Death From the Skies

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**Sinful Hero**

Air Superiority sounds like a good way to inspire sales.

I'm assuming if you control the skies, all of your opponents reserves get -1. I wonder if FMCs count towards that?

Copying from previous page.

Warhams-77 wrote:
Iuchiban - Warseer

I will try to sumarize the new stuff:

All Flyers have now three new Atributes: Combat Role, Pursuit and Agility (the more the better)

When shooting there are two types of targes: Ground and flying. Flying targets are FMC, other Flyers, Jetbikes and Grav vehicles. The rest are ground targets.

New rule: Air superiority: If a player has Flyers in Reserve at the end of the Aerial Duel Phase can add +1/-1 to their reserve rolls. Opponent has -1 to reserve rolls.

Any flyer can now make an additional pivot at any point of ther movement if they roll their Agility or less in a single D6.

Only Flyers with the Attack Role can have AA when shooting, but they have -1 BS when shooting Ground Targets.

Flyers do not benefit from cover (Terrain or other models)

When moving Flat Out you can add your Pursuit to the distance

The different combat roles give different bonusses depending on the type of the Attack Pattern.

There are 6 different attack patterns. If I could post a picture of the patterns I would do it, but I think that it is forbidden ...

**SinisterSamurai**

Warhams-77 wrote:

The different combat roles give different bonusses depending on the type of the Attack Pattern.

There are 6 different attack patterns. If I could post a picture of the patterns I would do it, but I think that it is forbidden ...

Convince him to PM you the images or post them to 4chan or something

Lanlaorn wrote:The guy on Warseer said none of the datasheets have new stats, though, right?

So I think it's just BA & GK getting screwed again.

I doubt he's compared every line, but it seems like most of the ones he's checked are the same.

**casvalremdeikun**

Hmmm, seems like Strafing Run became a godsend of you want to shoot ground targets with your Stormtalon (an Attack role flyer).

Also, if this is true, jetbikes now have their worst enemy in the form of the Stalker tank squadron.

**Warhams-77**

I think it means that jetbikes only count as flyers when they are shot at by flyers. I dont think this will affect tanks shooting at them.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

SinisterSamurai wrote:
Warhams-77 wrote:

The different combat roles give different bonusses depending on the type of the Attack Pattern.

There are 6 different attack patterns. If I could post a picture of the patterns I would do it, but I think that it is forbidden ...

Convince him to PM you the images or post them to 4chan or something

An upload seems to be in progress

Automatically Appended Next Post:
NZ Preorders are online

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-NZ/Warhammer-40-000?N=102331+4294967192&Nu=product.repositoryId&qty=96&sorting=phl&view=table&categoryId=cat440130a-flat

Automatically Appended Next Post:

**casvalremdeikun**

Stormhawk appears to use the same cockpit bottom as the Stormtalon, so swapping the enclosed cockpit for the original seems to be an option. Yay for me, at least.

**Sledgehammer**

As an IG player why the hell would I buy a 58$ book that nerfs one of the only decent units, and then forgets to include the other units that could support it?

I'm sorry but, I was looking forward to this, and am now appalled.

**Warhams-77**

The Vendetta could be on the same datasheet as the Valkyrie

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Iuchiban - Warseer

To sumarize a litte bit:

Duel Phase happens at the beginning of each Player's turn. It is optional. It only involves Flyers in reserve or active reserves. If a player wants to skip the phase, roll a d6. Winner decides.

4 Subphases:
Interception
Aproximation
Maneuver
Attack

INTERCEPTION
Each player roll a D6. Winner (after applying modificators) is attacking player, the other defending player.

APROX, MANEUVER AND ATTACK
During each phase each player chooses secretly a Tactic, then compare tactics in a table and apply results.

At the end of the Attack phase, resolve a shooting phase between both flyers, applying the mods from the previous phases (if any)

**Uriels_Flame**

I would like to pre-order this for all the fliers (and pretty pictures) but I'm hoping GK have some options. If we can only take Stormravens, does that mean we can fly it in 3 different modes or is it one mode only and we just have to use it for what it is...

**Gamgee**

So I was right. Move along nothing but crap rules that fixes nothing and adds nothing of value to anything.

**casvalremdeikun**

Uriels_Flame wrote:
I would like to pre-order this for all the fliers (and pretty pictures) but I'm hoping GK have some options. If we can only take Stormravens, does that mean we can fly it in 3 different modes or is it one mode only and we just have to use it for what it is...

I am hoping for the same thing for Blood Angels. We(BA and GK) had the original Stormravens, we should be able to use them well beyond what anyone else can.

**Uriels_Flame**

Please allow my Dreadknight to catch a ride

**Vankraken**

Gamgee wrote:
So I was right. Move along nothing but crap rules that fixes nothing and adds nothing of value to anything.

Sadly I have to agree. Another attempt by GW to make some gimmick that is basically shoehorning rules onto models that weren't designed with them in mind. Dakkajets for example are actually rather terrible Air to Air fighters and far better at attacking ground targets as they can only glance AV12 flyers which are usually the things that need dedicated skyfire to take down or at least force jinking.

**Sledgehammer**

Vankraken wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
So I was right. Move along nothing but crap rules that fixes nothing and adds nothing of value to anything.

Sadly I have to agree. Another attempt by GW to make some gimmick that is basically shoehorning rules onto models that weren't designed with them in mind. Dakkajets for example are actually rather terrible Air to Air fighters and far better at attacking ground targets as they can only glance AV12 flyers which are usually the things that need dedicated skyfire to take down or at least force jinking.

Yeah I'm pretty disappointed too. I love me some dogfights. Hell my profile picture is the insignia of the Flying Tigers

**JimOnMars**

Vankraken wrote:
Gamgee wrote:
So I was right. Move along nothing but crap rules that fixes nothing and adds nothing of value to anything.

Sadly I have to agree. Another attempt by GW to make some gimmick that is basically shoehorning rules onto models that weren't designed with them in mind. Dakkajets for example are actually rather terrible Air to Air fighters and far better at attacking ground targets as they can only glance AV12 flyers which are usually the things that need dedicated skyfire to take down or at least force jinking.

Yea. Especially if now "attack" aircraft are -1 BS against ground targets, or BS1. A lot of good a gun is going to do if it only hits once in six tries. I was thinking about getting the new kit and magnetizing it. Thanks GW for saving me the money.

**Kanluwen**

Sledgehammer wrote:
As an IG player why the hell would I buy a 58$ book that nerfs one of the only decent units, and then forgets to include the other units that could support it?

I'm sorry but, I was looking forward to this, and am now appalled.

I'm happy with it.

The Valkyrie and Vendetta never had any business being able to engage enemy aircraft without a specialized loadout.

**Sledgehammer**

Kanluwen wrote:
Sledgehammer wrote:
As an IG player why the hell would I buy a 58$ book that nerfs one of the only decent units, and then forgets to include the other units that could support it?

I'm sorry but, I was looking forward to this, and am now appalled.

I'm happy with it.

The Valkyrie and Vendetta never had any business being able to engage enemy aircraft without a specialized loadout.

Any forward firing gun that has a variable convergence is and can be a dedicated anti aircraft weapon. The problem is never the weapon, but rather the bearing of them. A head on engagement is one where that is no longer an issue. Something the Flying Tigers themselves used to their advantage in China.

As long as you don't engage in a turning dogfight, a forward firing weapon is just as effective as it would be on any other aircraft.

Furthermore why shouldn't two assault fighters be able to have skyfire against each other? They are on a level playing field concerning their capabilities after all.

**Ghaz**

There's a little bit of information on the Webstore Blog.

**A Town Called Malus**

So it's a game of rock/paper/scissors to decide who shoots first (and therefore probably wins)?

**Ghaz**

A Town Called Malus wrote:
So it's a game of rock/paper/scissors to decide who shoots first (and therefore probably wins)?

From what it says on the Webstore Blog that looks like its one of three tables you can choose from.

**Uriels_Flame**

Seems we are adding another aspect to the game. Will be different for sure...

**Vector Strike**

>more tables
>more subphases

Why, GW, why? People will forget this stuff after 3-4 tests and will leave it alone.

**Peregrine**

Well, confirmed that it's the same concept as the old Death From The Skies "rules", which were absolute garbage that nobody ever used. I can't wait to see the inevitable inclusion of the old statement about how you should just roll a D3 to see what move your pilot picks, because there's no advantage to be gained from making a smart choice.

**Requizen**

There's a quote directly from luchiban that says that the phase is optional and that you can choose to skip it. No one is forcing anyone to do this, even if both players bring flyers.

**mercury14**

Do we know what Bombers do yet?

**gungo**

Requizen wrote:
There's a quote directly from luchiban that says that the phase is optional and that you can choose to skip it. No one is forcing anyone to do this, even if both players bring flyers.

Bingo this is nearly exactly the same as the old death from skies book just updated.
If you ignored the last book just ignore tribe current book it makes absolutely no difference.

However whole the Rock Paper Scissors phase is optional is the combat role and new stats optional?
Do all attack planes lose -1 bs vs ground targets?
Does pursuit still add to movement?
Does agility still give a chance for another pivot?

**mercury14**

If only one wants to skip though, the other can try to force it.

**Phydox**

Everything is coming up Milhouse!

**mercury14**

1) So do attack flyers have the -1 BS vs ground targets or do fighters?

2) Is there a bonus for being a bomber that we know of?

**casvalremdeikun**

mercury14 wrote:
If only one wants to skip though, the other can try to force it.

Then don't play that person. Simple as that.

**mercury14**

The scissors-paper-rock think seems pointless. The mechanic should be just a quick dice roll.

Honestly if Bombers don't get a really good trait this all seems pointless. If Bombers get something good like ignores cover then these rules have at least some promise. Not that I want to see more ignores cover in the game.