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Johnny-Crass wrote:There should be a cap on both of these....

Fair point. Either a cap or a limit on which armies could take them. I'll admit I was only thinking of my beloved Empire and their paltry 3 attacks at most when I thought of these items.

Clarence wrote:Basic Spear:

As is, except the model wielding a Spear gains the ASF when getting charged.

THIS. Spears being used how they are used.


SKINK BOW: Short bow, Jungle poisons. 1 Point per model.

I'd love my Lizardmen to have some sort of ranged combat ability...

When would you want to do that? If it's rank and file you just want to kill them. If it's a big monster you probably have multi attacks and you'll just want to kill them anyway.

Blade of the Burning Promise. Dark Elves only, 45pts. Two-bladed weapon, counts as two hand weapons. Attacks from this weapon strike at +1 S and count as Flaming.

Sword of Kas. Vampire Counts only, 40pts. Close combat attacks from the Sword of Kas are resolved at +2 Strength, but on a roll of 1 to hit, the wielder suffers a hit from his own weapon at his Strength +2.

AnomanderRake wrote:Blade of the Burning Promise. Dark Elves only, 45pts. Two-bladed weapon, counts as two hand weapons.

Why not just make it Paired Weapons like the Fencer's Blades?

Because it's not supposed to look like that, of course.


Desert Sun and Sickle Moon: This Khopesh and Spiked Shield add +1 to Attacks as an Additional Hand Weapon, allow a 6+ Parry save as for a model armed with Hand Weapon and Shield, and add +1 to the model's armour save as a Shield would. Cannot be taken with a Shield. 15 pts, Tomb Kings only.

Ok I have finished basic testing and will put the first batch of weapons out hopefully this weekend.

Try these

Warp blade-skaven only-80pts

A blade made out of pure warpstone

Counts as a great weapon that ignores armour and ward saves.


Gotreks axe-dwarf slayers only-100pts
grants S10 ASF x2 attacks a 3+ parry save multiple wounds(2d6) and heroic killing blow

Felixs sword-empire only-100pts
grants +4S ASF +2 attacks 4+ parry save multiple wounds(d6[2D6 against dragons]) 2+ward save against flaming attacks and killing blow

Khainespear

Dark Elves only

100 points

This is the favoured weapon of Lord Khaeleth Mournweaver, Ruler of Hag Graef. It is 6 feet of enchanted Naggarrothi blackwood, topped by a narrow leaf-blade forged by Hotek himself. The completed weapon was then consecrated in a Cauldron of Blood.

This is a spear. It ignores armour, grants +2 S and A, as well as the ASF and HKB special rules. Any enemy model in base contact with the user, on the turn he charges, must pass an initiative test or be reduced to 1 A for the remainder of that turn. The user of this weapon also causes terror.


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Widowmaker, Aenarion's Doom, Khaine's Sword

High Elves or Dark Elves only

500 points

Storm of Magic ONLY

This is a sword. Grants 10 attacks, all of which hit and wound automatically. All successful ward saves taken against this weapon must be re-rolled. Ignores armour. Grants Flaming and HKB. Grants bearer a 3+ ward save.

That SoM sword is unbelievably OP. : P Give that to lord with dawnstone & enchanted shield on pegasus/barded horse and you have guy who has re-rollable 1+/2+ AS and 3+ ward and who nearly automatically kills all mages from fulcrums...

Both of them are ludicrously OP. I am a Dark Elf player, but come on, show some damn creativity not just "ALL THE SPECIAL RULES".

Slight drawbacks would be nice. For example, that spear might be Always Strikes Last, instead of First. That way, it's incredibly powerful, but slow enough that you have a chance to defend yourself.

The Axe of Mork
SoM only, O&G only, 300pts
Requires two hands. The wielder may exchange any number of points in WS, S, I and Attacks at the start of their Close Combat phase. For example, a Black Orc Warboss has a WS of 7, S of 5, I of 4 and 4 Attacks. If fighting a monster, he might choose to exchange 3 WS for 3 Strength and one point of Initiative for an attack, becoming WS4, S8, I3 and having 5 attacks. On the turn a Waaagh is declared, the user gains D6 extra points to spend int his way, so might, for example, roll a four, gaining two more strength and two more attacks to fight with Strength 10 and seven attacks! The wielder also gains an extra D6 points in this way if fighting in a challenge against a model with naturally equal or higher WS - Mork is pleased to see such an epic duel. This effect DOES stack with the extra D6 for calling a Waaagh, so a humble Night Goblin Warboss might end up gaining an extra 12 points to distribute freely if the gods are smiling upon him! This effect may never increase a characteristic above 10 or decrease it below 1.

Axe of Mork seems fine, but the d6 in challenge should chage in d3 IMHO

Lets bring back the Tenderizer in all its glory. Y'all Ogre players will know what I mean


Tenderizer: 85 pts

Great Weapon. Multiple Wounds D6. Attacks from the Tenderizer always hit on a 3+, the weapon is simply too massive to avoid. In addition, the bearer may exchange his normal attacks for a sweep attack. If this is done, the bearer inflicts an automatic hit from the weapon on every enemy model in base contact.

Massive Throwing Axes (WoC only)

(Additional Weapons) 10pts

Range 6"

Just like a regular throwing axe but is +2 strength and not quick to fire but instead are slow to fire...

Why? Because even though i like hacking and smashing i'd like my warriors to have some amount of shooting besides a banner...

Not a weapon, but a banner I'd love for my Bretonnians

Banner of the Lady's Retribution
-Unit must have Knight's Vow, Questing Vow, or Grail Vow

When charging, all knights killed before attacking by higher initiative enemies or stand and shoot are resurrected by the lady to make one final charge attack as normal before passing into the spirit realm.

(I'm sick of losing half my knights to stand and shoot and/or higher initiative infantry blocks before they even get to attack)

Not sure how to price this theoretical banner

Pretty powerful, I'd make it 50 points.

When electing to hold as a charge reaction, Spears and Halberds inflict an automatic hit when charged in the front arc for every model in base contact with the charging unit with a spear/halberd resolved at a STR equal to half the distance charged -1.

My cav charged your spear block, the total distance I went is 12 inches, therefore the 5 models you have in base contact with my cav inflict 5 STR 5 hits on my unit.

BronzeJon wrote:
When electing to hold as a charge reaction, Spears and Halberds inflict an automatic hit when charged in the front arc for every model in base contact with the charging unit with a spear/halberd resolved at a STR equal to half the distance charged -1.

My cav charged your spear block, the total distance I went is 12 inches, therefore the 5 models you have in base contact with my cav inflict 5 STR 5 hits on my unit.

I think this would be a pretty good rule to use... makes sense and would allow you to use spearmen much in the way that they were historically used. In history, one of the primary purposes of pikes/spears was as an anit-cav unit

BronzeJon wrote:
When electing to hold as a charge reaction, Spears and Halberds inflict an automatic hit when charged in the front arc for every model in base contact with the charging unit with a spear/halberd resolved at a STR equal to half the distance charged -1.

My cav charged your spear block, the total distance I went is 12 inches, therefore the 5 models you have in base contact with my cav inflict 5 STR 5 hits on my unit.

I like this but maybe have it only affect cavalry? after all cavalry where historicaly the most affected by this.
Just think...... Brettonians charge a horde width unit of 50 clanrats with spears (yes i can deploy one of these-infact its my main unit and frequently pushes my screaming bell)

That is an awfully clunky rule. I'd say the strength is as per a normal hit, for the sake of less math.

If you want halberds to function as spears and pole axes though, I'd have to say they'd just cost more.

Here's some thoughts:

Non-magical equipment:

spear: a model armed with a spear gains Fight In Extra Ranks (1) in any turn it did not charge. In the turn the model is charged, it gains Always Strikes First.
(usually +0pts/model)

lance: a model armed with a lance gains Fight In Extra Ranks (1). In the turn the model charged, it gains Always Strikes First and +2 Strength.
(usually +2pts/model)

halberd: a model armed with a spear gains +1 Strength. In any round it did no charge, them model gains Fight In Extra Ranks (1) in any turn it did not charge.
(usually +2pts/model)

shield: a model armed with a shield improves their armour save by 1. If the model is also using a hand weapon, it gains +1 additional armour and a 6+ Parry save to attacks made in its front arc.

Magical Equipment:

Warpfire-projector (Skaven)- 50pt magic weapon: the model gains a Strength 4 Breath Weapon with the Flaming, Magical, and Multiple Wound (d3) special rules. If a unit suffers one or more casualties from a warpfire-projector, it must make a Panic test. When a model elects to use its warpfire-projector, roll a d6. On a 3+, resolve the attack as normal. On a 2+, use the large round template--centered on the model--instead of the flame template, and resolve the hit as normal, and remove the model as a casualty.

Blade of Oberon (Woodelves)- 85pt magic weapon: requires two hands. The Blade of Oberon grants the user +2 Strength, Multiple Wounds (d3), and Heroic Killing Blow.

Spears and Halberds are already pretty solid. +1 rank of fighting, +1 Str while still able to use a shield. Considering you have to charge to get into combat, and a high movement race could conceivably get auto hit by Str8 attacks, that's really insane.

Not only that, but it does a bad thing that WHFB has an unspoken rule against: don't slow down the game. People should WANT to charge. If the enemy has spears/halberds, you simply won't charge them unless you have to. Units like Gnoblar trappers which have some protection vs. charging or even Night Goblins with Fanatics are wussy units. But Halberd soldiers being somewhat charge-resistant is ungood.

It could be totally historically accurate. It's not balance accurate. Halberds at least would need to be repriced across the board. Spears aren't quite as good, but they'd still need a bump.

OR, if you're going to go this route, give the player a choice of having a "long" halberd/spear. If they choose long they get this rule, but they get ASL. If not, it works as normal. I think that would be fair.

The Horn of Naggarond

150 points

This may be taken on a dreadlord. If he takes this, he can exceed his normal 100 point magic item limit, but may not carry any other magic items.

This horn may be used once per game. Declare that you are using the horn at the start of your charge phase. All friendly Dark Elf units across the table that are Elves, ie not Harpies, hydras,, etc, unless they are mounts, may re-roll all failed charges, and gain 1 extra D6 to the charge roll, for the duration of that charge phase. All said units also gain the ASF, ITP, Cause Fear and Unbreakable USRs for the duration of that game turn.

So basically every round you give everyone:
+D6 Charge (that alone is at least a 50pt item. It's 25 points for DoC and it affects one unit once. It's 55pts in BRB for a free reroll on one unit). Yours affects all DE on the entire map.
-ASF for everyone! I don't know how much that's worth, but a whole lot.
-Fear/ITP is at least 50pts. BRB it costs 50 to give one unit Terror.
-Unbreakable is about the granddaddy of buffs. I don't know DE and how much a dreadlord costs, but if this horn did nothing except give Unbreakable it would be worth 150. DoC has one that gives Stubborn in 12" and it's 125. Though admittedly they benefit a lot more cuz they are also Unstable.

Still, this is an awful lot of bonuses for one item.

You missed where he said one use only.

Yeah I did.

I guess it's not bad for one use. In general they don't have ITEMS that are super deathy one use no saves/dispel. But it's not like this is casting Dwellers. A lot of its buffs are essentially defensive. Though I don't know the DE book and I don't know how it synergizes with it.

So I take away most of my former rant.

Eh 1 turn with all those bonuses is enough to win most games; just use it on round 2 or 3 when everything is about to be or already in combat and most of your army is still on the board. Auto-win!

Now if it stipulated that you were only allowed to use that horn on turn 1 or turn 6--then I would be ok with it =p

I don't think you'd auto-win much. Re-rolling chanrges? You'll get into a combat or two you might not have. Always Strike First? How many units are there with a higher Initiative than Dark Elves anyway? And as for Immune to Psychology, Fear, and Unbreakable...those aren't winning you anything. The'yre just helping you not lose.

@Duke: I agree with you on simple and easy rules, and creating anti-incentive to charge is an excellent point. Halberds seem pretty solid to me (...but they cannot use shields. Or have I missed something?); I was just offering a possible alternate for people who want "halberd" in Warhammer to mean "halberd", rather than "pole axe".
But spears are nonexistant on the table right now. I mean, if they were balanced, halberdiers and spearmen might see more equal play. Or I might consider giving my Night Goblins some spears. Or switching my polearms for spears on my Men-At-Arms.
Always Strike First seems to make sense to me, and it would give those units a slight edge; elite units don't use spears, and they're the ones who really benefit from Always Strike First.
Right now, it seems like the hand weapon/shield combo is a little better than the spear/shield one, and it's usually cheaper. Spears should either cost the same (the loss of a Parry save is minor compared to an extra rank of attacks, but I think it evens out when you consider that the first bonus applies to every model, not just to the 11th-15th guys), or be decidedly better.
The biggest issue would probably be Saurus with ASF for a turn...

You can have halberds and shield in ranged combat and when they close they are 2h but really they are just NOT ASL.

Of all the weapons that need help I think AHW is #1 and a distant distant 2nd is maybe spears. But one thing they did do was make spears dirt cheap.

I think ASF is way too good. They were really careful with what units got access to what weapons. Which is why you almost never see slowby cheap units with access to GW. Cuz it's not much of a penalty giving ASF to Init 1. Likewise, the stuff with access to spear could go from Init 1 to infinity and that might not have been anticipated. I don't think they are that bad. To give bonuses that high, I think you'd need a drawback, like -1M. If you're trucking around a real 12ft spear, you're not that fast.

Mounted you get +1 str the first round. It could work on ground too?


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Warpsolution wrote:
I don't think you'd auto-win much. Re-rolling chanrges? You'll get into a combat or two you might not have. Always Strike First? How many units are there with a higher Initiative than Dark Elves anyway? And as for Immune to Psychology, Fear, and Unbreakable...those aren't winning you anything. The'yre just helping you not lose.

Thinking on it a bit more it's an interesting concept. I don't know if the points are right, but it does what I personally like in this section: gives and takes. 150pts is huge, that's half a dragon or 15 core troops. Not to mention you have to get a dreadlord who is now naked except for a horn. And it forces you to invest more in DE units to hope more are able to capitalize on it. It could be that it's merely a round of really good morale.