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2016/09/16 16:13:25
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga KS - Finished @ $410,198
The following are already included in the base pledge
Add Ons beyond this point are not in the base pledge
Collectors Edition Resin Miniatures
Deadzone Mercenary Packs
Minion Packs
Project Pandora
Mission Packs
MDF Tiles
Announcement
Spoiler:
Mantic Games today announced the newest in its series of dungeon crawler tabletop board games: STAR SAGA, which will launch a campaign on Kickstarter on September 26th.
The spiritual sequel to the smash hit DUNGEON SAGA, Star Saga: The Eiras Contract will see the dungeon crawler format take flight—into outer space!
Featuring strong story-telling elements with immersive game scenarios, and set in Mantic’s evocative Warpath Universe, STAR SAGA will see players guide a team of space mercenaries on a mission to retrieve stolen data plans from a research facility orbiting a far-off alien world. Players will take on platoons of minions, powerful alien bosses and be forced to make difficult choices as the story takes unexpected twists and turns. Further campaigns and expansions will utilize the full scope of the science fiction settings, from space stations and starships to alien worlds and beyond.
Dungeon Saga was praised for its simple core mechanics that provided a perfect opening for new players, and Star Saga will build on that success. Introducing newly improved and stronger rulesets, Star Saga will feature both ‘learn as you go’ rules for new players, and more detailed, advanced mechanics for seasoned gamers.
Star Saga: The Eiras Contract will hit Kickstarter on September 26th at 8:30AM EST, and run for 25 days.
The campaign this time around is a bit more streamlined than in the past, with just one pledge level, which will be priced at $100.00 USD. If you get in early, there will also be an identical version of this pledge, in limited quantities, offered at a discounted price ($90.00).
There will also be a retailer pledge level for those interested and qualifying stores.
The contents of the core pledge includes the CORE STAR SAGA BOX GAME (MSRP $79.99), the STAR SAGA MISSION CREATOR expansion (MSRP $39.99) and the STAR SAGA CHARACTER CREATOR expansion((MSRP $39.99). That’s $140 in retail value before we’ve met any of our planned stretch goals!
The contents of the core box will include:
• The Rulebook featuring tutorials and basic mechanics for novices, as well as expanded rules for veteran players.
• The Eiras Contract Mission Book with 10 narrative adventures, two intro missions, character bios and the story behind Eiras.
• High Quality Card Sheets with floor tiles and counters
• Four Character cards
• More than 100 Game Cards for equipment, skills, and all the powers of the Nexus player.
• A Selection of Custom Dice
• 32 Highly Detailed Miniatures including:
o Four Mercenary Heroes
o Three Bosses
o 24 Minions
• plus loads of scenery
I liked DS for what it's worth but I felt it needed more replayability. The fact that basically scenarios are totally fixed was a problem for long-term play I think.
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2016/09/16 16:45:16
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
At this stage my main question is 'Am I going to get stat cards for the host of Mercs I already have from Deadzone?', ala the extra 8 or 12 or whatever it was extra heroes on top of the basic box 4 in Dungeon Saga, except the minis already exist.
"Dungeon Saga was praised ..." By whom ?!!
"Star Saga will feature ... more detailed, adcanced mechanics ...". Like they promised Dungeon Saga would during the Kickstarter to raise pledge levels only to fall WAY short in fulfillment ?!!
Mantic has run twelve Kickstarters to date. 12 !! They say they improve and learn with every one but read what customers have to say about them.
If you're interested, do yourself a favor and take a look at their KS history and read the comments. Do your due diligence before you choose to invest.
They lost me and my dollars with the way they botched Dungeon Saga with all the broken promises, pathetic delivery and offensive treatment of customers.
"You never see toilets in the 41st Millennium - that's why everyone looks so angry all the time." - Fezman 1/28/13
2016/09/16 18:23:32
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
They haven't, but we both know it's going to be in board game plastic, either the same as the most recent lot in DZ2E, or another iteration on the formula. And really, that material is perfectly fine by me.
Dungeon Saga was average. Average rules, average miniatures, average tiles. Fell short on the advanced rules, went back on their adventure gamebook add-on and made you pay for a corrected rulebook. $20 for additional book boxes which made each expansion more expensive than MSRP.
I'll pass, thanks...
"The Omnissiah is my Moderati"
2016/09/16 18:43:51
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
TBH I could really use a sci fi dungeoncrawler. There's not really any on the market. I didn't back Dungeon Saga but I think I'll back this one.
"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke
2016/09/16 19:01:23
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
Myrthe wrote: "Dungeon Saga was praised ..." By whom ?!!
"Star Saga will feature ... more detailed, adcanced mechanics ...". Like they promised Dungeon Saga would during the Kickstarter to raise pledge levels only to fall WAY short in fulfillment ?!!
Mantic has run twelve Kickstarters to date. 12 !! They say they improve and learn with every one but read what customers have to say about them.
If you're interested, do yourself a favor and take a look at their KS history and read the comments. Do your due diligence before you choose to invest.
They lost me and my dollars with the way they botched Dungeon Saga with all the broken promises, pathetic delivery and offensive treatment of customers.
Well, I can't blame anyone for being skeptical of Mantic's Kickstarters.
They did bring in some new people to untangle the mess that was the DS fulfillments and from what I can see, once they got on the case they did sort out the situation decently given the circumstances and, for what it's worth, the Walking Dead KS seems to have went well so far.
Thus I have a bit of hope that they have actually finally learned to run a campaign, but unfortunately, I don't trust them enough to put my own money on the line yet.
Dude having just watched the KS unboxing video for Walking Dead I really regret not having backed it. 7 months for a fully realized fantastic looking product. :/
"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke
2016/09/16 19:57:02
Subject: Re:Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
I'll probably be in for a $1 and play the waiting game, see what ends up being unlocked. I think the main deciding factor for me is going to be what the figures look like.
The quality seems to have really improved and this is looking to be a much better developed product (although some of that may be down to external licence involvement).
2016/09/17 10:31:17
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
I played Dungeon Saga for the first time last week and it was a perfectly fine game. I feel like I got my money's worth from the kickstarter. In saying that, you kind of need to keep in mind some things.
It is effectively a 'budget' Descent / Super Dungeon Explore / etc. If you are expecting the game to be as deep as them, you are going to be annoyed and disappointed. Dungeon Saga IS worth the money. And, although I haven't played Descent I'm sure it's ALSO worth its (notably higher) price point.
Now, on the subject of Star Saga. Well, I do have Star Wars: Imperial Assault (hence why I was talking about Descent earlier) and I've invested heavily into the game, purchasing the vast majority of its released expansions. As such, I don't really feel the need for 'Star Saga' myself. - I've got a Fantasy pseudo RPG in Dungeon Saga and I've got a Sci Fi pseudo-RPG in Imperial Assault.
From using the two, one of the interesting things I found with them is, sure Imperial Assault is more tactically interesting, more complex, greater depth and all that. It's also a MUCH larger time sink. - You're talking about getting the same people turning up consecutively 10 times in a row. Even subbing in players can result in someone getting annoyed by the way someone else has 'messed with' their character.
Conversely, the base Dungeon Saga, even with the optional rules at the back is very much more "Pick up and play." - Worst case, you need to remember whether the 'bonus objectives' in the last mission were accomplished or not.
They're similar, sure but there's enough differences that it's not a case of, "X exists, so Y is immediately inferior." Each game has its own niche.
So yeah, that's my thoughts on it all.
2016/09/17 16:58:00
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
judgedoug wrote: TBH I could really use a sci fi dungeoncrawler. There's not really any on the market.
Somebody said that exact thing on the last Remote Presence podcast regarding Corvus Belli's proposed idea to do one in the Infinity universe. There are TONS of sci-fi dungeoncrawlers on the market. I'm sure there's many I'm missing, but most of the sci-fi dungeoncrawls instead take the form of "board the derelict spacecraft", most immediate that comes to mind is the obvious Space Hulk and Space Crusade. You've also had the Aliens boardgame and now Aliens vs Predator from what I've seen of that. Doom is still in production iirc from Fantasy Flight, Sedition Wars is still on sale for dirt cheap and plays OKish with the 2.0 rules. And of course there's the monster that is Imperial Assault. It doesn't get any more "sci-fi dungeoncrawl" than the what is literally Descent with a star wars reskin. MERCS had a kickstarter for the soon-to-release MERCS:Recon. I'm sure there's many more, but that's just a few of the big ones.
And also, didn't Mantic have one before? I could have sworn they did a Corporation vs Ratmen board game based on the original Dwarf Kings Hold rules.
We'll see how it plays out, I'm certainly more interested in what this might play out as than I was for DZ Infestation and Mars Attacks & Walking Dead. DS looked fine, but mediocre. Standard MO for Mantic.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/17 16:58:53
I'll watch, and probably go in for $1, but I can't see myself backing fully for product after the clusterfeth that Dungeon Saga was in the end.
What's happening with Warpath? Shipping by the end of this year if we're lucky and the book sometime next year? It'd seem a lot better if they shipped WP before starting the next one.
Azazelx wrote: I'll watch, and probably go in for $1, but I can't see myself backing fully for product after the clusterfeth that Dungeon Saga was in the end.
What's happening with Warpath? Shipping by the end of this year if we're lucky and the book sometime next year? It'd seem a lot better if they shipped WP before starting the next one.
+1 for this; I really want to like Mantic but the continual KS project churn for years now has really started to sour me.
If they could get any of them out the door without some sort of derailment befalling the project, I could maybe overlook it. They always seem to have something waylay their plans and suddenly there's a materials swap or a delayed wave or a completely lost section of orders. Getting their house in order isn't helped by constantly taking on new things to mess it up.
We've been saying that for years now, and I just don't see it getting any better.
2016/09/18 16:01:50
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
Just a quick question for those that did back DS. Are the tiles used similar in quality/thickness to say the ones in zombicide.
I certainly won't be backing this if the card tile pieces are poor quality. I know we'll have no idea until it's actually in our hands, but if DS is top notch, then I guess they'd use the same manufacturers for DS-in-space.
My Painting Blog: http://gimgamgoo.com/ Currently most played: Silent Death, Xenos Rampant, Mars Code Aurora and Battletech.
I tried dabbling with 40k9/10 again and tried AoS3 - disliked both, but I'm enjoying HH2 and trying Battletech Classic and AS out
2016/09/18 17:28:34
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
DS tiles are about 60% of the thickness of a Zombicide tile. The core isn't as high a quality card. The print is good but a bit too shiney where as the Zc ones are matte. They are the same thickness as AvP tiles but the print quality is better on those. Overall they are fine but they won't last as long as Zc tiles and the quality isn't the same (but it's not poor quality). The whole feel of DS is cheaper than Zc which admittedly is at the top of it's game (pun intended).
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/09/18 17:31:39
2016/09/19 00:26:15
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
DaveC wrote: DS tiles are about 60% of the thickness of a Zombicide tile. The core isn't as high a quality card. The print is good but a bit too shiney where as the Zc ones are matte. They are the same thickness as AvP tiles but the print quality is better on those. Overall they are fine but they won't last as long as Zc tiles and the quality isn't the same (but it's not poor quality). The whole feel of DS is cheaper than Zc which admittedly is at the top of it's game (pun intended).
So the short of this is the quality of the game isn't good shocker, as its Mantic
While Deadzone 2.0 was a great fix, that was my last plunge into Mantic
I appreciate the honest details though. I was semi interested, at least to see what it will be, but that confirms no pledge here.
2016/09/19 01:32:09
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
I can't say much about DS in relation to other similar products as I own none of those. I think if the Star Saga comes out at a similar quality I wouldn't be opposed to buying into it.
The prices you can get the stuff for on Miniature Market nowadays... 55 or so for the main game, 33 ish per expansion so...I mean I probably got stuff a bit cheaper/kickstarter extras than spending the same money at retail but it's close. And you can pick and choose (and more book boxen via retail sets). So if Star Saga is really really awesome and tempting I'll back, and if not I'll expect to see it at retail for a decent rate like DS.
Having said that, I really wonder if SS will be able to generate half the buzz and backer dollars that DS did. What will really make or break it for me is what the initial hero party looks like and the extra characters added as it (hopefully for them) expands, and what the sets of enemies look like. Maybe we'll get to see some Zzo'r or whatever, or get some extra space-ratmen/plague/whatever to add interest to deadzone forces.
Oh, also... Those sets of dungeon furniture and doors are something like $12.49 a set on miniature market. Scifi equivalents would be most welcome. A few windows and a nicely detailed scifi door can turn almost any vaguely rectangular structure into a nice scifi building (looking at you, Medge scenery sprues) and I think people may order the doors for other scifi boardgames like Imperial Assault (does that even have standee card doors? I don't remember). Not to mention more crates, a weapons locker with actual weapon details built in but not made of expensive resin, and so on... at the aforementioned pricepoint could be quite nice. So even if I end up having no interest in the core game, I certainly hope they do well and follow the suit for the DS release.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/19 02:12:22
2016/09/19 11:20:53
Subject: Re:Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
Solo and co-op from the start
Based off DS rules changed and simplified where necessary - developed in house
No Adventures Companion all rules developed and integrated at the same time.
Levelling up rules for characters - use any character in any mission
Create your own mercenary rules
Create your own mission rules
KS to flesh out game no new rules add new miniatures, scenery, gaming aids, 3D objectives and new expansions
STAR SAGA – DEVELOPING THE RULES
I’m sure a lot of you are keen to know how it plays. So, I’m here to run you through how it works, how it compares to Dungeon Saga, and where we’re going to take it in the future… See what I did there?
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2016/09/21 08:25:28
2016/09/19 11:23:16
Subject: Mantic Games - Star Saga: The Eiras Contract - SciFi dungeon crawler - Kickstarter September 26th
Gimgamgoo wrote: Just a quick question for those that did back DS. Are the tiles used similar in quality/thickness to say the ones in zombicide.
I certainly won't be backing this if the card tile pieces are poor quality. I know we'll have no idea until it's actually in our hands, but if DS is top notch, then I guess they'd use the same manufacturers for DS-in-space.
Completely agree with you on this - the tiles in DS are too thin. For TWD we have moved to a much higher quality card (and we're using a different manufacturer) - over 2.5mm thick, sturdy card, with linen textured printing. It's the TWD quality level we're carrying forward into Star Saga, not the Dungeon Saga quality level .