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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





WAAAAAAAGGHHH!

Now that I have your attention I would like to get straight to the point.

Hi! I am a long time fan of Warhammer 40k and just now breaking into the table top experience. I have decided to pursue an ork army up to around 2000 points. This is my first time doing anything of the sort and wanted some advice from experienced players.
.

I am currently building up my army through select purchases from ebay and my local nerd shop of pre owned and painted models. What specific pieces should I bet looking for to create a viable ork army?

I would like some feedback on my current army and what I have too much of and should avoid buying and what I need more.

My current army list is as follows
Note: All models were already well painted and assembled when I bought them.

1 Warboss
41 slugga boyz
34 shoota boyz
14 burna boyz
8 Nobz
5 Lootas
5 Ard boyz
4 biker nobs
2 Trukks

Visually the army is a combination of Bad Moonz, Goffs, and Death Skulls.

1 outdated 4th edition codex, but it was $2 so I got it just to hug it.

Total $ I have spent so far is $220.

1. Do you guys think this has been a good price to pay for all of these models?
2. What else do I need to get this army battle ready?
3. About how many points is this army as it stands?
4. Standard point value played with? I was under the impression that 2000 points was the sweet spot to be at.
5. How much $ (USD) can I expect to be putting down for a 2000 point army (painted models)
6. How are orks as a faction in combat? I love the orks and I hear they are fun to play so I will play them even if they are weak, but I am curious as to what the general opinion on them is.
7. As it stands I doubt this army is good for fighting at all so what units should I focus on buying to round it out and make it viable?


Things I know I need. 7th edition ork codex. Dice. Lots of them.
Any other essentials needed?

Note: This is my very first time building anything of this sort so all advice is VERY appreciated.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/29 08:15:45


 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

Hi and welcome to Dakka!

Unfortunately, you're going to be playing 40k on hard mode, due to all non-ork armies being a hard counter to Orks.
I'm not much help for Orky tactics, but when you find something that works, abuse the hell out of it.

$220 sounds about right for those models, IMO, but you should get the codex and rulebook before buying anything really, otherwise you'll be going in blind.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, standard point values vary, but tournament standard (back when that was possible) is 1750 - 2000.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 09:39:42


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




The budget range is more or less impossible to ballpark. Depending on the kits you choose and whether you buy new or used you could reach 2000 points spending $100 or $800. Luckily you have a lot of boyz already so much of the spending is done, but be prepared to drop $250 more if you're going at retail price. Artillery, tankbustas and regular non-nob bikers are the best units in the current codex but the models are ludicrously expensive. Every army should have at least one painboy, a couple of deffkoptas and a few sources of kannon or zzap gun fire. If your opponents run flyers or skimmers then the traktor kannon is literally the best AA gun there is. Other than that, max out on rokkits.

Players tend to exaggerate the Orks' vulnerabilities. They are nowhere near as easy to win with currently as Eldar, Necrons, Tau, the Mechanicus books or most marines. But I'd put them ahead of Tyranids, Chaos Marines, Sisters, Dark Eldar, Grey Knights, maybe the Guard depending on allies. Overall they're completely average.
   
Made in de
Fresh-Faced New User




hi
im relatively new(read noob) to 40k and tabletop myself(for about a year now). i play eldar.
i also have the luck (he might read this, so i stay with luck)to learn from and play against an experienced ork player.
i blame it on the differece in experience(and me forgetting to use all my rules), that i could so far only win 1 game (w/1 score higher), draw maybe 2 times, and lost the other 20 or so games, being annihilated about 80% of the time.
so obviously its suggested to learn them rules. all of them. especially interesting for orks is everything melee(doh!), like challenges(and how to avoid them if needed), pile-in shenannigans, spreading wounds, multi charges etc.and how to move your piggies to get board control and overwhelm the foe with the green tide of 4 s4 attacks per 6 points an ork(thats your pointy stick).

as mentioned before, a mob of some bikers, added warboss on bike with lucky stick and a doc for fnp, is one of if not the best unit the orks have. tanky as hell, butchering all but the most powerful foes(and beware stormshields, although, still maaany attacks) and with the ability to charge whatever they like most of the time due to bikes.
da thinking cap is a nice alternative/addition, as you could roll on tactical or whats it called to get 3 units infiltrated...

oc, every nob needs a bosspole and(if meleeing) the good old power claw. you should have nobs(even lootas and bustas, but these may not need a pk).
if you like trucks, get trucks(like, many). if you like sluggas or shootas, get big mobs.

some cheap grots to screen/hold obj/fill the troops slot) are not to underestimate, though some may disagree/discard them alltogether.
a single killcopter to hide your hqs behind, switching them between squads, is not too bad.

meganobs in a transport, tankbustas(squigbombs), rokkits on trukks, rokkits(and rokkits), megacannons,burnaboys(powerswords!!),grotsnik
are all ok/good for what they do, depending on the rest of your army.
lootas are good in smaller squads, maybe a bosspole. they are cheap in points and get a lot of aggro.

bossbikers or just bosses are too much buck for not very much more bang. also flashgitz and morka/gorkanaut are not as cool as they may seem. avoid.
thats enough text for now, enjoy.
   
Made in us
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





I would say to start with two more boxes of boyz (New) Two Boxes of lootas (New) some bitz (rokkits and tankbusta bombs..) some old squigs..and build the lootas as lootas then use the burnas to convert a unit of standard boyz to burna
build the two meks with kmb..use the bits to convert the leftover boyz to tank bustas..tankbusta nob does not need a pk just a boss pole rokkit and tankbusta bomb..
depending on your speed you may need more rtrukks or other transportation..

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 15:43:44


'\' ~9000pts
'' ~1500
"" ~3000
"" ~2500
 
   
Made in us
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver







If you want to compete (at all) you need to make a decision: more boyz or moar Battlewagons!!!!! Green tide or Blitz brigade...both require the Waaagh Ghazhkull book on top of your rule book and the current Ork codex
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Thank you guys for your feedback so far!

Alright so can I get some numbers on what pieces I am looking for?
Like how many Battle wagons?
How many mekboyz and painboyz?
Bikes?

Getting Ghaz and his book as an addition to the 7th codex is also good right?

 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

Get the codex first, then decide. Don't dive too deep before figuring out what works for you and what does not.

It's cost me quite a bit.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 17:17:34


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Selym wrote:
Get the codex first, then decide. Don't dive too deep before figuring out what works for you and what does not.

It's cost me quite a bit.


Problem is I dont know what works for me as I have never played a game of table top. I have watched a ton been played, but this is my first time doing it. I would hate to buy an army list that I think is neat, but have be absolute crap on the table top. Thats why I have requested the advice of you guys here on Dakka Dakka. Getting some solid pointers on where to go is very helpful and appreciated greatly! ^_^
I'd rather put my money down on a solid army and modify it from there than take chances with my ignorance.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 17:24:09


 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

The best way to go is to get the codex, get 1 HQ choice and two troop choices (start with a Warboss and 20 Boyz).

Play a few small games, and each time you feel like it, increase the game size by adding a new unit, until you found the way you want to go.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Selym wrote:
The best way to go is to get the codex, get 1 HQ choice and two troop choices (start with a Warboss and 20 Boyz).

Play a few small games, and each time you feel like it, increase the game size by adding a new unit, until you found the way you want to go.


That does sound good, but at this point in time I dont have any friends who play the game and the two locations in which 40k is played within practical driving distance of me play only 1k-2k point games (from what I have seen anyways). So as it stands the only real way for me to get into the game is to go big from the start. I really do wish I had some buds who played it to do what you suggested though.

 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





Orks are pretty tough for a beginner to win with (as I found out), so don't worry about losing a lot. You may discover that you just run out of guns toward the end of the game.

Having said that, you are close to a green tide, which can be very durable, but is often pulled the wrong way by sacrificial chargers.

If you go that way, adding the painboy is the single most important thing to do. Then more expensive stuff like mek guns, tankbustas and meganobz. Try kitbashing/scratchbuilding as many of these as you can.
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
 Selym wrote:
The best way to go is to get the codex, get 1 HQ choice and two troop choices (start with a Warboss and 20 Boyz).

Play a few small games, and each time you feel like it, increase the game size by adding a new unit, until you found the way you want to go.


That does sound good, but at this point in time I dont have any friends who play the game and the two locations in which 40k is played within practical driving distance of me play only 1k-2k point games (from what I have seen anyways). So as it stands the only real way for me to get into the game is to go big from the start. I really do wish I had some buds who played it to do what you suggested though.

Ask the players at those two locations, they'll be happy to help ease a new player into the game. Most players only do 1k-2k point games as standard as things can get a little awkward outside that range when you're doing regular games. They'll probably be quite happy to play increasing amounts from the 100 point range and up.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 17:52:49


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Alright thanks a ton for the advice so far

Question:
1. Where can I find the base line rules for defining what is a mob and how many models constitute what?
2. Is there a accurate general list of basic table top rules somewhere I can find online? I looked myself before asking (its amazing what can easily be found on google), but couldnt find anything.
3. Does the ork codex cover all of these technical Table top questions like the ones above?
4. Does WAAAGH Ghazghkul Green tide require the Ghazghkul book and model himself?

I have little doubt these are very stupid questions, but again I am pretty clueless.


Also I am glad to hear Orks are on the weaker side. I like a good challenge and didnt want them to be stupid OP. One of the reason I wanted to get into this game was to make some friends along the way and playing a super competitive Necron list did not seem like the way to go.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 18:07:26


 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

1) The Codex
2) The Rulebook (or illicit copies, which are really hard to find, are unreliable and will probably have viruses)
3) Most of them, yes.
4) I have no idea. I think Ghazzy is a Lord of War in the Ork Codex, so you should be fine.
   
Made in us
Wicked Canoptek Wraith




I dont know where i am... please... i dont know where i am

havent played orks since 5th edititon but i know 30 ork boys with shootas in a unit is good. i know that bikers are pretty good. i could be of more help if i knew who you would be fighting normally.

Hate me or love me. either way i benefit. if you love me ill always be on your heart. if you hate me i wil always be on your mind
space marines-battle
company
30k: word bearers, deamons, cults and militia,

 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

I don't think he knows that yet - given he's never played a game.
   
Made in us
Wicked Canoptek Wraith




I dont know where i am... please... i dont know where i am

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
 Selym wrote:
The best way to go is to get the codex, get 1 HQ choice and two troop choices (start with a Warboss and 20 Boyz).

Play a few small games, and each time you feel like it, increase the game size by adding a new unit, until you found the way you want to go.


That does sound good, but at this point in time I dont have any friends who play the game and the two locations in which 40k is played within practical driving distance of me play only 1k-2k point games (from what I have seen anyways). So as it stands the only real way for me to get into the game is to go big from the start. I really do wish I had some buds who played it to do what you suggested though.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
go to the club and try to make some friend.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 18:39:26


Hate me or love me. either way i benefit. if you love me ill always be on your heart. if you hate me i wil always be on your mind
space marines-battle
company
30k: word bearers, deamons, cults and militia,

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




As stated above welcome to dakka.

I have heard for a long time that orks have a hard time, particularly in competitive atmospheres, winning games. I have seen ork players(and chaos players) get so frustrated with their lack of comeptitiveness that have either quit playing all together or changed races. My personal opinion is that they are kinda sore losers, and their attitidues matched with their lack of prowess and confidence as generals but I digress. I recently saw a list that made the final round at BAO(a highly competitive tournament) and thought I'd share since there seems to be the feeling that the old greenskins just can't cut it. This is as close as I can remember

Warboss - da big bosspole(for fearless) power klaw
Painboy
Greentide, all sluga boys, all jobs with power klaws
Warboss - I wanna say he took the lucky stick but I don't remember

Bully boys squad, all in trucks

Screw air and screw shooting is I think the point here. Just stick to what orks are great at fighting and crumpin humies and anyone else dumb enough to stand before the WAAAAGH!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You can find a detailed version at blood of kittens network

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 18:46:47


 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





You don't need the Ghazghkul model to run the green tide, but the rules for it are in that book (encompasing a grand total of 2 pages, although the artifacts and a couple other rules from it are needed as well).

You only need 1 warboss and 100 boyz/nobz, at least 90 must be boyz (it's ten units of standard boyz, which can take 1 nob each). You can have up to 300 if you like...get your paintbrush ready. I like running about 6 nobz with power klaws and 94 boyz, and of course the painboy.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




I'm in the same boat with no friends who play the table top of even the rts online games anymore. :( Dakka and local games stores are my last refuge for my love of 40k.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Alright I am going hard on studying up on how the game is played for real and studying up online. My local nerd store has around 5 dedicated 40k players who meet every Saturday so thats great.

Here are some questions I dont see covered in the videos ( http://www.miniwargaming.com/show/intro-warhammer-40k ) <-- The video series if anyone is interested.

When it comes to getting attachments like boss pole and lucky stick do I need specific items on my models to show this?
Do unit models need to be changed in some way to represent buffs given to the unit like extra armor saves due to being heavier armored or anything of the like that is not a big upgrade like a nob going to a mega armored nob?




 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Definitely buy the codex before anything else. You'll want to know what works well in-game or you could end up with a lot of models that you never use.
Get a feel for the other gamers in your area, if they are hardcore then you will have to build the army in a specific way to win but if they're easygoing you can just field whatever looks nice.
All of a faction's mandatory rules can be found in that faction's codex. The Ghazghkull supplement just has optional rules, only some of which involve Ghazghkull himself. The rules for Ghazghkull the unit are actually in Codex: Orks, if that's confusing enough for you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Tibs Ironblood wrote:

When it comes to getting attachments like boss pole and lucky stick do I need specific items on my models to show this?
Do unit models need to be changed in some way to represent buffs given to the unit like extra armor saves due to being heavier armored or anything of the like that is not a big upgrade like a nob going to a mega armored nob?


It depends on whom you're playing with. I have no idea what the lucky stick is supposed to look like, I think if you just tell your opponent at the beginning that your boss has the lucky stick then he'll be fine with it. Tournaments can be a different matter, the rules depend on who's running it.
The bosspole is a more obvious upgrade. I think it is more sportsmanlike to put an actual pole on your model for that. You can make one out of toothpicks if you have to.
Going from regular armor to 'eavy armor should be represented on the model somehow to keep things organized and avoid confusing the other player. Just glue more plates to 'em.
Going from regular to Mega armor is a completely different story. It changes the model's base size and everything. If you don't use the right model you are technically cheating to a small extent.

But generally if you're doing friendly games at the local store or whatever then most people will be fine with some degree of proxying. Every army I see is a "work in progress" to some extent.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/29 19:12:30


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




You're gonna want the new codex and gazgull supplement for the rules and additional formations. Once you have it I would have a look around the Internet and check out some lists that may support your play style, run some test games at 500-1000 points with the modles you have to get a feel for what you like and don't like about orks. If you want to be uber competitive I would start by copying what the "pros" are doing and then evolve from their with your own twists. If you just want to play for fun, write your own lists with units that you just plain enjoy and go to town.
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





'Eavy armor isn't officially represented, but you can use the shoulder pads for it. If you have some units that have it and some that don't, especially in the green tide, then get some ork shoulder pad kits and put them on the boyz.

None of the artifacts (like lukky stikk) are physically represented in 40k, as far as I know.

mega armored nobz are meganobz, a different unit than nobz. You can buy the meganobz kits for $$$$$$$, or just slather lots of armor on nobz. I'm currenly working on doing just that.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




So on the subject of custom models in an attempt at "what you see is what you get." This is maybe my biggest single issue with gw modles. They don't come with all the options listed in their codex many times. Take for example your lucky stick, there is nothing in a gw kit that could be considered the lucky stick as stated in the artifacts section. Now of course you can kit bash something yourself but then you are fundamentally changing the model, and you don't want to be accused of modeling for advantage. So my advise here, tournaments will not have a problem with slightly(and sometimes all the way) custom models, especially when you are only doing something like glueing some extra bitz to represent a lucky stick for your opponent. However if you do something like say cut the legs off a Necron warrior, glue him to the base and then say his legs got shot off but he's still fighting, and then further when an opponent tries to draw line of sight you claim he cannot because the model is too short, now you are modeling for advantage with no effort to be easier for your opponent to recognize and only trying to cheat by making your guys super short. Kinda like odd job in the old golden eye n64 in a golden gun match, you just can't hit the little fether.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So on the subject of custom models in an attempt at "what you see is what you get." This is maybe my biggest single issue with gw modles. They don't come with all the options listed in their codex many times. Take for example your lucky stick, there is nothing in a gw kit that could be considered the lucky stick as stated in the artifacts section. Now of course you can kit bash something yourself but then you are fundamentally changing the model, and you don't want to be accused of modeling for advantage. So my advise here, tournaments will not have a problem with slightly(and sometimes all the way) custom models, especially when you are only doing something like glueing some extra bitz to represent a lucky stick for your opponent. However if you do something like say cut the legs off a Necron warrior, glue him to the base and then say his legs got shot off but he's still fighting, and then further when an opponent tries to draw line of sight you claim he cannot because the model is too short, now you are modeling for advantage with no effort to be easier for your opponent to recognize and only trying to cheat by making your guys super short. Kinda like odd job in the old golden eye n64 in a golden gun match, you just can't hit the little fether.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One last thing, always use a consistent base size with the standard gw kit.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/29 19:31:24


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Any suggestions on where to find some solid lists of ork 7th edition armies?

Also on greed tide: I am a total noob, but the way green tide was described was as one mega blob of orks. Are we talking 100+ models all in one blob acting as one super unit? Can you have anything else in the army?

It sounds interesting, but I am really curious about what it does exactly.

 
   
Made in gb
The Last Chancer Who Survived




United Kingdom

A green tide is the term for an Ork horde. Coz Orkz iz green an green iz best.
It comprises mainly of Orkoid infantry, but can have other things, it isn't just one unit of 100. There is an Apocalypse formation that does that, but it is not for normal games.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Army lists can be found here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/forums/show/14.page

Look around for ones with Ork in the name. They will also have a number in the title, which is usually the total points value.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/29 20:32:01


 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





 Selym wrote:
A green tide is the term for an Ork horde. Coz Orkz iz green an green iz best.
It comprises mainly of Orkoid infantry, but can have other things, it isn't just one unit of 100. There is an Apocalypse formation that does that, but it is not for normal games.


There is also the formation called "Green Tide" in the Ghazghkull supplement, which is different from the Apoc formation and the "green tide" (small g) description of orks in general.. It is 10 units of boyz plus a warboss and a few special rules (including waaaaagh! on every turn except 1.) The unit funcitons as a single unit, and is worth 11 killpoints if every last boy is killed...in which case the orks are probably tabled anyway.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 JimOnMars wrote:
 Selym wrote:
A green tide is the term for an Ork horde. Coz Orkz iz green an green iz best.
It comprises mainly of Orkoid infantry, but can have other things, it isn't just one unit of 100. There is an Apocalypse formation that does that, but it is not for normal games.


There is also the formation called "Green Tide" in the Ghazghkull supplement, which is different from the Apoc formation and the "green tide" (small g) description of orks in general.. It is 10 units of boyz plus a warboss and a few special rules (including waaaaagh! on every turn except 1.) The unit funcitons as a single unit, and is worth 11 killpoints if every last boy is killed...in which case the orks are probably tabled anyway.



Sounds fun! Is it actually a legit thing to play as far as trying to win goes or just for funzies?

 
   
 
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