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Made in ca
Evasive Pleasureseeker



Lost in a blizzard, somewhere near Toronto

 dpal666 wrote:
I guess I'm different, it's not a specific army for me, it's the 1/2 build army that bugs me.

I put tons of time assembling and painting, and only get to play once or twice a month. I don't want to play the army you bought 2 days ago with no arms/heads/weapons, whatever. I come to play and have fun.



Well, take solace in knowing you're not alone.

I don't mind playing against things like a Rhino(s) built entirely out of cardboard and/or plasticard as long as they at least resemble the regular kit. Hell, I've seen some scratch builds posted here that literally look 99.9% like the actual kit - they're freaking awesomesauce!
Same deal with the likes of a LEGO Predator, etc... When they're well done, they look fantastic and honestly, I'm super jealous of someone who has the talent & ability to do those kinds of scratch builds. (just as I am with guys who can basically sculpt their own models!)

What I'll refuse to play against is stupid BS like 3 roughly cut carboard rectangles held together by a ball of duct tape...
Or the so-called "Tyranid Prime conversion" that's a Pokémon fig with its arms ripped off and pieces of rough cut sprue + 1 scything talon glued onto it.
Or the "Riptide" that's been "scratch built" from a single tp roller + a pair of twigs taped on as 'arms'...
And let's not forget the o-so-cleaver, "camouflaged" infantry that's made of various rocks/bushes/battlefield debris/etc... glued to bases.

Basically, I fully agree that if I've spent the required time investment & actual effort to build a proper WYSIWYG army, then it's only proper that opponents show the same level of respect in return!


 GuardRalph wrote:
Exp. 626, you just got to be in my sig. That last line is pure gold.


Hehe, thanks!

 
   
Made in us
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade





cedar rapids, iowa

For me it is space wolves. Rune priests and drop pods are just killer against any army.

And I play against them ALL the time.

Some tips for other armies that I have learned.

Eldar, tie up wraith knights and ignore the jetseers...they will fail a psychic test. Be ready to pounce.

Necrons are JUST like nurgle minus the psychic abilities. Treat them as such. Shoot them as much as possible and eliminate their units one at a time. (Make them take saves.)

These are probably my three hardest armies to play against.

 
   
Made in us
Bush? No, Eldar Ranger





Any and all deathstars and spams. The game's about strategy, not winning because you bought 3 Riptides and I didn't feel like dumping money into 4 more Wave Serpents to counter it.

School's out, the War Machine rolls once more
6000 pts  
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




 Will1541 wrote:
Any and all deathstars and spams. The game's about strategy, not winning because you bought 3 Riptides and I didn't feel like dumping money into 4 more Wave Serpents to counter it.


Actually, a huge part of the game is in list building, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Giving oneself a huge mathematical advantage in the list construction step is a "feature" that GW has stuck us with.
   
Made in us
Human Auxiliary to the Empire




What you said is true sfshilo. But people don't need to go so far that they have lists that make no sense in taking other than to win at all costs.

around 5000 points
around 3000 points 
   
Made in nz
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




New Zealand

 Mywik wrote:
Daemons

I dont evenwatch anymore what he is rolling prior to the game. Its just boring to watch your opponent roll random tables for like half an hour .


My friend rolls up his stuff pretty easily within 5 minutes @ ~1500+pts. Then he has to endure 6 phases from me which he can't take part in (except to remove models)... The shooting phase.

5000
 
   
Made in de
Masculine Male Wych






Martel732 wrote:
 Will1541 wrote:
Any and all deathstars and spams. The game's about strategy, not winning because you bought 3 Riptides and I didn't feel like dumping money into 4 more Wave Serpents to counter it.


Actually, a huge part of the game is in list building, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Giving oneself a huge mathematical advantage in the list construction step is a "feature" that GW has stuck us with.


While this is true, spamming obvious OP Units is more like a bug, than a feature. Think if 40k was a Video game somebody with 3+ Riptides or 6+ Serpents would be called an abuser... and normally it would be fixed very fast, but hey,we all know GW


On Topic: Dont like most WAAC lists, army doesnt matter, cause they are mostly abusing some sort of OP unit. Winning with such a list has nothing to do with skill as a player or in list building. Its just boring
   
Made in us
Bush? No, Eldar Ranger





Martel732 wrote:
 Will1541 wrote:
Any and all deathstars and spams. The game's about strategy, not winning because you bought 3 Riptides and I didn't feel like dumping money into 4 more Wave Serpents to counter it.


Actually, a huge part of the game is in list building, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Giving oneself a huge mathematical advantage in the list construction step is a "feature" that GW has stuck us with.


I agree the game is about list building, and the fun is building a balanced list that can effectively compete with other balanced lists. But when the list requires a tailored list just to beat it, it takes the joy out of it, both for the that did it and the poor sod being crushed under boot.

School's out, the War Machine rolls once more
6000 pts  
   
Made in cn
Hurr! Ogryn Bone 'Ead!





中国

I'm so bored of Chaos, it's not that there hard, even with Helldrakes my Tau/IG can down them, its just pretty mch everyone i know has a Chaos army, there never painted well it seems and i feel like i know there rules better than my own army even, Necrons would be second for the same reason, they beat me more but its the amount of people who run them rather than the losing part. I really want a game with anything...EVEN MARINES >.>

You all talk about eldar but pretty much everytime i play them i either draw or beat them two hammerheads and a broadside squad ftw

3000 - 天空人民军队
1500
2000+ - The Sun'zu Cadre.
2000 Pt of Genestealers
1500 Pt of Sisters

'Serve the people'
 
   
Made in fi
Boosting Space Marine Biker





Tau. That's it.

I despise playing agaist Tau since it's not going to happen with SM army, unless you're having a powerplayer list. That's why I avoid Tau players like plaque.

Innocentia Nihil Probat.
Son of Dorn  
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

Venomspam DEldar, effective automatic defeat with absolutely zero capacity for you to inflict casualties if the Dark Eldar player isn't brain dead if you're using Tyranids.

Martel732 wrote:
I ignore the fluff as well. *Guilty*. If they would put the fluff into the rule system, it wouldn't be a problem. But they don't, so the fluff literally doesn't matter in the tabletop game.

Being into 40k but not the background is like being into porn but not masturbation.

There's no point.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/08 14:19:58


 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




 Will1541 wrote:
Martel732 wrote:
 Will1541 wrote:
Any and all deathstars and spams. The game's about strategy, not winning because you bought 3 Riptides and I didn't feel like dumping money into 4 more Wave Serpents to counter it.


Actually, a huge part of the game is in list building, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Giving oneself a huge mathematical advantage in the list construction step is a "feature" that GW has stuck us with.


I agree the game is about list building, and the fun is building a balanced list that can effectively compete with other balanced lists. But when the list requires a tailored list just to beat it, it takes the joy out of it, both for the that did it and the poor sod being crushed under boot.


That's all on GW. I can't blame people for making legal selections. Maybe *gasp* those selections should be balanced or not legal!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/08 14:21:00


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




There's no point.

There is if your working in the porn industry or making money out of it.
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




 Kain wrote:
Venomspam DEldar, effective automatic defeat with absolutely zero capacity for you to inflict casualties if the Dark Eldar player isn't brain dead if you're using Tyranids.

Martel732 wrote:
I ignore the fluff as well. *Guilty*. If they would put the fluff into the rule system, it wouldn't be a problem. But they don't, so the fluff literally doesn't matter in the tabletop game.

Being into 40k but not the background is like being into porn but not masturbation.

There's no point.


Everyone in the fluff seems to be an overpowered moron, and the fluff is never represented by the mathematics of the actual units, so why should I pay attention to the fluff again? It's like a universe of DragonballZ characters.
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Murfreesboro, TN

Frakking Wave Serpent Spam. I can forgive people for bringing it (I play venomspam after all). I just can't forgive GW for green-lighting the broken monstrousity that is the Serpent Shield..... If it had been leaked before the codex was released it would have been dismissed as a rabid eldar fanboy's wish list wet dream....

"I'm not much for prejudice, I prefer to judge people by whats inside, and how much fun it is to get to those insides." - Unknown Haemonculi 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




 gardeth wrote:
Frakking Wave Serpent Spam. I can forgive people for bringing it (I play venomspam after all). I just can't forgive GW for green-lighting the broken monstrousity that is the Serpent Shield..... If it had been leaked before the codex was released it would have been dismissed as a rabid eldar fanboy's wish list wet dream....


I'm getting pretty bitter in 6th edition. After my 14th or maybe 15th straight loss to Eldar, I announced that I would only play Eldar players if I got to smash Wave Serpent models with a hammer if I managed to kill one in game. Otherwise, there's no point in me showing up to be vaporized over and over. I think they've all figured out how to table BA and non-gravstar count-as Iron Hands enough. I might actually go on hiatus until the BA codex comes out.
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

Martel732 wrote:
 Kain wrote:
Venomspam DEldar, effective automatic defeat with absolutely zero capacity for you to inflict casualties if the Dark Eldar player isn't brain dead if you're using Tyranids.

Martel732 wrote:
I ignore the fluff as well. *Guilty*. If they would put the fluff into the rule system, it wouldn't be a problem. But they don't, so the fluff literally doesn't matter in the tabletop game.

Being into 40k but not the background is like being into porn but not masturbation.

There's no point.


Everyone in the fluff seems to be an overpowered moron, and the fluff is never represented by the mathematics of the actual units, so why should I pay attention to the fluff again? It's like a universe of DragonballZ characters.

40k isn't really all that powerful or even particularly high up on the power scale of sci-fi (a single culture ship would solo the entire setting and never once be even mildly threatened). Every day I turn up warframe, I am playing characters who put even the highest end space marines to shame. Nevermind comic characters or the likes of Samus Aran.

As for game mechanics: the divide between game play and story exists in virtually every franchise where both exist. Starcraft Battlecruisers can be shot down by Hydralisks and take several shots to kill them despite them in the background being used to sterilize planets? Game mechanics.

Prophet in Crysis should be able to just climb over the damn buildings by punching his own hand-holds but has to go through the same invisible walls seen in every FPS? Game mechanics.

Dragon shouts by the oldest greybeards in the background can shatter mountains but in the game of Skyrim the most your fus roh dah can do is send people about a hundred feet? Game mechanics.

Your explicitly normal human soldier in battlefield regenerates like wolverine when he hides in cover? Game mechanics.

D&D characters are not impaired in the slightest by damage until they hit 0 HP and then flop over dead like someone just cut their strings? Game mechanics.

To say that because the story and game mechanics do not mesh is to say that stories do not belong in games at all.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




Fair enough, but I really don't like the story GW is telling. So there's no motivation for me to pay attention to it from that respect, either.
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

Martel732 wrote:
Fair enough, but I really don't like the story GW is telling. So there's no motivation for me to pay attention to it from that respect, either.

40k's canon is no canon. Other than the basics, every interpretation is as equally invalid as any other; including GW's.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

So this will likely annoy some people, but I don't like playing against static gunline armies. I feel like I'm doing all the work in the game (moving, using LOS, cover to protect myself on the way across the board, assaulting) while they just sit there and use only the shooting phase if they can help it. It's just not as fun as playing against an army that actually moves and does things beyond "shoot a lot".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Experiment 626 wrote:
On a serious note, I hate donkey caves who design their armies with the sole purpose of crushing their opponent as fast as possible & with the least amount of actual effort required. It's a game of toy soldiers, yet for some people, it seems to be how they measure the true size of their penis.

Exalted for truth!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/08 16:36:09


 
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

 ClockworkZion wrote:
So this will likely annoy some people, but I don't like playing against static gunline armies. I feel like I'm doing all the work in the game (moving, using LOS, cover to protect myself on the way across the board, assaulting) while they just sit there and use only the shooting phase if they can help it. It's just not as fun as playing against an army that actually moves and does things beyond "shoot a lot".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Experiment 626 wrote:
On a serious note, I hate donkey caves who design their armies with the sole purpose of crushing their opponent as fast as possible & with the least amount of actual effort required. It's a game of toy soldiers, yet for some people, it seems to be how they measure the true size of their penis.

Exalted for truth!

You're not alone.

I could run static gunline guard and plonk at you with sabres and artillery all day while shouting "COME AT ME BRO" from behind my Imperial Strongpoints.

I would also be incredibly boring.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Kain wrote:
You're not alone.

I could run static gunline guard and plonk at you with sabres and artillery all day while shouting "COME AT ME BRO" from behind my Imperial Strongpoints.

I would also be incredibly boring.

I don't get how people can have fun playing something so static and have fun. I get that some people enjoy it, but I secretly suspect that they'd be great accountants or file clerks.
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




At least Starcraft has massive penalties for turtling for too long. You lose. Of course, 40K has no economic component. Maybe it should.
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

 ClockworkZion wrote:
 Kain wrote:
You're not alone.

I could run static gunline guard and plonk at you with sabres and artillery all day while shouting "COME AT ME BRO" from behind my Imperial Strongpoints.

I would also be incredibly boring.

I don't get how people can have fun playing something so static and have fun. I get that some people enjoy it, but I secretly suspect that they'd be great accountants or file clerks.

Well, I know people who run blob guard take one look at all the models they'd have to move, say "feth it" and decide they're not going to move. For the guard it's more viable to stand still than Cultist mob, Ork spam, or Tyranid wave lists because unlike heretical onslaught, green tide, or scuttling swarm lists you have enough long ranged options to be able to afford to cover camp.

I can sympathize, moving horde armies can be an absolute time consuming pain.

But the Tau rarely have that excuse.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Martel732 wrote:
At least Starcraft has massive penalties for turtling for too long. You lose. Of course, 40K has no economic component. Maybe it should.

I like turtling in Supreme Commander, which I feel is far and away the superior RTS, because it's actually strategic; whereas Starcraft is a twitchfest APM to win bore made for cocaine addicts.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/08 16:50:29


 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

I'm not so sure Guard -have- to have their entire army sit still. It's not like they don't have tanks or units who aren't Platoons who can move. Moving something would be better than maintaining perfect Turtle Formation.
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

 ClockworkZion wrote:
I'm not so sure Guard -have- to have their entire army sit still. It's not like they don't have tanks or units who aren't Platoons who can move. Moving something would be better than maintaining perfect Turtle Formation.

A lot of guard players feel that once they get their artillery/tanks into cover there's not too much reason to move them since they have the range to shoot at most of the board.

Vendettas are much more lively in their movements of course; but they kind of have to keep moving.

This isn't saying I agree with it, but saying that as someone who has an extensive guard collection I understand the mindset.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




"I like turtling in Supreme Commander, which I feel is far and away the superior RTS, because it's actually strategic; whereas Starcraft is a twitchfest APM to win bore made for cocaine addicts"

There are players like Polt who don't use APM to defeat their opponents. There is a lot of decision making that has to be done quickly. A big part of the game, though, is getting favorable army trades. Although that can be strategic as well. I've never played Supreme Commander, but I don't like any system that rewards doing nothing or where turtling is viable.
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

Martel732 wrote:
"I like turtling in Supreme Commander, which I feel is far and away the superior RTS, because it's actually strategic; whereas Starcraft is a twitchfest APM to win bore made for cocaine addicts"

There are players like Polt who don't use APM to defeat their opponents. There is a lot of decision making that has to be done quickly. A big part of the game, though, is getting favorable army trades. Although that can be strategic as well. I've never played Supreme Commander, but I don't like any system that rewards doing nothing or where turtling is viable.

As I said, "twitchfest" which is not strategic.

Starcraft II deliberately does not include streamlining options made in every other RTS because the cult of APM was afraid that if the game was streamlined their skills would become meaningless.

Starcraft II is the Call of Duty of RTS games, which is to say it's an overrated baby's first introduction into the genre populated mostly by screaming children whose vocabulary mostly consists of stringing together curse words and where "skill" mostly translates into reflexes.

As for supcom, Starcraft will never measure up to this;


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/08 17:01:55


 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




As I said, never played it, so I can't really judge. Most other RTS's I've played lack balance and there are cheese units or cheese combos that developers never address.

And also, as I said, I will never support a game that rewards turtling. Sounds like you have an axe to grind with Starcraft, and I'm not paid by Blizzard to defend their product.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/04/08 17:06:56


 
   
Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

Martel732 wrote:
As I said, never played it, so I can't really judge. Most other RTS's I've played lack balance and there are cheese units or cheese combos that developers never address.

Starcraft has the shapeless deathblob which has become the only way to win any game that does not end in the first five minute rush. The late game of Starcraft is a derpy mess because the game is built on the assumption that the game is going to be only fifteen minutes long because ESPORTS.

If I want a multiplayer match that's over in a few minutes with screaming children, I'll play Call of Duty.

When I play an RTS, I prefer at least an hour to go into my games.

It's why I loved the age of empires series and sins of a solar empire.

Yes, a sins of a solar empire game's average length is four hours, if you're not patient enough then tough.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
 
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