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Well been playing warmachine for about a year. Took a break for a few months to start playing 40k again. Love 7th edition by the way, I have had nothing but good times with it so far. I was having fun with warmachine also but after come back to it today for a few games at the FLGS I find it very frustrating to play and not really any fun at all? Im really unsure on why this is?!?!

I had a few 35 point games, I run khador. I used to have tons of fun with it and now like I said was very frustrating and not fun in the slightest? Whats going on haha, im so confused as to why ive lost interest so fast??? Is it just the few differences in 40k (rolling tons f dice, lots more models, more terrain?)???

Thoughts? Id just hate to give up on WM as im already into it for hundreds of dollars!

BETTER DESCRIPTION POSTED BELOW AND IN LOWER COMMENTS

Ya the big thing was I was out of 40k for a few years and picked up warmachine for something different. Was fantastic, I played a slow grow journeymen league. It was fantastic up to 35 points. Played a few 50 and such but 35 I just found the best for me as you could play a few games instead of one larger on on a busy night. Now being out of 40k for a while this is the only tabletop game I was playing and had nothing to compare it too.

Then a few months ago my FLGS started a Slow grow 40k league. Heard about it on a warmahorde night. I hadn't played forever and thought, well ive got tons of models let pick this game back up! I started playing and immediately found it extremely fun. Tons of models, lots of dice rolling and the overall environment/gameplay seems a lot more relaxed compared to warmachine. I continued playing this league, and still am (we are at 1500 points right now). I also love the amount of terrain you can place, as in warmachine terrain really made things difficult for charging and all that fun stuff.

Them just yesterday I thought well its warmachine night and I haven't played for months, lets dust off the old khador and give it a try just to mix things up! Halfway through my first game I just found it very slow and kinda boring? Of course I lost haha but no big deal. Also seemed that it was always going to be a very one sided game, either you seemed to do very well or you did very bad, there was nothing in between. I found this very frustrating when you just get walked all over and can do nothing about it. I even stayed and watched 2 of the more better playing in the group have a game and same thing. One guy just got wrecked while the other just seemed to walk all over him (50 points by the way). Most, if not all the 40k games ive had lately in 7th edition have been fairly even games and tons of fun with the new tactical objectives. Like I said above warmachine seems to be just a competitive game overall compared to 40k, even just for casual games :(

THOUGHTS? Hope that helped describe my situation a little better

Sometimes a person needs a game that doesn't require much thinking? It's why I play GTA.

I would suggest just regular board games, not miniature games. They get far too complex and put too much burden on the player.

I sometimes just need a card game like War, or a board game like risk, or chess.

Ya im still loving 40k, just warmachine today was terrible haha. Been a few months since I played. Kind of a weird post haha, was just saying what was on my mind haha!

Apples and oranges... 40K does it for me, it's the entire thing, the game, the books, the great new rules, tanks, flyers, terrain, infantry, xenos, awesome models which are fun for me to build, and paint. I've seen the 40K universe animated in a movie, some video games. Just good stuff!

I have some of the warmachine models, I played the game a few times with someone else's models, I still haven't open the stuff from the boxes I have... I just can't do it. I'm hoping I can trade them in at a local store since the plastic is still on the boxes.


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Oh, it's also the awesome folks I've met through playing 40K.


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If you don't like your WM stuff sit on it for a bit, then when you are sure trade it for 40K stuff, or sell it.

I don't blame you. The small scale games just don't do it for me. Unless I'm playing 1,500+ points it doesn't feel like a war game, it feels like I'm controlling a bar fight. Lots of people complain about standard 40k being like apoc now but I couldn't be happier about fielding tons of models and giant LOW, etc. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

Don`t worry you`re not being a weirdo, believe it or not but it`s actually possible to still prefer 40K over Warmachine after getting acquainted with both. They`re very different games with their own strengths, it probably just comes down to the fact that you prefer GW`s particular flavour of tabletop gaming and there`s nothing wrong with that.

I can only take a game or two of Warmachine in a day before my brain gets fuzzy, but I can sit there and play long complicated process games like Battletech for 10 hours straight.

I don't get why Warmachine seems to complicated to people.

It is complex. Not complicated. It is very easy to learn and veeeery hard to master. Some things seem "random" at first, but the ruleset is so tight, you'll only get surprised once.

But: If you don't like a game, don't worry, nobody is forcing you into it.

Some people find certain complexities hard to get used to.

I get like that even with Infinity. I can play a huge game of 40k, with constant re-checking rules and such, and do it all day. I get through a couple of smaller games of Infinity and I feel mentally exhausted.

I don't dislike it. I find it takes a ton of brain power to play intelligently. It's actually mentally challenging to actually figure out the best move to make from the current board position. Sure, you can play it in a story driven do whatever mindset and it'll be fun, but I tend to play against people who go to Masters type events and travel to go to events like Templecon and Gencon and whatnot.

Timed turns + high level players = brain drain for me. I'm not in their league and it takes all my concentration just to keep the game going against them. I occasionally get lucky and win.

Timed turns are very hard, true. Ask for a more leasure time limit than
1 hour per side is USUALLY enough, but just play it with 1.5hours.

About half of my opponents are the travelling tournament player types. I get my casual games in against the other half, but I find even a single game that's pre-tournament practice sets the tone of the whole evening. With Gencon coming up the locals who are heading to Indy for the big events there have been wanting a lot of tournament type games as practice, so lately I've been playing them more often than the casual players.

Warmachine supports both casual and competitive play. I just happen to be among competitive players and it's right before a big convention worth of tournaments they want practice for.

I also prefer 35 points and they all want 50, so that's an extra level of brain power to manage more models, more threats, more synergies, more everything. All while the death clock ticks away.

Yeah, I don't like 50 points either. It's playable at that point value, but it's on the edge of being too much.

I've always argued that if warmachine wants to expand into bigger games they need an entirely new fast playing rules set, not this half effort book filter that was unbound.

I don't think they need to expand into larger games. 35 to 50, depending on the points values of each model, is roughly the model count that 40k was when it grew from being a house game made by the UK importer of D&D to being the internationally played miniature game.

People may say they want the big battles of 40k with 100+ models per side, but the game size that sells well across the board and made 40k the big deal it was at it's height is a lot closer to 35-50 points of warmachine than not.

I play 40k mostly as a visual experience, I like how impressive a painted 40k army looks on tabletop. 40k provides kind of a 'kinematic' experience, unfortunately GW ruined that word when they began to use it as a corporate buzzword.

This is why Warmachine doesn't do it for me, much less skirmish game. I don't even play Kill team, I don't like it at all. Same reason why I like BFG more than X-wing.
I'd like to start WHFB, but cost of building an army is just hugely daunting, there is no way I could afford it, plus I'm not big on painting craptons of identical miniatures.

40KNobz11 wrote:
Well been playing warmachine for about a year. Took a break for a few months to start playing 40k again. Love 7th edition by the way, I have had nothing but good times with it so far. I was having fun with warmachine also but after come back to it today for a few games at the FLGS I find it very frustrating to play and not really any fun at all? Im really unsure on why this is?!?!

I had a few 35 point games, I run khador. I used to have tons of fun with it and now like I said was very frustrating and not fun in the slightest? Whats going on haha, im so confused as to why ive lost interest so fast??? Is it just the few differences in 40k (rolling tons f dice, lots more models, more terrain?)???

Thoughts? Id just hate to give up on WM as im already into it for hundreds of dollars!

Unless you can explain more, I'm not really sure how anyone is going to be able to guess why you're feeling the way you do? Do you feel like you're not rolling enough dice? Or not enough models? Or the fact that activation sequences are extremely important?

 frozenwastes wrote:
I don't think they need to expand into larger games. 35 to 50, depending on the points values of each model, is roughly the model count that 40k was when it grew from being a house game made by the UK importer of D&D to being the internationally played miniature game.

People may say they want the big battles of 40k with 100+ models per side, but the game size that sells well across the board and made 40k the big deal it was at it's height is a lot closer to 35-50 points of warmachine than not.

Thing is, when people build up their collections, they naturally want to use them on tabletop. When I began 40k, a 1000 point game felt big. Nowadays, I don't feel like getting out of bed under 1500, and more would be better. Unfortunately, for a newcomer, big armies are intimidating in many ways (playing time, painting, cost). This is a conundrum for tabletop games. It is well known that WHFB suffers from being such a dinosaur, 40k armies have got bigger over time (though 6th edition briefly reversed the trend) and WM players too have kinda began to complain how big the games are getting.

Toofast wrote:
I don't blame you. The small scale games just don't do it for me. Unless I'm playing 1,500+ points it doesn't feel like a war game, it feels like I'm controlling a bar fight. Lots of people complain about standard 40k being like apoc now but I couldn't be happier about fielding tons of models and giant LOW, etc. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

I play Napoleonics. 40K is a bar fight when compared to that.

Some people enjoy checkers more then chess.

I don't play anything but collect 40k but I agree with most posters it's how you pick up the complexity of each thing. Some things are easier learned than others but it's the individual who discovers which is picked up best.

Ya the big thing was I was out of 40k for a few years and picked up warmachine for something different. Was fantastic, I played a slow grow journeymen league. It was fantastic up to 35 points. Played a few 50 and such but 35 I just found the best for me as you could play a few games instead of one larger on on a busy night. Now being out of 40k for a while this is the only tabletop game I was playing and had nothing to compare it too.

Then a few months ago my FLGS started a Slow grow 40k league. Heard about it on a warmahorde night. I hadn't played forever and thought, well ive got tons of models let pick this game back up! I started playing and immediately found it extremely fun. Tons of models, lots of dice rolling and the overall environment/gameplay seems a lot more relaxed compared to warmachine. I continued playing this league, and still am (we are at 1500 points right now). I also love the amount of terrain you can place, as in warmachine terrain really made things difficult for charging and all that fun stuff.

Them just yesterday I thought well its warmachine night and I haven't played for months, lets dust off the old khador and give it a try just to mix things up! Halfway through my first game I just found it very slow and kinda boring? Of course I lost haha but no big deal. Also seemed that it was always going to be a very one sided game, either you seemed to do very well or you did very bad, there was nothing in between. I found this very frustrating when you just get walked all over and can do nothing about it. I even stayed and watched 2 of the more better playing in the group have a game and same thing. One guy just got wrecked while the other just seemed to walk all over him (50 points by the way). Most, if not all the 40k games ive had lately in 7th edition have been fairly even games and tons of fun with the new tactical objectives. Like I said above warmachine seems to be just a competitive game overall compared to 40k, even just for casual games :(

THOUGHTS? Hope that helped describe my situation a little better

I'm the opposite. I like the mental challenge. I was getting bored with 40k because of its lack of strategy and when I played WM I knew I found the game that could give me the intense tactical experience I wanted. I've since sold off all my 40k stuff.

I have tried warmachine and I think it is a fantastic game. That said it is nor for me.

One of my biggest problems was that there was too much diversity in stats model to model.
;
Even if just getting introduced to a unit in 40k I can just look at the stats and have a solid idea of the numbers involved. There is a fixed list of abilities that I need to know for the most part in the main rulebook, and its not individual to each unit. Could I learn them all? Sure, but it was daunting to someone trying to get into it.

Also pg.5 being a license to be an donkey-cave kinda killed it for me. As people took it literally.

 Leth wrote:
I have tried warmachine and I think it is a fantastic game. That said it is nor for me.

One of my biggest problems was that there was too much diversity in stats model to model.
;
Even if just getting introduced to a unit in 40k I can just look at the stats and have a solid idea of the numbers involved. There is a fixed list of abilities that I need to know for the most part in the main rulebook, and its not individual to each unit. Could I learn them all? Sure, but it was daunting to someone trying to get into it.

Also pg.5 being a license to be an donkey-cave kinda killed it for me. As people took it literally.

You mean the "Page 5" that says:
"Most importantly- and let's state this loud and clear for the record - Page 5 is not permission to be a 'donkey cave' in the name of competition. It's not a shield to hide behind when you're playing like a sissified cheesball running down the clock, gaming in scenario, or rules lawyering your hapless opponent to death. Page 5 doesn't discriminate between genders. And Page 5 is never, ever, EVER an liscence to diminish another player so you can inflate your own vertically challenged self esteem. Remember, we all come here to battle out of common love. Respect Page 5. Respect each other."

You mean, that Page 5? That gives you liscence to be a donkey cave?

 MWHistorian wrote:
I'm the opposite. I like the mental challenge. I was getting bored with 40k because of its lack of strategy and when I played WM I knew I found the game that could give me the intense tactical experience I wanted. I've since sold off all my 40k stuff.

I never got that from WM. One of the biggest complaints the "WM Evangelists" at the local club had about 40K was that in the modern game there are so many models on the table at typical point values that there's no real room to maneuver or play tactically, yet whenever I see WM played by those same tournament-loving types or they tried to get me into the game, every game seemed to follow a pretty similar pattern; deploy almost all your stuff in a block in the part of your deployment closest to the objectives, both blocks advance towards each other and either A; slug it out over the objective until attrition decides a winner, or B; one player chains together a specific set of abilities to dump vast damage numbers on the enemy leader for an insta-win.

Now, don't get me wrong, the rules are unquestionably tighter and better written than 40K, but when it comes down to models on the table, I've not seen or experienced anything in playing Warmachine that I couldn't get from just playing 40K at a lower points value except the ability to end the fun prematurely by assassinating the enemy leader.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
I'm the opposite. I like the mental challenge. I was getting bored with 40k because of its lack of strategy and when I played WM I knew I found the game that could give me the intense tactical experience I wanted. I've since sold off all my 40k stuff.

I never got that from WM. One of the biggest complaints the "WM Evangelists" at the local club had about 40K was that in the modern game there are so many models on the table at typical point values that there's no real room to maneuver or play tactically, yet whenever I see WM played by those same tournament-loving types or they tried to get me into the game, every game seemed to follow a pretty similar pattern; deploy almost all your stuff in a block in the part of your deployment closest to the objectives, both blocks advance towards each other and either A; slug it out over the objective until attrition decides a winner, or B; one player chains together a specific set of abilities to dump vast damage numbers on the enemy leader for an insta-win.

Now, don't get me wrong, the rules are unquestionably tighter and better written than 40K, but when it comes down to models on the table, I've not seen or experienced anything in playing Warmachine that I couldn't get from just playing 40K at a lower points value except the ability to end the fun prematurely by assassinating the enemy leader.

I'm not a tournament guy, I just like actual strategy in strategy games. You're simplifying the game to a ridiculous degree. There's a lot more to the game than blocks crashing against each other. I'm still new but none of my games have been like that. I also like how strategy is left to the player and not random cards or spells. That's kinda nice too.

To be fair, I wasn't happy with 40k in 6th, but I've really been enjoying those new objective based games.

I think I have ve played four now and I really enjoyed them all. That random element adds a lot of fun to the game, and I have never been totally steamrolled, even against competitive Necron and Eldar builds.

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
I'm the opposite. I like the mental challenge. I was getting bored with 40k because of its lack of strategy and when I played WM I knew I found the game that could give me the intense tactical experience I wanted. I've since sold off all my 40k stuff.

I never got that from WM. One of the biggest complaints the "WM Evangelists" at the local club had about 40K was that in the modern game there are so many models on the table at typical point values that there's no real room to maneuver or play tactically, yet whenever I see WM played by those same tournament-loving types or they tried to get me into the game, every game seemed to follow a pretty similar pattern; deploy almost all your stuff in a block in the part of your deployment closest to the objectives, both blocks advance towards each other and either A; slug it out over the objective until attrition decides a winner, or B; one player chains together a specific set of abilities to dump vast damage numbers on the enemy leader for an insta-win.

Now, don't get me wrong, the rules are unquestionably tighter and better written than 40K, but when it comes down to models on the table, I've not seen or experienced anything in playing Warmachine that I couldn't get from just playing 40K at a lower points value except the ability to end the fun prematurely by assassinating the enemy leader.

I'm not a tournament guy, I just like actual strategy in strategy games. You're simplifying the game to a ridiculous degree. There's a lot more to the game than blocks crashing against each other. I'm still new but none of my games have been like that. I also like how strategy is left to the player and not random cards or spells. That's kinda nice too.

I have to say his experience was largely my own as well. I actually found there was LESS room to maneuver in Warmachine than in 40K because of the reasons he mentioned: almost every game I ever played turned into a brawl in the middle of the board, and you can't break out of it because free strikes are so incredibly punitive that once you get stuck in you basically don't move until attrition settles the matter. I gotta say I don't take issue with his simplification of the game because, in my experience, the game really did feel that way. This wasn't just me dabbling in the game for a month either, I played for over a year, collected some 200 pts of Cygnar, and tried out a handful of different warcasters and even dabbled in Skorne.

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Leth wrote:
I have tried warmachine and I think it is a fantastic game. That said it is nor for me.

One of my biggest problems was that there was too much diversity in stats model to model.
;
Even if just getting introduced to a unit in 40k I can just look at the stats and have a solid idea of the numbers involved. There is a fixed list of abilities that I need to know for the most part in the main rulebook, and its not individual to each unit. Could I learn them all? Sure, but it was daunting to someone trying to get into it.

Also pg.5 being a license to be an donkey-cave kinda killed it for me. As people took it literally.

You mean the "Page 5" that says:
"Most importantly- and let's state this loud and clear for the record - Page 5 is not permission to be a 'donkey cave' in the name of competition. It's not a shield to hide behind when you're playing like a sissified cheesball running down the clock, gaming in scenario, or rules lawyering your hapless opponent to death. Page 5 doesn't discriminate between genders. And Page 5 is never, ever, EVER an liscence to diminish another player so you can inflate your own vertically challenged self esteem. Remember, we all come here to battle out of common love. Respect Page 5. Respect each other."

You mean, that Page 5? That gives you liscence to be a donkey cave?

Whatever the page was, People used it as a shield regardless of what it said. I just was not having fun and someone said something about page 5.

Also sorry for stating my opinion and experiences. Everytime I think about getting back into (thanks article on 3++) I see Warmachine players attacking people for liking 40k, or indirectly insulting them and I remember why I got out of it.

Its like the prius owners of the minature world.