Switch Theme:

Experiences of a Player With Too Many Armies: Chaos Daemons  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Spawn of Chaos






I started collecting Chaos Daemons way back when Warhammer Fantasy Chaos Warriors and Daemons were in the same codex. When the codexes split, I suddenly couldn't use my daemon models anymore. They sat on the shelf for awhile, even when daemons got their own separate codex. About six or so months ago, though, I was inventorying my models and realized I had enough daemons to actually play as allies to my Chaos Marines. So I converted the bases to 40k bases and played a few games. I didn't have much, just stuff I used to use in my Chaos Warriors army, such as fleshhounds, bloodletters and plaguebearers, but I had fun with them. I decided I wanted to try out a few of the new units, so I bought a few boxes, then a few more, then before I knew it I had a 2.5k Chaos Daemon army. I decided not to focus on a single Chaos god. I play Word Bearers Chaos Marines, so I figured every Chaos god should be represented in my daemon army. This army was designed to be mostly just for fun, campaign games and friendly games and whatnot. I've got my Dark Eldar if I want to play in tournaments (though I haven't tried the new codex yet.) That being said, I still want to win, it's just secondary to using models and units I like, and getting a good story out of the game. So I'm up to 5 armies for 40k, and 2 for fantasy, and I just felt like giving a little overview of how I've enjoyed/hated the armies/models I've used and how well they do for me. I'd be happy to hear if your experiences are any similar or different to mine. Normally I play games at 2000pts, but I've swapped units in and out of my primary lists for awhile. The environment I play in is somewhat competitive, but typically fairly laid back, until the leagues start again, then it's cut throat all the way! Well, let's get started. Here's my current army list for my 2000 point Chaos Daemons army.

HQ
Keeper of Secrets w/ x2 Greater Rewards
x1 Herald of Slaanesh w/ Exalted Seeker Chariot, Greater Etherblade, Lesser Locus of Grace
x1 Herald of Khorne w/ Bloodthrone of Khorne, Etherblade
x1 Herald of Tzeentch w/ Mastery Level 3, Exalted Locus of Conjuration, Disc of Tzeentch
x1 Herald of Nurgle w/ Etherblade, Greater Locus of Fecundity

Elites
x5 Bloodcrushers

Troops
x20 Bloodletters
x20 Plaguebearers

Fast Attack
x14 Seekers of Slaanesh
x10 Flesh Hounds
x3 Screamers

Heavy Support
x1 Soul Grinder of Slaanesh w/ Baleful Torrent
x1 Burning Chariot

And now I'll just give a little analysis of the units I've been using and what I think of them.

HQ

Keeper of Secrets w/ x2 Greater Rewards
You know, you learn a lot in your first game with a new army. "I'll just use a stock Keeper of Secrets with no upgrades. That's an efficient monstrous creature!" and then it was pretty much instantly shot off the table in turn 1. For my second game, I got it two greater rewards and it rolled the "Re-roll failed invulnerable saves" and "4+ feel no pain" and tears of frustration fell from my opponent's eyes as he tried, and failed, to kill my greater daemon! Yeah, those rewards are worth it. Why a Keeper of Secrets? Honestly, I've never seen anyone use one and I wanted to be a unique snowflake. Besides, waaaaay back when I first started Warhammer and I was browsing the models, I saw the Keeper of Secrets box and thought "Man, that's a freaky lookin daemon, I want to play Chaos!" so it somewhat inspired me to pick my first army (Chaos Warriors, back when daemons and mortals were in the same codex.) I actually didn't get the Keeper of Secrets and bought a Minotaur as my first model instead. Then I rarely used that Minotaur, other than my Path to Glory games (an awesome and fun little game system that was introduced in a white dwarf magazine and would make GW some decent cash if they brought it back, just sayin!) Anyway, the Keeper of Secrets isn't a bad choice, though certainely not the strongest greater daemons. It's fast-ish, and resilient if I get lucky on the greater rewards rolls. It used to be my primary anti-tank / anti-walker model in the army, but the new edition kind of put an end to that. It still shreds infantry in close combat, short of th/ss terminators, and even threatens them if I get good greater rewards. Still, it's a greater center-point to the army and can range from a mild distraction, to a significant threat depending on my greater rewards rolls (I know, I've mentioned those rolls about 3 times now, but they really dictate how well it does.) So far I've left it at mastery level 1, because I hate putting too many points into one model, but that may change. Let me know what you think about raising the mastery level. Is it worth it? I don't really like the idea of spending extra points for a small chance at getting a good psychic power (invisibility.)

Herald of Khorne w/ Etherblade, Bloodthrone

I'm not gonna lie, I use this unit because I like the model. Not the boxed Bloodthrone, I instead use an Chaos chariot I used to use in my fantasy army, and put a bloodletter in it. I really liked chariots in warhammer fantasy, so I figured I'd try them out in 40k too. Though I'm not really a fan of the current chariot rules, I like chariots nonetheless. It's....somewhat resistant to shooting, and fast enough to make it into combat by turn 2 if my opponent doesn't dedicate too much firepower to it. When it does hit, it hits like a truck! Absolutely shredding anything it comes in contact with! And then dies. Yeah, in close combat, even a couple tac marines is enough to kill the herald. I would like if chariots offered a little protection to the rider in combat, like -1 to hit the rider or something, but I'm pretty sure when people think "Chariot" they think about the CCB, and that would make it even more ridiculously hard to kill. Therefore, my Herald of Khorne has become somewhat of a suicide unit. Throw it at the biggest threat my opponent has and do as much damage as possible before they kill him. He's great at hunting small squads, but then again so is pretty much everything else in the army. Not really worth the points, since he's a close combat unit that is incredibly fragile in close combat. But hey, it's a model I put time into converting and painting, so I'm gonna use it dangit! As long as I don't expect him to survive till the end of a game.

Herald of Slaanesh w/ Greater Etherblade, Exalted Seeker Chariot, Lesser Locus of Grace
This may be my favorite model that will never ever see combat. Every time I use it, a group of people tell me how awesome that model is. Then I tell them what it does, and everyone around gasps in fear and awe. And then my opponent shoots at it in turn 1 and it explodes into a thousand tiny pieces. In about ten games using it, it has made it into combat once, and that was against a rhino! Lame. No matter how much los blocking terrain, no matter how much cover, it only ever takes one or two shots to knock it out. But it may be the best designed model I've ever seen. The rules for it are pretty awesome and unique too. The way my army is designed, is to throw as many threats as possible at the enemy and flood them with too many targets. This one always gets targeted first. I had a couple ideas to make it more resilient, and let me know if you think any of them would work. My first idea was to take a squad of three seeker chariots and let the herald on the exalted seeker chariot join them. That would soak up a few shots, but I fear it would make the unit an even bigger target, and not a resilient one. But just imagine, 10-d6 strength 4 rending impact hits, plus a bunch of rending attacks, plus a strength 5, master-crafted ap 2 herald.... (must.... put.... away.... wallet...) Another idea was to just take the herald out of the chariot, use the exalted seeker chariot as a heavy support option and give the huntress on the chariot an etherblade or something. It would be less points, and honestly almost as good, but really is anything less than a herald worthy of that chariot? I imagine the herald of khorne on his chariot is competing with the herald of slaanesh on her chariot to see who can get the most kills on the battlefield, and that's how I justify them not instantly turning against each other. If the herald of khorne loses, he immediately turns and attacks the herald of slaanesh after the battle anyway. But one day this chariot will get to assault a nice squishy infantry squad, one day, and it will be glorious!

Herald of Tzeentch w/ Mastery Level 3, Exalted Locus of Conjuration, Disc of Tzeentch
Suitably, I suppose, my herald of tzeentch has gone through some changes since I first used him(Tzeentch would be proud.) Initially, he didn't have the disc and was just thrown into a 20 strong squad of horrors to throw strength 6 flickering fires, followed by the squad's strength 6 flickering fires. Now that the new psychic rules have eliminated that option entirely the horrors don't really fill the role of ranged support anymore. So I took them out. I still wanted Tzeentch to be represented though, so I decided to try something new with the herald. I had an old Warriors of Chaos Disc of Tzeentch, and a cool looking Tzeentch herald from the burning chariot box, so I decided to throw them together and try it out. I figured a unit that could move, launch a few psychic powers, then turbo boost away would be fun. Then I had another idea. Is there any reason the Locus of Conjuration couldn't work for other disciplines too? What about a strength 5 Sunburst? Or a strength 5 Inferno? Or a strength 9 Molten Beam? Or a strength 6 Fire Breath? (I'm determined to make pyromancy not be useless.) So now he flies into a big group of enemies, Sunbursts, Flame Breaths and Molten Beams, then turbo boosts out. (except I never seem to roll sunburst...) Oh, and he also gets to keep FLickering Fire, which I may use if he's at long range. Later, I decided to put him in a squad of three screamers for some protection. I've toyed with the idea of giving him an etherblade, just for extra oomph if he ever finds an opportunistic chance to assault a vulnerable squad, but I doubt it would be worth the points. I'm also trying to think of interesting disciplines to mix with the Locus of Conjuration, like telekinesis. He's another pretty fun character in an army that's good at fun (though of questionable merit) characters.

Herald of Nurgle w/ Etherblade, Greater Locus of Fecundity
Probably the most boring HQ choice I have, but in all honesty, probably my most efficient. Like I said, I wanted a herald for every chaos god to suit my Word Bearers theme, and this guy is pretty much essential for my squad of 20 plaguebearers. I actually don't think he's ever died since I started daemons. He and his unit lock down a section of the board for me. Whenever assaulted, they win, the few times they get to assault, they win. He's tough enough to win duels with his etherblade against everything but dedicated close combat characters, and in those cases he just refuses the challenge. I've considered putting him in a palanquin, but those are a lot of points. I've also considered giving him some mastery levels, but there's only one nurgle power I really like (Miasma of Pestilence.) And again, that just bumps his points up, and I really don't want to take anything out of the army to accommodate that.


Elites

x5 Bloodcrushers
More often than not, they get one-shotted by high strength weapons, but come on... you say not to that model. Keeping in theme with the army, I throw as many fast, big threats at the opponent at once, and this is one of those units. They really do crush whatever they reach short of terminators, assuming the squad hasn't been whittled down too far (which it usually has been, sadly.) I like them, but they are a lot of points for such fragile models.


Troops

x20 Bloodletters
Nothing special, and rarely get their points back, but having 20 bloodletters just appear in the middle of your battle lines can be frightening. They're good at soaking up fire, and if my other units have pinned my opponent into combat, the bloodletters can be devastating. Cover is the bane of their existence though. As fragile as they are, having to strike last in combat means I will have lost a significant number before they get to swing. if I wasn't so obsessed with having variety in my army, they would probably be replaced with more plaguebearers. I do remember one game where they assaulted my opponent's tac marine squad with my six remaining bloodletters and he didn't know they were ap3 in close combat. Heh he thought he was going to win that fight until I said "Oh no, you don't get any armor saves." Good times.

x20 Plaguebearers
The troops choices in general are somewhat less exciting than the alternatives in this codex, but liked the herald of nurgle, the plaguebearers are my best troops choice. I do have to say, they are incredibly reliant on that herald being alive, though! They rely on the herald for the resilience (feel no pain) and for the close combat strength of the herald. That being said, when the herald is still alive and kicking, the squad is very tough. Sustained fire can slowly whittle them down, but they are quite resistant to assault. I used to deep strike them behind enemy lines, like the bloodletters, but I've changed tactic with them recently. Now I just deploy them normally and let them capture objectives near my table edge and deter enemy units from trying to deep strike behind me. If I don't have the Keeper of Secrets in my army, my Herald of Nurgle will be my warlord. Not because he's the deadliest fighter, but because I know he'll never die.


Fast Attack

x10 Flesh Hounds

I was fortunate enough to have ten of these from back when I had daemons in my warriors of chaos army. I just had to swap over their bases to the 40k bases (which was a pain, by the way.) and they were good to go. I had even already painted them, and I'm a very lazy painter! Of all the units in my army, this is probably the best. They do so many things, scout, plenty of attacks, multiple wounds, fast movement type, psychic protection. All of this for a relatively low points cost. Something I found out real quick was that this unit was great at hunting vehicles. In an army with very few anti-tank options, having a fast unit with lots of strength 5 attacks against rear armor tends to destroy most vehicles. Keep em away from walkers, though! Against anything with a 4+ or worse armor save, they'll shred them. They do alright against 3+ armor assuming them got the charge and are in relatively good shape. Terminators obviously are too much for them to handle. High strength weapons are usually busy trying to kill my bloodcrushers or chariots, so the flesh hounds tend to escape their attention. Battlecannons and Basilisks give the Flesh Hounds nightmares, but they're only gonna get one shot before the Flesh Hounds and tearing at their tracks!

x14 Seekers of Slaanesh
When I was designing my army list, it was a toss up between this unit and a unit of 5 or 6 Fiends of Slaanesh. In hindsight, this unit seems to be significantly better (and *significantly* less money!) They look nice on the table, are almost as fast as bikes, and have a ton of attacks. However, they never really seem to impress me. Maybe it's because they're so vulnerable to small arms fire, vulnerable to overwatch, vulnerable to difficult terrain, vulnerable to a small child sneezing somewhere in a 5 mile radius, so they never assault at full strength. Combat for them always seems to go the same, from "Alright, I'm rolling 40 attacks." to "And... they killed two space marines." Maybe it's just bad luck on my part, or I'm severely overestimating rending. Oh, and *never* throw them at a dreadnaught! I figured with so many rending attacks they would surely do some damage! But they only ever end up doing 1 hull point, maybe 2 hull points once in their career. Then they get squashed and lose combat. I'm not sure what to do with these girls. I usually deploy them on the table at the start of the game, because with their speed they can pretty much be anywhere I want them to be by turn 2. But do you think I should outflank them instead? It would give them some protection on turn 1 and maybe 2, but that detracts from my strategy of "throw too much at them at once for them to handle." I'd be happy to listen to any advice people have on using Seekers, because I like this squad and want them to do well.

x3 Screamers of Tzeentch

When they nerfed smash, I made sure to add some more anti-tank to the army. This small box was my first choice (partly because it's actually a somewhat fairly priced box....ish). I thought they were a nifty unit, but figured a couple strength 5 armor-bane attacks would rarely be strong enough to do anything. I still kind of feel that way, and maybe I've just had good luck with them, but most vehicles they get into combat with explode. They also provide ablative wounds to my herald of tzeentch, which is their primary purpose anyway. A good unit, but I'm still tempted to get two more boxes and run a six-strong squad of screamers for a more dedicated anti-tank unit.


Heavy Support


Soul Grinder of Slaanesh w/ Baleful Torrent
This was another unit that has had a big change from initial conception to finished unit (Nurgle would be most displeased.) At first I was enamored with the 2+ cover save soul grinder, so I devoted it to Nurgle. "Fire at my soul grinder!" I would say "And weep as your shots fail to dent the indestructible hide of my monstrosity!" Several games of sitting in a corner, missing with ever large blast it shot later, I decided I could probably use it better. The soul grinder is a little more resilient than most walkers, and as a slaaneshi one, it would be faster too, so hey, let's have it charge right up the battlefield and increase that target distribution! I gave it the torrent to help remove things from cover, and it's done well for me ever since.

Burning Chariot of Tzeentch
This may have been another unit I got because I thought it was a cool lookin model, and not so much for the practicality. Oh wait, ranged anti-tank! Ok, I can justify using it now. It is, admittedly, inconsistent with its anti-tank, but when you have so few options, you take what you can get. Besides, it's a third chariot in my army, and I like the daemon chariots! I think it may be worth putting an etherblade on the flamer for the chances when it can assault a devastator squad or something. It is super fragile though. Fortunately, most of my opponent's anti-tank fire is usually dedicated to my other units, so this chariot gets a free pass for a turn or two, or until it blows up something important. I haven't decided if it's worth the points yet or not. Something this fragile usually isn't, but I really do have no other ranged anti-tank. I'll give it a few more chances. If nothing else, it has the cool-model factor going for it.


Runners Up
These are units I used to use, or have used once or twice, and have taken out because they just couldn't cut it. I still may occasionally use them for a change of pace, though.

x20 Horrors
Used to be one of my favorite units, even if it rarely killed much. Just being able to throw out 4-d6 strength 6 shots, followed by the same from the herald, was a fusillade of firepower! It was my only real ranged support and just gave the army some variety. The change to psychic powers completely nullified the entire unit. It would now take 12 warp charges for a decent chance at casting those two powers, and my army only generates 7 (including the charges generated by the horrors). And this is for an attack that never did much anyway. It sounds like a lot of shots, but doesn't translate into many kills. Sure, they could cast other powers, but that's a fairly costly unit just to throw out a couple buffs, and those points are better spent elsewhere. Besides, I'm now happy with the herald being on the disc now, rather than having to support the horrors. I will miss their Blue Horrors rule, even if it was a silly gimmick. (One day it was going to kill a terminator!) If you have any suggestions on how I can use the horrors to better effect, I'd be happy to hear it. (Keeping in mind my army is certainly not geared towards a daemon factory build)

x10 Furies of Slaanesh
Man this squad was brutal in warhammer fantasy! Back when they were part of my chaos warriors codex, they were the terror of enemy artillery. Cannons, mortars, bolt throwers, all died to the claws of my furies! The transition to 40k wasn't particularly kind to them. They are *waaay* to fragile. That being said, they are miniscule amounts of points (under 100 for 10 of them.) They have a decent amount of rending attacks on the charge and can cause a bit of damage if they assault at full strength, even to vehicles and heavy armor. I may try to put them back in the army list, but I would have to free up points elsewhere, and that's hard to do.

x3 Flamers of Tzeentch
A pure throwaway unit. I'd have them attempt the riskiest deep strikes in order to get the perfect flamer shot. If they died, no big deal, they not many points at all. I have been exceptionally lucky with this squad. In the few games I've used them, they have, in a single turn, killed 9 out of 10 sternguard in one game, 4 out of 6 th/ss terminators in another and a whole squad of firewarriors in a third. However, I do realize that is well beyond the average result I will have with them so kind of let them retire with a good record. I'll still try them out from time to time for fun, and who knows, maybe they'll one-shot a dreadknight or something in a game.


Potential Units
These are units I've considered using, but wanted some feedback before I spent the money on them. Let me know if they're any good or not!

x6 Plague Drones w/ Champion, Etherblade, Rot Proboscises
I've been sorely tempted to try this unit. It's a ton of points (and a ton of money) and I just don't know how tough or powerful it would be. I suppose if it travels through cover, they will have a decent save, but would they have the close combat power to win fights? Even against something of an equivalent points value? Let me know if you have had success with this squad before and if they're worth the points.

x9 Nurglings
This is another squad I've wanted to try recently. I like the thought of infiltrating close to the enemy in cover for a good save, maybe even a 2+ cover save. I just don't know about their survivability though. They can't sit in that cover forever, and that cover doesn't help them against close combat. Swarms die so easily to so many things. Also, with only a strength of 3, would they even do any damage if they got to attack something? I've used Wyches and Hormagaunts before, even with a ton of attacks they don't kill anything. I'd still like to try them out, though, so let me know if you've had any success with them.

Skullcannon of Khorne
The thought of a ranged khornate unit kind of gives me a bad feeling. Not really getting skulls for the skull throne if you're actually hurling magic skulls across the battlefield at enemies. Doesn't really strike me as something Khorne would be proud of, but oh well, as long as blood flows I guess. Assaulting into cover is a major problem for this army, and a little ranged support wouldn't be that bad, even if it never kills much. What do you think? Is it worth spending the points on this for the chance that it will allow some of my units to strike at normal initiative in combat?

And I suppose that's it. Hope you enjoyed reading it! If you did, maybe I'll continue this and post about the other armies I play.

   
 
Forum Index » 40K General Discussion
Go to: