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Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

I'd probably give mine a blade of admonition (so I can use a model I converted for blessed weapons in 3e) and put her in a command squad of power weapon wielding celestians.

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
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UK

Does noone feel genuine embarrassment just for fielding Sisters Repentia?

Anyway, what use do Sisters have as an allied detachment? I've got a few that I bought years ago purely because I liked the models.

And yes, I bought some of *cough* them *cough*.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/20 22:32:28


 
   
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

 Crimson wrote:
Puscifer wrote:

I take mine with just a Boltgun and the book. It's worked really well so far.

The Canoness and the other single model HQ are not good. Why spend points on something not good, when you can invest points elsewhere?

I understand the logic of it, seems just, you know, kinda boring. I like making characters... characterful.


Mine is...

Beware... Fluff...

Spoiler:

The Order of the Iron Lady is a fairly new order, formed during the later years of the last century. As soon as the Order was created, it's Sisters were sent on a First Pilgrimage from Terra to Ophelia VII, but they never reached the final stop on their journey. With their ships lost in the Warp during a freak storm, the Order found themselves on the edge of the Galaxy deep within the area known as the Ghoul Stars.

Upon reaching this hazardous area of space, the Order were ambushed by a massive fleet of Chaos Warships of the Black Legion. With their numbers dwindled, the Order were forced to land on the Night World of Arbor XII - a desolate Deathworld with no sunlight and dangerous beasts that hunted both the Black Legion and the Order.

During the seventy-four day conflict, Canoness Superior Ardat Arkashi, the last of the command staff was murdered on the field of battle by Mortius Krux, a Lord of the Black Legion. While the blood was still warm from her wounds and Lord Krux roared in victory, a single Acolyte of the Sisterhood, Sister Hilda, stood in front of the huge fallen Astartes and challenged him. Sister Hilda, a fresh recruit, was the attendant for the Canoness and was not schooled in the arts of combat. She took the sword of her fallen leader and stood firm against Krux.

While he dismissed the challenger as unworthy, Krux ordered one of his lieutenants to cut the upstart down. The fallen Astartes provoked Hilda and feigned attacks against her as he thought that his next victim was hardly worth the glory for the Chaos Gods. Hilda stood firm, closed her eyes and quietly uttered prayers to the Emperor. The Black Legionnaire, looked on in amusement and as he went to feign another attack against Hilda, she made a stunning riposte and cut off the Astartes' head. Shocked by the move by this mere human girl, Krux ordered his retinue to kill Hilda, but one by one each member of the Retinue was cut down, all while Hilda uttered prayers to the Emperor, her eyes firmly closed.

When Krux was the only Chaos Marine left, he attacked with the fervour and ferocity of his patron, Khorne. His savagery and sheer brute force was too powerful for Hilda and he disarmed her with a flick of his axe. He then swatted Hilda away as if a human would swat away a fly. He stalked her as she attempted to crawl away on her belly and then reached down to grab her by the throat. He took her tiny head in his hands and slowly pushed through her left eye into the pit of her skull, but as Krux did this, Hilda did not scream. He threw her aside like a piece of meat and carried on with the battle.

Hilda crawled her way over to her book and the ornate Boltgun of her fallen Canoness. Exhausted, battered and weary, Hilda read the psalm that the book was open to. She shakily took aim with the Boltgun and while she uttered the words, she pulled the trigger. The shot pinged off the side of Krux's horned helm, angering him to the point of blind rage. He lifted his axe and slowly stepped towards the fallen Sister. Hilda kept repeating the words of the psalm and fired again and again, each shot hitting the giant Chaos Marine, but not causing any real damage.

Then as the Chaos Lord was about to bring down his axe upon the fallen Sister, a bright light shone. It blinded Krux with it's brilliance and he stumbled away from Hilda as he covered his eyes from the blinding light. Even his enhanced vision and helm couldn't shield him from the light's intensity.

Hilda, seeing the Chaos Lord had faltered, picked up a Power Maul and proceeded to smash it repeatedly into Krux. Krux was weakened. Each blow caused him great pain and as Hilda's unrelenting attacks continued, her prayers and psalms only got louder and more fervent. As Krux fell to his knees, Hilda struck his helm with the Maul, sending it flying to the dirt.

Exhausted, Hilda picked up the Boltgun and as she commended her prayer to the Emperor, she pressed the barrel of the Boltgun against the Traitor Lord's head and pulled the trigger.

The act of a single young Sister, won the day for her Order.


The Space Marines of the Death Spectres Chapter, arrived and formed a relief detail to rescue and recover the Sisters that were still alive. Hilda, was deemed to have been touched by the Light of the Emperor and that it was the Emperor who saved her and what was left of the Order.

Cardinal Argus Thade declared that Hilda was a beacon of the Emperor's Holy Light and was promoted to Canoness of the remnants of the Order of the Iron Lady, taking the name Hilda Tarth. When given the choice of returning to Terra to start their pilgrimage again, Hilda decided that the remaining Sisters would form a Mission and that they would start their pilgrimage again from Arbor XII.

With just a single ship and no more than a hundred Sisters, the Order of the Iron Lady started their journey. Along the way, Hilda Tarth became a well schooled tactician and warrior, but what she lacked in experience and combat prowess, she more than made up for in the strength of her faith. Something that every member of her Mission has fallen back to in times of great need.


Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
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Preacher of the Emperor






Good ways to equip a command squad? Very eager to take one of these, but will probably need quite a bit of converting done, so it'd be nice to have a clearer idea of what to do beforehand. I'm thinking that lots of combi weapons or power weapons would be very fun, but what'll be most effective?

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USA

 Troike wrote:
Good ways to equip a command squad? Very eager to take one of these, but will probably need quite a bit of converting done, so it'd be nice to have a clearer idea of what to do beforehand. I'm thinking that lots of combi weapons or power weapons would be very fun, but what'll be most effective?
Depends on what you want to do with them.

I mean hell, if you have a lot of marines in your meta, you could even try equipping them with combiplasmas!

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

 Troike wrote:
Good ways to equip a command squad? Very eager to take one of these, but will probably need quite a bit of converting done, so it'd be nice to have a clearer idea of what to do beforehand. I'm thinking that lots of combi weapons or power weapons would be very fun, but what'll be most effective?


I've gone with this: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/558787.page

I'm 4-0 with this list so far and I'm very happy with it's composition.

Things to remember...

The Canoness and most other HQ in this army are bad. Best way to combat this is to take them lean and save points for other stuff.
Canoness usually die horribly in CC. I chose to keep mine at the back in a HB Command Squad. Between this unit and the Exorcists, they won me a very one sided victory vs Tau.
Multi Meltas on anything except an Immolator, are bad. It's a wasted turn if you are having to move. Either HF or HB are my weapon of choice here, but as my army already has a ton of Flamers per squad, I went for the long range HB option.

Can't wait to try these guys vs Guard/Orks/Nids.

Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
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Some Tomb World in some galaxy by that one thing in that one place (or Minnesota for nosy people)

 Troike wrote:
Good ways to equip a command squad? Very eager to take one of these, but will probably need quite a bit of converting done, so it'd be nice to have a clearer idea of what to do beforehand. I'm thinking that lots of combi weapons or power weapons would be very fun, but what'll be most effective?


I personally like the EZ-bake oven where you just fill them with heavy flamers since heavy flamers are great and make tau very crispy from one round of shooting

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/20 23:45:55


"Put your 1st best against you opponents 2nd best, your 2nd best against their 3rd best, and your 3rd best against their 1st best"-Sun Tzu's Art of War

"If your not winning, try a bigger sword! Usually works..."

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Northampton

My only concern with the EZ bake squad is getting there.

Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
Made in se
Regular Dakkanaut



Sweden

Stormfather - I just came to the same conclusion you had about GW actually not knowing their own rules when it comes to Command Squad and Repentias. Why give a unit Move through cover in a prayer that can not be used in the movement phase but only be used in the assault phase? And according to the Special rules, Move through cover doesn't affect charge ranges. Or if we are to follow the RAW on page 18 not be used at all since we are to use the Act before rolling to hit. The same goes for Repentias... I posted in the YMDC to get other peoples opinion on this since I am taking my Sisters out to a tournament next week and I will actually field Repentias (and a Penitent since I am being a power gamer) and would really wish that I am not the only one who hopes that RAI (and a FAQ sometime late 2016) will say that we can make the units play the way they obviously should and not the way they are actually written...

Has anyone else found anything else that is broken, rules wise, when it comes to Acts of Faith?

Agusto

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/21 00:34:02


 
   
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USA

God I just want to slam the face of anyone who says "EZ Bake Oven" in to a wall somewhere. Not because I hate the tactic, but because I hate the unfortunate implications of the phrase.


But that aside, given the army's focus on shooting, I still think the command squad works best as a countercharge unit.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/21 01:17:03


The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in au
Sister Vastly Superior






 Melissia wrote:
God I just want to slam the face of anyone who says "EZ Bake Oven" in to a wall somewhere. Not because I hate the tactic, but because I hate the unfortunate implications of the phrase.


But that aside, given the army's focus on shooting, I still think the command squad works best as a countercharge unit.


I prefer the term Hotboxing.

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 Melissia wrote:
God I just want to slam the face of anyone who says "EZ Bake Oven" in to a wall somewhere. Not because I hate the tactic, but because I hate the unfortunate implications of the phrase.
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can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. 
   
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Camas, WA

It's been easy bake oven for 10+ years. I think I'll stick with it.

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Agusto wrote:
Stormfather - I just came to the same conclusion you had about GW actually not knowing their own rules when it comes to Command Squad and Repentias. Why give a unit Move through cover in a prayer that can not be used in the movement phase but only be used in the assault phase? And according to the Special rules, Move through cover doesn't affect charge ranges. Or if we are to follow the RAW on page 18 not be used at all since we are to use the Act before rolling to hit. The same goes for Repentias... I posted in the YMDC to get other peoples opinion on this since I am taking my Sisters out to a tournament next week and I will actually field Repentias (and a Penitent since I am being a power gamer) and would really wish that I am not the only one who hopes that RAI (and a FAQ sometime late 2016) will say that we can make the units play the way they obviously should and not the way they are actually written...

Has anyone else found anything else that is broken, rules wise, when it comes to Acts of Faith?

Agusto


"Or if we are to follow the RAW on page 18 not be used at all since we are to use the Act before rolling to hit"

I saw someone else comment on this as well. There is nothing broken about the EC AoF. People are interpreting id est as a limitation, it is not, it is a clarification, a restatement, etc.

AoF
"A unit with the Act of Faith special rule can attempt to use its Act of Faith immediately before it acts during a phase; i.e..."

The i.e. goes on to provide examples, not limitations. You are not restricted to ONLY use the AoF "immediately before ... strikes blows in the Assault phase..." That is an example of when to use AoF

If you misinterpret the i.e. the only CC AoF that works is the Repentia one. Clearly this is not the case.

"Why give a unit Move through cover in a prayer that can not be used in the movement phase but only be used in the assault phase? And according to the Special rules, Move through cover doesn't affect charge ranges."

EC
"This Act of Faith can be used in your Assault phase..."

This is all you need to know about this AoF, it can be used in your assault phase. At the start of your assault phase, before you declare a charge. While MtC is more useful in the movement phase it is still uuseful in the assault phase. It means your unit does not have to take Dangerous Terrain tests on the changes (like when they have to charge through the smoking wreckage of their own AV11 Immolator or your opponents Wave Serpent). You are correct in that it has no impact on the assault distance, but this is why the unit also gains Fleet!

So, you can have a unit of 5 Power Axe wielding Celestians which get better than average charge distance, don't lose models from charging through smoking wreckage, re-roll armor saves (because you added a priest or two with an Eviscerator right!) with 4 A on the charge, re-rolling to hit (remember those priests), re-rolling to wound their S5 AP2 powerweapons (cause you added a second priest right!) who are Fearless, who will win most combats and then they get to run down their enemy with a Sweeping Advance with 4 (cause you put a Cannonness in this unit right!) + d6 +d3.

Don't get me wrong, this is not the best unit available to us as it is fragile to shooting, pricey, etc, but if you can get it into combat it will do OK against most things. 20 Hounds, maybe not, but other things...
   
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

I think the biggest issue with the above is that AS are bad in CC.

I see this army as a mid to close range shooty army that needs to be able to Alpha Strike.

They have good maneuverability and have fair survivability when compared to other shooty armies like Tau and Dark Eldar.

On the subject of Dark Eldar, I'm playing my AS army like I did my Haemy Coven DE - MSU with lots of flamer weapons on a hard hitting anti armour platform (SSB in Immolator) with harder hitting anti vehicle back up (Dominions and Exorcists).

Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
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I think the counter to CC armies is going to end up being a wall of sisters with a priest in there. As long as there aren't any AP 3 or better CC weapons, 20 sisters should require 180 wounds to put down as long as you keep passing war hymn checks. (rerollabe 3+ is 1/9 wounding hits actually creates a casualty).

Any word on Arco-flaggellant spam? Even as an ally force, you could take 60 Arcos for 600 points plus priest costs. Even at I3, they get 5 str 5 attacks on the charge and are only 10 points each.
   
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Some Tomb World in some galaxy by that one thing in that one place (or Minnesota for nosy people)

I haven't heard anything on arco spam. They probably won't work since they lack any reliably fast way to get into ccbecause rhinos/immos aren't assault vehicles which means a t3 charge at best and that's if they don't get shot up before hand and survive overwatch

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/21 12:29:45


"Put your 1st best against you opponents 2nd best, your 2nd best against their 3rd best, and your 3rd best against their 1st best"-Sun Tzu's Art of War

"If your not winning, try a bigger sword! Usually works..."

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Regular Dakkanaut




Right. Even 60 of them won't really hold up long to serpent spam which stands a real chance of gunning down all 60 of them in a turn... They average 10 shots per tank and with it all TL they hit with pretty much everything. No FNP for you when it's str 6+...

However, against everything else that's a 60 man wall that you have to deal with. I guess Ork boyz just do the job better... Oh well.
   
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Pyrrhus of Epirus wrote:
The i.e. goes on to provide examples, not limitations. You are not restricted to ONLY use the AoF "immediately before ... strikes blows in the Assault phase..." That is an example of when to use AoF

Incorrect. You, like most people, are making the mistake of confusing i.e. with e.g..

I.E. translates to "in other words", it is used to provide an exhaustive list.

E.G. translates roughly to "for example", and is used to provide non-exhaustive lists.

So when the codex says "i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the shooting phase, or strikes blows in the Assault phase", it means those three exact times.

Do I think that's Rules as Intended? No. Is it Rules as Written? Yes.
   
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I played Speed Freak Orks last night vs Immolator Spam / Battle Conclave spam and tabled him turn 3, 2000 pts, I lost 8 sisters, 2 arcos and 3 Immolators. He did have 20 Storm Boys and 5 koptas in reserve that never made the table, which helped.

A 5 man Arco Squad with 1 DCA would get charged by 12 boyz and wipe them before they swung. Trick is to hide them behind the transports and run the transports in groups of 2.

Even with Night Fighting and a CFF all of his vehicles were down turn 2 (which isn't saying much against Orks). 3 sets of Arcos, 3 sets of troops and one Seraphim squad finished off all those boyz that were now in the open.

Would this have done as well against Tau or Eldar, no, I would lose 2-4 Immolators a turn and the scouting Dominions with melta probably do not get to do anything all game, but it was fun to play and I finally got to field the 20 arcos I have had since the WH days.

Only got 2 AoF off all game and those both required LH. So I recommend that upgrade on about 1/3 of your Immolators. SI is pointless on the Doms as they are dead before they get to shoot again, but it was useful on the 15 man BSS sitting on a quad gun.

Never got to see Priests in action as they were with my troops and my troops were never assaulted.
   
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Did a 1850 pts battle against my brother.

A battle conclave with 2 priests is pretty brutal. Re-rolling 3+ invulnerables.. Makes you feel like a deathstar.

Only problem is getting them into combat.

3 Exorcists, 3 dominions with 4 melta+combi-melta. Took down stuff ranging from flyers (Stormtalons) to infantry (Centurions) with ease.

My small 5-man sister troop squads kept hiding as much as possible.. I don't think I'll run 10-woman squads anymore but I might go try a 20-woman squad for laughs.

Sororitas Command Squad, had my Canonness and Uriah in it. Did win some combats against combat-squad tacticals but not very impressive.

I might go try Celestine + 2 Priests + Battle Conclave next time.

Blew most of my acts of faith in turn 1/2 ... Ignores Cover on Dominions makes a lot of stuff cry.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/21 13:47:45


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 streamdragon wrote:
Pyrrhus of Epirus wrote:
The i.e. goes on to provide examples, not limitations. You are not restricted to ONLY use the AoF "immediately before ... strikes blows in the Assault phase..." That is an example of when to use AoF

Incorrect. You, like most people, are making the mistake of confusing i.e. with e.g..

I.E. translates to "in other words", it is used to provide an exhaustive list.

E.G. translates roughly to "for example", and is used to provide non-exhaustive lists.

So when the codex says "i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the shooting phase, or strikes blows in the Assault phase", it means those three exact times.

Do I think that's Rules as Intended? No. Is it Rules as Written? Yes.


I will respectfully disagree. Id Est translats as "that is." I taught Latin after uni for a few years, I didn't google "i.e." and get 5 answers, 4 of which were wrong. I.E. provides clarification, nothing more. That is how it has been used for about 1600 years in texts. It is not an exhaustive list, just a clarification. Remember that the old school GW guys were all ex-Catholic school boys, they know their Latin, there are countless examples in GW lore where they make decent attempts at new Latin words with plausible declinations.

The rules says to use the AoF immediately before you act... And then provides clarification. For the movement and shooting phases there is really only so much you have the option of doing, so it appears to be an exhaustive list. But in the Assault phase you have sub-phases. You use the AoF immediately before you act in the appropriately part of that phase.

Exempli Gratia is for example. But this is also not an exhaustive list of examples. Just some examples.

I am not sure why you are saying that one provides an exhaustive list and the other doesn't. Neither does, they are both merely used to provide clarification, one through restatement and one by examples.
   
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Sweden

Am I the only one who thinks that Cruddace has somehow missed the introduction of 6th ED? The list he has written, even though it keeps dwindling down in sheer number of units available everytime he touches a keyboard, would have made a pretty powerful 5th ED army! Imagine our new A.S: without any fliers around to bother us (hence no AA needed and thus non given to us) and with the ability to charge out of wehicles still there and working (hence the nice, but fragile, CC units we have). It would have been... better, to say the least.

Should anyone contact him just to make sure he knows that the rest of us (unfortunately) plays a different game than he does?

Agusto
   
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USA

Can we take the semantics debate to YMDC? I'd rather see people post their own tactics than discuss obnoxious grammatical points.

Agusto: It's possible that he just took an army from the 5th edition WD dex and adapted it to this dex without much thought.

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The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
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Regular Dakkanaut




Pyrrhus of Epirus wrote:
 streamdragon wrote:
Pyrrhus of Epirus wrote:
The i.e. goes on to provide examples, not limitations. You are not restricted to ONLY use the AoF "immediately before ... strikes blows in the Assault phase..." That is an example of when to use AoF

Incorrect. You, like most people, are making the mistake of confusing i.e. with e.g..

I.E. translates to "in other words", it is used to provide an exhaustive list.

E.G. translates roughly to "for example", and is used to provide non-exhaustive lists.

So when the codex says "i.e. immediately before the unit moves in the Movement phase, shoots (or runs) in the shooting phase, or strikes blows in the Assault phase", it means those three exact times.

Do I think that's Rules as Intended? No. Is it Rules as Written? Yes.


I will respectfully disagree. Id Est translats as "that is." I taught Latin after uni for a few years, I didn't google "i.e." and get 5 answers, 4 of which were wrong. I.E. provides clarification, nothing more. That is how it has been used for about 1600 years in texts. It is not an exhaustive list, just a clarification. Remember that the old school GW guys were all ex-Catholic school boys, they know their Latin, there are countless examples in GW lore where they make decent attempts at new Latin words with plausible declinations.

The rules says to use the AoF immediately before you act... And then provides clarification. For the movement and shooting phases there is really only so much you have the option of doing, so it appears to be an exhaustive list. But in the Assault phase you have sub-phases. You use the AoF immediately before you act in the appropriately part of that phase.

Exempli Gratia is for example. But this is also not an exhaustive list of examples. Just some examples.

I am not sure why you are saying that one provides an exhaustive list and the other doesn't. Neither does, they are both merely used to provide clarification, one through restatement and one by examples.


In english, "that is" and "in other words" mean the same thing. If we were to edit Streamdragon's post to swap those two phrases it would change nothing about his argument. You're the one who said they're providing examples not limitations. If they know their latin so well certainly they would have used e.g. in that circumstance, right?

Anyway this also probably should go to a YMDC thread.
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






Quick question ... can I take Uriah with twenty sisters, five priests added to battle conclaves ( maybe two large ones - how many can you have in each?) maybe three exorcits and two HB immos with repentia and have a feasible small list? Is all that legal now. I know Arcos are cheaper by 30% so that's a start. Even two large sisters squads only with priests would be a pita to remove I would think?

 
   
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Camas, WA

 felixcat wrote:

Quick question ... can I take Uriah with twenty sisters, five priests added to battle conclaves ( maybe two large ones - how many can you have in each?) maybe three exorcits and two HB immos with repentia and have a feasible small list? Is all that legal now. I know Arcos are cheaper by 30% so that's a start. Even two large sisters squads only with priests would be a pita to remove I would think?


Uriah - 100
2x 20 Sisters ~ 280 or so
5 Priest - 250
Battle Conclaves (10 each) - 100 each
3 Exorcists - 375
Repentia with Immos - 145 or so ea

That should give you an idea.

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disadvantage of blob units is that you spent so many points on a unit that can only target one enemy unit
   
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As an aside, for anyone who is having difficulty with layout of the new epub, I found the following to be really helpful:

http://www.adobe.com/products/digital-editions/download.html

Cleanest view so far.

Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
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