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Trying to make a basic 1000pts list that will be easy to build on, This is my first list for loyalist marines so i would greatly appreciate feedback.

HQ 400p
~Captain
Artificer Armor, storm Shield, Power Fist

~Command Squad (to go with the Captain)
4x Veteran with Plasma Guns
1x Apothecary
Razorback with Twin-linked Lascannon


Troops 410p
~Tactical Squad, 10 men
Space Marine Sergeant
Lascannon
Plasma Gun
Razorback with Twin-linked Lascannon
(combat squaded with the Sgt and Plasma in the Razorback while the Lascannon hangs back)

~Tactical Squad, 5 men
Space Marine Sergeant
Plasma Gun
Razorback with Twin-linked Lascannon

Heavy Support 190p
~Predator
Autocannon
Heavy bolter sponsons

~Predator
Autocannon
Heavy bolter sponsons

its not bad but you dont really need that many lascannons, at 1000p you cant have that many tanks at that points value and you should spend some of those points elsewheres, or at least change the weapons mounted to something else like a heavy flamer, or a tl assault cannon. i think the most your going to need is maybe 2 lascannons

 ionusx wrote:
its not bad but you dont really need that many lascannons, at 1000p you cant have that many tanks at that points value and you should spend some of those points elsewheres, or at least change the weapons mounted to something else like a heavy flamer, or a tl assault cannon. i think the most your going to need is maybe 2 lascannons

you probably have a point there.. I may just be sticking in those lascannon because i want something more substantial then a heavy bolter. a heavy flamer or two would give me some options against hordes and free up some points ... Maybe put those points into power swords for the tactical sergeants? or would i be better with some Combi weapons/ putting the points elsewhere?

and thank you very much for the feedback.

honestly heres what id probably do:

10 man tacticals: lose the lascannon in favour of a heavy bolter tacticals marines dont need a lascannon its a devestator brothers weapon, he can stand still at the back where the tactical marine gets up in peoples faces, a multi-melta is also an option.

if your feeling adventerous you could drop the 5 man teams razorback entirely and then buy them a plasma cannon instead, plasma cannon marines are cheap to find on ebay as snap fits, like 3 bucks a pop

from here we have 85 points to spend a few things you can do with it:

third predator, squadron them up and you now have a heavy 6 autocannon with monster hunter and tank hunter, not a bad idea

whirlwind: this heavy support choice is very disrespected amongst codex marine players because for 90 you get the thunderfire cannon which is objectively better in every way, but that still doesnt mean she isnt capable of handing out all kinds of hurt, she puts ina lot of work if you need someone to crack open cheap tyranid chaffe units, or break up ork boys into smaller chunks so they go down easier. the whirlwind also gives you an answer to those ugly bikes you see lots f people lugging around. she ignores cover and most bkes/jetbikes dont have a 3+ armor to cower behind.

Thunderfires are 100 actually.
Squadron of whirlwinds + spotter speeder in the suppression force formation is really worthwhile I've found (if you don't want to go double thunderfires). Barrage, twin-linked, shred. That's some nice big templates.

In regards to the list;

HQ:
Bikes not take your fancy for the Captain and command squad? Yes everyone plays them, but it is for a good reason.

Troops:
I'd go for cheap and cheerful with tacticals. Heavy bolters are so under-rated (imo), Ultramarine/Fists chapter tactics give them such a boost too. Personally though, I prefer scouts. Cheap, infiltrate, access to snipers and a hellfire heavy bolter. Bikers again, are a powerful consideration with that relentless grav, jink and T5.
Go with your gut here, it'll determine your army's overall playstyle.

Fast Attack:
If you don't love FA then we can't be friends.

Heavy:
Dakka pred squadrons are fun and usefully shooty. At lower-point games they really shine.

If you haven't already mate, get a few proxy games in first. I know when I started marines I went out and bought all the wrong stuff for how I wound up playing them. You don't want to buy three predators then discover you hate losing tanks every game but love moving mass infantry at your opponent.

Generally when looking at 5 man tac squads, I take scouts instead. Instead of that razorback, you could invest those points into the preds. You could field one of each of the classic types, an Auto/HB Destructor for thinning hordes, and a Full-Las Annihilator for popping armor.

Although I do like the fully mechanized list you have here.

It might be worth swapping some of the plasma for melta. Depends on how much heavy armor you expect to face.

 Flood wrote:
Thunderfires are 100 actually.
Squadron of whirlwinds + spotter speeder in the suppression force formation is really worthwhile I've found (if you don't want to go double thunderfires). Barrage, twin-linked, shred. That's some nice big templates.

In regards to the list;

HQ:
Bikes not take your fancy for the Captain and command squad? Yes everyone plays them, but it is for a good reason.

Troops:
I'd go for cheap and cheerful with tacticals. Heavy bolters are so under-rated (imo), Ultramarine/Fists chapter tactics give them such a boost too. Personally though, I prefer scouts. Cheap, infiltrate, access to snipers and a hellfire heavy bolter. Bikers again, are a powerful consideration with that relentless grav, jink and T5.
Go with your gut here, it'll determine your army's overall playstyle.

Fast Attack:
If you don't love FA then we can't be friends.

Heavy:
Dakka pred squadrons are fun and usefully shooty. At lower-point games they really shine.

If you haven't already mate, get a few proxy games in first. I know when I started marines I went out and bought all the wrong stuff for how I wound up playing them. You don't want to buy three predators then discover you hate losing tanks every game but love moving mass infantry at your opponent.

Its probably worth mentioning that this is not exactly my first army, I do have around 4000s points in a slaanesh themed chaos marines that is largely massed troops. Still not an experienced player in any sense.

I'm looking at a more mechanised list to mix things up a little and try out the other side. I only overlook heavy bolters because my havocs can get auto cannons for the same price


Oh as for proxying its probably worth mentioning that I do have a nice chunk of marines I bought second hand, about 130$au for 100+ minis (no regrets even if I haven't used most)
And apart from what I have commandeered for my chaos army or traded I still have 20 scouts (if memory serves me correctly there is 4 snipers,1 missile,2 heavy bolters,8 knife and boltgun, 5 shotgun) 3 land speeders, 10 terminators (chaos has there eye on) a predator, a whirlwind, a command squad, a metal vanguard squad.. 3 assault marines. A metal terminator librarian, 2 metal chaplains (one terminator one power), the assault on black reach commander and some troops (the Dreadnaught mysteriously grew spikes). I suppose I do have 3 bikes traded from dark vengeance ..4 marine bikes and 2 attack bikes...but my chaos is eyeing of all but the attack bikes >.> oh and a handful of marines that have not been snatched up just yet.

Sooo I have those things that I can try to work into a list, but I am looking for a focus on armour

Cool (sorry if I came off condescending).

Well if we're going for a mechanised force how about something like;

HQ - 285
Techmarine on a bike
Command Squad w/ 4x plasma, apothecary + rhino

Troops - 230
Tactical Squad (5) w/ heavy bolter + rhino
Tactical Squad (5) w/ heavy bolter + rhino

Fast Attack - 225
Razorback w/ las-plas
Razorback w/ las-plas
Razorback w/ las-plas

Heavy - 260
Whirlwind Squadron (2)
Vindicator w/ Siege shield

Total - 1000pts

There's your lascannons separate from your transports so they don't have to move around and snapshoot, second gun on them in case of a weapon destroyed roll.
Whirlwinds for anti-horde, vindi for that high-strength viable target, techy to wheel around fixing things and your troops/command guys both in suitable metal boxes.

Again, I'd prefer scouts in troops, but you wouldn't have them in a metal box.

Welcome to playing Space Marines!

First of all, it's a good idea to build upon units you'll want to use later. Tactical Marines are pretty nice, especially when combat squadded with a Rhino. Keep in mind that Razorbacks are not fast vehicles and you'll really be limited by their mobility if you want to fire effectively and also get troops into position. The Rhino is far-superior IMO and you can still fire out of the hatch. You can take Grav Cannons & amps now on the Tactical Squad which is a salvo weapon, and can fire from the hatch... something to consider. It also makes a 5-man in a rhino threatening (especially if the sgt has a matching combi!)

The predators are a tough unit to use honestly.. you're again going to suffer from their lack of being "fast"... i like the idea of them being your lascannon platforms (turret and sponsons) but you may be in trouble if you have to re-locate them to get around some LOS blocking terrain. I would recommend something else honestly, like Whirlwinds, TFCs, or Land Speeders.

If you are open to Forge World units, the Whirlwind Scorpius and Sicaran Battle Tank are amazing units to consider to fill these slots even more effectively!

The Command squad is cool, and if you like them, use them, but maybe consider an auspex on the HQ that goes with them to reduce enemy cover saves (which will most likely be present on whatever you need the AP2 weapons to kill). I would also drop the storm shield on the captain because he already has a 4++ and at 1000 points you will be tight on points anyway. If something is gonna one-shot him, you're gonna look out sir anyway, so the extra +1 invuln isn't going to make that much of a difference IMO.

Overall, it's a nice start but I'd think about the biggest hurdle you'll face - moving to place your Objective Secured Tac Marines while firing effectively with those Razorbacks.

There's 6 rhino/razorbacks in Flood's list and no drop pods. I don't know if this is a good base to start with, imho.

You could take a three or four-man bike squad in place of a tact. + rhino, or place one of the tacts in a drop pod with a different weapon (You seem to like plasma).

Drop one of the empty razorbacks and take a land speeder to make your whirlwinds re-roll scatter and have infinite range against a single target.