Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Here is my latest effort at a competitive AM list. Tactics are posted at the bottom. Most of this is based on what I actually have, so there's limited wiggle room! The tournament is no lords of war, max 2 detachments and max warp charge of 12. Let me know what you think, would you find this in any way scary to fight?

Company command squad with master of ordinance 80pts
2 priests 50pts
1 Commissar 25pts

2 Infantry Platoons, consisting of these units:

3 Combined Squads 216pts
3 Lascannons
1 Melta Bomb and bolter
Accompanied by Commissar

3 Combined Squads 216pts
3 Lascannons
1 Melta Bomb and bolter
Accompanied by Inquisitor

4 Combined Squads 262pts
4 Autocannons
2 bolters
2 melta bombs and 1 set of krak grenades
Accompanied by Coteaz

Platoon command squad with Autocannon 40pts
Platoon command squad with Autocannon 40pts

30 conscripts accompanied by a priest 90pts
30 conscripts accompanied by a priest 90pts

Wyvern 65pts
Manticore 170pts

Inquisition

Inquisitor with ML1 + 3 Servos Skulls 64pts
Coteaz 100pts

11 Henchmen warband - 8 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 78pts
11 Henchmen warband - 8 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 78pts
11 Henchmen warband - 8 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 78pts

Tactics:

The two conscript units and autocannon unit move up to take objectives, getting in CC where appropriate. Autocannons can still fire if they don't move.
The two lascannon blobs sit back and shoot, boosted by orders from the company command squad and psychic powers.
The CCS, 2 PCSs and the henchmen warbands hug cover and provide buffs to the main blobs.
The wyvern and manticore ideally hide behind LOS blocking terrain. If there's none, they'll deploy in table corners if I have first turn, or the manticore will start in reserve if I don't. This is to ensure at least one rocket barrage to hit heavies!
The henchmen bands roll on telepathy to get shrouded or invisibility to shield the blobs, the inquisitors roll on divination to provide buffs from within them.

Most of it looks pretty solid. Placing my astra militarum hat (current hat) aside, if I were playing against this, I see some very obvious targets.

You only have two pieces of armor, which are somewhat fragile. All of my anti-tank fire would go there first, and they would be unlikely to survive more than 1 turn on the board.
Otherwise, the CCS would have a giant target on it. That one squad is 6 easy to kill models that provide a HUGE force modifier to you. Any decent player will recognize how much they contribute and how easy they are to kill and remove them.

Based on the list you have, I'd recommend switching some things out to get the CCS a chimera and probably add in something like a defense line. The chimera will give your opponent's high S weapons one more thing to spread their fire between and give a little more protection to the CCS. Defense line seems obvious. I don't usually use one, but with the set-up you have, I feel like it i (or something like it... like a shield generator), s almost required.

Don't take any of this to suggest that this doesn't look like a solid list, just how I'd attempt to cripple it from an opponent's perspective.

You're probably right on the softer targets... My thought was to try and hide all three of them out of LOS where possible, but I accept that it might not be possible for three units. I don't know how much terrain the tournament will have either... If the worst comes to the worst I was considering setting up the manticore behind the wyvern for some extra cover haha. I suppose I could evem use the cheap wyvern to provide LOS blocking for the CCS?

Are you sure putting in an extra AV12 vehicle is the answer though? I do fully expect the artillery to die if it is exposed, but I was hoping to prevent that from happening with terrain and their range

The defense line does sound like a sensible idea though, though I'm not 100% sure what I'd drop for it. Could trade out the manticore for a deep-striking scion squad with meltas and the defense line perhaps? I do have a defense line I could use.

I'm not sure that an extra AV 12 vehicle is the answer, only that it should help (and provide some protection for the command squad). I'm used to running quite a few more tanks, so I give my opponent's armor piercing stuff more things to target. The defense line should give all of the tanks a nice boost.

As for what to drop, I don't have any experience with Manticores, but it does seem like a lot of points for an easy to kill chassis. You could almost pay for another wyvern, a command chimera, and a defense line for the same points.

I don't expect the inquisition squads to produce much, but your setup is something new to me. I could see dropping 1-2 of them for points. If you have used them at least a few times, I'd be very interested to see how they do. I'm more used to smaller inquisition squads with only 1-2 upgrade characters with a chimera or razorback to run around grabbing objectives. . While I use quite a few of the same elements as you, I do run with much more armor (only one large blob) and so hard to imagine exactly what these squads would do.

WIth the servo skulls, I do think that a scion squad or two would be a good add, but may not be better than other things you already have.

Thanks again for the advice! The inquisition squads are mainly there as a cheap access to bolters, plasma and a psyker all for 78pts. I'll be using them to either buff blobs, respond to deep-strikers or psychic shriek MCs and the like to death. They'll be the ones hugging cover when the blobs advance in the open, trying to give some targetting priority issues to my opponent. I think they are a really good buy for what you get, hence the full warbands.

Wish I could use my other wyvern, unfortunately I've stupidly left it back home and I'm at uni now... The main point of the manticore in this list is to deal with hard targets on the other side of the board. It's been something I've been struggling with as I don't think the HWTs alone will really cut it at this point cost. I was thinking scions before, but then had the idea of the manticore instead, as it is probably tougher than a scion squad and can fire across the board from turn 1 (after which it'll probably die though admittedly). That 170pts is kind of earmarked for more anti-tank stuff, though I'm not 100% sure what to spend it on

Another thought - if you're recommending a chimera, wouldn't it be more sensible just to get another CCS, as they cost less points then I'd have more orders about too haha

I could trade manticore for 5 melta scions, ADL and 2nd CCS if I make a 30pts of further painful savings somewhere

The one thing I would be scared of when playing the list is time. This will be exhaustig for you to play.

I think it is a strong list - I used to play something very similar with the earlier IG Codex. Even the two vehicles are alright. You should be able to hide/keep out of range at least the Manticore (my personal preference would be the Deathstrike - it scares the hell out of some opponents).

There are a few tweaks I think are needed:

1. That Inquisitor should have the Liber. Getting that blob 6" forward will make it a threat from T2. Without it, you'll shoot Lasguns for 3 turns.
2. All blobs should have a minimum of 10 Krak 'nades. Everything else will leave you extremely vulnerable to tough MCs or even the weaker walkers. Even a Sentinel could hold up a huge chunk of your army forever.
3. Single Priest in the Conscripts is risky. Two would be better to avoid loosing the whole unit to sniping or barrage.
4. What purpose does Coteaz serve? I think this is were the additional points for the above could come from.

Haha, I do think this may take a bit of time! Not played any games with it yet, but I aim to be as efficient as possible with them when I do lol

I chose the manticore over the deathstrike as it would get a guaranteed shot off before being shot down, was a bit concerned with the deathstrike not being able to fire first turn so it'd get focused by the entire enemy anti-tank

Coteaz was mainly there as a ML2 psyker with some additional decent bonuses (seize, pseudo-interceptor, 2+ save, decent CC attacks, 3 wounds, LD10, stubborn, small shooting attack)

I do agree about the liber though, I had it and rad grenades in the list before I tried to shave things for the manticore to fit too.

Not sure about the additional characters, I might stretch to one additional priest perhaps to jump into units as needed? It seems a shame to increase the cost of the conscripts more though as they are pretty cheap!

So, aside from core stuff I definitely want, I have about 270pts to spend on any of the following:

Long ranged anti tank: manticore or 90pts double melta scions

Insurance: Extra priest, extra CCS,

Army buffs: ADL, liber heresius, coteaz

I'd agree that the extra priest in the conscripts seems a waste. It would be extra insurance, but the squad only costs 90 points to start with (115 with priest). The extra priest doesn't add much other than some insurance... but I'd just call it a loss on the off chance that the priest gets sniped. It happens. If you do add another priest, I'd add it to Coteaz's squad.

I'd not drop Coteaz, he's a huge buff to the lascannon blob and the army in general. In a squad of 40 w/ 4 lascannons, he's also give a great "don't deep strike within 12" bubble. I've wiped entire squads as soon as they landed which chose not to heed that warning.

My thought is that the two melta scions are going to do better than one manticore. Not having played a manticore, that's just a "how it looks on paper" opinion.

A second CCS would be an interesting add. I don't do it, and I've not seen it done, but with so many squads that can benefit from senior orders (I usually only have 1-2), I think that is a good option to try.

As a side note, I'd second the opinion that one of your biggest opponents will be time, especially in a tournament (timed) setting. Not a whole lot you can do about it if you're playing a foot guard list, but it bears keeping in mind. I hope you have an army tray of some type so that you're not pulling guys in and out of a case between games.

Your two Infantry Platoons are combined in a way not consistent with the rules. Each Infantry Platoon may have up to 5 Infantry Squads, but those squads may only combine with other squads in the same platoon. Thus, you have a total of 10 squads, but you cannot group them as you have as a group of 3, 3, and 4. If you have a Platoon with 5 squads and combine 3 of them, you cannot group the remaining 2 with squads from the other platoon. See the "Combined Squads" special rule in the AM Codex, it limits combinations to the same platoon.

 madric wrote:
Your two Infantry Platoons are combined in a way not consistent with the rules. Each Infantry Platoon may have up to 5 Infantry Squads, but those squads may only combine with other squads in the same platoon. Thus, you have a total of 10 squads, but you cannot group them as you have as a group of 3, 3, and 4. If you have a Platoon with 5 squads and combine 3 of them, you cannot group the remaining 2 with squads from the other platoon. See the "Combined Squads" special rule in the AM Codex, it limits combinations to the same platoon.

Indeed. I don't know how I missed that too.

Dang. Missed that, in my mind I thought that the limit was 2-6 infantry squads

That means either forcing in room for another PCS or shifting things around quite a bit :(

Could lose the manticore for a PCS with autocannon, scion squad and aegis line?

Instead of having combined squads of size 3, 3, and 4. You could make 3 separate platoons, each with 3 combined squads. Dropping 1 squad with an autocannon should free up points to create one platoon command squad with an autocannon.

So the combination instead would be:
* Platoon1:
- platoon command with autocannon
- 3 combined squads (with lascannons)
* Platoon2:
- platoon command with autocannon
- 3 combined squads (with lascannons)
* Platoon3:
- platoon command with autocannon
- 3 combined squads (with autocannons)

That way you can keep your manticore.

Ok, I've pretty much decided on the list I'm using! Going to drop the manticore after all in place of deep striking scions and a second CCS with another master of ordnance. I made up the points for the third PCS from dropping a few bolter henchmen.

I'd rather not drop the extra men from my one advancing blob - I'd like as much assurance as possible that some melta bombs will make it to enemy lines!

Here's the list:

Company command squad with master of ordinance 80pts
Company command squad with master of ordinance 80pts
2 priests 50pts
Commissar 25pts

3 Infantry Platoons, consisting of these units:

3 Combined Squads 218pts
3 Lascannons
3 Bolters
1 Melta Bomb
Accompanied by inquisitor

3 Combined Squads 213pts
3 Lascannons
3 Bolters
Accompanied by commissar

4 Combined Squads 264pts
4 Autocannons
4 bolters
2 melta bombs and 1 set of krak grenades
Accompanied by coteaz

Platoon command squad with Autocannon 40pts
Platoon command squad with Autocannon 40pts
Platoon command squad with Autocannon 40pts

30 conscripts accompanied by a priest 90pts
27 conscripts accompanied by a priest 81pts

5 Tempestus scions with 2 meltaguns 90pts
Wyvern 65pts

Inquisition

Inquisitor with ML1 55pts
Coteaz 100pts

10 Henchmen warband - 7 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 73pts
10 Henchmen warband - 7 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 73pts
10 Henchmen warband - 7 acolytes with bolters, 2 with plasma guns and a psyker 73pts

I'm looking forward to using it, with the buffing orders and psychic powers. I'll let you guys know how it gets on in the tournament!

Looks nice to me. I reckon you will get tired with so many models/units to manage - will be going flat out just to get thru the games.

I's be worried about the Wyvern getting popped you could always run mortar squad instead to camp objectives. I like the dual CCS+MoO 's!

The good thing is so much obsec untis that cant run away easily since you have priests/commissars. Also enemy AT will have nothing much to shoot at.

Which missions Maelstrom or Eternal war?

Yeah, I am begininning to be a bit apprehensive about that...

Sorry, I have mortars, for basically the same price a wyvern gains a shot, twin-linked, shred, ignores cover and it probably more durable (even against anti tank weaponary)

Really hope I don't run into too many wyverns or artillery myself though. It wouldn't be fun if those characters got sniped and my expensive blobs head for the hills :(

The missions are:

The scouring with hammer and anvil
A game with 3 objectives spaced evenly down the middle of the board, with vanguard strike deployment
Purge the alien with Dawn of war (perhaps not the best for me with 19 kill points)

Other rules are: max of 2 detachments or formations, psychic phase power dice capped at 12+D6 at maximum (even if you have more). LOW are allowed, as is forge world stuff.

Yeah mortars are trash compared to wyverns.

Ughh Purge the alien. Hate that mission its likely gonna be an autolose. tbh I would prolly have an meltdown in a tourny with so many models.

If LoW are allowed I'd be lazy/cheeky and put a shadowsword in there screened by an ADL/infantry with a bunch of wyverns hiding behind. Let your conscripts contest objectives.

Otherwise just space your guys out you should be ok, I seen a guy with bases that has round moulded spots for an entire squad spaced at max 2 inch but maintaning coherency. I dunno what they are called but very handy for this situation.

Yeah, that'd be cool! I might get round to making some movement trays at some stage, not sure they'd all fit on the table at 2" coherency though

Unfortunately I'm a bit model-limited, I only have one wyvern (which is really a Griffon) and no shadowsword or the rules to use it lol

Tournament done, it was really good fun! I wound up playing against three very elite armies, which was an advantage to me.

Game 1 was scouring against space marines and a knight. He had a large squad of shrouded grav centurions, several land speeder storms, a red scorpion artillery tank and a thunderfire cannon.
The centurions whittled through many squads and the knight crushed a blob of conscripts in short order. Eventually massed las fire whittled through the centurions and Coteaz managed to hold up the knight with his blob and his 2+ save. The scions killed the thunderfire (though not before it had killed plenty of lascannons) and lascannons killed the red scorpion tank. The game only lasted til turn three however, due to time constraints and my opponent was a little annoyed. I don't think his lot would have improved as my blobs still hadnt reached his far objectives. I didn't put a single hull point on the knight however. If it had gone to turn five it probably would have cleared me off one objective and it might have been a little closer perhaps. I won 10-4. The MOOs and wyvern did quite well in this game, and my psychic phase did not a lot.

Game 2 was against deathwing and a culexus assassin. He basically had 5 termi squads inlcuding a large one of deathwing knights. I made a mistake early on by not charging the culexus with conscripts, instead failing to las it to death and it proceeded to tie up coteaz's unit for a turn and block all my psychic powers. That same conscript squad killed a terminator unit in close combat and rescued the central objective form a melee, and the one on the other flank died to the deathwing knights. By turn 3 I'd whittled most of his units down and claimed two of three objectives, but we were playing an unusual mission type where one of the three would disappear on turn 4, and to my bad luck it happened to be the one in my deployment zone. Ran out of time one turn 4, he had one terminator on his objective and belial in combat in my deployment zone for linebreaker, and he won 5-4. I would have tabled him turn five irritatingly...

Game 3 was kill points against grey knights and space marines. Draigo led a centurion squad and he had two dreadknights and two other decked out units of terminators. Turn 1 he failed to get invisibility off with the cent. unit so I focused it, bringing down most of the centurions and draigo to one wound. His dreadknights jumped up and flamed stuff, and I charged one with Coteaz's unit, and it died to force on Coteaz's daemon-hammer Draigo died on overwatch to a large blob (despite invisibility) and lascannons felled the other dreadknight. Last act of the game was a conscript charge to wipe out the remaining terminators and I won with a tabling.

I placed 6/16 in the end. It was good to pick up speed with the list by the end (these were my first three games of 7th edition and I had a lot of models to manage). Look forward to using this list in future!

Great report and well done getting thru the turns and winning games!

Yes I had to chuckle at the "my opponent was a little annoyed" comment I have had people get angry with my horde IG before, all a bit unfortunate but it happens.

Because you dont have points tied up in metal boxes or elite units, you can bring a huge amount of firepower in a list like this - with priests it makes for a tough army to bowl over.

Yeah, I did feel a bit bad in that first game, I think the main thing that cost me time was having to sort each of my blobs into the correct size before the game. I was better prepared for the next two, and it felt like they both got to more of a conclusion.

Next time I bring a similar list I'm going to have them prepared for setup in their relevant boxes!

One thing I did like was the comments I got from people passing (most to the tune of 'how on earth did you paint all that' )