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Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

Im looking for any advice/tips and ideas on the questions below. Cheer in advance!

1. Im aiming towards a Thousand Sons build but on the GW site I cant see any being sold. Have they been discontinued?
2. Would it be worth waiting to see if they get updated/rereleased (recent Khorne release etc)?
3. Im not looking for an uber build, just something semi fun that wont be curbstomped. I currently own, two Rhinos, some 2nd ed metal Chaos marines, a Lord of Change and a FW Great Lord of Change. Are there fun or playable TS builds out there?
4. I am also looking to maybe ally in some Tzeentch Daemons. Any ideas on their viability / usefullness?
5. I have a Superheavy for all my other factions and would like to pick one up for Chaos too. Is the Lord of Skulls any good / worth it? If not, what FW options are useful?
6. Does anyone own a Hellblade and used it ingame? I love the aesthetic but its really it VS a Hellturkey for aerial support. Any ideas?
7. In the Daemon Prince kit is it possible to create a TS style Daemon Prince or is it a generic kit?

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in au
Unrelenting Rubric Terminator of Tzeentch





 Ratius wrote:
Im looking for any advice/tips and ideas on the questions below. Cheer in advance!

1. Im aiming towards a Thousand Sons build but on the GW site I cant see any being sold. Have they been discontinued?
2. Would it be worth waiting to see if they get updated/rereleased (recent Khorne release etc)?
3. Im not looking for an uber build, just something semi fun that wont be curbstomped. I currently own, two Rhinos, some 2nd ed metal Chaos marines, a Lord of Change and a FW Great Lord of Change. Are there fun or playable TS builds out there?
4. I am also looking to maybe ally in some Tzeentch Daemons. Any ideas on their viability / usefullness?
5. I have a Superheavy for all my other factions and would like to pick one up for Chaos too. Is the Lord of Skulls any good / worth it? If not, what FW options are useful?
6. Does anyone own a Hellblade and used it ingame? I love the aesthetic but its really it VS a Hellturkey for aerial support. Any ideas?
7. In the Daemon Prince kit is it possible to create a TS style Daemon Prince or is it a generic kit?


1. They are an upgrade pack, so you have to buy a box of CSM and then an additional upgrade pack with the aspiring sorceror and some bits to "upgrade" your CSM to look like TSons, though why there are only 2 sets of arms and bolters while there are 6 torsos, I will never know. Here's the link: http://www.games-workshop.com/en-IE/Chaos-Space-Marines-Thousand-Sons-Upgrade-Pack though it appears they are temporarily out of stock in your country.

2. I'd suggest against collecting them unless you really like them since they're pretty bad, but there are rumours about some love coming for them in the near future, but given that this has been the case for the last few years, take it with a large heaping of salt. Keep in mind that the "upgrade" kit is finecast, with all the issue that entails.

3. TSons are pretty terrible, mainly due to the 58 point sarge and normal troopers costing double a normal marine but dying to small arms just as fast. There are a couple of people on here who run them, but the more you try and improve your list, you generally find the easiest and best way is to reduce the amount of TSons in your list. They need a rhino unless you're taking Ahriman, and even then it's still advised. You're going to need to build the rest of the army around them since they can't deal with 2+ armour, mosnterous creatures or vehicles in any way, which is quite a large limitation.

Fun is what you make of it, I still enjoy putting mine on the table, and playable has many definitions, but I find that my lists would be greatly improved by the removal of all TSons squads and the MoT sorc tax that makes them troops. I'm not saying they don't have their upsides, and those times when you bounce every plasma shot coming your way is great, but by and large, you'd be better off with 10 x CSM with 2x plasma guns for almost 1/2 the cost. Taking crimson slaughter and the balestar on your sorc can be epic when he rolls ignores cover though. 2 units of 9 TSons, a sorc, a heldrake and a forgefiend have served me well enough as a base. Covers most bases, though with little redunandacy at around 1k, then add stuff to suit (daemons for more psychic/troops, another FF for AA/anti 2+ etc), I generally cover with daemons allies, though another forgefiend is handy past 1500.

4. Tzeentch daemon allies are great, though you might find yourself trying to minimise the CSM portion of your list for more Daemons. Screamerstar is there for the taking, warp charge batteries in 11 man horror squads, beatsticks in the Lord of change with 1 lesser and 2 greaters, heavy support daemon princes, LoC and Herald having access to Div, anti hoarde in Flamers, Screamers & Burning chariots, anti armour in Screamers, Burning chariots and Soul Grinders. Lots of options. Keep in mind that you can't run TSons as troops as an allied detatchment or non-primary CAD due to the very specific wording in the chaos codex.

5. Not in the slightest. If you absolutely must have a superheavy and don't feel that the giant FW chickenman fits the bill (or don't want to use him because your friends complain that he's OP as hell), then I'd say it'd be a toss up between the Fellblade, Typhon or Warhound/Reaver. Personally I think the Brass scorpion looks the coolest, but it's not awesome rules-wise.

6. I don't use one, but I'd say they have very different functions. The Fellblade is made of wet tissue paper and is for AA work, vaugely similar to the Stormtalon while the 'Drake is one of the toughest fliers around and is made for destroying large clumps of infantry while providing incidental/limited AA. Get the right tool for the job, but honestly, if your group runs FW, then get both. The heldrake is almost always worth it and the helblade should cover your AA needs nicely as long as you don't expect it to survive. Strongly reconsider the helblade if there is are many Tau players in your area. I wouldn't even think about taking a 'Drake with the hades, 4 shots at BS3 with a limited arc of fire is pretty poor, you should probably take the helblade over that every time.

7. Depending on how you paint it you could make it look sufficiently tzeentchian. Eagle or dragon bits from fantasy kits are a common conversion, and if you type "tzeentch daemon prince" into google, you should get some nice ideas for conversions that are within your skill level.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/05 19:42:36


 Peregrine wrote:
What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

Thanks for the detailed and thought out reply Dra.
I might go back to the drawing board re: the tzeentch theme.

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in ca
Evasive Pleasureseeker



Lost in a blizzard, somewhere near Toronto

 Ratius wrote:
Thanks for the detailed and thought out reply Dra.
I might go back to the drawing board re: the tzeentch theme.


Just keep your main 1ksons CAD to a min/maxed format... 2x 5-strong Thousand Sons squads, your MoT Sorc (or Ahriman), perhaps some Termies and a supporter or two such as a Drake and/or Forgefiend.
Ahriman is actually a real blast to use with a pair of rolls from Santic + Psy Shriek. If he lands Gate of infinity, he's utterly filthy as he can zap his squad to wherever needed and then scream three times. Sanctuary turns those MoT Termies into the equivalent of loyalist Hammernators. Hammerhand can't be ignored either, and while help boost Ahriman himself to a whopping S8 in combat!
Cleansing Flame is riskier to use, but it's a wicked spell and is great for nailing annoying FMC's due to Nova's auto-hitting everything in range.


Another purely 'fun' Tzeentch Sorc build is to take a Lv3 from the Black Legion supplement and give him the Last Memory relic. Thanks to Spell Familiars, it's possible to cast a WC2 version of Sunburst on just 3 dice. (just don't Perils at all!)
Not only do you get a Lv4 Psyker for cheaper than Ahriman will run you, but you can also slap him into a Rhino alongside a squad of 1ksons and have him blast his Nova power out the top hatch! (even more fun if you take Santic and land Cleansing Flame for a double Nova bomb!)

You also get the option to give a bike-mounted Sorc the Crucible of Lies to essentially give him the 'Daemon of Tzeentch' ability to re-roll saving throws of 1. The bike is however pretty much mandatory though due to the -1T the relic comes with, but you can end up building a rather scary beatstick character who can tank a 3+/3++ all re-rolling 1's!
Give him an escort of Spawn or other Bikers.

And as long as you keep your actual CSM's themselves to a bare minimum, (ie: just min/maxed 1ksons squads and perhaps some Termies), then the Black Legion drawback of being forced to give every squad the Veterans of the Long War upgrade isn't that harsh at all. (1ksons come with the upgrade standard)

 
   
Made in gb
Stitch Counter





The North

I run a Thousand Sons army...

As long as you're willing to bend the fluff to suit your army it can work - and can work rather well.

Yes I have squads of 9 TSons, but they run in Rhinos which are placed strategically to block LoS of threats when they disembark to shoot another target.


Basically build a normal chaos army, but realise you need to build around two things: 1) Thousand Sons need a meatshield to protect them and 2) Ahriman can make rather large blobs of cultists suddenly appear the other end of the table thanks to his Warlord trait... there's your meatshied AND a super massive distraction.

The army needs to be played with more care and attention than a standard power armoured force. Is it more difficult to achieve the same results, well yes - and that's why it's rewarding to win, you can't just chump your way through and win by default for being cheese

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/06 15:24:35


Thousand Sons: 3850pts / Space Marines Deathwatch 5000pts / Dark Eldar Webway Corsairs 2000pts / Scrapheap Challenged Orks 1500pts / Black Death 1500pts

Saga: (Vikings, Normans, Anglo Danes, Irish, Scots, Late Romans, Huns and Anglo Saxons), Lion Rampant, Ronin: (Bushi x2, Sohei), Frostgrave: (Enchanter, Thaumaturge, Illusionist)
 
   
Made in gb
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God






Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways

You could also check out puppets of war for Egyptian themed conversion bits rather than sticking to gw.

   
Made in ca
Hauptmann




Hogtown

I've been playing a raptor heavy slaanesh army, doing well with it and having a blast. From experience I say run what you want use the book to your advantage and play smart, play mercilessly and surprise the enemy.

Thought for the day
 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

I run a Thousand Sons army...

As long as you're willing to bend the fluff to suit your army it can work - and can work rather well.

Yes I have squads of 9 TSons, but they run in Rhinos which are placed strategically to block LoS of threats when they disembark to shoot another target.


Basically build a normal chaos army, but realise you need to build around two things: 1) Thousand Sons need a meatshield to protect them and 2) Ahriman can make rather large blobs of cultists suddenly appear the other end of the table thanks to his Warlord trait... there's your meatshied AND a super massive distraction.

The army needs to be played with more care and attention than a standard power armoured force. Is it more difficult to achieve the same results, well yes - and that's why it's rewarding to win, you can't just chump your way through and win by default for being cheese


Thats kinda it for me Wulf - a semi - competitive build. I'd definteily run 9x squads in Rhinos (which I have) - thanks for the positive feedback - Im now kinda 50-50!
I could proxy in 50 IG as zombies - fodder - its not a harsh Meta we play with.

After that could you answer or give your views on the original questions - HQ, LoW, Allies, Switches?

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in us
Did Fulgrim Just Behead Ferrus?





Fort Worth, TX

 SilverMK2 wrote:
You could also check out puppets of war for Egyptian themed conversion bits rather than sticking to gw.


Kromlech also makes some nifty not-1KSons bits.

"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me."
- Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks 
   
 
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