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The reason immo spam can work over razorspam is the fact that all of sisters weapons are designed for close range and the immos can get them their where they need to be fast especially with doms scout/outflanking to make the enemy have to deal with them before they can even think of any other target priority. I did the math in my head and I think you could easily get 9 immos (3 being doms) all with msu sisters with flamers and then 3 exorcists and then a canoness with book then add your own flavor to it (priests or some repentia in DC etc)

I know I'm swapping my usual builds of maybe 3-4 rhinos to hide worthless BSS squads or for 4 flamer doms squads to now 5 Immos, 2-3 Rhinos, and I already own 3 Exorcists.

The Easy Bake Oven™ look tempting versus the pipe organs, might have to try it now that the squad doesn't need to be massive and such a points liability.

Don't forget IG allies and making a lot of guardsdmen fearless with priests. Try shifting a 50 man power blob with meltas or flamers that's also fearless for a mere 25 points more? Gross.

I'm starting to think that three Exorcists is overkill.

I'm using mine as AA batteries and they haven't failed me in the two games I've played, but I feel that the army needs something else.

Retributors may have taken a bit of a nerf, but two - three turns of rending HB isn't bad.

PE are a unit not many people like, but they are a unit that must be answered. A three strong unit can mulch nearly any blob, be it IG, Ork or Nid and they are no slouches in cc vs Terminators and MEQ. Could they be a good distraction unit?

So is this the current thread now?
Argh, mods, lock one or the another.

So, how are people feeling about Canoness vs. Celestine now?
Celestine dies way easier than before and went up in points, and Canoness got access to those cool relics. Problem is that if you start to giving Canoness upgrades that actually allow her to kick some arse, she'll soon be as expensive as Celestine. I'm sure a cheap Canoness with little or no upgrades could work, but frankly, that's just boring.

With Canoness you can get command squad, which now seem nice, not to mention an interesting modelling opportunity.

I was thinking a Canoness with EW cloak and Eviscerator. How stupid is this? I know it is crazy expensive for few S6 attacks, but at least she would be a proper threat in CC and look badass.

If you take the saves reroll and EW relics on a Canoness you have a very sturdy unit to soak up shooting for some squad.

Also whoever said you can only take on relic is mistaken. I just checked the SM codex and it uses similar language "You can exchange one weapon for one relic", it doesn't limit you to only one.

Yep, I've checked the Eldar codex as well, the wording is the same and people can take multiple relics. Canoness with Mantle of Ophelia and Cloak of St. Aspira is now my default HQ. Dunno about the second one yet, probably Uriah, but it somehow feels a bit mish mashed with all the different abilities.

Lanlaorn wrote:
If you take the saves reroll and EW relics on a Canoness you have a very sturdy unit to soak up shooting for some squad.

Also whoever said you can only take on relic is mistaken. I just checked the SM codex and it uses similar language "You can exchange one weapon for one relic", it doesn't limit you to only one.

Why some people think SM can take many, is because they have two weapons to exchange. There was a huge debate on that.

However, with AS there is absolutely no ambiguity. It says can take one. That's one, not two, not three, not seventeen. One.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

meh_ wrote:
Yep, I've checked the Eldar codex as well, the wording is the same and people can take multiple relics.

Wording is not the same. It is in fact completely different.

Hey guys just doing some theorycrafting at the moment for the Sororitas Command Squad let me know what you think.

Cannoness

Sororitas Command Squad + Hospitaller + Dialogus w/The Litanies of Faith

Priest

This is just the bare minimum so far but here's my thinking Litanies of faith makes the unit autopass their AoF & War Hyms so if you manage to make it into close combat the entire unit can have re-rolls to all their saves including the Rosarius on the Cannoness. Personally I see this as better calue than the Cloak on a single model. Kit the Command squad out with some Power weapons and I think we've got a cheap yet effective beat stick in the army.

I made this thread for discussing the legality of wargear options to not derail this thread. Please take any arguments for multiple relics there.

At the start of 6th ed Razor spam dropped from top tier because the 5th ed meta was still lingering, armies were heavily geared to kill av11 because they did not adapt to 6th ed yet, and cron air/wraithwing was dominating the meta.

What's different now? The meta is white scars, deamons, necrons, ig/sm, sm/tau, tau/eldar and hell turkeys. The distance between top tier and bottom tier has become much closer than it was in 5th ed. With the exception of serpent spam/tau the meta is heavily geared away from opening av11 boxes and av13+ has become very popular.

 schadenfreude wrote:
At the start of 6th ed Razor spam dropped from top tier because the 5th ed meta was still lingering, armies were heavily geared to kill av11 because they did not adapt to 6th ed yet, and cron air/wraithwing was dominating the meta.

What's different now? The meta is white scars, deamons, necrons, ig/sm, sm/tau, tau/eldar and hell turkeys. The distance between top tier and bottom tier has become much closer than it was in 5th ed. With the exception of serpent spam/tau the meta is heavily geared away from opening av11 boxes and av13+ has become very popular.

Mech IG is still very strong in this edition with cheap Chimeras and Vet Squads running around. Watched a game where a fellow IG player took over 12 Chimeras with naked vets, tossed in some Leman Russes and Vendettas and went to town. The Mechdar player he was fighting had too many targets to handle and eventually all off his Wave Serpents were brought down through massed Multi-Laser shots or assaulting Veteran Squads.

I can see a lot of converting happening with a lot of plastic flamers...
BTW, can someone please take the apostrophe out of the thread title? Grammar rage imminent

I can't think of any situation where I would want Repentia now. No armor save and a 6++ when not in an assault and the inability to assault from vehicles means they will be butchered every time they step outside the rhino or immolator.

I learned in my game last night that you do not let your Priest accept a challenge. Does not end well.

Repentia do seem the weakest link in the Codex. Thanks for changing the thread title!

 inmygravenimage wrote:
I can see a lot of converting happening with a lot of plastic flamers...
BTW, can someone please take the apostrophe out of the thread title? Grammar rage imminent

QFT

 Dannyevilguy wrote:
I can't think of any situation where I would want Repentia now. No armor save and a 6++ when not in an assault and the inability to assault from vehicles means they will be butchered every time they step outside the rhino or immolator.

I learned in my game last night that you do not let your Priest accept a challenge. Does not end well.

Yea shame about the Repentia, losing the FNP was about the only way they could survive long enough to maybe get a few models into assault. My gaming group allows assault from stationary vehicles as a house rule so I'll still run them but it's a nerf for sure.

The new Repentia are brutally bad, which is a shame because I found them to be a really effective unit in the WD 'dex, particuarly in late 5th but even into 6th, with the right useage. Now, however, they've lost what little defense vs. shooting they once enjoyed, and I honestly feel like deploying Repentia is just handing your opponent 85+ points.

Im putting togeter a list, but a few issues keep bothering me, tht I hope will be FaQ'd soon. I don't use Facebook, so I'm not sure if these have been brought up on the Digital Editions webpage, but Im not the first to notice any of these so hopefully we'll get a ruling soon.

So, the codex states that we roll for our Assault phase Acts of Faith immediately before the unit makes attacks. That completely invalidates the Command Squad's Endless Crusade, since Fleet and Move through Cover are both useful long before any blows are struck. Additionally, Repentia's Spirit of the Martyr, which grants them their version of FnP, must be rolled for immeidatly before they swing, ehich is Initiative 3 if te Mistress is still alive, or Initiative 1 if not. Either way, it's probably too late, since most enemies strike before initiative 3, and your whole squad will already be dead. On the other hand, War Hymns are rolled for at the beginning of the fight subphase, this would be a much better time for Spirit of the Martyr.

Having a priest in a unit, RaW, orvents them from enjoying the benefits of your Warlord's Martyrdom, as the prist does not have Acts of Faith. It seems like an oversight, but it may very well be intentional, as why else stipulate that the unit must be 'entirely' composed of models with Act of Fairh?

Condemnor Confusion. I personally think it's one Perils per hit, I mean the thing is only 10 points after all.

Seraphim Superior Eviscerator- apparently differen editions of the codex have different rules here?

It might have been discussed elsewhere, however I think the smashing preacher might be an unsung hero just yet.

A preacher with a power mace is S5, Ap4. Given Smash, he's now S5, Ap2. If he ACTUALLY Smashes, he's at initiative, S8, Ap2! Answer challenges with your preacher against opponents that strike at initiative slower than you that are T4 and you are clocking them out with instant death. Not to mention you have hatred and fearless.

40 pts for the best upgrade to you sister squad or conclaves. Sneaky, at initiative, power fisting!

 TheKbob wrote:
It might have been discussed elsewhere, however I think the smashing preacher might be an unsung hero just yet.

A preacher with a power mace is S5, Ap4. Given Smash, he's now S5, Ap2. If he ACTUALLY Smashes, he's at initiative, S8, Ap2! Answer challenges with your preacher against opponents that strike at initiative slower than you that are T4 and you are clocking them out with instant death. Not to mention you have hatred and fearless.

40 pts for the best upgrade to you sister squad or conclaves. Sneaky, at initiative, power fisting!

I have a new Sunday afternoon conversion project...

Repentia have had it rough for a while and I was really hoping for them to be usable again but I guess they are just shelf siters for now. Back onto immo spam filled with flamers, how do you think these would fair in the current meta? The quad flamer doms is nothing to laugh at and will most likely only live to have one round of shooting so the AoF thing isn't too big of a deal for them.

The MSU will give tau a hard time since they excel at focus firing and can't really do that against this list.

Serpent spam might do something to this list but they will need to work hard to do it since they will need to hold their serpent shields for the immenent mass of pens from all the MM and exorcists then the guardians fall over to flamers (DA should die all the same).

I could see daemon flying circus giving them problems due to lack of AA but they can just place fodder squads of sob as stop gaps to prevent charges on the immos and then focus fire them to death after they ground.

 A GumyBear wrote:
Repentia have had it rough for a while and I was really hoping for them to be usable again but I guess they are just shelf siters for now. Back onto immo spam filled with flamers, how do you think these would fair in the current meta? The quad flamer doms is nothing to laugh at and will most likely only live to have one round of shooting so the AoF thing isn't too big of a deal for them.

The MSU will give tau a hard time since they excel at focus firing and can't really do that against this list.

Serpent spam might do something to this list but they will need to work hard to do it since they will need to hold their serpent shields for the immenent mass of pens from all the MM and exorcists then the guardians fall over to flamers (DA should die all the same).

I could see daemon flying circus giving them problems due to lack of AA but they can just place fodder squads of sob as stop gaps to prevent charges on the immos and then focus fire them to death after they ground.

Heavy flamers are way cheaper. Bring some and the DA make that lovely burning pointy ear smell all the of the Imperium enjoys!

The Dominion moto: "Eldar, the other other white meat!"

SJ

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
The Dominion moto: "Eldar, the other other white meat!"

SJ

Going to Sig that the minute I get infront of my PC.

Edit: SIGGED

Okay, role of the Canoness was discussed in the other thread. Is there any reason to ever take Canoness, and if yes, what wargear should she have?

I like taking her with the book since its cheap and being a cheap hq makes it better and allows for more bodies on the board which means more immos and I think we all know how I feel on immos with the new dex

 A GumyBear wrote:
I like taking her with the book since its cheap and being a cheap hq makes it better and allows for more bodies on the board which means more immos and I think we all know how I feel on immos with the new dex

No weapon upgrades at all?

 Crimson wrote:

 A GumyBear wrote:
I like taking her with the book since its cheap and being a cheap hq makes it better and allows for more bodies on the board which means more immos and I think we all know how I feel on immos with the new dex

No weapon upgrades at all?

For my 2,000 point list I swapped out celestine for a normal cannoness so i could squeeze in a squad of 10 celestians.

There wasn't room for more equipment so I had to leave it be.

I'm not incredibly sold on any of the relics anyway especially not a priest who I won't use and everyone who can use it is T3, and what's EW going to matter to a unit shooting at a T3 model with only 3 wounds anyway. Buckets of S6 everywhere

 Crimson wrote:

 A GumyBear wrote:
I like taking her with the book since its cheap and being a cheap hq makes it better and allows for more bodies on the board which means more immos and I think we all know how I feel on immos with the new dex

No weapon upgrades at all?

I take mine with just a Boltgun and the book. It's worked really well so far.

The Canoness and the other single model HQ are not good. Why spend points on something not good, when you can invest points elsewhere?

Keeping the silly bint nice and cheap is a must, IMO.

Puscifer wrote:

I take mine with just a Boltgun and the book. It's worked really well so far.

The Canoness and the other single model HQ are not good. Why spend points on something not good, when you can invest points elsewhere?

I understand the logic of it, seems just, you know, kinda boring. I like making characters... characterful.

Not a lot of wargear doesn't mean they aren't characterful. She's Canoness Serenia, reader of hymns and bringer of redemption through the power of the Emperor's Faith (and mass-reactive gyro-bolts).