - 100 points
10 x Gaunts /w spinefists, scuttlers & without number - 100 points
FAST ATTACK
2 x Raveners /w rending claws, scything talons - 80 points
HEAVY SUPPORT
Carnifex / barbed strangler, venom cannon, enhanced senses, reinforced chitin - 163 points
Carnifex / barbed strangler, venom cannon, enhanced senses, reinforced chitin - 163 points
2 x Zoanthropes /w warp blast, synapse - 130 points
TOTAL: 1,847 POINTS
I think if I was building the army from scratch for 5th edition I'd definitely consider leaving the Raveners and Warriors out, but everything else I'm pretty happy with after my first few games in 5th edition.
I've found that having Scuttlers on all your Stealers/Gaunts really gives you some interesting tactical options when fighting different types of armies. If you know you're going first, you use the scout rule and get the serious jump on your enemy. If you're going second you put all those units into outflanking positions and mess with your opponent's mind.
The list also gives you the option (if you're going 2nd) to Deep strike both the Raveners and the Tyrant for interesting possibilities. Normally I'd never Deep Strike the Raveners, but when you know you're going 2nd and if they're going to get shot anyway Deep Striking them into a fairly concealed position along with the Tyrant can be a thorn in your opponent's side later in the game.
The Lictor is great because not only does he mess with your opponent's mind and help you make your outflank reserve rolls when you need 'em, but his feeder tendrils work great with both the Stealers and the Gaunts and save you the points buying tendrils for your Stealers instead (those points go towards the scuttling ability instead).
The Zoanthropes just give you a bit of tactical flexibility and provide more Synapse for the Gaunts.
The Warriors are the unit that most doesn't synergize with the rest of the army and honestly the only reason I'm taking them is because I already painted two of the models (and I like the look of the models too). I think warriors with Deathspitters might be a better option at this point and I may consider ripping their arms off at some point to do so.
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2008/08/26 16:54:48
Subject: Re:Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Hi again, Yakface. You're welcome for the C&C!
Reading your 1850 list and comments, my immediate reaction was to add a Broodlord. His feeder tendrils and infiltrating fit your style perfectly. On second thought, playing him with a retinue would be bad for your list, taking away the speed and versatility on one of your Stealer units. But what about playing him alone? Could be interesting.
You are definitely right about changing the warriors to deathspitters. They are worth their weight in gold. Give them each twin-linked DSpit and ExCara, that's it. Put in one with a BStrangler, TSacs and ExCara and ScyTal. A squad of 6 costs only 204 points. And no one I play with is calling cheese, because the bugs still go squish out of cover!
Question about the Carnifexes: Given that the VCannon is a bit less reliable now, with increased tank durability and cover saves (my regular opponent's Kustom Force Field, grrrr), what do you think about running an elite strangler fex? It saves a ton of points and can still put the hurt on light tanks if it needs to.
Overall, props for running a balanced and fun list. I think most opponents will respect and admire your choices.
Happy gaming!
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2008/08/26 17:52:00
Subject: Re:Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club
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doak22 wrote:Hi again, Yakface. You're welcome for the C&C!
Reading your 1850 list and comments, my immediate reaction was to add a Broodlord. His feeder tendrils and infiltrating fit your style perfectly. On second thought, playing him with a retinue would be bad for your list, taking away the speed and versatility on one of your Stealer units. But what about playing him alone? Could be interesting.
Sadly, you can't take the Broodlord on his own.
After playing a few games with Warriors, I've found that even with the ability to run units without Fleet are extremely vulnerable to being shot to death by short-ranged rapid fire weapons before they can charge. Basically, you can't get within the magic charge range without soaking one round of fire from the unit you want to charge unless your opponent makes a mistake or another unit has already locked them in combat.
That makes me extremely wary to field a Broodlord. I think I'd rather save my points for other units instead.
You are definitely right about changing the warriors to deathspitters. They are worth their weight in gold. Give them each twin-linked DSpit and ExCara, that's it. Put in one with a BStrangler, TSacs and ExCara and ScyTal. A squad of 6 costs only 204 points. And no one I play with is calling cheese, because the bugs still go squish out of cover!
I don't think I'd ever take twin-linked Deathspitters mainly because I'd never want to try to model that up! 204 points is too much to spend for this army on an anti-infantry unit IMHO. I'd stick with something really cheap and small like a 3 man unit w/ Deathspitters just as a minor distraction/Synapse unit.
Question about the Carnifexes: Given that the VCannon is a bit less reliable now, with increased tank durability and cover saves (my regular opponent's Kustom Force Field, grrrr), what do you think about running an elite strangler fex? It saves a ton of points and can still put the hurt on light tanks if it needs to.
Overall, props for running a balanced and fun list. I think most opponents will respect and admire your choices.
Happy gaming!
With the nerf to rending it is those heavy vehicles that will really ruin your day if you don't stop 'em and I still think the Venom Cannon is key to shaking/stunning those types of vehicles so that they don't shoot your army to death as you try to get to grips with the enemy.
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2008/08/26 18:33:02
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Oh man. Newb error on the Broodlord. And I agree with your analysis of Fleet.
As for modelling the TL-Dspitters, I took a simple route. Instead of putting together two guns, I have one arm as the gun and the other is the barbed strangler ammo arm. Green stuff an ammo feed/tube between the arms, and yer done. Really, it makes sense...TL-Blast is re-roll the scatter again, so it's like one gun with a quick and plentiful ammo supply. Also, it turns out looking different enough from a regular DSpit warrior (only has the two arms, I put the ExCar where the bottom holes are), that no one I've encountered yet has complained about WYSIWYG.
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2009/01/28 12:36:09
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Courageous Skink Brave
The Heart of the Eye of Terror (aka Blackpool)
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Love the army Yak, and I'm seriously considering starting 'nids once I've got the bulk of my Daemons finished off, and I'd just like to ask a question about your Carnifexes.
As you say in the article they're there for anti-tank purposes, but the venom cannon can only glace most vehicles. How does the army fare against mech armies, have you considered changing anything to deal with high volumes of armour?
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Greenbynog:
"To stray down the murky path of analogy, if I stuck a mustache on a banana, it's a special kind of banana, but a banana none the less. Yep, I think that made it loads clearer."
Minmax:
"Average GW mouthbreather statline:
WS 1; BS 2; S 2; T 4; W 1; I 1; A 1; Ld 5; Sv -
Special Rules: Mob Rule, Consume Snacks, Whine." |
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2009/01/28 17:29:41
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
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Love the army and your painting is GREAT!
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2009/01/29 06:53:54
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club
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Sok wrote:Love the army Yak, and I'm seriously considering starting 'nids once I've got the bulk of my Daemons finished off, and I'd just like to ask a question about your Carnifexes.
As you say in the article they're there for anti-tank purposes, but the venom cannon can only glace most vehicles. How does the army fare against mech armies, have you considered changing anything to deal with high volumes of armour?
while the Venom Cannon has certainly taken a major hit in 5th edition, the fact is that Tyranids just don't have any other long-ranged AT firepower. The Barbed Strangler is okay but Strength 8 just isn't going to cut it against things like Land Raiders and will even struggle to get a glancing hit against AV13 vehicles (which there are plenty of throughout the game).
so while your Venom Cannons aren't going to be taking out any (non-open topped) vehicles what they will be doing is shaking, stunning and immobilizing them. This accomplishes the all important goal of preventing the enemy vehicles from shooting at the rest of your bugs while they approach and stops them from moving out of the way when you need to get into CC with them.
As such, Gunfexes are still very much a part of my army concept in 5th edition as once you go without them you really leave yourself to the mercy of certain types of armies.
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2009/02/07 12:40:17
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control
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Cheers for saying why we use venom cannons as i have a Tyranid army and never saw the point in having them.
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2009/10/05 21:18:22
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Defending Guardian Defender
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Just found the army profiles section and your bugs. Really nice lookin'.
Well done.
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2010/01/29 08:18:05
Subject: Re:Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Slippery Scout Biker
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Yak i have a very weird question to ask you and am also asking for help
my question is dose this army list attached sound like a good army
and can you help me with some conversion i deas (i have the winged hive tyrant in my folder) i just need some other ideas now 5th edition has come out because i want to make my army look cooler the only thing i have made look diffrent is my hive tyrant i have given it the carnifix enhansed senses head and spore cyst back part to act as Armor shell now that is the only save wpgrade out for the Hive Tyrant
if you get any ideas people can you PM me please
Filename |
LEAGUE.doc |
Download
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Description |
the list of splinter fleet leviathan 3 |
File size |
20 Kbytes
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2010/04/21 17:31:05
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Huge Hierodule
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Just wanted to say I really like your paint job, both in terms of your choice of colours and your ability as a painter. Oh, and I can't help but read your posts in Sean Connory's voice!
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2010/04/22 02:42:22
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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You need a BFG fleet to match!
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http://www.teun135miniaturewargaming.blogspot.com/ https://www.instagram.com/teun135/
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2011/09/07 01:28:50
Subject: Article Discussion: Hivefleet yakface
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Agile Revenant Titan
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Looks like a nice army. Paintjob is amazing, too.
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Eldar -5000 points |
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