what hordes army has the most debuffs

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**th3eviltwin**

what hordes army has the most debuffs

**motyak**

Warlocks only? Animi included? Across the whole army?

**th3eviltwin**

Across the whole army

**motyak**

Oh...hard to say. Circle maybe? Although now that I think about it they have a lot of denial-debuff crossover. They can deny spells, which debuffs a warcaster really but is technically denial I guess, if that makes sense.

Curse of shadows bouncing around, pathfinder removal, forest creation (sort of a debuff if applied right I guess), muzzle, windblast, stormwall, bestial, pillars of salt, purification, sunder spirit

And those are just on the warlocks, I'm sure the units/beasts/solos have more. Hope that helps.

**Grey Templar**

None of the hordes factions really have much in the way of offensive debuffing.

Each faction has some offensive debuffs, but none of them really focus on it. Maybe the closest would be the Grimms in Trolls.

If you want a real debuff faction its Cryx on the war machine side.

**Surtur**

Skorne under dominar rasheth has a fair amount of debuff power.

**Mordekiem**

Grey Templar wrote:
If you want a real debuff faction its Cryx on the war machine side.

Yeah, Cryx is really the big debuff faction. And the Dennys are probably the biggest debuff casters. Their feats and spell lists revolve around debuffs. And bane thralls are possibly one of the best (or at maybe most popular?) debuffing units in the game.

**mrfantastical**

Skorne. They have a lot of support units, warlocks, and even beast that specialize in debuff, and negation effects.

**Grey Templar**

None of those items are really true debuffs though. Its still very much support orientated.

**mrfantastical**

Well you're kinda right. I get Skornes denial play style confused with debuff (which mentally for me is the same thing). But Skorne does have some "debuff" models. Agonizer can lower Warbeast strength by 2, or the Kreas spiritual paralysis lowers models defense to 7.

**Shas'O Dorian**

mrfantastical wrote:
Kreas spiritual paralysis (lowers models defense to 7).

LIVING models, important distinction

**Maxus**

Nobody mentioned Legion? Many Enemy Upkeep spells across more Warlocks. All their beasts having eyeless sight could be considered an "debuff", denying stealth, forests, and clouds to hide behind. Vayl2 with purification and icy grip and her feat allowing you to cast all of her spells w/o spending fury.

But it all depends on your definition of debuff.

**Grey Templar**

That's not a debuff.

**Surtur**

Yeah, a debuff would be something that targets the enemy and debilitates them in some manner. This can be either penalties to stats or rolls or in someway prevents normal actions from m being taken.

**Talamare**

Cryx is #1
Skorne is probably #2

**vipoid**

Talamare wrote:
Cryx is #1

That's a funny-looking Horde army...