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When perusing eBay recently, I noticed a rather large selection of recasts available for sale. I was under the impression that they were straight up piracy, but if it is so blatant maybe it is acceptable?

Now, my question.
Is there a simple way to.determine if a painted model is an original or a recast?

When I was assembling my current force I used a lot of secondhand sourcing, and I'm fairly certain some of my suits are recasts. I didn't mark them differently from the rest of my suits, but I need a way to differentiate them when it comes time to get rid of them. Or should I not worry about it if recasts.are acceptable now?

It's up to concerned citizens and GW to alert eBay to the presence of recasts. It certainly is not legal or acceptable and we strongly discourage them on DakkaDakka.

From a painted or under coated model in a photograph to avoid buying them?

It would be tough, but there's one or two ways I'd suggest.

Firstly, is it priced to good to be true? Sadly anyone willing to pass off recasts as the real thing will likely not offer any discount, but it's something to consider.

Secondly, look at their other items for sale. If they're offering something that is coherent with the rest of their items (from the same army etc) then odds are higher that they're a genuine seller offloading surplus models. If their for sale page looks like a mini version of a Forge World catalogue, steer clear.

Finally most recasts have evidence present on the actual model. That is mould lines from the casting process will never line up with any evidence of the original process, plus there can be artifacts from the recast process ("creases" in large flat areas is the most common I've seen) that are seldom seen in originals, this can of course be cleaned up, but people looking for a fast buck are generally lazy and won't bother. This obviously also applies if you can examine them in person.

If you've got them in hand, then the two dead giveaways will be the smell, if you scratch, cut or drill it they often smell of solvent. I've heard it described as petrol like, but I'd liken it more to a permanent marker.

The other is that most modern FW casts are a uniform pale grey colour, two of the main casters generally use a yellow resin and a darker grey.

As to the acceptability, that's going to vary from person to person, I've no issue buying recasts for myself, but I'd never sell them.. That's just my arbitrary line in the sand, and I can't justify why buying them is ok but selling them isn't for me.

There is no issue buying a recast in most cases, making and selling them is where the issues switch from moral to legal, so I'd be leery offering models I knew to be recasts for sale. I guess your choice is to not look too closely at your models, on the grounds of plausible deniability, or be as sure as you can about them and not sell the recasts.

 Azreal13 wrote:

The other is that most modern FW casts are a uniform pale grey colour, two of the main casters generally use a yellow resin and a darker grey.

However, it is worth noting here that the yellow resin was ALSO used by Forge World themselves a few years back. Newer products will be the pale grey resin from FW but don't automatically assume yellow resin = recast, especially if it's a kit that's been around a few years or a larger kit (which tends to sell less so tends to have older components in stock - the Hierophant is an example of this).

The yellow or tan resin on newer stuff is a dead give away, same with sellers listed as being in China or Russia none of those are legit castings. FW has been using a grey toned resin for about the last 15 years, if you're looking at anything that's really ancient or was done by Armorcast it will likely be tan. The knock off resin stinks when it's cut, sawed, or filed and if you get a really bad cast it sometimes sweats out oils and the material will be brittle and crumbles apart over time.

Another common feature of recasts are two sets of mold lines, often recasters don't take the time to clean the original model so it'll retain the original set of molds lines plus have a new secondary set due to being recast. You can also measure the dimension of the model with a micrometer or digital calipers and the recasts will always be slightly smaller compared to models cast from the original masters. Both resin and silicone shrink with each generation of castings while it's not noticeable to the eye it can be measured with the right tools.

The price and lack of the FW printed bag is usually a dead give away, if somebody is selling more than a model or two at prices below what FW charges it's likely a recast. Because FW does not sell to any non-GW retailers there's no way to get it at a reduced price online, so most legit FW stuff commands a value very close to it's original retail. Anything that you see that's marked down 10-20% (or more) is likely a recast especially if the seller has numerous models available at similar discounts. I'd be suspicious of any model that's being sold built and primed as it's very easy to hide defects from the camera with a primed model. There's a good chance that it'll arrive with issues you can't see in the photos.

People do sell legit FW models in trading sites or ebay but they tend to be partially built and it's usually just a couple models at a time not a whole slew of them.

The last and most obvious clue is if it's a resin version of a plastic kit, FW doesn't cast any of the basic kits. I've seen resin crisis suits and riptides that are 100% resin which are items that have never been made by GW or FW. (I've also seen admech stuff recast in resin as well as stock marine models)

I've seen one bold-faced person on ebay refer to his stuff as 'second generation'

And for some odd reason he choose the worst, ugliest metal models to recast.

From what i can see.

1. primed but not painted
2. dis colored
as everyone else has said

if you already bought one and just want to know

3. it tends to be WAY more brittle
4. cutting into the resin you can get that gasoline smell (delicious resin mmmmmmmm)

also easy to figure out, if its from Russia or China.

Generally price is a dead give away.
Location wise, I've found China and Russia put out more re-casts than anyone else.

On eBay check feedback, most re-casters have it set as private.

Stock of an item.
Always see the forgeworld thirster on eBay for £80.
However, when the guy has 30 in stock its a slight red flag.



Resin wise I've not found any huge differences.
I have 1 or 2 I think are re-casts, but they were part of large lots I won, so I don't have any real signs to spot them.

If you can, pull up sprue pics of the items.
Forgeworld use the same area for tabs at all times.
Re-casters tend to have the tab where ever is easiest to get it.



Hope some of that it useful.

I can also confirm that color is not always an indicator of a recast. The Eldar Scorpion Type II that I bought direct from FW had grey, yellow and white pieces.

Yeah - to be honest the only way to truly tell would be disassembled pieces where you can see if it has the same "gates" as the official model.

Things like resin color / cast quality / brittleness can all vary, and can sometimes be worse from FW / etc themselves!

So, to the OP talking about a painted model - you're very likely never going to be able to tell for sure from the physical model itself... as noted better giveaways are things like the price / location it's being sold from (not always an indicator) / etc.

I tend to keep my printed FW invoices so when selling an item, I have proof its the real deal.

Another big give away is the storage of the model.
If it doesn't come in a FW bag and its "new" then that's an instant red flag for me.


Same as when people are "selling an old collection"
Which usually consists of a ridiculous amount of the same model that are apparently new.



In short though, painted models will be a nightmare to spot the authenticity of.
That's why most re-casters spray prime the models before selling.

Recasters, at least the proper ones who are doing it on a full blown commercial basis, don't spray or assemble the kits.

The people doing this are dumb enough to think that they can buy at recast prices and sell at FW prices and not ultimately get found out.

The proper recasters don't do this, they're selling at a heavy discount and are up front about what they're doing. While there are legal issues and moral grey areas, there is no element of deceit in the actual buyer/seller relationship, in fact I've found every one I've dealt with every bit as keen to provide good service as any seller of genuine products.

The "primers" are out to cheat people, and deserve everything they get.

Paulson games has it all. Athough some people dispute it, I've also noticed the recasts are slightly smaller.

Also, some of the thinner parts tend to be even thinner, even semi-transparent on recasts. Look at the pic below - the armour plate below the drum is almost see-through. This is typical of one of the major producerss

Quite a few grey recasts are a darker shade than FW and slightly less glossy. They're pretty readily distinguishable in the flesh of course, so also be suspicious if you don't see good photos on a listing.

Once they're painted it's in essence impossible; you might have a chance using a micrometer, as P G said, or you can drill into your model although I think the pungent smell will diminish over time.

If you're selling, I would simply be open, explain some of the models were bought retail and others arrived via swaps/eBay - buyers will be aware you can't totally guarantee provenance in that case.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:

The other is that most modern FW casts are a uniform pale grey colour, two of the main casters generally use a yellow resin and a darker grey.

However, it is worth noting here that the yellow resin was ALSO used by Forge World themselves a few years back. Newer products will be the pale grey resin from FW but don't automatically assume yellow resin = recast, especially if it's a kit that's been around a few years or a larger kit (which tends to sell less so tends to have older components in stock - the Hierophant is an example of this).

Yeah, I recently sold a legit FW graveyard set on eBay, and that resin was a tan color. I *think* that my capillary towers were also cast in that same resin (they've had paint on them for a long time). Those were older casts as noted, but "not grey" doesn't necessarily equal "not Forge World."

It can be almost impossible to tell on the good quality ones. I've seen some that are identical to the real thing painted up. Same detail and everything. Ironically it used to be the most consistent way to get a finecast model, because even the recasters were more consistent and they only needed one good model from GW to pull it off.

Recasts quality, color, and moldlines vary, so saying "certain colors are obviously recasts" and the like is never a foolproof technique. If we were to use the "terribly cast details, bad moldlines, flash, etc." Most finecast models from GW would fall under the category as well.

To truly tell if something is recast, you have to look for subtler things. A guy selling a full epic army that is primed but not painted for example. Sellers from more sketchy countries (Russia, China,etc.) Or odd things in general, like a seller somehow has 40 of the exact same out of print model or character.

Once recasts have been painted, you'll never notice a difference unless the guy bought the cheapest casts he could and made no effort to clean them up. Proper casting isn't nearly as difficult as people think it is and the well done ones can be of high quality. I have friends who recast OOP minis for personal use and the only way you can tell is by the weight of the model.

like clockwork, this thread repeat itself; recaster are everywhere now days, US/Canada/Germany in addition to china/Russia.

In my experience recasts are usually as good as the original, in some cases even better; only 1 dkok infantry was cast so bad that it was not salvageable.

 Big Mac wrote:
like clockwork, this thread repeat itself; recaster are everywhere now days, US/Canada/Germany in addition to china/Russia.

In my experience recasts are usually as good as the original, in some cases even better; only 1 dkok infantry was cast so bad that it was not salvageable.

And people don't read the OPs. The models are mine. I was asking what are the simple ways to tell which of my models are recasts and which are genuine when they are already painted.

 carldooley wrote:

 Big Mac wrote:
like clockwork, this thread repeat itself; recaster are everywhere now days, US/Canada/Germany in addition to china/Russia.

In my experience recasts are usually as good as the original, in some cases even better; only 1 dkok infantry was cast so bad that it was not salvageable.

And people don't read the OPs. The models are mine. I was asking what are the simple ways to tell which of my models are recasts and which are genuine when they are already painted.

Scratch them with a knife and smell. If there's petroleum smell - it's 100% recast. Look at the resin. If it's yellow and the model is quite new - 100% recast.

 carldooley wrote:

 Big Mac wrote:
like clockwork, this thread repeat itself; recaster are everywhere now days, US/Canada/Germany in addition to china/Russia.

In my experience recasts are usually as good as the original, in some cases even better; only 1 dkok infantry was cast so bad that it was not salvageable.

And people don't read the OPs. The models are mine. I was asking what are the simple ways to tell which of my models are recasts and which are genuine when they are already painted.

Thats what we're trying to tell you. Once they're painted it's almost impossible without damaging the model.

The only real trick is checking the weight, if the model is supposed to be metal.

Yup, once painted, there's not much you can do to spot a recast without damaging the model.

The weight MIGHT be off compared to a legit one (if it's recast resin-resin - it'll certainly be off if the original is metal).

The colour alone is not an indicator - nor is the smell. I've received FW parts (in FW bags, from FW) where the parts were still stinky and curing and outgassing. Smell is often a side effect of inadequately cured resin, inadequately mixed resin or a combination of both. Many PU resins have a similar smell when curing. FW used to smell like Px to certain explosive sniffers, too.

Pin drill into the model.. Inspect the shavings.. Fill small hole with green stuff

The real question here is why do you care if the models are recasts? You already have them, and if you can't tell the difference without asking for help from us then it's not like you're going to be ripping off any future buyer with a defective product. I have no shortage of nasty things to say about recasters and people who buy from them instead of buying the real model, but obsessing over whether models you already own are recasts or not is a good way to drive yourself insane.

 chromedog wrote:

The colour alone is not an indicator - nor is the smell. I've received FW parts (in FW bags, from FW) where the parts were still stinky and curing and outgassing. Smell is often a side effect of inadequately cured resin, inadequately mixed resin or a combination of both. Many PU resins have a similar smell when curing. FW used to smell like Px to certain explosive sniffers, too.

Yeah, I've had FW stuff picked up at WHW that smelled terrible, but I think it was a rush-job.

Your best bet is to find a verified legit figure and compare the details.

 Peregrine wrote:
The real question here is why do you care if the models are recasts? You already have them, and if you can't tell the difference without asking for help from us then it's not like you're going to be ripping off any future buyer with a defective product. I have no shortage of nasty things to say about recasters and people who buy from them instead of buying the real model, but obsessing over whether models you already own are recasts or not is a good way to drive yourself insane.

He's concerned about when he may resell them, which he clearly stated in the OP.

 Azreal13 wrote:
He's concerned about when he may resell them, which he clearly stated in the OP.

Yes, but why? If they aren't identifiable as recasts without asking a forum for help then why does it matter if they're recasts or not? They're obviously good casts, whoever made them, and I don't really see any point in trying to appease a tiny minority of anti-recast zealots that will get upset about possibly receiving some recast parts several links down the chain of ownership from the person who actually made them.

Because he's conscientious and doesn't like the idea of selling fakes for the price of genuine models?

Frankly, it's irrelevant, he asked the question and got answers. I'm not going to waste my time considering the whys and wherefores of the minutiae of his thought process that led to him creating the thread at that precise moment.

I've only bought recasts of oop models. That's the only time I see it as acceptable