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Well hell, the bonus faction booster starts to make this look a lot more attractive.

I was just thinking. We had up to 5 factions available for most of us (if you didn't double up on certain factions) the first time around. Plus 2 battlezones worth of terrain, the mouse pad mat... it really was a good deal, wasn't it? Maybe that's why I had such trepidation when this started.

 judgedoug wrote:

Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).

It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.

 warboss wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:

Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).

It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.

Well, courting disgruntled GW vets is often cited as a main part of Mantic's niche (e.g., DB=Not BB; DZ=Not Necromunda; KoW=Not WFB; FFs=Not Squats; etc.).
Many of those vets liked the aesthetic just not GW's approach. That might be a possible explanation?

As long as it's not chibi or whatever it is. People obsessed with that stuff are just as odd as the style.

Earth Dragon wrote:
As long as it's not chibi or whatever it is. People obsessed with that stuff are just as odd as the style.

Criticize the minis, not the folks who like them.

I'm wondering if the Strider and Nightmares are actually on their "would like to do in HP" list they just didn't want to wait. The Strider in particular seemed like a good candidate in my mind that I thought they might do.

Some might think "restic free" was violated, but they are from the existing range. If they can use them to spice it up and get to the HP kits later, I'm all for it. But like I predicted, there are those who "flipped their shiz" even though we didn't fund any new restic/PVC.


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 warboss wrote:

Earth Dragon wrote:
As long as it's not chibi or whatever it is. People obsessed with that stuff are just as odd as the style.

Criticize the minis, not the folks who like them.

Difference between like and obsessed.......big difference. I'll critisize a couple of people I've met all I want (considering one was convicted of some disgusting crap)

I think the promise was all models being created will be rest if free. Old models brought in are definitely not going against that.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I think the promise was all models being created will be rest if free. Old models brought in are definitely not going against that.

Are the Veermyn Nightmares new? (I have no clue what rat men Mantic made before this KS, this may very well be an existing unit but they were not in the previous KS.)

They seem to be restic.

The nightmares are on Mantic's site already.

 pretre wrote:
The nightmares are on Mantic's site already.

Thanks

I've got the OP ready to update once we hit that goal with the new retail. It's pretty decent.

 judgedoug wrote:

Mymearan wrote:
I've always wondered, and I'm not trying to be an ass here... But why are most of Mantic's sculpts sub-par compared to most other manufacturers out there? Honestly, I rarely see another manufacturer with such consistently mediocre sculpts. I like the Enforcers the most, but overall there's so much awkward posing, weird anatomy etc. Is there any particular reason for this? Sure, they're cheap as hell, but does that mean they also hire mediocre sculptors? Do they not give them enough time? Is it the art direction? I can't figure it out. They have some great sculpts, and when I see those I feel like most of their stuff is such a wasted opportunity. Even if they cured the whole Manticverse of Tiny Legs Syndrome, that still wouldn't help. Posing and anatomy.

Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).

Really? Those are some amazing sculptors indeed (haven't heard of Calvert-Lee though). It has to be the art direction then, I just can't stand it. The weird thing is, I LOVE oldhammer and old GW stuff. Absolutely love it. So full of character and charm. I can't find any of that in Mantic's stuff though. As for examples, some of my least favorites are all the Plague miniatures with their goofy faces and awkward anatomy, (except the Stage 1), the Marauders with their tiny legs and faces on their stomachs, and the Forge Fathers with 80s biker vests and armored guys that are all posed like they're about to hug someone. I really like the Enforcers, the Rebs have some neat sculpts and the Asterians are ok I guess, although suffer A LOT from being compared to Jes Goodwin's brilliant Eldar aesthethic.

 warboss wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:

Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).

It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.

I guess it's subjective. Mantic KoW Orcs are my #1 favorite Orcs, tied with LOTR Uruk Hai. Also, Urban War Viridians are one of my favorite sci-fi hard-armor models... I have like 50 of them painted up as near-future German infantry (with Leopard 2A6 tanks and Marders as transport)

Forge Fathers are straight up superior to Squats. Squats were one of my main 40k 2nd armies, and they were pretty gak, with horrible aesthetic consistency (flak-armoured infantry, Space Marine Rhinos, leather clad bikers, and norse exo armor all in one army? It was hard to justify thematically)


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Mymearan wrote:
Jes Goodwin's brilliant Eldar aesthethic.

No one will ever compare to Jes Goodwin's ability to create brilliant designs and 100% follow through with the sculpts.
My Eldar was the last of my 40k to go (not counting Space Hulk, I have a full set of RT metal genestealers and terminators); shipped last week actually. It was hard giving them up, but I haven't liked anything about 40k in a decade.

 judgedoug wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
There goes that whole 'resin plastic free zone' thing!

the Nightmares? I've got about 100+ of the old pvc veermyn (because I'm crazy and I love them) and they are part of Mantic's initial foray into pvc... so like those KoW Orc Gore Riders, they are very cleanly cast and nearly free of mold lines.


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 Bolognesus wrote:
I don't think the peacekeepers in that bundle have arms compatible with the jetbikes - you'd need the regular enforcers for that. I don't see those coming for free anywhere - am I missing something?

" So, having moved a few things around, when we hit this stretch goal, we will unlock Deadzone: Infestation spec Faction Boosters, and you will be able to pick one FREE in a pledge of Quarantine!"

Faction boosters are the peacekeepers+strider and equivalent vermin bundles. Faction starters != faction boosters, from what I can see.

I agree about the LOTR Uruk Hai (great minis!) as well as the Viridians although with the latter I like them due to nostalgia and within the framework of when they were released. As for FF, I'd hope they'd be superior to squats because even if you agreed with my opinion that mantic stuff is late 1990's to early '00 in style/quality overall that still would place them a decade or so after the squats were designed. They're basically a modern day equivalent of Dreamblade/Shockforce... a cheaper more cartoony version of 40k's take on existing scifi tropes.

I'm in my late 30's and have been gaming since high school so I have plenty of things that I like partly because of nostalgia. I just don't have any nostalgia for the majority of Mantic's offerings so the 1990's style doesn't suit me. Obviously YMMV; opinions not facts; etc but I've found myself really wanting to like mantic in theory but the majority of the minis just stop me from doing so in actual practice.

I like the enforcers and the terrain but I'm not interested in doing another heavy armor scifi army/warband after doing so much of it in 40k (especially since there is literally no mantic scene going on in my FLGS and I'd be the one half heartedly pushing the game if I did so). That pretty much leaves me with their terrain as a potential purchase and I do think they did a good job with that.

Updated OP since it is clear that Boosters are part of Quarantine now.

 warboss wrote:
I agree about the LOTR Uruk Hai (great minis!) as well as the Viridians although with the latter I like them due to nostalgia and within the framework of when they were released.

I agree about Void Viridians, but UW/M Viridians are still ace.

There's really no other near future sci fi figures on the market that have such subtle excellence in design.
Infinity figures may be sculpted better, but I do not like the anime influence with everyone lithe and jumping around. UW/M Viridians look like generic near future soldiers. The "Future from 1980's" that is my favorite (Terminator, Aliens, Blade Runner, etc)

 warboss wrote:
As for FF, I'd hope they'd be superior to squats because even if you agreed with my opinion that mantic stuff is late 1990's to early '00 in style/quality overall that still would place them a decade or so after the squats were designed. They're basically a modern day equivalent of Dreamblade/Shockforce... a cheaper more cartoony version of 40k's take on existing scifi tropes.

Whew, I had some Dreamblade/SF stuff, and no way. Early GW Squats are a joke compared to Mantic's Forge Fathers. I'm not say the basic Steel Warrior is a fantastic model (it's merely acceptable), but leagues better than Squats.

 warboss wrote:
I'm in my late 30's and have been gaming since high school so I have plenty of things that I like partly because of nostalgia. I just don't have any nostalgia for the majority of Mantic's offerings so the 1990's style doesn't suit me.

It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.

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I like the look even better now!

Rider needs to be facing direction of travel.

 CptJake wrote:
Rider needs to be facing direction of travel.

Eh?

You mean his head. Just position it up. It's a 'neutral' position.

Must struggle to not add 18...

 judgedoug wrote:
Must struggle to not add 18...

I know! The top view makes them look a lot more badass.

 judgedoug wrote:

Whew, I had some Dreamblade/SF stuff, and no way. Early GW Squats are a joke compared to Mantic's Forge Fathers. I'm not say the basic Steel Warrior is a fantastic model (it's merely acceptable), but leagues better than Squats.

You're missing half of what I wrote in terms of meaning. I said they were the modern day equivalent of Dreamblade. Mantic by and large makes worse looking, retro cartoony, but much cheaper 40k "alternatives" just like dreamblade did a decade or more earlier. As for squats, again, you're missing half of what I wrote. I didn't say early squats are the same quality as FF but that FF are a snap shot in time in terms of both quality and style of what squats would have been had they gotten a late 1990's redesign during 2nd ed 40k instead of being canned. Unfortunately, they didn't get that redesign in the late 1990's by GW but instead the early 2010's with mantic. In any case, it's getting a bit off topic so I won't belabor the point further.


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The jet bike does look nice though.

Updated OP again for all the new stuff. We're pretty close to $300 retail for Quarantine.

 judgedoug wrote:

Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).

I don't think McVey did any sculpting did he? He was/is the Art Director though. Also, not everyone agrees that Naismith is as good as you seem to think he is. Remy was hampered by poor art direction and mediocre concepts for most things. The digital guy, Calvert-Lee, is good but is also hampered by the AD and concepts.

warboss wrote:
It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style.

I agree. And it also seems that their concepts all have a pretty distinct anime tinge to them, which I'm personally not a big fan of.

 judgedoug wrote:
No one will ever compare to Jes Goodwin's ability to create brilliant designs and 100% follow through with the sculpts.

So much truth here. Shame he will likely never work for another miniatures company.

judgedoug wrote:.
It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.

I totally disagree here. The Orx are still completely comedy in my opinion, especially the Deadzone ones. The Riffs from Fallen Frontiers look intelligent and brutal.

The Veermyn are all pretty comedy-ish too in my opinion. The Forge Fathers have good ideas, but mostly poor execution.

~Eric

So an early birder dropped out just as I was managing my pledge to get more stuff, saved $5!

 Ozymandias wrote:
So an early birder dropped out just as I was managing my pledge to get more stuff, saved $5!

You mean you gained a jetbike.

That is the new standard of Mantic currency. A faction booster will cost you 5 jetbikes. Might be worth it if they threw in a jetbike.

Alrighty, now I'm finally seeing value being offered for a sweet spot pledge. I can already tell my wallet is going to ache just as bad as it did for DZ, especially since I'm strongly considering getting an Asterian booster so I finally have all the factions.

I have to say, while I am a bit peeved about the jet bikes being tossed out starting at $10 a pop, now they are looking like a very attractive option. Plus, it might just be me, but the way that render looks, the front vanes may be separate pieces, meaning those folks looking for a much smaller profile that would match a GW bike and base better might need nothing more than a smidge of plasticard and/or greenstuff to get SM-compatible jetbikes.

Plus, seeing the direction the jetbikes and Striders have taken, I am definitely looking forward to what the eventual WP kickstarter will offer in terms of vehicles. They had my curiosity before, but now they have my attention.

Still holding out for Corp being introduced as a stretch faction and being given a proper HIPS sprue at last, especially since they would offer a beautiful midway point for conversion stock for both Enforcers and Rebs.

I'm liking the Jetbike. Probably going to add at least one during the pledge manager. They look a lot like the Sparrow bikes from Destiny.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I found Mantic's small metal models quite nice.

I'd rather not have to lug around 40mm based or larger models in metal, tho. Honestly I wouldn't mind MA/DBX board game plastic. It's nice.

I concur.
Metal is fine for human-sized models in one piece, or perhaps two, depending on what they are. Larger metal models (40mm+) need to be one piece, or they end up like those Basilean Characters from the KoW1 KS where the metal wings weigh so much they can never be permanently attached. Or the River Horse Loka Hippo that warped in the mold and ended up in two halves where never the twain shall meet.


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 judgedoug wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I think I just got numb to it, to be honest. Call is shell shock from Deadzone, Relic Knights and Wrath of Kings... Restic and metal are both complete crap to work with, but Restic is at least much better for transport and play.

Disagree; metal single piece models (Warlord, Foundry, Perry, etc) are the easiest models to work with. 10 seconds of cleaning, glue to base. Fit in precut foam trays.

Fully agreed! I'll never give up my old Citadel Metals either!


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 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
I still think of sprue of characters works, if it's stuff that would have been included in the box.
We don't know what will be in the box. Is there even a box? I haven't seen one yet?

There doesn't seem to be a box. It's more of an a la carte thing this time. Hardcover rulebook, sprues of scenery, pack of counters, sprues of figures...

I can understand the hesitation to want to put metal figures up into higher ground in a Deadzone game.
Hopefully we'll see a bit more progress with this campaign today and have less reason to argue over materials at that point.

We all played Necromunda for years without the sky falling. It's really not as big of an issue as people are thinking it is.