@malfred - These are pictures of the GW World Eaters and the FW World Eaters. I'll let you decide which looks cooler. (I hope this works, never posted pics on Dakka.

tinfoil wrote:FW has released preview pictures of Khorne conversion kits for CSMs and Terminators.

They look pretty good -- although the Berzerkers look ridiculous from the belt down, due to GW's inexplicably ridiculous space marine leg proportions and stances.

Fact - These will be too expensive for anyone but the most braindead of fanboys to bother with.

Fact - Those are the current plastic CSM legs.. so that means you have to waste a significant portion of a CSM box to use these.

Fact - They will not be attainable through GWUS since FW is acting like twits to the US market again.

Fact - These models are only as good as the rules they have in the current CSM codex.... ie: complete garbage. (Hwang will now reply.)

Fact - Even if I was not on a complete GW Moratorium, I would file these under "Duly Noted and Summarily Ignored".

Abadabadoobaddon wrote:Well, ya see Ahtman, the Chaos legions do things differently than the loyalist chapters. As you probably know, among the loyalists entombment in a dreadnought is considered a great honor while on the other hand in the Chaos legions it is a fate worse than death. What you may not have known is that for some legions this dichotomy extends to tactical dreadnought armor as well. For example, among the World Eaters, being forced to don a suit of terminator armor is considered a severe punishment since the bulky armor makes it more difficult to advance after fleeing enemy and makes it practically impossible to do so sweepingly. Thus only less skilled and more cowardly World Eaters are made to wear terminator armor - this is why, unlike their power armored brethren, they only have WS4 and aren't Fearless. I hope this has resolved any issues you may have had with the new Chaos codex. Thanks.

Nah, your rationalization doesn't work well for me, though it is a creative and not bad at all. As I stated, I'm not discounting the new Codex. It is a good Codex for competitive balanced lists and Renegade marines. It is not good for representing the specific aligned Legions: Death Guard, World Eaters, Thousand Sons, and Emperor's Children. Now this is my opinion and one I am allowed to have. Just because some little pissant internet fanboy apparently doesn't like anyone to disagree with him does not mean I'm not going to. If the new codex was so all encompassing they probably wouldn't need to release a Demon Codex or drop hints about the Legions getting some special rules down the line.

Eh to each his own I guess, trying to convince people of your opinion of the superiority of newer versions of rules/fluff to older versions through the ether of the innernets is akin to getting pigs to fly.

And for some reason, Nurglitch reminds me of Captain Beatty from Fahrenheit 451. Sorry for the off topic-ness.

On topic: the khorne termie ears do bug me. They're too monolithic, besides the khorne symbols alone are enough to left a viewer know what god the model is associated with.

They look good, Better than nothing so atleast some people will be happy

Abadabadoobaddon wrote: What you may not have known is that for some legions this dichotomy extends to tactical dreadnought armor as well. For example, among the World Eaters, being forced to don a suit of terminator armor is considered a severe punishment since the bulky armor makes it more difficult to advance after fleeing enemy and makes it practically impossible to do so sweepingly. Thus only less skilled and more cowardly World Eaters are made to wear terminator armor - this is why, unlike their power armored brethren, they only have WS4 and aren't Fearless. I hope this has resolved any issues you may have had with the new Chaos codex. Thanks.

EErmmm WTF? where did you find this little bit of (fluff).. that sounds like someone rationalizing why certain rules are the way they are into some sort of goofy fluff. which are entirely wrong.

A terminator of any kind, whether bezerker or androgenous is not a curse nor a punishment. It's a different armament that quite frankly works in both fluff and rules and needs no further goofy comment about it. Lol, a punishment, .... good one.. llollerskates!!!one11OOLL

VermGho5t wrote:Eh to each his own I guess, trying to convince people of your opinion of the superiority of newer versions of rules/fluff to older versions through the ether of the innernets is akin to getting pigs to fly.

If it were possible to convince people that your opinion is right by talking to them there wouldn't have been any reason to invent swords, knives, guns, bombs, big pointy sticks, etc., etc. Usually the only way to convince someone of the absolute rightness of your opinion is blunt force trauma to the head.

Rbb wrote:
If it were possible to convince people that your opinion is right by talking to them there wouldn't have been any reason to invent swords, knives, guns, bombs, big pointy sticks, etc., etc. Usually the only way to convince someone of the absolute rightness of your opinion is blunt force trauma to the head.

Right, because only in death do the concede to your way of thinking ..... Um.... NO

VermGho5t wrote:Eh to each his own I guess, trying to convince people of your opinion of the superiority of newer versions of rules/fluff to older versions through the ether of the innernets is akin to getting pigs to fly.

I agree. I'm not trying to convince anyone to believe what I do, just stating that is how I feel. I say I prefer Coke and that there is nothing wrong with Pepsi and I have Pepsi fans snarling and going into gran mal seizures. I know part of my reaction was my surprise to see such an asinine comment as "cry like a little baby because big daddy GW was a meany and took away your rules". To top it off, after starting the whole thing with such an unnecessary comment, it then tried to take the high road. Either obvious troll is obvious or they are not smart enough to see their own hypocrisy. I generally expect better from Dakka; this isn't 4chan, and it caught me off guard.

I don't see how pointing out that plastic Berserkers aren't the same as World Eaters is much different then pointing out that plastic marine box isn't the same as the Red Scorpions. It's just a generic box that you can paint up to be Red Scorpions, but if you have the FW resin parts you really have the look. Of course you still have to use the Marine Codex to play them in a structured event without any special IA rules. You don't have to buy the FW stuff at all though. It came from the question as to why would these be better then just the basic Berserker box and the answer was, and still is, because these are the World Eaters. It has nothing to do with rules implementation, what version of the game you are playing, or even playing the game with the models. The difference is that these are a specific Legion and if you want to capture that in your modeling these are here to help.

As to the rules, this isn't that complicated either, but I'll restate it anyway. I think the older fluff and rules were more interesting, this isn't a zero sum equation. I can appreciate the older stuff and still think the newer one is ok to. I don't have to hate the new stuff just because I like the older stuff better. I think that the new codex is fine and represents Renegade Marines just fine, but it doesn't represent the Legions that well in my opinion. GW seems to be splitting up Chaos though and I wouldn't be surprised to see something down the line. As it is now what would have been a $20 purchase is now $40 (Renegade Marines + Demon Armies) and if they do something to represent the oldest, angriest marines that have lived in the Eye of Terror in another book later that is another $20. Not bad marketing really, they've been doing to Marines for years.

two_heads_talking wrote:

Abadabadoobaddon wrote: ... Thanks.

EErmmm WTF? where did you find this little bit of (fluff).. that sounds like someone rationalizing why certain rules are the way they are into some sort of goofy fluff. which are entirely wrong.

I recommend you retune your sarcasmometer.

Dear Abbadoobie,

Thank you for brightening my day with your wonderful post about the Legion's tactical dreadnought armor dichotomy. Your well thought-out rationalization has certainly convinced me, and I am now well on my way to resolving my issues regarding the new Chaos codex.

Thanks,

-Hordini



Dear everyone who replied to Abbadoobie's post seriously,

You make me chuckle.

Thanks,

-Hordini

Fact - These will be too expensive for anyone but the most braindead of fanboys to bother with.

That's actually an OPINION, not a fact.
The fact is that some people like the look of Khorne and still collect the models.
The fact is that some people still like Khorne.
Those people (and the wealthy people who can afford it) will purchase/strive to purchase these models.

Fact - Those are the current plastic CSM legs.. so that means you have to waste a significant portion of a CSM box to use these.

Again, that's opinion.
You can use them for Khorne Bikers (I wouldn't... but there are those who would) or you can buy the legs as bits.

Fact - They will not be attainable through GWUS since FW is acting like twits to the US market again.

Again... that's opinion.
They will be as attainable as anything else from FW, considering their recent delays. That means you cna get them, but you'll have to wait for them.

Fact - These models are only as good as the rules they have in the current CSM codex.... ie: complete garbage. (Hwang will now reply.)

That's 4 opinions in a row.
The models have nothing to do with the rules.
These model kits are very well done, and look incredible.

I won't comment on your rules opinion.

Eric

dienekes96 wrote:

two_heads_talking wrote:

Abadabadoobaddon wrote: ... Thanks.

EErmmm WTF? where did you find this little bit of (fluff).. that sounds like someone rationalizing why certain rules are the way they are into some sort of goofy fluff. which are entirely wrong.

I recommend you retune your sarcasmometer.

or perhaps...... looks like everyone's sarcasometer is a bit malfunctioning.. sheesh... can't anyone have a bit o' fun at someone else's expense without getting piled on? no? oh well, looks like similar to Wil E. Coyote, it's back to the drawing board and more acme stuff.

Sarcasm or not, I think we can all agree that Terminators are pretty awesome contortionists with the way they bend their spine to fit into those things. I think everyone can laugh at that, and that's a fact.

Wow. Estoy mucho unimpressado.

FW go miles towards correcting the proportion problems in IG figs, while still keeping them "heroic". I wish they could apply the same skill to the CSMs. The legs inside that armor must be skinnier than Kieth Richards', even if it's ceramispandex.

I personally like the nose-hose on the termi, and think t will look cooler when painted. It does give me Welcome Back Kotter flashbacks, though. "Up your nose with a rubber hose!"

So, the World Terminators are the Long Fangs of Khorne?

(Hm. That's a conversion that needs doing - Long Fangs on O2...maybe one in a wheelchair)

stonefox wrote:Sarcasm or not, I think we can all agree that Terminators are pretty awesome contortionists with the way they bend their spine to fit into those things. I think everyone can laugh at that, and that's a fact.

WAIT .. doesn't the armor make the marine a terminator (short for space marine in tactical dreadnaught armor) rather than the marine making the armor a terminator?

Nice face, shame about the legs. Why aren't these full resin models?

George Spiggott wrote:Nice face, shame about the legs. Why aren't these full resin models?

I believe they are upgrade kits rather than full out kits. not sure why though. maybe forge world is not authorized to do a full up kit if there is already a model available for that.. just a guess though.

I prefer the Nurgle ones. I'll probably get some Khorne Terminators (I have over 60 regular Berzerkers, and I don't need any more), but otherwise stick to the Nurgle ones.

BYE

I love how GW simply added moar skulls, spikes & screaming...

two_heads_talking wrote:

Abadabadoobaddon wrote:...Thanks.

EErmmm WTF? where did you find this little bit of (fluff).. that sounds like someone rationalizing why certain rules are the way they are into some sort of goofy fluff. which are entirely wrong.

Well, that's just like, your opinion, man...

To be honest, I actually like the older ones more. Not the exact model you put up there, but with one of the other helmets and the running legs they look quite good.

So, I wonder why silly hats are the Chaos order of the day? Like, why do the lords of both blood and change terrorize their opponents with 3-foot-tall headgear? And let's not even talk about the Nightlords. I mean, if those Marines are supposed to be 8 feet tall, those wings on their helmets are 2.5 feet tall, with a 3-foot span. Damn, that's silly.

So's a shako, but people wore them into battle.

I quite like them, however for the price that will be asked for them, I'm not sure if its worth plonking the fat cash down.

Sure I'd get them if I was doing world eaters, but I'm not.

So a 'must have' option for the fanatics/those who like converted armies....

two_heads_talking wrote:

stonefox wrote:Sarcasm or not, I think we can all agree that Terminators are pretty awesome contortionists with the way they bend their spine to fit into those things. I think everyone can laugh at that, and that's a fact.

WAIT .. doesn't the armor make the marine a terminator (short for space marine in tactical dreadnaught armor) rather than the marine making the armor a terminator?

Ah, but then again the non-spiked slightly-less-angry good guy marines have guys running around in power armor with Terminator Honors who have been rewarded for their courage and experience with the ability to swing their chainswords slightly faster. However, according to the SM Codex these guys are generally referred to as Veteran Sergeants. So, are they Terminators, or do they just have the right to wear the armor? When will GW stop screwing around with all those stupid rules questions and finally release a FAQ that answers the important stuff like this?

If they have the Terminator Badge they have been chosen to wear the armor at some point and have worn it. In the fluff the Tactical Dreadnought armor isn't used in most situations so the Vets only wear it when called upon to clear a hulk or take a particularly hard target, outside that they lead squads or make up shock troops and such.

Death By Monkeys wrote:So, the World Terminators are the Long Fangs of Khorne?

(Hm. That's a conversion that needs doing - Long Fangs on O2...maybe one in a wheelchair)

You, sir, need to come clean the Mt. Dew off my monitor. I can't get that image out of my mind... now, I need to find a pewter wheelchair and convert a longfang sergeant for my buddy.

two_heads_talking wrote:

George Spiggott wrote:Nice face, shame about the legs. Why aren't these full resin models?

I believe they are upgrade kits rather than full out kits. not sure why though. maybe forge world is not authorized to do a full up kit if there is already a model available for that.. just a guess though.

I wonder if they didn't just cut an easy route... why do a full conversion if the legs are adequate? I agree that the proportions aren't that grand, but they're not that bad, either... and I suspect the angle of the photo has something to do with that as well. Maybe it's all the extra bits & bobbins on the top half; kinda like those cartoon strong men with tiny little legs and barrel chests & arms. If you add the side satchel and some other grenades, etc. to the legs, it'll bulk out a bit.

Geddonight wrote:

two_heads_talking wrote:

George Spiggott wrote:Nice face, shame about the legs. Why aren't these full resin models?

I believe they are upgrade kits rather than full out kits. not sure why though. maybe forge world is not authorized to do a full up kit if there is already a model available for that.. just a guess though.

I wonder if they didn't just cut an easy route... why do a full conversion if the legs are adequate?

I'm guessing they didn't do legs because they don't want to eat into GW Chaos Terminator box set sales. Putting out models that compete directly with GW plastic kits is probably a no-no so they stick to "conversion kits". This is why there are no legs - legs are used as the limiting factor in GW plastic marine kits. You always end up with an abundance of torsos/heads/arms, but are limited in the number of complete models you can construct by the numbers of legs.