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So I put this list together, used the forces of war page and I think it worked great especially giving you the armament information and special rules at the end. Does anyone know if there is a way to save this page to put onto my Ipad?

List:

CONFIDENT/VETERAN
TANK COMPANY POINTS 1895

Panzerkompanie HQ (Lehr):

2x Panzer IV J 175 points

COMBAT PLATOONS:

4x Panzer IV J 350 points

4x Panzer IV J 350 points

3x Panzer IV J 260 points (would of liked to make this four but I will run it with the HQ unit to make it full strength)

SUPPORT PLATOONS

Assualt Gun Plt.
1 StuG G (late)
1 StuH42 195 Points
(Wanted the 3 stug G's with the option to take a StuH42 but I couldn't afford three so I went with the two late ones and the StuH42...I dont have this model so I might just run two Stug G's (late) same points)

Gepanzerte Aufklärungs Platoon
1 Cmd Panzerfaust SMG team
4 Sd Kfz 250
6 Panzerfaust MG team
285 points

Half-tracked Panzerspäh Platoon
1 Sd Kfz 250 (Recce)
2 Sd Kfz 250/9 (2cm)
100 Points

Motorised Heavy Artillery Battery
1 Cmd SMG team
1 Kubelwagen
1 Staff team
1 Kfz 68 radio truck
2 15cm sFH18 howitzer
2 Sd Kfz 7
1 Panzer IV J OP

I know alot of people prefer the rocket batteries for the germans because you get more smoke out of them (IIRC) but I just like big guns although I would of prefered to take a larger battery.
I like this list because all of my PzIV's get spearhead and so do my infantry which I can hopefully use to seize good defensible terrain early and position my Panzers to have good interlocking sectors of fire early. I use spearhead more for seizing key terrain and limit my enemies freedom of movement early. I see alot of people try to use it to close the distance and press an attack but I do not feel that is playing to germany's strength.

So point management is my biggest problem as I am new to building list.

Some questions I have:
1) Is the StuH42 worth it or would two stug G (late) be better?
I know it has the breakthrough gun which can be a big help to the smaller german infantry numbers. I was thinking it was worth it just for that since all my infantry teams are Panzerfaust teams with tank assault 5 or 6 and I have 15 PzIV's for tank battling so the Stugs would be supporting them more against infantry closing in to assault.

2) I took all of the options with the artillery because it sounds cool but...well I have no idea what they do as I haven't used any artillery yet....so what do they do?
Kfz 68 radio truck is used for???? Increasing the distance of the guns or increasing chance to spot rounds well??

Panzer IV J OP??? Regular PzIV but is used to spot right? So a spotter with armor? Is this better than a spotter on foot, my thought is that it isn't because you can not take advantage of tall buildings to increase you LOS.


Also I need to purchase the 15cm guns so what box do yous suggest. I usually buy PSC but is there a company that makes box with all the extras like the KubelWagon and Radio truck all in one?

And lastly I used a lot of halftracks because I just purchased 15 of them (291 D's i believe) and two boxes of conversion kits from PSC so I want to use them.


Any recommendations/critiques are welcome even to try to convince me to change my arty! I am a newish player and this is my first from scratch list I have tried to build so Thanks in advance!

I use the list a fair bit, I like three panzer 4/70's just adds more fire, better than the 3 pz4 and StuG's

Also prefer cheap Nebs and some AA - but ymmv

The radio truck has no game effect beyond providing a transport for the staff team.

Also 2 15cm guns have to reroll hits on bombardment, and loosing just one means they can't fire smoke. Since that is your only smoke template someone with airsupport or an AOP will try to take out at least one gun first off. Also a one gun bombardment adds +1 to the 'to hit rolls'

The short platoon of StuGs is nearly useless, and makes your army have 7 platoons, which isn't ideal as you want 6 or 8. Drop them (195pts), and increase the 15cm battery to 4 guns (150pts)
leaving 50pts available. This is enough to add the Tank Hunter team and three extra 250s to the GepAufks platoon.

2+4+4+3 PzIVs
GepAufks w TH and 7 250s
halftrack patrol
4x 15cm guns, trucks, ObsPzIV
6plt/1900pts

What you are missing is cheap smoke, you're going to have to decide if using your big guns for a smoke template is worth it.

EDIT: Removed new list for maintenance.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Reaver83 wrote:I use the list a fair bit, I like three panzer 4/70's just adds more fire, better than the 3 pz4 and StuG's

Also prefer cheap Nebs and some AA - but ymmv

I wanted to use the 4/70's but I already have the Stug G models and I need to buy arty and AA so they are not in the budget.

Do you use the rockets and if so do you find that them becoming reluctant/trained a problem? It dosent state why they are different from the rest of the company.

AndrasOtto wrote:The radio truck has no game effect beyond providing a transport for the staff team.

Also 2 15cm guns have to reroll hits on bombardment, and loosing just one means they can't fire smoke. Since that is your only smoke template someone with airsupport or an AOP will try to take out at least one gun first off. Also a one gun bombardment adds +1 to the 'to hit rolls'

The short platoon of StuGs is nearly useless, and makes your army have 7 platoons, which isn't ideal as you want 6 or 8. Drop them (195pts), and increase the 15cm battery to 4 guns (150pts)
leaving 50pts available. This is enough to add the Tank Hunter team and three extra 250s to the GepAufks platoon.

2+4+4+3 PzIVs
GepAufks w TH and 7 250s
halftrack patrol
4x 15cm guns, trucks, ObsPzIV
6plt/1900pts

What you are missing is cheap smoke, you're going to have to decide if using your big guns for a smoke template is worth it.

Ah I didn't know that about the artillery but I see your point. I posted that new list at the same time as your post so I didn't see your suggestions will update it when I make changes. If I drop the Stug's for 195 pts and pick up the extra 2 guns I can use the 50pts for the cheap AA. But that leaves me at an odd number again. Ok I'm gonna fiddle some and see what I come up with. Thank you both for your help so far.

If you get your 2 HQ tanks, 2 platoons of 4 panzers, a GepAufks platoon with a TanHunter, and a recon platoon of halftracks (or Pumas) that's 1280 for 4 platoons.

At 1900pts, you have 620pts for either 2 or 4 platoons (6 or 8 total)

If you get cheap smoke (3 NW41s) and cheap AA (3 2cm flak38s) thats 145pts and we're up to 6 platoons with 475pts left.

A 15cm Arty Btty is 310 with no upgrades, leaving 165 for our last platoon.

There's not much you can get for 165 in the Panzer list except a platoon of Mobenwagens, or you can get a 2nd halftrack/Puma patrol and use the 65pts to expand the rocket platoon to 6 launchers

10PzIVs 2+4+4
GepAufks w TH
2 Recon Patrols (Pumas or 'tracks)
3 Flak38s
6 NW41s
4 15cm arty
8/1900

In half on situations, you can have all your tanks, the Geps and the 15cm btty.
Three less PzIVs, but you get an extra recon patrol, flak, and a rocket battery to throw smoke while your 15cms deliver the hurt.

This list is going to have very few half on battles. It's an always attacks/spearhead so unless he is facing another always attacks armor list, he should get everything.

This is what I am running for this list right now at 1900.



Compulsory Panzerkompanie HQ (p.9) - CinC Panzer IV J, 2iC Panzer IV J (175 pts)
- Bergepanther recovery vehicle (15 pts)
Compulsory Panzer Platoon (p.10) - Command Panzer IV J, 3x Panzer IV J (350 pts)
Compulsory Panzer Platoon (p.10) - Command Panzer IV J, 3x Panzer IV J (350 pts)
Panzer Anti-Aircraft Gun Platoon (p.10) - Command Wirbelwind (Quad 2cm), Wirbelwind (Quad 2cm) (110 pts)
Tank-Hunter Platoon (p.27) - Command Panzer IV/70 (V), 2x Panzer IV/70 (V) (450 pts)
Gepanzerte Aufklarungs Platoon (p.17) - Command Panzerfaust MG, 6x Panzerfaust MG, 4x Sd Kfz 250 half-track (285 pts)
- Replace Command Panzerfaust MG with Command Panzerfaust SMG (0 pts)
- Tank-hunter (20 pts)
Panzerspah Platoon (p.18) - 2x Command Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma, 2x Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma (200 pts)
- Replace Command Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma, Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma with Command Sd Kfz 231 (8-rad), Sd Kfz 231 (8-rad) (-30 pts)
- Replace Command Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma, Sd Kfz 234/2 Puma with Command Sd Kfz 234/1 (2cm), Sd Kfz 234/1 (2cm) (-25 pts)

1900 Points, 7 Platoons

Everything except the AA and the IV/70s either spearheads or recce moves. It usually ends up with being close enough to your opponent that other than the IV/70s, you are too close for thier air to come in to most things.

Sometimes you'll loose the roll off against Patton, and sometimes it's a die roll to defend anyway.

In addition, Hasty Attack, Cauldron, and Breakthrough all have the attacker putting units in reserve.

Ok here is the new list.

Basically I dropped the 15cm guns and the Stugs. I bumped up my third PzIV platoon to 4 tanks instead of 3, also I went with the battery of 6 15cm rockets, I was going to do the 20cm rockets but it seems they don't have smoke (???). I also picked up 2 AA guns for 50 pts (Cheap and can be left off table for reserves or used to protect arty). And a sporadic FW190F. The FW was 100pts and I was going to use the 100pts to bump my recon up to 2 squads but from what I understand of the rules they would then be considered 2 separate platoons (which would give me an odd number) and I am not sure if 2 platoons of recce would be any good.

Basically I am flexible on the aircraft and the AA so if I can use the 150 pts somewhere else I'll drop them quickly. I also could free up another 25pts by nixing the tank hunter team but I would only do that to pick up another anti tank unit.

CONFIDENT VETERAN
TANK COMPANY POINTS1900

HQ
Panzerkompanie HQ
2x Panzer IV J 175pts

COMBAT PLATOONS

4x Panzer IV J 350 pts
4x Panzer IV J 350 pts
4x Panzer IV J 350 pts

SUPPORT PLATOONS
Gepanzerte Aufklärungs Platoon
1 Cmd Panzerfaust SMG team
4 Sd Kfz 250
6 Panzerfaust MG team
285

Half-tracked Panzerspäh Platoon
1 Sd Kfz 250 (Recce)
2 Sd Kfz 250/9 (2cm)
100

Volks Rocket Launcher Battery p.33
RELUCTANT TRAINED
1 Cmd SMG team
2 Observer Rifle team
3 Kubelwagen
6 15cm NW41
6 Sd Kfz 11
140

Anti-aircraft Gun Platoon
1 Cmd SMG team
2 2cm FlaK38 gun
50

Air Support
3 Sporadic Air Support FW 190F
100


So my questions for this now would is: Would I be better served dropping the FW and getting the second recce squad (platoon)? Does that second recce squad count against my platoons if I have to divide them for reserves or is this just for movement purposes? I guess the other alternative would be adding to the AA instead of the recce.

I wil probably change this list again as I feel that I would be better served with another combat unit instead of the AA and FW. I would really like to take the Stugs I just like them lol.

Again thank you everyone for your suggestions/comments/answers.

It's a good list. The FW190 is good because it gives you a deep strike threat.

I'm concerned, however, that your only artillery is the RT rockets. There is a rule that lets your opponents try to range in on a rocket battery after it fires using the smoke trails. They are ranged in as if concealed, but for Trained targets, thats only a 4+. If they are hit, then as a Reluctant Platoon they only unpin on a 5+. Until they unpin, they can't fire.

MrMcAwesome wrote:
I was going to do the 20cm rockets but it seems they don't have smoke (???).

Correct. Neither the 21cm NW42 or the 30cm NW42 rockets have smoke.

Iirc my list is

Hq - panzer 4's
2 platoons of panzer 4
Aufklarungs
3 panzer 4/70
Recce (8rad or nebs)
3 15cm nebs

It works very well, but you need to be very very aggressive, the rockets need to be hard to see, and I normally fire turn 2 when I first assault - they will unpin but not for a while

If I have the points I'd take air over AA. The 4/70 I find really effective

Mr.McAwesome,

Models on hand is something to consider, however, rifle fire/MG fire can bail a 250/9. It can't bail an 8-rad. Plus the points savings can get you the tank hunter stand in the Gep.Aufk.