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Made in de
Dakka Veteran




Eacute cole Militaire (Paris)

Hi,
I have a very unusual request this Time.
I visit the Same Game Store with some Times of absence for about 10 years.
I saw two owners come and go, several employes and Never had any Problems.
Even when im Not in france i let my wife buy items there Even they dont have a discount on gw stuff.
They also Order forgeworld stuff for you without shipping Costs.
I did so several Times ( Titans, thunderhawk, several small items and a mechanicum Army).
Wont say im the money wise best Client, but could easy be.

I was in the store at saturday to preorder the new blood angels.
Picked up a stormraven while doing so.
When unboxing at home i noticed that the canopy was missing.
I went back to the store and told the employe about the Problem.
His answer " this is impossible".
I told him it is clearly possible.
He " you lost the canopy on another stormraven and now want a cheap replacement!!!
Arguing goes on and on finally he told me i should wait he is going to unpack another one and give me the canopy.
He returns with a complete stormraven telling me i should take the whole item and bring back the incomplete one.
I told him that this is nonsense but he just repeated" take it".
I wanted to Leave the store.
When i was about to leave he yelled" this [see forum posting rules] is a thief hold him".
The Guards from the mall where coming at me.
I told them Not to Touch me, that it is Not my fault etc but one of em tried to grab me.
Kicked him hard and Ten minutes later Police came in.
They noticed everything but the gamestore employe says i stole it...
What is the best Way to react?

Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace.
For if you do, one day you will look behind you and you will see us And on that day, you will reap it,
and we will send you to whatever god you wish.  
   
Made in gb
Worthiest of Warlock Engineers






preston

That.... Im not sure.
But boycot his store and warn your friends/group.

Free from GW's tyranny and the hobby is looking better for it
DR:90-S++G+++M++B++I+Pww205++D++A+++/sWD146R++T(T)D+
 
   
Made in us
Daemonic Dreadnought





Eye of Terror

So, first things first. If there is a part missing from a kit, call GW. Do not deal with the store. GW has a really good record of dealing with quality defects and would likely send you the canopy free of charge.

Second, this sounds like a misunderstanding that got out of hand. I am not sure if there was a cultural / language issue, but people don't generally tell you to leave with something then call you a thief.

If someone at a store starts yelling at you to stop, believing you are stealing, employees have a limited right to detain you to address the issue. If guards come, then you really ought to take a moment and sort things out.

It does sound like the person was being rude, however. If there's a cultural mix up, it's your job (the store employee) to solve it without things getting so far out of hand. I suggest you find another place to buy 40k stuff (i.e. the Warstore or Frontline gaming).

   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran




Eacute cole Militaire (Paris)

Dakka " tilts" my n word, he called me nikka( im from Israel, Little choclat)

Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace.
For if you do, one day you will look behind you and you will see us And on that day, you will reap it,
and we will send you to whatever god you wish.  
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






If a retail product is missing a piece, often you need to talk to the manufacturer, not the store, and the store is never expected to open another box and give you a piece. At best you can have a refund if you are within the stores refund policy.

You should have called GW and they would have given you a replacement.

I think giving you a complete replacement model and bring back the incomplete one is pretty over the top good customer service... Sounds like he was willing to exchange product. If you wanted an exchange you should have brought your receipt and product to exchange. You came grossly unprepared for basic commercial interaction with business owners and executing your consumer rights.

Are you sure he didn't bring a replacement up asking for 'the product to be exchanged' and you didn't misinterpret and try to take it with a 'I will take it home and bring back the other one'? Maybe he was willing to exchange assuming you had the incomplete kit with you.

You do not have the right to kick other people. You should be glad you are not hurt worse than you were because were unreasonable and deserved to be arrested for assault. You don't have the right to 'not be touched or detained'. Just cooperate until things are sorted out. if you turn insane and start committing physical violence, you will lose all credibility and probably end up in jail.

You made the wrong decision at every turn, and that assumes we are getting the straight story from you...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/08 15:00:15


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Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




Once you kick a guard and have to have the police called for possible assault, it becomes a great deal harder for you to have it sorted.
It's likely it's been logged even if you where not charged, so to any outsider looking in its not going to look good for you.

As nkelsch said, you really didn't handle the situation right. No store will hand you a replacement without the return of the defective or incomplete original returned.
So I would assume it's possible miss understanding, which means maybe an apology is your best option now.
   
Made in dk
Stormin' Stompa





You have a wife, meaning that you are an adult.....and yet decides that an appropriate response was kicking a mall guard like a child?

-------------------------------------------------------
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18.000 3.500 8.200 3.300 2.400 3.100 5.500 2.500 3.200 3.000


 
   
Made in no
Stealthy Grot Snipa





So, you bought a product, discovered it was defective, went back to the store without the product in question, asked for a replacement part, there was a hubbub, and you assaulted a security guard?

Yeah, you're an idiot.

When you buy something and it's broken/have missing parts, bring it back to the store with your receipt, exchange for another product or get your money back. If you can do all that without assaulting anyone, that'd be even better.

"The Emporer is a rouge trader."
- Charlie Chaplain. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Louisiana

 winterwind85 wrote:
Hi,
I have a very unusual request this Time.
I visit the Same Game Store with some Times of absence for about 10 years.
I saw two owners come and go, several employes and Never had any Problems.
Even when im Not in france i let my wife buy items there Even they dont have a discount on gw stuff.
They also Order forgeworld stuff for you without shipping Costs.
I did so several Times ( Titans, thunderhawk, several small items and a mechanicum Army).
Wont say im the money wise best Client, but could easy be.

I was in the store at saturday to preorder the new blood angels.
Picked up a stormraven while doing so.
When unboxing at home i noticed that the canopy was missing.
I went back to the store and told the employe about the Problem.
His answer " this is impossible".
I told him it is clearly possible.
He " you lost the canopy on another stormraven and now want a cheap replacement!!!
Arguing goes on and on finally he told me i should wait he is going to unpack another one and give me the canopy.
He returns with a complete stormraven telling me i should take the whole item and bring back the incomplete one.
I told him that this is nonsense but he just repeated" take it".
I wanted to Leave the store.
When i was about to leave he yelled" this [see forum posting rules] is a thief hold him".
The Guards from the mall where coming at me.
I told them Not to Touch me, that it is Not my fault etc but one of em tried to grab me.
Kicked him hard and Ten minutes later Police came in.
They noticed everything but the gamestore employe says i stole it...
What is the best Way to react?


Holy cow. Get a lawyer. You need to get in touch with GW HQ, and you need to cover yourself in the mean time, so get a lawyer.

If there are no charges being pressed by anyone, and you aren't in any legal trouble, the need for a lawyer is not so pressing. Regardless, this should be reported to GW HQ ASAP. I don't know the best way to do that, but you can always start with a call to GW customer service which I expect will get escalated quickly.

Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"

AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."

AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
 
   
Made in gb
40kenthus




Manchester UK

I get the impression it's an independent store, not a GW.

If you didn't want to take the kit, why did you?

Seems like everything you could have done wrong, you did do wrong!

I'd just avoid that store in future and buy online.

Member of the "Awesome Wargaming Dudes"

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Louisiana

 monders wrote:
I get the impression it's an independent store, not a GW.


Oh snap, you are probably right about it being an independent retailer. In that case, the OP should suck it up and be glad he isn't in jail. If this happened in a GW retail location, that's a whole different story as GW has a lot more potential liability.

You can always call GW customer service and they will probably send you a complete replacement kit.

Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"

AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."

AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
 
   
Made in gb
Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control





Twickenham, London

I don't judge you for kicking a security guard because you most likely felt threatened in some way. You'd have been a bit more justified in knocking the employee that was racist to you about though. Sounds like the employee was a jerk but why didn't you get the manager?

"If you don't have Funzo, you're nothin'!"
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Never use a long word where a short one will do. 
   
Made in gb
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General




We'll find out soon enough eh.

weeble1000 wrote:
 monders wrote:
I get the impression it's an independent store, not a GW.


Oh snap, you are probably right about it being an independent retailer. In that case, the OP should suck it up and be glad he isn't in jail. If this happened in a GW retail location, that's a whole different story as GW has a lot more potential liability.

You can always call GW customer service and they will probably send you a complete replacement kit.


Not sure about France, but in the UK at least your "contract" is always with the retailer where you bought the item not the manufacturer when considering faulty goods or items "not fit for purpose", and it's their responsibility to make it right. Given the EU's general stance on consumer rights laws I'd imagine something similar applies.

Kicking a guard was probably a bad plan, but frankly I've met enough petty, vindictive, couldn't-pass-the-police-exams Little Hitlers working retail security that I have no problem believing his actions were provoked and possibly entirely justifiable, even if technically illegal. Sadly, if the chain of events described is accurate, letting his temper get the better of him with the guard has probably killed any chance he had of getting the mall management to punish the game store guy for falsely accusing him of theft and being a vile racist gak.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/08 17:06:06


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Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter






Sounds like a whole lot of gak.

You shouldn't of kicked the mall cop.

If the manager knows you id start there. or get a lawyer. or both.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Scott-S6 wrote:
And yet another thread is hijacked for Unit to ask for the same advice, receive the same answers and make the same excuses.

Oh my god I'm becoming martel.
Send help!

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Louisiana

 Yodhrin wrote:
weeble1000 wrote:
 monders wrote:
I get the impression it's an independent store, not a GW.


Oh snap, you are probably right about it being an independent retailer. In that case, the OP should suck it up and be glad he isn't in jail. If this happened in a GW retail location, that's a whole different story as GW has a lot more potential liability.

You can always call GW customer service and they will probably send you a complete replacement kit.


Not sure about France, but in the UK at least your "contract" is always with the retailer where you bought the item not the manufacturer when considering faulty goods or items "not fit for purpose", and it's their responsibility to make it right. Given the EU's general stance on consumer rights laws I'd imagine something similar applies.


You are probably correct. In any case, GW customer service would likely deal with it. But what I meant about GW having more liability was with respect to the provocative actions of the sales clerk. If a GW store manager had behaved like that, GW would be exposed to a range of potential liability.

Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"

AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."

AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
 
   
Made in fi
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine






Finland

 Thud wrote:
So, you bought a product, discovered it was defective, went back to the store without the product in question, asked for a replacement part, there was a hubbub, and you assaulted a security guard?


Coffee status: Spilled on my table.

   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 winterwind85 wrote:

The Guards from the mall where coming at me.
I told them Not to Touch me, that it is Not my fault etc but one of em tried to grab me.
Kicked him hard and Ten minutes later Police came in.
They noticed everything but the gamestore employe says i stole it...
What is the best Way to react?


Up until this you had my sympathy, but I'm afraid you can't go kicking security staff,

even if you can get the situation with the 'theft' cleared up (see if you can get the police to get hold of any store video to support your story) you are probably looking at some sort of assault charge and a ban from the mall

work on your temper, and in future ask for the police yourself as they are much more likely to try and get to the root of the problem than security staff who's wages are paid by the mall/store

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Florida

I might have grown up listening to too much Ice T. What's wrong with assaulting cops again?

I'm a bit confused. *Did* you take the offered Stormraven out of the store?

\m/ 
   
Made in us
Hurr! Ogryn Bone 'Ead!





Bowling Green Ohio

I definitely think there was some kind of a translation error going on here.
This is insane.
Maybe instead of kicking the guard, try to explain what happened, or what you thought happened.
If I've learned anythimg from these types of misunderstandings, if you stay calm, as long as the guards aren't playing super-cop, you won't have any problems.

I had a similar thing happen to me at a book store one time, there was a promotional buy one get one free. So I bought my book, and selected another book of equal value, checked out, and walked out the door. As I walked out the siren went off, and there were guards all around me within seconds.

One of them did grab me, but I did not kick him, I offered them my bag and my receipt. After checking, they noticed that only one item got rang up, but I had two. So I told them to go ask the cashier if they didn't believe me about the special.

I was clear in minutes. No problems.

I think in your case there was a miscommunication, a bad word was said, and things got heated.

Maybe it seems like he tried to screw you, but I don't think anybody is that much of a prick...especially in a scenario in a mall like this.

Thanks
Austin

Thought for the day: It is better to die for the Emperor than to live for yourself
 
   
Made in us
Veteran Knight Baron in a Crusader





It doesn't sound the store owner is the problem here...
   
Made in us
Zealous Sin-Eater



Chico, CA

You kicked the rent-a-cop, how old are you?

Peter: As we all know, Christmas is that mystical time of year when the ghost of Jesus rises from the grave to feast on the flesh of the living! So we all sing Christmas Carols to lull him back to sleep.
Bob: Outrageous, How dare he say such blasphemy. I've got to do something.
Man #1: Bob, there's nothing you can do.
Bob: Well, I guess I'll just have to develop a sense of humor.  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Louisiana

Noir wrote:
You kicked the rent-a-cop, how old are you?


Okay, to the OP kicked a mall cop. That has been established. However, it was my impression that the OP was asking for advice about how to proceed going forward.

One can't unkick the mall cop, and I think that repeatedly expressing the quite obvious viewpoint that assaulting a mall cop is not a terribly good idea nor an effective way to de-escalate a tense situation is rather unproductive.

Of course, one could interpret the OP as asking about the best way to have reacted in that situation, in which case I suppose saying that kicking a mall cop is childish is sort of on point. If that is what the OP is looking for, fine. But then what is the point of this thread?

Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"

AlexHolker: "The power loader is a forklift. The public doesn't complain about a forklift not having frontal armour protecting the crew compartment because the only enemy it is designed to face is the OHSA violation."

AlexHolker: "Allow me to put it this way: Paramount is Skynet, reboots are termination attempts, and your childhood is John Connor."
 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Lawyer up.
   
Made in no
Terrifying Doombull





Hefnaheim

 Thud wrote:
So, you bought a product, discovered it was defective, went back to the store without the product in question, asked for a replacement part, there was a hubbub, and you assaulted a security guard?

Yeah, you're an idiot.

When you buy something and it's broken/have missing parts, bring it back to the store with your receipt, exchange for another product or get your money back. If you can do all that without assaulting anyone, that'd be even better.


Agreed and agreed
   
Made in us
Blood-Raging Khorne Berserker





Pittsburgh, PA



This is the only advice that anyone should be giving you, although it sounds like you were (way) in the wrong.

The fact that you had to ask for that advice tells me you're probably making this up, though, because that's so blatantly obvious it shouldn't need to be stated, and I have a hard time believing that someone would ask this seriously on a totally unrelated forum.
   
Made in gb
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord






 Bi'ios wrote:


The fact that you had to ask for that advice tells me you're probably making this up, though, because that's so blatantly obvious it shouldn't need to be stated, and I have a hard time believing that someone would ask this seriously on a totally unrelated forum.


This. My Internet BS senses are tingling.




Games Workshop Delenda Est.

Users on ignore- 53.

If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Florida

 Redbad wrote:
One of them did grab me, but I did not kick him, I offered them my bag and my receipt. After checking, they noticed that only one item got rang up, but I had two. So I told them to go ask the cashier if they didn't believe me about the special.


They're not supposed to grab. Even in the states (where it's illegal to be black), you can sue for assault if a mall cop touches you.

\m/ 
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

nkelsch wrote:
If a retail product is missing a piece, often you need to talk to the manufacturer, not the store, and the store is never expected to open another box and give you a piece. At best you can have a refund if you are within the stores refund policy.

Retail rules vary from country to country. Here in Oz, there is never a requirement to go to the manufacturer... You are always entitled to a refund or exchange from the store you bought the product from.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 melkorthetonedeaf wrote:
 Redbad wrote:
One of them did grab me, but I did not kick him, I offered them my bag and my receipt. After checking, they noticed that only one item got rang up, but I had two. So I told them to go ask the cashier if they didn't believe me about the special.


They're not supposed to grab. Even in the states (where it's illegal to be black), you can sue for assault if a mall cop touches you.

As with retail laws, I would hesitate to make any sort of judgement on what is and isn't allowable behaviour from security personel based solely on US law.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/08 22:22:42


 
   
Made in se
Dakka Veteran





Sweden

I smell troll.

An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.  
   
Made in us
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife





Anyone elses BS'ometer spiking ?

 daedalus wrote:

I mean, it's Dakka. I thought snide arguments from emotion were what we did here.


 
   
 
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