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We have a bone to pick with GW The predator kit uses the same front armor as the dinky rhino which is armor 11 vs 13. So we decided to fix this little problem. We took the design to a 3D application and are working up a new front panel.

Now I think this will be a single piece once it is prototyped and will fit on the front where the regular rhino panel fits, and we also want to include some strips of reactive armor plating so you can put them wherever you want (and cut to size), this could be the turret or along the sides.

What do you guys think, if you look at the graphic, you can see how the detail is built upon from left to right. There is still room for some details to be added, but nothing drastic, so suggestions cant hurt.



Now this is an old school rehash of the old predator panel on the old Mk Rhino chassis. This will be scaled to fit the newer rhino chassis for Heresy Era armies, its pretty basic, but then again thats old school for you.
Again it fits in place on the current front panel area.




Again suggestions?

Lots of new stuff coming out for the design table and your critiques!

Thanks guys,
Nick - www.chapterhousestudios.com

The old school rehash looks great so far!

I really like the new viewport in the first picture.

heck ya! I love the viewport, I actually want that for my rhinos!! when is the release date?

I would be all over that Heresy era front plate. Looking forward to when it hits your store.

Hey Nick - that was my idea!




Do I get a free one?

So the reactive armor on the last 2 pics isnt there permanently? that just shows what it would look like right?

Honestly, I think adding a bit to mount a storm bolter like a leman russ hull mounted weapon like the heavy bolter would be kind of neat


that or a big ass imperial eagle

yeah,
I think it will be cool to have another 3rd party part store.
But I think you gotta be carefull with the using GW's names.
Salamaders and SpaceMarine are plastered all over your website, these names are GW IP.
I figure once GW notice you... you'll probabily be skating on thin ice!

I think you should concentrate on making more 'Future Warrior' Tank Armour and Weapons.

I'd like to see more of your designs for armour upgrades.
I don't like the first design much... but I can see it has potential.
Your Rhino MkI design is solving a problem nobody has!
lots of people have had the retro idea... the easy cheap way do do this is to use old MkI rhino parts.. photo of mine.


But if you are making a direct MkII to Mk1 convertion kit with no intention to tiptoe around GW.
I'd like to see the proportions kept true, basically I'd want the same part stretched lengthways, your angles and view-port look a bit off..
Also you need to provide MkI headlights (again slightly wider) and bumper/turn indicator bar.

Panic...

I like the last plate. Who's Chapterhouse?

I'll reserve judgment until I see it in person or a non rendered picture.

Frazzled wrote:Who's Chapterhouse?

Chapterhouse is a great new little company that makes specialized bits to compliment GW products.

Well, NEW is a kind of misnomer. They've ben doing it a while, but have really started to explode recently, it seems.

You can check their website here:
http://www.chapterhousestudios.com

Or you can check out their Bartertown subforum here:
http://www.bartertown.com/trading/viewforum.php?f=78

Nick's a great guy, and they do some absolutely splendid work!

Eric

Guys and the rare Gal,

The boxes on the modern armor front will be modeled on the front armor, we will likely include some extra strips to be cut or glued where you want to glue them.

The Heresy-Mk I armor front will be stretched and fitted to replace the Mk II front, no unsightly gaps. I hadnt thought about lights and turn signals, but will talk to my designer about those as well.

That is a splendid idea on the storm bolter bit, the only issue I see, is the rules say its pintle mounted, if we do it fixed to the front, you can get screwed over on LOS and arcs to fire.

Legal Issues.

Guys, we just spent $1000 to get these issues looked at by an IP attorney. For the record, they sorta smiled at GWs Legal page, alot of it isnt correct in legal terms, so they basically dont explain themselves at all.

Needless to say, GW doesnt explain the real legal laws and use ignorance of the public to scare off competition.

Salamanders, Rhino, Predator and many other words are not GW IP. You can use them, as well as some trademarks like Space Marine etc, you just have to know the legal rules to do it correctly.

*Off legalese*

These are probably due for release by September at the latest. Depending on the number of pieces, I think they will run 5-9$ if its just a single hatch and some smaller accessories, they will be resin as well.

Thanks for the kind words and critiques, spread the word, we are trying to make the hobby a bit more fun for everyone without the usual price gouging!

Nick
www.chapterhousestudios.com

Looks nice. I've never liked the newer predator because of that issue (some front as the rhino).

Feel free to work up some Space Wolf stuff!

Frazzled, I have purchased lots of stuff from Nick and his group and can say they are top notch. They have all the little bits for the salamanders that I really needed heh. BTW Nick all those orders coming out of Nashville you can thank me for hehehe.

So how will you make this? Will your rendering be 3d printed, or are you going to make it out of plasticard or something?

Looks cool, whatever the case.

My 3 pred's will love these

Any word on the land raider kit? My 2 redeemers are waiting to love those as well lol

Checked the site.
I like those bits!

Chapterhouse wrote:Guys and the rare Gal,



Guys, we just spent $1000 to get these issues looked at by an IP attorney...Salamanders, Rhino, Predator and many other words are not GW IP. You can use them, as well as some trademarks like Space Marine etc, you just have to know the legal rules to do it correctly.

You might want to think about getting a refund;

1) Dark Angels (amongst others) most definatley IS a Registered US trademark... (Serial Number 75975495 in fact).

2) Their page is allowed to be confusing - since 3rd party ignorance of the law provides no exemption from the law

3) Regardless of the rights or wrongs, can you afford to fight a 'cease and desist' injunction?

4) They've got you bang to rights on copyright. You've blatantly stolen/ripped theirs off!

I don't know if you Americans have an equivalent to 'passing off' but if so, you're knackerd...

Don't get me wrong, I wish you all the best but you'd be better off (or at least safer) not selling things that have chapter-specific iconography (and certainly not canonic chaper iconography).

Best wishes and good luck - I have a feeling you're going to need it!

Mike

Mike,

I know Dark Angels and many other terms are trademarked, thats why we have a trademark disclaimer and make no claims to creating or even these being official or endorsed by GW.

Copyright gives ownership to specific models, not components of models and especially not pieces fitting on a model or icons that use public domain. Anyone can use skulls, lightning bolts, eagles whatever as long as they are not copies of GW original art (not stuff they stole from history).

Any other legal questions, feel free to pm me and I will answer them, no reason to make this thread a legal one.

LR is still constantly being worked on.

This will be a resin kit, from a 3d rendering. WYSIWYG once its finalized.

Space Wolf bits are coming, probably in time for the codex or before.

Thanks for the orders Im trying to figure out some referal bonus system that will work.

Nick

von-horst wrote:You might want to think about getting a refund;

1) Dark Angels (amongst others) most definatley IS a Registered US trademark... (Serial Number 75975495 in fact).

Just because something is a registered trademark doesn't mean you can't use it. It just means you have to acknowledge the holder of the trademark. They do not claim to be GW.

von-horst wrote:
2) Their page is allowed to be confusing - since 3rd party ignorance of the law provides no exemption from the law

Exactly GW keeps people ignorant of their rights so they can bully people.

von-horst wrote:
3) Regardless of the rights or wrongs, can you afford to fight a 'cease and desist' injunction?

At this point the Chapterhouse could take GW to court and request a judge to grant a delcaratory judgement, which chances are would allow Chapterhouse to continue and would result in GW being punished if they continued their harrassment.

GW would have you believe otherwise, but it is a common enough practice for model companies to produce kits and for thrid party companies to produce enhancements to those kits without any formal relationship between the companies.

von-horst wrote:
4) They've got you bang to rights on copyright. You've blatantly stolen/ripped theirs off!

GW's copyrights on their models are on the models in their wholeness. Which is why Chapterhouse can never produce a kit to build a complete Rhino; Chapterhouse can however build components with common geometries, since GW holds no patents or copyrights on the interefaces between parts (which is how automotive and cellphone companies can force licensing agreements on 3rd party manufacturers).

von-horst wrote:
I don't know if you Americans have an equivalent to 'passing off' but if so, you're knackerd...

Don't get me wrong, I wish you all the best but you'd be better off (or at least safer) not selling things that have chapter-specific iconography (and certainly not canonic chaper iconography).
...

America uses common law as a basis for its legal system. Beyond using a trademark iconographic image, making entire kits that can stand in for GW kit or outright passing off their product as GW's their is little that can be done by GW. This is partially because Chapterhouse states openly it is not GW and does not endorse GW. GW would have to prove that Chapterhouse has done damage to them by diminsihing their "goodwill" with their customers as a result of some misrepresentation of association with GW.

LOL, what he said, we just went about it the right way and got a lawyer to work for us.

Declaratory Judgement is a good tool for small companies to battle larger ones, it ask the judge to not wait and make a long and costly court case and ask them to make a judgement as soon as possible, saving time and legal fees, I believe...

That is a splendid idea on the storm bolter bit, the only issue I see, is the rules say its pintle mounted, if we do it fixed to the front, you can get screwed over on LOS and arcs to fire.

well I can't speak for everyone on this board, but I know I would kill to have that bit as an option in the kit. when can we expect new digital sculpt pics?

I like all the bits et al, but those hatch doors and front panel look like exact replica's of GW's. Now you've added your iconography, but that's kind of iffy.

Uriels_Flame wrote:I like all the bits et al, but those hatch doors and front panel look like exact replica's of GW's. Now you've added your iconography, but that's kind of iffy.

They are being phased out soon enough, they are legal, but on the Iffy end...

Storm bolter inside the Rhino's hull!!! brilliant!!! now mine will stop breaking off whenever I transport it somewhere.

Again, you lose the pintle range of fire and are stuck witha hullmounted bolter only firing foward, is this something you guys will sacrifice for the foward mounted?

Again, you lose the pintle range of fire and are stuck witha hullmounted bolter only firing foward, is this something you guys will sacrifice for the foward mounted?

I know I would. 1) rule of cool. It's definently unique. 2) having a pintle mount clutters up the top of a pred in my opinion, and can sometimes look like you're shooting through the sb from the turret. 3) As a modeller, you can always just make it a bit that can be glued on to the front of the hull-- to give people the option of doing a hull mounted gun.

Well ok then, it may come later, but ill look into it.

One thing I'm impressed with is the increasing quality of Chapterhouse product. I'm waiting for a broader range than just marines myself

Are you guys machining your moulds, or casting from hand sculpts?

Would using these bitz disqualify your models from being used in a GW-sponsored tournament?