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Hi gang!

This is my second attempt at a Salamanders drop pod list, it's a 2,000 point list designed to scale back to 1,850, 1,750, 1,500, 1,250, 1,000, 750, and 500 points.

This uses all the models from each version of the list essentially, though combi-Flamers get swapped in on Tac and the likes in any version of the list that's too small for Vulkan.

The real issue I have is at 2,000 points I'm adding a 6th Pod (3rd tactical.) Is there something else I should consider using the last 140-150 points on?

Otherwise I'm using a RAPTORWING detachment with my CAD to ensure the Storm Talons get deployed on turn 2. This is not a null deployment list...so the last 140-150 could in theory go to something that's not in a pod.

I'd appreciate honest feedback, as I'd like it to be fairly competitive while still being able to scale for smaller games without a hassle.




SALAMANDERS 2,000 CAD & RAPTORWING


HQ (290 POINTS - Both IC's are riding in Tactical Squad #03's Drop Pod):

190 POINTS - Vulkan He'stan

100 POINTS - LVL 02 LIBRARIAN: Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan) and Force Weapon (Master Crafted, C-TAC)


TROOPS (420 POINTS):


140 POINTS - TACTICAL SQUAD #01:

BASIC TROOPS: x03 Tactical Marines w/Boltguns and Bolt Pistols

SPECIAL WEAPON: x01 Tactical Marine w/Flamer (Shred, C-TAC)

SERGEANT: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan), and Melta-Bomb (Master Crafted, C-TAC)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


140 POINTS - TACTICAL SQUAD #02:

BASIC TROOPS: x03 Tactical Marines w/Boltguns and Bolt Pistols

SPECIAL WEAPON: x01 Tactical Marine w/Flamer (Shred, C-TAC)

SERGEANT: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan), and Melta-Bomb (Master Crafted, C-TAC)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


140 POINTS - TACTICAL SQUAD #03:

BASIC TROOPS: x03 Tactical Marines w/Boltguns and Bolt Pistols

SPECIAL WEAPON: x01 Tactical Marine w/Flamer (Shred, C-TAC)

SERGEANT: Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan), and Melta-Bomb (Master Crafted, C-TAC)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


ELITES (925 POINTS):


370 POINTS - STERNGUARD VETERAN SQUAD #01:

BASIC TROOPS: x07 Sternguard Veterans w/Bolt Pistols and Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan)

HEAVY WEAPONS: x02 Sternguard Veterans w/Heavy Flamers (Shred, C-TAC)

VETERAN SERGEANT: Bolt Pistol, Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


370 POINTS - STERNGUARD VETERAN SQUAD #02:

BASIC TROOPS: x07 Sternguard Veterans w/Bolt Pistols and Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan)

HEAVY WEAPONS: x02 Sternguard Veterans w/Heavy Flamers (Shred, C-TAC)

VETERAN SERGEANT: Bolt Pistol, Combi-Melta (Master Crafted, Vulkan)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


185 POINTS - IRONCLAD DREADNOUGHT w/Heavy Flamer (Shred, C-TAC), Meltagun (Master Crafted, Vulkan)

DEDICATED TRANSPORT: Drop Pod w/Deathwind Launcher


RAPTORWING (365 POINTS):

x03 Land Speeders w/Heavy Flamers (Shred, C-TAC)

x02 Stormtalons w/Skyhammer Missiles and Twin-Linked Assault Cannons

I'd like to start up a Salamanders army, so it's nice to see people attempting competitive builds with them. I'm not expert, but here are my thoughts.

Couple of thoughts:
1. Why do you not just go for min squads for the sternguard?
2. Why do you give 7 sternguard combi-meltas? Shouldn't, like, 3 or 4 suffice to take out an initial target? Past that, I'd just take meltabombs or a chain fist.
3. Why do you mix flamers and meltas? I'd specialize each squad to be very good at taking out a type of unit specifically.

I'd go with the following load out, which should give you enough melta to wipe out any sort of enemy:

Tactical Squads: Flamer, Combi-Flamer (3 squads)
2 Landspeeders: 2 Multimeltas
1 Landspeeder: 2 Heavy Flamers
Sternguard 1: (5 men) - 2 Flamers, 2 Combi Flamers
Sternguard 2: (5 men) - 2 Meltas, 2 Combi-Meltas

It also seems like you could take the special Salamanders detachment pretty easily, the Flameblade Strike Force. All you're missing, I think, is a dev squad, which I think you could give heavy flamers and have them charge up in a rhino or drop down in another pod. You'd get Space Marine battle focus, 2 warlord traits, and +1 Strength to all flamer weapons. I love the Ironclad though, not sure how'd you get that into the formation.

I mean I second the flame blade force or whatever. That or just a normal gladius for objective secured.

With my gladius list you get 10 free drop pods with objective secured. Very in your face, by turn 2 everything will be in and you get all the benefits of space marines. You get to use their bolters close, tons of flamers/meltas, so plenty of vareity for targets.

Demi company 1
Vulkan
Devestators X 4 multi melta sarge with signam and bolt pistol
Assualt squad w/ 2 flamers
Tactical sqaud w/ drop pod and flamer X 3

Demi company 2
Chaplain with melta bombs
Devastor squad X 4 multi melta sarge with signam and bolt pistol
Assualt squad X 10(chaplain goes here) 2 flamers
Tactical squad with drop pod and flamer X 3

Ravenhawk assualt group
Ironclad with power fist, chain fist, and 2x heavy flamers
Sternguard X 10, 2 meltas, 8 combi meltas
Stormraven gunship stock

1850 on the nose.

This gives you so really good options and takes advantage of the chapter tactics. The only thing I'm sad for is I can't ever justify power weapons for my sarges because they so over costed even with the free master craft...but meh.

This gives you 10 free pods or 30 free hull points with objective secured plus a ton of in your face marines. 10 meltas on the Sternguard are there to down a wraithknight/stormsurge/imp knight. That is their purpose in life, if they succeed they make their points back. If they fail hopefully the ironclad assualt will finish the job. Either way this formation can easily drop the enemy lord of war.

Vulkan and chaplain ride with assualt squad sans jump packs for a pretty decent melee threat.

 crimson_caesar wrote:
I'd like to start up a Salamanders army, so it's nice to see people attempting competitive builds with them. I'm not expert, but here are my thoughts.

Couple of thoughts:
1. Why do you not just go for min squads for the sternguard?
2. Why do you give 7 sternguard combi-meltas? Shouldn't, like, 3 or 4 suffice to take out an initial target? Past that, I'd just take meltabombs or a chain fist.
3. Why do you mix flamers and meltas? I'd specialize each squad to be very good at taking out a type of unit specifically.

I'd go with the following load out, which should give you enough melta to wipe out any sort of enemy:

Tactical Squads: Flamer, Combi-Flamer (3 squads)
2 Landspeeders: 2 Multimeltas
1 Landspeeder: 2 Heavy Flamers
Sternguard 1: (5 men) - 2 Flamers, 2 Combi Flamers
Sternguard 2: (5 men) - 2 Meltas, 2 Combi-Meltas

It also seems like you could take the special Salamanders detachment pretty easily, the Flameblade Strike Force. All you're missing, I think, is a dev squad, which I think you could give heavy flamers and have them charge up in a rhino or drop down in another pod. You'd get Space Marine battle focus, 2 warlord traits, and +1 Strength to all flamer weapons. I love the Ironclad though, not sure how'd you get that into the formation.

Hi thanks for replying! I'll try to respond here with my reasoning and see if that helps...though obviously the list may change depending on concensus here, etc.

STERNGUARD:

The reason I went with two squads, with x08 Combi Meltas and x02 Heavy Flamers, was due to Vulcan Master-Crafting both the Bolter and the Meltagun in each Combi weapon. I've even considered using all Combi Meltas and will test that build out as well.

With Master Crafted Bolters and thier special ammo, they become a mid-range threat after they use their Meltagun shots when they drop pod in. By throwing in the Deathwind launcher, you give the Flamers added help if you have no choice but to land them closer to a blob depending on the matchup.

With Salamanders I've found that keeping the Bolters Master Crafted really ups the Sternguard's versitility during my test games. Combat Squading is effective, and a must here too...but it might ultimately be best to stick with 5 man squads to free up points for other units. When I play 1250 points using this list scaled back I swap to two 5 man squads and it works extremely well.


FLAMEBLADE STRIKE FORCE:

Wow...honestly I didn't know this existed (thanks for pointing this out!) I've been struggling to crunch numbers with this to a degree that I'm happy with though after doing some research.

Demi-Companies are great for objective holding...but they can get picked off due to squad sizes and a mix of squads that don't always synergise well. Buy you can still use Drop Pods...the original intent of the army.

I really wish the Skyhammer Annihilation Force (mentioned in the post below yours), could be a viable choice here since it would work perfectly in this formation...the poster below you thinks it's not, and some articles I've tracked down say much the same. It's a pity, because it would make a ton of sense! However it might work well in a Gladius Strike force using Vulkan and more Melta.

The Stormlance Battle Company is nice as a core if you can't include two Demi-Companies for free transports, but you have to take vehicles (no Drop Pods!) So my plan has to shift to make that work for the Flameblade bonuses. The first question is whether or not chaging tactics here works better/is more reliable, or if Pods still get you where you need to go more reliably.

Both the Demi-Company and Stormlance Battle Company force you to take Devistators, but I'm assuming from what I've read that you can only take Centurions with the Demi. Regular Devistators outside of the Storm wind Annihilation Force

Devistators can't take heavy flamers (which is a crime, since Salamanders really should get them for Devistators in their chapter tactics.) So the one advantage of my CAD is I get more units which won't have to snap fire after movement or podding. The Skyhammer would of course fix this, giving you relentless with Master Crafted Multi-Meltas due to Vulkan.

So with either core you wind up paying a tax for a Dev squad. If you go Demi-Company, I would take Grav-cents if you can afford them...and if I shorten down to 5 man squads of Sternguard, I might think on 3 for a pod, to make a mini Skyhammer situation using relentless after landing.


The other tax would be a small Assault squad, but they work better in general with my list than basic Devistators.


RAPTORWING:

This is all about reserve manipulation for my Stormtalons. I have this in every list down to 750 points! I love Stormtalons, but I want to minimize reserve rolls. However, since you pay for Land Speeders, this means you cannot fully null deploy. Making Stormlance a more viable option if I go for the Flameblade.


I'm going to followup with the other post too, but tell me what you think. I chose CAD to ensure my units would be effective without chaff...but it might be that weight of numbers wins the day when it comes to holding objectives.

This list is pretty solid, but those tactical squads bug me. I've been playing Salamanders quite a few years now, and from my experience, you shouldn't mix the special and combi weapons. If the flamer is effective against a target, then the melta is barely better than a bolter, and vice versa. You have more than enough melta in the rest of the list to drop those melta bombs as well.

I would HIGHLY suggest switching this list over to a FlameBlade. Adding 1 strength to your flamers means you'll pile wounds on to every infantry unit in the game so heavily they won't keep up. Heavy flamers might not get through MEQ armour, but rerolling 2s to wound is going to pile in enough wounds that your opponent is going to fail quite a few anyways.

I too had considered the full combi melta loadout on sternguard, but it shoots the cost of the squad insanely high, turning casualties into heavy detriments. Play a Flame Blade with a Gladius, pop the doctrine the turn you drop your veterans, and reroll 1s. its not quite the same as mastercrafted, but its enough to go for those Strength 4 AP 3 rounds if thats what you need with minimal risk.