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Hello,
I've been thinking about starting an Eldar army and have about $250 dollars to spend (at retail price, I will be getting them from a discounted store that does 20% off) and would love some suggestions on how to go about doing that.

I've looked at the battleforce and am not sure if it is really worth it. I hear vipers aren't really good and would hate to buy the model for no reason.

On the model front I love warp spiders (what inspired me to grab Eldar in the first place) and wave serpents are pretty cool looking too (and I hear they are deadly).

For the Hq I was thinking a Farseer so I can try my hand at some Psyker cheesiness (my current Necron army is kinda lacking on that front)

Thanks for any suggestions.

First is get a codex. That's always your #1 buy.

Next, if you want Warp Spiders, hit up eBay for the metal ones. They are much better and cheaper than the Finecast.

Second, see if you can pin down one of the older battle forces as they had a Warwalker instead of a Vyper, meaning it was actually really good.

Choose a starting force and stick with it; Footdar, Wraithbone, or Tanks. It's easier to build towards a theme and branch out later.

Footdar are pretty weak if you are trying to play competitive. The best unit in the game for the points costs is hands down the wave serpent. Their death star is farseer on a jetbike with warlocks on jetbikes. everything that makes eldar win is their speed. Warp spiders can put out a bunch of STR6 shots and then jump away like its nobodies business but because they are so good right now they are expensive (even on e-bay) They are the unit I have the least amount of due to the cost. Vypers are OK but not competitive by any standard. If you want to play in tournaments, use the deathstar mentioned above with wave serpents filled with 5 dire avengers each. Thats pretty much the way to go unfortunately. It makes for a boring army though because you just shuffle your tanks around and shoot everything from across the board only moving up to start unloading troops onto objectives.

 TheKbob wrote:
First is get a codex. That's always your #1 buy.

Next, if you want Warp Spiders, hit up eBay for the metal ones. They are much better and cheaper than the Finecast.

Second, see if you can pin down one of the older battle forces as they had a Warwalker instead of a Vyper, meaning it was actually really good.

Choose a starting force and stick with it; Footdar, Wraithbone, or Tanks. It's easier to build towards a theme and branch out later.

vypers are far from useless, and pretty much everything in the codex: eldar is "good" if not "great' so making the arguement against a vyper is kinda hard

If you're looking for high-points/low-cost units, look at Jetbikes and/or Wraithguard, Dark Reapers, Warp Spiders. Throw in a Farseer/Spiritseer.

As said, look at what 'flavour' of force you want.
Fast with jetbikes,
Tough with Wraiths,
Static and shooty with Reapers and War walkers,
'Horde' with Guardians and an Avatar.

There are lots of valid armies, and lots fit well with others.

Also, ebay. There is a lot of Eldar on there. Get newer models from your site, but pad them out with 2nd-hand.

I'd say pick an idea and build that. Chances are you'll end up with a good list anyway.

Book - $50
2 x fire prisms $100
2 x Dire Avengers $70
2 x jet-bikes $80
1 Farseer $15
---------------------------------
$315
w/ 20% discount
$252

Eldar's strength is its solid maneuverable troops. This will let you see if you like wave serpents or jet bikes more, while allowing you to grow your army as you see fit. From here I would suggest warp spiders or a wraith knight. Instead of buying a farseer model you can also buy another jetbike and make him a jet seer which is pretty strong.

I'd suggest only one Prism, if that's the route you go. A Serpent (don't field more than 1 outside a tourny) or a Falcon would be a suitable second tank, for the same price.

You should probably decide what type of force you like first. There are a lot of options, and none are useless (footdar and sword wind are on the weaker side, but still quite playable. Mech Infantry is broken because it relies on Serpents).

The styles are:
-Sword Wind - All aspects (possibly a transport or two), without duplicating aspects more than necessary. Specialists for everything.
-Footdar - Lots of Guardians, a couple goodies, and probably an Avatar
-Mechanized Infantry - Infantry in Serpents and Falcons.
-Wraithspam - Wraith seers with lots of tough Wraith guard/lords/knights
-Bikes - Lots of Jet bikes, and a grab tank or 3

Jetseer Council will skew your list (and drink your 'friends' tears) no matter what type you choose, so should be avoided if you're playing friendly games.

 ionusx wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:
First is get a codex. That's always your #1 buy.

Next, if you want Warp Spiders, hit up eBay for the metal ones. They are much better and cheaper than the Finecast.

Second, see if you can pin down one of the older battle forces as they had a Warwalker instead of a Vyper, meaning it was actually really good.

Choose a starting force and stick with it; Footdar, Wraithbone, or Tanks. It's easier to build towards a theme and branch out later.

vypers are far from useless, and pretty much everything in the codex: eldar is "good" if not "great' so making the arguement against a vyper is kinda hard

Howling banshee and harlequins are terrible. guardians are better then they are.

A couple serpents, a couple War Walkers, guardians, dire avengers, farseer, warp spiders, and rangers. All good choices that can roll into bigger lists.

 lambsandlions wrote:
Book - $50
2 x Wave serpents
2 x Dire Avengers $70
2 x jet-bikes $80
1 Farseer $15
---------------------------------
$315
w/ 20% discount
$252

Better, and he said he likes the look of serpents

But 2 serpents at that level is just mean. His games won't be any fun.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Avoid these units if you're starting, until you're more familiar with what you're doing.

Units that I think are a bit sub-par (About worst to about best):

Bad Units

-Hemlock Fighter - AV10 Flier who can't use it's main weapon the turn it comes in. Even if it could, nowhere near worth it's points.

-Harlequins - Not many people are very fond of them in the Dark Eldar 'dex, where they're better, have a better delivery system, and better fit the structure. I don't bemoan the lack of an Assault transport for other CW Eldar melee units, but the Harlequins need it. They don't even have Battle Focus! Simply not a threat, and not terribly beefy.

Sub-Par Units

-Banshees - These guys can do some work. Against power armor t4 and lower. If they aren't assaulting into cover. If they can safely and quickly get to their targets. Most of the time, but not always, Scorpions are simply the better choice, and Scorpions are good but not stellar.

-Vypers - Vypers are fun. I field them a lot. However, they only beat out War Warkers by a tiny amount in mobility (and that's debatable), while losing out a lot in firepower (and a little in survivability). Field them if you have them, they're fun, but you might enjoy other models more at first. Strategically, they are rarely the best option, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't field them regularly if you get them!

-Falcons - AV12 4+ is passibly survivable for a backfield model, similar to a Predator, but if you try to use it's mobility to get it close, it goes down very easily (think how fragile Dreadnaughts are, and they're Walkers). These things don't do much as transports (Only 6 capacity anyways), becuase you won't want them to move up the field. Worse dakka than a Predator (model to model), while costing much more per model. Should be our heavy battle tank, but isn't. A twinlinked Brightlance outshoots it aganst av13+, and a Scatter Serpent makes it feel pointless against anything less than av13.

-Fire Prism -
Again, a twinlinked Brightlance outperforms against any AV value, and its Blast variants don't generate as many wounds as most other Heavy Support choices. Like the Falcon, might see more play of the Serpent weren't OP, but isn't terribly powerful as is. A single shot a round is hard to justify its points.

-Rangers -
Bunch of snipers should be fun, but the odds of them doing anything important is actually quite low. You're probably better off getting Guardians, despite the higher point cost (Guardians come with at least 10 models, Rangers come in smaller units). Eventually probably a good thing to get, but probably not in your starting army.

Now all of the above is just my opinion of what isn't that great in the Eldar dex. All these things can be fun, so field what you want, but if you want my advice on what to look at, avoid the above.

Bharring wrote:
But 2 serpents at that level is just mean. His games won't be any fun.

But he said he wanted serpents

3-4 Serpents 3-4 units of DA , 2-3 units of jetbikes should be a nice start of an army. Although that is a lot more then 250$.
So probaly the best way to star twould be the list ninjadragon made.

 lambsandlions wrote:
Book - $50
2 x fire prisms $100
2 x Dire Avengers $70
2 x jet-bikes $80
1 Farseer $15
---------------------------------
$315
w/ 20% discount
$252

Hi Thanks for the list but in Canada (where I am) it looks like thing are a bit more expensive (lucky me!).
If I were to buy that it would be:

Book - $59.50
2 x fire prisms $119
2 x Dire Avengers $80
2 x jet-bikes $90
1 Farseer $25 (plastic model)
---------------------------------
$373.50
w/ 20% discount
$298.8
w/ tax (Canada's good ol' 13%)
$337.644 (a fair ways out of my price range to start off with)



I was thinking a variation of the list:

Book: $59.50
Farseer: $25
Jetbikes: $45
Dire Avengers or Gaurdians: $40-43.50
Wave Serpent: $53.50
Warp Spiders: $49.50
---------------------------------
$276
W/ 20% discount
$220.8
W/ Taxes 13% (Hazaa)
$249.50

That lands me right on the target zone, includes the warp spiders, and only has the one serpent (as some guys said would be nicer to my opponent).

As a list how effective would that be?
Also should I go with gaurdians (more models = more fun and, of course, MORE MODELS YAAAY!!!) or Dire avengers (Tougher fancier models with the nice hair)?

Nicer to your opponent huh.
I guess you will have to gauge that on how "nice" your opponent is being to you?

Codex
2 Battleforce Boxes
1 Jetbike

Use the Jetbike + spare Dire Avenger Bitz to make an HQ(Autarch or Farseer)

Vypers are not great but they are not bad either. On a scale of 1 to 10 they are a 7 in a codex filled with 8,9, & 10s. There are plenty of Codicies out there that would love to have them. Or you can get creative and turn them into Hornets with some bitz and imagination.

Dire Avengers + Wave Serpents = Profit

20 Guardians are wonderful at sitting on a back objective in cover plinking away with their weapon platforms. They are also useful as a Turn 1 meat shield to deny drop pods a spot to land behind your WSs. It is always nice to have at least one blob type unit when only a blob will do. And just like Vypers they are just over-shadowed by other stuff.

*note*
Finding metal Warp Spiders on ebay for a decent price is near impossible now.

If you're getting the Serpent and either Guardians or a box of Avengers, you should probably hold off on something else (perhaps jetbikes) and just get the Battleforce to start. Then add Jetbikes later. If you'll use both the Guardians and Dire Avengers, there is nothing wasted, so you'll basically get the Vyper for free (not the best unit, but they can be a lot of fun).

Bharring wrote:
If you're getting the Serpent and either Guardians or a box of Avengers, you should probably hold off on something else (perhaps jetbikes) and just get the Battleforce to start. Then add Jetbikes later. If you'll use both the Guardians and Dire Avengers, there is nothing wasted, so you'll basically get the Vyper for free (not the best unit, but they can be a lot of fun).

If I did that it would be: Battleforce, farseer, warpspiders, codex. after discount &taxes that would be $247.70 which is in my range.
Do you guys think that would be better or the previous list?

If you get the Battleforce, leave the gun off the Vyper and use it as a chariot-like Jetbike for your Farseer.
As said, the Vyper is effectively free when you price-up the Battleforce. Saves you having to buy a jetbike.

Before you buy a Farseer, the Farseer With Staff is an illegal setup. Farseers can't use staves in the recent codex. I'm not sure about the Iyanden supplement.

[Edit:] Oh, and look at getting some magnets. With the price of Dire Avengers these days, you might want to chop-and-change the Exarch's loadout. I'd use some 1.5mm diameter/ 2mm long, with a 1.5mm drilll-bit.
Do the same with the Guardian weapon platform and Wave Serpent and you're set.

 joeforever wrote:

Bharring wrote:
If you're getting the Serpent and either Guardians or a box of Avengers, you should probably hold off on something else (perhaps jetbikes) and just get the Battleforce to start. Then add Jetbikes later. If you'll use both the Guardians and Dire Avengers, there is nothing wasted, so you'll basically get the Vyper for free (not the best unit, but they can be a lot of fun).

If I did that it would be: Battleforce, farseer, warpspiders, codex. after discount &taxes that would be $247.70 which is in my range.
Do you guys think that would be better or the previous list?

Sounds like winner to me. Warp Spiders are a lot of fun to play with, and with what you mentioned you could field around 600pts. And with a 2nd battleforce later on, be up to around 1k.

 Skinnereal wrote:
If you get the Battleforce, leave the gun off the Vyper and use it as a chariot-like Jetbike for your Farseer.
As said, the Vyper is effectively free when you price-up the Battleforce. Saves you having to buy a jetbike.

Before you buy a Farseer, the Farseer With Staff is an illegal setup. Farseers can't use staves in the recent codex. I'm not sure about the Iyanden supplement.

[Edit:] Oh, and look at getting some magnets. With the price of Dire Avengers these days, you might want to chop-and-change the Exarch's loadout. I'd use some 1.5mm diameter/ 2mm long, with a 1.5mm drilll-bit.
Do the same with the Guardian weapon platform and Wave Serpent and you're set.

Use the stave as a singing spear. Nobody will mind

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

Use the stave as a singing spear. Nobody will mind

I thought that was the Singing spear. huh