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@Imateria - Well they have been identical for decades. I'm annoyed by such sudden changes.

Stealers have been described as vicious shock troops, the terrors of close combat for as long as I can remember.

Now they're lard arses.

I'mean sorry, I am just bitter about this on top of several editions of SM players moaning about Nods killing their stuff in CC.

 Souleater wrote:

 Jackal wrote:

The stealers in a cult are famed for being far more effective than those of a normal hivefleet

This is the first time I have heard this.

Can you provide a source, please?

I think they messed with the fluff to legtitimise the changes. There is now absolutely no reason to use codex genestealets. Originally the genestealers you used in the codex were a mix of normal purestrains and GSC 4th gens. Weirdly enough said 4th gen cultists (as did all cultists) used to come under control of the hive mind... which has since been changed in the new fluff.

In fact the only difference between a broodlord and patriarch as it currently stands is a broodlord is bred specifically to be the first to infest a new planet, while any puresteain genestealer has the possibility of becoming a patriarch when needed. So in theory a broodlord would be the more powerful leader of a cult.... while weaker when used as a freshly spawned leader for some genestealers.

Now on the issue of fluff gsc stealers vs nid stealers.... I always presumed nids stealers would be more shock infantry (tougher and harder hitting) while gsc's stealers would be more infiltrators amd ambushers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The solution would be simple. Give nid genestealers a 4+ save, base bonus to charging, more deadly vs armour, more upgrade options etc. While keeping cultist ones as they are. All being 14 points.

The shock infantry in the Tyranid Codex are Warriors and Raveners. Genestealers are infiltration and ambush units, like Lictors. They're not designed as dedicated combat units at all.

Alcibiades wrote:
The shock infantry in the Tyranid Codex are Warriors and Raveners. Genestealers are infiltration and ambush units, like Lictors. They're not designed as dedicated combat units at all.

Then give them a points decrease say to 10-12ppm and half the cost of all the upgrades, make broodlords cost 30 pts instead of 60.

Alcibiades wrote:
The shock infantry in the Tyranid Codex are Warriors and Raveners. Genestealers are infiltration and ambush units, like Lictors. They're not designed as dedicated combat units at all.

genestealers have been describes as shock troopers and also infiltrators for an extremely long time..... albeit in their current form they can't perform that role.

Alcibiades wrote:
The shock infantry in the Tyranid Codex are Warriors and Raveners. Genestealers are infiltration and ambush units, like Lictors. They're not designed as dedicated combat units at all.

''Genestealers are legendarily ferocious close combat opponents, with lightning fast reflexes and deadly claws, capable of ripping through adamantium.''

That's taken from their description on GW Webstore.

The thing is people for a long time have identified genestealers as not being good enough. Good for GW for doing something about it in GSC.

Lets just hope 'nid 'stealer problems don't get forgot about if/when their codex cycles back round.

Yep, I'd be happy if they kept "purestrains" as GSC, and discounted "fresh hatchlings" for us Nids....maybe let us take Purestrains as an Elite choice, because the Hive Mind took them over. One thing I'd Really like to see is being able to purchase Flesh hooks for them though!

Tyranids have 'gaunts for cheap spam.

I'd much rather see 'Stealers e brought up to be worth their current points.

Cheap spam units aren't the same as an infiltrator unit. Currently Genestealers are meant to throw off your opponent's infiltrators, be a distraction carnifex for your distraction carnifex (which they're pretty bad at) and/or camp objectives if they live long enough.

Discount hive Genestealers at 11 or 12 ppm would be fine with me. Granted they should come stock with stealth (and probably flesh hooks).

Genestealers should be for killing things dead in assault.