Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Chapter Tactics: Salamanders

Detachment: CAD

HQ -290
Vulkan He'Stan - 190
Librarian - Combi Melta, ML2 - 100 (rolling for Pyromancy table to fit the theme)

Elite: 310
Ironclad Dreadnoughts - 155 (Melta Fist, Heavy Flamer Fists, Ironcladd Assault Launchers) - 155 ------- Chainfist or Seismic Hammer?
Ironclad Dreadnoughts - 155 (Melta Fist, Heavy Flamer Fists, Ironcladd Assault Launchers) - 155 ------- Chainfist or Seismic Hammer?

Troops: 410
Tactical Squad - 1 srg combi melta, 9 Marines, 1 flamer 1 multi melta Rhino with Dozer blade - 205
Tactical Squad - 1 srg combi melta, 9 Marines, 1 flamer 1 multi melta Rhino with Dozer blade - 205

Heavy Support - 240
Predator - Twin Linked Lascannon - 100
Predator - Twin linked Lascannon - Sponson lascannons - 140

Detachment: 1st Company Strike force - 600

Sternguard Squad - Srgt - Combi Melta, 2x Heavy Flamers, x2 Combi Meltas - Rhino - Dozer Blade - 200
Sternguard Squad - Srgt - Combi Melta, 2x Heavy Flamers, x2 Combi Meltas - Rhino - Dozer Blade - 200
Sternguard Squad - Srgt - Combi Melta, 2x Heavy Flamers, x2 Combi Meltas - Rhino - Dozer Blade - 200

So overall I think it looks pretty versatile. I have answers to swarms, TEQs and am pretty mobile + tons of objective secured. Also at my club we dont play with fliers so Anti Air is not a concern of mine. All my squads are pretty safe from shooting/assault armies at least at first as the walls of Rhinos can keep them alive to get into the sweet 12-24 inch range spots where my meltas can really do work. The Sternguard I think will be a lot of fun as well with their dual heavy flamers. Want to assault theim/their transport? Eat two d3 auto hitting heavy flamers. Need to clear out a swarm of guys/armor 4 guys? Heavy flame them down. TEQS/Vehicles? Melta them down. Even when I need further range than the heavy flamers allow I still have bolt pistols on those guys to take shots with.

-----

So theres my 1850 points. This is a pure TAC list and I have no idea what I will be fighting with it. I wanted to go full on Hot and Heavy with these guys to fit the Salamanders theme so that means tons of Meltas and flamers. This is the core list which I think looks pretty solid, but I have some ideas on how to fix it up as well as questions.

--- > Outdated questions below, but still always looking for opinions on them in general. <----

1. Dozer Blades or double Storm bolters on Rhinos? - The Dozer blades help a ton with dealing with dangerous terrain, but I am not 100% sold on them because the extra storm bolter is some nice extra shooting to support the marines, but I suppose its effectiveness will depend on how i use the Rhinos themselves. If they are there to move their full speed to hold objectives block LoS then the Dozer seems better. What do you think?

2. The Heavy support slot. The main question is if I want to have the superior fire power of the Predator for anti tank fire or the versatility of another Devastator squad in a rhino. The Rhino lets two devs fire safely each turn and if I need it to can quickly rush to objectives and unload a squad of marines. So the question is really if I want to have the extra fire power (predator) or the versatility of object secure marines and rhino. Would the mix of the two be best here or would going all in on two preds or two devs be the best? To afford the two devs I would have to axe my ML2 Psyker, but could give him an Auspex as a consolation prize.

3. The Dreadnaughts. I feel like having them around gives a nice anti meele buffer to my forces as well as their multi melta providing some choice fire support. They are superior in melee compared to the ironclad version, but are more vunerable to glances/pens, however the venerable rule helps tone down the effects of pen hits by forcing a re-roll if I choose. However the Ironclad has that crucial extra armor point allowing it to prevent possible glances and pens. Also due to my chapter tactics both can re roll failed multi hits so the Venerable will very likely hit every shot Hitting on 2s rerolling misses) and the Ironcladd hits on a 3 that he can re roll which is still a very good chance to hit. Note: At my club we play with a good deal of cover so its not hard to LOS block them/get big boy cover saves.)

-----

Updated:

1. Do I want seismic hammers or chainfists for the dreads? The Concussive does not seem all that useful, but I am not so sure how many other single models in meele strike hard enough to hit the Dread at initiative better than four. The Chainfist is a great insurance policy for tearing up vehicles though.

2. Also wondering if the Ironcladd assault launcher are worth it. I think so personally. Robbing a unit of its +1 attack can be a big deal + if I charge into cover I dont lose my precious one attack.

3. Drop a Dread for a 3rd predator to make up a 3 tank squadron for their MC and tank hunter bonus? That would allow me to get another Predator fully decked out with Las+sponsoon lases and give the 3rd pred sponsoon las cannons with an auto cannon. Its a lot more range fire power that can be put out right there at the cost of a very meaty dreadnought that could ruin a squads day very easily. Also diminishes the hot and heavy a theme a bit with the loss of such a beautiful mountian of fire.

So what are your guys' thoughts? Anything you see that looks like crap? Would changes would you make?

theme wise you should take an ironclad dread with twin heavy flamers. Re roll wounds with them. I'm not a fan of venerables, but I can see why someone would want one.

I kinda think your tactical flamers should be melta instead. re-rolling to hit and you double up the melta shots. You can get enough flame templates elsewhere and can give the squads a little more focus.

Other than that I can't say much. It seems like it would be a fun army.

 evilbuttertart wrote:
theme wise you should take an ironclad dread with twin heavy flamers. Re roll wounds with them. I'm not a fan of venerables, but I can see why someone would want one.

I kinda think your tactical flamers should be melta instead. re-rolling to hit and you double up the melta shots. You can get enough flame templates elsewhere and can give the squads a little more focus.

Other than that I can't say much. It seems like it would be a fun army.

Hmm I like what you are saying with the dreads. Only problem is that the upgrades to dual flamers for the ironclads would cost 20 points each which would mean I would have to cut something else. I could see replacing just the bolter with a flamer so its a heavy melta/flamer, but then it lacks focus, but does have versatility. Maintains the theme though with all the heat. Perhaps axe one Dread, buy the other a drop pod and dual flamers for mega horde clear? I could see that working wonders in some situations + Clears up points for other upgrades.

Also on the tacticals the upgrade from flamer to melta is 5 points so that would cost me 10 more points meaning I would have to axe something else somewhere. I kinda like having the division there because it offers versatility to the squad and I dont want them to be too weak against any situation.

an ironclad with double flamer podding next to something would certainly ruin that unit's day. And he'll take some pressure off your rhinos while being able to withstand a fair bit of fire. Would be great for getting out things like cover camping Tau and some jinking bikes.

 evilbuttertart wrote:
an ironclad with double flamer podding next to something would certainly ruin that unit's day. And he'll take some pressure off your rhinos while being able to withstand a fair bit of fire. Would be great for getting out things like cover camping Tau and some jinking bikes.

Yeah I like that imagery. Only problem I feel with that is to get it I am trading out the extra Dread which would serve well as a meele guy to deter meele blobs.

I did the math and if I trade out one venerable dread, I can upgrade the other to be a dual flamer Ironclad with a drop pod. If I also then axe my dev squad I can put two more preds with the 1st for a 3 tank mini formation for the monster/tank hunter.

So its really a question of if I want the more versatile Devs alongside the meele support venerable or if I want the tactically flexible ironclad with the preds for far superior long range las shots.

don't forget that if the devs move they snap shot while the predators can still be more mobile. Plus tank and monster hunter could really come in handy. Predator survives better than a rhino, you'll have more lascannons, you'll have a way of dealing with cover saves and the ironclad is no slouch in combat.

Honestly though, I like the list both ways, but I'm keen on twin heavy flamer ironclad in salamanders. Make him look fancy and it's like He'stan built it himself to go melt heretics and xenos.

Army list updated.

Swapped out Dev squad for another pred.

Decided to opt out of using drop pods as I dont actually own any yet (working on getting some now) and dont feel comfortable proxying in soda bottles just yet xD.

Decided to roll with Dozer blades over twin storm bolters.

Currently wondering:

1. Do I want seismic hammers or chainfists for the dreads? The Concussive does not seem all that useful, but I am not so sure how many other single models in meele strike hard enough to hit the Dread at initiative better than 4. The Chainfist is a great insurance policy for tearing up vehicles though.

2. Also wondering if the Ironcladd assault launcher are worth it. I think so personally. Robbing a unit of its +1 attack can be a big deal + if I charge into cover I dont lose my precious one attack.

3. Drop a Dread for a 3rd predator to make up a 3 tank squadron for their MC and tank hunter bonus? That would allow me to get another Predator fully decked out with Las+sponsoon lases and give the 3rd pred sponsoon las cannons with an auto cannon. Its a lot more range fire power that can be put out right there at the cost of a very meaty dreadnought that could ruin a squads day very easily. Also diminishes the hot and heavy a theme a bit with the loss of such a beautiful mountian of fire.

Might suggest dropping the Predators for a squad of Lascannon/Missile Launcher Centurions. I think they add a big more durability and might draw less ire than the Grav-Cents do.

I would drop pod your sternguard once you get the models. The points you get back from the dozer blades you can use to turn your tac squads to all melta.

bomtek80 wrote:Might suggest dropping the Predators for a squad of Lascannon/Missile Launcher Centurions. I think they add a big more durability and might draw less ire than the Grav-Cents do.

I do not currently have any centurions in my collection. And yeah I would probably avoid grav cents to not be "That guy".

MisterPerkins wrote:I would drop pod your sternguard once you get the models. The points you get back from the dozer blades you can use to turn your tac squads to all melta.

I really like the idea of drop podding them and will try that as soon as I can. However I like my tacticals having a flamer to be honest. It gives them some more versatility to deal with hordes + superior over watch.