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@Nurgleboy77: Perhaps it is because people try to use advanced tactics straight off the bat? But perhaps I am only saying that is because my Wood Elves outmaneuver everything except full Slaanesh?

No, UNLESS it was combined with Warriors of Chaos.

No, because I collect them!

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Yes, but only because I want Chaos back in one big tome as a combined army again gosh darn it.

QFT, it really made me angry when they did that....

I want a Nippon army!

LunaHound wrote:I want Chaos to be 1 book.

Combining :
Warrior of Chaos + Demon of Chaos + Beastmen

Same here - only problem is that they won't do it, because 3 books at £15 each is £45 (can't be bothered working out in USD) so unless they released them as one book that cost £45, its not going to happen.

Plus, they don't like combining armies. How could they possibly sell a Beastmen battalion, a Warriors of Chaos battalion AND a Daemons battalion if there was only one army book?

They think profit first, and always will.

Well I think that it was better when you could mix the books, so that's why I voted yes.

But as for the Demon book being the most over powered, shouldn't the Demon book be the most powerful? Like when you read the fluff they are any army made out of a never ending tide of nightmare creatures. And IMO gameplay should reflect how difficult they are to fight. But then again, if it truly were written according to fluff a Bloodthirster would be a core choice and be something ridiculously cheap like 5pts...

What the gamers want sadly no longer matters to Games Workshop. 3 Armies > 2 Armies in terms of models sold, so they make 3 armies.

I absolutely despise this book. It embodies WAAC, it requires TRYING to make a balanced list, and it is plainly OP.
My dad is deeply considering selling his 3k+ Daemons army because he is totally SICK of winning with it.
I think it should have been made into a HoC 2.0 book along with Beastmen. The new WoC book is limited, Daemons are OP, and Beastmen are quite rubbish. Why not? It should have NEVER been made into a stand-alone book.
Greetsz,
Mr. Self Destruct

I enjoy playing with them I don't see why they are so bad. I think they are fine.

More gaming, Less whining.

I have played against them I think they are fine..beat me every time but fine.

I voted no. I liked when there were 3 (well 2, Daemons took too long to be published) books, and you could use Core units from one as Special in other.

I think Chaos should have the chance to make 3 different lists AND a combined 4th.

I don't play Fantasy so I chose no opinion but based on what I've heard and read there need to be some serious changes made.

Yes, but not because they're cheese, but because I miss the old Hordes book.

nieto666 wrote:Those who say no own Daemons, those who say yes and maybe don't own them.

My first army after getting back into Warhammer was Daemons of Chaos. So I own a Daemons Army, the Legion of Grimdark. It's all Khorne and Tzeentch -- basically Tzeentch tricked Khorne into giving him a legion of soldiers to command. I'm still building on it, especially now that the plastic Horrors are available.

And I voted Maybe.

I like being able to run an all Daemon army...but at the same time, I really wish I could add Pink Horrors, Screamers and Flamers to my Tzeentch Chaos Warriors army. That army is lead by a Sorcerer Lord and his 3 Chaos Sorcerer apprentices, all of them zipping about on Discs of Tzeentch, with Tzeentchy Chaos Spawn (i.e. apprentices who failed to make the grade) as shock units. A lot of marauders converted with chaos mutations to give them the "we bathe in magic" look. Just for the fluffiness of it, I'd love to be able to supplement this army with Daemons.

That's why I voted maybe.

I don't necessarily want to see Beastmen drawn back into the fold (one can always simply mix in some Gors with ones Marauders to get that "mixed horde" look), but I do miss the horde of chaos warriors charging into battle driven on by daemonic allies feasting on the psychic carnage they wrought. So I would be okay with getting rid of the Warriors of Chaos and Daemons of Chaos books in favor of an Armies of Chaos book, especially if Daemons were Special units that became Core when the General is a Daemon Lord. Like if you take a Daemon Lord of Khorne as your General, then Bloodletters become Core, allowing you to field an all Daemon army as long as at least 25% of your points are Bloodletters.

That would be the best of both worlds, allowing for all Chaos Warrior, all Daemon, or mixed armies.

Turalon wrote:Well I think that it was better when you could mix the books, so that's why I voted yes.

But as for the Demon book being the most over powered, shouldn't the Demon book be the most powerful? Like when you read the fluff they are any army made out of a never ending tide of nightmare creatures. And IMO gameplay should reflect how difficult they are to fight. But then again, if it truly were written according to fluff a Bloodthirster would be a core choice and be something ridiculously cheap like 5pts...

There is a point where fluff and gameplay have to meet in the middle that I think you are failing to realize with this comment. The idea of the game is nearly balanced gameplay, and Fantasy Daemons weren't even close to balanced gameplay at that point.

Obivously with the new edition now it is very different.

I voted 'No', believing this to have been a question for Fantasy and not 40k. In Fantasy, they make perfect sense to be on the battlefield on their own. But in 40k, they should definately be incorporated into C:CSM IMO.

I voted no...

Then I realized I have yet to see or play against a Daemon army in WHFB.

I've played one before in 40k and it wasn't so bad... I lost... but It wasn't like I was cockblocked from doing stuff.

Nah,Daemons have as much of a rich background and character as any other army.

I say let them stay.

I have no problem whatsoever with them being a stand alone army.

I do however mimic alot of the sentiment of other long time chaos players that they should be able to be fielded alond side Chaos.

I play mostly 40k and the generic *summond daemons* and elite *troops with mark of xxx* really fall short of the fluff ball for me. Makes my armies feel way too generic.

What I also miss is the old chaos infighting rules. Seeing Khorne and Tzeentch models on the table togeather kinda makes me yack lol.

Yes, them marching forward/summoned by mortals and beastmen make more sense. A full army of Daemons I don't have a problem with, but did prefer them as they were in 6th.

Well, i play them so...

A ban would not be preferable. I am a huge fan of Nurgle and would rather see a new army book where they would be playable effectively.

I don't think that Daemons should be removed from WHFB, but the current armybook is shamelessly overpowered.

The results would be different if this was asked during 7th

Maybe - I don't think the army should go away, since it offers something different from the others, has hugely iconic GW units, and also looks amazing when converted / painted to the fullest. But the current list is obviously OP and the only thing I like about it is that I luckily only run into it at tournaments (where it rapes my skavenses ) ... FWIW I also think it's a vomitously bland book for what should be the most insane carnival of chaotic critters (un)imaginable!

- Salvage

first and foremost i would like to say that while everyone b about how overpowered deamons are so is every other book. you just got to play them right.
so i say keep the chaos.

And i do believe that they should have a combined chaos book.

and they are not that bad in 40k cause they deepstrike in. hello easy to conrtol where they land. and then just shoot a ton of shots. deamons gone

Having played 40k chaos marines, it was a waaaaaaaaaaaay better codex when they combined both marines and daemons, summoned daemons just don't cut it they are faceless and boring and it doesn't make sense that a horror has the exact same combat ability as a bloodletter........just a bit odd really

H.B.M.C. wrote:I think Fantasy and 40K would be better off without a Daemons book. Talk about "Codex: Unnecessary".

Alongside:
-Space Wolves
-Black Templar
-Blood Angels
-Grey Knights
-Space Marines

Which could easily just be one big book. Unfortunately, they aren't.

Che-Vito wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:I think Fantasy and 40K would be better off without a Daemons book. Talk about "Codex: Unnecessary".

Alongside:
-Space Wolves
-Black Templar
-Blood Angels
-Grey Knights
-Space Marines

Which could easily just be one big book. Unfortunately, they aren't.

I would say Grey Knights are unique enough to warrant their own Dex. Vakathi has made some great posts about how to do a single codex though. Doesn't really matter though, because it will never happen.


I didn't play Fantasy in 7th, but a few people I've talked to said that the new edition really put Daemons where they should have been all long, so it's no longer an OP Army Book. So, Let them stay!

nieto666 wrote:Those who say no own Daemons, those who say yes and maybe don't own them.

I voted no and I have no Daemons, Although when I voted I misunderstood the question, I thought it was asking if it would be better to completely eliminate EVERYTHING daemon related. Now realizing my mistake I would have went with No opinion.