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So after his break from gaming he has come back into our club, I've run a friendly fun list that didn't use forgeworld, unbound, or any things considered to be broken atm. After he's finished that game, he's come to me in person telling me how great it'd be to be "that guy" he likes the idea of being the gaming tyrant and no-one being able to beat him, he's asked how broken the list he's written is and after telling him that asking someone specific to a game and tailoring their list in the worst way possible he thinks it's fine if he can win. The opponnent uses a fun list and i'm concerned how affected he will be by being utterly destroyed.
Help give me some reasons for him not to want to be "that guy", and why no one would want to play him (he thinks people will be fine with him taken alllies & unbound to a fun game) if he does this

Number one reason for him to not be that guy:
If he's that guy, you won't be his regular opponent.

Just to get the full perspective here, what exactly was he saying? Was he saying he wanted to be specifically "that guy" or did he just say he wanted to try using allies and unbound?

What Alfndrate said. Dude sounds like a douchenozzle, not your problem, let him become the most hated person in your gaming group until hes shunned out of it.

"James...after much deliberation I have decided to become a huge tool. This will be a pervasive change that will be delicately woven throughout every aspect of my life.
Naturally I will require your assistance to be as big of a tool as I have envisioned. Will you do this for me James? Will you help me realise my dream?"

I'm hoping that this is a rough transcript of the conversation.

 plastictrees wrote:
"James...after much deliberation I have decided to become a huge tool. This will be a pervasive change that will be delicately woven throughout every aspect of my life.
Naturally I will require your assistance to be as big of a tool as I have envisioned. Will you do this for me James? Will you help me realise my dream?"

I'm hoping that this is a rough transcript of the conversation.

I wonder how he brought the topic up to his parents.

1. Find a new "friend".

One whom isn't a d-bag.

No matter what he shows you, tell him it's OP.
If he asks how broken Vespids are, say "They're totally OP! They get AP3 on their basic gun!"
Then, when he gets his "broken cheese" list, own him with Screamerstar or Serpent Spam. Do this repeatedly.

 plastictrees wrote:
"James...after much deliberation I have decided to become a huge tool. This will be a pervasive change that will be delicately woven throughout every aspect of my life.
Naturally I will require your assistance to be as big of a tool as I have envisioned. Will you do this for me James? Will you help me realise my dream?"

I'm hoping that this is a rough transcript of the conversation.

Actually it was pretty similar, he came up to me and said " **** I'm going to become that guy at our gaming club, but i require your assistance in making sure my list is broken as possible, and unbound seems really easy to be OP" he then said he doesn't give a about home rules (no unbound) and that he'd use it anyway

now he does seem like a when its written like this but he has some "different" circumstances relating to the parent part.

is that really the best option to just let him be hated and have no opponents?

Verviedi wrote:
No matter what he shows you, tell him it's OP.
If he asks how broken Vespids are, say "They're totally OP! They get AP3 on their basic gun!"
Then, when he gets his "broken cheese" list, own him with Screamerstar or Serpent Spam. Do this repeatedly.

This is the correct response. If someone wants your help being a douchebag, just be one back and give him all the wrong advice. Make it as convincing as possible.

I have to disagree that acting like a jerk is a good way to keep others from being jerks. This has a very high chance of leading to a poisonous culture within your gaming group. I agree that everyone should decline his challenges if he's no fun to play against but giving him a taste of his own medicine will only send the message that it is acceptable behavior.

He suddenly had this idea to be unbeatable and play overpowered things in his hobby out of nowhere? That sounds odd. He had previous experience with gaming so he should know that what he's planning is going to only ruin someone else's fun. Try to pick his brain and find his motive and why he thinks it would be enjoyable.

Maybe he's looking to feel powerful and game-bullying is appealing. What was he doing on his break? Did he get drawn into the world of xbox live and now somehow thinks being a complete tool is the norm? Maybe money is tight for him and he feels like this expensive hobby has to be justified with wins. Maybe he's just big into drugs now and doesn't care about consequences.

Maybe he's looking to play very competitive games and did a poor job at articulating this. He may be looking for more of a challenge or it could be that intentionally weak lists go against his sensibilities. If this is the case then maybe you could direct him to a more competitive group to practice his skills (and sportsmanship) with. -or maybe suggest he pick up a different game with a stronger competitive scene.

Especially if he's saying he doesn't give a crap about house rules and will violate them regardless, I'd just say the group needs to not play against him. 6 people who up, and he is one of them? A 1v1 and a 2v1. 2 show up? The other goes home without playing.

There's really no other response other than calling him on his BS attitude and seeing what that does.

Either call him out on his BS or just let him turn himself into "that guy" and tell everyone not to play him. If he wants to ruin his fun that way, let him be a dbag.

 Dais wrote:
I have to disagree that acting like a jerk is a good way to keep others from being jerks. This has a very high chance of leading to a poisonous culture within your gaming group. I agree that everyone should decline his challenges if he's no fun to play against but giving him a taste of his own medicine will only send the message that it is acceptable behavior.

He suddenly had this idea to be unbeatable and play overpowered things in his hobby out of nowhere? That sounds odd. He had previous experience with gaming so he should know that what he's planning is going to only ruin someone else's fun. Try to pick his brain and find his motive and why he thinks it would be enjoyable.

Maybe he's looking to feel powerful and game-bullying is appealing. What was he doing on his break? Did he get drawn into the world of xbox live and now somehow thinks being a complete tool is the norm? Maybe money is tight for him and he feels like this expensive hobby has to be justified with wins. Maybe he's just big into drugs now and doesn't care about consequences.

Maybe he's looking to play very competitive games and did a poor job at articulating this. He may be looking for more of a challenge or it could be that intentionally weak lists go against his sensibilities. If this is the case then maybe you could direct him to a more competitive group to practice his skills (and sportsmanship) with. -or maybe suggest he pick up a different game with a stronger competitive scene.

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break. As the gaming club host I've asked for everyone to give him a second chance and we've done that unfortunately he wants to come back to get "revenge" because he wants to win against them. Should I just point him in a direction of a less competitive club or should we just take competetive lists against him again? And yes he is fairly high ranking in Black ops 2 and does try to "troll" people.

However the third paragraph first sentence is wrong, he wants to play powerful lists against our weak ones, not balanced or visa versa.

Thanks everyone, BTW that vespid idea sounds would you uses serpentspam or screamerstar?

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break.

So he is going to do what you did to him.....and you are worried about what? That he is going to do it better?

Seems like you deserve each other.

Steelmage99 wrote:

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break.

So he is going to do what you did to him.....and you are worried about what? That he is going to do it better?

Seems like you deserve each other.

Lol sooo true, best comment I've read all day

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

 Dais wrote:
I have to disagree that acting like a jerk is a good way to keep others from being jerks. This has a very high chance of leading to a poisonous culture within your gaming group. I agree that everyone should decline his challenges if he's no fun to play against but giving him a taste of his own medicine will only send the message that it is acceptable behavior.

He suddenly had this idea to be unbeatable and play overpowered things in his hobby out of nowhere? That sounds odd. He had previous experience with gaming so he should know that what he's planning is going to only ruin someone else's fun. Try to pick his brain and find his motive and why he thinks it would be enjoyable.

Maybe he's looking to feel powerful and game-bullying is appealing. What was he doing on his break? Did he get drawn into the world of xbox live and now somehow thinks being a complete tool is the norm? Maybe money is tight for him and he feels like this expensive hobby has to be justified with wins. Maybe he's just big into drugs now and doesn't care about consequences.

Maybe he's looking to play very competitive games and did a poor job at articulating this. He may be looking for more of a challenge or it could be that intentionally weak lists go against his sensibilities. If this is the case then maybe you could direct him to a more competitive group to practice his skills (and sportsmanship) with. -or maybe suggest he pick up a different game with a stronger competitive scene.

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break. As the gaming club host I've asked for everyone to give him a second chance and we've done that unfortunately he wants to come back to get "revenge" because he wants to win against them. Should I just point him in a direction of a less competitive club or should we just take competetive lists against him again? And yes he is fairly high ranking in Black ops 2 and does try to "troll" people.

However the third paragraph first sentence is wrong, he wants to play powerful lists against our weak ones, not balanced or visa versa.

Thanks everyone, BTW that vespid idea sounds would you uses serpentspam or screamerstar?

Not sure I understand. So he wants to be "that guy" because you and everyone else demolished him and then laughed at him? The plot thickens....

Steelmage99 wrote:

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break.

So he is going to do what you did to him.....and you are worried about what? That he is going to do it better?

Seems like you deserve each other.

It seems like you misunderstand me, when he did this whole competetive douche thing and laugh at our fluffy players last time our reply was to take competetive lists back

Sounds like your whole club is stuck in a toxic cycle.

 curran12 wrote:
Sounds like your whole club is stuck in a toxic cycle.

Which is why instead of replying the same way we did last time I think it'd be good to ask some people on dakka dakka for some alternate options. Instead I get told that I deserved it because we took a competetive list against his competetive list and won

The problem is that by your own admission, your club isn't exactly handling maturely either. Look at your first response to him, it wasn't a matter of "we need to talk to this guy and figure out what we can do so we can all be happy", it was "we're gonna kick his ass and learn him good." To top it off, you also admitted to laughing at him when you had your revenge stomping on him. Is this the way you want your club to act? This isn't a gaming club, it's a gang of bullies at that point, and you're shocked that he is going this way to respond? If I got kicked around and laughed at, why would I want to EVER play nice with you guys?

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

 Dais wrote:
I have to disagree that acting like a jerk is a good way to keep others from being jerks. This has a very high chance of leading to a poisonous culture within your gaming group. I agree that everyone should decline his challenges if he's no fun to play against but giving him a taste of his own medicine will only send the message that it is acceptable behavior.

He suddenly had this idea to be unbeatable and play overpowered things in his hobby out of nowhere? That sounds odd. He had previous experience with gaming so he should know that what he's planning is going to only ruin someone else's fun. Try to pick his brain and find his motive and why he thinks it would be enjoyable.

Maybe he's looking to feel powerful and game-bullying is appealing. What was he doing on his break? Did he get drawn into the world of xbox live and now somehow thinks being a complete tool is the norm? Maybe money is tight for him and he feels like this expensive hobby has to be justified with wins. Maybe he's just big into drugs now and doesn't care about consequences.

Maybe he's looking to play very competitive games and did a poor job at articulating this. He may be looking for more of a challenge or it could be that intentionally weak lists go against his sensibilities. If this is the case then maybe you could direct him to a more competitive group to practice his skills (and sportsmanship) with. -or maybe suggest he pick up a different game with a stronger competitive scene.

When he left last time it was because we took competitive lists against him and laughed when HE lost causing him to take that break. As the gaming club host I've asked for everyone to give him a second chance and we've done that unfortunately he wants to come back to get "revenge" because he wants to win against them. Should I just point him in a direction of a less competitive club or should we just take competetive lists against him again? And yes he is fairly high ranking in Black ops 2 and does try to "troll" people.

However the third paragraph first sentence is wrong, he wants to play powerful lists against our weak ones, not balanced or visa versa.

Thanks everyone, BTW that vespid idea sounds would you uses serpentspam or screamerstar?

So let me get this straight.....your "non-competitive" club used competitive lists to beat him and pushed him away from the game.

When he came back looking to play in the same style that you played against him, you moved the goalposts by saying that the club was now non-competitive and labeled him as "that guy".

You proceed to complain about the problem your club has created both for this person and itself on dakka instead of actually talking to the player.

You are now considering giving advice to him, that you yourself believe to be false and may influence him to spend his money unwisely, with the intention of countering it the next game and beating him down again.

Am I understanding this right!?

If I saw players at a club giving advice to people with the intention of misinforming them, with the intention of some misguided attempt to 'teach' them a lesson, which would ultimately end in said player being put down again (possibly with the inclusion of financial loss), I would let them know what was happening. If these morals were prevalent, then I would not return. Totally toxic.

The answer to this is simple: be the better person, talk with the guy and understand what kind of game he wants, and then attempt to accommodate him accordingly.

If it is competitive games he is after, then set up a league with competitive games in mind. If the rest of the players don't wish to do this, then simply tell him that he won't find many games if he continues attempting to play as he is.

Create some house rules, such as highlander, which will limit the amount of competitive units on the field.

If he doesn't follow club house rules, then tell him he won't get a game. Simple.

He will either adapt, or he will leave.

We played fluff almost exclusively even when before he came, after 3 months of curb stomping several of the players(my good friends) we decided that if he'd rather play competitively we would do that too, after one game were the thousand son player beat him(being legit here) we never saw him again until now, ive specifically asked everyone to give him another chance because we felt bad for him leaving and this is what he proclaims after we've had one game(both fluffy lists)

BTW the laughing part was because they clubs players vindicator shot scattered and simultaneously took out two land raiders. I commented on the vespid idea because it was funny, I wouldn't actually make him buy any our tau player would lend him some to trial(he has like 3 squads)

And we do actually have a extensive amount of house rules, I sit down and read each rule book to pick out anything that can be exploited, but he said that he dosent care if it's a house rule because it's in the rule book he can use it. I'm not sure if calling us bullies is appropriate and I don't know why its a problem on dakka.

I hope this post responds to everything

The problem is that warhammer can be played in a variety of ways and with differing mindsets.

Some people just buy whatever models take their fancy. Or they have some idea of what they want their army to be without regards to the rules. This makes for a very fluffy/ friendly way of playing.

On the other hand other players, myself included, like to build competitive armies. If you wanted me to make a fluffy army, I would try and do so in the most competitive way(space marine bike armies, or 6th edition tzeentch flying circus for example). However, if this was not possible, then I would have a difficult time, as I would always be at odds with myself as to why I should choose this 'fluffy' but garbage unit. Picking an army of said units would not be as fun for me as attempteing to make the most efficient list I could.

As I said in my last post, I would recommend some kind of competitive scene being set up, which he and players like him could play the way that they want to play, and a more houseruled scene for standard play. If this isn't the direction the club wants to take, then suggest to him a more competitive club.

Alternatively you could suggest to him to make 2 lists for when he attends, one competitive, and one non-competitive. This is what we do when we play. This way no one should be caught out by someone bringing a tournament list vs a fluffy one.

Will do as you suggested big blind bill, problem is he dosent like facing other competitive armies so I will probably have to direct him to the other club. A shame I guess but better than continuing that cycle.

Though I do want to make sure that the people that said that it was a toxic/venemous environment regret that thought as I do try to make it the friendliest sort of environment possible, I can ignore the personal insult though

If you get to know his lists for the next session, tip off his likely opponents to tailor their lists against them.

Lol. How old are you guys?

 calamarialldayerrday wrote:
Lol. How old are you guys?

I'd tell you but unfortunately most people generate a preset opinion of someone's attitudes depending on their age, so I'd rather not tell you in order to have you have an opinion of me depending on my attitude and not my age.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Skinnereal wrote:
If you get to know his lists for the next session, tip off his likely opponents to tailor their lists against them.

I'd certainly like to do that but it seems like that if I like a suggestion "certain" people comment on how bad of a person I am in response.

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

 calamarialldayerrday wrote:
Lol. How old are you guys?

I'd tell you but unfortunately most people generate a preset opinion of someone's attitudes depending on their age, so I'd rather not tell you in order to have you have an opinion of me depending on my attitude and not my age.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Skinnereal wrote:
If you get to know his lists for the next session, tip off his likely opponents to tailor their lists against them.

I'd certainly like to do that but it seems like that if I like a suggestion "certain" people comment on how bad of a person I am in response.

OK. Here is a piece of actual serious advice.

You are going to have to talk with him....not to him or at him....but actual communication.
During this communication you are only allowed to talk about how YOU feel or YOUR worries. You are not allowed to guess at why he is doing what he is doing, you are not allowed to blame him and you cannot start a sentence with the word "You".

Do not reference Dakka, the Internet or "all the other guys at the club".....just stick to using "I".

(Here is your chance to practice)

What would you actually say to him?

This sounds like teenager stuff, haha.

You can always do what you guys did the first time though, it worked the first time, right?



Seriously though, a more mature club would have banned him the first go around instead of making competitive lists or the owner would have asked him quietly to fix himself or not come back. It would be the owner of the FLGS/wherever you play to ask such a thing. If all the players had a problem, a mature discussion would have worked too, or contacting the owner in private to fix these issues. I don't understand it, there are so many good FLGS out there, and then the other half of them ruins the reputation of the first. It's not rocket science how to be mature and run a business or a gaming club but, I do imagine it takes more effort then chewing on crayola crayons.

What ever happened to treating others as you would be treated/acting like a gentleman and approaching an issue straight forward? It seems it is so commonplace to stir the pot and let BS fester than the cut through it this latest generation.

Steelmage99 wrote:

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

 calamarialldayerrday wrote:
Lol. How old are you guys?

Do not reference Dakka, the Internet or "all the other guys at the club".....just stick to using "I".

(Here is your chance to practice)

What would you actually say to him?

Actually, why am I bothering? Steelmage99 nailed it.