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AlmightyWalrus wrote: And now we've seriously got the argument that a nation founded on the ideas of liberty and freedom from persecution requires people to confirm to the majority, otherwise they're being racist. The Off-Topic forum never ceases to amaze me.
Citizens of the USA live in a society, therefore they live under the auspices of commonly accepted and held values and beliefs. We certainly don't live in anarchy. If we didn't all mostly agree on basic common principles then we wouldn't have the functioning society that we currently enjoy.
Do you consider an IRS audit to be a serious federal investigation? I do. So she's not even the only current candidate under a serious federal investigation.
An audit is not a criminal investigation.
Oh and in regards to who's an American, I'll just note cat lovers aren't even real people, much less citizens. You know they are hollow inside right? Thats what Rodney tells me.
All whembley said was "serious federal investigation".
Thanks fore the clarification. Then to be further clear, HRC is under criminal investigation by the FBI. Those boys don't play.
Yup. Not a "security review" that the Clintonistas tried to spin. The FBI don't waste their time.
From what I understand, the FBI has not publicly identified which if any federal statute Clinton is being investigated for violating... meaning that, at least right now, cannot be considered a "criminal investigation." Of course, it should also be noted that the FBI has no legal obligation to identify any federal statute that might have been violated.
whembly wrote: Yup. Not a "security review" that the Clintonistas tried to spin. The FBI don't waste their time.
Not according to the government attorneys most recent court filing.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:20:43
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
AlmightyWalrus wrote: And now we've seriously got the argument that a nation founded on the ideas of liberty and freedom from persecution requires people to confirm to the majority, otherwise they're being racist. The Off-Topic forum never ceases to amaze me.
Citizens of the USA live in a society, therefore they live under the auspices of commonly accepted and held values and beliefs. We certainly don't live in anarchy. If we didn't all mostly agree on basic common principles then we wouldn't have the functioning society that we currently enjoy.
True, but that does not mean total cultural conformation. One can be very different culturally from a countryman and still follow all the laws of one's country.
For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back.
AlmightyWalrus wrote: And now we've seriously got the argument that a nation founded on the ideas of liberty and freedom from persecution requires people to confirm to the majority, otherwise they're being racist. The Off-Topic forum never ceases to amaze me.
Citizens of the USA live in a society, therefore they live under the auspices of commonly accepted and held values and beliefs. We certainly don't live in anarchy. If we didn't all mostly agree on basic common principles then we wouldn't have the functioning society that we currently enjoy.
True, but that does not mean total cultural conformation. One can be very different culturally from a countryman and still follow all the laws of one's country.
True and the widespread acceptance of that truth in the USA sets us apart from a lot of other countries. We can all be different people but we're the same in that we believe in the same rules and values for society so we can peacefully and productively coexist.
jasper76 wrote: @ Preston Jon: IMO, any effort to suppress the civil rights of a minority group is to brand them as second class citizens...in other words, not full citizens.
@Asterios: Do you know why Trump was selected for auditing? I don't. Because the IRS performs many audits does not mean that any one of those audits is "not serious".
@whembley: yep, tax evasion and insecure IT setups are both bad. I don't expect everyone to be an IT expert...I do expect everyone to pay the taxes they owe.
Why was I audited? they never told me except it was random, hell a case could be made that Trump's audit is political in nature? wouldn't be the first time the IRS was influenced by politics (hint hint the tea party deal), so the fact you would compare an audit to what Clinton is going thru is just showing you are desperate for anything against Trump while deflecting off of Clinton.
Thinks Palladium books screwed the pooch on the Robotech project.
From what I understand, the FBI has not publicly identified which if any federal statute Clinton is being investigated for violating... meaning that, at least right now, cannot be considered a "criminal investigation." Of course, it should also be noted that the FBI has no legal obligation to identify any federal statute that might have been violated.
whembly wrote: Yup. Not a "security review" that the Clintonistas tried to spin. The FBI don't waste their time.
Not according to the government attorneys most recent court filing.
BS. The FBI investigates crimes, not civil actions.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Frazzled wrote: BS. The FBI investigates crimes, not civil actions.
They investigate alleged criminal activity and also function as a part of the United States national security apparatus as a domestic intelligence agency.
This isn't the 1930s and they don't just hunt rum-runners and mobsters; their mission is incredibly varied and pretty damn broad.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:42:19
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
@Asterios: I didn't really compare the two, except that both constitute "serious federal investigations", which was not even my own choice of words.
I don't really need to search far to find things wrong with Trump. The guy has more red flags than a Chinese parade. And I don't support Clinton at present. My humble endorsement, for what it's worth, goes to Bernie Sanders.
All this to say, please don't assume you understand my motives.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:40:25
whembly wrote: Yup. Not a "security review" that the Clintonistas tried to spin. The FBI don't waste their time.
Not according to the government attorneys most recent court filing.
You might want to read that again...
The DoJ requested permission for the FBI to enter a secret declaration that the agency could not find records responsive to a FOIA demand from VICE regarding HRC’s email server.
As such, it is the DoJ who argues that the FBI isn’t just doing a “security review,” but is in fact collecting records for the purpose of enforcing the law And because this is an active investigation, the FBI/DoJ is given leeway to not provide any response to an FOIA request.
Duh.
Besides, the FBI director is on record in stated that the FBI doesn't "do" security review. Don't get snooker'ed into the Clinton spin machine.
To recap: The DoJ, honest to god, acknowledges in that scribd doc that the FBI is conducting a law enforcement action, in addtion to a counterintelligence assessment.
Another interesting thing to note: this is the SECOND request by the FBI to seek a "declaration secret" in a civil FOIA case... seems to me that the FBI investigators are dotting their "i" and "t" in this regard.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:42:10
jasper76 wrote: @Asterios: I didn't really compare the two, except that both constitute "serious federal investigations", which was not even my own choice of words.
I don't really need to search far to find things wrong with Trump. The guy has more red flags than a Chinese parade. And I don't support Clinton at present. My humble endorsement, for what it's worth, goes to Bernie Sanders.
All this to say, please don't assume you understand my motives.
no but you insinuate an IRS audit is a serious investigation when it is not, there is a 1 in 116 chance of being audited on your tax return, does that sound like it is something severe? hell i've been audited twice and both times got even more money back from the Government.
Thinks Palladium books screwed the pooch on the Robotech project.
I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:53:11
Frazzled wrote: BS. The FBI investigates crimes, not civil actions.
They investigate alleged criminal activity and also function as a part of the United States national security apparatus as a domestic intelligence agency.
This isn't the 1930s and they don't just hunt rum-runners and mobsters; their mission is incredibly varied and pretty damn broad.
No gak. However their investigations are only criminal. They do not investigate civil actions. They have given criminal immunity to at least one witness at this point.
The Justice Department has granted immunity to a former State Department staffer, who worked on Hillary Clinton’s private email server, as part of a criminal investigation into the possible mishandling of classified information, according to a senior law enforcement official.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
Now I think we will both acknowledge, that, while the IRS audit may not be criminal, it could lead to both massive penalties and referral for actual criminal charges. (crosses fingers...)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/07 20:54:13
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Frazzled wrote: BS. The FBI investigates crimes, not civil actions.
They investigate alleged criminal activity and also function as a part of the United States national security apparatus as a domestic intelligence agency.
This isn't the 1930s and they don't just hunt rum-runners and mobsters; their mission is incredibly varied and pretty damn broad.
No gak. However their investigations are only criminal. They do not investigate civil actions. They have given criminal immunity to at least one witness at this point.
Their investigations can be both security-related or criminal (or both).
Regardless, the FBI is currently investigation Clinton but has not named any federal statute that she is accused of violating (because they don't have to). I know to some people, coughcough::Whembly::cough, an investigation equals guilt but we'll have to wait and see. We won't know if it's criminal until they get to the end of it.
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
They don't have to name what they are investigating her on until (and if) they charge her.
Please show me what civil action the FBI has ever investigated.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Frazzled wrote: They don't have to name what they are investigating her on until (and if) they charge her.
Please show me what civil action the FBI has ever investigated.
Didn't the FBI nail Capone on taxes?
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
jasper76 wrote: @ Preston Jon: IMO, any effort to suppress the civil rights of a minority group is to brand them as second class citizens...in other words, not full citizens.
@Asterios: Do you know why Trump was selected for auditing? I don't. Because the IRS performs many audits does not mean that any one of those audits is "not serious".
@whembley: yep, tax evasion and insecure IT setups are both bad. I don't expect everyone to be an IT expert...I do expect everyone to pay the taxes they owe.
Why was I audited? they never told me except it was random, hell a case could be made that Trump's audit is political in nature? wouldn't be the first time the IRS was influenced by politics (hint hint the tea party deal), so the fact you would compare an audit to what Clinton is going thru is just showing you are desperate for anything against Trump while deflecting off of Clinton.
Initially he could have been selected for an audit at random, or there could have been figures on his return that threw up red flags that automatically generate an audit, same with specific credits, some will automatically refer a return for further review, then moved forward for audit.
Asterios wrote:
jasper76 wrote: @Asterios: I didn't really compare the two, except that both constitute "serious federal investigations", which was not even my own choice of words.
I don't really need to search far to find things wrong with Trump. The guy has more red flags than a Chinese parade. And I don't support Clinton at present. My humble endorsement, for what it's worth, goes to Bernie Sanders.
All this to say, please don't assume you understand my motives.
no but you insinuate an IRS audit is a serious investigation when it is not, there is a 1 in 116 chance of being audited on your tax return, does that sound like it is something severe? hell i've been audited twice and both times got even more money back from the Government.
That happens, it means you are claiming things on your return that you can easily back up and support. Obviously with a return such as Donald Trump's, its a bit more complicated, but trying to jump through tax loopholes and bending the word of our overly complicated tax laws to your benefit can make things take longer when you have to justify the numbers on your return.
jasper76 wrote:I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
See above for reason he may have been audited. There isn't a spot on a 1040 where you declare your political affiliation, and while his initial return may have been audited due to a red flag (or randomly, who knows?) the subsequent returns could have been pulled for auditing because he was a high risk at that point due to the information found in his initial audit. To bring it down to a relatable level, if you are audited for the Earned Income Credit, and are denied that credit, you face greater scrutiny in subsequent years filings when you claim the Earned Income Credit.
Frazzled wrote: BS. The FBI investigates crimes, not civil actions.
They investigate alleged criminal activity and also function as a part of the United States national security apparatus as a domestic intelligence agency.
This isn't the 1930s and they don't just hunt rum-runners and mobsters; their mission is incredibly varied and pretty damn broad.
No gak. However their investigations are only criminal. They do not investigate civil actions. They have given criminal immunity to at least one witness at this point.
The Justice Department has granted immunity to a former State Department staffer, who worked on Hillary Clinton’s private email server, as part of a criminal investigation into the possible mishandling of classified information, according to a senior law enforcement official.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
Now I think we will both acknowledge, that, while the IRS audit may not be criminal, it could lead to both massive penalties and referral for actual criminal charges. (crosses fingers...)
If there is an issue found in an audit that could lead to a criminal charge, such as fraud or ID theft, the IRS will refer the case to its Criminal Investigation Unit, who works with Law Enforcement to gather evidence and prosecute. At the same time, penalties can be levied against whoever this is taking place against in the court proceedings, but the judge of the case will usually determine if the IRS will be awarded these penalties (all court cases differ, but this is generally how things are). IRS will often work alongside the local authorities, and in some cases FBI/DEA/other alphabet agencies to bring about prosecution, but can also go after the person directly.
feeder wrote:
Frazzled wrote: They don't have to name what they are investigating her on until (and if) they charge her.
Please show me what civil action the FBI has ever investigated.
Didn't the FBI nail Capone on taxes?
IRS nailed Capone, they investigated for tax evasion (which is a criminal offense) and gathered evidence over 3 years, tracking his money and where he spent it.
FYI: I work for the IRS, in collections, and see audits every day. I do understand how these things work, and hearing things like: "My last 8 years of tax returns are being audited so I cant release them" throws up red flags for me. I am not attempting to use an "appeal to authority" fallacy here, I am simply sharing my view on how things work as I see them every day.
Considering that Trump keeps on getting the Star credit in New York (A credit for people that earn less than $500k) it's not surprising to me that he keeps on getting audited.
With how much he lies about everything, it wouldn't surprise me if he was lying on his taxes.
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
well according to the IRS 10% of those making a million or more were audited in 2015, so odds not in his favor
so I find it funny how some people here say Trump supporters are fools for listening to Trump and here you are taking him for his word, and funny thing is even though i'm gonna vote for trump I take his word with a grain of salt and then some.
I think that proves you wrong, and only took me 10 seconds to find that article.
IRS nailed Capone, they investigated for tax evasion (which is a criminal offense) and gathered evidence over 3 years, tracking his money and where he spent it.
and here I've been told all this time it was the Treasury Department who busted Capone, especially since they were the ones charged with bringing him down.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 22:35:35
Thinks Palladium books screwed the pooch on the Robotech project.
d-usa wrote: There is no such thing as a cohesive "American" culture. The closest thing we have to an American culture is the fact that we are made up of many individual cultures.
I am also pretty sure we just had this conversation a month or so back. I'm pretty sure we have it at least every other month.
American culture is the widespread acceptance of a set of social values and legal concepts under the auspices of which we have created a specific nation that protects these values and concepts. There are many nations on earth that don't hold he same values and legal concepts and that is the appeal that inspires people to immigrate to become American to enjoy living in our unique environment. In most countries it is much harder to be accepted as being an equal citizen regardless of your background than it is in America. We live in a huge country full of people that look different, talk different, act different, etc. but the vast majority of us accept our fellow citizens as being just as American as ourselves regardless of those differences.
But none of that is really affected by having subsets of cultures or identifying as Irish American, Asian American, African American, or any other cultural affiliation.
skyth wrote: Considering that Trump keeps on getting the Star credit in New York (A credit for people that earn less than $500k) it's not surprising to me that he keeps on getting audited.
With how much he lies about everything, it wouldn't surprise me if he was lying on his taxes.
This is a State of New York Credit, IRS has nothing to do with it. Federal and State completely separate, although if his state return is being audited by the state and there are discrepancies they may let us know. Edit: What it does do though is give a general perception that his accountants may be jumping through loopholes to get lower tax rates, thereby making it a little easier to believe that he is often audited and that the issues may be that much more complicated.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/07 22:35:36
d-usa wrote: There is no such thing as a cohesive "American" culture. The closest thing we have to an American culture is the fact that we are made up of many individual cultures.
I am also pretty sure we just had this conversation a month or so back. I'm pretty sure we have it at least every other month.
American culture is the widespread acceptance of a set of social values and legal concepts under the auspices of which we have created a specific nation that protects these values and concepts. There are many nations on earth that don't hold he same values and legal concepts and that is the appeal that inspires people to immigrate to become American to enjoy living in our unique environment. In most countries it is much harder to be accepted as being an equal citizen regardless of your background than it is in America. We live in a huge country full of people that look different, talk different, act different, etc. but the vast majority of us accept our fellow citizens as being just as American as ourselves regardless of those differences.
But none of that is really affected by having subsets of cultures or identifying as Irish American, Asian American, African American, or any other cultural affiliation.
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
well according to the IRS 10% of those making a million or more were audited in 2015, so odds not in his favor
so I find it funny how some people here say Trump supporters are fools for listening to Trump and here you are taking him for his word, and funny thing is even though i'm gonna vote for trump I take his word with a grain of salt and then some.
I think that proves you wrong, and only took me 10 seconds to find that article.
This issue wouldn't even be on my radar except that Trump refuses to release his tax records. That's a deal-breaker for me as a modern voter. Too suspicious. But then again I'd never be voting for someone like Trump in the first place.
Automatically Appended Next Post: On the subject of American culture, it's weird that proponents of American culture are denouncing identity politics, because a strong sense of ethnic identity has always been a pretty distinctive aspect of American culture.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 22:48:39
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
well according to the IRS 10% of those making a million or more were audited in 2015, so odds not in his favor
so I find it funny how some people here say Trump supporters are fools for listening to Trump and here you are taking him for his word, and funny thing is even though i'm gonna vote for trump I take his word with a grain of salt and then some.
I think that proves you wrong, and only took me 10 seconds to find that article.
This issue wouldn't even be on my radar except that Trump refuses to release his tax records. That's a deal-breaker for me as a modern voter. Too suspicious. But then again I'd never be voting for someone like Trump in the first place.
too be honest I never got into the whole releasing of tax records, seriously what do they prove? nothing, they are no major revelation, no ah ha moment, no nothing and those who take tax records into consideration should really consider what they stand for.
Thinks Palladium books screwed the pooch on the Robotech project.
All candidates for our highest office should be beyond reproach when it comes to their taxes. IMO, anyone who aspires to elected office should make their tax records public.
If you don't agree, that's fine and all. I just have higher standards I guess.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 22:55:06
jasper76 wrote: All candidates for our highest office should be beyond reproach when it comes to their taxes. IMO, anyone who aspires to elected office should make their tax records public.
If you don't agree, that's fine and all. I just have higher standards I guess.
but why would their tax returns matter? what will they prove? what will they mean? seriously why does anyone care?
jasper76 wrote: I'll ask again, do you know why Donald Trump was selected to be audited? And do you know why he had been audited by the IRS every year for the past 14 years?
I do not, and he hinself has not been forthcoming on the subject, and has been behaving quite suspiciously by refusing to release his tax records.
If you know why he's being audited, please share the source, because I'm interested. Somehow I doubt his name was pulled out of a hat at random, but feel free to prove me wrong.
well according to the IRS 10% of those making a million or more were audited in 2015, so odds not in his favor
so I find it funny how some people here say Trump supporters are fools for listening to Trump and here you are taking him for his word, and funny thing is even though i'm gonna vote for trump I take his word with a grain of salt and then some.
I think that proves you wrong, and only took me 10 seconds to find that article.
This issue wouldn't even be on my radar except that Trump refuses to release his tax records. That's a deal-breaker for me as a modern voter. Too suspicious. But then again I'd never be voting for someone like Trump in the first place.
Automatically Appended Next Post: On the subject of American culture, it's weird that proponents of American culture are denouncing identity politics, because a strong sense of ethnic identity has always been a pretty distinctive aspect of American culture.
If I recall, there are several items the self described "transparent" Obama wouldn't release, such as his school records. It appears the pattern that candidates are prone to holding out on us.
This is true about the ethnic identity. I think we all know.know several people who claim to be from some American tribe or another, or people whose families have been in this country for generations who claim to be Scottish, Italian, French, or whatever.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/07 23:02:55
Well, I'll be voting in about an hour or so. What do I do, guys? I dislike both of the Democratic nominees, but I don't dislike either of them as much as I dislike the Republican ones.
Hillary will likely win the nomination, and likely will likely go on to win the presidency, but she's a TPP supporter her foreign policy ideas are gak and I'm not interested in America getting dragged into another "intervention".
I like all of Bernie's ideas from a moral perspective, but at best, if he became President 90% of what he wants to achieve will never, ever go anywhere while at worst, I'm not confident that he could beat the Republican opposition in the primary even if he did somehow clinch the Democratic nomination.
What do?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 23:04:49
I'd like to see college records. High school records seem kind of creepy. Obama got written up by Mr. Benkley for smoking a Marlboro behind a dumpster!?!? Lol
Automatically Appended Next Post:
BlaxicanX wrote: Well, I'll be voting in about an hour or so. What do I do, guys? I dislike both of the Democratic nominees, but I don't dislike either of them as much as I dislike the Republican ones.
Hillary will likely win the nomination, and likely will likely go on to win the presidency, but she's a TPP supporter her foreign policy ideas are gak and I'm not interested in America getting dragged into another "intervention".
I like all of Bernie's ideas from a moral perspective, but at best, if he became President 90% of what he wants to achieve will never, ever go anywhere while at worst, I'm not confident that he could beat the Republican opposition in the primary even if he did somehow clinch the Democratic nomination.
What do?
Vote for Bernie. It's more about the principles then his ability to achieve them. That's my 2 cents.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/07 23:09:12
BlaxicanX wrote: Well, I'll be voting in about an hour or so. What do I do, guys? I dislike both of the Democratic nominees, but I don't dislike either of them as much as I dislike the Republican ones.
Hillary will likely win the nomination, and likely will likely go on to win the presidency, but she's a TPP supporter her foreign policy ideas are gak and I'm not interested in America getting dragged into another "intervention".
I like all of Bernie's ideas from a moral perspective, but at best, if he became President 90% of what he wants to achieve will never, ever go anywhere while at worst, I'm not confident that he could beat the Republican opposition in the primary even if he did somehow clinch the Democratic nomination.
What do?
Vote for what you believe in. Ultimately it doesn't matter.
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
