Is the Emperor going to die in 40k 6th Edition?

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**shadowsnip**

Steel Angel wrote:Anyone ever think that maybe it's the throne thats keeping him from becoming fully aware. If he did the high lords would lose most of the power base. Good reason to keep him asleep. Maybe the pykers that it drains are ment to keep him down.

I don't think GW would think that far into it. Do you?

**Steel Angel**

well would make some sense. Cypher could be tring to get to earth to free the big guy. maybe it was given to him as a quest of redemion

**RAVEN 97**

Be cool if the emperor did die, maybe he will make new primarchs !!!!!!

**xXSir MontyXx**

I've touched on that subject, I believe they know how he is gonna come back. They just don't want to risk losing that. Astronomican orb their power.

**Soo'Vah'Cha**

I think they just forgot to plug the damn throne into a wall socket.......now its a sacred wire and a holy plug, so nobody knows what to do.

**CuddlySquig**

No plot advancement will come in the 6th edition you silly sausage, because no plot advancement will ever happen ever for any reason ever.

**LoneLictor**

The only reason GW would advance the plot line is to talk about the Imperium's newest victories and the Tyranid's/Chaos's newest failures.

**AlmightyWalrus**

TBH I think I summed this thread up pretty nicely in January...

AlmightyWalrus wrote:The Emperor dying in 6th edition is about as likely as the Ultramarines getting wiped out by a surprise Squat attack utilizing Unobtainium Missiles to shatter the entire Ultramar System...

**dalsiandon**

Just tossing this out there....what if it's already happened and the Adapteus Custodes just aren't saying? The astronomica is still working because of the sacrifice of a 1000 psykers everyday is enough to power it, and that would be way it is so unpredicatable in how well it goes, and it is not just the nature of the immaterium to be blamed.

**labmouse42**

Some of the fluff that was in the Slaves to Darkenss book released in the 90s gave this background.

The emperor is trapped in the golden throne. If his spirit were released, he would be reborn again, but the imperium are keeping his soul trapped in a shattered body.
To make matters worse, he is aware that souls are sacrificed daily to keep his husk of a body alive. The people he is sworn to protect are being sacrificed in his name to keep the status quo.
All this is done to ensure that astropaths have a beacon to allow for safe travel between the vast distance between the stars.

If the emperor were to die, humanity would be screwed for 20 to 100 years. Then the emperor would reappear, summon his marines to him, and bring some serious ass-whopping on the people who enslaved him for millennia!.

**Bylak**

Yeah I don't get why so many people think it would be difficult for GW to keep the story going if the Emperor were to die. I mean if anything it gives them MORE story possibilities. Like others have said, and using the Necron Codex as an example, GW has no problem retconning it's own fluff to fit with the current dynamic of the story. They could hypothetically start 6th edition at the dawn of the 42nd millennium and say something like "with the Emperor dead the light of the Astronomican will be completely diminished by the dawn of the 43rd millenium" or something like that. How long have we been in the 41st for?! Gives them lots of time.

Also, again like others have mentioned it opens up the door to in faction IoM conflicts due to different camps being set up. Right now there are 6 codexes (8 if you factor in BT and DA) that you kind of have to stretch the fluff to have them meet in combat on the table. With the Emperor dead it's a lot easier to say "oh yeah these two groups are just in opposing factions!" and let those players go at it. Again like others have said it opens up the door for the possibility of the recreation of the Legions, Primarchs returning (we have Abaddon on the table right now, Demon Princes, Avatars of Khain . . . no reason why they couldn't release Primarchs for standard 40k play), possible alliances between IoM factions and Chaos Legions seeking redemption.

There's nothing but opportunity here if we all keep in mind GW is more than willing to change the fluff if they see the opportunity as well.

**Orlanth**

VenerableBrotherPelinore wrote:
ringthorn1 wrote:Wait? Who is the starchild everybody is talking about. can i find him in the rulebook

The Starchild theory is detailed in the 3rd edition rulebook, the Eye of Terror novel, as well as a series called the Inquistion War Trilogy from Black Library. It may be detailed elsewhere, but that's where I've seen it.

In effect, it's the belief of some that when the Emperor dies and sheds his mortal remains on the Golden Throne, he'll be reborn. His soul is already partially in the warp, in the manner of the shaman who joined to become him, perhaps being begun by the compassion he cast off to strike down Horus, and needs the remainder to complete the 'birth'. This however, cannot happen while he's still tied to the Golden Throne. This may or may not be in the form of a warp entity, or another being much as he was before being placed within the Throne, it depends on how you read it (Most read it to be as a warp entity capable of neutralising the Chaos powers as it states in Eye of Terror).

I 'believe' this, the supporting evidence is that apparently the Emperor, while immortal, has died a number of times since his first birth in 8000BC. Each time he came back.

The Emperor is on the Golden Throne not by choice, but he does his duty while on it. I think it most likely that the Emperor would welcome death and rebirth, but is also aware of how his death would fragment the Imperium.

Still I think it would be a good thing. The death of the Emperor will result in the loss of control of the Astonomicon, which will make the weakness of the Imperium plain to all to see. Chaos and orc factions will immediately invade, but conversely it will remove the focus for the hive fleets who also use the Astronomicon as a beacon. The biggest problems will be internal political upheavals, bolstered by the dogma that the existance of the Emperor protects the soukls of the citizens of the Imperium. While a common creed there is nothing to indicate it is actually true. Mankind lived without a guiding Emperor before and the Eldar know that human souls dissaipate in the warp those not doing so are not sucked in by Slaanesh anyway.

ASll in all the death and rebirth of the Emperor will be a good think long term, so long as the Imperium holds together while the hunt for his reincarnation occurs. Good news is that there is at least one Primarch who can be roused for this purpose, and hope that a few more are recoverable.

**Skippy**

We really need better apprenticeships in the future so we can fix our advanced weapons after weve built them

**Veteran Sergeant**

forruner_mercy wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:The Emperor dying in 6th edition is about as likely as the Ultramarines getting wiped out by a surprise Squat attack utilizing Unobtainium Missiles to shatter the entire Ultramar System...

Still do not understand why people hate the UM.

All explained here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/416667.page#3679253

**Sasori**

Orlanth wrote:
VenerableBrotherPelinore wrote:
ringthorn1 wrote:Wait? Who is the starchild everybody is talking about. can i find him in the rulebook

The Starchild theory is detailed in the 3rd edition rulebook, the Eye of Terror novel, as well as a series called the Inquistion War Trilogy from Black Library. It may be detailed elsewhere, but that's where I've seen it.

In effect, it's the belief of some that when the Emperor dies and sheds his mortal remains on the Golden Throne, he'll be reborn. His soul is already partially in the warp, in the manner of the shaman who joined to become him, perhaps being begun by the compassion he cast off to strike down Horus, and needs the remainder to complete the 'birth'. This however, cannot happen while he's still tied to the Golden Throne. This may or may not be in the form of a warp entity, or another being much as he was before being placed within the Throne, it depends on how you read it (Most read it to be as a warp entity capable of neutralising the Chaos powers as it states in Eye of Terror).

I 'believe' this, the supporting evidence is that apparently the Emperor, while immortal, has died a number of times since his first birth in 8000BC. Each time he came back.

The Emperor is on the Golden Throne not by choice, but he does his duty while on it. I think it most likely that the Emperor would welcome death and rebirth, but is also aware of how his death would fragment the Imperium.

Still I think it would be a good thing. The death of the Emperor will result in the loss of control of the Astonomicon, which will make the weakness of the Imperium plain to all to see. Chaos and orc factions will immediately invade, but conversely it will remove the focus for the hive fleets who also use the Astronomicon as a beacon. The biggest problems will be internal political upheavals, bolstered by the dogma that the existance of the Emperor protects the soukls of the citizens of the Imperium. While a common creed there is nothing to indicate it is actually true. Mankind lived without a guiding Emperor before and the Eldar know that human souls dissaipate in the warp those not doing so are not sucked in by Slaanesh anyway.

ASll in all the death and rebirth of the Emperor will be a good think long term, so long as the Imperium holds together while the hunt for his reincarnation occurs. Good news is that there is at least one Primarch who can be roused for this purpose, and hope that a few more are recoverable.

I'm not too steeped in lore, but with the loss of the FTL Travel, how would anyone be able to do anything in the Imperium anymore? And Wouldn't Terra be consumed by Daemons, since the Emp is holding them back ever since Magnus looked into the future? How would they hunt for his reincarnation, if they can't travel anywhere?

Please feel free to correct me on all of this, but it seems if the Emperor died, it would immediately spell the end for Imperium, as with no more communication, FTL travel, and the destruction of Terra, each planet would have to fend for itself, and we know how effective the PDFs are...

**dalsiandon**

Sasori wrote:
I'm not too steeped in lore, but with the loss of the FTL Travel, how would anyone be able to do anything in the Imperium anymore? And Wouldn't Terra be consumed by Daemons, since the Emp is holding them back ever since Magnus looked into the future? How would they hunt for his reincarnation, if they can't travel anywhere?

Please feel free to correct me on all of this, but it seems if the Emperor died, it would immediately spell the end for Imperium, as with no more communication, FTL travel, and the destruction of Terra, each planet would have to fend for itself, and we know how effective the PDFs are...

Well it could create problems that is for sure.

And as for your thought on the PDF? Depending on what you read sometimes they are good sometimes not so much. And if you're like Commisar Cain, it really doesn't matter if they are good or not, they will be looked down upon.

**xXSir MontyXx**

AlmightyWalrus wrote:TBH I think I summed this thread up pretty nicely in January...

AlmightyWalrus wrote:The Emperor dying in 6th edition is about as likely as the Ultramarines getting wiped out by a surprise Squat attack utilizing Unobtainium Missiles to shatter the entire Ultramar System...

Self quotation.... fancy. Last time I saw someone do that, they got an arrow in the knee.

**Orlanth**

Sasori wrote:

I'm not too steeped in lore, but with the loss of the FTL Travel, how would anyone be able to do anything in the Imperium anymore? And Wouldn't Terra be consumed by Daemons, since the Emp is holding them back ever since Magnus looked into the future? How would they hunt for his reincarnation, if they can't travel anywhere?

Warp travel would not be lost. Very long range warp travel will be. You dont nedd the astronomicon for warp travel, you nedd a warp drive. You dont even need a navigator, you can make small calculated warp dives, this is what the Tau do. The navigator gene allows navigated warp dives, something the Tau cannot do. This ability would remain. The astronomicon is a very important beacon but there are other local ones. So as a result the central control over the imperium was dissipate, this is bad news for the high lords of terra, but noone else need worry about that of itself. The Imperium largely runs itself and would be in a better shape by lacking the interference of the Adeptus Terra.
The main problems will be mass hysterical panic, the collapse of the Imperial cult and an immediate Dark Crusade from the Eye of Terror.

Sasori wrote:
Please feel free to correct me on all of this, but it seems if the Emperor died, it would immediately spell the end for Imperium, as with no more communication, FTL travel, and the destruction of Terra, each planet would have to fend for itself, and we know how effective the PDFs are...

Not at all. Though the Imperium would need to move quickly to contain the large scale chaos incursions. Fortunately this is done with what are effectively static defences (on a galactic scale) whole armies are already in permenant position or reserve position in all likelihood with minor local beacons for travel and marked space lanes. Some departments of the Imperium may also have contingencies for just such an event as the 'loss' of the astronomicon though not for the loss of the emperor as a religious event. After all something similar happened before.

**BaronIveagh**

I've actually heard rumors to the effect that the big E will kick off in 6th before. Not sure how reliable they are...

Warp travel won't be lost in the least. The astronomicon is not the only warp beacon, to start with, and secondly, there are DAoT items called a Void Abacus that allow warp travel without even using a navigator.

AS far as an Immediate Dark Crusade... it's more likely that the CSMs will totally fall apart. Remember that the only thing they have in common anymore is their hatred for the Emperor. Without him to give them a foe, they have nothing left to define themselves by, and worse, their defeating him becomes impossible.

**Ehsteve**

After some discussion with others, this is how we believe (if the Emperor did infact die) it will/should/could happen (warning, possible spoilers):

Spoiler:

**Wardragoon**

Ehsteve wrote:After some discussion with others, this is how we believe (if the Emperor did infact die) it will/should/could happen (warning, possible spoilers):

Spoiler:

1. Roboute Guilliman heals from stasis
2. Leman Russ returns from the Eye of Terror and declares the Wolftime
3. Jaghatai Khan returns from the Webway
4. Vulkan is released from Tarzyn's collection, Book of Fire prophecy complete
5. Corax returns from the Eye of Terror
6. Cypher returns the Sword to Terra to redeem the Dark Angel Chapter
7. Tau Empire further expands, become a greater menace in the Eastern fringe
8. Ahriman discovers the Black Library and the means to restore the thousand sons still loyal to him, return to Terra and beg forgiveness from the Emperor
9. Tzeentch finally recovers the last spell, regaining the last shard of power, using Ahriman, discovers the Black Library and recovers his staff
9.1. With the rise of Tzeentch (just as planned), the Chaos Gods war against one another to stop either becomming more powerful
9.2. The Alpha Legion turn against Abaddon and execute raids/sabotage on their main offensives (either going renegade or returning to Terra for forgiveness)
9.3. hence the 13th Black Crusade is foiled as the ruinous powers leave their champions or they are whisked away to do unholy battle
10. Emperor dies as the 13th Black Crusade is repelled from Cadia and forced back to the Eye of Terror
11. Tyranid fleet goes into disarray as the psychic beacon is extinguished, splinter fleet break off and begin random assaults on nearby planets, becomming more like the Ork menace
12. Necrons seize Imperial worlds with the IoM reeling from the death of the Emperor
13. With the expansion of the Necrons, the Eldar begin a major offensive against their ancient foes
14. Surviving Primarchs form a council to control the IoM, overseeing the Lords of Terra
15. Imperial Guard regiments cut off from other forces with the fall of the Astronomicon, are either wiped out or resist incursions from chaos/necrons/tyranids/tau
16. Thorian Inquisitors discover new Emperor, Imperium rejoices
17. AdMech discover and repair fault with the Golden throne now that the Emperor is no longer attached
17. IoM in shambles, new Imperial expansion begins with the Primarchs advising the new Emperor
18. Nearby Imperial Guard regiments conquer and liberate other cut off regiments with the reestablishment of the astronomicon
19. Abaddon rallies the forces of chaos, legions now divided by the warring chaos gods
20. It is the 42nd Millennium and in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war

I really don't see most of that happening, I could see this (assuming emperor isnt long dead and his death is an obscenely well hidden secret), with the return of so many forces to the IoM would abandon the general hopeless atmosphere pervading the setting, I'll give my stab at this list.

Spoiler:

Now for my funny/gripey addons to this list
13.Admech just said the wrong prayers, nothing wrong with the throne
14.Marneus Calgar goes to cadia and kills Abaddon in single combat, since thats what ultramarines do
15. Tau reflect what happens in gameplay and get wiped out
16.IoM gets wise to Space wolf and Ultramarine fluff armor, chapter size for those two are allowed to grow to the point that one marine from those two chapters can be on every planet
17.The above results in Tyranids unable to take another planet, also leaves chaos pretty screwed too
18.Imperial guard gets even more armor
19. Kaldor Draigo magically appears and chuck norris' every Custodes and kills the emperor in what is later told as 'glorious single combat', replacing the emperor on the golden toilet
20.This is the 42nd millenium and in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only Matt Ward codex's

**Great White**

The day the Emperor dies is the day Draigo leaves the warp and kills everything

**Exalted Pariah**

New theory: Draigo leaves the warp next to the Emperor and revives him using his awesome. Emp awakes and comforts him as he dies by telling him no one else is allowed the Emperors True name, he whispers: "matt...ward"

Now for my actual theory for 6th edition, rather than the Emp dying, instead the Atronomicon grows steadily fainter as the Golden throne loses the Emperors life sign little by little, rather than the fluctuations in the past. this does a few things
1) makes communication and travel vastly more difficult
2) higher up officers know that each day brings less hope, sending moral into a steady decline
3) enemies of the Imperium press the advantage on all sides, run into each other and continue fighting
4) only "good" news, tyranids stop advancing coreworld as much/fast, BUT start focusing on ALL other worlds in their reach(mopping up any missed scraps of food)
5) being suppressed less now that the Emperors power is fading, the Eye of Terror expands by hundreds of light years, enveloping Cadia and thousands of "secure" systems, psykers and daemons show up more frequently
6) chaos forces start skirting the edge of segmentum sol

its the 40k everybody loves, but now even MORE GRIMDARK!

**AlmightyWalrus**

xXSir MontyXx wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:TBH I think I summed this thread up pretty nicely in January...

AlmightyWalrus wrote:The Emperor dying in 6th edition is about as likely as the Ultramarines getting wiped out by a surprise Squat attack utilizing Unobtainium Missiles to shatter the entire Ultramar System...

Self quotation.... fancy. Last time I saw someone do that, they got an arrow in the knee.

I used to take arrows to the knee, then I took a mace to the face.

Seriously, that meme is already old and tired, and not very funny to start with. At least my self-quotation had a point.

**The Son Of Russ**

Wardragoon wrote:
Ehsteve wrote:After some discussion with others, this is how we believe (if the Emperor did infact die) it will/should/could happen (warning, possible spoilers):

Spoiler:

1. Roboute Guilliman heals from stasis
2. Leman Russ returns from the Eye of Terror and declares the Wolftime
3. Jaghatai Khan returns from the Webway
4. Vulkan is released from Tarzyn's collection, Book of Fire prophecy complete
5. Corax returns from the Eye of Terror
6. Cypher returns the Sword to Terra to redeem the Dark Angel Chapter
7. Tau Empire further expands, become a greater menace in the Eastern fringe
8. Ahriman discovers the Black Library and the means to restore the thousand sons still loyal to him, return to Terra and beg forgiveness from the Emperor
9. Tzeentch finally recovers the last spell, regaining the last shard of power, using Ahriman, discovers the Black Library and recovers his staff
9.1. With the rise of Tzeentch (just as planned), the Chaos Gods war against one another to stop either becomming more powerful
9.2. The Alpha Legion turn against Abaddon and execute raids/sabotage on their main offensives (either going renegade or returning to Terra for forgiveness)
9.3. hence the 13th Black Crusade is foiled as the ruinous powers leave their champions or they are whisked away to do unholy battle
10. Emperor dies as the 13th Black Crusade is repelled from Cadia and forced back to the Eye of Terror
11. Tyranid fleet goes into disarray as the psychic beacon is extinguished, splinter fleet break off and begin random assaults on nearby planets, becomming more like the Ork menace
12. Necrons seize Imperial worlds with the IoM reeling from the death of the Emperor
13. With the expansion of the Necrons, the Eldar begin a major offensive against their ancient foes
14. Surviving Primarchs form a council to control the IoM, overseeing the Lords of Terra
15. Imperial Guard regiments cut off from other forces with the fall of the Astronomicon, are either wiped out or resist incursions from chaos/necrons/tyranids/tau
16. Thorian Inquisitors discover new Emperor, Imperium rejoices
17. AdMech discover and repair fault with the Golden throne now that the Emperor is no longer attached
17. IoM in shambles, new Imperial expansion begins with the Primarchs advising the new Emperor
18. Nearby Imperial Guard regiments conquer and liberate other cut off regiments with the reestablishment of the astronomicon
19. Abaddon rallies the forces of chaos, legions now divided by the warring chaos gods
20. It is the 42nd Millennium and in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war

I really don't see most of that happening, I could see this (assuming emperor isnt long dead and his death is an obscenely well hidden secret), with the return of so many forces to the IoM would abandon the general hopeless atmosphere pervading the setting, I'll give my stab at this list.

Spoiler:

1.Word get's out that the emperor is trully dying(not dead yet mind you), rebellion and secession are rampant (making for IoM vs. IoM matches more plausible)
2.Using the instability to their advantage Chaos forces manage to take and hold the Cadia Gate, albeit with massive losses
3. Cypher discovers an entrance into the webway, and manages to do something to the Golden Throne before being slain by custodes(fixing it in all actuality, allowing for more editions to be made)
4. Black Templars launch in full strength to destroy hive fleet Leviathan
5. Tau expansion continues, they find a way to counter psykers
6. Tyranids continue devouring IoM space in other sectors
7. After the losses from the Chaos attacks on their home system Ultramarines focus on rebuilding their own domain
8. Dark Angels with several other chapters launch a counter crusade to retake cadia (iirc rumors state Dark Angels are supposed to be the poster boys for the next edition)
9. Eldar continue to be Fey and Enigmatic, continuing to wield the 'I told you so' card against the Imperium
10. Sisters of Battle recruit in far larger numbers to take on the mass rebellion (hence their own non web codex)
11. Necrons continue to awaken, making the situation for IoM that much worse
12.It is the 42st Millennium and in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war

Now for my funny/gripey addons to this list
13.Admech just said the wrong prayers, nothing wrong with the throne
14.Marneus Calgar goes to cadia and kills Abaddon in single combat, since thats what ultramarines do
15. Tau reflect what happens in gameplay and get wiped out
16.IoM gets wise to Space wolf and Ultramarine fluff armor, chapter size for those two are allowed to grow to the point that one marine from those two chapters can be on every planet
17.The above results in Tyranids unable to take another planet, also leaves chaos pretty screwed too
18.Imperial guard gets even more armor
19. Kaldor Draigo magically appears and chuck norris' every Custodes and kills the emperor in what is later told as 'glorious single combat', replacing the emperor on the golden toilet
20.This is the 42nd millenium and in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only Matt Ward codex's

For someone who hates Matt Ward so much, why have you named yourself after him, Ward Ragoon?

**DoctorZombie**

Storm Lord wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:The Emperor dying in 6th edition is about as likely as the Ultramarines getting wiped out by a surprise Squat attack utilizing Unobtainium Missiles to shatter the entire Ultramar System...

Oh please let this happen. I'd pay good money for that.

Don't be hating on my Ultrasmurfs!

**Wardragoon**

I know I should have left that in my signature, comes from an old ps1 game long before I actually even heard of 40k.

**Semper**

They are slowly advancing it. VERY slowly.. in the decade i've been observing 40k they've reached the 41,900's.. when I first started out they were still in the late 40k/early 41st mark or so. It's the fact they're not doing too many major changes... 13th Crusade, new tyranid fluff and Tau have to have been the biggest fluff moves in that period.

I think killing the emperor would be bold but could be amazingly brilliant. With fiction, especially fiction like this they could do well with it. I mean hell they killed off Solar and Eldrad.. why not old emps? YEAH there would be a void and yeah all those fans roaring 'FOR THE EMPEROR' would become a little dumb struck but that's the point of it! A shock a huge shift like that is meant to change things... you've seen it before when Vader tells luke of his heritage, when Ned Stark got the sword in a game of thrones and when we found out Dumbledore was actually a homo. It's how they moved on that would effect it.

If I were them i'd do it. Have a huge campaign in the summer to represent the mess and then have salvation come in the form of Lemon Russ wandering out of the warp with some old eldar tech that did what the emperor did, healing Roboute and waking Lion. The new dynamics would be endless. All of a sudden the GRIM DARKNESS OF the 41st millennium will be re-realised as mankind's true saviour is gone and that brief lapse in power opened alot of holes. Then.. if it proves too un-commercially substantial they can bang out the star child or name Roboute emps (and have someone to roar 'for the emperor!' for once again).

Think of the games that could come from it too? The internal politics from this shift would open a big doorway.

**xXSir MontyXx**

Exactly the meme is unfunny. I brought something as uninteresting as a self quotation.

**Red Comet**

Semper wrote:
If I were them i'd do it. Have a huge campaign in the summer to represent the mess and then have salvation come in the form of Lemon Russ wandering out of the warp with some old eldar tech that did what the emperor did, healing Roboute and waking Lion. The new dynamics would be endless. All of a sudden the GRIM DARKNESS OF the 41st millennium will be re-realised as mankind's true saviour is gone and that brief lapse in power opened alot of holes. Then.. if it proves too un-commercially substantial they can bang out the star child or name Roboute emps (and have someone to roar 'for the emperor!' for once again).

Think of the games that could come from it too? The internal politics from this shift would open a big doorway.

That would be rather interesting to see happen. We'd see primarchs as playable special characters in games like that. I'd prefer it if they all stayed as Apoc only models though. It would be interesting if there was a civil war because of the Emperor's death and the different Marine chapters and organizations within the Imperium takes sides.