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https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-cav-strike-operations?ref=discovery





Add ons



Why are we doing this?

Thanks to you, our last two Kickstarters were an amazing success as we added to our Bones line of plastic fantasy figures. We want to bring this same success over to the CAV range of figures where their larger size will benefit even more from the cost savings associated with producing a figure in plastic. The CAV: SO Kickstarter is focusing on getting these larger models switched over faster as well as the introduction of several new figures for you to use.

Where is the Rule Book?

CAV: Strike Operations centers around an all-new edition of the game. During the Kickstarter we will provide everyone a link to download a free PDF copy of the base rules and see the changes we have made as part of the update. We will make an announcement when this download is available. We have already committed to producing this game without asking for your assistance and will be releasing a full-color, hard-back rule set for retail sale.

Where is the Rule Book?

CAV: Strike Operations centers around an all-new edition of the game. During the Kickstarter we will provide everyone a link to download a free PDF copy of the base rules and see the changes we have made as part of the update. We will make an announcement when this download is available. We have already committed to producing this game without asking for your assistance and will be releasing a full-color, hard-back rule set for retail sale. The free pdf rules are linked below

http://www.talon-games.com/downloads/CAV_SOpreview.pdf

NOTE: The minis will be in BONES plastic (ie slightly flexible PVC)

The official pledge calculator is now up and running

https://ks.reapermini.com/cav

register with the email address you use for KS

pick your stuff, click recalculate and you'll find out the shipping cost you'll end up paying

Think these will be Bonesium models?

 porkuslime wrote:
Think these will be Bonesium models?

Pretty sure that was the plan.

Neat, I've always wanted to play this.

 porkuslime wrote:
Think these will be Bonesium models?

Yep, unless something major has changed, these will be the Bones CAVs that were shown last year. You can see them here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/516769.page

Not perfect, but I recall somewhere someone saying these were early test runs. Very likely I'll be buying into this one, if only for the models.

 Eilif wrote:
Not perfect, but I recall somewhere someone saying these were early test runs.

Bit of an understatement, even if they were test runs.

I was never a fan of the original metal CAV models as they screamed to me of entry level CAD design work without any flare or soul due to both the designs and the static poses but I'd be willing to at least take a peek and see if they've improved in the intervening decade.

I'm the opposite, I quite liked the original CAV metals, especially compared to some of the other mecha offerings from other companies.

I'll have to keep an eye or for this one, still have my Ritterlich (including 8 Jaguars) and Mitso-Ta forces.

Info fro the reaper forums

CAVBOSS

Most CAV models will be in the 2"-2 1/2" size and are 10mm scale-wise. This size fits well with existing mech games and terrain lines.

The same plastic from Bones is being used to produce the CAV: SO minis but will be a light gray color rather than the traditional white. They will include a hex base that is black and a harder plastic.

Tannhauser42 wrote:I'm the opposite, I quite liked the original CAV metals, especially compared to some of the other mecha offerings from other companies.

I'll have to keep an eye or for this one, still have my Ritterlich (including 8 Jaguars) and Mitso-Ta forces.

I'm right there with you. I don't own any CAV's but I;ve always liked the designs. The sculptor John Bear Ross did most of them IIRC and I've tended to like his work wherever it appears.

OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Info fro the reaper forums

CAVBOSS
Most CAV models will be in the 2"-2 1/2" size and are 10mm scale-wise. This size fits well with existing mech games and terrain lines.

The same plastic from Bones is being used to produce the CAV: SO minis but will be a light gray color rather than the traditional white. They will include a hex base that is black and a harder plastic.

.

CAV is tecnicallky 10mm, but alot of the small and medium sized designs will size up well against Battletech and other 6mm mecha. That's because in the CAV universe, CAVs aren't as tall as Battlemechs are in the Battletech universe. The largest CAV's though will dwarf the largest Battletech models

Ouch. Those early sculpts look rough.

They look like 80's battletech miniatures, sorry but not impressed, hope they updated the design

There is apparently no plans to alter any of the designs (apart from a few size tweeks on a few figures)

I have a couple of the metal ones and in person they really look great. Though I didn't go for some of the more 90s looking ones.

I really want some CAV Bones minis, but after the Bones 2 campaign, I might just wait for retail. Mantic is giving me all the crappy stretch goals I can handle at the moment.

from the reaper forum

CAVBOSS

CAV: SO doesn't change the composition that much from previous versions. Naming is a little different...
Your overall force is called a Force Group which is made up of Squads (generally 4-6 models each).

As part of the KS an abridged copy of the rules will be available as a free download to let people see whats going on. We have already committed to printing a hard back, color copy of the rules that will be available by November. This book will not be part of the KS as we want to get that into peoples hands right away and don't want to be doing multiple shipments to the same people. More info to follow.
SamuraiJack, on 05 Aug 2014 - 4:54 PM, said:
Maybe they can rename one the Myrnnyx for Amalor

-- I am planning to do something for him. I was always a fan of his painted mechs and want to make sure we honor his memory in some way.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
from the reaper forums

CAVBOSS
TaleSpinner, on 06 Aug 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:
@CAVBOSS: Will we have a force creator similar to what we had had with CAV 2 and do currently have through Reaper Game for Warlord (i.e., Army Creator). It really makes playing the game easier.

-- Yes. I currently have a programmer working on a program that will do just that. We have a working copy now and we are working through the bugs. I hope to make it available during the KS for people to download.

Seems odd not to have the Rulebook available through the kickstarter. Seems like alot of folks might want to buy the rules with their minis.

A good idea to release it ahead of time, but a bad one to not also make it available as part of the KS.

If not a physical book, I'm sure there will at least be a digital copy available in the KS.

I'd agree, but I suspect they don't want backers to be involved in a year long (speculation but not an unreasobable guess) wait for the minis while the hardback is available to non KS backers

whatever people say they will get grumpy and upset about it as time ticks on

(and start demanding an early shipment of just the rulebook which either makes Reaper the bad guys for saying no, or means they've got split shipment hassle to take care of)

better to give the cut down pdf as soon as the KS ends (so people can decide whether they like they system), and let them buy the book on their own. It also helps build bridges with FLGS etc who can sell the books and will then have more incentive to stock the line after the KS as they will have some idea of how big a player base there may be

(personally I'd offer a full pdf as a paid add on too, but that might not fit with an FLGS strategy as described above)

I can see why they'd do it the way they are doing it. I prefer to own hardcopies of games I play regularly despite always bringing my android device(s) to the FLGS when I play. If anything, it tells me that they're thinking ahead of time about how not to potentially screw themselves over and then later screw backers. I wish other KS had done that (cough... Robotech... cough).

That makes some sense.

One other possibility is that they want to get the rulebook into FLGS's (assuming FLGS's are willing to take another chance on CAV) ahead of the release of the miniatures.

So far Reaper seems to be one of the companies where a Kickstarter has reulted in sustained sales of the product at the FLGS. I see bones at nearly all the FLGS"s around here. Maybe they're hoping for a similar reception for Bones CAV's.

Truthfully, how they're selling the rulebook is more a curiosity for me. There's only a slim chance that I'll be paying CAV:SO. It's far more likely that I'd be buying the CAVs to play alongside my armies of rebased Mechwarrior clix in games of Mech Attack and Alpha Strike.

Exactly as stated earlier. We already have all of our minis out in metal and people are ready to play now. We want the rulebook out there so people don't have to wait. Multiple shipments are a nightmare to deal with.

taken from the Reaper forums

CAVBOSS

Greetings all! Glad to see everyone is as excited as I am to finally get this thing rolling! I've added a link to a downloadable 8.5 x 11 " poster for you to print out and post at your local game-store or convention to get the word out. Any help is much appreciated! Have a great weekend!



http://talon-games.c...CAVSOFLYER1.pdf

The original CAV game was a lot of fun but it seemed as if Reaper has never had a good grasp of how to support a set of game rules over time. They all just seem to die a quiet death.

As for casting the minis in the soft plastic... not a fan. I don't mind it for organic shapes but there's nothing like the crisp detail of metal or hard plastic for mechanical objects. I don't think that the bones material is going to do the designs justice.

 Dullspork wrote:
The original CAV game was a lot of fun but it seemed as if Reaper has never had a good grasp of how to support a set of game rules over time. They all just seem to die a quiet death.

As for casting the minis in the soft plastic... not a fan. I don't mind it for organic shapes but there's nothing like the crisp detail of metal or hard plastic for mechanical objects. I don't think that the bones material is going to do the designs justice.

Fair points. Reaper Games don't seem to get much press or stick around long, but the Warlord game seems to be doing well enough that it gets an expansion every couple years. Bones CAV's are more apealing to me, but I do wonder why they didn't go with a Warlord Kickstarter. The issue is that Reaper is really a miniaitures company, not a game company. Time will tell whether putting the rules in the hands of a separate/related entity (the talon games fellow) who seems to be really committed to them will have a different result, but it's possible.

As to the PVC mecha, there is reason to be skeptical, but they can look quite good if done correctly. Some of the Mechwarrior Dark Age minis were really nice figures (some weren't) and those were not even intended for a traditional wargaming audience.

I am ok with the soft plastics, mostly for the price. I have been collecting BattleTech minis for 3 decades and because of that have a huge collection from just about every Giant Mecha Game out there. But some of the new players have trouble getting enough together to play larger games. Bones makes that possible.

I will cringe at the thought of what Bones might do to some of the detail, but it's something better than CAV's that are 10-15 dollars apiece like they are now.

I am a big fan of pewter, and I will always prefer to work with it and ABS plastic as a painter, but the price is getting bad.

What's really too bad is that I really love the CAV game designs, but I really have to urge to have anything Bones. Everything just goes "bendy", and I still am wary about how paint sticks to them.

 Dullspork wrote:
The original CAV game was a lot of fun but it seemed as if Reaper has never had a good grasp of how to support a set of game rules over time. They all just seem to die a quiet death.

It's less of a problem with Reaper supporting a game, and more a problem of simply getting traction with the game. It was certainly much harder in the earlier days of Warlord and CAV when Games Workshop dominated the miniature gaming market, and when Privateer Press was only just starting. Now, though, with GW spiraling downwards, and numerous games picking up speed, Reaper may have a better chance of getting a foothold in the wargaming market,

People are aware that having Bones versions of these mechs doesn't erase the current metals from existence, right? Or that you can, right now, buy every single one of them without waiting for a kickstarter to start and fund and end and ship? If you like mechs in metals, or you don't like the Bones plastic, there's nothing keeping you from going that route and doing so right now, you could even play the current version of CAV until the new rules come out for free here. Personally, I can't WAIT for Bones plastic mechs.

The problem of Reaper supporting the game is a legit concern, however, since Reaper is a miniatures company, not a game company. I kinda wish they'd make a games division that was fully supported by the miniatures side of the company and properly marketed, Reaper's games always seem like such an afterthought for the company. It's strange, because Reaper is such a powerhouse in the market for miniatures they surely COULD be a good games company if they brought in some real games designers, but even with a few editions of Warlord and CAV out, they just don't really want to fully invest in making games. And clearly, Reaper's business model is vary successful, but I just wonder how much more they'd sell if they also had a game driving sales on top of all the RPGs and proxies they currently sell.

One other note for folks who just like Mech miniatures, regardless of the game, the "Robot Supply Depot" section of the Reaper online shop has all the CAV sculpts that were either retired from the game, rescupted or resized. There's a number of neat figs in there, some at a nice discount from comparable sculpts in the current CAV lineup.

One nice thing about Reaper is that except for licensed miniatures where they no longer have the rights, nearly EVERY Reaper miniature ever produced is still available. Even if it is not in the current catalog.