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I'm a bit concerned about templates. As someone who uses the standard platoon OOB of a country that used large squads I find it much more difficult manoeuvring my squads than someone with a 7 man minmaxed vet squad and frequently need to bunch up due to how my clubs terrain is.

For example in the last scenario game (Island defence) we played the defensive positions that I was given bunched my guys up into a squares which would have made them amazing artillery targets.

I am willing to give it a go but I can't help but worry that I might need to make a massive overhaul of my army, argue a lot about the terrain setup or consider starting a new army.

Not having templates in 1.0 was actually one of the big sells for me. Much rather roll a dice to figure out the number of potential casualties than get into template placement discussions. Even with the nicest opponent, templates are just a disagreement waiting to happen.

squad spacing is a significant issue in real life though - i welcome these changes.

I can see the light howitzer being made redundant though - i'd like to see how the sturmtigers 4D6 HE be represented as well.

Overall, tactical changes with officers drawing dice out of the bag will make snipers more preferential and the use of senior officers in swarm based lists like the Japanese.

badgermeister wrote:
squad spacing is a significant issue in real life though - i welcome these changes.

I can see the light howitzer being made redundant though - i'd like to see how the sturmtigers 4D6 HE be represented as well.

Overall, tactical changes with officers drawing dice out of the bag will make snipers more preferential and the use of senior officers in swarm based lists like the Japanese.

In real life squads arent required to maintain 1" coherency though.

I too was drawn to having no templates in 1st ed. Its so much easier to just roll a die or 3 to determine effect without having to wrangle a template around terrain and models. Not really sure why people would have issue with it.

I'd imagine they did it to ease the transition for 40k players (and lets be honest, thats a major source of new players). Its not like templates are objectively superior. About the only thing they add is that a potential "miss" can still hit other units.

Heres hoping its a more straight line deviation like Starship troopers did, aka you either fall short or go over, theres no accidentally hitting 20 feet to the right of the target from 40 feet away like 40k does

There are tons of templates in BA1, though. Off-board artillery uses templates, and mortars and on-board artillery firing smoke are all templates. Often many games will have several templates on the table.

BA2's templates are to
a) unify the system, so there's not templates for one type of firing and no templates for another type
b) reduce overkill (unit of three guys gets hit by 15 hits from an HE3d6 weapon, taking five hits per model)
c) reduce unrealistic deathstar clumps of guys charging across the field

I will repeat once again that it has been indicated by Alessio that there is no such thing as template deviation in BA2. If you miss, the shot misses (just like current HE), if you hit, you place a template.

This new method means that smaller units won't be taking the 2, 3, 4, 5 hits per model under current HE rules; and large units will take less hits if they are properly dispersed as per real-world tactics, unlike the current HE rules which do not reward actual battlefield tactics.

does that mean infantry units will be able to spread out more now? Because 1" spacing is pretty tight.

 privateer4hire wrote:
Not having templates in 1.0 was actually one of the big sells for me. Much rather roll a dice to figure out the number of potential casualties than get into template placement discussions. Even with the nicest opponent, templates are just a disagreement waiting to happen.

Know what? I agree. When playing 40k, that often happens (especially when the guy you shoot at tries to avoid the maximum damage...)

Just to confirm, is this a full starter set with everything needed to play a game, ie two forces and the rules?
It's something I've been looking at getting into and this could be the way to do it

To be honest, they still haven't released it for either pre order nor announced precisly and officially its content in the news letter if i'm not mistaken. Though, according to how they built "D-Day Firefight", my guess is that they're gonna keep the same kind of composition and just introduce new models in it.

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:
Not having templates in 1.0 was actually one of the big sells for me. Much rather roll a dice to figure out the number of potential casualties than get into template placement discussions. Even with the nicest opponent, templates are just a disagreement waiting to happen.

Know what? I agree. When playing 40k, that often happens (especially when the guy you shoot at tries to avoid the maximum damage...)

Definitely. Remember a guy playing 40k orks who used to have a little 2" measure that he used to ensure each of his miniatures was as fully dispersed as possible. It does encourage gamey behaviour, but hopefully for BA2 the rule will have been implemented with intelligence.

 Huron black heart wrote:
Just to confirm, is this a full starter set with everything needed to play a game, ie two forces and the rules?
It's something I've been looking at getting into and this could be the way to do it

From what I've heard around the internet, it's gonna be two sections of US Airborne, a section of German Grenadiers and a Puma armored car, a piece of terrain, mini rule book, dice, pin markers, range rulers, hopefully some templates. Nothing official has been announed yet, so take it salty, but you should have everything (apart from glue) to game.

Received an offer from Wayland Games the other day with this



I assume it must be 1st ed. still, considering how far off the 2nd ed. book is? Will drop them a note to check.

Considering the books gonna be released by fall that surely wont be any 2nd edition one. They just wanna get rid of the 1st rulebooks they still have in stock

 Bonegrinder wrote:

 Huron black heart wrote:
Just to confirm, is this a full starter set with everything needed to play a game, ie two forces and the rules?
It's something I've been looking at getting into and this could be the way to do it

From what I've heard around the internet, it's gonna be two sections of US Airborne, a section of German Grenadiers and a Puma armored car, a piece of terrain, mini rule book, dice, pin markers, range rulers, hopefully some templates. Nothing official has been announed yet, so take it salty, but you should have everything (apart from glue) to game.

Either way it is still a great deal, especially for that Puma.

Why is it that every time I pick up a TT game, a new ruleset gets dropped like 6 months later?

 Pacific wrote:
Received an offer from Wayland Games the other day with this

Spoiler:

I assume it must be 1st ed. still, considering how far off the 2nd ed. book is? Will drop them a note to check.

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
Considering the books gonna be released by fall that surely wont be any 2nd edition one. They just wanna get rid of the 1st rulebooks they still have in stock

If Wayland's reputation is anything to go by then 2nd Ed will be out before you get a dispatched email

I think they mean the "Armies of" and campaign books, and all but the German army book is useable with 2nd Ed, the only softback core rules is in the starter set. Free with a £50 order is good, would've got my Konflikt starter from them if it wasn't for their poor rep at getting things out the door and to their customers.

 Stormonu wrote:
Why is it that every time I pick up a TT game, a new ruleset gets dropped like 6 months later?

Same comrade! We're doomed!!!

 Bonegrinder wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
Received an offer from Wayland Games the other day with this

Spoiler:

I assume it must be 1st ed. still, considering how far off the 2nd ed. book is? Will drop them a note to check.

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
Considering the books gonna be released by fall that surely wont be any 2nd edition one. They just wanna get rid of the 1st rulebooks they still have in stock

If Wayland's reputation is anything to go by then 2nd Ed will be out before you get a dispatched email

I think they mean the "Armies of" and campaign books, and all but the German army book is useable with 2nd Ed, the only softback core rules is in the starter set. Free with a £50 order is good, would've got my Konflikt starter from them if it wasn't for their poor rep at getting things out the door and to their customers.

Comment for another thread, and I know its anecdotal, but I've not had any problems with ordering from Wayland. That's probably getting on for a dozen orders over the past 3-4 years.

I think a lot of the issues (from what I have read) were in ordering the really high volume GW stuff on release, which Wayland were taking pre-orders from, but then not able to fulfil.

 Pacific wrote:

 Bonegrinder wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
Received an offer from Wayland Games the other day with this

Spoiler:

I assume it must be 1st ed. still, considering how far off the 2nd ed. book is? Will drop them a note to check.

 Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote:
Considering the books gonna be released by fall that surely wont be any 2nd edition one. They just wanna get rid of the 1st rulebooks they still have in stock

If Wayland's reputation is anything to go by then 2nd Ed will be out before you get a dispatched email

I think they mean the "Armies of" and campaign books, and all but the German army book is useable with 2nd Ed, the only softback core rules is in the starter set. Free with a £50 order is good, would've got my Konflikt starter from them if it wasn't for their poor rep at getting things out the door and to their customers.

Comment for another thread, and I know its anecdotal, but I've not had any problems with ordering from Wayland. That's probably getting on for a dozen orders over the past 3-4 years.

I think a lot of the issues (from what I have read) were in ordering the really high volume GW stuff on release, which Wayland were taking pre-orders from, but then not able to fulfil.

I think the main issues people were finding was with their "available" stock status. E.g. not in stock but would get it in "1-3 days" (could have been 3-5).

I've had longer than month-long waits on things in this status from both the Malifaux and spartan games ranges & neither of the items were new releases - Their customer support then just fobbed me off with "it'll be here at the end of the week", from around week 3 onwards.

My experience with them was definitely flavoured due to gak going down irl, but shortly after I'd seen their "representatives" posting on this forum and basically being very rude to people in a very tom kirby-esque fashion.

TLDR - Wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them.

So just had the warlord games news letter saying there will be special offers sent out to news letter subscribers. Will be keeping an eye out although will pick up it from a discount retailer online.
Unless they pull something good out of the bag.

I will be interested to see what we get through the news letter. I am interested in some good platic us and british paras, but we will see as their plasic us infantry have ginormous heads with tiny bodies.

 Maniac_nmt wrote:
I will be interested to see what we get through the news letter. I am interested in some good platic us and british paras, but we will see as their plasic us infantry have ginormous heads with tiny bodies.

They do but to be fair they are an older kit now. Started to put some of the newish grenadier models together last night and they are a lot more in proportion. Infact one of the best figure kits I've built in a while.

 Maniac_nmt wrote:
I will be interested to see what we get through the news letter. I am interested in some good platic us and british paras, but we will see as their plasic us infantry have ginormous heads with tiny bodies.

You know' even in real life the american soldiers seemed to have a big head due to their double helmet a light one a'd a heavy one. So, that's quite realistic

Sorry wrong thread.

I posted this in the rumors section, but will post again for anyone that missed it

BA 2nd Ed rulebook and starter up for pre-order with special offer for existing customers. General Patton figure comes with orders of the hardback rule book direct from Warlord games. The US Airborne are on the wish list!









Contents:

24 New Plastic US Airborne

12 Plastic German Grenadiers

Plastic SdKfz 251/10 AusfD. 3.7cm PaK half track

Plastic Ruined Farm

A5 Softback Bolt Action 2 Rules Book

Quick Start Guide

Quick Reference Sheet

12 Plastic Pin Markers

Plastic Templates and Tokens

Construction Diagrams

10 Six Sided Dice

10 Order Dice



http://www.warlordgames.com/pre-order-bolt-action-2-and-the-band-of-brothers-starter-set/

starter set looks darn great, but i'd have loved to see them giving a bit more variety to germans.

Thus it seems the poor germans won't be granted anything the east useful as special rules... that's a pity!

I hope the US airborne soldiers are gonna be released as box on its own.

I agree, would have preferred a Puma armoured car to the half-track. I have no idea what free infantry to get. I have all the Grenadiers and Soviet troops i'll ever need as it is never too early to start my brits, I guess.

Well, i pesonnaly planned as Market Garden British Paratroopers as a third army... but that'll be later on

I think they didn't give a puma because the poor airborne would've been going to struggle to much with it since it can rely on both recce and 8+. And in so far as this is unlikely to be changed that would be a good explanation why they dropped they're overnumbering halftracks in it.

The changes are Worth a second edition in term of variety but i'm very concerned about officiers allowing more plays than you have units and these harrowing templates... shivers.

Whatever happens i'm waiting for feedbacks before even thinking to clicking on purchase button.

Damn, no Puma. I am a little disappointed here.

Don't mind not including a Puma since the Germans only made like 100 of them. The 251/10 is a great vehicle to include, as you can transport guys and it has antitank capabilities - plus, if you can easily expand the German force with the Grenadiers or Fallschirmjager starter army sets and won't duplicate the vehicle (Grenadiers Starter Army set has Puma and StuG; Fallschirmjager Starter Army set has 251/1 and StuG)