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2014/08/29 21:43:47
Subject: Size variance
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Praetorian
Washington
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So I recently picked up a new plastic set of Gator posse and noticed how much larger they are than the metal ones. This caused me to go through my collections to see if this was the case with other models as well. I then noticed my Exemplar Errants UA, which is metal, was larger than the unit itself. Anyone else notice these? How common are you finding it?
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2014/08/29 21:48:57
Subject: Size variance
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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I noticed the size differences in Exemplars right away. The Gator size has been a big thing since it was revealed at Lock and Load.
The funniest part about the Exemplars is they got smaller whilst their crossbows got ENORMOUS.
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2014/08/29 23:00:20
Subject: Size variance
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Praetorian
Washington
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They do have huge crossbows.
I also noticed on them that I got two crossbowmen out of the whole group...while I've seen other people who got 4. Which number did you end up with?
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2014/08/29 23:32:15
Subject: Size variance
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Gun Mage
In the Chaos Wastes, Killing the Chaos scum of the north
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medikant wrote:They do have huge crossbows. I also noticed on them that I got two crossbowmen out of the whole group...while I've seen other people who got 4. Which number did you end up with? You know what they say about guys with huge Crossbows EDIT: They say "damn he has a huge crossbow I am not gonna annoy him"
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/30 00:34:37
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2014/08/30 03:16:35
Subject: Size variance
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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medikant wrote:They do have huge crossbows.
I also noticed on them that I got two crossbowmen out of the whole group...while I've seen other people who got 4. Which number did you end up with?
4 total, 2 of the hip aimers, 2 of the across the chesters.
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2014/08/30 16:13:00
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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It's one of the things that gradually soured me on PP. There's no size or even scaling consistency across the ranges. For a company that charges what they do, I find that inexcusable.
The trolls are pretty bad in this regard- you've got miniatures like the Kriel Warriors, which had fairly normal looking proportions, and then stuff like the Champions and those giant handed Earth Mages which have really cartoony, outlandish proportions, and then someone like Janissa Stonetide or whatever her name was.
The warbeasts, similarly, show pretty inconsistent morphology, though that could be explained by background, it still irritates me. They seem to make very little effort to maintain consistency and make no apologies for variance in scale. Makes me feel like a real nitpicker to complain about it, but it started to annoy the crap out of me when I looked at the amount of money PP charge for their stuff.
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2014/09/01 13:24:31
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Brigadier General
The new Sick Man of Europe
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I'm pretty sure that materials as white metal expand when they get hot. Meaning that when the a white metal is cast is will only fit the mold when the metal is still hot and shrink about 0.5mm is the material cools. Polymers don't have this property so PP's plastic miniatures cast to be the same size as the previous metals will in fact be noticeably larger in general.
Still no excuse for how big the arms are on the Trollblood sculpts though.
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DC:90+S+G++MB++I--Pww211+D++A++/fWD390R++T(F)DM+
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2014/09/01 14:27:19
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Black thirteenth versus regular gun mages.
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greatest band in the universe: machine supremacy
"Punch your fist in the air and hold your Gameboy aloft like the warrior you are" |
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2014/09/01 15:05:49
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Brigadier General
The new Sick Man of Europe
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Those models really confuse me. They're been blatantly sculpted to be true scale models, but every other sculpt by this company is at least moderately heroically scaled. They're still highly detailed sculpts, just too "fine" compared to the other Gun Mages.
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DC:90+S+G++MB++I--Pww211+D++A++/fWD390R++T(F)DM+
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2014/09/01 15:16:58
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Tea-Kettle of Blood
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sing your life wrote:
Those models really confuse me. They're been blatantly sculpted to be true scale models, but every other sculpt by this company is at least moderately heroically scaled. They're still highly detailed sculpts, just too "fine" compared to the other Gun Mages.
PP used to hire third party sculptors to do most of their sculpting for them since they didn't have the resources to keep a team of large sculptors in house. This is the reason for most of the scale discrepancies in the PP line-up.
As the story goes, in the case of the Black 13th, the sculptor wasn't informed of the correct scale for "heroic" miniatures, so he sculpted them in true 28mm scale, hence why they are smaller than the rest of the Gun Mages.
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2014/09/01 16:37:23
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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There are reasons and excuses for PP's crappy scaling, no argument. But it's still crap- and if PP want to hide behind excuses, they shouldn't charge premium prices.
PP definitely get a free pass in that regard from the fanbase.
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2014/09/01 16:47:32
Subject: Size variance
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Tea-Kettle of Blood
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Da Boss wrote:There are reasons and excuses for PP's crappy scaling, no argument. But it's still crap- and if PP want to hide behind excuses, they shouldn't charge premium prices.
PP definitely get a free pass in that regard from the fanbase.
You're nitpicking.
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2014/09/01 16:50:56
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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I really don't think I'm nitpicking? I mean, maybe the smiley means that you're just having a joke, but honestly, the crappy scaling put me off PP miniatures. The game is great, but the minis much less so.
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2014/09/01 17:15:45
Subject: Size variance
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Tea-Kettle of Blood
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Da Boss wrote:I really don't think I'm nitpicking? I mean, maybe the smiley means that you're just having a joke, but honestly, the crappy scaling put me off PP miniatures. The game is great, but the minis much less so.
It was sort of a joke because I, and I'm willing to bet 99,99% of people, don't really care about a 2 or 3 mm difference between miniature size, you have a much greater relative variance in actual human and animal sizes so why should all miniatures have the exact same height? And while it is weird in those rare instances, like the Black 13th, where the variance is uniform across the entire unit, that doesn't really diminish the quality of the miniatures in any way.
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2014/09/01 17:18:50
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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I don't mind variance in height, but when proportions are completely wrong it really bugs me.
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2014/09/01 18:00:24
Subject: Size variance
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Satyxis Raider
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Once on the table noone notices. Especially with a good paint job.
While a minor snafu on PPs part, I couldn't care less.
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2014/09/01 18:56:29
Subject: Size variance
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Da Boss wrote:There are reasons and excuses for PP's crappy scaling, no argument. But it's still crap- and if PP want to hide behind excuses, they shouldn't charge premium prices.
PP definitely get a free pass in that regard from the fanbase.
To be fair, pp actually get a lot of stick from the fan base for both the scale (the black thirteen and vlads shoulders are long running jokes) and the quality of their plastics. It's quite often you see 'what unit/model would you like to see re sculpted' threads, and see them run for ages.
And the plastics?
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greatest band in the universe: machine supremacy
"Punch your fist in the air and hold your Gameboy aloft like the warrior you are" |
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2014/09/01 19:03:27
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
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That's a feature, not a bug. Just because you dislike Troll physiology does not mean it's a mistake.
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Games Workshop Delenda Est.
Users on ignore- 53.
If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. |
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2014/09/01 19:51:21
Subject: Size variance
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Wraith
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From pictures I've seen of the new Cephalyx models, I have come to the conclusion that the Cephalyx Overlords & Mind Slaver units were also sculpted in the same scale as the B13 and other models from that release era. Pyre troll for one.
Pictures of the new Cephalyx solos & units next to the existing shows the old models to be pathetically tiny.
The unit leaders have close to a 1/4" difference in height, as well as an overall volume difference.
This will make the overall look of an army goofy, but using the existing models with Cryx still works ok.
WRT the Trolls, they are all over the place because that seems to be part of how trolls are.
That said, model scale is not an issue for me playing the game. The models have defined base sizes, and that is all that matters there.
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Bam, said the lady!
DR:70S+GM++B+I+Pw40k09/f++D++A(WTF)/hWD153R+++T(S)DM++++
Dakka, what is good in life?
To crush other websites,
See their user posts driven before you,
And hear the lamentation of the newbs.
-Frazzled-10/22/09 |
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2014/09/01 21:28:00
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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Like I said, it is only an issue for me because they are charging GW level prices for their stuff, and quality is inconsistent. I consider proportions and scaling a major part of the quality.
WRT trollbloods and the giant silly arms being a feature, well, I can accept big arms, and Kriel Warriors have big arms, but to me they have to be somewhat consistent in implementation, or it just becomes a style I'm not interested in. The later Trollblood sculpts are completely all over the place, so I don't like it . YM, of course, MV.
I would be (and am) just as harsh on GW when they pull crap like that, so I don't give PP a free pass. Their game is awesome, but their pricing structure and model quality are both problems for me.
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2014/09/02 02:02:20
Subject: Re:Size variance
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Tea-Kettle of Blood
Adelaide, South Australia
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It's a skirmish level game, they have an excuse to charge as much as they do. While there are several models I think need a new sculpt overall I'm quite happy to have slightly lower quality models for a much higher quality game, and I appreciate their consistent prices worldwide.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/02 02:02:34
Ailaros wrote:You know what really bugs me? When my opponent, before they show up at the FLGS smears themselves in peanut butter and then makes blood sacrifices to Ashterai by slitting the throat of three male chickens and then smears the spatter pattern into the peanut butter to engrave sacred symbols into their chest and upper arms.
I have a peanut allergy. It's really inconsiderate.
"Long ago in a distant land, I, M'kar, the shape-shifting Master of Chaos, unleashed an unspeakable evil! But a foolish Grey Knight warrior wielding a magic sword stepped forth to oppose me. Before the final blow was struck, I tore open a portal in space and flung him into the Warp, where my evil is law! Now the fool seeks to return to real-space, and undo the evil that is Chaos!" |
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2014/09/02 17:39:35
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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Hey, if you're happy paying those prices for the miniatures, good for you! I think it's a rip off. The only "good reason" for charging any price is that people will pay it, of course. So if PP can shift miniatures and profit from their high prices, that's cool. But with all the competition these days, I don't see any reason to put up with it.
The rules system is good, very good in fact, which adds value to the models.But I don't agree that the game being skirmish based is justification for such high prices. I can make forces for Saga from nice hard plastic figures for a fraction of the cost of PP's over priced metals and resins.
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2014/09/02 19:07:39
Subject: Size variance
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Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh
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Then you are free to do so. Or see if your friends will allow you to substitute those figures for PP figures when you play warmahordes.
If you want to play a game and that game mandates use of certain objects/models then it is your choice whether to do so or not. However, there are no police forces that make you use those specific features. That is dependant on you and your opponent(s).
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2014/09/02 19:31:30
Subject: Size variance
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Battlefield Tourist
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Yeah, I've thought of doing that. I might even get around to it. What I'd prefer of course is if PP sorted out their issues so the miniatures were more worth the money. I have some hope that they will, given time.
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2014/09/03 05:09:26
Subject: Size variance
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Tea-Kettle of Blood
Adelaide, South Australia
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Well skirmish based = less models sold = higher profit margin per model required. Maybe they could get away with charging less, I don't have that sort of insight into their business structure to know. I'm just happy to be playing a game that is so much cheaper than Warhammer.
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Ailaros wrote:You know what really bugs me? When my opponent, before they show up at the FLGS smears themselves in peanut butter and then makes blood sacrifices to Ashterai by slitting the throat of three male chickens and then smears the spatter pattern into the peanut butter to engrave sacred symbols into their chest and upper arms.
I have a peanut allergy. It's really inconsiderate.
"Long ago in a distant land, I, M'kar, the shape-shifting Master of Chaos, unleashed an unspeakable evil! But a foolish Grey Knight warrior wielding a magic sword stepped forth to oppose me. Before the final blow was struck, I tore open a portal in space and flung him into the Warp, where my evil is law! Now the fool seeks to return to real-space, and undo the evil that is Chaos!" |
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2014/09/04 18:23:29
Subject: Size variance
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Satyxis Raider
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I get enough enjoyment of of the game that the cost is worth it.
though I do like to use various models not just pp ones. I also like top do some major conversions. I've had no issue using them even at the LGS tourneys.
If I did larger events then I'd just get the actual model, but that isn't a concern for me at this time.
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2014/09/05 03:48:27
Subject: Re:Size variance
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The Conquerer
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
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They are a pretty small company. Their parts replacement service basically seizes up every year when the holidays and convention season rolls around.
I don't believe they have a very high profit on individual models even with the higher cost, although the company is doing reasonably well overall.
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Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
MURICA!!! IN SPESS!!! |
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