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I am only recently getting back into WHFB, and after building an OK army and not being happy with how it played, I decided to try my luck with Dwarfs.

Comments and critiques are greatly appreciated, but keep a couple things in mind:

I am not interested in a gunline.

I am not a fan of the AoD

I will be playing this list in local gaming club tournies and friendlies, so I am looking to make it functional, not tournament cookie cutter.

Lords/Heroes:

Dwarf Lord
GW, Shield Bearers, MRoKragg, RoFury, RoResiliance, RoPreservation, MRoSpite, RotFurance.
Will be placed in the Hammerer unit.

Thane
Shield, RoS, RoCleaving, RoFuryx2
Will be placed in Longbeards

Runesmith
Shield, MRoBalance, RoSpellbreaking
Will be place with Organ Gun

Core:

Warriors x10
F/C, Shields

Quarrelers x10

Thunderers x10
F/C, Shields

Thunderers x10
F/C, Shields

Longbeards x24
F/C, Shields, RoCourage

Special:

Hammerers x23
F/C, Shields, RoBattle

Miners x5

Bolt Thrower
Engineer, RoPenetration, RoBurning

Grudge Thrower
Engineer, RoAccuracy

Rare:

Organ Gun

The idea here is to have the Hammerers, Organ Gun, and a unit of Thunderers on one flank, Warriors, Longbeards, and the other unit of Thunderers on the other, and the remaining warmachines and Quarrelers in the middle. The miners are purely for table quarter control.

I don't have a whole lot of experience so take my advice accordingly.

I have never tried a small unit of miners like that. I would be worried that when they get on the table there would still be several turns for your opponent to dispatch 5 dwarfs. Fortunately we have a ld 9.

I would probably lose the f/c on your thunderers. IMHO commands don't seem to add a lot for their points cost. Be prepared to get flank charged. That big bad lord isn't going to be able to fight unless you put him in the corner when you get flank charged. I would probably drop both commands on the thunderers and the command on the warriors (I am guessing that they are speed bumps and to protect the long beards flank). I would also lose a long beard to see if I could squeeze in another 10x warriors to guard the flank of your hammerers. Maybe drop a few more longbeards if needed and pick up the rune of stoicism instead of courage. I like the rune of stoicism because it helps with fear too along with possibly adding the +1 for outnumbering.

I have a tendency to tool up my characters only to later wish that I would have toned them down a little and squeezed in one more unit of something.

Anyway that is my advice, not sure how good it is.

Having your infantry blocks at 24 and 23, respectively, is sort of overkill-ish. I understand you're going for full rank bonus, but 1) you probably don't need full rank bonus every time, and 2) That's a lot of points to spend. Dropping 4 longbeards and 3 hammerers can get you to a tooled-up bolt thrower.

I prefer Rune of Stoicism over Rune of Battle (your 40 guys still outnumber most enemies to get you that point of combat res, plus you won't auto-break from fear causers).

I agree with boogeyman on the Miners. A gyrocopter is a superior war machine hunting choice, as it can also marchblock and redirect charges and it has a much better armor save.

Longbeards are ever so nice, but they're making you take a unit of warriors (115 points) and then they're even more expensive than elite infantry (Warrior 8, great weapon 2, longbeard upgrade 3, shield one, 14 ppm, plus another 115 that you wouldn't take anyway). If you drop the miners, you can take another block of hammerers, for -1 point per model and add Stubborn, which as we all know is golden with high dwarf Ld.

10 Thunderers with full command seems like a waste. They're going to lose close combats anyway most of the time. I would say take a musician so they can be almost certain to rally after a charge, and leave the champ and the standard at home.

However, putting shields on the quarrelers does double their chance of armor save, so I recommend it.

That's all I got. Much luck!

I agree with Malleus on three points.

A gyrocopter is very good and could be taking, using points from the miners being dropped as 5 are not going to do much against the things you'll come up against in a 2250 game.

Also i do think that you may as well drop 4 longbeards and 3 hammers but i don't agree with getting another BT. I would add more warriors. Probably in another unit, dependant on how many you can buy from it.

And there isn't any point taking FC on the thunderers, except a standard bearer.

Otherwise, a pretty good list, have fun and good luck!

I agree with most of what Malleus said.

Those units are really big.
There are a lot of points sunk into them.
The gyrocopter is a superior war machine. Especially when lacking in ranged weapons and you will have to footslog it across the board.
I already stated my thoughts on the command with the thunderers and warriors unit too.
Since you have a lord, you can have one more unit of longbeards than warriors.
You can pick up a 10x naked warrior block for 80 pts. It will give you some protection and maybe tie up the enemy long enough to get your own flank charge. The longbeards would help them stay a little longer.
I would look into dropping some of the extras on your characters to pick up extra units.
I am partial to a unit of rangers also. They can help support a flank and challenge that table quarter your looking to control.
If you really want to bog down an opponent try a large unit of slayers. Unbreakable is nice.

I would definetly look into getting the gyrocopter like Malleus suggested.

Thanks guys! Taking your advice into account I came up with this:


Lords/Heroes:

Dwarf Lord
GW, Shield Bearers, MRoKragg, RoFury, RoResiliance, RoPreservation, MRoSpite, RotFurance.
Will be placed in the Hammerer unit.

Thane
Shield, RoS, RoCleaving, RoFuryx2
Will be placed in Longbeards

Runesmith
Shield, MRoBalance, RoSpellbreaking
Will be place with Organ Gun

Core:

Warriors x10
Musician, Shields

Warriors x10
Musician, Shields

Quarrelers x10
Musician, Shields

Thunderers x10
Musician, Shields

Thunderers x10
Musician, Shields

Longbeards x19
F/C, Shields, RoCourage

Special:

Hammerers x18
F/C, Shields, RoBattle

Miners x5

Bolt Thrower
Engineer, RoPenetration, RoBurning

Grudge Thrower
RoAccuracy

Rare:

Organ Gun

With this list I have 80 points left over that I am not sure what to do with. I could beef the Miners up to 10 w/FC, I could drop them altogehter and take a cannon, or I could take a Gyrocopter.

Better, prevail. Drop the miners and get a Gyrocopter. You'd be 5 points over but hey.

Good list now

That five points is easily picked up by dropping a musician somewhere. Probably the quarellers who can be a little further back.

I think you'll like the gyro, but bear in mind that it takes some work to figure out how to use the thing. Get familiar with the rules for fleeing and directions and all that.

Also, my preference would be to trade one of your thane's runes of fury for a Master Rune of Swiftness. I think having a shot at reducing incoming attacks is pretty nice.

Additionally, your lord is essentially paying 40 points to get one extra attack with his great weapon. Not very efficient. Points savings could go on another rune for your longbeards (i.e. trade courage for battle/stoicism, always a nice combo) or anything else you can think of...

RZ

What would you do about the Lord?

I don't need the extra attack, but I want the GW for some extra punch, and I also wanted the magic weapon as I have very limited options for dealing with things such as Cairne Wraiths.

I would lose the miners and all your musicians except in longbeards and hammerers. In my limited experience when a dwarf unit breaks it is from combat and they have a tendency not to run very far, ( my hammerers breaking on double sixes only to run 4" and get caught by 30 stinking night goblins from a flank charge ) Anyway when that happens musicians don't help.

This would get you the gyrocopter plus 20 more points. I would drop the R of fury on the lord to get another 25. I would drop another longbeard too. This should give you 57 points to play with, maybe throw your miners back in there. I would also switch a unit of thunderers to a unit of quarreller rangers they are the same price but you would gain scout ability.

You would lose one attack on your lord, all your +1 to rally, and one longbeard. You would still be able to go 3x6 formation with an extra just in case.

Alright, well the dwarf lord seems relatively fine. Not sure why you are giving him the rune of furnace, but perhaps you have a bunch of people trying to set his beard aflame, whatever.

The Thane with his jacked weapon runes seems a little under protected, 5 S 5 attacks is nice, but I would probably take one of those attacks away to give him a 2+ re-rollable armour save.

Runesmith with Rune of Balance and all his other trimmings is pretty standard

I would spend a fourth one on a BSB, I find them exceedingly useful for dwarfs, you are taking the charge for most of the time, and getting to re-roll those critical times is a great benefit, even if you don't add a special banner.

As for the core

I disagree with 10 Warrior strong units if they are carrying shields. If you are set on 10 strong dwarf warriors, give them great weapons, let them hang back, and deliver a counter blow, 10 strong with shields is just asking to die.

Bit heavy on the shooting for my taste, but you can do a fair amount of damage with those three.

Longbeards are fine, work well with the thane.

Special

I would drop the miners, take a canon with Rune of Forging, allowing you to re-roll artillery dice for it.

Not a fan of Grudge Throwers I have found them to be generally inaccurate and do very little, either add a canon, or a pair of bolt throwers for the price of it.

Rare

Organ gun is good times

A pretty heavy shooting list, I typically avoid where I can, but with luck you will be hitting pretty hard, and the remainder of troops should be able to be dealt with your two combat units. Beware of gorgers, and other warmachine hunters.

BossGlefang wrote:Alright, well the dwarf lord seems relatively fine. Not sure why you are giving him the rune of furnace, but perhaps you have a bunch of people trying to set his beard aflame, whatever.

The Thane with his jacked weapon runes seems a little under protected, 5 S 5 attacks is nice, but I would probably take one of those attacks away to give him a 2+ re-rollable armour save.

Runesmith with Rune of Balance and all his other trimmings is pretty standard

I would spend a fourth one on a BSB, I find them exceedingly useful for dwarfs, you are taking the charge for most of the time, and getting to re-roll those critical times is a great benefit, even if you don't add a special banner.

As for the core

I disagree with 10 Warrior strong units if they are carrying shields. If you are set on 10 strong dwarf warriors, give them great weapons, let them hang back, and deliver a counter blow, 10 strong with shields is just asking to die.

Bit heavy on the shooting for my taste, but you can do a fair amount of damage with those three.

Longbeards are fine, work well with the thane.

Special

I would drop the miners, take a canon with Rune of Forging, allowing you to re-roll artillery dice for it.

Not a fan of Grudge Throwers I have found them to be generally inaccurate and do very little, either add a canon, or a pair of bolt throwers for the price of it.

Rare

Organ gun is good times

A pretty heavy shooting list, I typically avoid where I can, but with luck you will be hitting pretty hard, and the remainder of troops should be able to be dealt with your two combat units. Beware of gorgers, and other warmachine hunters.

Yeah, the RoFurnace was just tossed on. 5 points to protect him from the odd flaming attack.

You are probably right about the Thane, I will look into that.

I couldn't decide whether I want to make the Thane I have a BSB or not, but decided not to because the two blocks of Hammerers and Longbeards can already use runed standards, so I figured I was better off using that to my advantage. Where would you suggest taking points from in order to bring an extra hero?

As for the Warriors, my thoughts were to just use them as charge bait, either to bait and flee, or stand and wait for the hammerers/LB's to flank. I figured the shields just gave them more staying power.

As for the Grudge Thrower, it is the only machine I have painted so far, so at least for now, I have to use it. =P

Rune of the Furnace isn't a bad call. For 5 points, you protect yourself from getting sniped by the first spell in the Lore of Metal (Burning Iron I think). Not critical, but not terrible either. Especially useful against Slann who may have bane-headed you.

For your thane, I'll reiterate that one of the Runes of Fury should be replaced with a MR of Swiftness. 4 ASF Str 5 attacks can be pretty nifty. It also provides some defense to the thane *and* his unit.

I can understand the desire for magic attacks. Perhaps consider the MR of Kragg the Grim combined with Rune of Might (which essentially will leave you wounding *everything* on 2+) or Rune of Snorri Spangelhelm to help ensure you don't fluff. Same cost as your setup, but provides some other options to consider.

I say leave the shields on your bait warriors. Great value.

I think the Grudge Thrower, if you can get good with guesses is excellent. It'll worry big monsters with its D6 wounds.

Just my thoughts...

RZ