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.....I have decided on the faction I want. Now it's to get the faction rulebook I guess.

I just had to post this because the whole idea of Cyriss just sounds too cool. Although I have no idea of the mechanics behind it and all, but I am going for Cyriss if anything.

I thought about Menoth but got turned off when I saw the Warcasters. Then I clicked on Cyriss randomly and that was it.

You don't need the faction book. Its really just needed for fluff.

Word of warning. Cyriss is a difficult faction for a newbie to pick up because they have some differences from the normal rules, and are rather complicated. Just be aware your learning curve will be a little steeper.


Anyway... So, you've decided to whip out some CoC

And Aurora whats more.


Well, here is what I would purchase to begin with.

Aurora, 2 of the walker heavy kit(magnetize), Corollary, Galvanizer, 2 units of Angels, and finally an Optifix Directive.

That'll be your basic Aurora force there.

Also be warned that they will not be part of the regular update schedule. If somebody has sold you on Warmachine because you're not going to have to wait multiple years for updates like you do in some other games, that may not apply to Cyriss. Every other faction is pretty much assured a few new releases/updates ever year. How how often the updates for Cyriss will be exactly isn't really known at this point, but it won't be at the same rate as other factions. It might be a model or two every year or two, it might be 5 years before we see anything new. It just isn't known at this point.

Cyriss probably has at least a year before anything new comes out.

But people do misinterpret that statement. It just means that Cyriss won't always have new stuff when one of the expansion books comes out(PP typically does 1 book for hordes and 1 for warmachine every 2ish years which has stuff for most of the factions)

I did notice that CoC had less models than say Cygnar or Menoth. Thanks for telling me about te update schedule. It might be slight bummer but the more I read, the more I feel CoC is unique. The Iron Mother looks fantastic and Prime Axiom is so well named, considering their fluff.

Learning curve I'll have to play and read up more I guess. Each loss will give more experience. I'll probably watch some CoC battle reports to get an idea.

 milkboy wrote:
I did notice that CoC had less models than say Cygnar or Menoth. Thanks for telling me about te update schedule. It might be slight bummer but the more I read, the more I feel CoC is unique. The Iron Mother looks fantastic and Prime Axiom is so well named, considering their fluff.

Learning curve I'll have to play and read up more I guess. Each loss will give more experience. I'll probably watch some CoC battle reports to get an idea.

If you want some great CoC Battle Reports check out the official Privateer Press TwitchTV channel and watch the recent Iron Guantlet finals, which is the official PP 'best of the best' tournament.

The player who took second was playing CoC and played some amazing games over the course of the tournament. Though the final was a bit of a grind fest.

Could I ask how many points I should target first? What's the usually lowest point game most have? I will probably be playing pick up games so I thought it'll be good to bring around a reasonable number of points.

 milkboy wrote:
Could I ask how many points I should target first? What's the usually lowest point game most have? I will probably be playing pick up games so I thought it'll be good to bring around a reasonable number of points.

The lowest points for most pick-up games will be 35.

Most PGs will organize slow grow leagues that start at battle box level (around 12 points) and will rise all the way up to 50, but for normal pick up games 35 points is usually the lowest.

Don't jump straight to 35 points though. Start with a battle box or equivalent and go from there as you learn the rules. This game does have a learning curve and you just made yours steeper by choosing CoC as your first faction.

Most games in the U.S. are played at either 35 or 50 points. Though from what I understand some countries like Germany play at different levels, I remember reading that some German Tournaments are played at 42 points.

I'd suggest starting at 15 points, play about 10 games then move up to 25 or 35. At 35 points play about 15-20 games and when you're comfortable move up to 50.

The best way to start is to check to see if there is a Press Ganger in your area http://volunteers.privateerpress.com/location/users They'll help you set up introductory games and introduce you into the local gaming groups.

Thanks for the tips. I guess ill have to accept the learning curve. I would prefer to start a faction I like to look at so I guess I'll still stick to CoC for now. And their uniqueness is also quite a charm.

And yep will be looking for a Press Ganger as I'm not sure which hobby shops near me stock Warmachine.

What they all said. I started with Convergence. It probably wasn't a smart idea. I love them enough though that I don't mind.

The faction book is a good buy if you're interested in the background (like I was) and so you can have all the exact unit stats in one place. Of course the War Room app from PP does the rules stuff now (It's a smartphone/tablet thingy that lets you load up unit cards to look at), but since I'm a outmoded traditionalist who doesn't believe in mobile computing I passed on that.

Also I would suggest a unit of Eradicators with Aurora. They are one of those units that a lot of people feel don't have a real place, but she looks like she could give them a good polish (not that I really think they needed it anyway).

I was just checking out the starter sets available. The CoC starter looks like pretty good value rather than buying them individually. But they didn't list the Forgemaster individually. Means he is not available out of the starter?

It looks like Jay from Chain Attack, Discountgames inc, and the winner of this years Iron Gauntlet has just announced the CoC Discountgamesinc summer bundle.

Discount Games Inc. is excited to announce our summer bundles! The bundles will go on sale July 4th. Each bundle will be a 25 point list created by a member of Team Muse. Every faction will have at least one bundle, some factions will have more than one. The bundles will also include a short article by the Team Muse player giving instruction on how to play the list and how the list can be expanded to 35 and 50 points. Finally, the bundles will also include a 30mm blast deviation token.

Here is our first bundle! This list was created by Will Pagani for Convergence of Cyriss:

Father Lucant -5 Inverter +8 Corollary +3 Enigma Foundry +3 Clockwork Angels +3 Reciprocators (max) +9 Transverse Enumerator +2 Optifex Directive +2

We will be announcing bundles every day on the Discount Games Inc. Facebook page and blog.

He hasn't released a price for it yet, but it'll be at least 30% of MSRP.

I have never had a bad experience with discount games. Really good store.

To the OP, CoC is not a very complex faction, they just have a few unique rules, mostly with their war machines. They are easy to understand though.

For just learning the game, you'll want to play 15-25 point games till you have a handle on the basics(especially Induction)

Then you can start playing normal sized games. Most people will be happy to play some smaller games to help you.

^ Interesting list in that bundle. Certainly not like anything I would have put on the table. I'm sure I will have the internet masses descending upon me in a screaming horde for daring to question the word of Pagani, but including a Corolary with Syntherion when there's one vector in the list seems...questionable. Plus inverter would not be my first choice.

Ah well, I'm sure the man knows what he's doing.

I'm always skeptical of top players lists till they've been proven to work.

Top players are often very willing to experiment, so watch out for duds when looking at their lists.

KingKodo wrote:
I have never had a bad experience with discount games. Really good store.

To the OP, CoC is not a very complex faction, they just have a few unique rules, mostly with their war machines. They are easy to understand though.

Not complex, no, however understanding induction chains and focus efficiancy takes a while to learn. Especially if you're new to the game, which is why people warn new players about CoCs newbie-unfriendlyness.

CoC are fairly expensive as well. Especially if you dislike model repping, as individually each unit isn't stellar, and you NEED one or two support units to make them shine.

Order of activation is super important as well. If you mess up, or do something in the wrong order, Cyriss will punish you.

Its a very rewarding but difficult faction to play as.

Just remember that a on a focus chain, the corollary should start it, the corollary doesn't have to induct to the jack it power transfers to, and the last induction should be back to the corollary, which should be within 3" of the caster and that you induct when you spend a focus, not when you resolve the action.

So for an example:

Turn 1 Corollary activates, gets a free focus from being within 3" of Aurora

Corollary Power Transfers that one focus to Warjack A, then inducts a focus to Warjack B

Warjack A activates, spends a focus to run, inducts to Warjack C.

Warjack B activates, spends a focus to run, inducts to Warjack C.

Warjack C activates, moves, spends a focus to boost a ranged attack, inducts to the Corollary.

On turn 2 the corollary should be within 3" of the caster, so when it activates it will gain a second focus.

For the most part, corollry can run entire battlegroups, and your caster should (ideally) never need to allocate anything to the jacks. Be aware that Disruption can screw up the chain. As can moving the corollary too far from the caster.

From what I can tell, the movement of the Corollary would be dependant on where you want Warjack C to end up? Because you need to be in range for it to induce back? So some planning is necessary to ensure the chain works?

Got a side question. I read up a bit on Colossal on Battlecollege. It says the Colossal cannot be teleported etc. Would it benefit from Aurora's Apparition?

 milkboy wrote:

Got a side question. I read up a bit on Colossal on Battlecollege. It says the Colossal cannot be teleported etc. Would it benefit from Aurora's Apparition?

No, because Colossals cannot be placed and Apparition is a place effect.

 milkboy wrote:
From what I can tell, the movement of the Corollary would be dependant on where you want Warjack C to end up? Because you need to be in range for it to induce back? So some planning is necessary to ensure the chain works?

Yip. This is why people say Cyriss is a difficult start to the game. Theres SO MUCH planning ahead involved.
You'll spend a good amount of time at the start of your turn not doing anything because one screw up with placing or activation order can ruin your whole turn.

There is a bit of leeway, since induction is 6" and you need to be within 3" of the caster, so if 1mm of the corollary's base is inside the 6" and 1mm is inside 3" of the caster base you can tack on like an inch either way due to the corollary's base size.

But you shouldn't rely on that because you can't premeasure (except for caster control areas and a few other cases).

Welcome to Convergence. Turn in your fleshbag for a sleek new Clockwork vessel at the door.

In all honesty, play the hell out of the battlebox. After playing 10+ games with it, induction and Field Marshalls will be second nature, no harder than learning any other faction. The only other oddball thing after that is master the Corollary and it's specific requirements to maximize it's abilities

Some notes from when I boxed up my Cryx and started CoC:
-Remember that the Prime Axiom can create a Servitor EVERY turn. I've forgotten about this so many times, can be a game changer.
-Remember, the Corollary can always induct one of the focus it spends with it's special action. 3 focus is great, 4 focus is better.
-Vectors can only induct one focus per activation. I did this wrong a lot early on the vectors inducing all three focus I put on them. It's such a cool mechanic I think I wanted it to be even better than it was.

Good luck!

And one other thing about the Prime Axiom. This might be obvious, but it surprised the heck out of me when I had it shown to me. It has two open fists, and servitors make great throw targets...

advance up, slap down a servitor, then throw it. Great way to mess with people from a stealth/shield guard/knockdown perspective.

Although I really want to start with Aurora, would it be easier to start with the Syntherion starter and get used to the Focus induction mechanic first? Or should I jump straight in?

Aurora seems to be a much bigger jump in difficulty as she is a forefront type of warcaster.

 milkboy wrote:
Although I really want to start with Aurora, would it be easier to start with the Syntherion starter and get used to the Focus induction mechanic first? Or should I jump straight in?

Aurora seems to be a much bigger jump in difficulty as she is a forefront type of warcaster.

Aurora is a trap in that she LOOKS like a frontline caster, but she isn't really, none of Cyriss's casters are really good at frontline combat.

If you like Aurora stick with her, but as with almost all casters don't charge out recklessly.

I find Syntherion is more forgiving because of his Field Marshall ability, but you can learn with whatever you like.

I would recommend the battle box for a bit, though.

I guess this thread shows the wide range of opinion for this game. I think Aurora looks horrid.

OT: a couple of units of clockwork angels can't be a bad choice.

Clockwork Angles are hit and miss for everyone but Aurora, who definitly wants to max out the FA on them.
They are fragile though, but Enigma Foundries can sort that out.

As a run down:
Assimilators are the best floating jack, the others are meh, walking jacks are mostly based on taste but Ciphers are amazing. Monitors are good at assassinating pesky solos and UAs due to True Sight, Inverters are your anti-heavy beat stick. Knock a model down with the MACROPUMMELER then wail on them. Prime Axiom is good, but not Stormwall level. Probably the second best colossal in the game.

Light jacks are mostly take to taste except for the corollary which is basically an auto-include in every list. Diffuser is useful combined with jack heavy armies. Mitigator is for knocking down and removing high ARM troops. Galvanizer is just sort of there. Useful for repairing in a pinch but Optifex Directives do that better, for cheaper IMO.

Attunement servitors are your second auto-include. Flare is just too useful. Take 2. Servitors in general are useful. They cost less than a point each and are great for blocking charge lanes and being irritating. Reflex Servitors are okay, they're less of a threat than oppnents think they are, and of they get distracted dealing with them, then its less things attacking the main army. Elimimation servitors are okay, better against Flare'd targets but not as essential as Attunements. Accreation servitors suck. Don't bother.

Steelsoul Protectors are okay. Algorithimic Dispersion Optifex is caster-sensitive. You'll want one or two in a Syntherion list to run ahead and cast Magnetic Hold through him onto whatever you want to annoy.

Reciprocators are probably the best medium base infantry, followed by Eradicators. Perforators are iffy but work well with Iron Mother. Obstructors are alright, Reductors are better. Reductors wprk best when you put them behind a unit of Reciprocators or Obstructors, wait for the enemy to get tied up in a tar pit, then spray into the combat, because you ignore friendly models, and enemy models don't benefit from the in combat DEF bonus because its a spray.
Clockwork Angels are hit and miss. Good flanking units and Eyriss killers, but don't expect them to survive a protacted comat.

All infantry is better with Enigma Foundries.
Transverse Enumerator is best friends with Reductors and Eradicators.
Always have at least one Optifex Directive and remember each one can preform an action. So you can give a jack Pathfinder, Magical Attacks and repair it all in the one turn.

Transfinite Emergence Projector is amazing. Take 20.

^what he said pretty much exactly. I'll do a quick rundown of the casters since that's pretty much the only thing left.

Aurora - The one I'm least interested in. Can't say much about her except she likes infantry and is capable of a long range assassination if you let her (although the threat is honestly more valuable than the actual ability. Always let the opponent know you could get to him from halfway across the board).

Axis- The one nobody talks about. I think he deserves more hype than he has. He is the king of Jam in Convergence. Everything he does messes with the opponent's ability to get an alpha strike on you. Take him with a wall of single wound infantry and a second row of enigma foundries, then just sit there and bring back more models than the opponent can kill. His theme list is really limiting but absolutely hilarious. Also his field marshal gives counter charge. Take a couple inverters and laugh maniacally as you counter-charge enemy heavies and knock them over during their own activation.

Lucant- The one everybody is talking about. He's good, gunlines fear his name for a reason. I'd take him with a combined arms force containing jacks and medium base infantry. I haven't looked at this guy as much since he hasn't grabbed my attention, but I'm glad he's in the faction.

Iron Mother - The other one everybody is talking about. It seems like 2 Axioms is what people do with her. I can't blame them too much, although dual colossal lists are not a thing I would do personally. Her carrier group theme list is pretty awesome, effectively allowing you to pop out 2 free squads of servitors at the start of the game. Spell list is kind of cool but situational. There is a potentially interesting build around spamming elimination servitors and casting Backlash, but her main threat is the axiom under feat getting an assassination. Would totally take perforators with her. POW 10 armor piercing guns are a thing.

Syntherion - Cool guy. Loves his vectors. King of upkeeps within faction. Can't tell you much except take his theme and the list will pretty much build itself. Just throw vectors in to taste. You can't really go too far wrong.

Sim-Life wrote:

Transfinite Emergence Projector is amazing. Take 20.

erm, the TEP is FA2 and costs about 10 points, so he can't take your advice unless he wants to play 1000pt WM battles.