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Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:Huron Blackheart disagrees with this statement.

You seem to have misspelled Lucius the Eternal, friend.

I do believe that Huron is darker than Lucius, he get other Marines tortured severely until they join him. He loves torture.

Lucius isnt as scary. Just get a sniper thats a fanatic to kill him, then commit suicide. Unless he comes back as undead zombie Lucius.

But Chaos is the only grim dark part because thats the only way Chaos can be.

I miss this (latest codex's i see alot of possing characters but not much gory images.)



Their just not as scary, they used to be like the borg, one unified emotionless machine race, with advanced weapons. Now their more borg with willpower. Together they were one, resistance was futile.
I imagined clouds of dark green fog rolling in as silent machines stalked the streets like ghosts, picking people off, wraiths ripping anyones limbs off with no moral code or anything.
Now they all have lords wearing coats and been ecentric, some machines are just ment to be relentless evil. you couldn't really blame them for having selfish human motives for attacking a location or slaughtering its population as they were slaves to gods and that made you pitty the necrons too, they fell to the lies of adavnced creatures now they choose to go out and kill makes them just like any other race.

And i found the previous lords more scary, they commanded without a single word, they had a cold stare but were clearly different from other necrons although they never spoke or looked much different you could just tell there was somthing more sadistic and scary about them, the one you really try to avoid in battle.

I hear talk about the nids already having this down, yeah but how many other 40k races already have the quirky leader characers down with a system of order based on rank and rules. The necrons had a perfect ruling system already, its too human now, thats what made the necrons great, they wern't human, they worked in a way humans never could. Now they're just like any other 40k race, with factions territories and ranks.

and the vehicles, there too fancy. The necrons should have simple elegant machine forms, and what happened to the sleek silver metal, now its like green stone. I was hoping for the newcrons for more machine constructions like tomb spyders, maybe somthing like the sentinels from the matrix films, after all no other army can really do dangerous AI machines.


Also:



Wha...what is that supposed to be. -__- really looks like a corpse taking a piggyback ride on a necron.

When you are doing lovecraftian style horror, you are walking a very fine line. If you give little information, all it reads as is "Ok guys, this thing is totally scary, but you're going to have to trust me, because it was so scary, I cant describe it", and that is just lazy, or uninspired. And thats what the old necrons fluff read as to me. It just sounded like GW implemented them without thinking about what they wanted to do with them, and they simply floated around, being mysterious without having any mystery.

hotsauceman1 wrote:Somone said the codex are more heroic while the BL tends to still be dark. An idea. Everyone says Kids are GW main source of profit. Kids want heroism. Now they buy codexes but maybe not the BL because they dont bother.
So what if the dichtmy is actually intended.

I think that that's almost certainly what's going on. The problem is that it's counter-productive to be so full on in doing that: a good writer could inject more heroism into a Codex suavely, with subtlety, but leave some of the older vibe, myths and grimdark mysteries and subtexts in place for the older and more attentive readers. This preserves the older lore so doesn't rile up the older fans/customers, and gives the writers more options in the future - whilst still giving plenty of Awesome! to the kids.

Instead it's more, 'All that old lore was BS, and we'll retcon (therefore destroy, rather than preserve) everything such that the older fluff, novels, computer games and other licenses, and armies that folks have lovingly built are now all false. Not the old 'many interpretations, none of it's true, it's all true' thing but flat out false.'

Why do that to your own IP when you don't actually need to? It's like an arrogant and spoilt kid trashing his old stuff when he gets new stuff... it's all fun and games until he realises that one of the old things would have actually been useful or better, and he could have easily had both had he a scrap of maturity.

Tadashi: I wouldn't agree that the less grimdark started with the Tau: They added to the dark by juxtaposition - the light that makes the shadows even deeper. The setting was perfectly grimdark for a long while after their arrival.

rockerbikie wrote:

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

rockerbikie wrote:Huron Blackheart disagrees with this statement.

You seem to have misspelled Lucius the Eternal, friend.

I do believe that Huron is darker than Lucius, he get other Marines tortured severely until they join him. He loves torture.

A very nasty trait for a villain, it's gotta be said, but Huron's pretty much another power-hungry warlord, and power-hungry warlords using torture is a given. Hell, even Ghazghull does it. There are plenty like him in 40K.
Lucius, on the other hand, is proper sick. Lucius doesn't care about power, but deliberately seeks out the best in an opponent's army to fight them and prove his superiority; so far, pretty generic, I'll grant you.
However, it's the sadomasochism that makes him so fething creepy. The self-harm for pleasure and to taunt an opponent, the enjoyment of other people's pain through the lash that he uses? Yeah, he's downright psychopathic.

Lucius isnt as scary. Just get a sniper thats a fanatic to kill him, then commit suicide. Unless he comes back as undead zombie Lucius.

It's not how easily someone is to kill that makes them scary; it's their traits. Yeah, you can kill Lucius, good for you. You can also kill real-life serial killers, but it doesn't stop them being creepy fethers, does it? Besides, by those standards, Huron's even less scary, as you'd just need a regular assassin and not someone who was also willing to die themselves.

tsz52 wrote:

hotsauceman1 wrote:Somone said the codex are more heroic while the BL tends to still be dark. An idea. Everyone says Kids are GW main source of profit. Kids want heroism. Now they buy codexes but maybe not the BL because they dont bother.
So what if the dichtmy is actually intended.

I think that that's almost certainly what's going on. The problem is that it's counter-productive to be so full on in doing that: a good writer could inject more heroism into a Codex suavely, with subtlety, but leave some of the older vibe, myths and grimdark mysteries and subtexts in place for the older and more attentive readers. This preserves the older lore so doesn't rile up the older fans/customers, and gives the writers more options in the future - whilst still giving plenty of Awesome! to the kids.
Instead it's more, 'All that old lore was BS, and we'll retcon (therefore destroy, rather than preserve) everything such that the older fluff, novels, computer games and other licenses, and armies that folks have lovingly built are now all false. Not the old 'many interpretations, none of it's true, it's all true' thing but flat out false.'
Why do that to your own IP when you don't actually need to? It's like an arrogant and spoilt kid trashing his old stuff when he gets new stuff... it's all fun and games until he realises that one of the old things would have actually been useful or better, and he could have easily had both had he a scrap of maturity.
Tadashi: I wouldn't agree that the less grimdark started with the Tau: They added to the dark by juxtaposition - the light that makes the shadows even deeper. The setting was perfectly grimdark for a long while after their arrival.

I agree ,............... specially in the part that GW is doing stuff for kids; they want individual heroism, cool characters and things they can easily link to what the "know"............ example; when I bought my newcron codex a bunch of kids bought it just before me,.....the first thing they looked where the special characters and was like; -"Look, this guy has hiper-logic!!! What??!!.....Yes, HIPER-logic,..not logic, HIPERLOGIC!!!...Cool!! Yeah!!- and the like..................

[newcron opinion/offtopic on]
For me it was a huge dissapointment,......because they killed what I liked most about necrons; The feeling of "hidden inexorable ever-living evil threat" to all life they posed to every one, so ancient that even the eldar only remembered them in "legends" only spoken once per century,........... Agreeed there were thing that fluff-wise ought to change; C'tan domination for one or the "too impersonal" for another, but please, was it necessary to have what we have now? Tomb kings in spaceeeee!!!........what a lack of imagination!........ They sold the soul of that army (what an irony ) to please the consumer.......... When (in my opinion) should be the consummer who chooses an army because the feeling* (we could debate to which point a company should please the demands of the customer, but its not my intention to debate this, yet ).

I absolutely would have done things differently,..............and probably better, or at least not as bad as they have done..................... but again, this may be a conversation to another post,.............

As they say an image is worth more than 1000 words so,...
From that;

That said; Our number is legion, our name...............death.
TO

That says; we are the newcrons,..............skin of steel, heart of fire!!!!!!
[newcron opinion/offtopic off]

Just fighting the old Crons in Dawn of War and on the tabletop had a feel of fighting unstoppable unknown fear, the way that they were meant to be. The sight of two units of warriors encroach upon your IG squad capturing an objective, marching impassively out of the Fog of War, while the Guard were losing moral with every flayer shot (DoW), or a solid warrior and lith phalanx relentlessly pushing toward your thin line of marines was truly sinister. Although it could be said that the Tyranids do a better job at being the unified, unknown and endless fighters of the 40K setting, I would disagree. The Nids and Crons don't really compete, as they're completely different. One has an essence of primeval fear about it (Nightbringer), with practically indestructable armies attacking without reason or rhyme. It is the Ancient Terror. The Nids on the other hand, have motives (Nom) that can be perceived by the young races, they are subject to scientific research and with each conflict are being understood. They aren't the unfathomable evil of the Necron, rather the Scientific Evil, the types of which can be seen in many stories involving Earth getting invaded by aliens.

What I find interesting is that as the tabletop has gotten less grim/dark (and I'll offer my opinion that this was done because GW realized they aren't actually selling to 12 year old boys with adolescent angst, they're selling to those 12 year old's parents) that the FFG games have become much more grim/dark (in particular, natch, Dark Heresy).

I'll be honest. I do miss the 2nd edition look-and-feel, and the little vignettes peppered through the books (not about any named character and not about battle or anything, pure atmospherics). I remember in one of the 2nd Edition books (I think it was the rule book, as opposed to the weapons book or the army list book) this pen and ink drawing from inside the steeple of an absurd, baroque Imperial Cathedral looking down on the the countless worshipers below like ants.

Of course, back then I was an angsty 12 year old who grew up watching Brazil and playing Paranoia. So maybe I'm just projecting/romanticizing it all.

But I do miss the oldcrons, not least for how they just retconned all of the Cain books into wrongfluff.




Wow, that was a lot of words, and I sound really old and beardy.

Just looking at the new cron cover ugh, its so...bright and full of colors, reds bright oranges yellows, can't they decide what colors they wanted. Its like some 80's sci fi cover or somthing. Simple and bold worked for necrons, bits and bobs sticking out everywhere makes them look just messy and incoherent. Like the writer and artists didn't know what they wanted so just threw lots of ideas together that they thought looked cool. Like the command barge, with the two crons sitting in the front with the eye pieces working on the controls. There machines, why would they even need buttons and controls when they can plug directly in. Why have an attachable eye piece when they can replace an eye with such equipment like the destroyers do.

New new necrons scream PG rated cartoon show aimed at 12 year olds. Give me a necron lord crushing the life out of a pirate trying to raid a tomb world anyday, one who didnt need a fancy metal cape and helmet to show everyone whos in charge.

The DE apparently copyrighted the colour green and sued the necrons for the IP infringement

Webway portals for example are suddenly emerald green fire, and the Necrons are all in bright summery shades?

They looked far cooler in dark metal, under a wash of green light.

To all those complaining about the new cron dex...you realize that you don't have to make them colorful and honorable and crap, right? There's enough background to support our favorite genocidal robots.
Hell, that's what I am doing. F k the royalty and the praetorians, Ima gonna make an army of deathmarks, ghost arks and destroyers and bring the red harvest like in the good ol' days.

That said, I do miss the psychological horror aspect. That didn't show up at all in the new dex.

That's because the writer wouldn't know subtlety if he was ambushed by it in a dark alley. I doubt he could have done it right if he'd tried to, so i'm rather glad he didn't, in a way.


*shrug* It's not my first favourite army that's been butchered, and it won't be the last.

Squats, Grey Knights, Necrons, Norscans, Fimir...

I am curious how they'll redo the BT though, since they've been popping up in the Necron fluff..

I think the universe got brighter after Matt Ward allowed the Blood Angels and Necrons to have a big group hug. =]

Ever since that magical moment..... It all just looks so much brighter in all the chaos and destruction.

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Brighthammer_40,000_%282nd_edition%29

I'll just leave that here.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:To all those complaining about the new cron dex...you realize that you don't have to make them colorful and honorable and crap, right? There's enough background to support our favorite genocidal robots.
Hell, that's what I am doing. F k the royalty and the praetorians, Ima gonna make an army of deathmarks, ghost arks and destroyers and bring the red harvest like in the good ol' days.

Background as a necropolis world, not as the united race with a dark purpose they once where in the previous codex,.......... a patetic attempt from GW, if I may say,............

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
That said, I do miss the psychological horror aspect. That didn't show up at all in the new dex.

Me too,....

Milisim wrote:
I think the universe got brighter after Matt Ward allowed the Blood Angels and Necrons to have a big group hug. =]
Ever since that magical moment..... It all just looks so much brighter in all the chaos and destruction.

Still trying to belive that this did not happen.................

I think a lot of people who miss the Oldcrons take their supposed Lovecraftian undertones for granted. The writers at GW simply said they were unfeeling, unknowable, unrelenting, and a whole lot of other un's. The problem is they told us that but didn't show us that. Instead, we had an army with one goal which was clearly spelt out and there was zero room for creativity, and hobbies revolve around creativity.

Tyranids are the same as Oldcrons, people say they aren't because Necrons represent things like "primordial fear" "Lovecraftian terror" and the like, but they never really did, we were just told to believe they did. The thing is we knew exactly what the C'tan wanted, we know the origins of Necrons, we know how the War in Heaven went down. All the things that we shouldn't know in order to make something Lovecraftian were known. The things that were unkown, like their hierarchy, society, etc, is what makes makes an an army interesting but we had no information on that.

Oldcrons would have been better if we had almost no information on the Necrontyr->Necron transformation, or if the C'tan's motives were completley nebulous or capricious. Tyranids do a much better job at being an unkown horror and Lovecraftian, just look at their origin story...it's a mystery. Also the idea that the strongest force in the universe cares not for morals, feelings, mercy, etc; they just want to devour is quite Lovecraftian.

Also I want to throw out there that C'tan IMO are more Lovecraftian in the new book. There's a line in the dex that says that the C'tan could not be fully destroyed because they are fundamental to this universe like time, space, mathematics, gravity, and whatever else. To suggest a fundamental force of the universe is inherently evil is pretty damn Lovecraftian.

Lovecraftian....man I typed that word a lot.

They were subtle. A lot of people don't seem to pick up on subtle horror, though.

If you have to be told 'these are bad heeby jeebie overtones' then it's not properly horrific Slasher movies aren't the same kind of horror as psych-horror. Psychological horror is usually far more scary.

Lovecraftian may not be quite the right word, as his writings generally fit better with Chaos and Nids (Tentacles...) , but subtle 'horror from the dawn of time, permeating everything you think is safe' style horror is usually termed 'lovecraftian' because he was the best known writer for that style.

Read the old dex, specifically the little stories and inserts. Put what's hinted at and not said outright together. Then think of the result for the Imperium, and how little is actually known of the oldcrons. Psychological horror is at it's best when all you get is hints and whispers, and don't know everything about what's hunting you, how or why.

The new dex lays them out as pretty well known threats, even trading insults back and forth, warrign amongst themselves over honor etc. There is no horror aspect.
It's more like a soap opera, though with a little potential for dark and grim.

If you didn't get the vibe from the old dex, so be it. A lot of us did, and not all of us appreciate the rewrite, even if there is a world where Necrons still act like automata.






Automatically Appended Next Post:
I would have preferred more fluff on the Crons in the same vein int he old dex, and less on the Ctan, as the War In Heaven stuff could have been better couched as excerpts from old Eldar legend and translations from dead race's monuments etc, but it as as it is. Factual descriptions then to dispel the horror feel a little.

tsz52 wrote:Instead it's more, 'All that old lore was BS, and we'll retcon (therefore destroy, rather than preserve) everything such that the older fluff, novels, computer games and other licenses, and armies that folks have lovingly built are now all false. Not the old 'many interpretations, none of it's true, it's all true' thing but flat out false.'

Like what?

CthuluIsSpy wrote:That said, I do miss the psychological horror aspect. That didn't show up at all in the new dex.

It didn't show up in the old dex.

asimo77 wrote:I think a lot of people who miss the Oldcrons take their supposed Lovecraftian undertones for granted. The writers at GW simply said they were unfeeling, unknowable, unrelenting, and a whole lot of other un's. The problem is they told us that but didn't show us that...

All the things that we shouldn't know in order to make something Lovecraftian were known. The things that were unkown, like their hierarchy, society, etc, is what makes makes an an army interesting but we had no information on that

This exactly. When people start describing how much better the old Necrons were, all I hear is them describing the Tyranids.

Ascalam wrote:Lovecraftian may not be quite the right word, as his writings generally fit better with Chaos and Nids (Tentacles...) , but subtle 'horror from the dawn of time, permeating everything you think is safe' style horror is usually termed 'lovecraftian' because he was the best known writer for that style.

That's how I perceive it as well. In my opinion, 'nids are too much "mindless animal" and Chaos is too "loud" to qualify, but Necrons, on the other hand ...

(just as an addendum: for me, 'nids and Chaos would qualify if we go into stuff like Genestealer infiltration or hidden Chaos cults, but not how these forces are commonly represented on the TT)

Ascalam wrote:
They were subtle. A lot of people don't seem to pick up on subtle horror, though.
If you have to be told 'these are bad heeby jeebie overtones' then it's not properly horrific Slasher movies aren't the same kind of horror as psych-horror. Psychological horror is usually far more scary.

True,...........I absolutely agree with you,........... is far worse what you imagine can be there than what they show you directly,............take the first alien movie for example or the birds from hitchcock.....................horror is not always a madman with an axe,...........

Ascalam wrote:
Lovecraftian may not be quite the right word, as his writings generally fit better with Chaos and Nids (Tentacles...) , but subtle 'horror from the dawn of time, permeating everything you think is safe' style horror is usually termed 'lovecraftian' because he was the best known writer for that style.

I must admit I have not read him yet,.........

Ascalam wrote:
Read the old dex, specifically the little stories and inserts. Put what's hinted at and not said outright together. Then think of the result for the Imperium, and how little is actually known of the oldcrons. Psychological horror is at it's best when all you get is hints and whispers, and don't know everything about what's hunting you, how or why.

Exactly what I loved the best of the old book was precisly that the little you know of necrons was from second-hand, rumors, whispers and dark profecies.............leaving to you to fill the gaps with your own (wild) teories,...............that was far more fluff-rewarding for me,.............although I admit there were some thing that ought to change; but they changed it badly,.....................again in my opinion.............

Ascalam wrote:
The new dex lays them out as pretty well known threats, even trading insults back and forth, warrign amongst themselves over honor etc. There is no horror aspect.
It's more like a soap opera, though with a little potential for dark and grim.

No coment,..........

Ascalam wrote:
If you didn't get the vibe from the old dex, so be it. A lot of us did, and not all of us appreciate the rewrite, even if there is a world where Necrons still act like automata.

Well there where some things that ought to change,............and not everything is bad in the new fluff,........for instance I liked when they turned against the c'tan and "broke" them into pieces they after enslave,.............

Lynata wrote:
That's how I perceive it as well. In my opinion, 'nids are too much "mindless animal" and Chaos is too "loud" to qualify, but Necrons, on the other hand ...

Agreed,.....I think that they try to minimise the fluff threads to the imperium,......... I mean when you read the 4ed nids codex you (at least me) got the vibe that the hive-mind controled all the fleets, with a purpose, and objective, werever........now they are "animals". Eldar were a manipulative race willing to sacrifice hundreads of human to save one of their own..............now a dying race hanging on the blink of extintion, traped in "noble" belifs, (at least that's the feeling I got from them)............ Chaos, always turns upon himself,......by the way someone should do something with Abbadon, man, 13 times trying and still noting, chaos gods sure are way patient!!........and so go on with the threats to the imperium,.........

DarknessEternal wrote:There's no point in the history of the game where it wasn't packed to the gills with silliness and jokes. For example, Orks.

Look like others have already done justice here for us greenskins but actually i thin chaos and orks have been getting an up0sizing of Grimdark as opposed to our earlier stages of comic relief and corny plot lines. In other words all your grim dark is getting filtered over to "Da baddest boyz around"

*sets up a table called Da baddest boyz around club*

Only Chaos, Dark Eldar, Nids and Orks allowed... (no girlz)

Ok let's assume that the supposed subtle horror did in fact exist in the old codex, you guys do realize that pretty much all of that, with a few exceptions, is still intact?

Take the book "Xenology" which is a good example of the kind of oldstyle Necron horror you guys are talking about, there's no reason for any of that to be invalid with the new codex.

It could be possible that the new codex focusses more on royalty and the Necrontyr tragedy than horror (though Szeras and the Nightscythe entries are pretty spooky) that doesn't mean that the old stuff is gone. Also if you want unsettling then the recurring themes of madness and insanity, as seen in the Flayer and Destroyer viruses, are unnerving enough I think.

In fact I think the major theme of the new codex is to outline how tragic the Necrons really are, the Ghost Ark entry specifically sent that message across well. So while this book's themes are madness, tragedy, royalty, and hierarchy that doesn't mean the old horror stuff is gone, assuming it ever really existed in the first place. I'd argue it really didn't except for in a few instances like "Xenology"...which still meshes perfectly with the update.

They aren't trying to target children with the New codexes, the Grim Dark Future becomes Less dark then Darker in periods. If they were trying to market to adults Space Marines would look like: but in sexy power armour.

DarknessEternal wrote:

labmouse42 wrote:

Eiríkr wrote:Look back to the early 90s... You'll find that 40k was a helluva lot brighter and comical than now.

The book 'slaves to darkness' disagrees with that statement.

The books Freebooters, Waaaagh! The Orks, and 'Ere We Go, 'Ere We Go, agree though.

That's irrelevant. Orks are the goofy army of 40k. Using the silly ork codex as your basis of an arguement is invalid.

labmouse42 wrote:That's irrelevant. Orks are the goofy army of 40k. Using the silly ork codex as your basis of an arguement is invalid.

It is not an acceptable practice of debate to ignore evidence that directly refutes your point.

labmouse42 wrote:That's irrelevant. Orks are the goofy army of 40k. Using the silly ork codex as your basis of an arguement is invalid.

Personally, I think "Look at those goofy Orks, 40k is such a silly game" is the strongest possible point that can be made about how dark the setting is. Even at their very goofiest, back in 2nd Edition, the Orks were ALWAYS rabidly homicidal, slave-holding, torture-loving psychopaths who thought that a gruesome death was the height of hilarity and committed mass murder for fun. Nowadays they're even darker. As I posted back on the second page;

BeRzErKeR wrote:In the Imperium, humanity battles desperately across a million worlds for their very survival as a species. No sacrifice can be balked at, no extremes can be shunned, no hesitation can be tolerated and no dissension can be allowed; to fail means not only death but an eternity of torture as the playthings of unspeakable entities from the darkest hells.

For the Orks? This is how they PLAY. Total war against an enemy that will never surrender, retreat, ask or give quarter? Great entertainment! Brutal pit-fights, commonly ending in the death of one or both parties, to resolve minor disputes? Grab the popcorn, this is better than watching football! Building up a civilization, advancing technology peacefully, becoming wise and philosophical? BORRRRRING! Rather go split someone's head open with an axe, that's fun!

The Orks are the comic relief, yes. . . but that says something about the universe, not them. In any other setting, they'd be the Always Chaotic Evil race.

I would say that the IMPERIUM has gotten a bit less grimdark (well, in patches, anyway); GW seems to be setting the Imperium up as slightly more heroic, so it's more charcoal grey vs. black morality rather than just a battle between unremitting evils. The Necrons seem to have received a little of the same treatment. But, uh. . . it's still, by far, the darkest and most horrifying fictional universe I've ever heard of. Compare it to, say, Forgotten Realms; what's the race that most closely resembles the Imperium? I think it's the Drow, except the Drow aren't quite merciless and amoral enough.

I just think they could have done better and been more respectful to the necrons with the new range and codex.
We have way too much info on armies i think, leaves little to the imagination. Thats what i liked about necrons i could think up cool scenarios and situations and have nobody say to me well thats not how they work, read the codex look at this section and this section, they totally disagree with you.

The mystery of the 40k universe is been slowly explained all away. They should stop trying to describe everything away about the armies they re release. Its never some mysterious creature apears on some planet then some survay group get dispatched and the story goes all aliens on them. Its now like oh look a creature its a deamon, dispatch GK jobs done.

The 40k universe is only populated by things already explained now, i liked the old codexes where they talked of mysterious fleets of aliens ships that disapeared many years ago. Strange transmitions from dead worlds, things that have not yet been explained (but im sure they will)

I also enjoyed the feeling that the necrons wernt all shiney and new looking, they were old. Beyond ancient old with weapons so old and powerful nobody knew what the hell they were. I loved it when they were painted like rust.

DarknessEternal wrote:It is not an acceptable practice of debate to ignore evidence that directly refutes your point.

I did not ignore you point. I described it as irrelevant. Let me illustrate.

Labmouse42 Argument
40k was more dark in the 90s than it is today

Supporting Evidence
Slaves to Darkness is much darker than any books released today.

DarknessEternal Counter Evidence
Ere' We Go was goofy in the 90s.

Reason Counter Evidence is Irrelevant.
Orks are still goofy today. As chaos is less dark, and orks remained the same darkness, the overall level of darkness decreased in the 40k universe.
Imagine it like paint pots. If chaos went form chaos black to shadow grey, and orks remained at space wolves grey, the entire shade would be lighter today.
To disprove my point you would need to prove that the Chaos has not decreased in darkness, or prove that other codex's have become much lighter.

Example.
To give an example of the darkness of Slaves to Darkness for those people who do not have access to it, I have scanned an image from that book.
This is not for you DarknessEternal, but for those others reading this. Please note the daemonette drinking the blood at the bottom left side of the image.
Enjoy!!!!

Now, why don't we have stuff like that anymore?
If that was made like today, it would be friggen bad ass.