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Dakkanauts, I have what I think will be a pretty nasty competitive list for the dark kin. It has a nice balance of shooting and assault, and will (hopefully) be durable enough to stick around till end game. Here's the list, and the tactics to follow:

DE CAD
HQ
1- Court of the Archon: 3 Sslyth, 1 Ur-Ghul, 1 Lhamaean, Venom DT

ELITES
5- Trueborn: 4 blasters, Venom DT
5- Trueborn: 4 blasters, Venom DT

TROOPS
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT

FAST ATTACK
1- Razorwing Jetfighter: 2 Dark Lances, 2 Necrotoxin Missiles, 2 Shatterfield Missiles
1- Razorwing Jetfighter: 2 Dark Lances, 2 Necrotoxin Missiles, 2 Shatterfield Missiles
6- Reavers: 2 Caltrops, Arena Champion

HAEMONCULUS COVENS GROTESQUERIE FORMATION
1- Haemonculus: Syndriq's Sump
3- Grotesques: Raider w/ Night Shields and Disintegrator DT
3- Grotesques: Raider w/ Night Shields and Disintegrator DT

The Court, Reavers, and both Grotesque units bum-rush to get into assault. I've found that the Court hits like a truck, mostly due to the Sslyth, and that the Grotesques are better when they're outnumbered. The Reavers are almost always rock stars, and exist just to smash things with their Caltrops and bladevanes. Those units take the heat off the Warriors, who hopefully jink their way to safety from objective to objective. The trueborn are meant as deep-striking suicide squads, unless my opponent has a lack of armor; then they just start on the board and blast the Splinter Cannons. The Jetfighters are obviously the anti-air, and their missiles are great anti-infantry. I put two shatterfield in there for the S7 in case they need to hit some armor as well. Night Shields on all the Raiders should keep them trucking long enough to do their job. Thoughts?

Looks good to me. I always forget that the venom can Deepstrike on its own.

 Homeskillet wrote:
Dakkanauts, I have what I think will be a pretty nasty competitive list for the dark kin. It has a nice balance of shooting and assault, and will (hopefully) be durable enough to stick around till end game. Here's the list, and the tactics to follow:

DE CAD
HQ
1- Court of the Archon: 3 Sslyth, 1 Ur-Ghul, 1 Lhamaean, Venom DT

ELITES
5- Trueborn: 4 blasters, Venom DT
5- Trueborn: 4 blasters, Venom DT

TROOPS
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT
5- Warriors: Raider w/ Nightshields and Dark Lance DT

FAST ATTACK
1- Razorwing Jetfighter: 2 Dark Lances, 2 Necrotoxin Missiles, 2 Shatterfield Missiles
1- Razorwing Jetfighter: 2 Dark Lances, 2 Necrotoxin Missiles, 2 Shatterfield Missiles
6- Reavers: 2 Caltrops, Arena Champion

HAEMONCULUS COVENS GROTESQUERIE FORMATION
1- Haemonculus: Syndriq's Sump
3- Grotesques: Raider w/ Night Shields and Disintegrator DT
3- Grotesques: Raider w/ Night Shields and Disintegrator DT

The Court, Reavers, and both Grotesque units bum-rush to get into assault. I've found that the Court hits like a truck, mostly due to the Sslyth, and that the Grotesques are better when they're outnumbered. The Reavers are almost always rock stars, and exist just to smash things with their Caltrops and bladevanes. Those units take the heat off the Warriors, who hopefully jink their way to safety from objective to objective. The trueborn are meant as deep-striking suicide squads, unless my opponent has a lack of armor; then they just start on the board and blast the Splinter Cannons. The Jetfighters are obviously the anti-air, and their missiles are great anti-infantry. I put two shatterfield in there for the S7 in case they need to hit some armor as well. Night Shields on all the Raiders should keep them trucking long enough to do their job. Thoughts?

Looks good but IIRC venoms only hold 5 and the archon plus his court is 6 models.

Nah, he doesn't have an archon, just the court. They'll fit. Though I'm not sure how great that squad really is, I would at least get Medusae in there.

I would try to find points for aethersails on the grots' raiders so they have a good chance for combat by turn 2.

Looks fairly solid. My big concern is Anti-Tank, you have only 16 Dark light shots in the entire army and no haywire at all. What is your plan vs an AdLance? Otherwise it looks good so I just wonder if you can shift afew things round perhaps go RSR on the Detachment and get 2-3 units of Haywire Scourges.

for the cost of that grotesque formation you could afford a dark artisan formation and some scourges

corpsyworpsy wrote:Nah, he doesn't have an archon, just the court. They'll fit. Though I'm not sure how great that squad really is, I would at least get Medusae in there.

I would try to find points for aethersails on the grots' raiders so they have a good chance for combat by turn 2.

Actually, if I put them right on the deployment line turned sideways, I can pivot, move 12", and turbo-boost another 18" right into the enemy deployment zone on Turn 1. They just sit there and say "deal with me or else.."

FlingitNow wrote:Looks fairly solid. My big concern is Anti-Tank, you have only 16 Dark light shots in the entire army and no haywire at all. What is your plan vs an AdLance? Otherwise it looks good so I just wonder if you can shift afew things round perhaps go RSR on the Detachment and get 2-3 units of Haywire Scourges.

Oddly enough, this list is light on AT. Sadly, it would be enough against a "normal' list, but against Adlance I don't think it has enough to take all of them down. That being said, this list isn't necessarily built to kill the Adlance. It is built to survive it. It has enough to kill everything allied to an Adlance, and to reliably kill at least one of the Knights. With my speed and the Nightshields on my troops, he can't catch me and can't reliably shoot down my boats either. I'll take the objectives and play keep-away from the Knights.

On the topic of the RSR detachment, I personally think it actually hinders DE. I feel their super-cheap, super-fast, objective-secured Raiders are perfect for winning Maelstrom battles. I don't think the addition of 3 fast attack slots is enough of a benefit to lose Objective Secured. Agree or disagree?

I agree on the RSR detachment if FA wasn't so important for AT. My issue is 3 AdLance builds cause you massive problems:

First is one that will go away is the double Wraithknight and summoningseer. That has the volume of units to survive you and match you for scoring.

Second is my personal fave the FBSC which will delete your skimmers in short order. Even the DSing ones will die before they fire.

The last is something along these lines which will be more popular in the future:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/644694.page#7760587

Wow, this list looks good, im taking some of the ides here for my casual games. Are you taking raiders for the night shields? Because for the KW, a venom would be nice IMO

FlingitNow wrote:I agree on the RSR detachment if FA wasn't so important for AT. My issue is 3 AdLance builds cause you massive problems:

First is one that will go away is the double Wraithknight and summoningseer. That has the volume of units to survive you and match you for scoring.

Second is my personal fave the FBSC which will delete your skimmers in short order. Even the DSing ones will die before they fire.

The last is something along these lines which will be more popular in the future:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/644694.page#7760587

Well, I'd agree the standard Eldar power-list as it stands would give me massive trouble, unless I got first turn. And in competitive play, relying on winning Rock-Paper-Scissors to win is a good way not to lose. Thankfully, the damnable Serpent Shield will likely be fixed and those Ignores Cover guns will go away.

The FBSC is indeed annoying, and does present a difficult matchup. But the only thing they have that is truly scary is the 30" SMS (again, ignores cover will cause this list lots of problems), and starting out of range I can move and turbo-boost up close to the Firebase to get into assault the following turn. OR stay out of range and again shoot the rest of the army. But in general I agree that the FBSC is problematic.

With the Skitarii, we'll have to wait to see how they pan out!

gummyofallbears wrote:Wow, this list looks good, im taking some of the ides here for my casual games. Are you taking raiders for the night shields? Because for the KW, a venom would be nice IMO

The main reason for taking Raiders is actually the third HP and their larger frame. They are more survivable, and when they go down (hopefully whilst sitting on an objective) the passengers can hide behind the wreck and either completely block LoS or get a 4+ cover save. Venoms are great little gun platforms, but I anticipate being shot at a LOT, and so a jinking gun platform is not much of a gun platform at all, lol. The Nightshields are more like icing on the cake, lol.

I think you missunderstood me. Those where builds that are run with AdLances very regularly. So there won't be Wave Serpents as Summoning Seer 2 Wraithknights and Adlance is already over 1700 points. Whilst pushing up to the FBSC just forces you into charge range of Knights and avoiding a 30" bubble whilst also avoiding Knights is not going to happen. And to be honest the S7 is very worrying as it puts on average 8 HPs on a vehicle before your jinks so you will lose units quickly even with a 3+ jink.

Those are my concerns. I'm not sure the way AdLance is run that simply avoiding it is viable unless you have 15+ Drop Pods.

Ah yes, I did misunderstand, lol. Yeah those are tough nuts to crack, but the FBSC isn't cheap. Those lists bank on being able to table or nearly table their opponents. Take out those evil Broadsides and it makes it easier to get some work done and stay mobile.

Same thing with a Wraithknight and some Wave Serpents; yes they are nasty, but also expensive. Focus fire on them, then play keepaway. Certainly not easy by any means, but it's the best tactic against those lists (in my opinion).

You cant pivot and gain the extra move anymore. Something in the rule book about any part of the vehicle cant over move maximum movement or something. I can look it up if need be, just letting you know is all.

As a question, do you not feel those Night Shields are a bit wasted when they'e only protecting 5 warriors?