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2014/08/04 17:33:56
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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Hi,
I'm looking to make a starter list based on the Tau Battleforce. So far I've thought up 2 variants:
Variant A
HQ: Commander with 2 gun drones 109 pts
No slot: Crisis Bodyguard Team (2 Crisis Bodyguards, 4 gun drones) 112 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui) 90 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (5x Fire Warrior Shas'la, 1Fire Warrior Shas'vre, 2 gun drones) 88 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
Total 493 points
Variant B (using Farsight Enclaves rules and investing in a Cadre Fireblade, or just a fancier Fire Warrior model):
HQ: Cadre Fireblade with 2 gun drones 84 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui w. Bondking Knife Ritual) 93 pts
Troops: Crisis Team (3x Crisis Shas'ui, Bondking Knife Ritual, 2 Gun Drones each) 141 pts
Troops: Fire Warrior Team (12x Fire Warrior Shas'la, Bonding Knife Ritual) 120 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
478 points total.
Which list do you think is better? Any criticism appreciated.
Also, I have 1 marker drone left, should I replace one gun drone with it?
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/08/04 18:25:41
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2014/08/04 19:39:26
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Executing Exarch
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I am not a huge fan of either list; you have lots of battlesuits but no weapons on them. Instead of taking drones, you should get guns on the suits. Drones are fine once you have guns, but guns come first.
Dual up on either fusion or plasma. As you have no AT to speak of I would go with fusion.
In the first list, If your going to run a commander you probably want to deck em out a bit. A buffmander is too expensive and does not have enough to buff at this points level, so a shooting commander would be good. Probably want iridium armor and stims at the least, maybe a drone controller and vectored thrusters. If you have spare points always take a neuroweb jammer(great to fill out the last couple of points) and onager gauntlet.
Never take crisis bodyguards if you have elite slots open(farsight+7 guards is the other exception). Just run a regular crisis team to save points, and the commander can join them.
Bonding is only worth it on expensive suits, unless you have to take it...and if your going farsight you want as many suits as possible. Fireblades are OK but if you have a lot of fire warriors stick to an ethereal.
Stealth teams are ok, but you probably want a fusion blaster in the squad.
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The most important rule of 40K-Page XVII of the 6th edition rulebook, the figure at the top right of the page. "Shake hands with your opponent and thank them for a good battle and fun experience." Then go out for a beer.
Shine bright like Iyanden |
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2014/08/05 03:42:04
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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Revised list, thanks for the tips:
HQ: Commander with twin-linked fusion blaster, iridum armor, stims, vectored retro-thrusters, 2 marker drones, 174 points
Elites Crisis Team (2 Crisis with twin-linked fusion blaster) 84 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui, one with Fusion Blaster) 95 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Troops:Fire Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
Total: 501 points
What do you think?
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2014/08/05 19:41:09
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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Anyone
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/05 19:41:41
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2014/08/05 19:59:40
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Water-Caste Negotiator
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I am new to Tau too, so take my advice with a grain of salt.
1. Generally don't twin-link the weapons, Pay extra to have two separate weapons. You still roll twice, but have twice the fire power.
2. If you are using drones with the commander, spend the 8 points for a drone controller. That gives his drones (and the drones of any unit he joins) BS 5. I like to mix in a marker drone or two also.
3. I am not sold on Stealth teams yet. I would drop them and boost the fire warriors.
General observation: Do you have much longer ranged fire power? You might want to look at some missile pods for at least one suit. Put a target lock on the suit and it can fire separately.
For the Greater Good!
Thanks,
Duncan
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For the Greater Good!
40K, SW:Armada, Bolt Action, Legions Imperialis(maybe…) |
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2014/08/05 20:46:39
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Poisonous Kroot Headhunter
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Just knocked this up, might give you a bit more diversity and some needed long range fire power. Markerlights are really needed in such low point games imho
+++ Tau (497pts) +++
+++ 500pt Tau: Codex (2013) v20 Roster (Primary Detachment)) +++
Selections:
+ HQ +
* Commander
Crisis battlesuit, 2x Fusion blaster , Puretide Engram Neurochip, XV8-02 Crisis 'Iridium' Battlesuit
+ Elites +
* XV8 Crisis Team
(Supporting Fire, Very Bulky)
* Crisis Shas'ui
Crisis battlesuit, 2x Fusion blaster
* Crisis Shas'ui
Crisis battlesuit, 2x Fusion blaster
+ Troops +
* Fire Warrior Team
(Supporting Fire)
6x Fire Warrior Shas'la with pulse rifle ), Photon grenades
* Fire Warrior Team
(Supporting Fire)
6x Fire Warrior Shas'la with pulse rifle ), Photon grenades
+ Heavy Support + )
* Hammerhead Gunship
Railgun with submunitions, Twin-linked smart missile system Automatically Appended Next Post: Aren't really ended I meant to put
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/05 20:47:00
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2014/08/06 18:36:25
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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HQ: Commander with 2 fusion blaster, iridium armor, Advanced targeting system, vectored retro-thrusters, 148 points
Elites Crisis Team (2 Crisis with 2 fusion blaster) 104 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui, one with Fusion Blaster) 95 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Troops:Fire Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
Total: 495 points.
I'm trying to stick to Tau Battleforce contents for now, beyond iridium the commander equipment is a bit of a filler for points.
Also, @ PastelAvenger and anyone else who's willing to contribute with some tactical insight: why wouldn't markerlights be worth at 500 points, but (I presume) be worth in a bigger army.
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2014/08/06 18:49:54
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Poisonous Kroot Headhunter
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500pts is one character and 2 tactical marine squads, firewarriors hit on 4s wound on 3s Tau at 500pts have more than enough firepower to destroy a squad a turn.
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2014/08/06 19:59:00
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Water-Caste Negotiator
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I still like some sort of Markerlight support. I think the best is the Drone Controller and Drones for the commander. That said, a Pathfinder team is wonderful (but squishy.)
With unbound armies now, you never know what you might find at 500 points. Check out some of my battle reports for some examples.
Still not convinced the stealth team is worth it, but I have not gotten to use mine yet. I would still beef up the Fire Warriors or add the marker drones and some seeker missiles. But that is just me. (And I don't have a winning record.
Thanks,
Duncan
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For the Greater Good!
40K, SW:Armada, Bolt Action, Legions Imperialis(maybe…) |
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2014/08/07 01:51:13
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Road-Raging Blood Angel Biker
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I have slightly edited your list to something that will work better for the battlesuits:
HQ: Commander with two fusion blasters, iridum armor, stims, vectored retro-thrusters, neuroweb system jammer 162 points
Elites Crisis Team (1 Crisis with two fusion blasters, 1 Crisis with two burst cannons) 94 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui, one with Fusion Blaster) 95 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Troops:Fire Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
Total: 499 points
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2014/08/07 03:42:45
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Sneaky Sniper Drone
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at 500 points you are very unlikely to run into anything that would require the use of fusion blasters. I person run my crisis suits with 2 missile pods. S7 will be enough to deal with anything you will see at that points range. I would recommend this list. I don't know what models you have, but if you can buy 2 sniper drone teams kits, do it. They are good at low points.
HQ - Commander - 2 missile pods
Elites - Crisis team 2x - 4 missile pods
troops - Fire warrior team - 8 man
Fire warrior team - 7 man
fast attack - pathfinder team - 4 man
Heavy - Sniper drone team - 1 Marksman w/ 6 sniper drones
501 (my play group and FLGS, gives us a 5 point allowance)
Here is my reasoning behind the list.
So the commander and crisis teams can sit in the back with a total of 12, s7 ap4 shots. These can glance and pen AV 12 and glance AV13, I doubt you will see AV13 at such low point value.
These are also infantry killers, marines are a bit tough. One thing to remember with Tau, is the strength in the army is weight of fire and range.
Your fire warriors are your troops and can provide a lot of fire power and weight of fire when in rapid fire range. don't take the Shas'ui, all it gets you is 1 extra leadership.
Pathfinder team, this is your markerlight support and should sit in the back, behind cover and paint a unit and wipe it off the board.
Sniper team. These guys are fun. marksman is BS 5 and has drone controller, so that gives your drones BS 5. The drones have 48'' range and have rapid fire...at 24''. They also have markerlights. so you get another source of BS 5 markerlights. So if you wanted to, you could use 2 or 3 drones to markerlight and use the rest to shoot. So you sit these things in the back, behind cover and let your opponent come to you and just unleash the fire storm. Use the range of this army to your advantage.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/07 03:43:59
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2014/08/07 04:48:44
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Shas'la with Pulse Carbine
San Diego, CA
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I actually like the idea of Stealth suits in a list this small. Since he doesn't have access to much long range fire power yet, this allows for some down range dakka turn one with infiltrate.
Honestly though, just learn how to play with what you have at first, most people playing at the 500 point level are not power gamers. What I think this post should be aimed at is what kind of models you should look for in the future. Riptides and Broadsides (Missile variant). Some of the best dakka in the game.
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2014/08/07 12:54:35
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Poisonous Kroot Headhunter
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Stealthsuits need target locks if one is going to take a fusion blaster really.
The above list is very different to what you were originally thinking of and to be honest I don't have a wealth of experience with Sniper teams.
I would agree changing the fusion blasters on the crisis suits to either missile pods or plasma rifles as you do see very little AV 14, a landraider would take half your points at this level and wouldn't do am awful lot.
I prefer my commander to have a few more bells and whistles though and I find the puretide engraved chip always worthwhile on most suit weapon configs.
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2014/08/07 15:53:13
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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Hello, I am just about in the same boat as OP.
I have been collecting for a year now and only started playing a couple months ago but we are playing at 750 pt fights,
I am Tau facing Space Marines and i haven't tried missile pods yet as i was told they are too weak vs Space marine infantry? But my opponent always rolls with a DN and without a well placed deep strike crisis team equipped with fusion blasters, he makes it hard for me to get in range if i were to run up the board instead. So I am wondering if I should try out missile pods on my crisis team. would you suggest target locks and do two missile pods or a closer range weapon in the 2nd hard slot?
Thanks.
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2014/08/07 16:44:12
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Water-Caste Negotiator
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Based on my limited experience, I would look at some plasma rifles for fighting Marines. The AP2 works really well I hear. For anti-dreadnought work look into a Broadside with TL-HRR. The AP 1 S 8 should help out. For the secondary system I normally take the SMS, but against Marines, I would consider the TL-Plasmas.
Thanks,
Duncan
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For the Greater Good!
40K, SW:Armada, Bolt Action, Legions Imperialis(maybe…) |
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2014/08/07 16:54:38
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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Sorry dont mean to impose on this thread but one other thing. I do have a Hammerhead and a Broadside. I was thinking TL-HRR and SMS, Then on the Hammerhead If i go with missiles on my crisis suits, and with what i said above for my Broadside, then would you go Railgun or ion cannon for when im hunting infantry. I feel like the ion cannon when on the move i would have a better chance of landing some hits and when i sit still i can blast with the IC overcharged.
Thanks,
Cylee
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2014/08/07 17:36:38
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Sneaky Sniper Drone
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Don't get me wrong, plasma is great and laughs at marines, and in my 500 list, I run 2, 2 man crisis units, one with plasma and one with missile pods. If you face a lot of drop pod marine armies, man go plasma all day and put EWO on them and laugh at them when they pod turn one. My meta is a lot of horde armies and other Tau, so missile pods are great. Also at 500 points you will most likely be on a 4x4 table so you will most likely have range on anything that comes at you. Automatically Appended Next Post: cyleetron wrote:Sorry dont mean to impose on this thread but one other thing. I do have a Hammerhead and a Broadside. I was thinking TL-HRR and SMS, Then on the Hammerhead If i go with missiles on my crisis suits, and with what i said above for my Broadside, then would you go Railgun or ion cannon for when im hunting infantry. I feel like the ion cannon when on the move i would have a better chance of landing some hits and when i sit still i can blast with the IC overcharged.
Thanks,
Cylee
Yea, go Ion cannon. You can increase your BS skill with markerlight after you move.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/07 17:38:46
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2014/08/07 19:54:27
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Water-Caste Negotiator
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See, I would have leaned toward the rail gun with the submunitions. That way you have the big S10 AP1 if you need it, but can also get a blast weapon. Maybe I just like rail guns.
Thanks,
Duncan
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For the Greater Good!
40K, SW:Armada, Bolt Action, Legions Imperialis(maybe…) |
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2014/08/07 20:15:46
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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vadersson wrote:See, I would have leaned toward the rail gun with the submunitions. That way you have the big S10 AP1 if you need it, but can also get a blast weapon. Maybe I just like rail guns.
Thanks,
Duncan
So if I upgrade to submunitions I then have the option to choose which form of the gun to shoot on my attack phase? Like I won't be stuck only with the submunitions?
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2014/08/19 19:43:19
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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I did some more tweaking of the list:
HQ: Commander with 2x missile pod, iridum armor, puretide engram neurochip, adnvanced targeting systems, 158 points
Elites Crisis Team (2 Crisis with 2x missile pod) 104 pts
Elites: Stealth Team (3x Stealth Shas'ui) 90 pts
Troops:Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Troops:Fire Fire Warrior Team (6x Fire Warrior Shas'la) 54 pts
Fast Attack: Piranha with Burst Cannon and 2 Gun Drones 40 pts
500 points total.
VS heavy armor lists, swap missile pods for fusion blasters. What do you think?
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2014/08/20 12:27:05
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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Nobody? :(
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2014/08/20 16:28:51
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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I honestly think that games below 750 pts are too low to have a commander XV8 for an HQ. with the points you would save switching to have an ethereal you could get 2 more crisis suits and have more s7 ap4 super long range shots.
To clarify, if you are using a tactic which keeps your crisis team in the way back then I dont think that having extra points spent on a commander is entirely worth it. I have ran commander many times in 750/800 pt games and he has always worked really well up front and center with the survivability upgrades and with drone controller and many drones in the crisis team that he joins.
But if you are staying back then I recommend adding more points into firewarriors. I dont run with less than 8 in a unit unless its one unit you plan to keep way back the whole game behind a wall on top of an objective.
The ethereal honestly does SO much for FW in low point games. Just Do Not let him die. =p Automatically Appended Next Post: Another thing, what is your main focus for your stealth team?
armored hunter? general infantry hunter? distraction?
Once I had somewhat success with stealth units but i was lucky that there was just enough cover for them to jump behind for a couple turns while i jumped out and maybe kill 1 or 2 models in a unit and draw fire from 1 or 2 units until you gotta book it outta there.
If this is one of your very first games then I would suggest not taking a stealth team yet or if you are facing Space marines.. burst cannons hardly do damage to their infantry. )against marines the BEST wep is a plasma rifle on a crisis suit fyi.)
Automatically Appended Next Post: if it were me (and I normally face heavy infantry ie space marines)
I would go
HQ- Ethereal 50 pts
Elite- 1 crisis team 215 pts
Suit A : plasma rifle x 2, advanced targeting
Suib B : plasma rifle x 2, advanced targeting
Suit C : fusion blaster x 2, target lock (to fire at heavy armor if there is any, otherwise switch and have 2 missiles and target lock or 2 plasmas and advanced targeting)
The crisis team would have 4 gun drones to soak up wounds.
Troops : Fire warrior unit x 9 81 pts
Fire warrior unit x 9 81 pts
Fast : 1 piranha. fusion blaster if facing armored units.
dispod upgrade 65 pts
this should be a little under 500 points.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/08/20 17:33:31
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2014/08/20 19:15:49
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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Sadly I don't have enough stuff for that ATM.
I'm trying to get an army going just based on the Tau Battleforce (all I have at this point) and then see how it goes and think about adding some more stuff later.
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2014/08/20 19:30:54
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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you can use anything to proxy as an ethereal really. and you should have 3 crisis suits right? then you have the models for the list i came up with. or wait how many fire warriors did they give you?
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2014/08/20 19:37:04
Subject: Re:[500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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it's 12 fire warriors, that's the main issue. Not enough even with proxying stealth
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2014/08/20 21:31:05
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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oh in that case I would be very cautious if I were to split the FW into 2 groups with such few members each. If I had to choose between 2 groups of 6 or 1 group of 12 I might choose 1 group of 12.
but thats just me. You would be able to afford suffering more wounds without having to do a leadership test.
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2014/08/21 04:02:37
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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cyleetron wrote:oh in that case I would be very cautious if I were to split the FW into 2 groups with such few members each. If I had to choose between 2 groups of 6 or 1 group of 12 I might choose 1 group of 12.
but thats just me. You would be able to afford suffering more wounds without having to do a leadership test.
AFAIK don't you need 1 HQ and 2 troops to be rules legal? That's why I have 2 squads of FW.
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2014/08/21 07:05:29
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Executing Exarch
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LordBlades wrote:AFAIK don't you need 1 HQ and 2 troops to be rules legal? That's why I have 2 squads of FW.
To be a Battle-Forged list, yes. I wouldn't worry about the units of 6 at this level of points, but mob them up when you get to larger battles and another troop choice.
I think your list from the 19th looks fine, though I probably would have gone with plasma rifles (personal preference, I think they're the bee's knees).
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2014/08/21 15:19:29
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Drone without a Controller
Buffalo
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Quanar has a point.
I would agree more with your list from the 19th if you went less missile pods. I have tried them twice and both times they failed to make an impact for me.. and compared to the plasma rifles.. those things tore a hole in my opponents SM army.
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2014/08/22 04:00:52
Subject: [500] - Tau - Tau noob list, advice needed
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Dakka Veteran
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So it's worth losing 12" range and some shots just to ignore armor saves ?
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