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Zond wrote:
I found all my old Fanatic issues whilst unpacking today. Made me realise how much I miss the GW setting, especially BFG. No other fleet game has had the same weight except the also mourned for Babylon 5.

I really liked Silent Death back in the day. It was sorta like Battletech in space, and we used it to work space battles in Star Wars with custom build ships, since all the RPGs had TERRIBLE rules for space (West End Games and d20 alike).

 Farseer Faenyin wrote:

I really liked Silent Death back in the day. It was sorta like Battletech in space, and we used it to work space battles in Star Wars with custom build ships, since all the RPGs had TERRIBLE rules for space (West End Games and d20 alike).

Silent death is still being produced and slowly expanded.
http://store.metal-express.net/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=2
Not being much of a spaceship gamer, I'm not sure how it compares to other rulesets (I've only played Full Thrust a few times) but for fans of SD, it is available and in PDF form too.

Have played Blood Bowl, Mordheim and Necromunda....can actually still get games of these without much trouble (easier than I can games of Warmachine).

Recently nabbed the Aeronautica Imperialis rulebooks and some models off Ebay, partially to help with a story I'm writing and also in hope of getting a handful of games in.

Epic was well Epic, but the writing was on the wall as soon as they figured they could get people to play it with full sized models. I remember years and years ago they did an epic exhibition with full size miniatures, every body thought it was cool, but it sent a shiver down my spine.....I see now that I was right.

Played Gorkamorka, BFG, Bloodbowl and Necromunda at various times. Always wanted to give Epic or Mordheim a try, but never really found the time or the group.

It's a shame there's not more creativity like this at GW these days. Glad I downloaded pretty much everything a while ago when rumours that the site might change started!

 Andrew1975 wrote:
Epic was well Epic, but the writing was on the wall as soon as they figured they could get people to play it with full sized models. I remember years and years ago they did an epic exhibition with full size miniatures, every body thought it was cool, but it sent a shiver down my spine.....I see now that I was right.

They couldn't even get that right. Either way it would be ridiculous, but if Apocalypse had been a modified version of Epic, it would have been a proper playable game rather than a rarely-played exercise in rulebook-selling.

 Eilif wrote:

 Farseer Faenyin wrote:

I really liked Silent Death back in the day. It was sorta like Battletech in space, and we used it to work space battles in Star Wars with custom build ships, since all the RPGs had TERRIBLE rules for space (West End Games and d20 alike).

Silent death is still being produced and slowly expanded.
http://store.metal-express.net/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=2
Not being much of a spaceship gamer, I'm not sure how it compares to other rulesets (I've only played Full Thrust a few times) but for fans of SD, it is available and in PDF form too.

Yeah, I have some of the rules in PDF already...but wasn't aware they were expanding on it. That's awesome.

I still have a few of the larger gunships that I planned to use as mission ships for BFG.

Can anyone find Jake Thornton's blogs on Dreadfleet? They are illuminating.

Backfire wrote:
It's a shame Dreadfleet didn't do great, because it was so refreshing that they produced something new which wasn't Space Marines. Sadly, one of the biggest criticisms the game faced was that "It's not Space Marines!"

I disagree with that. Dreadfleet was lambasted because it was a product no one wanted and because it wasn't very good, no matter the quality of the miniatures within. Claiming that people didn't like it beacuse it "wasn't Space Marines" is about as truthful as saying that Space Hulk only did well because it was Space Marines. No, Space Hulk did well because it was a good game and had amazing production values. A good cloth ocean and some nice minis weren't enough for Dreadfleet because it wasn't good in the first place.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Can anyone find Jake Thornton's blogs on Dreadfleet? They are illuminating.

Is this the one? http://quirkworthy.com/2011/10/08/dreadfleet-review-2-more-ships-more-battles/


Kind of funny but all this reminiscing has got me thinking about Necromunda a lot again. Problem is I can't decide if I want to buy some kits and convert a new plastic gang, or not give GW my money because they stubbornly hold onto the notion that they can't make money off of smaller games and push hard on big armies only. I feel like buying those kits only reinforces their beliefs and there's plenty of other games that will offer alternatives.

I think I'd be all over Deadzone if the models weren't so awful and uninspired They should have just gone all out and made "not Necromunda" human gangs and called it a day.

Big P wrote:
The only GW games I still play are specialists.

Same here. BFG is an awesome game, and Mordheim has a lot of potential. Luckily I already have the rules for both. Thanks GW!


I'll still play them from time to time.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Backfire wrote:
It's a shame Dreadfleet didn't do great, because it was so refreshing that they produced something new which wasn't Space Marines. Sadly, one of the biggest criticisms the game faced was that "It's not Space Marines!"

I disagree with that. Dreadfleet was lambasted because it was a product no one wanted and because it wasn't very good, no matter the quality of the miniatures within. Claiming that people didn't like it beacuse it "wasn't Space Marines" is about as truthful as saying that Space Hulk only did well because it was Space Marines.

I actually remember when DF was released and there were plenty of people complaining how GW "wasted resources on a fantasy ship game when they could have released missing Space Wolves kits etc". You can look the thread up if you don't believe me. And those complaints were BEFORE anyone had the opportunity to play it.

So yes, my statement is quite correct. Of course it was not the only factor, as I explained in my post.

Dreadfleet didn't do so great because it was 1-shot game that would never be further expanded upon and because it wasn't very good on its own merits. Also it was overpriced. GW scouring the world to destroy all copies of it after several months certainly didn't help.

Why does Dreadfleet (or even the most recent Space Hulk) even come up in conversations regarding Specialist games? They weren't Specialist games. They were one-off limited edition games that were never intended to be further supported.

Specialist games were games that had previously acquired expansions, miniature lines, and support before being shunted to the side and grouped under the SG sub-brand.

The only thing SG and Ltd. Ed games had in common was GW's desire not to invest any more resources in them.

I think they get brought up for a few reasons. For one, the original Space Hulk sort of got bundled together with the other games at the time. Back then they weren't called Specialist Games, they were just games that GW made.

In recent times, they get brought up alongside Specialist Games because many people just assume any of GW's "other" games are Specialist Games. I think also, because some people think that is the only way we will ever see these games be brought back, is by a one-off, single box re-release. I think people would take that over nothing, but sadly I don't think that will ever happen.

Ahhh, the Specialist Games.
I have memories of seeing them in my local GW in my youth...

I have an Imperial fleet, all cruisers sadly and i have some Mordheim and Necromunda forces. I also have an Epic SM army.

We still play them at my club, so i still play.
I just weep for GWs stupidity.

I'm currently playing in a 20-player tabletop Blood Bowl league (on its 4th season), and play in BB tournaments every few months (have to skip plenty more). I can't speak for other Specialist Games, but BB is as strong as ever. GW dropping their support is strictly a positive development from my perspective.

While credit goes to GW for the initial ruleset, it's the BB community that have kept the game thriving. We have updated, well-balanced rules (more than any supported GW game can claim). Then there are a plethora of independent companies putting out a huge variety of models, pitches, tokens, and custom dice. All without GW's support, or in spite of GW's opposition.

My greatest fear as a Blood Bowl player was that GW would try to reinvigorate the IP with half-baked new rules, inadvertently break the game, and end up dividing the community. Or perhaps take further legal action against the companies responsible for sustaining the BB hobby for all these years (as they've already gone after NAF.) "Your search for: blood bowl did not match any products" is the best news I've seen on GW's website in a long time. I just hope they've given up for good.

 whigwam wrote:

My greatest fear as a Blood Bowl player was that GW would try to reinvigorate the IP with half-baked new rules, inadvertently break the game, and end up dividing the community. Or perhaps take further legal action against the companies responsible for sustaining the BB hobby for all these years (as they've already gone after NAF.) "Your search for: blood bowl did not match any products" is the best news I've seen on GW's website in a long time. I just hope they've given up for good.

That's how I felt when the re-released the Necromunda rulebook. It felt like they stripped all of the flavor and energy and character out of the original and it ended up dividing my gaming group where some wanted to use the free PDF and others wanted to stick with old original rules.

I just wish I could find people who still played the Specialist Games regularly around my area.

BFG - I know of 6-7 people with fleets, but most are mum on getting them dug out of their holes in the attic or closet to play.

Mordheim - We have gone back to it on a few occasions, but people hate certain lists so much that it falls apart quickly....or it starts with 'limited warbands allowed' and never really takes off.

Blood Bowl - Played heavily by a group that hasn't changed their player base in 7-9 years...they love their game and hate outsiders. At events, they are also annoying as hell to game around. Luckily, as I said, I have XBox 360's Bloodbowl.

Epic Armageddon - Great game, but I played a few people with my Eldar and suddenly they hated the game because of how 'Spirit Stones' worked. I couldn't find games anymore, and I sold my army.

 MarcoSkoll wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Well if Necromunda just became Skirmish 40K it wouldn't be Necromunda any more. That doesn't seem like a good idea.

Well, Necromunda of course started as 2nd edition.

I don't think it's an inherently bad idea. Set up a core of rules suitable for skirmish play, then bring out setting based expansions - a not entirely different concept to what FFG did with the 40kRPGs, all of them (loosely) based on the same underlying rules, but all set in different areas of the fluff.

I thought that was the idea when Gorkamorka used very similar rules, but added vehilces and Orks. I was hoping for more spin-offs like Eldar Exodite knight worlds, Inquisitor warbands in the cities, Space Marine Scout Training, Adeptus Mechanicus explorators exploring catacombs, Ship's Naval Crews in the bowels of the ship, etc.

Alas, it was never to be.....