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I'm a 40k player (still loving it) but I want to get in some Fantasy-style play, and I thought Hordes would be perfect. I specifically love the Circle Orboros models, and from what I've heard this game is a bit more lenient in playing the models you like versus the new hotness.

I've never played Warmahordes before, but I know of some guys at the FLGS who will show me the ropes; that being said, can you all help me out with suggestions on models to build around Kromac? He looks awesome, love that he can shapeshift. I like the idea of beasts, and was thinking of the Ghetorix, Warpwolf Stalker, Gorax, and just to get some infantry in there, Tharn Bloodweavers (the book says they can explode living things; how cool is that?). What are your thoughts?

Also, is there a good site to buy used or discounted Hordes models? The cheaper the better, jumping into another game will not make the boss happy.

Miniature market is doing a 40% off sale right now. http://www.miniaturemarket.com/

Ebay is always a thing for used stuff.

 Homeskillet wrote:
I'm a 40k player (still loving it) but I want to get in some Fantasy-style play, and I thought Hordes would be perfect. I specifically love the Circle Orboros models, and from what I've heard this game is a bit more lenient in playing the models you like versus the new hotness.

I've never played Warmahordes before, but I know of some guys at the FLGS who will show me the ropes; that being said, can you all help me out with suggestions on models to build around Kromac? He looks awesome, love that he can shapeshift. I like the idea of beasts, and was thinking of the Ghetorix, Warpwolf Stalker, Gorax, and just to get some infantry in there, Tharn Bloodweavers (the book says they can explode living things; how cool is that?). What are your thoughts?

Also, is there a good site to buy used or discounted Hordes models? The cheaper the better, jumping into another game will not make the boss happy.

As a general note on models, a good way of thinking about Warmahordes is that every model is playable, but that doesn't mean that every combination of models is good. You can't just expect to take a pile of random models and expect to do well, you need to build synergies between units in your list to have a winning army. This is not to scare you off, but to make you aware that there are some combinations of models that just don't work well together.

Regarding the specific models you mentioned, while I'm not an expert on the Circle, you are looking at some commonly suggested models. Kromac is regarded as a fun and competitive warcaster,and the Stalker, Gorax, and Ghetorix are commonly suggested pieces (with the Gorax and Stalker being considered to be core pieces). The infantry I know less about, but as a note you usually want to take all of the relevant attachments for a unit (unit and weapon attachments, with a few exceptions). You'll also want a unit of shifting stones with the UA, they are a common utility unit that allow you to teleport your beasts across the board.

On a general note, Battle College can be a great resource.

Concerning Kromac, he's a bit of a goofy guy. He may feel tough and invincible, just remember he is tough for a 'Lock, but when he dies you lose! He's great for making those last finishing runs and wiping out your enemy, but anything before that is foolhardy. He is a great assassin, if you get a clear line to the enemies Caster/Lock you can pop feat charge and assassinate him.

For starting models at a "Battlebox" level, around 12 points, I'd suggest a Gorax, Argus, and a Gnarlhorn Satyr. These synergize pretty well with him. Ghetorax is also really strong, but a little spendier point wise than a basic Satyr. As with most Locks, you can't really go wrong with a Feral Warpwolf either. As far as units go, he works well with most close combat units. Take a gander at Tharns, any of them are decent. Wolfriders are glass cannons, but very effective. If you want tougher units, Warpwolf Skinwalkers are a good choice.

With ANY, literally ANY circle list, you will want at least 1 unit of Shifting Stones, preferably with their UA. 3 points for lots of versatility.

If you have any specific questions concerning rules or tactics, give me a hollar!

Thanks much for the help so far, all. I was able to get a few of the models I wanted from miniaturemarket, so that helps a lot in the price department.

As to the tactics, I did check out battlecollege and got some great advice there, I just wasn't sure how up to date it was, so I thought I'd ask the dakkanauts as well. Battlecollege said that the Warpborn Skinwalkers don't synergize well with Kromac; any opinions on this? The models for the Warpborn are killer, would love to be able to field them with Kromac.

Shifting Stones are definitely something I keep hearing as 100% necessary, so I'll snag those up as soon as possible.

 Homeskillet wrote:
Thanks much for the help so far, all. I was able to get a few of the models I wanted from miniaturemarket, so that helps a lot in the price department.

As to the tactics, I did check out battlecollege and got some great advice there, I just wasn't sure how up to date it was, so I thought I'd ask the dakkanauts as well. Battlecollege said that the Warpborn Skinwalkers don't synergize well with Kromac; any opinions on this? The models for the Warpborn are killer, would love to be able to field them with Kromac.

Shifting Stones are definitely something I keep hearing as 100% necessary, so I'll snag those up as soon as possible.

Battle College articles are all pretty well maintained, just ignore the discussions they link to which are usually really old. Here has more current discussions and the FAQ at the top of the page is great.

Skinwalkers work well. They don't synergize with Kromac as well as some other Locks, but they're still a very strong tarpit unit. Kromac's Inviable Resolve bumps them to 20 armor while in melee, which is amazing for infantry. Also, since they are medium bases, Kromac can hide behind them. Add in a Blackclad Wayfarer for Hunter's Mark, giving them +2" to charge. Also, make sure you invest in the Warpwolf Skinwalker's UA, really turns them into a powerhouse. One thing you'll find with Circle Orboros, or maybe Warmahordes in general, is there is rarely, if ever, a "bad unit". Some may work better than others, but every single unit and model has a purpose and will be useful on the battlefield. For what it's worth, Skinwalkers are one of my favorite infantry units, those 8 wounds are great!

I cannot stress enough how useful and iconic Shifting Stones are. They are fine without their UA, but I'd suggest giving them one of those too.

Circle infantry is a funny one.

Reeves are awful. They have one good trick with War Wolf solos, but they don't do anything the Nyss Hunters do MUCH better.

Wolves or Orboros are good on charge turn because of mini-feat but after that are very meh.

Druids are one of the staple units. The ability to lay down clouds and push enemy models around is a big deal.

Tharn Bloodweavers hit like a truck. Have the first one strip the unit your attacking's debuffs then either mulch light ARM infantry with the explodo or one at a time against high ARM/medium with the additional dice.

Bloodtrackers + Nuala are the Circle "go to" small base infantry

Stones are essential.

Skinwalkers + Alpha are a good, solid unit. Not as good as a Gatorman Posse, but then not much else is.

Tharn Ravagers are generallfy avoided because their low DEF and low ARM makes them very squishy for a medium base unit.

Tharn Bloodpacks are, from what I understand, decent enough.

Standing stone and mannequins aren't widely used.

The druid and wolds are decent but overshadowed by bloodtrackers

With the exception of Reeves, which are almost completly useless, Circle infantry more than any is very much a "take what suits you" option.

Thanks again for the tips, I'll have to find a way to use Skinwalkers at some point; they are just too bad-ass looking not to use. Also glad to hear the Bloodweavers are nasty, I'd like to use Tharn with Kromac.

In checking around, I've seen the Razorwing Griffon and the Scarsfell Griffon; do any of you know if either of these guys will synergize well with Kromac's abilities? They look pretty nasty.

 Homeskillet wrote:
Thanks again for the tips, I'll have to find a way to use Skinwalkers at some point; they are just too bad-ass looking not to use. Also glad to hear the Bloodweavers are nasty, I'd like to use Tharn with Kromac.

In checking around, I've seen the Razorwing Griffon and the Scarsfell Griffon; do any of you know if either of these guys will synergize well with Kromac's abilities? They look pretty nasty.

Skinwalkers aren't BAD. With the UA they're really good and an excellent tarpit and with certain casters (eMorvahna) they're amazing. Its just that a Gatorman Posse does a similar job but better.

The griffons are iffy beasts. The Razorwing is arguably the most useful, especially under eKaya (POW17 trample, ignoring base size with boosted attack rolls,what's not to love?), the Scarsfell suffers from being a bit rubbish though. The Rotterhorn is getting a lot of discussion due to its animus, but its new so it'll be a while before people can make a fair assessment.

As with everything in warmachine, if you want to run Kromac and griffons, go for it. The great thing about the game is that you can take whatever you want and "make it work". In fact, a lot of vets love the challenge in taking weird lists and becoming brillant at using them.

Kromac was my first love, so I have a lot of good play experience with him. Also Will Pagani has an excellent Kromac list that has become a tournament staple.

My usual list (note that these are made at Forward Kommander, a nice site for playing with list ideas though not 100% accurate sometimes for themes):

Points: 50/50
Kromac the Ravenous (*4pts)
* Gorax (4pts)
* Ghetorix (11pts)
* Gnarlhorn Satyr (8pts)
* Warpwolf Stalker (10pts)
Shifting Stones (2pts)
* Stone keeper (1pts)
Shifting Stones (2pts)
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew (Leader and 1 Grunt) (1pts)
Tharn Bloodtrackers (Leader and 9 Grunts) (8pts)
* Nuala the Huntress (2pts)
Tharn Bloodweavers (Leader and 5 Grunts) (5pts)

Kromac can run 3 heavies nicely, and Bloodtrackers are just really solid in general. The girls jam well and do great damage especially to Prey. Kromac himself usually just hangs out in the back a bit buffing things and keeping Bestial up if the enemy has casters (which is an AMAZING spell) or threatening assassination while pressuring scenario points. He looks like a beat stick, but isn't really. His main role is to support the army with Warpath while leaving that 13" assassination threat on the table. If your opponent forgets that and does something foolish, you win. If they don't forget it they are keeping their caster away from flags and zones most likely. I have gotten a fair few wins where Kromac was my last model on the table but within 13" of an over confident enemy caster.

Will's list:
Points: 50/50
Kromac the Ravenous (*4pts)
* Gorax (4pts)
* Feral Warpwolf (9pts)
* Ghetorix (11pts)
* Warpwolf Stalker (10pts)
Shifting Stones (2pts)
* Stone keeper (1pts)
Shifting Stones (2pts)
Stoneward and 5 Woldstalkers (5pts)
Stoneward and 5 Woldstalkers (5pts)
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew (Leader and 1 Grunt) (1pts)
Blackclad Wayfarer (2pts)
Gallows Grove (1pts)
Gallows Grove (1pts)

Will's list is optimized for fighting Cryx so has the soulless Woldstalkers instead of BTs, and somewhat more efficient beasts. I have seen the list with 2x Stalkers instead of a Feral and an extra Grove too. A Riphorn might substitute for the Feral as well now that it is out.

Basically with Kromac you want somethings that can reliably trigger Warpath because the spell is amazing. Stalkers with Wild Aggression are bonkers good at clearing infantry after they warp Berserk + Sprint . Slaughter everyone around you with free boosts to hit, then Warpath 3" and slaughter everyone around you, then Sprint back to safety.

General Circle tips:

The Gorax is really good. Really, really good. So good that it is almost a crutch. Two is unneeded, but one is almost every list using living beasts is sensible for a long time.

Skinwalkers are good, though a little less so for Kromac. Many other casters like them however. Just be sure to get the Alpha; he really takes them to 11 (and probably makes them better than Gatormen Posse for the in faction buffs.)

Blood Trackers + Nuala are just fantastic.

Shifting Stones + UA + another unit of Shifting Stones are a must have. Even if you don't put both units in every list, you will use double Stones a great deal. Most of Circle's most obnoxious "LoL, you thought you were safe?!" tricks stem from the stones.

Goats are a little hit or miss sometimes. They are a bit pillow fisted compared to the wolves, and most of our beasts don't want to be getting hit at all. Still, they can add some good utility here and there. The Riphorn looks like a good replacement for the Feral WW in some lists.

Warpwolves are the work horses. The Stalker is in just about every list as he is amazing, then has a fantastic animus in Sprint that just makes so many of our models super happy. Ferals are good for killing just about anything (Mat 7 instead of 6 is really nice) although sometimes they take a back seat to Stalkers due to not having an animus. Purebloods are a little more iffy. Some people like them, some hate them, most don't use them much. Ghettorix is just wonderful at killnig things, and surprisingly hard to kill.

Argus- basic one is bad. Bad bad bad. Winter Argus is sorta ok, sometimes useful. Moonhound is good if you are going to have shooting.

Griffons- Scarsfell is really hard to make work. Razorwing is ok, although maxes at Pow 16 tramples with +2 Mat, or Pow 14 with rerolls. Kind of nifty sometimes. The Rotterhorn has a really cool animus and is great at killing those Def; Ridiculous infantry that sometimes pop up. Used with the solo Una he can really do some work for a good price.

Wolds: Mixed bag. The woldwarden is largely considered useless and is completely eclipsed by Megalith who does the same thing but better. Woldwatchers are nice little guys for holding points and shield guarding ugly shots. Wold guardians are neat, but hard to use well due to slow movement and lack of a damage buff. Woldwrath is very situational, and due to the $ cost not really a sensible purchase. eBaldur and pBaldur can both make wolds much better, though only eBaldur's theme force really makes them the only beasts you take.

Awesome, thanks for the advice once again all. I just picked up a squad of Skinwalkers, and the Alpha is on its way. Can't wait to get my beasties on the board and get some games in!