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Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

(I hear and sympathize with your inevitable groan of dispair Warpsolution). Here is a Necromancer special:

Ra'kham Van Hel:
M-4
Ws-3
Bs-3
S-3
T-4
W-3
I-3
A-1
LD-9

Magic: Lv4 lore of Vampires
Equipment: The Bloodwolf Staff, Gorewolf Cloak, Lamian Ring
Special Rules: Undead, Loremaster, Master of the Dead

Bloodwolf Staff: +1 to casting attempts
Gorewolf Cloak: Grants a 4+ ward save
Lamian Ring: in any magic phase, the controlling player of Van Hel may choose to call upon the power of the Lamian ring, morphing his form into that of a hideous, humanoid batlike creature of gigantic proportions change Van Hel's profile permantly to:

The Hunted:
M-6
WS-5
BS-1
S-5
T-5
W-3
I-8
A-5
LD-8

(note: all equipment and magical abilities are lost in the transformation, when making the change Van Hel will not cause his army to take the tests that would be required for if he was slain, the new general becomes the nex highest level caster in the army if you have one. If the hunted dies from then on the army does not suffer any effects. If you have no other suitable wizards then your army must take the required tests. The change is irreversible)
Unit type: Monstrous Infantry
Equipment: Hand weapon
Special Rules: Undead, Frenzy, Poisoned Attacks 5+, Regeneration (5+), fly

Well there you have it, hopefully not too OP. Im thinking about 350-380 points let me know what you think and please feel free to make any improvements.



This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2013/03/12 20:13:46


 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins




WA, USA

Couple of questions:

1. In his human form he has 4 wounds, and his feral giant death beast form he has 3? Typo?

2. Does he lose his casting abilities with the transformation? If so, what if this guy is your general, does that have an influence?

3. What's the model type of the transformed thing? Monster? Infantry?

And a few critiques:

I don't know the VC codex well, but is T4 common amongst Necromancers? If not, drop it.

I feel that S5 and Poison 5+ are kind of redundant and the Poison is not contributing anything worthwhile to the unit.

I also feel that WS6 is too high. If this thing is a hulking, out of control monster, why is it as skilled as some of the best elite trained infantry in the game? I'd say WS4, or at a very, very big stretch WS5.

 Ouze wrote:

Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

 curran12 wrote:
Couple of questions:

1. In his human form he has 4 wounds, and his feral giant death beast form he has 3? Typo?

2. Does he lose his casting abilities with the transformation? If so, what if this guy is your general, does that have an influence?

3. What's the model type of the transformed thing? Monster? Infantry?

And a few critiques:

I don't know the VC codex well, but is T4 common amongst Necromancers? If not, drop it.

I feel that S5 and Poison 5+ are kind of redundant and the Poison is not contributing anything worthwhile to the unit.

I also feel that WS6 is too high. If this thing is a hulking, out of control monster, why is it as skilled as some of the best elite trained infantry in the game? I'd say WS4, or at a very, very big stretch WS5.

W 4 is a typo yes, I've already mentioned he loses his casting ability, he's monsterous infantry, t4 is a necromancers toughness, I'm defiantly keeping WS 6 no question about it. I based the bat thing on a ghoul king ands that is the same as a ghoul kings.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/03/11 00:27:48


 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins




WA, USA

Okay, then what if I pick this guy as my general? VC requires your general to be a wizard of some flavor, correct? This guy stops being a wizard.

I think the best solution to that is a tag where this guy cannot be the army general.

And I'm going to disagree on the WS6. This guy is NOT a ghoul king vampire. He's a were-monster Necromancer.

 Ouze wrote:

Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

Im sticking to WS 6 this thing is similar to a ghoul king and will consequently be represented but the same skill in combat. Weapon skill doesn't necessarily represent finesse in combat...
If you pick this guy as your general and don't use any other wizards as well then your army diserves to crumble to dust.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
5 edits already...


This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/03/11 01:01:16


 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

Anyone?
   
Made in gb
Sinister Shapeshifter




The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.

Why would a lahmian ring turn him into a hulking monstrosity? It goes against the written fluff for them. Rather than that, I'd have the ring give him a penalty to hit and if he is reduced to his last wound, except via miscasts, he hulks out.

And necromancers are T3 for a reason. You already have tough, hardcore casty characters in the form of vampires.

As for the WS, I'd say drop it down to 5, there is know way an angry bat thing is anywhere near as fighty as a Ghoul King or a standard Vampire.

And I'd say go for 375 points.

Malifaux masters owned: Guild(Sans McCabe), Outcasts(Sans Misaki), Arcanists(Sans Marcus)

Check my blog that I just started: http://unionfaux.blogspot.co.uk/ 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

 thedarkavenger wrote:
Why would a lahmian ring turn him into a hulking monstrosity? It goes against the written fluff for them. Rather than that, I'd have the ring give him a penalty to hit and if he is reduced to his last wound, except via miscasts, he hulks out.

And necromancers are T3 for a reason. You already have tough, hardcore casty characters in the form of vampires.

As for the WS, I'd say drop it down to 5, there is know way an angry bat thing is anywhere near as fighty as a Ghoul King or a standard Vampire.

And I'd say go for 375 points.

It's deliberately the Lamian ring not Lahmian because that is another word for vampire. You obviously haven't read the book as master necromancers are T4 not 3 anyway so I'm not going to down grade him. It's based on the ghoul king stats which work well so far with him. Anyway the bat is supposed to be massively strong and dangerous, the sort of thing he changes into to rip through smaller units. But at the risk of ignoring all advice given so far I will change it to WS 5 which I suppose is 1 higher than a varghulfs still...
   
Made in us
Evasive Eshin Assassin





This guy is no where near as blatantly Awesome-sauce as the last guy. He's halfway to reasonable, even! It's also a lot easier to read. Okay, let's price him:

1. Base Master Necro cost.
2. +35pts for lvl4
3. +30pts for Loremaster
4. +35pts for the +1 to cast Staff, +45pts for the 4+ Ward-cloak, and...uh...50pts for the Ring?

So that's 195pts more than the usual Necromancer.
Now, some other comments:

- make his Gorewolf Cloak the thing that transforms him. (1) it's called the Gorewolf Cloak, (2) cloaks and other such items are associated with shape-shifting. The Ring can be his Ward-item.
- on that note, I'd just like to point out that bonuses to cast and 4+ Ward saves do not interesting characters make. Good ones, sure. But not interesting. Not by any reasonable standards.
- ...change the name of that Ring. Why would you call it by a name that's one letter different from something else in that same army, with a tone that's entirely different from the Rings?
- why is his alternate form called The Hunted? What's hunting it?
- also, why does he transform? I mean, sure, magic. But it just seems a little weird that he, being a Necromancer, not a Vampire, turns into a Vampire-esque thing. What's your idea?

 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

After last times atrocious attempt I didn't try with the fluff as I was writing this late at night. But basically he was a man living in a remote empire community on the borders of ostermark, when his wife was killed by a dire wolf attack he searched and searched for a way to bring her back. Eventually he gives up on reason and travels into Sylvannia to find a method. Upon finding a isolated vampire keep while stumbling blind through a remote forest, he begged the occupant for aid. Eventually bargaining this life away for a life time as the thrall of the vampire lord within. After many years of forced servitude and tutoring he discovers a dark and twisted metal ring in a long forgotten chamber. In the rings metal he sees a writhing bat like beast, bound by the vampire. Snatching the ring, he unwittingly unlocks its power transforming himself into the massive beast locked within. He hacks his way out of the keep killing many of the vampires servants but crucially not the unknown lord himself. He then fled into the night. Over time the man adopted the name Ra'kham Van hel in mockery of the witch hunter of the empire. He also learnt to control the power of the ring and through his travels has acquired both great necromantic prowess and many powerful artefacts.

What do you think?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for the lamian ring, "Lamian" is another word for vampire/undead representing a bat like creature. I dont think Lhamian would make sense here as he doesn't really fit in with that theme...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/03/21 21:44:15


 
   
Made in us
Evasive Eshin Assassin





Not bad, sir. I feel like the "villain with good intentions" theme fits Hero-level characters better than Lord-level ones (such characters usually see the error of their ways--often as they lie dying at the hands of some noble hero--in a suitably theatrical and dynamic fashion before they can master the powers of evil), but I think it works.

So...the ring has a monster in it, and it lets you become the monster? I guess that could work. I still think the Cloak should be the item to grant him the power, though. It just fits the image so well. Plus, you could even drop the ring all together and save 45pts on him since his other form has Regeneration.

How much is a naked Master Necromancer, anyway?

Finally on "Lamian" versus "Lhamian". I'm well aware what Lamian means (the Lamia often being portrayed as a beautiful woman crossed with a lion or a snake, with a penchant for powerful enchantments and eating children).
That's why Games Workshop gave those specific vampires that name; they're all about seduction and a sadistic, playful evil. GW just changed the spelling a little to add that Warhammer-look to it, or just 'cause, or whatever.
I'm not suggesting you change the name to Lhamian (you're right, it would fit not at all). I'm suggesting you change it to something more savagely monstrous, perhaps something with a nod towards bats (Ring of the Ah'ul?). But I still vote for a sticky, bloody cloak of freshly flensed hide being the totem-esque device that lets him transform.

 
   
Made in gb
Ghastly Grave Guard



Uk

Naked master necromancer is 165 points while a level 4 one is 200.
   
Made in us
Evasive Eshin Assassin





So...360pts?

The transformation thing is the hardest to price. On one hand, it makes him a (fairly decent) close-combat monster. On the other, it has a huge drawback in and of itself, since it's permanent and he loses all his Wizard-y-ness.

I put it at 50pts mostly because it's a very drastic rule; the potential for awesomeness seems high, even though it's not promised. But I'd listen to other suggestions.

 
   
 
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