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I want soft-backs back as well. I think hard-back books are around 50% more expensive due the materials & shipping / transport costs. I could never see a great reason for the hard-backs esp when the turn-over of some Codex's is so high &ie they don't have to last 10 years).
BTW I still have books in fairly good nick from the 90's so the argument that you need hardbacks for longevity is a bit far-stretched if you look after your stuff.

That's me, and because I don't buy the books, I don't buy the models either, I don't buy the rules, I don't buy any of the formations, dataslates or their add-on items that I might have been tempted into once I had the core rules.

So for the sake of trying to screw an extra £15 out of me for the Tau codex, GW have actually lost at least £100 of sales on codex, rules and additional models (Riptide, etc.)




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not believe it is merely coincidence that GW's annual sales fell 8% the year after doubling the price of codexes.

yeah,
If they sell hardbacks at £30
And softbacks at £15-20

How much will electronic versions sell for?

I'm of the opnion they should be £10 and you get the ibook/ebook free with the hardcopies...

Panic...

I remember when they were like $30-40 oz glory days

although im skeptical of what the price would be

im assuming maybe $60 oz maybe

 Kilkrazy wrote:
That's me, and because I don't buy the books, I don't buy the models either, I don't buy the rules, I don't buy any of the formations, dataslates or their add-on items that I might have been tempted into once I had the core rules.

So for the sake of trying to screw an extra £15 out of me for the Tau codex, GW have actually lost at least £100 of sales on codex, rules and additional models (Riptide, etc.)




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not believe it is merely coincidence that GW's annual sales fell 8% the year after doubling the price of codexes.

Yeah, GW seemed to have this idea in their mind that their whole customer base would just bend over and take this. After many months, I have finally invested in the new DE book simply because I like the army so much.

But I refuse to pay $50 for the extra special rules in the supplements (since that is what that Coven book boils down to), and I am loathe to buy the Ork codex I need, as well as the damn 7th edition rule book!

And this is coming from someone who bought the LE 6th Edition rule book, so please don't mis-characterize me as someone who simply won't buy 40k books. I do...or at least I used to. That extra $15 they tacked onto every book, coupled with the halved lifespan of 6th resulted in me ending all of my purchases for 40k. Would I come back if they addressed these price issues? Probably, I certainly *want* to play 40k, but I'm not going to put up with being fleeced for ing paper products that hold little objective value and are invalidated in a relatively short space of time.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
That's me, and because I don't buy the books, I don't buy the models either, I don't buy the rules, I don't buy any of the formations, dataslates or their add-on items that I might have been tempted into once I had the core rules.

So for the sake of trying to screw an extra £15 out of me for the Tau codex, GW have actually lost at least £100 of sales on codex, rules and additional models (Riptide, etc.)




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not believe it is merely coincidence that GW's annual sales fell 8% the year after doubling the price of codexes.

Ontop of that.. the new codices look terrible, imo. The layout looks amateurish, the fluff is gutted, there are barely any pictures compared to previous books. In general they raised the prices, cut the costs and reduced the content. It's no longer a book I want to own unlike 5th ed books which had higher production values.

 Kirasu wrote:

 Kilkrazy wrote:
That's me, and because I don't buy the books, I don't buy the models either, I don't buy the rules, I don't buy any of the formations, dataslates or their add-on items that I might have been tempted into once I had the core rules.

So for the sake of trying to screw an extra £15 out of me for the Tau codex, GW have actually lost at least £100 of sales on codex, rules and additional models (Riptide, etc.)




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not believe it is merely coincidence that GW's annual sales fell 8% the year after doubling the price of codexes.

Ontop of that.. the new codices look terrible, imo. The layout looks amateurish, the fluff is gutted, there are barely any pictures compared to previous books. In general they raised the prices, cut the costs and reduced the content. It's no longer a book I want to own unlike 5th ed books which had higher production values.

*shrugs* different strokes for different folks. Personally from 5th I only got my Necron codex and that's it, and when 6th arrived I started collecting every codex because of how amazing I think the books are. To me, everything about the new codeci, codex supplement and campaign supplement like Leviathan are things of beauty,

You like the removal of fluff and the inclusion of huge photos rather than original artwork?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
You like the removal of fluff and the inclusion of huge photos rather than original artwork?

Well... I don't agree with that sentiment, the only codex I felt was truly light concerning the fluff so far was the Imperial Guard one. But hey, I'm relatively new to the hobby, my first codeci were the 5th ones, so maybe that's why I can easily enjoy the new stuff

What I miss from the older style codices were the pages dedicated to the fluff, from a specific POV. Like the Imperial Reports on the Necrons from the 3rd Ed Book, or of World Eaters taking cover from artillery when Kharn pops up and kills them for being cowards.

In 5th Ed I eventually bought every codex. The cost was high but manageable, when they decided to go to all hardback I have only bought one codex so far. I wanted to buy the others but at almost double the cost ... I could not justify it. If they do start releasing each codex in soft cover for about the same price as they were in 5th ... I will begin my collection of every codex again.

Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
That's me, and because I don't buy the books, I don't buy the models either, I don't buy the rules, I don't buy any of the formations, dataslates or their add-on items that I might have been tempted into once I had the core rules.

So for the sake of trying to screw an extra £15 out of me for the Tau codex, GW have actually lost at least £100 of sales on codex, rules and additional models (Riptide, etc.)




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do not believe it is merely coincidence that GW's annual sales fell 8% the year after doubling the price of codexes.

^This. My £2-3k per year hobby spend has stayed the same, where GW used to see 100% of that, now they see less than 10%.

I'm not sure how excited people should get at this news though.....isn't the difference between the hard and softcover end times books £5?

The problem isn't so much price (I'm willing to pay a premium for a full color hardcover), it's that it was combined with the insane acceleration of product releases. The books not only cost more, but to keep up with all the releases I needed to buy a lot more of them, not even taking into account all the ebook releases, I would need to spend x3-x4 the amount of money I spend on GW rulebooks on a yearly basis. Combined with the ebooks (insane pricing on a handfull of pages of rules) I threw the towl in the ring regarding GW rulebooks.

Just cheaper softcovers isn't going to change that...

Herzlos wrote:
Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

Sadly, I think this is likely to be closest to reality. I think if introduced, the soft-cover books will be around the same price point that the hard-cover books are now and the hard-cover books will rise in price accordingly. It really isn't in GW's nature and hasn't been for some time to lower prices by any significant amount.

 filbert wrote:

Herzlos wrote:
Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

Sadly, I think this is likely to be closest to reality. I think if introduced, the soft-cover books will be around the same price point that the hard-cover books are now and the hard-cover books will rise in price accordingly. It really isn't in GW's nature and hasn't been for some time to lower prices by any significant amount.

Not to burn through all my optimism for the week, but maybe GW is actually trying to change? Switching to a different format would let GW lower prices and save face. If they just dropped the price on the hardbacks, it’s hard to do without admitting there is a problem, or they’ve been excessively gouging us these past years. But switching to softcover lets them pass the saving on to us, while toning back the crazy pricing strategy that’s not working well for them.

While I love my fluff as much as the next guy, I’d support a return to the thin, rules-dense 3rd ed codex style if we could return to those prices. Keep the all-inclusive current style as the “special edition” or just outsource the fluff to the folks over in the Black Library wing of the company. But by lowering the cost of entry, we can get more people playing the game.

Just my undercaffinated wishlisting for a monday morning.

 Nevelon wrote:

 filbert wrote:

Herzlos wrote:
Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

Sadly, I think this is likely to be closest to reality. I think if introduced, the soft-cover books will be around the same price point that the hard-cover books are now and the hard-cover books will rise in price accordingly. It really isn't in GW's nature and hasn't been for some time to lower prices by any significant amount.

Not to burn through all my optimism for the week, but maybe GW is actually trying to change? Switching to a different format would let GW lower prices and save face. If they just dropped the price on the hardbacks, it’s hard to do without admitting there is a problem, or they’ve been excessively gouging us these past years. But switching to softcover lets them pass the saving on to us, while toning back the crazy pricing strategy that’s not working well for them.

While I love my fluff as much as the next guy, I’d support a return to the thin, rules-dense 3rd ed codex style if we could return to those prices. Keep the all-inclusive current style as the “special edition” or just outsource the fluff to the folks over in the Black Library wing of the company. But by lowering the cost of entry, we can get more people playing the game.

Just my undercaffinated wishlisting for a monday morning.

But remember, Finecast was cheaper and was also supposed to pass the savings onto the customers. Look how that turned out.

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:

 filbert wrote:

Herzlos wrote:
Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

Sadly, I think this is likely to be closest to reality. I think if introduced, the soft-cover books will be around the same price point that the hard-cover books are now and the hard-cover books will rise in price accordingly. It really isn't in GW's nature and hasn't been for some time to lower prices by any significant amount.

Not to burn through all my optimism for the week, but maybe GW is actually trying to change? Switching to a different format would let GW lower prices and save face. If they just dropped the price on the hardbacks, it’s hard to do without admitting there is a problem, or they’ve been excessively gouging us these past years. But switching to softcover lets them pass the saving on to us, while toning back the crazy pricing strategy that’s not working well for them.

While I love my fluff as much as the next guy, I’d support a return to the thin, rules-dense 3rd ed codex style if we could return to those prices. Keep the all-inclusive current style as the “special edition” or just outsource the fluff to the folks over in the Black Library wing of the company. But by lowering the cost of entry, we can get more people playing the game.

Just my undercaffinated wishlisting for a monday morning.

But remember, Finecast was cheaper and was also supposed to pass the savings onto the customers. Look how that turned out.

Ultimately, we shall have to wait and see but with GW, it is very much a case of 'once bitten, twice shy'. We have seen examples of this in the past where people have claimed that a reboxing or rebranding or similar will result in lower prices but very rarely does it actually turn out that way. Like many others, I would be delighted were this actually to be the case so I am not without hope but the cynic in me is going to hold off until I see it with my own eyes.

 filbert wrote:

Herzlos wrote:
Last codex I bought was £18 (£20 with 10% discount). If they get back to that price I'll buy more, since it's only 30% more expensive than everyone else (standard paperback army book price seems to be about £15, and I've bought plenty on a whim).

Somehow I can only see them being mini books at £25-30 whilst the full size hardbacks move up to £35-40.

Sadly, I think this is likely to be closest to reality. I think if introduced, the soft-cover books will be around the same price point that the hard-cover books are now and the hard-cover books will rise in price accordingly. It really isn't in GW's nature and hasn't been for some time to lower prices by any significant amount.

This has been very much the MO for GW since, well, pretty much since I returned to tabletopping proper and stopped just being a fluff bunny which was around mid-5th.

"Take an idea that everybody heartily endorses and get's enthusiastic about, then find some way to subvert it so it pisses those same people off."

MWHistorian wrote:But remember, Finecast was cheaper and was also supposed to pass the savings onto the customers. Look how that turned out.

filbert wrote:Ultimately, we shall have to wait and see but with GW, it is very much a case of 'once bitten, twice shy'. We have seen examples of this in the past where people have claimed that a reboxing or rebranding or similar will result in lower prices but very rarely does it actually turn out that way. Like many others, I would be delighted were this actually to be the case so I am not without hope but the cynic in me is going to hold off until I see it with my own eyes.

Keep your harsh reality out of my rampant optimism! It upsets the kittens and unicorns.

Hope springs eternal. Or is the first step on the road to disappointment. At this point I don’t really expect any changes, but part of me still dreams that GW will wake up and make some improvements. Even vague signs of a gradual shift back towards sanity would be great.

 Nevelon wrote:
Keep your harsh reality out of my rampant optimism! It upsets the kittens and unicorns.

Could be me, but that unicorn looks like it's trying to drown the kittens behind your back... BAD UNICORN! ;-)

That sounds good to me.
At a reduced price i would think about buying more codexes again.

If they want to keep selling the hardback editions, they would do well to offer a free digital copy with a purchase of one of them. That way they'd be good value for money vs the paperback. Paperback buyers could get a discount on the digital edition, if they wanted to go that way.

I actully like soft cover books, because I like getting them rebound with spiral binding and a clear cover.

Makes the books last longer, and let's you lie them flat on the table. So useful.

As long as the soft cover books drop back to at-least the pre-hard cover prices....

 Fenriswulf wrote:
If they want to keep selling the hardback editions, they would do well to offer a free digital copy with a purchase of one of them. That way they'd be good value for money vs the paperback. Paperback buyers could get a discount on the digital edition, if they wanted to go that way.

There are a number of ways they could incorporate the digital side better. One thing about bundling PDFs/e-pub versions of the rules is I suspect that might happen only if you ordered direct from GW (so they could e-mail you the key/etc.) So people would have to choose between discounters, or free/discounted electronic copies.

Of course, there are other ways to handle it, but I suspect that this might be the easiest way.

Cheaper as in Finecraft cheaper or digital codex cheaper.

I think people are deluding themselves if they think there's going to be some uber saving.

Nagash hardback in slipcover case when it was available was £50
They've now released the paperback version at £45

Not much of a saving for something looking considerable inferior.

I suppose the codex price would come down a fraction, then after a few releases, would jump back to the hardback price. So the net result is us paying the hardback price for a paperback.

Another boost for the GW coffers and shareholders.
:-(

Why should softcover books be so much cheaper than the hardcover ones? I do not work in the printing industry but as far as i know the markup in terms of material costs is only a slight markup. Most of the added cost of hardbacks is usually the premium you pay as a customer for a nicer look and to get the novel a month or so in advance. Most of the cost is personal costs starting with the author, the layouter, ... All those costs you have for every book and it doesn't matter if it's hard soft or electronic.

For ebooks you might save the handling of physical product but Apple and Google all want there money too. And I am pretty certain that the apple version takes a lot of time to produce. All those links etc. need to be placed and that's where the value of the apple book lies.

So I rather keep the books as they are right now. The new 40k format with all rules and points in one section is great. And well I like many miniature pictures in my books. Original art from time to time is ok but I play with miniatures and not pencils.

Lorien wrote:
Why should softcover books be so much cheaper than the hardcover ones? I do not work in the printing industry but as far as i know the markup in terms of material costs is only a slight markup. Most of the added cost of hardbacks is usually the premium you pay as a customer for a nicer look and to get the novel a month or so in advance. Most of the cost is personal costs starting with the author, the layouter, ... All those costs you have for every book and it doesn't matter if it's hard soft or electronic.

For ebooks you might save the handling of physical product but Apple and Google all want there money too. And I am pretty certain that the apple version takes a lot of time to produce. All those links etc. need to be placed and that's where the value of the apple book lies.

So I rather keep the books as they are right now. The new 40k format with all rules and points in one section is great. And well I like many miniature pictures in my books. Original art from time to time is ok but I play with miniatures and not pencils.

Pics of models that what the Heavy Metal part of the codex is for.... wait never mind.

Lorien wrote:
Why should softcover books be so much cheaper than the hardcover ones?

I guess they don't. But then GW did increase the price significantly when they moved to hardcover using that as the reason for the price increase.

GW marketing 1, consumers 0