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Harald along with 2 wolves, 4 TWC- bp/ccw, pf/bp, and 2 WC/SS = 461pts

Canis along with 2 wolves, 4 TWC - bp/ccw, pf/bp, and 2 WC/SS = 456pts

15 BC with 2 melta = 200pts
15 BC with 2 melta = 200pts

10 Skyclaws with 2 flamers, pf, wgl with bp/ pf = 220pts

2 Rune Priest with Runic armor, staves, jump packs = 200pts

1 Wolf Priest with jump pack and Runic armor = 145pts

Plan to run the BC pretty much naked to help keep drop pods from killing my TWC. Each TWC unit will be joined by one of the rune priest initially for some psychic fun.

Wolf Priest will go flying around with the skyclaws to give support and screen if necessary.

Alternate thoughts for the troops choice is GH in pods, but then the TWC are running in the open.

No vehicles or dreads here. Thoughts?

Throw me a bone here folks...

Everything is fast except the BCs which don't seem to fit the rest of the list. I would think about getting faster troops perhaps airborne.

You've only 2 2+ wounds as tanks for each unit which is a little light.

Flamers on Skyclaws are a good way to kill yourself out of assault range. Though unit is sucking up 365 points and I'm not sure it is worth it.

Wolfclaws aren't that great on TWC as they will kill 3+ save units anyway and with Harald you're S6 so largely wounding on 2+ so shred isn't that great. Whilst putting expensive weapons on guys with SS is probably not a great mix as they'll be tanking. With Furious Charge having 2 with Mauls and 2 with SS is a good mix as the mauls are S8.

I also think you can make a better guy than Canis with a stand WGBL or WL.

Hope this helps.

Yeah, BC were left that way on purpose for area saturation and to help not allow drop pods to wreck my TWC. They give me a nice 28"x12" footprint with TWC in the middle. Maybe a bit extreme. I'm not sold on keeping the WGL in the skyclaws and may be able to throw a GH squad in with the banner and drop pod. I like the thought of Skyclaws near the GH Banner. Frost swords vs the claws then with Harald?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here is 2.0:

Harald with wolf and 6 TWC: 3 SS, 2 PF, and 1 Rune sword = 553pts

Rune Priest with JP/Staff/Hood with 10 Sky claws and 2 flamers = 245 pts

Rune Priest with JP/Staff/Hood with 10 Sky claws and 2 flamers = 245 pts

GH x10 w/ 2 melta, banner, pod = 220pts

GH x10 w/2 melta, pod = 195 x 3 units = 585pts

1848pts

Why Frostblades? Why are you going for expensive Ap3 weapons? The TWC will murder 3+ save units without them. Grab a Power Maul or two they are amazing with Harald. Also get a model with multiple wounds and Runic armour to tank light arms fire.

2 units of Skyclaws makes sense, though Hood are probably not needed. Rarely are the Psychic Powers that you care about the ones cast at you. Again flamers are a bad choice of weapon for them.

4 units of Grey Hunters I presume to go double CAD so you can have 3 HQs? I would try to fit in a 5th pod even if it is an empty one so you get 30 marines in first turn. If you drop the hoods and flamers that gives 40 points. Drop a fist, SS and Frost blade from the TWC that gives another 60 and drop 2 TWCs. Then drop both meltas from 1 GH squad and split it into 2 units. Grab the 2nd unit a pod and 2 power mauls and a WBL with Armour of Russ and TW and move the fist over to him. Now you have a 2+ tank at the front of the unit that can also mess people up in a Challenge. The unit weighs in with 4 sources of invun and 16 S8 rending attacks on the charge along with 5 S10 attacks and 8 S6 rending. You've still got the Skyclaw wrap and support and now have 30 marines in their face turn 1 too.

I've had great results with a combi pod twc list with the last codex. Dropping some GH in there lines force them to deal with the imminent threat while the two charge up field. Personally I would spent my points on something other then skyclaws, also second that you can make a better guy then canis.

 FlingitNow wrote:
Why Frostblades? Why are you going for expensive Ap3 weapons? The TWC will murder 3+ save units without them. Grab a Power Maul or two they are amazing with Harald. Also get a model with multiple wounds and Runic armour to tank light arms fire.

2 units of Skyclaws makes sense, though Hood are probably not needed. Rarely are the Psychic Powers that you care about the ones cast at you. Again flamers are a bad choice of weapon for them.

4 units of Grey Hunters I presume to go double CAD so you can have 3 HQs? I would try to fit in a 5th pod even if it is an empty one so you get 30 marines in first turn. If you drop the hoods and flamers that gives 40 points. Drop a fist, SS and Frost blade from the TWC that gives another 60 and drop 2 TWCs. Then drop both meltas from 1 GH squad and split it into 2 units. Grab the 2nd unit a pod and 2 power mauls and a WBL with Armour of Russ and TW and move the fist over to him. Now you have a 2+ tank at the front of the unit that can also mess people up in a Challenge. The unit weighs in with 4 sources of invun and 16 S8 rending attacks on the charge along with 5 S10 attacks and 8 S6 rending. You've still got the Skyclaw wrap and support and now have 30 marines in their face turn 1 too.

What is up with your love for power mauls? They are rubbish. + 2 Str at Ap 4 is useless on pretty much everything. TWC striking at Strength 7 while still giving an armour save is just a waste of points. Far better off with the Str 6 Ap3 wolf claws or Str 6 Frost weapon. You will still wound most things on a 2+ and you ignore 3 + Armour.

Also Flamers are a fine option on the skyclaws and the original blood claws for that matter. It negates their slightly reduced Ballistic skills, are assault weapons, ignore cover saves and give decent hits in overwatching if you do get charge. Flamers or meltaguns on bloodclaws of any kind. He already has 8 melta guns, flamers are fine.

I agree that pushing for 30 marines dropping in the first turn would be the best. Maybe drop the hoods from the priests and the runesword from the sixth TWC and use a FA slot to buy a drop pod, so that you can drop three in the first turn. Then hopefully have a follow up 10 marines in the turn after that. Or you could just take 2 5 man GH squads and drop 3 first turn, then hopefully 2 more in the second turn so that you can use small numbers to pop a tank.

Power Mauls are cheaper and crucially S8 on the charge negating FnP on lots of things and causing ID. Why do you need Ap3? A maul us superior to a claw against nearly everything as the extra attack out weighs the rerolls:

Maul 6 attacks: 3 hits: 2.5 wounds that cause ID
WC 5 attacks: 2.5 hits: 2.43 wounds that don't cause ID

So unless you're against 3+ saves the Maul is better and fewer points. If you are against 3+ save units you'll wipe them anyway with the unit. In fact the fact that you probably take 2 rounds to wipe rather than 1 means you get shot at for 1 turn less. Also the S8 rending makes them a serious threat to any vehicle and they do double the damage vs a Knight. Mauls are VERY good. They help you more against all the important targets and are cheaper.

So you don't want the Skyclaws in assault? Why not?

Are the flamers on SC going to keep me out of assault?

I can drop them and try to squeeze in another min unit of GH/BC with pod as I do like the idea of trying to get 30 marines on the table

If you fire them chances are they will. They kill hordes well and casualty removal from the front means you're likely to then fail charge. Or you don't fire them in which case you're spending points to reduce your attacks in assault. Neither is really a good result for the Skyclaws. They will butcher hordes in CC anyway so the flamers don't even add an element they struggle against. Meltas are good as you can soften up small 2+ save units or pop a transport so you can assault the contents.

Alright Alright Alright....

so - reduced a few units, but I don't think I reduced effectiveness:

Harald and 6 TWC: 3 SS/3 PM, 3 PF/BP + 595 pts

Rune Priest with JP/Staff with 10 Sky claws = 225 pts

Rune Priest with JP/Staff with 10 Sky claws = 225 pts

GH x10 w/ 2 melta, banner, pod = 220pts

GH x10 w/2 melta, pod = 195 x 2 units = 390 pts

BC x5 with pod = 95 x 2 units = 190 pts

1845pts

Skyclaws can support TWC and 1st turn pods while other 2 pods can come on for different objectives and/or assault help.

Give some feedback for 3.0 please!

I like the 3rd list. I do have to ask though. Are you running Herald for the Outflank theoretically starting everything off the table T1? 5 pods, DeepStrike the claws, outflank the twc?

Distinct possibility, but I can't assault off of Outflank so would rather be in the face of anything that could possibly hurt them on turn 1 - giving them the opportunity to rush across the board.

I'm using the Unleashed FoC as I want to fit in 3 HQ choices - not so much for the outflank ability.

I realize I'm losing the Objective Secured on this 80% all troop army as well.

I'm kicking around alliance with my Ravenwing, but then I have to take Sammael and Harald or just losing a Rune Priest and putting in more BC's into the 4/5th pods.

That's why I'm here!

I like the powermaul setup, rending str 8 attacks on the charge lets you also threaten armor quite well.

I like the last list with pods+1 unit TWC+ the skyclaws the best.

Thanks!

Any thoughts on dropping one of the Rune Priest?

I hate losing the Obj Secured rules.

If I drop one rune priest, that frees up 75pts.

I could throw some relics in there on the other priest and/or add some Bloodclaws to the obj grabbing pods...

What's the best addition if I take out Harald for this list?

Just beef up the other 2 pods, or take a 3rd pod for a total of 6 and move the Priests to Lvl 2s?

Maybe Lukas?

I personally don't like Herald unless you are going to outflank. Seems to be his only real benefit. His relic is somewhat pointless. If your doing the WU Detachment, why run more than 2 troops. They serve the same purpose as any other unit. I would drop some of those troops and grab some Long Fangs for some long range support, Pick up a couple dreads in pods, and/or another twc.

Most likely I will drop him and add more to beef up my troops.

I'll run it both ways and see how I like it.

Busy trying to get some pods together and traded at the moment.