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Mmmmh I haven't thought of using wulfens instead of TWC. I'm guessing in this context they're slower and weaker but pack a better punch.

I really wonder how the bike squad performs, I didnt see much of it on the table.

Wulfen can make your heavy hitters a lot better. The +3 to all movement one is crazy on TWC characters.

 pretre wrote:
Wulfen can make your heavy hitters a lot better. The +3 to all movement one is crazy on TWC characters.

If that's the bounding loap special rule wulfen have, characters don't get that and attaching a character to wulfen stops them from using it. As of the new FAQ.


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Oberron wrote:
I really wanna make a list with 6 exorcist with the Cellestan detachment. What would be good to back them upp/make them stronger? I know the new cannoness is an option but with anything outside of SOB I'm lost with the imperiam, to many choices that I get confused. A techmarine looks good to help out exorcist but other than that What else would compliment the range firepower? Bikes for speed and harassment units? easy bake oven sisters? Dominions?

Also as a side note what are the best elite options from castellans? Lets say best for melee and/or best for mid-range shooting.

Canoness Veridyan will give them precision shots. A knight crusader would distract from them pretty well. As for the rest of the armies of the imperium...guard tanks? Wyverns are scary and SM quad mortors are really nasty too if you want to go full ordnance.

ERJAK wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Wulfen can make your heavy hitters a lot better. The +3 to all movement one is crazy on TWC characters.

If that's the bounding loap special rule wulfen have, characters don't get that and attaching a character to wulfen stops them from using it. As of the new FAQ.

I mentioned that in my post. Bounding leap is run and charge. Their aura works on characters though and one of the most likely is +3 to all movement.

Any thoughts on the optimal set up for a Castellan's bikestar?

I was thinking something like this, with using the bikes to string out the unit so the footslogging can stay attached and slingshot into assault. Not to mention some t5 3+/3++/4+FNP meatshields.

Celestine for fearless, and hit and run.
Coteaz for 2 rolls on telepathy, aiming for invis
priest for reroll saves
SM command squad, Iron hands chapter tactics, apothecary, Bikes, Stormshields. For some tasty, majority t5 3++, FNP on the unit and +1 to FNP on the marines. Not to mention celestine can give the unit her saintly blessing for elites to buff the unit with furious charge and counter attack.

Options are:

Adding some power weapons or grav to the bikers for some extra hitting power, but I'm not sure of the optimal setup.

Adding in an SM libby on a bike to add an additional priest for redundancy without breaking majority toughness and another roll at getting invis or rolling for one of the 'new' SM powers.

Seems massively expensive and potentially slowed down by non-12" moving chars. Although if you're willing to do that I think I'd throw in a second priest and an inquisitor w/rad grenades. Shred and -1T on the enemy would be brutal with power weapons.

TBH it's not really that expensive considering Big C and little C are considered all but mandatory. So it's really around 205 points to bring it together and make a scary looking deathstar.

Adding a 2nd priest and an inquisitor is a non option without adding at least 2 marine ICs on bikes as it would shift the majority toughness to t3 and defeat the point of bringing bikes in the first place.

The rest of the list i was considering to run in tandem with this is:

Celestine
Coteaz
Priest
BSS F/HF Rhino
BSS F/HF Immo TL-MM
2x BSS 2 Melta Immo TL-MM
SM Command Squad, IH CT, Apothocary, Bikes, 4x stormshields.
3x Dominion 4 melta, Rhino
3x Exorcist

Totals out at 1845.

That's more of a tar pit than a deathstar though. Sure, they're hard to remove, but they're not super likely to kill things. You get 20 S4 AP- attacks, some number of S3 attacks, and 6 S5 AP3 attacks on the turn you charge. Assuming you hit with 15 + 5.33 against enemy T5, you put out 8ish wounds. If the enemy has 2+ and FNP, you might do nothing. It looks better if you shred instead of rerolling your own and I've left Coteaz math out since I forgot his stat line, but...


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You could give them PW and a chapter banner which would increase the attack count.

If you're going to do a command squad, you should probably take at least a captain with a hammer and chain.

I concur, the IH "bikestar" works well mostly because of the captain gorgon hammer (and his potential friend captain america if you go double down, but starts to be a different army).

And definitively put some grav in here. This unit is not a stellar close combat unit even with the captain, so it needs to be polyvalent (plus grav really complement the sister arsenal).

 RabbitMaster wrote:
I concur, the IH "bikestar" works well mostly because of the captain gorgon hammer (and his potential friend captain america if you go double down, but starts to be a different army).

And definitively put some grav in here. This unit is not a stellar close combat unit even with the captain, so it needs to be polyvalent (plus grav really complement the sister arsenal).

I'd somewhat disagree. The captain makes the unit even more tanky. The all SS 4+++ Command squad also covers that. It's overkill mostly especially since Celestine got much tougher and more expensive without a significant increase in offensive power. It needs some AP2 and either some Strength or ability to reroll wounds or just large numbers of attacks.

You could also do something like allying something like Grey Knights and take Brother-Captain Stern. (Hammerhand for the Strength and Sanctuary for 2+++ from the stormshields) or anyone that can give the unit Furious Charge or Rage or -1T to enemies. Alternatively swapping some of those SS for some axes (losing the SS gives you the extra attack).

You need something that hits hard though. Bro Cap S is slow.

The Thunderhammer is the part that is hitting hard in that unit.

Although, if you want tanky AND hits hard, I already listed off a couple lists for that.

Ok so here's my last idea for LVO, looking for feedback:

Adepta Sororitas CAD:
HQ: (Old) Celestine (135)
HQ: Canonness with condemnor (75)
HQ: Command squad + 5x condemnor + 2x meltas in rhino dozer (180)

TR: BSS + 2x flamer in rhino dozer (115)
TR: BSS + 2x flamer in rhino dozer (115)

FA: Dominion + 4x melta in repressor (180)
FA: Dominion + 4x melta in repressor (180)
FA: Dominion + 4x melta in rhino dozer (145)
-------------------------------------------
Inq representative detachment:
HQ: Hereticus inquisitor with condemnor, psyocculum, 3x skulls (99)
-------------------------------------------
IH allied detachment:
HQ: Captain Gorgon + Fist + lightning claw + auspex + bike (220)
EL: Bike Command Squad + 4x gravguns + 2x shields + apoth + 1x meltabomb (225)
TR: Scout squad in LS storm heavy flamer (95)
FA: Stormtalon + skyhammer (115)

The list is slightly overpoint (1879) so I need to trim ~30pts of fat somewhere...
I know the anti-psyker part is really expensive because of that stupid canoness tax, but when it works it's worth it: 7 condemnor shot at BS10, that's 7 perils bypassing everything but FNP. And at LVO one can expect to face many psykers over 6 games.
To free up some points I was considering maybe replacing the 3rd domninion squad by a Thunderfire/quad-mortar, but not having 3 dominion squad makes me feel funny. With the spare points I could give the cannoness a combi-melta, transforming the command squad in pseudo-dominion. Another option is to remove the LS storm from the scout, but it's a nice fast obj-sec grabber and the outflank fast HF is actually quite nice to dislodge infantry hiding in ruins.

Drop the canoness and take a SCS from IA. You can mix books in a cad. Make sure your BSS are from IA as well since their act matters if it works in multiple phases.

Leave the Doms from C:AS since that gives them access to repressors.

Take the Chain (45) on your Captain, drop the two dozers on the rhinos and upgrade him to a Chapter Master.

 pretre wrote:
Drop the canoness and take a SCS from IA. You can mix books in a cad. Make sure your BSS are from IA as well since their act matters if it works in multiple phases.

Leave the Doms from C:AS since that gives them access to repressors.

Can we really do that ? I thought we had to choose between the two codex (hence my comment about the cannonness tax). If yes then sure it solves a lot of issues =) I mean GW-wise it makes sense (different books but same faction), ITC-wise however not so sure.
[EDIT] well the more i think of it the more it make sense army-format wise. That's the exact same scenario as for the few other armies/units (like the Iron priest for SW that can be taken from different books, etc...).

 pretre wrote:
Take the Chain (45) on your Captain, drop the two dozers on the rhinos and upgrade him to a Chapter Master.

Chain's already there (his name is not Captain Gorgon for nothing ^^)

Clarity is important:

Codex Adepta sororitas is distinct and separate from the Vestal Formation (and its attendent units) in Imperial Agents as the book itself tells you.

Celestine has a specific rule that allows her to be added to other Sisters of battle armies but this exception is NOT granted in the Imperial Agents book.

As far as Forge World goes, most of their units say they can be taken "As part of " an X or Y army when they are not intrinsically so. Most of Forge World falls into this category, but not all of it does.

Pandoras box. It was just a bad idea from the word go. Blame 6E.

 Jancoran wrote:
Clarity is important:

Codex Adepta sororitas is distinct and separate from the Vestal Formation (and its attendent units) in Imperial Agents as the book itself tells you.

Celestine has a specific rule that allows her to be added to other Sisters of battle armies but this exception is NOT granted in the Imperial Agents book.

As far as Forge World goes, most of their units say they can be taken "As part of " an X or Y army when they are not intrinsically so. Most of Forge World falls into this category, but not all of it does.

Pandoras box. It was just a bad idea from the word go. Blame 6E.

It's a list for LVO, so the new Celestine is out of consideration I have to settle for the old one.

Pretty sure we could field a Vestal detachment with the old codex though. I don't have my C:IA with me at work to double check, but I would be surprised if anything restricted it to C:IA. Anyway, that detachment is just plain bad.

 Jancoran wrote:
Clarity is important:

Codex Adepta sororitas is distinct and separate from the Vestal Formation (and its attendent units) in Imperial Agents as the book itself tells you.

Celestine has a specific rule that allows her to be added to other Sisters of battle armies but this exception is NOT granted in the Imperial Agents book.

As far as Forge World goes, most of their units say they can be taken "As part of " an X or Y army when they are not intrinsically so. Most of Forge World falls into this category, but not all of it does.

Pandoras box. It was just a bad idea from the word go. Blame 6E.

This is incorrect.

Combined Arms Detachment
Restrictions
All units chosen must have the same Faction (or have no Faction).

Emphasis is mine. Both C:AS and C:IA units have a faction of 'Adepta Sororitas'. Hence you are free to mix and match those units in a CAD (and indeed any detachment of the appropriate type). This is the same reason you can use a Inquisitorial Representative detachment to take an Inquisitor from C:I. It is important to note that the ITC does not allow you to take two identically named units in the same list, however. (You could not take both a Dominion from IA and a Dominion from AS.)

Forgeworld, on the other hand, lists it by book. "Codex: Adepta Sororitas References in Imperial Armour Volume Two: Second Edition to ‘
Codex: Sisters of Battle’ should be read as ‘Codex: Adepta Sororitas" so you can't take Repressors for a unit from C:IA.

Ug, sounds like i'm reading something from an intellectual property lawyer.

I was just going to throw New Celestine (and friends) in with my seraphim and see what happens. I think they may be the cheapest jump-type troops available to her, and they have a re-rollable 6++ to boot!

Are TWC with Hammers or fists the only source of lots of S10 attacks? I know some ICs can get them, but the points per attack ratio is higher.

S10 is of course useful for breaking FNP on T5.

 RabbitMaster wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
Clarity is important:

Codex Adepta sororitas is distinct and separate from the Vestal Formation (and its attendent units) in Imperial Agents as the book itself tells you.

Celestine has a specific rule that allows her to be added to other Sisters of battle armies but this exception is NOT granted in the Imperial Agents book.

As far as Forge World goes, most of their units say they can be taken "As part of " an X or Y army when they are not intrinsically so. Most of Forge World falls into this category, but not all of it does.

Pandoras box. It was just a bad idea from the word go. Blame 6E.

It's a list for LVO, so the new Celestine is out of consideration I have to settle for the old one.

Pretty sure we could field a Vestal detachment with the old codex though. I don't have my C:IA with me at work to double check, but I would be surprised if anything restricted it to C:IA. Anyway, that detachment is just plain bad.

Nope. Vestal Detachment uses just the units in Imperial Agents. Not Adepta Sororitas.


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Faction does not define formation. Faction just means faction. So no. Im not wrong.

Doubling down?

Vestal only requires AS faction:



So you are still incorrect.

And Faction is a defined term from the rules. Units in different books can be the same faction. For example: AS is a faction the exists in two books.


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Mavnas wrote:
Are TWC with Hammers or fists the only source of lots of S10 attacks? I know some ICs can get them, but the points per attack ratio is higher.

S10 is of course useful for breaking FNP on T5.

Twc and wulfen are my favorite (and the cheapest).

Yeah, Wulfens are monstrosities.

BTW, what's your usual Sister+SW army list Pretre ?

I posted my wulfen add on a page or so back. Add Celestine and fill the rest with BSS, doms and exorcists.

Sorry if this been Answer, Ive been out due to surgery and have a really hard time reading right now.

In the Fall of Cadia can the SoB take the transports (not as a dedicated but just take them) from the FA slot. aka Drop pods?

 Amishprn86 wrote:
Sorry if this been Answer, Ive been out due to surgery and have a really hard time reading right now.

In the Fall of Cadia can the SoB take the transports (not as a dedicated but just take them) from the FA slot. aka Drop pods?

Not definite but I think the ruling as per current FAQs is:

They could buy them from your points allowance but not start the game in them as they are still a different Faction (*) - so Drop Pods are less useful.

(*) There was quite a bit of discussion about how detachments and formations and all that nonsense works in relation to this and Factions when C:IA came out.

Mr. Morden is correct.

Units in the same detachment don't change faction. Transport usage is based on faction. The only time a unit can start in another unit's transport now is if it is a dedicated transport for that unit (Example: Henchmen in Codex: IA) and that is because the main rulebook says a DT changes to your faction when you take it.

I thought they FAQ ed that for the IA valks so they were useable

war wrote:
I thought they FAQ ed that for the IA valks so they were useable

That is true and a separate issue.

war wrote:
I thought they FAQ ed that for the IA valks so they were useable

Page 46 – Faction and Allies
Add the following to the end of the first paragraph:
‘Transports from this Faction can transport Astra
Militarum, Militarum Tempestus and Inquisition units
as if they were all of the same Faction.’

Not for sisters :(