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Hello to you all.
First of all I would like to say that I'm totally new in miniature hobby, with one game behind me, but want to share my opinion about tough subject of prices.
Since I read DD and Bols everyday I see " GW prices are too high" "GW is a joke" etc. For me prices are fair enough. And i say that with all sanity of my mind. Why?
lets take Dark Vengeance and Infinity Icestorm sets.
DV retail price is 85euro, you can get for 75-80 from independent shops. contains 49 amazingly detailed models, rulebook, dice etc. 49 high quality models.
Icestorm. 90+euro for 14 models, that probably will miss some part, paper battlefield etc.
lets add Warmahorde box sets. 2player boxset 99$ retail for 20 models. legion of everblight 49.99$ for 6 models.
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market. and quality cost. LEGO prices are awfully hight. 20euro for miniature Millennium Falcon. or 200euro for a big one. why its so high? because of quality. big companies dont care about "recession" or " because kid has no money". No one cares that i have no money to buy brand new house, no one cares that PS4 games are 70+euro, and probably will last for 2 evenings, or game wont be even fully developed ( assassins creed).
Quality= price. have that in mind before you start shouting that something is overpriced.
Thank you for your time.
Outside the starter sets, GW minis are felt to be expensive.
The DV box and others like it, are seen as very good value, in GW terms. It is not a good comparison to use with other games.
Try looking for a list used in a 'normal' game, and price up the models needed to build it. Then, add in the books and rules needed to play it.
Only then can you compare prices per game.
Even then, what is a normal game? I'd say 40k is between 1500 and 2000 points, but we usually play 1000 points at our club, due to having only 4 hours to play.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/28 14:35:36
Yes. books are bit expensive, but one night not going out will pay Maybe i have different look at it because i dont play, just paint so price per model is quite important to me. got 10 Blightkings for a 100. I'm mad, i know, but for a 100 i could get 3 warjacks that are not as high quality.
At Sergeant. that what i wanted to say. If you cant afford you dont buy. you can try alternative. back in '90s we had one Warhammer RPG book for 10 people. but still had a lot of fun.
However, once you buy the starter set, you then have to spend another £2-300 to get a reasonable sized force.
Infinity can be played with a full sized (300 point) force (and with a free rulebook) for £50-60. And I would strongly argue that the quality of the Infinity sculpts blows GW out of the water.
And you talk about quality = price, yet ignore the fact that you are paying more for the Infinity starter for less models than the GW starter, so clearly as you are paying more per model you should be getting much higher quality stuff from Infinity*
You have hit on the age-old price-per-model versus price-to-play debate.
Generally-speaking, lots of gamers tend to do price comparisons in terms of price-to-play rather than price-per-model.
Most sci-fi/fantasy table top wargames tend to sit somewhere around $100-$200 in terms of price-to-play a game that takes into account the full scope of the game rules. GW blows that out of the water. GW also tends to sell economy of scale miniatures, and when compared to competing miniatures using a similar production method, cost per model is usually much higher for GW. Most HIPS plastic troopers clock in at about $1 +/-. They are also often packed in large volume boxes with repeat sprues, e.g. 30 miniatures in 3 shots of the same mold, 10 models per frame. GW often sells its plastic models in smaller numbers with a higher, and insanely variable, price-per-model. A Cadian Shock Trooper is about $3/model whereas a Tactical Marine is about $4/model, an Assault Marine is about $7/model, and a Space Marine Captain is $30/model. GW prices by value in the game as opposed to value in design/material/manufacture/etc.
Historicals tend to be a little bit different as miniatures are generally viewed to be game-fungible and rules are often cheap or free. In that context, cost per model can be more of an issue as when you are in the market for a unit of historically accurate XYZ soldiers, there's often a range of companies producing appropriate models. That said, historical models also tend to be much less expensive on a per-model basis, so price-per-model is less of a salient issue compared to sculpt, production quality, accuracy, options, etc.
Kirasu: Have we fallen so far that we are excited that GW is giving us the opportunity to spend 58$ for JUST the rules? Surprised it's not "Dataslate: Assault Phase"
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So this thread is what, part of your interview process?
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Got a full Kingdoms of Men fantasy army of 92 models from Perry miniatures (and growing!).
It costs exactly 60GBP (or $91). The quality is the same as GWs: they were made by the same sculptors, the Perry twins, who used to work for GW after all. I can get the rules for free or cheaply.
92 models, $91. Great quality plastic, offers a lot in terms of customization.
Dark Vengeance is what, 65GBP ($98.6)? For 49 snapfit models that doesn't really offer much in terms on customization/conversion. And you need to buy more models to have a proper army. You don't even have the rulebooks.
bartman wrote: Hello to you all.
First of all I would like to say that I'm totally new in miniature hobby, with one game behind me, but want to share my opinion about tough subject of prices.
Since I read DD and Bols everyday I see " GW prices are too high" "GW is a joke" etc. For me prices are fair enough. And i say that with all sanity of my mind. Why?
lets take Dark Vengeance and Infinity Icestorm sets.
DV retail price is 85euro, you can get for 75-80 from independent shops. contains 49 amazingly detailed models, rulebook, dice etc. 49 high quality models.
Icestorm. 90+euro for 14 models, that probably will miss some part, paper battlefield etc.
lets add Warmahorde box sets. 2player boxset 99$ retail for 20 models. legion of everblight 49.99$ for 6 models.
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market. and quality cost. LEGO prices are awfully hight. 20euro for miniature Millennium Falcon. or 200euro for a big one. why its so high? because of quality. big companies dont care about "recession" or " because kid has no money". No one cares that i have no money to buy brand new house, no one cares that PS4 games are 70+euro, and probably will last for 2 evenings, or game wont be even fully developed ( assassins creed).
Quality= price. have that in mind before you start shouting that something is overpriced.
Thank you for your time.
PS: i dont work for GW
Quality being subjective :/
Its true that box sets are relatively the same price but the difference is that with infinity or WH you are basically done and can play at most levels, while dark vengeance you are at... what 500 points? when regular games are played at roughly 1500-2000. as well you still need to get the codecs which add to the price.
TLDR: Inf WH: makes you want to buy more. 40k: Requires you to buy more.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
heartserenade wrote: Got a full Kingdoms of Men fantasy army of 92 models from Perry miniatures (and growing!).
It costs exactly 60GBP (or $91). The quality is the same as GWs: they were made by the same sculptors, the Perry twins, who used to work for GW after all. I can get the rules for free or cheaply.
92 models, $91. Great quality plastic, offers a lot in terms of customization.
Dark Vengeance is what, 65GBP ($98.6)? For 49 snapfit models that doesn't really offer much in terms on customization/conversion. And you need to buy more models to have a proper army. You don't even have the rulebooks.
You get 1 main rule book but yeah you need the codexs
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/28 17:50:14
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market.
Not only is that subjective, its just nonsense. Do they have the best quality historicals? How about the best quality 6mm minis? How is there spaceship range these days?
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market. and quality cost. LEGO prices are awfully hight. 20euro for miniature Millennium Falcon. or 200euro for a big one. why its so high? because of quality. big companies dont care about "recession" or " because kid has no money". No one cares that i have no money to buy brand new house, no one cares that PS4 games are 70+euro, and probably will last for 2 evenings, or game wont be even fully developed ( assassins creed).
Quality= price. have that in mind before you start shouting that something is overpriced.
Thank you for your time.
PS: i dont work for GW
I would strongly advise you to do more research into the wargaming hobby at large before you make claims about GW being the best in the market or equating their price with their quality.
As mentioned in this thread already, other companies offer the same or better quality sculpts for cheaper, and offer better quality rules for much, much cheaper, if note outright free.
Much of GW's product line is overpriced. By how much is up for debate, but I can't imagine there are many people thinking a basic tactical squad or a rhino being worth what they're asking.
All that being said, GW still makes good kits, but they are not the best, nor do I feel they're worth the asking price.
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Its true that box sets are relatively the same price but the difference is that with infinity or WH you are basically done and can play at most levels, while dark vengeance you are at... what 500 points? when regular games are played at roughly 1500-2000. as well you still need to get the codecs which add to the price.
TLDR: Inf WH: makes you want to buy more. 40k: Requires you to buy more.
Highlighted bit is it in a nutshell. Just got a mate of mine into Infinity. He enjoys the odd boardgame and wargame (if the stuff is provided for it) but is a casual fan and doesn't want to splash out. He got a starter set of Combined Army for £30, got a couple of extra blisters for £5 second hand. That's enough to get him started, he's downloaded the rules for free off the website, uses their army builder online, and can already start playing. He's printed off some of the rules summaries from the website just to help get started.
The important here is that with that he is going to be playing 200pts+, which is well within the suggested points range at which Infinity is enjoyable. You couldn't even get close to that with any of GW's current range, short of buying a blunt instrument for that amount and bashing someone over the head when they leave a store and stealing their stuff.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/28 18:43:20
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market.
Not only is that subjective, its just nonsense. Do they have the best quality historicals? How about the best quality 6mm minis? How is there spaceship range these days?
By any objective standard, it is hard to say they are the best as well. If you compare apples to apples (hard plastic to hard plastic, resin to resin, metal to metal...) - no, dead wrong, pretty much across the board.
Now, he might like the way they look - that is fine. That has nothing to do with quality at all. Personally - to my eye - almost everything GW does is gak. Across the board, top to bottom. There are a few spots which are not horribad and can be made to look pretty good, but they are few and far between (often obscured by chibi jets and baby carrying robots...).
However, if you go looking for the best metal miniatures - it would probably be Infinity right now (for those in wide circulation). Technically excellent, fit is generally spot on, price compared to metal from GW? Wow...GW, much be mixing a bit of gold in their smelting pots.
Best resin is a harder one - GW resin sucks badly. Forge World resin can be good - can be god awful. Reliably good resin casts generally come out of your small operators. I have never had a bad Zealot, Kabuki or HiTech cast for example. Plenty of others that generally are producing bubble free and clean casts with resin. GW is not one of them. About half the time, neither is Forge World. Price wise, with the exception of some of the smaller boutiques, they are generally the same or lower.
Best hard plastic narrows the field a good bit. GW have a larger selection - but many poor items. Perry Brothers are one of he best for plastic miniatures. The new WGF is also excellent. The value you get from those companies far exceeds what you get from GW often by many times. Options range from few to many, depending on what you are buying and from whom. From what I have seen of the Robotech miniatures - they are excellent as well.
Books and printed material? Between same day/next day FAQs and errata, poor editing and copy/paste filler for the last 20 years, GW really isn't too impressive. Without even looking too far (FFG's line of GWRPG books) you see a much higher production value book, with more new information, better artwork and layout, for a lower price.
Granted, if you want to move the goal posts around a bit and say GW have the best grim-dark, science fantasy, hard plastic miniatures...I'll give you that.
Price to play is where GW really falls on its face. Few years ago, I priced out a few dozen 2000 point armies for GW (using peer reviewed lists...from various internet forums of what was considered "good"). Not including the extra bits to actually finish the lists. On average, to get to that level it was between $350 and $450 with some being over $500. Add Codices and Rulebooks for another $100 or so at the time. In order to pick up the rest of the special options - you would probably need to spend an additional $25-50 on bits for each army.
Compare that to Infinity, Warmachine, X-Wing or pretty much any other game that is competing for the same dollars - and GW is 4-5 times more expensive to get playable forces with.
Time is another not insignificant consideration. Generally speaking, you can play two or three games of the other games in the same amount of time that you can play one GW game. Because the rules are so badly stretched out of what they were originally designed for - it doesn't play well, and as I understand it has even gotten a bit worse with recent additions. Being able to actually play a full game without having to set aside an entire evening (important once you get the house, kids and all the rest of that) and the quality in rules becomes so much more obvious.
1. Startersets for GW do NOT contain the rules. They have a short starter guide for the basics but they do not contain the ruleset. Getting all the rules for your army (GW) costs more than some armies in other games.
2. The starter might contain more models, but those are a barely playable set, you'll have to invest a LOT more if you want to make something out of it.
3. GW starters are not ballanced. You'll get like 500 pts of one faction and maybe 300 for another (while again, you need like 1000 for a halfway-normal game and the infinity starters give you enough for both players to do something usefull)
4. If you simply go by model count, check bolt action. For 80€ you'll get like 60 models and some tanks-guns.
#3 is likely the worst offender of the bunch. Most starters give both players an equal footing to experiment and learn. 40k heavily skews it in favor of the "star" army (i.e. Space Marines) to the point where there's almost no way they can lose, so one player is going to have a great time winning and the other is going to get tired of having his face bashed in every game. But hey you can just spend a few hundred more to fix that...
Basically nothing about GW games is intended to promote a fun game, it's intended to sell figures and everything else is an unintended side effect.
Funny thing, I've been spending all the money I used to spend on wargaming on Legos. I feel like they retain their play-ability and value much longer.
You must be paying some weird markups for your Legos though. Here the mini-falcon goes for $9.99 and the min-figure scale one goes for $139(which is a 1200+ piece set). You could be thinking back to that huge collector one from like 7 years ago, but that was the biggest official Lego set ever released.
I wish we could compare GW favorably to Lego. Lego, over the past decade has been making explicit efforts to engage with their customer base to give them the exactly what they want. GW is more like the Lego of 10 years ago when they where about to go bankrupt. Basically they had no idea why people bought their products. Didn't know how people used their products. And, feared engaging with their loyal fans out of fear that they would pollute the brand image. Lego brought in a visionary outsider CEO to fix things. GW is going with a different approach. We'll see how that works out for them.
As far a GW's quality for cost. While they may make some of the best kits within miniature wargaming, they don't compare very well to anything coming out of Japan on either cost or quality.
bartman wrote: My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market.
No, really, they don't.
Quality wise they are about middle of the pack - and looking at their offerings for the last few years they are starting to fall behind. (A news flash - wolves pulling a grav sled is dumb - and fur does not grow in triangular plates that make it easier to press.) There are exceptions - the High Elves in the starter set were quite nice. But then you look at the Skaven in the same box.... and the average drops right back down.
There are other companies that produce much better miniatures, and some of them charge much less for those miniatures.
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Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
bartman wrote: Hello to you all.
First of all I would like to say that I'm totally new in miniature hobby, with one game behind me, but want to share my opinion about tough subject of prices. Since I read DD and Bols everyday I see " GW prices are too high" "GW is a joke" etc. For me prices are fair enough. And i say that with all sanity of my mind.
Uh huh, with respect, you're new, and you need to get some perspective before talking about pricing to people who have been involved in the hobby for a lot longer than you. when you see how with things like dire avengers, gw started halfing the contents of the box sets (ie going from a squad of ten to a squad of five) and yet still selling them at th same price, you tend to raise an eyebrow. When you see the likes of the old annual price hikes etc, you tend to question things. When you see gw cynical policy of nerfing the previous editions 'good' builds in order to sell the next editions good builds, you tend to question things. When you see overpriced rulebooks, overpriced codices and day 1 Dataslates (this stuff either used to be in the codex, or free in White dwarf) new and needless editions every two years, you tend to question things.
All these things combined? Yes, prices are too high.
lets take Dark Vengeance and Infinity Icestorm sets.
DV retail price is 85euro, you can get for 75-80 from independent shops. contains 49 amazingly detailed models, rulebook, dice etc. 49 high quality models.
Icestorm. 90+euro for 14 models, that probably will miss some part, paper battlefield etc.
Let's be fair, and discount those other starter sets by the same percentages for a start. I got my icestorm for £60.
Now let's look at those boxes in context.
Icestorm 'will miss some parts?' Really? How? Mine was perfect. As was that if anyone else's that I know that bought it. Cardboard terrain? Well, yeah, and it's quite useful. I don't see gw doing it. And the models are sublime. Plus they're made of metal, which is a more expensive medium. And it Also has dice, rulebooks etc.
lets add Warmahorde box sets. 2player boxset 99$ retail for 20 models. legion of everblight 49.99$ for 6 models.)
Discount these too.
Those six models are dreadnought sized. Those 2-player starter models are either dreadnought or terminator sized. Let's compare those box sets shall we? And let's compare Pp's war room and rulebook to gw's rulebook and codices and everything else.
because of quality. big companies dont care about "recession" or " because kid has no money". No one cares that i have no money to buy brand new house, no one cares that PS4 games are 70+euro, and probably will last for 2 evenings, or game wont be even fully developed ( assassins creed).
Quality= price. have that in mind before you start shouting that something is overpriced.
Gw isn't 'big' in the grande scheme of things. Quality = price? Well, yeah. But gw are overcharging at the end of the day. Their models are t much better than a lot if other offerings and their rules are terrible.
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Its true that box sets are relatively the same price but the difference is that with infinity or WH you are basically done and can play at most levels, while dark vengeance you are at... what 500 points? when regular games are played at roughly 1500-2000. as well you still need to get the codecs which add to the price.
TLDR: Inf WH: makes you want to buy more. 40k: Requires you to buy more.
Pretty much this!
I also want to point that usually box sets are typically designed to be loss leaders. They are priced where it is below market cost because the game requires you to buy more. That is why box sets aren't always the 'most effective' in terms of forces, they tend to lack something or have another thing you may not need. The whole idea is so you will buy more. If you want to compare prices then you have to look a things which aren't their loss leaders. There is also the agreements that prevent LGS from reducing prices and online warehouses can reduce up to 20% for GW products (but can't list or show them on their website), compared to other games where you can purchase their miniatures from wholesalers easier.
My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market.
Not only is that subjective, its just nonsense. Do they have the best quality historicals? How about the best quality 6mm minis? How is there spaceship range these days?
By any objective standard, it is hard to say they are the best as well. If you compare apples to apples (hard plastic to hard plastic, resin to resin, metal to metal...) - no, dead wrong, pretty much across the board.
Now, he might like the way they look - that is fine. That has nothing to do with quality at all. Personally - to my eye - almost everything GW does is gak. Across the board, top to bottom. There are a few spots which are not horribad and can be made to look pretty good, but they are few and far between (often obscured by chibi jets and baby carrying robots...).
However, if you go looking for the best metal miniatures - it would probably be Infinity right now (for those in wide circulation). Technically excellent, fit is generally spot on, price compared to metal from GW? Wow...GW, much be mixing a bit of gold in their smelting pots.
Best resin is a harder one - GW resin sucks badly. Forge World resin can be good - can be god awful. Reliably good resin casts generally come out of your small operators. I have never had a bad Zealot, Kabuki or HiTech cast for example. Plenty of others that generally are producing bubble free and clean casts with resin. GW is not one of them. About half the time, neither is Forge World. Price wise, with the exception of some of the smaller boutiques, they are generally the same or lower.
Best hard plastic narrows the field a good bit. GW have a larger selection - but many poor items. Perry Brothers are one of he best for plastic miniatures. The new WGF is also excellent. The value you get from those companies far exceeds what you get from GW often by many times. Options range from few to many, depending on what you are buying and from whom. From what I have seen of the Robotech miniatures - they are excellent as well.
Books and printed material? Between same day/next day FAQs and errata, poor editing and copy/paste filler for the last 20 years, GW really isn't too impressive. Without even looking too far (FFG's line of GWRPG books) you see a much higher production value book, with more new information, better artwork and layout, for a lower price.
Granted, if you want to move the goal posts around a bit and say GW have the best grim-dark, science fantasy, hard plastic miniatures...I'll give you that.
Price to play is where GW really falls on its face. Few years ago, I priced out a few dozen 2000 point armies for GW (using peer reviewed lists...from various internet forums of what was considered "good"). Not including the extra bits to actually finish the lists. On average, to get to that level it was between $350 and $450 with some being over $500. Add Codices and Rulebooks for another $100 or so at the time. In order to pick up the rest of the special options - you would probably need to spend an additional $25-50 on bits for each army.
Compare that to Infinity, Warmachine, X-Wing or pretty much any other game that is competing for the same dollars - and GW is 4-5 times more expensive to get playable forces with.
Time is another not insignificant consideration. Generally speaking, you can play two or three games of the other games in the same amount of time that you can play one GW game. Because the rules are so badly stretched out of what they were originally designed for - it doesn't play well, and as I understand it has even gotten a bit worse with recent additions. Being able to actually play a full game without having to set aside an entire evening (important once you get the house, kids and all the rest of that) and the quality in rules becomes so much more obvious.
Lots of good words.
You have said what i meant to say, only in double plus good English. A nod to thee sirrah.
To be fair to GW, their plastic kits offer a lot of customization in terms of bits included, plus usually nowadays they're dual kits so you can use those extra parts for something else. The problem is you are now forced to buy those said parts even if you want them or not. It's the equivalent of not being able to buy a Rhino kit, instead you get this uber box that you can assemble to make a Rhino or Razorback or Whirlwind or whatever. And it costs almost as much as two rhinos.
Maybe during 5th edition I would've said that GW models are worth the price (the game is another matter entirely). Not anymore.
...My point. GW has currently the best quality of models on the market. and quality cost. LEGO prices are awfully hight. 20euro for miniature Millennium Falcon. or 200euro for a big one. why its so high? because of quality. big companies dont care about "recession" or " because kid has no money". No one cares that i have no money to buy brand new house, no one cares that PS4 games are 70+euro, and probably will last for 2 evenings, or game wont be even fully developed ( assassins creed).
Quality= price. have that in mind before you start shouting that something is overpriced.
Thank you for your time.
Since you're new to the hobby, let me clue you in to a few things.
1) GW don't make the best minis. You'll learn this very soon if you stick with the miniature hobby for long.
2) Quality doesn't necessarily equal price. Perry is making better plastics than GW that cost 1/3 the price. Dark Sword is making better individual sculpts that GW at 30% less. Many other examples.
3) LEGO is manufactured with tolerances and precision that GW couldn't hope to match. Not to mention that LEGO bricks are endlessly reusable and can be handled by children for decades without breaking. You can debate whether LEGO is worth it, but there really is no comparison between a LEGO kit and a wargaming model kit.
I do agree with you that GW, LEGO and other products are luxury goods, but trying to justify GW prices based on quality doesn't work.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/28 23:25:37
Ferrari's are a status symbol. Miniatures are not. That's one huge reason people (who have the money, and some i'm sure, who do not!) buy Ferrari's.
Also, while mini's gaming is a little bit expensive ... compare it to model trains, car restoration, or other like expensive hobbies, and it's really not that extravagant.
You can take out a second mortgage on model trains, and still not be happy with the end result.
However i do agree with your overarching point ; the clientele for minis is usually (not always... but usually) young men in their teens to late twenties. That's when you get them. It's really rare that Tom, the 35 year old laborer, just picks up mini gaming. It's usually something you get into when you're younger, and then that bug bites you.
The problem is that often, not always, but often, young men in their teens to early twenties don't have an abundance of money. Mid to late twenties, abundance of money typically finds itself elsewhere (student loans... home downpayment... first car that isn't a shitbox, etc etc, other stuff, be it bars and drinking, or whatever ever fun vice - concert going, etc, whatever it is). However when those same guys get to the poitn in their careers where they are making the money that allows for the home / car / maybe family / and still have a comfortable cushion leftover, this is where they probably aren't phased at the price of minis anymore.
That's a long road to walk.
Again, not trying to make over-broad generalizations, but i think its a common enough roadmap for what typically happens.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/29 00:32:43
Since I've largely switched to historicals, I find any claims about GW being good value to be ludicrous. As has been pointed out, same material, (even the same sculptors if you really want) at a fraction of the price.
The new Soviet Winter Infantry by Warlord is £30. For 40 miniatures.
The new Victrix Rome's Legions of the Republic set is also £30. For 60 miniatures.
And those are all expensive compared with the soft plastic 1/72 historical figures. I wouldn't recommend 1/72 plastics for anyone used to metal and hard plastic, but the sheer number of 1/72 vehicle kits makes it an idea choice for WW2 gaming if you're not going with 28mm like Warlord, Perry or WGF.
Spoiler:
He's on a penny that's about 19mm wide. They're smaller and look more like classic toy soldiers/army men and may not be for everyone, but at $10 or so for 40 or so, some people like them just fine. They are probably the most budget option possible where you still have figures you are painting rather than using paper standees or whatever.
My own preference has been for 54mm metal historicals. $50 or so gets me 14 metal miniatures shipped. They're huge and look really impressive on the table top. Not for everyone, but the scale is definitely making a resurgence. Lots of 1/32 plastic figure kits available in this scale as well (which can work out to less than a dollar per figure). Victrix also has a small 54mm Napoleonics range in plastic and resin.
Spoiler:
All The King's Men metal 54mm miniatures. HaT 1/32 plastic figure Victrix comparison shot showing the size difference between 54mm and 28mm
There's just so many options in the wider hobby of miniature wargaming. If you want to stick to 28mm in GW style plastics though, there's still loads of options. You only end up paying high prices when you lock yourself into a single company's proprietary fictional universe. Whether it's Infinity, 40k or Warmachine, that's where you start paying so much per miniature regardless of the material.
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This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2015/01/29 02:33:22
Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better.
haven't expected that big feedback. thank you all for your time.
what i've got at the beginning was few Infinity models, with missplaced parts, dark eldar starter, AoW dwarves, but till now I haven't got them because of production process, couple of Scibor miniatures.
Infinity-love it because of style and model design. quality is very good but some models should be plastic for its safety (tsputnics tiny tail bit just ask to be broken every time you touch it). pricewise... ok.
AoW-still waiting but got few metal models. a lot of gaps, mold lines, overcasts and general "dirt" on surface.
price... hmmmmm
Our wargaming store dont have Infinity anymore and that system would be my favourite to play and to paint. but last time had to wait 3weeks for my order and thats bit annoying.
realistically, the price vs. entertainment gained is what people need to start looking at. People spend $150+ on a magic deck that lasts them a year or two. People spend 60 dollars on a game that often give around 60 hours of entertainment. Personally, I think war gaming (40K, Infinity, WM/H) has a great price vs. entertainment margin. I mean a 40 dollar GW kit can last you 5+ years without ever really needing to change them. Yes GW is expensive, but you don't NEED to but new models every month, just like you don't NEED to get every ps4 game, or every magic card. I feel like a large number of people who complain about the prices seem to miss that while starting an army can be expensive, it eventually gets to a point where you don't need to buy a ton of new models, just the occasional cheaper then a video game kit.
I'll never be able to repay CA for making GW realize that The Old World was a cash cow, left to die in a field.
6000 pts - 
4000 pts - Harlies: 1000 pts - 
1000 pts
Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress 
Waaagh an' a 'alf
1500 Pts WIP 
