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My starter box came today so I eagerly ripped the plastic off and opened it up to check out the models. That's where my excitement ended. The mold lines are awful, the details are very soft, I dry fit a few things and nothing seems to line up properly without any gaps, every single weapon is warped to the point of being a banana, the instructions aren't very good (I'll do fine but someone who doesn't have 20 years experience modeling and buys the starter kit will be frustrated), and you can't use poly cement so they will be prone to resuming their original form if knocked over or dropped. All this for a higher price per mini than GW if you buy anything but a starter or battle box. I will never again complain about GW prices, they're cheaper per model for MUCH higher quality models in every way possible. Just looking at that crappy, mold line infested plastic and the ED afflicted weapons made me want to ebay this box and spend the money on another drop pod or two.

PP has said since plastics were introduced that improving the quality is one of their top priorities but after a Google and forum search, the same problems people had with day 1 plastics are still prevalent. Yes, finecast is a pain. However, you might have to do a few HQs in finecast but the rest of your 40k army is high quality plastic. I would much rather do a few finecast minis than a whole army of this fething crap. I don't care how well PP treats their customers or how many tournaments they organize, comparing their models to GW is like comparing a Kia to a Mercedes if the Kia cost just as much (or more).

It's a shame that you had a bad experience. Personally I haven't had these issues to near the extent you seem to have had.

If you stick with it, I hope you have fun. If you do sell it and move on, have fun with 40K and the other games you play.

Sounds like you might have gotten one of the older Battle Boxes. I'd encourage you to go to the PP website and fill out the Parts Portal form. They will replace the models.

PP plastics aren't as good as GW's. That's a known fact and you'll have to get used to cleaning a lot.
My Convergence guys are new and they're alright, nothing like what you're talking about.

PP Platics are garbage*. If you're a plastics guy avoid PP.

Their metal models are largely pretty awesome, so just get things in metal where you can. The metal/resin hybrid models are also largely pretty good.



*I apologize to garbage for making the comparison, I know you deserve better but it was all I could think of.

A lot of PP's older plastics have serious QC issues. They've gotten better over the last year, but there is still plenty of older stock laying around.

Their overall quality in general is far less than what GW produces. At the very least GW makes damn nice models.

My box was pretty bad for mold lines, no instructions, flashing etc. It still only took me an hour to fully clean and build the whole box, and once the mold lines are removed you would never be able to tell they were there.

The quality is not as good as GW, granted, but the rules seem to make it a much more enjoyable game, especially when you dont have 3 hours to dedicate to the day.

You could always use alternative models like a lot of people do with GW, hell my 2000pt daemon army only has 3 actual daemon models in it.

PP does seem to have an aversion to instructions.

I respect GW for the quality of plastic they make
I do not respect GW for their business practices and poor rule set

Overall I accept the reduced plastic quality, for basically everything else.

Altho I will say, the problem is only pronounced in units with long weapons. Smaller weapon units, it is not even noticeable.

Indeed. Although given what minis Reaper is making I see little excuse for PP's current miniature quality beyond them deliberately maintaining a certain style which would be lost if they went to crisper details.

I am as much a PP fanboi as I could possibly be. I have been turning local gamers from 40k to W/H in droves, and now friends are telling friends making for a wonderful snowball effect.

That being said... their material quality is terrible. Sculpts are great in most cases... materials are AWFUL. It IS improving, but they need to dump that crappy plastic and get on board with GW/Wyrd for materials. Not sculpts, but MATERIALS.

I put together a newer box of Malifaux last night and I was so impressed that I can honestly say that the quality passed GW in many respects. I know PP can make the shift; if they do they will be unstoppable. W/H is my favorite game, but their models make me want to punch myself in the face at times.

Yea one of my favorite aspects of the hobby is building the models. That's become my least favorite aspect with PP due to the awful quality of almost every model in the box. I could never see anyone who buys models just to collect them and doesn't play the game spending money on PP stuff. These are strictly game pieces. Even if they improved the flash and joint fitting, they still have very soft details overall. Some of the parts look like they were made with play dough. Either drop the price or improve the quality of the models to be in line with GW.

Toofast wrote:
Yea one of my favorite aspects of the hobby is building the models. That's become my least favorite aspect with PP due to the awful quality of almost every model in the box. I could never see anyone who buys models just to collect them and doesn't play the game spending money on PP stuff. These are strictly game pieces. Even if they improved the flash and joint fitting, they still have very soft details overall. Some of the parts look like they were made with play dough. Either drop the price or improve the quality of the models to be in line with GW.

Neither of those things is going to happen. Their cost of producing the product isn't all the much lower than GW and being smaller they have less economy of scale, the price isn't going down. They're pretty well locked into their current process & manufacturers on plastics for at least the better of the decade, so the quality is not going to improve.

In terms of plastics PP is at where PP is going to be at for at least the next 5 years, at least if you believe the general consensus around the PP boards. That doesn't mean they don't have good models though. Most of their metals, and all of their metal/resin hybrid kits are fine. Really the only things to avoid are those you can only get in plastic, which is really limited to a handful of new units and I think 1 'Jack per faction. It's seriously not a huge a sticking point unless you're one of those "Plastics Only" players. In which case if you're primarily a modeler, it's best to forget PP.

I was recently converted from 40k to Warmahordes after it gained huge popularity at my flgs a few months ago. I agree that GW's models are generally superior in both material and sculpt but it really doesn't bother me too much. Whenever I start to get frustrated while assembling PP's models I just think about all the money and time I've saved compared to fielding a 40k army.

The early versions of plastic kits always seem to be worse. Like the mold needs to be "broken in" or something. No idea why.

But they have been getting better. My last plastic kit was bane rides and they were fine.

I will admit I haven't bought any 40K models since early 5th edition. Maybe the quality has improved. But the last few PP kits are no worse than the 40K kits I have gotten. However, PP is definitely a gaming company first that also makes models.

But the game and company is leaps and bounds ahead of 40K so it is a minor quibble to me.

 Chongara wrote:

Toofast wrote:
Yea one of my favorite aspects of the hobby is building the models. That's become my least favorite aspect with PP due to the awful quality of almost every model in the box. I could never see anyone who buys models just to collect them and doesn't play the game spending money on PP stuff. These are strictly game pieces. Even if they improved the flash and joint fitting, they still have very soft details overall. Some of the parts look like they were made with play dough. Either drop the price or improve the quality of the models to be in line with GW.

Neither of those things is going to happen. Their cost of producing the product isn't all the much lower than GW and being smaller they have less economy of scale, the price isn't going down. They're pretty well locked into their current process & manufacturers on plastics for at least the better of the decade, so the quality is not going to improve.

In terms of plastics PP is at where PP is going to be at for at least the next 5 years, at least if you believe the general consensus around the PP boards. That doesn't mean they don't have good models though. Most of their metals, and all of their metal/resin hybrid kits are fine. Really the only things to avoid are those you can only get in plastic, which is really limited to a handful of new units and I think 1 'Jack per faction. It's seriously not a huge a sticking point unless you're one of those "Plastics Only" players. In which case if you're primarily a modeler, it's best to forget PP.

It's not going to be that long. I too have heard the "locked in with Chinese contractor for 5 years" thing, but they're a few years into it now IIRC; or at least coming towards the end of it as the first plastic kit was (IIRC) the Exemplar Bastions released in 2010(?)...ish

From what I gather it is this contract that is preventing the release of the Convergence Battle Engine, which according to chatter from various designers at cons is their first "on sprue" model.

And they have been reducing prices on units that are being done in plastic vs in metal.

So it does make the game more accessible to people on a tighter budget.

I just started building the jacks from the starter box and the Repenter is missing the little square piece that the legs attach to, so I can't even play with it. I emailed PP and from reading other forums about this issue, it will be at least a week before I get the missing piece. This is ridiculous considering PPs cost per model. I am thoroughly underwhelmed with this starter set...

Toofast wrote:
I just started building the jacks from the starter box and the Repenter is missing the little square piece that the legs attach to, so I can't even play with it. I emailed PP and from reading other forums about this issue, it will be at least a week before I get the missing piece. This is ridiculous considering PPs cost per model. I am thoroughly underwhelmed with this starter set...

You can actually. The amount of space a model takes up is determined by its base size.

I'm starting a journeyman league this weekend and one of the requirements is the models must be fully assembled.

Toofast wrote:
I'm starting a journeyman league this weekend and one of the requirements is the models must be fully assembled.

Then explain to the organiser for 1 week you'll have to use a proxy or a blank base or just blutack the torso to the base. This really is not the issue you're making it out to be.

1 Cinerator is missing a head and we got an extra arm for Khador jack. Ah the joys of WMH modeling.

I don't think I've ever seen that many issues in one box. Well done, your prize is...I guess a free Khador jack arm. Enjoy.

I've said it plenty on the PP board, but I wish my favorite ruleset was accompanied by my favorite models. Malifaux is doing pretty well to blend these two aspects for me, but man Warmachine and Hordes are just SLICK when it comes to play.

PP does make some of my favorite minis though. Iron Mother, Clockwork Angels and withershadow combine are in my top ten, easily.
The plastics are at an 'acceptable' level, though I didn't buy the big two player battle box so I can't comment on that.

On the Cinerator head. Are you sure its actually missing? They're quite small and easy to misplace.

Yes I'm positive. I opened each cinerator individually and pulled each part out and set it down so they wouldn't go rolling away. I have looked around my work area and I don't see it anywhere.

Unfortunately PP's plastics are pretty bad. You often get mold lines in the worst places, and you can't just scrape them away you have to almost literally cut them off with a sharp knife.

They've acknowledged that they're looking at alternatives (the upcoming at some point Convergence battle engine is supposed to be a new kind of plastic) but nothing yet, however at least they seem to be listening to complaints which is more than some other companies do, even if said companies have better plastics.

I have had some missing parts as well; I bought a 2-player Hordes battlebox for my brother and his girlfriend, and one of the Warpborn Stalkers was missing an axe.

On the plus side, PP will send replacement parts. The only downside to that is that it seems to take a while, like two weeks or so, to get it.

Time to get parts can vary. I've gotten some in a few days and some in a couple weeks. It just depends on what they got going on and how busy they are.

Remember though, not many companies have that kind of service period.

PP has made leaps and bounds forwards when it comes to there plastics. Is it there yet? No. Is it better then it has been? Yes.

Keep em honest if you have a piece that is below your acceptable then request a new one. If that is still not good. Request the metal version. I did this with the pScorchia from the Battle Box.

Also to mispacks. They happen to all companies. I had a bad run back in my GW days and was at the point that I would take pictures lest they accuse me of calling in all the time for free stuff.

Ah and think back to the days of the first colossals being released..... People were getting free Stormwalls in there Conquest boxes and PP was letting them keep them.